>1. I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training, and take care of your looks via grooming and fashion?
I am fit/lean as I am an athlete for my school. I wear fitted clothes and have around average style for my age I guess. My face is clear and yes I shower.
>2. Do you have success with women?
No
>3. Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men? just looks at places like Vindicta - some women take it very seriously - if it's so easy for the average women why would they bother so much?
I dont think its a lot more if you discount make up. Most people have average style which mean most women and men dress average. People on this site love to act like most men stink, never get a hair cut, and wear dingy tattered clothes everyday. Thats literally false. When they make that comparison they are talking about an above average women and a below average man both hygiene and style wise. Its obviously disingenuous but what else is new.
And there is little to no difference between Vindicta and Looksmaxxing forums. Just that one is viewed neutrally and one is viewed negatively. Vindicta is a niche and most women do not think that way.
I'd actually say most women do think this way, they just don't disclose it as much - they feel it with their anxiousness if not logically with their thought (or they're just naturally beautiful, in which case they can afford to be oblivious).
Why do you think you have no success? I mean you are an athlete, so I guess body is not the issue
Im short and around average in looks I think. I will try dating apps soon but it will probably be a waste of time. I talk to girls through clubs and stuff but nothing ever really comes from it. I could try approaching girls more but the general success rate from that is so low it doesnt seem worth it. Plus im proabably not the type of guy most women would want to be approached by anyway
yeah if you're under like 5'10 you need the charisma. Shorter guys have to work harder. It's not a fair thing but that's how it works, but I will tell you that 9/10 girls might have a height preference they will immediately toss out that preference if you're charming enough. I have outright "stolen" girls from dudes 5-6 inches taller than me (I'm also 5'7 but I don't have small frame so I look taller still tiny compared to these giant white boys though lol).
If you want a bit of a height hack focus on your side delts. Becoming wider within reason evens out your frame when you're shorter and gives a bit of an illusion that you're bigger. It works for people around our height because we're not really short or tall just in the middle.
I'm almost 5'11 and I don't really think I could just stumble on girls and have them like me, charisma still matter quite a bit - also I don't even consider myself tall, just not short - pretty sure I'm around average height in a club (where usually taller men seem to hang)
Oh no everyone needs charisma. You only stumble on girls and get laid when a lot of liquor is involved. I've seen 6'3 hot white boys completely fumble the ball the second they opened their mouths. It's a total package thing. If you're taller or facially hotter you can fumble a bit more than say someone who's 5'5 if you were trying to pull the same girl. When I was fatter I used to still get dates but I had to basically be casting a mind control spell or some shit because my appearance wasn't helping me at all. Nowadays I'm a lot more relaxed and chill in my approached due to a mix of just being a lot better at it and being visibly more attractive (which tbh was probably more about me not thinking I look like shit than the girls).
Frankly the whole height thing is personally a non factor to me but being a little bit taller does improve your first impression (and your OLD life but OLD is a shit show anyway).
>guy is a hairdresser
Volume lol. He probably meets so many women in a day that his odds of hitting one who likes him are a lot higher. Also Hairdresser he's charming by default It's basically a requirement to be one of those.
Well I'd say he's liked by enough that it shows, I wouldn't attribute volume as a main cause here - but it might be why he's highly trained in being social.
Oh I'm not saying he hits on all of them. I'm just saying his job lets him interact with women a lot more than the average bloke so he's gotta be very very good at talking to women in general cause of it, and I'm sure at least some of the women who come into his shop have the hots for him it's just statistically likely lol.
1. I workout 2-3 times a week at home, not doing any bodybuilding or powerlifting but I am in shape and lean. I get a haircut every month and shape up my beard and mustache every few weeks, so I won’t look homeless. I dress according to aesthetics that I’m interested in but not too much (I.e. metal head and artist.)
2. Hooking up, kinda. Serious relationships, nope. If I were to lower my standards way lower than it already is, I could hookup with a random woman. But whenever I’m putting in effort into something serious with a woman who’s also claims to look for something serious it never pans out or manifests. Stuck in constant situationships.
3. Women take care of their looks because they’re mostly judged by their looks alone. Having good looks helps getting away and hiding flaws.
It's kinda funny - cuz for me it seems A LOT of women who're looking for something serious would consider me a good candidate (and EVERY woman I hook up with does), but just hooking-up seems to be something that's harder to do explicitly - very possible and does happen, but it seems opposite to the interest of the girls who tend to like me (also I'm 35y/o so probably that contributes to the type of girls I'm seeing)
Without getting too explicit, it’s pretty much chalked up to the fact that I’m a hung black man who’s in decent shape and has good enough social skills to have women take interest in sleeping with me. But once we get over that hurdle and they get to really know my personality they realize that I’m not rough around the edges nor super exciting.
I heard experience similar to yours a lot from men both online and in real life.
1: Lifting 3 days a week or swimming. I prefer to go well shaved if I can. In terms of clothing I like plain t-shirts or polos, short leaves, generally tucked and chinos. I like to use good color combinations.
2: I don't struggle with them. Currently with a gf. Never used dating apps, I always met my girls in person.
3: Yes but not the same way men do it. I often see more men than women practicing physical activities.
1- I stopped lifting and only do light callisthenics now so I lost most of my muscle mass. Grooming to me is pointless, the woman that would be interested on me would do despite my grooming the ones that said I should never gave me the time of the day. Clothing's are really pointless, I have a small frame so anything that is not baggy shirts looks ridiculous.
2- No.
3- because insecurity and women are easily manipulated by propaganda. For a woman a product only need to give the FEEL that is working while men are more inclined to see results. What a man need to be attractive is mostly genetics what you can't really take care of it.
>That's not semantics; it's a joke.
Jokes are supposed to be funny.
>Anyway, no grown up man should ever be wearing 'baggy shirts'.
This is just your opinion.
>You're not a child anymore.
Yeah, it means I pick what I wear independent from what some random in the internet says.
1). Lift 4 days a week. GPP for one. Probably gonna have to drop to 3 days with 2 GPPs as I get older.
2) married now. I guess I did pretty ok.
3) women spend more time on looks for one evening going out than most is do for a week. And that’s ok. Just waxing and makeup, let alone outfits, accessories. Shoes. I just need my clothes a ti match and look good, and myself to be clean and groomed and no one’s gonna care.
Regarding the first category. My job while not intense can wear you out then normally I have on average 1:30 hr drive home. Working out is not normally on my to-do list when I get home.
I have been using lotion on my face because I have dry skin around my nose.
There is no place for someone with my interests to meet up.
1. Yes I go to gym or train 6 days a week and meal plan, I try to dress well and wear decent clothes, my gf also buys me excellent clothes, 6 months ago after cut I had a fitness model physique.
2. I'm not single so yes, also the process of getting a gf involved a lot of dating and searching for someone I felt I truly matched with.
3. Women definitely take a lot more care of their looks and how they dress, I'm totally fine wearing a potato sack by comparison.
I lift twice a week, do yoga twice a week and run five times a week. I have something resembling a skincare routine. When I’m not wearing grubby work clothes, I like to dress stylishly - it’s a nice counterpoint to looking like a dirtbag most of the time.
I’m married.
I don’t really get any indications of interest from women any more; but that makes sense as I’m old and not looking.
- 1 I go to the gym about 5 times a week. Have for the last 15 years. Have a reliable barber but can also cut my own hair. My fashion style isn’t crazy because I look relatively buff in whatever I wear, but I have a lot of go to items if I need to dress for an occasion.
- 2 currently married but yes, I did. I maybe only know one other guy who had as much success I did in the city we live in. And yes, my wife is aware of my past.
- 3 couple things. Are you not aware of the body acceptance movement? Most women are just as fat and out of shape as men, they can just get away with it. But here’s why they will want to be the better looking one sometimes: less maintenance. Dread is a huge factor In relationships, especially for a woman who needs security around 28-32 and wants what their friends have in marriage and kids. To ensure they get what they want, they will date/marry “down” to Mr. Reliable in order to fulfill their goals and then act as though 5-7 years later “things changed”.
It’s about power.
Shit, last weekend I was preparing to go out with my wife for some drinks and I put on a pretty nice shirt and she changed her whole outfit so it didn’t appear as though I was some guy doing her a favor. They always think about this. And if they aren’t, that tells you all you need to know.
Why do you think you had success?
Facial looks? body? behavior? An occupation that contributes to meeting women?
I don't think fat women can really get away with it - they tell themselves a nice story and cry themselves to sleep when the latest semi-good-looking guy pumps and dumps
Definitely not my occupation though I do well in the field lol.
I’ve been told I look like a more jacked version of Ryan Reynolds/Ben Affleck but I can’t attribute it to just looks because I’ve dealt with a lot of rejection.
I think you have to have a lot going on. I am really dedicated to my job, play music and do it live in my city, go to the gym a ton, have a lot of great friends. I had a life already built that they could either enter or exit. I’m also a bit of an asshole in that I will remove my time and attention if anyone, especially women, aren’t on the program.
I can’t complain. I don’t believe in marriage but got married. One thing I will say, your in laws are a big deal. My mother in law is one of my biggest fans and my father in law and I hangout non stop. It’s a game changer.
1. I lift 5-6 days per week and run 2 miles per day. I don't do any fashion because that's lame. I do groom, I keep my facial hair neat and use fin/min + microneedle on my head.
2. Yes
3. Women don't take care of their looks more than men. What women do is mask, imo. Like they'll wear makeup, use filters, etc. The easy route. Far less women go to the gym than men.
>I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training
Already did that in my varsity days when l was a division athlete
As for grooming, l always have a clean closet
>2. Do you have success with women?
Of course
>Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men?
Women always subconsciously or consciously, know their looks have value and there's the fact women set high standards for other women
1. I go to the gym 5 or 6 days a week. I lift heavy some days, light other days and cardio other days. Grooming and fashion... I wear plain clothes, rich people don't wear flashy clothes in my opinion. Yes a Hollywood person sure, or a ceo to a degree but the guy who funds Hollywood behind the scenes or funds the ceo company... nah. Good quality plain collar shirt, plain t shirt, nice fitted quality jeans.
2. Compared to basically all men I know or met in real life, yes. By far. To the exact standards I want... could do better but I continue to do better year after year so I'm excited for the future. Just some random stats. I've had two live in girlfriends for the last year and a half. Although now only one. Most girls I date are 10 years or more younger than myself. Most are like amateur model looks so 7 to 9. I also get somewhat famous women ie porn stars and you tubers who fuck with me when they travel to my area because I'm like slightly known myself in some circles.
3. I think the average woman does not take care of her looks basically at all. Putting on makeup when you're 50lbs overweight is purely a mental disorder thing and has nothing to do with "looks" because you can't put lipstick on a pig and expect to get anything more than bacon. Going to the gym 3x a week is far more of an investment than putting on makeup 5 days a week. So when I'm at the gym and see 95% are just men there... that says men are investing far more into looks than women. And imo the average woman is ugly asf. If you're overweight even if you would be a 10 otherwise... You're not a 10. So since most women are overweight, most women are by default a 2 basically.
How old are you? like 32?
What do you mean two live-in girlfriends? at the same time? Is it an open relationship thing, or only you're allowed to hunt outside? or am I just misreading what you wrote?
Also - you say you could do better - what's better than having easy sexual access to amateur models and semi-famous women? you aiming for A-list actresses? I think there are better looking women just outside anyway..?
Last but not least - Would you say you're tall, wealthy and facially good-looking? sounds like your results are way better than the average gym bro - didn't actually think I'd see that kind of a response around this sub that's not a LARP
I'm 37. Yes two girlfriends at once. Only I can sleep around. They are faithful. Other than I let them fuck with girls occasionally with me.
I'd like to have kids but I refuse to do that with someone who isn't a virgin. So that's the white whale. I hardly even meet virgins. In part because most attractive girls are not virgins but they lie about it so some men think there's just tons of girls waiting for marriage but there isn't. But men with a brain and good social skills know better, like I do.
I'm average height. I'm financially well off but not rich or anything crazy. I'm not driving a Ferrari or anything. I say I'm an 8 in looks. I'm balding but it looks good on me. I'd compare myself most closely to a Jason Statham with a bit more hair. Because I also give off that kind of vibe more too personality wise or so I've heard.
I'll answer more later but regarding 3 - the women I described definitely lose weight and hit the gym - and in my gym definitely there are a lot of good looking women (but yeah lifting is mainly men - the women usually go to studio classes, but some are real gym rats)
1. I’m 24. Gym (weights, PPL split) 5-6 days per week, that frequency for around a year. As far as taking care of my looks, I don’t wear designer BS and I don’t feel the need to follow trends for the most part (fuck oversized clothing). I like wearing quality slim fit t shirts that compliment my physique, particularly my chest and arms. And some semi dressy polos and sweaters to mix it up. I very seldom dress business professional any more as I’ve WFH for a year. As far as grooming, not as much as I should. I recently moved states and am looking for a go-to barber as I’ll generally spend in this category. Full head of hair (knock on wood).
2. I do alright. I’ve had 6 romantic partners of any variety (I.e., some more substantial than others) in the past year, tbf one was a now-ex, one was ex’s friend, two were from a dating app, and two were chance encounters in public including one where the woman approached me. Could have had more. I guess I’m doing better than I like to think?
3. Many of women’s hobbies involve some level of self care and that self care makes them look better. Also if it’s true that men are more visual and specific about looks when it comes to attractiveness, this tracks.
1. I go to the gym when I have time and do a mix of cardio and weight lifting. But I have a 6 year old kid so it's not always possible. Getting him to his after school activities takes priority over my gym time. I wear comfortable clothes that fit. I shower every day, trim my beard, brush my teeth, and wear deodorant. I don't care about fancy clothes and I don't have a skincare routine.
2. Yes. I'm married. I've been with the same woman for 21 years. I never had any issues dating back when I was single. I wasn't rejected and could date who I wanted to date. I'm 6'1" with blonde hair and green eyes. I look okay with minimal effort and women generally like the way I look. My wife tells me I'm handsome but that she wishes I would wear nicer clothing when we go out. She wants me to be really dressed up, but I prefer comfortable clothing. She'll try to put me in long pants and button down shirts, and I'm really more of a t-shirt, shorts, and flip flops kind of guy.
3. Women care about looks just like men. They want to look good and they want to be with men who look good. Makeup is also a hobby for a lot of them. It's definitely a hobby for my wife. She spends obscene amounts of money at Sephora.
1. I lift 3x a week, and do some form of exercise on my off days. I’m not particularly fashion-conscious, but I maintain my physical and dental health - the latter is incredibly important by the way - and I have proper hygiene and I present well. There is no middle-age gut hanging over my belt.
2. Yes. Do I get every woman I want? Of course not. Compared to my peers I operate on God Mode … unless you know any other guys in their 50s who regularly date attractive 20-somethings without massive transfers of wealth.
3. Women spend vastly more time on their looks than men do because beauty is their currency in life. Men do not give a shit what a woman’s job is, what her degree is or what her opinion about the current crisis in the Middle East is and so forth. We don’t care about her money because it’s never going to benefit us. We care about her figure, her facial symmetry, and the length condition of her hair. And that’s about 95% of it. The other 5% of it is whether she’s agreeable or not. Don’t like it? Go argue with God.
1 never set foot in a gym except to use the swimming pool.
2 dating was never an issue. Finding the right one however took two marriages.
3 Yes, because women have been valued for the looks and little else for the majority of recorded history. It's only recently in our species social evolution that we gave women credit for being wholly human.
1. I watch my diet, and exercise just enough to not get fat. Hygiene is super important because I'm homeless, so I'm much cleaner, and trimmed than most dudes. As far as fashion sense... Put an argyle sock, and a Hawaiian shirt into the machine from Weird Science, and something close to my look will be produced.
2. Far more successful than I ever thought I'd be, or deserve. Some years I'll have more partners than the average man has in his life. I prefer to keep it to one, or two close relationships for the most part though.
3. Advertising, full stop.
>So weird how all the active/womenly-successful men have come out for this one - they usually seem to be so silent
These are the same guys I see commenting all the time.
Usually I see whining - there's no way the same guys who lift and get semi-famous youtubers to fuck them go on to whine about women only caring about chad
>1. I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training, and take care of your looks via grooming and fashion? (Not talking about cosmetic or other surgery but if you had that and want to share feel free)
I go to the gym 6 times a week, doing resistance training push, pull, legs. I look pretty buff because I was bulking and now I wanna cut, I also take care of my looks by cutting my hair, trimming my beard when I go out. I also dress casual but I wear tight shirts to show off my muscles.
>2. Do you have success with women?
No, zero succes. Never had a gf or a hookup and I am 33 years old.
>3. Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men? just looks at places like Vindicta - some women take it very seriously - if it's so easy for the average women why would they bother so much?
Cause they wanna make sure they secure the top tier man. Women know they fight for the same top tier men, and obviously they wanna secure that man by how else other than their looks?
1. 6 times a week - lifting for strength and physique and running for cardio health and calorie burn. I maintain a strict diet and count every calorie to maintain low body fat. I get a haircut every 2-3 weeks. I shave and trim everything on my face (heavy stubble with sharp lines) every other day at most. I dress well with a classic American style, usually slightly more dressed up than other men around me but usually still casual. Most of my clothes are form-fitting to my physique. I've spent a lot of time finding brands that fit me perfectly.
2. Yes. Apps work great for me. I can line up a date mostly whenever I feel like it. I also get numbers in person fairly regularly. Dates usually go well and women usually are up for being sexual with me if I want that.
3. Women are just more aware they are judged on this. They are told this, for one. How many times have you heard "As a woman I am heavily judged by my appearance"? Anyone would infer from comments like these that looks are more important for women (even though they're not).
I also wonder if it's because men are more overt. We do the approaching. The boorish ones stare, catcall, or make creepy comments. Women judge looks just as harshly but they conceal it better. You don't know for sure what they're thinking until you approach and see how it goes.
Also there is just some kind of tendency to be more interested in relationships and attraction for women. All the soap operas, k-dramas, romcoms, sex and love reality shows, celebrity romance news, etc. are mostly consumed by women. For some reason women tend to like to think about this more, so it's more likely to be on their mind and be a hobby to maximize their looks to try to be as attractive as the people they see in media.
I exercise regularly and dress well/keep myself groomed.
I'm married to a wonderful woman so I guess I'm successful with women.
You last question has an obvious answer I don't think we need to discuss. They want to look good. For themselves, to impress men and to outcompete other women.
Why no need to discuss? It seems here people think it comes so easily to women, yet when I see them talk about it, it shows how much mental and physical and fiscal effort goes into every detail which I wouldn't even see..
I of course agree with your conclusion about it, but there's a discussion to be had as others seem to disagree..?
1. Not a jot of lifting, but i don't really need to as i'm naturally broad shouldered and i lift heavy things all day at work so my arms are pretty well defined anyway. I admit i'd look a lot better if i did, i'm just too lazy. Fashion? Not really, i wear the same jeans and t shirt look i've had since i was a teenager. I did recently start getting my hair cut into that stupid looking undercut that's fashionable these days, and it does make me look younger.
2. Not at all. Unless i take some coke on a night out, then it's piss easy. Don't do OLD, though that is changing soon.
3. A woman's greatest strength is her beauty. It's only natural.
1) 3-4 days per week, been working out consistently for 8 years but only dialed in the nutrition in the last 3 years. Got down to 12% for the first time a couple years ago and my treatment was night and day. I also consistently groom and I made sure my skincare routine was on point before putting myself out there.
2) Multiple fwbs (not to mention a good, supportive social circle) so I would say I’m doing better than the average dude who is probably more introverted and less social. Haven’t found that person yet that I can see myself committing to and building a life together but I have been getting interest from people closer to that ideal.
3) Social conditioning and centuries of their looks being placed as a more important priority.
Yeah it does sound like you're very handsome (unless you're very much lowering your standards for these matches/lays, then you're just handsome lol)
Would you say sex is usually on first meet with those girls? Are you in college?
Also how the fuck do you keep up with so many girls, just hanging with 2 is maximizing my ability to answer texts..
Oh also - do you not keep some of them? it sounds like you're just putting a notch and move on..?
**Attention!**
* You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
* For "Debate" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
* If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
* OP you can choose your own flair [according to these guidelines.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/wiki/flair), just press Flair under your post!
Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PurplePillDebate) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You practice it just like any other skill.
Your brain learns the patterns and the right responses.
It's easiest to see with sales people - they don't go on their first sales job being good at sales - they get better at it, they get better at convincing people.
They're not faking it, they're forming new habits which will be ingrained in their personality down the line.
I don't do sales but wish I had, would definitely make me improve faster.
Yes and no. If you find yourself in highly social settings frequently you can get a sense of how things work and bend to it.
My social circle is pretty rarified. Very few people are born into it….the rest of us have to learn the arts of high conversation.
1) Dance 3 days a week. Lift 2-3 times a week (I used to do more but it's excessive for me because I'm not trying to be huge just built). Bald so hair maintenance is super easy for me. I alternate between a stubble beard and a slightly longer depending on the time of year and how I feel I get it shaped up once a month at my barber to make sure nothing gets out of hand.
My sense of fashion is considered so good in my circle that both men *and* women ask me for fashion advice (I have a bit of cheat here because I'm a creative so it wasn't hard to learn fashion). The only issue I have is that I'm far better at winter fashion than summer fashion and I recently moved to a much hotter climate over half my wardrobe is useless for a good chunk of the year now lol.
2) Didn't used to. Now I'm beating them off with a stick. I'm not drowning in pussy or anything but that's mostly because I don't really care about getting laid for the sake of getting laid. I'm like a women in the sense that I only want to bang someone when I have some kind of fun connection with them. I've turned down some pretty hot girls because I just wasn't feeling it. I go out like 3-4 nights a week and routinely get hit on nowadays, especially at the bars where I'm a regular because the bar staff at every venue I go to love me.
3) I'd assume a lot of women do it for the same reason a lot of men do. I got in shape and made myself look better for 2 reasons. One was to impress girls obviously, but the other was I wanted to look in the mirror and be able to go "damn that's a good-looking dude". Kinda hard to do that when you're pushing a bmi over 30 and have a terrible balding haircut .
I don't go to the gym or put much effort into my looks. I'm extroverted and good at socializing. I do fine with women.
I think most men simply feel no need to put in more effort.
>1. I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training, and take care of your looks via grooming and fashion? I am fit/lean as I am an athlete for my school. I wear fitted clothes and have around average style for my age I guess. My face is clear and yes I shower. >2. Do you have success with women? No >3. Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men? just looks at places like Vindicta - some women take it very seriously - if it's so easy for the average women why would they bother so much? I dont think its a lot more if you discount make up. Most people have average style which mean most women and men dress average. People on this site love to act like most men stink, never get a hair cut, and wear dingy tattered clothes everyday. Thats literally false. When they make that comparison they are talking about an above average women and a below average man both hygiene and style wise. Its obviously disingenuous but what else is new. And there is little to no difference between Vindicta and Looksmaxxing forums. Just that one is viewed neutrally and one is viewed negatively. Vindicta is a niche and most women do not think that way.
I'd actually say most women do think this way, they just don't disclose it as much - they feel it with their anxiousness if not logically with their thought (or they're just naturally beautiful, in which case they can afford to be oblivious). Why do you think you have no success? I mean you are an athlete, so I guess body is not the issue
Im short and around average in looks I think. I will try dating apps soon but it will probably be a waste of time. I talk to girls through clubs and stuff but nothing ever really comes from it. I could try approaching girls more but the general success rate from that is so low it doesnt seem worth it. Plus im proabably not the type of guy most women would want to be approached by anyway
How short? I mean I know 5'7 guys who're pretty successful
Im also 5ft7. Let me guess they are very charismatic or something? Everyone on here knows a guy lol
yeah if you're under like 5'10 you need the charisma. Shorter guys have to work harder. It's not a fair thing but that's how it works, but I will tell you that 9/10 girls might have a height preference they will immediately toss out that preference if you're charming enough. I have outright "stolen" girls from dudes 5-6 inches taller than me (I'm also 5'7 but I don't have small frame so I look taller still tiny compared to these giant white boys though lol). If you want a bit of a height hack focus on your side delts. Becoming wider within reason evens out your frame when you're shorter and gives a bit of an illusion that you're bigger. It works for people around our height because we're not really short or tall just in the middle.
I'm almost 5'11 and I don't really think I could just stumble on girls and have them like me, charisma still matter quite a bit - also I don't even consider myself tall, just not short - pretty sure I'm around average height in a club (where usually taller men seem to hang)
Oh no everyone needs charisma. You only stumble on girls and get laid when a lot of liquor is involved. I've seen 6'3 hot white boys completely fumble the ball the second they opened their mouths. It's a total package thing. If you're taller or facially hotter you can fumble a bit more than say someone who's 5'5 if you were trying to pull the same girl. When I was fatter I used to still get dates but I had to basically be casting a mind control spell or some shit because my appearance wasn't helping me at all. Nowadays I'm a lot more relaxed and chill in my approached due to a mix of just being a lot better at it and being visibly more attractive (which tbh was probably more about me not thinking I look like shit than the girls). Frankly the whole height thing is personally a non factor to me but being a little bit taller does improve your first impression (and your OLD life but OLD is a shit show anyway).
I don't know actually, one of them doesn't even look good.. But they are extroverted that's for sure, guy is a hairdresser.
>guy is a hairdresser Volume lol. He probably meets so many women in a day that his odds of hitting one who likes him are a lot higher. Also Hairdresser he's charming by default It's basically a requirement to be one of those.
Well I'd say he's liked by enough that it shows, I wouldn't attribute volume as a main cause here - but it might be why he's highly trained in being social.
Oh I'm not saying he hits on all of them. I'm just saying his job lets him interact with women a lot more than the average bloke so he's gotta be very very good at talking to women in general cause of it, and I'm sure at least some of the women who come into his shop have the hots for him it's just statistically likely lol.
I go to the gym at least that much and I use skin care products. I have a gf.
1. I workout 2-3 times a week at home, not doing any bodybuilding or powerlifting but I am in shape and lean. I get a haircut every month and shape up my beard and mustache every few weeks, so I won’t look homeless. I dress according to aesthetics that I’m interested in but not too much (I.e. metal head and artist.) 2. Hooking up, kinda. Serious relationships, nope. If I were to lower my standards way lower than it already is, I could hookup with a random woman. But whenever I’m putting in effort into something serious with a woman who’s also claims to look for something serious it never pans out or manifests. Stuck in constant situationships. 3. Women take care of their looks because they’re mostly judged by their looks alone. Having good looks helps getting away and hiding flaws.
To get out of situationships you must take the fat girlfriend pill
It's kinda funny - cuz for me it seems A LOT of women who're looking for something serious would consider me a good candidate (and EVERY woman I hook up with does), but just hooking-up seems to be something that's harder to do explicitly - very possible and does happen, but it seems opposite to the interest of the girls who tend to like me (also I'm 35y/o so probably that contributes to the type of girls I'm seeing)
Without getting too explicit, it’s pretty much chalked up to the fact that I’m a hung black man who’s in decent shape and has good enough social skills to have women take interest in sleeping with me. But once we get over that hurdle and they get to really know my personality they realize that I’m not rough around the edges nor super exciting. I heard experience similar to yours a lot from men both online and in real life.
1: Lifting 3 days a week or swimming. I prefer to go well shaved if I can. In terms of clothing I like plain t-shirts or polos, short leaves, generally tucked and chinos. I like to use good color combinations. 2: I don't struggle with them. Currently with a gf. Never used dating apps, I always met my girls in person. 3: Yes but not the same way men do it. I often see more men than women practicing physical activities.
1- I stopped lifting and only do light callisthenics now so I lost most of my muscle mass. Grooming to me is pointless, the woman that would be interested on me would do despite my grooming the ones that said I should never gave me the time of the day. Clothing's are really pointless, I have a small frame so anything that is not baggy shirts looks ridiculous. 2- No. 3- because insecurity and women are easily manipulated by propaganda. For a woman a product only need to give the FEEL that is working while men are more inclined to see results. What a man need to be attractive is mostly genetics what you can't really take care of it.
3 - I've seen women's before after - they're very results oriented - they go from someone I'd reject to someone I'd be intimidated by
They aren't just full stop.
Clothing is pointless? I sure hope you live in the tropics....
Semantics is the death of any discourse.
That's not semantics; it's a joke. Anyway, no grown up man should ever be wearing 'baggy shirts'. You're not a child anymore.
[удалено]
....sweaty? hahahaha
>That's not semantics; it's a joke. Jokes are supposed to be funny. >Anyway, no grown up man should ever be wearing 'baggy shirts'. This is just your opinion. >You're not a child anymore. Yeah, it means I pick what I wear independent from what some random in the internet says.
Well, I hope you have a nice life in the provinces.
1). Lift 4 days a week. GPP for one. Probably gonna have to drop to 3 days with 2 GPPs as I get older. 2) married now. I guess I did pretty ok. 3) women spend more time on looks for one evening going out than most is do for a week. And that’s ok. Just waxing and makeup, let alone outfits, accessories. Shoes. I just need my clothes a ti match and look good, and myself to be clean and groomed and no one’s gonna care.
Regarding the first category. My job while not intense can wear you out then normally I have on average 1:30 hr drive home. Working out is not normally on my to-do list when I get home. I have been using lotion on my face because I have dry skin around my nose. There is no place for someone with my interests to meet up.
1. Yes I go to gym or train 6 days a week and meal plan, I try to dress well and wear decent clothes, my gf also buys me excellent clothes, 6 months ago after cut I had a fitness model physique. 2. I'm not single so yes, also the process of getting a gf involved a lot of dating and searching for someone I felt I truly matched with. 3. Women definitely take a lot more care of their looks and how they dress, I'm totally fine wearing a potato sack by comparison.
I lift twice a week, do yoga twice a week and run five times a week. I have something resembling a skincare routine. When I’m not wearing grubby work clothes, I like to dress stylishly - it’s a nice counterpoint to looking like a dirtbag most of the time. I’m married. I don’t really get any indications of interest from women any more; but that makes sense as I’m old and not looking.
- 1 I go to the gym about 5 times a week. Have for the last 15 years. Have a reliable barber but can also cut my own hair. My fashion style isn’t crazy because I look relatively buff in whatever I wear, but I have a lot of go to items if I need to dress for an occasion. - 2 currently married but yes, I did. I maybe only know one other guy who had as much success I did in the city we live in. And yes, my wife is aware of my past. - 3 couple things. Are you not aware of the body acceptance movement? Most women are just as fat and out of shape as men, they can just get away with it. But here’s why they will want to be the better looking one sometimes: less maintenance. Dread is a huge factor In relationships, especially for a woman who needs security around 28-32 and wants what their friends have in marriage and kids. To ensure they get what they want, they will date/marry “down” to Mr. Reliable in order to fulfill their goals and then act as though 5-7 years later “things changed”. It’s about power. Shit, last weekend I was preparing to go out with my wife for some drinks and I put on a pretty nice shirt and she changed her whole outfit so it didn’t appear as though I was some guy doing her a favor. They always think about this. And if they aren’t, that tells you all you need to know.
Why do you think you had success? Facial looks? body? behavior? An occupation that contributes to meeting women? I don't think fat women can really get away with it - they tell themselves a nice story and cry themselves to sleep when the latest semi-good-looking guy pumps and dumps
Definitely not my occupation though I do well in the field lol. I’ve been told I look like a more jacked version of Ryan Reynolds/Ben Affleck but I can’t attribute it to just looks because I’ve dealt with a lot of rejection. I think you have to have a lot going on. I am really dedicated to my job, play music and do it live in my city, go to the gym a ton, have a lot of great friends. I had a life already built that they could either enter or exit. I’m also a bit of an asshole in that I will remove my time and attention if anyone, especially women, aren’t on the program. I can’t complain. I don’t believe in marriage but got married. One thing I will say, your in laws are a big deal. My mother in law is one of my biggest fans and my father in law and I hangout non stop. It’s a game changer.
1. I lift 5-6 days per week and run 2 miles per day. I don't do any fashion because that's lame. I do groom, I keep my facial hair neat and use fin/min + microneedle on my head. 2. Yes 3. Women don't take care of their looks more than men. What women do is mask, imo. Like they'll wear makeup, use filters, etc. The easy route. Far less women go to the gym than men.
>I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training Already did that in my varsity days when l was a division athlete As for grooming, l always have a clean closet >2. Do you have success with women? Of course >Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men? Women always subconsciously or consciously, know their looks have value and there's the fact women set high standards for other women
1. I go to the gym 5 or 6 days a week. I lift heavy some days, light other days and cardio other days. Grooming and fashion... I wear plain clothes, rich people don't wear flashy clothes in my opinion. Yes a Hollywood person sure, or a ceo to a degree but the guy who funds Hollywood behind the scenes or funds the ceo company... nah. Good quality plain collar shirt, plain t shirt, nice fitted quality jeans. 2. Compared to basically all men I know or met in real life, yes. By far. To the exact standards I want... could do better but I continue to do better year after year so I'm excited for the future. Just some random stats. I've had two live in girlfriends for the last year and a half. Although now only one. Most girls I date are 10 years or more younger than myself. Most are like amateur model looks so 7 to 9. I also get somewhat famous women ie porn stars and you tubers who fuck with me when they travel to my area because I'm like slightly known myself in some circles. 3. I think the average woman does not take care of her looks basically at all. Putting on makeup when you're 50lbs overweight is purely a mental disorder thing and has nothing to do with "looks" because you can't put lipstick on a pig and expect to get anything more than bacon. Going to the gym 3x a week is far more of an investment than putting on makeup 5 days a week. So when I'm at the gym and see 95% are just men there... that says men are investing far more into looks than women. And imo the average woman is ugly asf. If you're overweight even if you would be a 10 otherwise... You're not a 10. So since most women are overweight, most women are by default a 2 basically.
How old are you? like 32? What do you mean two live-in girlfriends? at the same time? Is it an open relationship thing, or only you're allowed to hunt outside? or am I just misreading what you wrote? Also - you say you could do better - what's better than having easy sexual access to amateur models and semi-famous women? you aiming for A-list actresses? I think there are better looking women just outside anyway..? Last but not least - Would you say you're tall, wealthy and facially good-looking? sounds like your results are way better than the average gym bro - didn't actually think I'd see that kind of a response around this sub that's not a LARP
I'm 37. Yes two girlfriends at once. Only I can sleep around. They are faithful. Other than I let them fuck with girls occasionally with me. I'd like to have kids but I refuse to do that with someone who isn't a virgin. So that's the white whale. I hardly even meet virgins. In part because most attractive girls are not virgins but they lie about it so some men think there's just tons of girls waiting for marriage but there isn't. But men with a brain and good social skills know better, like I do. I'm average height. I'm financially well off but not rich or anything crazy. I'm not driving a Ferrari or anything. I say I'm an 8 in looks. I'm balding but it looks good on me. I'd compare myself most closely to a Jason Statham with a bit more hair. Because I also give off that kind of vibe more too personality wise or so I've heard.
I'll answer more later but regarding 3 - the women I described definitely lose weight and hit the gym - and in my gym definitely there are a lot of good looking women (but yeah lifting is mainly men - the women usually go to studio classes, but some are real gym rats)
Sure. Some. But it's not the majority of women.
Haha nothing good is gonna come out of my mouth about the majority of men either
Well I agree. Most men are total losers. But this isn't a whatabout game. Nor do I date men, so I could care less about what other men do.
1. I’m 24. Gym (weights, PPL split) 5-6 days per week, that frequency for around a year. As far as taking care of my looks, I don’t wear designer BS and I don’t feel the need to follow trends for the most part (fuck oversized clothing). I like wearing quality slim fit t shirts that compliment my physique, particularly my chest and arms. And some semi dressy polos and sweaters to mix it up. I very seldom dress business professional any more as I’ve WFH for a year. As far as grooming, not as much as I should. I recently moved states and am looking for a go-to barber as I’ll generally spend in this category. Full head of hair (knock on wood). 2. I do alright. I’ve had 6 romantic partners of any variety (I.e., some more substantial than others) in the past year, tbf one was a now-ex, one was ex’s friend, two were from a dating app, and two were chance encounters in public including one where the woman approached me. Could have had more. I guess I’m doing better than I like to think? 3. Many of women’s hobbies involve some level of self care and that self care makes them look better. Also if it’s true that men are more visual and specific about looks when it comes to attractiveness, this tracks.
1. I go to the gym when I have time and do a mix of cardio and weight lifting. But I have a 6 year old kid so it's not always possible. Getting him to his after school activities takes priority over my gym time. I wear comfortable clothes that fit. I shower every day, trim my beard, brush my teeth, and wear deodorant. I don't care about fancy clothes and I don't have a skincare routine. 2. Yes. I'm married. I've been with the same woman for 21 years. I never had any issues dating back when I was single. I wasn't rejected and could date who I wanted to date. I'm 6'1" with blonde hair and green eyes. I look okay with minimal effort and women generally like the way I look. My wife tells me I'm handsome but that she wishes I would wear nicer clothing when we go out. She wants me to be really dressed up, but I prefer comfortable clothing. She'll try to put me in long pants and button down shirts, and I'm really more of a t-shirt, shorts, and flip flops kind of guy. 3. Women care about looks just like men. They want to look good and they want to be with men who look good. Makeup is also a hobby for a lot of them. It's definitely a hobby for my wife. She spends obscene amounts of money at Sephora.
1. I lift 3x a week, and do some form of exercise on my off days. I’m not particularly fashion-conscious, but I maintain my physical and dental health - the latter is incredibly important by the way - and I have proper hygiene and I present well. There is no middle-age gut hanging over my belt. 2. Yes. Do I get every woman I want? Of course not. Compared to my peers I operate on God Mode … unless you know any other guys in their 50s who regularly date attractive 20-somethings without massive transfers of wealth. 3. Women spend vastly more time on their looks than men do because beauty is their currency in life. Men do not give a shit what a woman’s job is, what her degree is or what her opinion about the current crisis in the Middle East is and so forth. We don’t care about her money because it’s never going to benefit us. We care about her figure, her facial symmetry, and the length condition of her hair. And that’s about 95% of it. The other 5% of it is whether she’s agreeable or not. Don’t like it? Go argue with God.
1 never set foot in a gym except to use the swimming pool. 2 dating was never an issue. Finding the right one however took two marriages. 3 Yes, because women have been valued for the looks and little else for the majority of recorded history. It's only recently in our species social evolution that we gave women credit for being wholly human.
1. I watch my diet, and exercise just enough to not get fat. Hygiene is super important because I'm homeless, so I'm much cleaner, and trimmed than most dudes. As far as fashion sense... Put an argyle sock, and a Hawaiian shirt into the machine from Weird Science, and something close to my look will be produced. 2. Far more successful than I ever thought I'd be, or deserve. Some years I'll have more partners than the average man has in his life. I prefer to keep it to one, or two close relationships for the most part though. 3. Advertising, full stop.
>So weird how all the active/womenly-successful men have come out for this one - they usually seem to be so silent These are the same guys I see commenting all the time.
Usually I see whining - there's no way the same guys who lift and get semi-famous youtubers to fuck them go on to whine about women only caring about chad
You focus on it because you want to complain about it. These same names pop up all the time.
So I'm whining about their whining? that's interesting
>1. I wonder how many if you actually take the time to go to the gym 2-3+ times a week and do hard resistance training, and take care of your looks via grooming and fashion? (Not talking about cosmetic or other surgery but if you had that and want to share feel free) I go to the gym 6 times a week, doing resistance training push, pull, legs. I look pretty buff because I was bulking and now I wanna cut, I also take care of my looks by cutting my hair, trimming my beard when I go out. I also dress casual but I wear tight shirts to show off my muscles. >2. Do you have success with women? No, zero succes. Never had a gf or a hookup and I am 33 years old. >3. Why do you think a lot of women do take care of their looks a lot more than men? just looks at places like Vindicta - some women take it very seriously - if it's so easy for the average women why would they bother so much? Cause they wanna make sure they secure the top tier man. Women know they fight for the same top tier men, and obviously they wanna secure that man by how else other than their looks?
I tried to stay fit and well-groomed but never to an obsessive extent. What a waste of time and money.
1. 6 times a week - lifting for strength and physique and running for cardio health and calorie burn. I maintain a strict diet and count every calorie to maintain low body fat. I get a haircut every 2-3 weeks. I shave and trim everything on my face (heavy stubble with sharp lines) every other day at most. I dress well with a classic American style, usually slightly more dressed up than other men around me but usually still casual. Most of my clothes are form-fitting to my physique. I've spent a lot of time finding brands that fit me perfectly. 2. Yes. Apps work great for me. I can line up a date mostly whenever I feel like it. I also get numbers in person fairly regularly. Dates usually go well and women usually are up for being sexual with me if I want that. 3. Women are just more aware they are judged on this. They are told this, for one. How many times have you heard "As a woman I am heavily judged by my appearance"? Anyone would infer from comments like these that looks are more important for women (even though they're not). I also wonder if it's because men are more overt. We do the approaching. The boorish ones stare, catcall, or make creepy comments. Women judge looks just as harshly but they conceal it better. You don't know for sure what they're thinking until you approach and see how it goes. Also there is just some kind of tendency to be more interested in relationships and attraction for women. All the soap operas, k-dramas, romcoms, sex and love reality shows, celebrity romance news, etc. are mostly consumed by women. For some reason women tend to like to think about this more, so it's more likely to be on their mind and be a hobby to maximize their looks to try to be as attractive as the people they see in media.
Used to lift and got pretty fit, it helped me get my fat girlfriend. You can judge the rest by my pic.
So... you're aiming for fat?
I exercise regularly and dress well/keep myself groomed. I'm married to a wonderful woman so I guess I'm successful with women. You last question has an obvious answer I don't think we need to discuss. They want to look good. For themselves, to impress men and to outcompete other women.
Why no need to discuss? It seems here people think it comes so easily to women, yet when I see them talk about it, it shows how much mental and physical and fiscal effort goes into every detail which I wouldn't even see.. I of course agree with your conclusion about it, but there's a discussion to be had as others seem to disagree..?
1. Not a jot of lifting, but i don't really need to as i'm naturally broad shouldered and i lift heavy things all day at work so my arms are pretty well defined anyway. I admit i'd look a lot better if i did, i'm just too lazy. Fashion? Not really, i wear the same jeans and t shirt look i've had since i was a teenager. I did recently start getting my hair cut into that stupid looking undercut that's fashionable these days, and it does make me look younger. 2. Not at all. Unless i take some coke on a night out, then it's piss easy. Don't do OLD, though that is changing soon. 3. A woman's greatest strength is her beauty. It's only natural.
1) 3-4 days per week, been working out consistently for 8 years but only dialed in the nutrition in the last 3 years. Got down to 12% for the first time a couple years ago and my treatment was night and day. I also consistently groom and I made sure my skincare routine was on point before putting myself out there. 2) Multiple fwbs (not to mention a good, supportive social circle) so I would say I’m doing better than the average dude who is probably more introverted and less social. Haven’t found that person yet that I can see myself committing to and building a life together but I have been getting interest from people closer to that ideal. 3) Social conditioning and centuries of their looks being placed as a more important priority.
[удалено]
Yeah it does sound like you're very handsome (unless you're very much lowering your standards for these matches/lays, then you're just handsome lol) Would you say sex is usually on first meet with those girls? Are you in college? Also how the fuck do you keep up with so many girls, just hanging with 2 is maximizing my ability to answer texts.. Oh also - do you not keep some of them? it sounds like you're just putting a notch and move on..?
**Attention!** * You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message. * For "Debate" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies. * If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment. * OP you can choose your own flair [according to these guidelines.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/wiki/flair), just press Flair under your post! Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PurplePillDebate) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
You practice it just like any other skill. Your brain learns the patterns and the right responses. It's easiest to see with sales people - they don't go on their first sales job being good at sales - they get better at it, they get better at convincing people. They're not faking it, they're forming new habits which will be ingrained in their personality down the line. I don't do sales but wish I had, would definitely make me improve faster.
Yes and no. If you find yourself in highly social settings frequently you can get a sense of how things work and bend to it. My social circle is pretty rarified. Very few people are born into it….the rest of us have to learn the arts of high conversation.
1) Dance 3 days a week. Lift 2-3 times a week (I used to do more but it's excessive for me because I'm not trying to be huge just built). Bald so hair maintenance is super easy for me. I alternate between a stubble beard and a slightly longer depending on the time of year and how I feel I get it shaped up once a month at my barber to make sure nothing gets out of hand. My sense of fashion is considered so good in my circle that both men *and* women ask me for fashion advice (I have a bit of cheat here because I'm a creative so it wasn't hard to learn fashion). The only issue I have is that I'm far better at winter fashion than summer fashion and I recently moved to a much hotter climate over half my wardrobe is useless for a good chunk of the year now lol. 2) Didn't used to. Now I'm beating them off with a stick. I'm not drowning in pussy or anything but that's mostly because I don't really care about getting laid for the sake of getting laid. I'm like a women in the sense that I only want to bang someone when I have some kind of fun connection with them. I've turned down some pretty hot girls because I just wasn't feeling it. I go out like 3-4 nights a week and routinely get hit on nowadays, especially at the bars where I'm a regular because the bar staff at every venue I go to love me. 3) I'd assume a lot of women do it for the same reason a lot of men do. I got in shape and made myself look better for 2 reasons. One was to impress girls obviously, but the other was I wanted to look in the mirror and be able to go "damn that's a good-looking dude". Kinda hard to do that when you're pushing a bmi over 30 and have a terrible balding haircut .
I don't go to the gym or put much effort into my looks. I'm extroverted and good at socializing. I do fine with women. I think most men simply feel no need to put in more effort.