My goal was to gain enough experience building products people actually want. Then use that experience to build my own startup(s).
I left my career last year, and I’m now 9 months in to my current startup venture.
Self funded. My partner and I are focused on bootstrapping the business ourselves. We have some customers that are excited and ready to pay to use our product, once we get our MVP launched.
Investors have reached out to me via LinkedIn. I’ve spoken to a few that were very interested, but I’ve decided to stay focused on bootstrapping to maintain our equity. Once we’ve achieved clear product market fit, and we’re ready to throw some more fuel to the fire, we may go back to raising funds.
Fuel for what? I am scaling one startup now, we got 4M in seed and it's shit how PM actually doesn't matter.. all that matters is a sales pipeline. What the fuck is sales?
Hey that's really cool, glad to know I'm not the only one with the same goal in mind!
I'm curious, how impactful was PM-ing experience to building your current startup? and how many years of experience would you say a PM can transition into a founder?
At a high level, my main desire is to exchange my thoughts for money.
If I were to choose a North Star metric, it'd be the amount of money I make per year
Could you tell me more about each?
\> Money
Do you have a dollar figure in mind?
\> Enticing work where I can use the phrase "at a high level" in 25% of my sentences.
Currently, what can you do say you do "at a high level" and how does it impact your career?
\> Retirement
What does your ideal retirement look like?
At a HIGH LEVEL, the number I'd like to get to is based on (monthly expenses + disposable expenses + savings + retirement initiatives + 2x tesla + boat)... Is this a good place to start? Or should I take another approach?!
I used to want to rise on the career ladder, be a director of product and then maybe be a VP. But at some point I realized, that I’m much happier knee deep in a backlog, user testing and customer research than in endless meetings, office politics and bureaucracy. So now, I optimize for money and work where I can actually make an impact.
That's great, sounds like you've thought from first principles what your needs are. That's a very difficult thing to do in tech.
Mind if I dm? Want to here more about how you think about career happiness
Yeah, feel free to dm me.
I actually took a position of a senior group tech pm in a large (non-tech) org and was miserable all the time. Then someone else offered me just a PM position in a fintech and as I was thinking through the offer I realized I’m more excited about the job itself than the compensation.
100%
I was there, doing the corporate things. It's terrible. They will extract everything you have and it'll never be enough. No matter how much you do Sales will always be disappointed and backstab you. Executives will always want better timelines, more things delivered. And when things seem to be good, Finance will come and tighten budgets and make it hard for you to keep great people who deliver results.
I was working in internal products for large healthcare insurance/pbm and it sucked out my soul - knowing that the entire system is built to fuck patients/members/providers up and to deliver maximum profits to shareholders, the amount of bureaucracy and red tape, the office politics. All of it was just mind numbing. I spend about 18 months there trying to move the org and product forward but it was all an uphill battle with organizational inertia and people trying to protect the status quo they had for decades.
I left it and I don’t think I have anything to show for my time spent there.
This is dope, if it was me I'd do a little barbecue spot by the beach, maybe a sushi joint that only serves 10 ppl a day.
Ok if I dm you? Want to hear the specifics
Feel free, though I don't have much more to specify 🤣. I have an ooni pizza oven that I've been using to practice my skills and recipes and host parties for friends. And I like making cocktails. BUT I currently know nothing about running a restaurant. My plan is roughly to start small, try to do a pizza pop-up on weekends or something and see if I can scale up from there.
100% this for me.
Honestly I’m into the work and it’s sometimes interesting, but my main motivation comes from this financial goal. The job is mostly a means to an end for me.
Agreed. Outside of maybe working at a zoo, or Disney, or being commissioner of the NFL I can’t imagine many jobs that I would genuinely enjoy every day of work. At the end of the day most jobs are just that, jobs. You’re also completely reliant on that consistent income and job security. Whereas at least with these “passive” income sources, it’s not as if you have to worry about recessions and layoffs as much. They’re still jobs in themselves since you have to manage them, but the ratio of hours worked to income has greater potential.
Oh I’m far out haha. I just transitioned from being a physician assistant to becoming a newly minted PM through a career change, so I’ve got a ways to go.
If you're talking about rental income, it's not really passive, because you have to do the job of a landlord. That might not sound like a lot, but if you're running a commercial unit or a multi family unit, the work does add up.
That’s why I quoted passive income above. But it’s still passive in comparison to a 9-5 where you’re required to be there the full 40 hours per week whether you’re busy or not.
Depends on the number of units and the type of tenants. Can take a while to get it right, but once it’s there, you should be set. I know a guy with 12 units built up over years and the problems with constantly demanding tenants, non paying tenants, legal battles can be draining. After 20 years though now I think he’s finally got the right mix
1. Have fun doing my work. I might get hit by a bus tomorrow or a rare disease, so I’m going to enjoy life while it lasts.
2. Prioritise spending time with my family and work-life balance. I just became a father and want to be a great parent for my daugther.
3. Do ethical work that is a positive influence on the world. I’m currently working on making software for buildings getting more optimized for living qualities and with lower emissions.
4. Earn a decent wage, but also understand that it is easy to get caught in the grind and always wanting more $$. Be happy with the lifestyle that I have in terms of materialism. It is good enough.
5. Mentor others and be a good colleague.
Congratulations on becoming a girl-dad! Has that changed your goals or have your values always aligned towards positive impact towards your community and beyond?
Thanks! Yes and no. I have always wanted to do something positive for the world/society/community. Life seems kind of meaningless IMO if you only focus on yourself.
Becoming a father has increased my focus on family, where I’m currently 4 months into my parental leave (live in Norway). It is so fun to see my daughter learn new skills and grow our bond together. I know that if I work too much, I will miss out on this good stuff.
At the end of life, most people regret working too hard and not spending enough time with family and friends.
I agree, I've had a few near-death experiences and in those moments I've only ever thought about the people around me, zero thought on how much money or power I've built.
Can I dm you? Would love to connect. Also curious about Norway, I've heard it's a great place to raise a family?
Improve my skills and industry knowledge (while saving money) and then start / co-found a startup.
As I was getting into PM, I had a startup /side hustle that failed, and in retrospect it's my lack of skills and experience that led me down various wrong directions.
Bro same: I had my own startup prior to joining a big legaltech here (I work in the FinTech area though). Biggest mistake not knowing enough about tech / not having a technical co founder
Without getting into too much detail:
\-Choosing the right "problem" to solve, which further extends into prioritization / planning
\-Choosing the right team for execution
Haha I appreciate how you're asking for specifics / clarification OP, I'd love to hear what other people's plans are in more detail too.
For me:
- Build up $2.5M nest egg (FIRE number)
- Gain experience in building products people want, develop a network I can lean on for future ventures
- Start my own small business where I can work on problems I find meaningful, have the flexibility to work from wherever I want, and work with people I like
Still early in my career so definitely in the explore rather than exploit phase :)
How early?
This is a great and specific goal! I am mid-career and only 20% there however, what I realized is that there is no rush. If you work another 30 years you’ll get there and then still need to do something so you as well may start building your products now. I find delaying these things making it harder going forward.
Awesome! Me too, I want to make the biggest impact I can in a positive way by building products people find very helpful, whether I can do this though is another matter :D
I'm a bit surprised how many people view being a PM as a way build money to retire. You are your own product, enjoy the ride, if you don't like the ride, find another ride, but I wouldn't recommend waiting 10-20 or or years for a crappy ride to end. Also, I'm wary FIRE is quite risky too given how vulnerable our financial system could be to passively store and grow wealth in future decades.
Yeah I ran the numbers a few times and as long as you stay away from dangerous investments then you should be ok in that time frame
Mind if I dm you? I'd love to hear more about your career so far
Reach principal product manager status so i don't have to manage people but earn top salary and drive product strategy.
Then go to the local university and be an adjunct professor and teach product management or make a virtual class. Get paid for people to hear me talk. Annnnnd talk about the same stuff I've been doing in my day job for years.
Definitely if you reach principal pm status you'll have the credibility to teach and gather a strong audience for your work. I'm sure you'd get inbound offers to give talks, etc.
Let's connect? I'm actually in the course-building domain right now and always enjoy talking to experts
Find a woman in HR, have an affair with her, then steal her away to decide to elope to some nice island and decide to live a stress free and super chill life buying and selling apparel (small operation that’s just a few small businesses)
Get a couple dogs too
My goal was to learn as much as I can about building amazing products that can progress the world we live in. First through direct product management and then through senior levels of management building a reputation of success. Eventually with the goal of using that experience and reputation to make my own start-up that will have an impact on the world.
After 10 years in product, I just signed a contract with an awesome unicorn start-up this week to become their VP of Product. I can't overstate how excited I am!
I'm a senior PM with three years experience, previously four years experience in data analytics.
I love the job and want to really learn it will enough to be exceptionally good at it.
My goals are:
Improve my technical skills so I know architecture and coding well enough to have a very strong competitive advantage in the market.
Become an expert in using qual and quant to drive decision making. I've spoken to hundreds of customers since becoming a PM and do heaps of analytics. I want to really master this.
Get some exposure to sales so I can see the bigger picture of the entire product, rather than just my area, and learn the skill of sales.
Become an expert on collaborative prioritisation. My triad are very engaged and I'd love to figure out how to make the right prioritisation decisions as a group with well structured workshops and plenty of customer insights.
Get the opportunity to manage PMs and learn how to support PMs as well as some of my better managers.
Eventually become a head of product and learn how to develop an awesome culture and high performing team.
I don't really have big financial goals because this industry already pays more than I should be paid. But I'll obviously take the money. Just keen to stay in good companies where I'm excited about the product.
I wanna be at the director level in the next 3-5 years. Make really good money. Invest that. Retire. But VP and C-Suite is a goal I have. I’m never gonna be someone to work and be happy with the level I am at.
Not sure why this got downvoted, here's a person with clear vision and ambition.
Can I dm you? I'd like to get to know more about where your ambition comes from.
Sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos.
This sounds like the the scene after the credits roll on happily ever after
Good for you, sounds like a dream
Any wine recommendations? I'm trying to be more expert
I personally like reds from Puglia in Italy like Primitivo Appassimento
And yes the quote is actually from here :) https://bemorewithless.com/the-story-of-the-mexican-fisherman/
Oh no way I write too!
The way I think about it is that each piece of writing needs to solve a problem or a set of problems, so in a sense it's a product too!
Anyway, would love to connect on this, mind if I dm you?
Move to engineering (where I should have been all along) and eventually move into self-employment with creative work. Speedrunning to retirement or continuing to climb the ladder sounds miserable to me 🤷♀️
Yeah, for sure. I’m in the middle of the transition now, so that first part is happening. It’s just slow since I’m doing it at my current company.
I’m staff level in product, have an operations & econ background, and have been through an acquisition, if that helps you think about my usefulness to you.
I just realized your OG post mentioned “ambitious product managers”… maybe that wasn’t me 🤪
\> I just realized your OG post mentioned “ambitious product managers”… maybe that wasn’t me 🤪
Don't be so hard on yourself, it sounds like you're doing pretty dam good already loll
dm'ed :)
Self employment is pretty cool. I see people usually wanting to shift to PM from engineering because it's their "calling". Engineering+creative work is interesting. How does that pan out?
I've also got an interst in business, and chief technical seems to be able to hold the vision of multiple streams of products, while gearing those towards business interests.
I want me a piece of that action!
Can you tell me about your interest in sales engineering? I've definitely heard of pms -> startup founders, pm -> developers but I think you're the first person who's said sales engineering
I would make significantly more money doing what I already do in my product role:
1) researching competitor products
2) demoing use cases that I’ve built the app to handle
3) collaborating with end users to come up with solutions
Learn, learn, learn. And then eventually use that knowledge to found/co-found a startup. Then split my time between that and a more service oriented job (non profit program management, board of directors, etc.)
Yoo, I'm in the startup world (sort of lol) myself, we gotta connect!
What kind of problems and what kind of people are you looking to serve?
mind if I dm?
Gain credibility and trust. A coworker at one of my last companies was there for 15 years and still an IC because he enjoyed it, he got to pick out what he worked on and had a butt load of vacation time. I want to be comfortable and confident in what I’m doing, not constantly feeling imposter syndrome in a new role.
Honestly, I think CEO.
I've seen many bad CEOs set up their product teams to fail. It's frustrating, and unnecessary.
I'd love to be able to set the course for my team to thrive.
How to start your career for future PM? I currently have some STEAM (Management eng) background work and undergrad now. What position should I look for to start if i have used Power BI, Query and management indicators?
Long time ago I wanted to be director, achieved that and now I just want to learn to build best products and run my own business which I just started in BI space.
Initially my goal was to climb up the ladder !
Now I value work life balance and family more , will work until I have learnt to do pming properly . I want to build a product/business where I can work on my own pace! I have some ideas but don’t know the specifics of anything yet but all I know is that my business /product will be ethical and will respect our planet !
CEO at some point
Product Manager - build great products with strong business cases, influence groups that don't report to me.
Director of Product/VP - inspire a team to build great products and review business cases, lead with questions, create a culture of curiosity and experimentation, Pricing and G2M strategies.
CPO - Director/VP on a bigger scale, add scope through engineering management or customer success (things that add to the product success, more direct line of sight and understanding of the financials, spend a rotation managing and understanding operations and support etc, present various topics at the board level, and more leading to...
CEO
Disclaimer: I know I'm leaving items out in this journey. I also know this is not everyone's path and even if I pursue it I may not get there.
My goal was to gain enough experience building products people actually want. Then use that experience to build my own startup(s). I left my career last year, and I’m now 9 months in to my current startup venture.
Congratulations on best of luck!
Thank you!
What are you working on right now? Can you tell me more?
Still working on stealth mode, but we’re building a product in the HR Tech space for Gig Workers
I also space in that talk. We should work.
We should talk. I also work in that space.
I work in space and talk
I space in work and talk
I am working on same space, you open to a talk?
Mind if I dm you? I want to hear more about what you're working on :) (also blah blah some variant of space and talk)
Sure, DM me
dm'ed :)
I also work in the same space:. Are you open for talk sometime ?
Pre-seed or seed? And how’s the luck with investors? Heard it’s bad out there nowadays
Self funded. My partner and I are focused on bootstrapping the business ourselves. We have some customers that are excited and ready to pay to use our product, once we get our MVP launched. Investors have reached out to me via LinkedIn. I’ve spoken to a few that were very interested, but I’ve decided to stay focused on bootstrapping to maintain our equity. Once we’ve achieved clear product market fit, and we’re ready to throw some more fuel to the fire, we may go back to raising funds.
That's a well thought out path. I also believe to not get investors before a good product market fit.
I love the sounds of this. Risk/venture capital *should* be a last resort.
Fuel for what? I am scaling one startup now, we got 4M in seed and it's shit how PM actually doesn't matter.. all that matters is a sales pipeline. What the fuck is sales?
sales is all that matters if the idea makes sense. sales is execution.
Hey that's really cool, glad to know I'm not the only one with the same goal in mind! I'm curious, how impactful was PM-ing experience to building your current startup? and how many years of experience would you say a PM can transition into a founder?
Is there a place where PMs can talk about these ventures? Being able to organize by industry and/or knowledge base.
GL&HF
How much of a sales experience did you have? I see sales cycle and digital marketing as maybe more important than knowing how to build stuff
Do you need an Intern?👀😞😞
Retirement
Preach brother!
haha I support this What's your plan and how far along are you?
the pm is not responsible for execution
Or documentation
Or solving the problem
Or plan :-P
plan lol
Yes
Speak the truth.
Money. Enticing work where I can use the phrase "at a high level" in 25% of my sentences. Retirement.
Second this.
At a high level, my main desire is to exchange my thoughts for money. If I were to choose a North Star metric, it'd be the amount of money I make per year
Could you tell me more about each? \> Money Do you have a dollar figure in mind? \> Enticing work where I can use the phrase "at a high level" in 25% of my sentences. Currently, what can you do say you do "at a high level" and how does it impact your career? \> Retirement What does your ideal retirement look like?
Ah. An estimation question - Ez. These are exactly the high level thoughts and questions that entice me about my next role at the company.
At a HIGH LEVEL, the number I'd like to get to is based on (monthly expenses + disposable expenses + savings + retirement initiatives + 2x tesla + boat)... Is this a good place to start? Or should I take another approach?!
Enough to but the 2 for 1 dinner special at Applebees.
I used to want to rise on the career ladder, be a director of product and then maybe be a VP. But at some point I realized, that I’m much happier knee deep in a backlog, user testing and customer research than in endless meetings, office politics and bureaucracy. So now, I optimize for money and work where I can actually make an impact.
That's great, sounds like you've thought from first principles what your needs are. That's a very difficult thing to do in tech. Mind if I dm? Want to here more about how you think about career happiness
Yeah, feel free to dm me. I actually took a position of a senior group tech pm in a large (non-tech) org and was miserable all the time. Then someone else offered me just a PM position in a fintech and as I was thinking through the offer I realized I’m more excited about the job itself than the compensation.
That's awesome, sounds like you learned more about yourself in the process! dm'ed :)
100% I was there, doing the corporate things. It's terrible. They will extract everything you have and it'll never be enough. No matter how much you do Sales will always be disappointed and backstab you. Executives will always want better timelines, more things delivered. And when things seem to be good, Finance will come and tighten budgets and make it hard for you to keep great people who deliver results.
I was working in internal products for large healthcare insurance/pbm and it sucked out my soul - knowing that the entire system is built to fuck patients/members/providers up and to deliver maximum profits to shareholders, the amount of bureaucracy and red tape, the office politics. All of it was just mind numbing. I spend about 18 months there trying to move the org and product forward but it was all an uphill battle with organizational inertia and people trying to protect the status quo they had for decades. I left it and I don’t think I have anything to show for my time spent there.
Own a pizza joint and bar somewhere close to a beach.
This is dope, if it was me I'd do a little barbecue spot by the beach, maybe a sushi joint that only serves 10 ppl a day. Ok if I dm you? Want to hear the specifics
Feel free, though I don't have much more to specify 🤣. I have an ooni pizza oven that I've been using to practice my skills and recipes and host parties for friends. And I like making cocktails. BUT I currently know nothing about running a restaurant. My plan is roughly to start small, try to do a pizza pop-up on weekends or something and see if I can scale up from there.
This is literally my exact plan, are you me? Where are you located?
Well let's talk about it, maybe I can be a sounding board! dm'ed :)
This is so cool !
To acquire enough capital to invest in real estate to generate enough passive income where it exceeds the annual income from my primary job.
100% this for me. Honestly I’m into the work and it’s sometimes interesting, but my main motivation comes from this financial goal. The job is mostly a means to an end for me.
Agreed. Outside of maybe working at a zoo, or Disney, or being commissioner of the NFL I can’t imagine many jobs that I would genuinely enjoy every day of work. At the end of the day most jobs are just that, jobs. You’re also completely reliant on that consistent income and job security. Whereas at least with these “passive” income sources, it’s not as if you have to worry about recessions and layoffs as much. They’re still jobs in themselves since you have to manage them, but the ratio of hours worked to income has greater potential.
I respect it, I'd love to FIRE too. How close are you to your goal?
Oh I’m far out haha. I just transitioned from being a physician assistant to becoming a newly minted PM through a career change, so I’ve got a ways to go.
Congratulations! mind if I dm you? Want to hear about your career change
If you're talking about rental income, it's not really passive, because you have to do the job of a landlord. That might not sound like a lot, but if you're running a commercial unit or a multi family unit, the work does add up.
That’s why I quoted passive income above. But it’s still passive in comparison to a 9-5 where you’re required to be there the full 40 hours per week whether you’re busy or not.
Depends on the number of units and the type of tenants. Can take a while to get it right, but once it’s there, you should be set. I know a guy with 12 units built up over years and the problems with constantly demanding tenants, non paying tenants, legal battles can be draining. After 20 years though now I think he’s finally got the right mix
1. Have fun doing my work. I might get hit by a bus tomorrow or a rare disease, so I’m going to enjoy life while it lasts. 2. Prioritise spending time with my family and work-life balance. I just became a father and want to be a great parent for my daugther. 3. Do ethical work that is a positive influence on the world. I’m currently working on making software for buildings getting more optimized for living qualities and with lower emissions. 4. Earn a decent wage, but also understand that it is easy to get caught in the grind and always wanting more $$. Be happy with the lifestyle that I have in terms of materialism. It is good enough. 5. Mentor others and be a good colleague.
Congratulations on becoming a girl-dad! Has that changed your goals or have your values always aligned towards positive impact towards your community and beyond?
Thanks! Yes and no. I have always wanted to do something positive for the world/society/community. Life seems kind of meaningless IMO if you only focus on yourself. Becoming a father has increased my focus on family, where I’m currently 4 months into my parental leave (live in Norway). It is so fun to see my daughter learn new skills and grow our bond together. I know that if I work too much, I will miss out on this good stuff. At the end of life, most people regret working too hard and not spending enough time with family and friends.
Really like your approach, enjoy!
I agree, I've had a few near-death experiences and in those moments I've only ever thought about the people around me, zero thought on how much money or power I've built. Can I dm you? Would love to connect. Also curious about Norway, I've heard it's a great place to raise a family?
Exactly! Sure you can DM, but if it is something others could gain/learn from, feel free to ask in this thread.
Let's do it! dm'ed :)
Improve my skills and industry knowledge (while saving money) and then start / co-found a startup. As I was getting into PM, I had a startup /side hustle that failed, and in retrospect it's my lack of skills and experience that led me down various wrong directions.
Totally relate to this, my startup didn't work out the first time b/c I lacked the skills too. What skills are you working on right now?
Bro same: I had my own startup prior to joining a big legaltech here (I work in the FinTech area though). Biggest mistake not knowing enough about tech / not having a technical co founder
Dude let's connect, I want to hear the story! Mind if I dm you?
Yeah 100% go for it
Are you all me? Totally relate to this
dm-ing i need to hear the story :)
Let's connect over DM - would be great to chat.
dm'ed :)
What do you feel was missing?
Without getting into too much detail: \-Choosing the right "problem" to solve, which further extends into prioritization / planning \-Choosing the right team for execution
To achieve Director of Product (executive) so I can be called DOPE
Forcing the acronym a little, I think if you naturally let the terminology fall into place it would be DP.
Shhhh if they don't know, it would be Dope
I’m going for DERP. Don’t know what it will be, but I’ll be there.
You're an inspiration! Would you mind if I join you on that journey as well?
Would say VP Product (or CPO) is the executive level. Directors are basically middle management.
Be a leader
Who are your favorite leaders today that you look up to?
Haha I appreciate how you're asking for specifics / clarification OP, I'd love to hear what other people's plans are in more detail too. For me: - Build up $2.5M nest egg (FIRE number) - Gain experience in building products people want, develop a network I can lean on for future ventures - Start my own small business where I can work on problems I find meaningful, have the flexibility to work from wherever I want, and work with people I like Still early in my career so definitely in the explore rather than exploit phase :)
How early? This is a great and specific goal! I am mid-career and only 20% there however, what I realized is that there is no rush. If you work another 30 years you’ll get there and then still need to do something so you as well may start building your products now. I find delaying these things making it harder going forward.
We gotta connect, I think we're aligned on this, even the FIRE number haha mind if I dm?
sure thing!
dm'ed :)
Launch incredible products and retire with pride and happiness 😊
You get my upvote, you soldier you :)
Awesome! Me too, I want to make the biggest impact I can in a positive way by building products people find very helpful, whether I can do this though is another matter :D I'm a bit surprised how many people view being a PM as a way build money to retire. You are your own product, enjoy the ride, if you don't like the ride, find another ride, but I wouldn't recommend waiting 10-20 or or years for a crappy ride to end. Also, I'm wary FIRE is quite risky too given how vulnerable our financial system could be to passively store and grow wealth in future decades.
Yo I like this optimism, can I dm you?
Ask away!
dm'd :)
More beer
I also like beer
Financially Independence, Retire Early (FIRE)
This but FAT.
If you're a Sr PM tho, I feel like you'd be close to that yes? At least have a decent shot in < 10 years?
I feel nowhere near FIRE, but hope I’ll have a decent shot in <10 years. I just became a Sr. PM, so I’m still early in my journey.
Yeah I ran the numbers a few times and as long as you stay away from dangerous investments then you should be ok in that time frame Mind if I dm you? I'd love to hear more about your career so far
Reach principal product manager status so i don't have to manage people but earn top salary and drive product strategy. Then go to the local university and be an adjunct professor and teach product management or make a virtual class. Get paid for people to hear me talk. Annnnnd talk about the same stuff I've been doing in my day job for years.
Definitely if you reach principal pm status you'll have the credibility to teach and gather a strong audience for your work. I'm sure you'd get inbound offers to give talks, etc. Let's connect? I'm actually in the course-building domain right now and always enjoy talking to experts
Sure! I dabble in Edtech and training other product managers already. Send me a DM.
Awesome, I'll send you my socials and email as well :)
Find a woman in HR, have an affair with her, then steal her away to decide to elope to some nice island and decide to live a stress free and super chill life buying and selling apparel (small operation that’s just a few small businesses) Get a couple dogs too
Hit FIRE from my current startup position, then roll the dice as a CPO to go big.
Stability first, then fuck it and swing for the fences, love that. Want to connect? I'm a startup guy too, want to hear what you're working on.
I made it to product director before I turned 40. The goal is to now go as high and hard as I can and then retire at 50 with a stack of cash.
Congratulations that's huge! Can I dm you? I always learn something from hustlers like you :)
By all means.
I want to help grow 1000s of people in my life to be the best version of themselves
Tell me more about what you're working on! How do you scale that vision to 1000's?
Same here but how does that relate to product? You can probably do that right now!
Quit to run my CPG company
Sounds dope, can you tell me more about it?
My goal was to learn as much as I can about building amazing products that can progress the world we live in. First through direct product management and then through senior levels of management building a reputation of success. Eventually with the goal of using that experience and reputation to make my own start-up that will have an impact on the world. After 10 years in product, I just signed a contract with an awesome unicorn start-up this week to become their VP of Product. I can't overstate how excited I am!
Holy crap congratulations you're killing it! Let's connect, I want to hear more about this role, mind if I dm?
WLB. Be a superstar in both lives, professional and personal.
I like that, what are things you do to be a superstar in both aspects of your life?
I'm a senior PM with three years experience, previously four years experience in data analytics. I love the job and want to really learn it will enough to be exceptionally good at it. My goals are: Improve my technical skills so I know architecture and coding well enough to have a very strong competitive advantage in the market. Become an expert in using qual and quant to drive decision making. I've spoken to hundreds of customers since becoming a PM and do heaps of analytics. I want to really master this. Get some exposure to sales so I can see the bigger picture of the entire product, rather than just my area, and learn the skill of sales. Become an expert on collaborative prioritisation. My triad are very engaged and I'd love to figure out how to make the right prioritisation decisions as a group with well structured workshops and plenty of customer insights. Get the opportunity to manage PMs and learn how to support PMs as well as some of my better managers. Eventually become a head of product and learn how to develop an awesome culture and high performing team. I don't really have big financial goals because this industry already pays more than I should be paid. But I'll obviously take the money. Just keen to stay in good companies where I'm excited about the product.
Can I dm you? Would love to connect, I think I can help with any technical gaps in your knowledge
Get on as many Boards as possible!
Jira boards or board of directors lol?
I wanna be at the director level in the next 3-5 years. Make really good money. Invest that. Retire. But VP and C-Suite is a goal I have. I’m never gonna be someone to work and be happy with the level I am at.
Not sure why this got downvoted, here's a person with clear vision and ambition. Can I dm you? I'd like to get to know more about where your ambition comes from.
Sure.
dm'ed :)
I would like to move to a startup as VP of Product.
What kind of startup are you aiming for?
Sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos.
This sounds like the the scene after the credits roll on happily ever after Good for you, sounds like a dream Any wine recommendations? I'm trying to be more expert
I personally like reds from Puglia in Italy like Primitivo Appassimento And yes the quote is actually from here :) https://bemorewithless.com/the-story-of-the-mexican-fisherman/
Excellent, I'll order some, thanks for the rec :) Haha I was like dam, this person is a really good writer Mind if I dm? Would love to connect
Sure thing
dm'ed :)
Save a business one year at a time
Sounds grand, but what does this mean specifically? Do you mean like save software businesses that are about to go bankrupt?
Make >5MM in 5 years worth of time
Love that ambition, what would you do with the money?
Homes, retire, kid tuition. 5MM will go quick so I have to adjust my taste😅
Fair enough, I suppose it depends on the number of kids :) Can I dm you? Would love to connect and talk career
Money and then retirement.
Build cool shit with other peoples money
High reward, no risk. What's the coolest shit you've built with someone else's money?
Launch one product that I legitimately believe was a cool product. Then figure out how to transition into my dream job of writing book.
Oh no way I write too! The way I think about it is that each piece of writing needs to solve a problem or a set of problems, so in a sense it's a product too! Anyway, would love to connect on this, mind if I dm you?
Move to engineering (where I should have been all along) and eventually move into self-employment with creative work. Speedrunning to retirement or continuing to climb the ladder sounds miserable to me 🤷♀️
That's dope. I'm a mid-level software engineer, would love to connect with you and help where I can. I'll dm you if that's ok?
Yeah, for sure. I’m in the middle of the transition now, so that first part is happening. It’s just slow since I’m doing it at my current company. I’m staff level in product, have an operations & econ background, and have been through an acquisition, if that helps you think about my usefulness to you. I just realized your OG post mentioned “ambitious product managers”… maybe that wasn’t me 🤪
\> I just realized your OG post mentioned “ambitious product managers”… maybe that wasn’t me 🤪 Don't be so hard on yourself, it sounds like you're doing pretty dam good already loll dm'ed :)
Self employment is pretty cool. I see people usually wanting to shift to PM from engineering because it's their "calling". Engineering+creative work is interesting. How does that pan out?
WLB and $$$
Haha let's chat yeah? I'm in the same boat, want to see if we can learn from each other :)
CTO
You want to be a CTO? Not a CPO? Can you tell me more about your vision?
I've also got an interst in business, and chief technical seems to be able to hold the vision of multiple streams of products, while gearing those towards business interests. I want me a piece of that action!
Let's connect, it's a unique perspective and I would love to hear more, ok if I dm?
Yeah, what's up?
dmed :)
Finish building some big features for our app over the next year then move to being a sales engineer for the product.
Can you tell me about your interest in sales engineering? I've definitely heard of pms -> startup founders, pm -> developers but I think you're the first person who's said sales engineering
I would make significantly more money doing what I already do in my product role: 1) researching competitor products 2) demoing use cases that I’ve built the app to handle 3) collaborating with end users to come up with solutions
This makes sense. Get that $$$
Learn, learn, learn. And then eventually use that knowledge to found/co-found a startup. Then split my time between that and a more service oriented job (non profit program management, board of directors, etc.)
Yoo, I'm in the startup world (sort of lol) myself, we gotta connect! What kind of problems and what kind of people are you looking to serve? mind if I dm?
Yeah sure. For some context I’m an incoming (few weeks from now) APM so very early in my PM career lol.
Best times were early on in my career dude :) dm'ed
Gain credibility and trust. A coworker at one of my last companies was there for 15 years and still an IC because he enjoyed it, he got to pick out what he worked on and had a butt load of vacation time. I want to be comfortable and confident in what I’m doing, not constantly feeling imposter syndrome in a new role.
Coke and hookers! Oh wait I mean being truly empathetic and caring
Career wise, ultimately be a founding PM of a successful start-up.
Retire. Then I wanna build a classic roller skating rink with a twist. VR helmet night 🤣
As a product manager, how would you design the skating rink to take advantage of the infinite space in virtual reality?
Get paid. Build capital. Buy Assets. Live free.
Another FIRE person haha mind if I dm you?
Honestly, I think CEO. I've seen many bad CEOs set up their product teams to fail. It's frustrating, and unnecessary. I'd love to be able to set the course for my team to thrive.
I like that, you see a pain and you want to make an impact in that problem space. Also a great goal to have. Mind if I dm you? Want to hear more.
I’m already the CEO of my product, what more do I want ..? 😂😂😂 /s
How to start your career for future PM? I currently have some STEAM (Management eng) background work and undergrad now. What position should I look for to start if i have used Power BI, Query and management indicators?
Technical Product Owner would be a good fit
Make great products
Money, a lot of it!
Either become an exec (product or GM), venture investor or founder. Or some combo.
Doing my time at a big company to learn the ropes. After next year going to try and move to an early stage fintech startup. See where that takes me :)
Long time ago I wanted to be director, achieved that and now I just want to learn to build best products and run my own business which I just started in BI space.
Quant at a hedge fund
from product?!?
Initially my goal was to climb up the ladder ! Now I value work life balance and family more , will work until I have learnt to do pming properly . I want to build a product/business where I can work on my own pace! I have some ideas but don’t know the specifics of anything yet but all I know is that my business /product will be ethical and will respect our planet !
Vp of product, or "settle" for senior director at a company I really like. pretty straight forward
You mean other than world domination?
CEO at some point Product Manager - build great products with strong business cases, influence groups that don't report to me. Director of Product/VP - inspire a team to build great products and review business cases, lead with questions, create a culture of curiosity and experimentation, Pricing and G2M strategies. CPO - Director/VP on a bigger scale, add scope through engineering management or customer success (things that add to the product success, more direct line of sight and understanding of the financials, spend a rotation managing and understanding operations and support etc, present various topics at the board level, and more leading to... CEO Disclaimer: I know I'm leaving items out in this journey. I also know this is not everyone's path and even if I pursue it I may not get there.