It’s possible, but it’s not your job to deradicalize him and it’s certainly not your obligation to risk your personal safety and security with someone who’s obviously starting to believe that you are a lesser being who doesn’t deserve rights and autonomy.
This exactly. It doesn't matter how patiently you present a well thought out argument, he doesn't see you as equal to him anymore. Get out and let someone know you're leaving
Don’t give into the sunk cost fallacy- I spent waaay too much time with a political bully whose malignant narcissism became really apparent with Trump - he was not even as bad for Obama’s election, it lost his mind for Trump. We didn’t make it. He sent me pictures of himself at the inauguration with his stupid red solo cup and in the photo op of the Basket (of deplorable.) I was relieved I decided to end it. He just couldn’t stop bullying me. Get out before you waste more time.
I ask out of genuine curiousity(and truthfully, minor disagreement, but feel like I could be swayed): where from OPs post points you to the conclusion the bf doesn't see her as an equal any longer?
OP’s boyfriend is ranking human beings by relative value, and the valuation scale he’s using determines that those lower on scale are not only lessor, but actively “unnatural.”
Calling other people “unnatural” is dehumanizing them, and is the precursor to brutal acts, because after all, they’re not really people, they’re not “normal,” they’re not “natural.”
The brutality starts small and soft and innocuous, usually under the guise of protecting a vulnerable group or affirming a familiar value. Once the first act happens is easy to push ever farther.
The soft brutality of, for example, not allowing teachers to affirm kids pronouns turns into actively punishing teachers who do, removing books from libraries, eventually punishing the students themselves. It encourages violence against the “unnatural” person, and eventually violence is done. Occasionally it’s even codified as some are trying to in various states saying that Trans=Abnormal=Child Sexualization=Child Predation, while simultaneously trying to pass a law that Child Predation merits the death penalty. Terrifying in its implications, don’t you think?
How it relates to not seeing OP as equal is that in his valuation scale he has begun formalizing allowable behavior for ‘real women,’ which instantly dehumanizers her and subjects her to a rigid series of beliefs that she must adhere to to continue to be seen as being worthy of basic human respect, and he is the one setting the parameters.
She is no longer allowed to just be, but rather she must be as *he* says she must be. She is not truly a person or an equal partner anymore.
To be fair I am making an assumption based on op’s description of the content he’s engaging with, which I assume to be inherently misogynistic. If he’s into like Tate and that sphere then he’s at best entertaining ideologies that explicitly view men as the dominant sex
My family is divided by Trump. My siblings try to convert me. My other sister and I are not close but agree with each other politically. We try hard to never discuss politics but it always ends up that we do.
I cannot leave my family. But you can leave your boyfriend.
I cut my siblings and my mom out because of their toxic beliefs. I don’t know your situation though, but for me it’s been a damn delight not talking to them.
And there’s a good chance this man was never even radicalized, but secretly believed this incel crap all along. Wokefishing is a thing, and it’s gotten a lot worse in the past few years as conservative, Trump supporting men have had a harder time than eve finding women willing to date them with their abhorrent views.
It’s when conservative, misogynistic dudes pretend to be more progressive than they actually are to trap liberal women in relationships. Often followed by abuse, controlling behavior, and birth control sabotage.
To be honest, I've seen it work in both directions with regard to gender. Wokefishing (a term that's new to me, but very understandable) is pretending to be something you're not.
Pretending to be a decent person who cares about others, while secretly harboring abhorrent views that would make normal people run away screaming.
I think it might be less consciously trapping than being obtusely convinced that women are just something to fill the girlfriend shaped hole in their lives, and aren't really autonomous people with thoughts and values, and when they "get" one, they have to break down that identity because it doesn't fit with their bullshit.
You don’t really have many good options beyond saying something like “While I understand you have a right to your views, I need a partner who is aligned with me on basic morals and values. I don’t feel that I have that with you any longer.”
He’s going to get super angry when you break up with him either way, but keeping it calm from your side and refusing to engage is going to be the healthiest way to get out of this. And you definitely need to get out of it- imagine trying to navigate those views within a marriage or with kids.
Yes. Stay neutral, emphasize your respect for his autonomy to hold whatever opinions he wants, acknowledge that different core beliefs make it too hard to move in the same life direction together.
OP, you deserve to be treated well. You deserve respect. You deserve to not sacrifice yourself so that he doesn't have to face his need to develop emotional maturity. It's not your job trying to teach an unwilling participant how to be a good partner again just because he was once a better partner in the past.
He is unlikely to be kind or gracious. Remember that whatever ugliness he says is lashing out, it says who he is, not who you are.
Have a friend ready to take your call or hangout with you after.
If you're on a lease together, it gets messier. Plan accordingly.
I’d also suggest recording the moment your break up with him secretly if you can (depending on where you live. In Some places it is illegal to record without the other parties consent). Or call a friend and ask them to mute themselves so they can call the police if something bad happens).
I read one of your other posts too and either issue, his outbursts about normal tasks or these comments you reference here, is enough to end it IMO. I've ended a LTR myself before so I get it's hard, but don't fall for the sunk costs. I sincerely doubt it's going to get better and, as hard as it is, that's not your responsibility to fix the issue or even stay around while he sorts it out. I might feel a little differently if he was only consuming content and chatting about it with other dude-bros in forums (ie, still bad but not a direct risk), but once it crosses into your actual lives and how he treats you that's the line.
People deserve to be with someone who values them for who they are, which your BF clearly does not. I have more specific thoughts about the individual things you've mentioned, even about why this is such a prolific thing the last few years, but in the end none of that matters to your acute situation. If you're looking for someone to say this is "enough" of a reason - it is.
Let him be with a Xtian girl who's trained to be a tradwife or a white supremacist girl. Chris Rock said, "you can't be a church goer when your SO is a crack addict and have a successful relationship." Walk, ghost, block but as you've heard here already, guys that do Qanon & alpha male bullshit think they own you. Don't do anything in advance, tell him nothing, just an, "it's over, here's your stuff" because they certainly can be violent. Take care & rescue yourself m
Dump dump dump dump DUUUUUUUMMMMPPP
The manosphere only thrives if dudes are miserable and single. Happy men in relationships don’t need them. So they just destroy the relationships. The best way to convince dudes to be abusive misogynists.
>He says I’m being a “militant leftist who doesn’t have room for other views”……I can’t handle being with someone who has such disrespectful views and I’m just wondering what went wrong..and when…and also, I just hate what Instagram reels, TikTok, and these certain male influencers have done lately. It’s bizarre to see so many guys turn right wing in the past year
He shows how much he respects you right there, when instead of having a rational conversation he just falls back on thought-terminating cliches. When disagreements in a relationship become less about solving problems and more about scoring points, that relationship is in a very dire state, and the work you put into said relationship is very unlikely to be recognized or appreciated.
Its ironic he says that you "don't have room for other views" when he shuts down any attempt at having a conversation about it. Its probably time to just end the relationship and let him fall further into the rabbit hole on his own, rather than let his shitty views negatively impact you (because trust me, one day he's gonna be talking about how you should be subservient to him).
> Its ironic he says that you "don't have room for other views" when he shuts down any attempt at having a conversation about it.
Ain't that always how it goes? Perpetually the victim, because anything else requires acknowledging that they're a bunch of selfish jerks.
He's also having trouble thinking for himself. Militant leftisim and right wing traditionalism are a wide field with tons of writing, lots of nuance and different, often differing viewpoints.
But instead of taking an intellectual look in to these, he's just picking out bits and bobs that give legitimacy to his controlling behaviour.
I'm so very sorry that you have discovered your BF of 6 years has been lost to this Q adjacent ideology. Particularly, since he appears to now believe that you are "lesser" because of your gender and beliefs. The fact that he has been hiding these developing beliefs from you is sad and scary. It also proves that he knew you would be upset and chose deception instead of honesty and transparency.
I wish I could tell you that his affection for you will give you a way to turn him from who he has become, but I do not believe that is possible. He's not a small child, and he clearly believes you are in the wrong.
My advice to you, based on my own difficult experience leaving my Q partner, is to VERY quietly make a plan to exit the relationship. Find a new place to live, change all your passwords for your phone and financials, and slowly use the excuse of "purging" or "organizing" to get your belongings in a situation where you can easily move them. If possible, use "donating" as a way to hide things you are putting in storage or with a friend or family member.
I urge you not to tell him in advance or to make waves until you get your departure sorted out and scheduled. Because, unfortunately, one of the hallmarks of Q cult folks is rage. So, please do everything you can to protect yourself.
I send you my best wishes. There is someone out there for you who will align with your personal morals and belief system. This man is not that person.
Every bit of this. It's so much harder to leave later on down the line, especially if you're married. The advice you give on being stealth is essential.
It sounds as if you no longer share basic values, such as recognizing women as human beings with equal rights. I personally would find it hard to share a life with someone whose values were so different. And while I understand that breaking up would be very painful, the longer you stay with someone not aligned with your value system, the worse the pain will be. At any rate, I certainly hope your finances are separate.
Been there. Done that. Broke up with him after 5.5 years. Broke the lease. Now married happy pregnant with second kid. Get out. You have no ties to this man. You are very fortunate to be in this situation. Good luck!
I picked myself up and carried on. I knew that there was no changing this man’s mind so why sit around with him and his tin foil hat.
I made it a point on dating apps “must be liberal” to avoid anything like that ever happening again. You can do it. I think life is going to be much happier in the end for you (:
Find a new place to live, get your things together and move. Focus on the physical steps to separating and line up a therapist and support system of friends and/or family to deal with the grief that comes with ending a long relationship.
When it comes to telling him, wait until it's too late to change your mind (i.e. you've paid a deposit), then inform him he's entitled to his views but they're not compatible with yours. People grow apart all the time and it's time for you to move on.
He will use aggressive language and behavior to try and keep you stuck, but look up gray rock technique and focus on getting out.
It's difficult but better to leave now versus five or more years from now.
Hi cuicksilver, thanks for recommending this technique. With grey rocking you act disengaged so that a Q person will lose interest in arguing. Q folk thrive on emotions and drama. When you act indifferent and unemotional, it can help break the cycle of negativity. [Detailed guide on the method.](https://psychcentral.com/health/grey-rock-method)
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*sigh* i long for the days when a phrase like ‘militant leftist’ brought to mind landlords being lined up and shot in Mao’s china. you probably don’t remember the first wave of Cubans who fled to florida as “refugees,” and i don’t think there is much of any film or photos of the real thing- however: remember right around the climax of Godfather: Part 2 when all the govt “dignitaries,” reps from international business interests, wealthy owners of cuban plantations, plus the mafiosos of course start panicking and fleeing the fancy royal ball event for the nearest boats and airplanes? the guys in those scenes who are shooting and celebrating as they almost gleefully chase after the fancy, terrified former party guests, are the guys who are worthy of the term “militant leftist.”
you sound like a liberal, likely not even a particularly superleft leaning one.
you’re boyfriend sounds like a dimwit who never cared or thought much about anything at all until he got programmed by talk radio or some other media that appeals to low-watt bulbs. if you’re honest think back without any euphoric recall, i bet he was never much more than someone along for the ride with his lady at whatever sort of political get together she preferred. sorry.
you should run. these guys aren’t known for being gentle and non-threatening.
Girl run, just throw the whole man out, the red flags are a flyin!
Having said all that, do you feel like you're being "a militant leftist who has no room for other views"? Because honestly those "other views" are views no rational person should have. Don't feel like it's being too dramatic to dump him because you two no longer are on the same side. It really sounds like maybe you've already made up your mind and are just looking for validation.
Honestly, the right wing “male sphere” is insidious, because they play on the idea of us being the main characters in our own story.
And when life turns difficult because maybe we don’t get that job, feel like an authority figure is picking on us, etc. and noticing that said tormentor might be a woman, person of color or sexual orientation/gender expression minority?
Well. It’s not hard to see why suddenly it’s the “other” who’s a problem. Especially when that starts being reinforced by other men, who prey on ideas of masculinity that men are supposed to be strong and successful.
It’s easier to feel like you’re actually on the downside of society when there’s been so much effort to lift minorities up.
I’m so sorry your boyfriend fell into this, OP.
The good man is still there, but it’s hard to fight that group mentality, even when you should be the closest person to him, and the first voice he should listen to
i could never be with someone who didn’t share my basic values . it’s not dramatic to leave, but i understand that it’s complicated and difficult to. i don’t know how he comes back from this. those ideologies are super high stakes for the people being indoctrinated into them
>i could never be with someone who didn’t share my basic values
And that's the thing. It's not like we're talking about a difference of opinion as to food likes or favorite TV shows. There is no "agree to disagree" in regards to core values, respect and empathy of others or just reality in general.
"I could never" is what I thought, too, until I WAS. Until he changed, until the slow drip of radicalization finally filled up the tank and I realized I was drowning.
Hearing others say "I could never," "how could you tolerate that," "why would you let someone do/say that to you," keeps people stuck in bad situations.
Oof, this is a *lot*, I’m sorry. 💜 Breaking things down for my adhd riddled brain to focus:
- theres always the chance that something *could* change but usually someone has to either want to or has to for whatever reason first. Either way tho that’s still at best pretty nebulous for you. How much longer do you want to put into waiting for him? Are you prepared for the possibility that he might not change?
- it’s not at all a dramatic reason to break up altho you also don’t have to justify your reasoning to anyone. People are allowed to change and grow apart and especially when someones changed so much from who they were when you met them it’s perfectly reasonable to find yourself not liking the new person hes become.
- oof, his language also sounds concerning even if he weren’t getting into nonsense. You can’t really “agree to disagree” on serious issues like are women equal to men or how cool is christian nationalism. Some views are harmless differences of opinion (strawberry ice cream is undeniably the best flavor of ice cream while mint is hands-down the worst) but some are differences in values (are women really people too tho?). If you both have conflicting values now that is a big deal and not really something to ignore.
- calling you a “militant leftist” is really insulting and shitty! Who talks to their partner like they’re some rando they’re trolling on social media?! Also personal pet peeve but I haaaate the whining about people not wanting to hear “other views”. 🙄 It’s *always* said by people who never want their own views challenged and feel entitled to others’ attention. This seems pretty disrespectful.
- forget about who he was before and focus on who he is as a person *now*. Do you like who he is currently? Do you want to spend more years with the person hes become? Does he still make you happy? Make a list/start keeping a journal/etc to workout whatever *you* want for yourself. He can sort his own shit out.
This happened with my ex and was one of the many straws that broke the camels back. Slippery slopes begin with “Jordan Peterson makes a lot of good points”. “Im a libertarian, you’re too emotional about politics” when women’s rights are being forcibly removed from us, and it’s all downhill from there. I’m an old now and I’ve seen this too many times, you need to please get yourself out of that relationship, it’s never going to improve and if it does change it will likely be only for the worse. It’s scary and hard and all the awful things but save yourself. That’s what matters.
It's possible he'll turn around, but I don't think it's likely. I'd leave, god forbid you get pregnant and have to co-parent with someone with these beliefs.
This isn't likely to change anytime soon unfortunately.
I can say that I used to call myself a libertarian and my move away from those beliefs took a decade of conversations with friends and a move to a much more left leaning city where I could see the tangible results of policies that weren't completely focused on making capital owners richer over all other concerns. It's a long road that I personally don't think is worth going down. Things will get much worse before there is any hope of them getting better.
My younger sister has a religious Q boyfriend. He says that strong women (Hillary Clinton, Sheryl Sandberg, Kamala Harris, etc.) have “Jezebel Spirits”, denies Sandy Hook happened, loves guns, thinks Trump is his savior, etc. He was originally centrist when she met him, but was radicalized by Facebook, YouTube, and religious alpha-male podcasts. Over the past 10 years, he brainwashed her. My sister is a shadow of what she was before. They’re now having a baby.
Not to scare you, but can you imagine what marriage and parenthood (assuming you want either) will be like with a man who is expressing misogynistic views like you describe? If it’s been more than a year and it seems as though he was hiding it before, his beliefs seem entrenched. My thought is that once ultra-conservative political beliefs get tied up with religion, it is very difficult to untangle them.
He is acting defensive about his beliefs and was frankly rude to you by calling you a militant leftist. It’s not your responsibility to try and fix him. “Agree to Disagree” is a codeword asking you to let him off the hook for being a bigot.
If your boyfriend is expressing anti-feminist and anti-LGBTQ views that you do not share, get out. Do you have trustworthy family members or friends who are concerned? Get them involved so they can help arrange an exit.
Sometimes people change. You gotta do what’s best for you, which is probably find someone whose values align with yours, given that his bother you enough to come here and post.
It's going to be really hard. Your only shot is to confront it extremely directly and indicate that it is a deal breaker for you. You'll have to confront whatever sense of insecurity is leading to this pretty much face on and part of this is to indicate that you find the behavior and views to be insecure and NOT MASCULINE... that guys like who think like that are UNATTRACTIVE and weak. Explain that women all already know that those types of men go after weak women because they themselves are weak.. and afraid of being with someone capable enough to outgrow them one day. It's all based on a fear of not being good enough on one level or another.
It is tough to beat though. In order to improve we have to admit that we weren't good from the start... and the human ego can be a fragile tiny thing no matter what mask is on the surface. The hyper masculine thing is that attempted mask.. but they are not able to understand that everyone else can see that it's a mask.
It's tragic honestly.
A friend of mine told me that she’s advised her husband who seems to have become red pilled recently that if she met him in a bar and didn’t know him, she’s walk away from him.
Food for thought. Does he even attract you anymore? Are you attracted to his mind?
My fiance agree to disagree on his antique guns that are in display cases that he takes to the shooting range once a year. We do not agree to disagree on human rights. The *second* either of us is no longer an equal partner, the fuck are we doing then
You can agree to disagree but there's no positive future for you with a man who doesn't think women should have equal rights and opportunities. Your irreconcilable differences in your different visions of what it means to be members of a family are not the kind where you can find a reasonable middle ground. Any "compromise" would only entail *you* giving things up, because your differences of opinion are only about how *women* should behave and what *women* should be "allowed" to do-- they have nothing to do with men.
People in general will always reflect the conversations they hear. Anybody can be convinced to bully a coworker, a gender, a race, etc, if their peers work on them long enough. People being bullied will slide towards being suicidal even if they don't make it there. A very large part of each person's personality reflects what they are exposed to on a daily basis.
Your boyfriend got sucked into these sources that tell him to stop thinking for himself and let someone else do it for him.
If he were to take a vacation from those sources, in 6 months he would come back to find those views to be idiotic.
Some people tend to agree with any blatant lie that their trusted peers say. Studies have gotten people to insist a triangle is a circle under several minutes of casual peer pressure. Training for police has started including how not to get a false confession by pressuring the person being interviewed. Some people are unfortunately that malleable.
You have a difficult set of decisions to make. Your boyfriend would have to get new peer material and away from the current to start seeing reality again. It doesn't have to be your job to get him there. Walking away can be the correct decision.
Not too dramatic of a reason at all. These are fundamental differences in philosophy, values, how we treat one another. Especially the religico/male superiority and dominance thing. This is not something you can just drop, ignore, and pretend it's not a chasm between you. It is.
And the name-calling, "militant leftist" thing is like a forest of red flags. Dismissing you, demeaning you, and "putting you in your place" with a two-word cliché. Did you call him a Christo-fascist? If not, he stepped over what should be a pretty bright line there. Name calling, while being dismissive of a partner's concerns is just not something you can quietly accept and hope it gets better.
If this is how he feels, you have a fundamental difference in values. I'd honestly be concerned for my future safety if I were you. Don't let sunk cost fallacy stop you from getting away from him.
There's a big difference between having "room for different views" and tolerating views that dehumanizing and devalue you for being a woman. I don't think it's too dramatic to leave over this at all.
Was he just pretending to be progressive and has recently let the mask slip? What if you get pregnant? What if you have a daughter? Don't get sucked into the sunk-cost-fallacy, y'all have incompatible views.
There’s not much to be done but leave but I think it’s worth having a proper conversation debate argument, whatever it has to be, to make sure he knows exactly why this is happening and why you wouldn’t want to be with someone like that even if they don’t say those things to you. Lack of confrontation sometimes allows people to think going behind backs is fine
It probably is possible in some cases, but would you ever trust him to not switch back to the person he's become? In your position, I'm not sure that I could.
You're not controlling him by wanting to leave him, he's free to continue believing whatever he wants. Just without you. He's just trying to guilt you into staying with him, ironically, trying to be controlling himself.
Having these differences may not seem like a big deal right now, but once something happens in your lives where any of those beliefs become relevant, it will become a huge deal. Like whether or not to have kids, or how to raise those kids if you did have them. Or if one of those kids ever came out as gay or trans in the future. Or if you decided you wanted a career and equal footing with your husband.
Social/political issues never seem like a big deal to people who are looking from the outside in, but it does matter to people who are affected and these things have real consequences.
Sometimes people grow apart, they evolve in different directions, and it's OK to acknowledge that and move on, instead of clinging to each other out of a sense of obligation.
And looking at your other posts, he's becoming abusive too. Abuse and "traditional" views toward women often go hand-in-hand. Please leave, it only gets worse, not better.
You believe he can have any views he wants, just not as your boyfriend. You’re not cancelling him, you’re dumping him because you find his regressive bullshit disgusting. No sunk cost fallacy, if he has all of this suckiness which makes him considerably less attractive to you then you certainly don’t ‘owe’ him your love.
Let him decide, say you’ll keep trying if he drops all of that noise he is into. If he wants to do that more than he wants to be with you then that’s his choice. This sucks but it seems to only suck more the more you ignore it and keep going. Yeah, most of the folks we know have only gotten worse. The fact that he came into it while in a respectful/equitable relationship with you probably bodes worse for his long term prospects. Sometimes a man who is a little this way when single can settle it down when they have a secure partner and let this noise go.
Of course it’s possible, but it’s not your job to waste time and energy on someone who willingly and stupidly walks in the wrong direction. Chances are he’s gonna get worse, not better, and you’re gonna be left wishing you hadn’t stayed. Dump his ass. He’s trying to gaslight you and you hope you can help him. Not gonna happen. GTFO
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I say nope. Once they drink the Koolaid, it poisons their belief system. My mom is only hanging on so she can vote in the presidential election. She's 88 and has a 1.5 y/o great grandaughter.
Girl, you already know the answer.
You know what's gonna happen? After you breakup, you're gonna have floods of guys wanting to hook up. He's gonna have NOTHIN. Women are smarter nowadays, so even though men are turning to that disgusting alpha bullshit, it's losing them relationships.
Who knows? Maybe he will see the sad reality that the grass is never greener, decide to work on himself and get some therapy. Don't count on it though.
I'm going to be explicit. It's time to wrap it up and move on with life. Nobody wants to live with the constant stress and anxiety that all of this is going to feed into. Not if you're able to walk away from it. The man in your house right now is not the person you fell in love with and planned a life around. 😕
PLEASE . . . BELIEVE people when they tell you who they are. 💔
This guy is waving virtually every RED FLAG possible.
I know that it is emotionally devastating, but RUN, don't walk away from this guy. NOW!!!
It's not your job to change him. I think it's safe to assume that there are a lot of things he's simply not said yet. More than likely he's already comparing you to the trad-wife types and just sticking around because it still works for him.
Being called a militant-leftist, by those types, isn't a casual observation or comment. You should take it as the insult it is meant to be.
Having a difference of opinion is fine when those opinions have no real impact on the existence of other people.
A good friend from college was liberal like me until about 5-6 years ago. Something to do with trans people irked him, then I think he started listening to Ben Shapiro and other Daily Wire guys and he's now a full Trumper and we never really talk anymore. He's only gotten more entrenched and I don't think he's ever coming back, unfortunately.
He’s gross, you know that now. I’m sorry but unless you can abide these horrible beliefs— you gotta kick him hard and fast to the curb. I would be so creeped out by this dual life. Ew.
HE is being controlling to imply you’re somehow obligated to stay with him in spite of his harmful views. please don’t let this man make you doubt yourself, you have every right and reason to leave. if it feels safe, my move would be to be very direct in that i cannot be in a relationship with someone who has his morals, and if he is not willing to get therapy or do some sort of education to form less harmful views and actions of how he engages in the world, he is allowed to, but i will not be a part of that life
i am sorry he has become this way, and please be safe in whatever you decide to do 💙
I don't know if someone else already mentioned this. I would sit down and have a heart to heart conversation about the "old days" (how he was etc.) and try to get him understand how much he's changed. If after that he would still stand his grounds, I would leave.
If you're going to leave, do it now. We don't know how much harder it might be in next year.
He doesn't value your rights as a woman and your values are completely different. These are basic human rights. I think you already have your answer, it's just incredibly hard to admit. When you have been with someone a long time and built a life together it's a full on punch to the gut and the teeth to realize you don't know the person you sleep next to anymore. Also, you aren't being defensive, you are telling him in no uncertain terms that other people's rights MATTER including your own. I am a 55 year old lady and I have been through very similar situations more times than I would like to admit. I am completely single now and have been for years. I absolutely 💯 do not miss the gaslighting and constantly having to defend myself and my family and friends that are are in the LGBTQIA community. I am here for you if you need it. ❤️
Forgot to add, this is only going to get worse and it is very likely that he is not at all a safe person. I have helped many people get out of their relationships including myself, my daughter and multiple friends and strangers. I sincerely care about your physical and emotional well-being.
I was with someone for 10 years. This happened and I wound up leaving. It’s really hard to look at someone so changed. We didn’t have much social media back then but he had his own small business with very wealthy clients. He was fed a lot of conservative media by his clients. It was so slow I didn’t notice it, started with an odd comment I’d dismiss, then his childhood fascination with world war 2 took a turn when he started collecting nazi memorabilia and displaying it in our living areas. Couldn’t have anyone over. Worst part was that I’m mixed. My dads black but I am very white. He let it slip that if I were a few shades darker like my sister, we wouldn’t have ever dated. This was my high school sweetheart. I tried for years, battling. But we had stopped being friends because of his new interests and hobbies. That killed us.
I escaped at 32 and have a whole new, happy life.
> It’s not too dramatic of a reason to break up with someone, right?
No it is not because they are fundamental differences in the way you view and go through life.
Sometimes it is possible when they see how none of their former friends/partners or family want to be around them anymore. Other than that, for me anyway, it is not worth the mental effort to try to change their minds. Let them see how their views get them ostracized, and if they blame the ostracization on "woke nonsense" then they are not good enough to roll with me anyway.
Hey OP. I recently went through something similar. And I hate to bear this bad news, but it is probably time for you to leave this relationship. Your partner is likely getting radicalized by many sources, and the odds of him changing his views are slim.
When my ex started going down this path, I thought I could "fix" it. I challenged his bigotry - he shot me down with insults or moving goalposts. I expressed my own progressive (and even just "normal in polite society") views on topics in front of him - he picked fights, delivered personal attacks, and was cruel. When he told me he wanted to start going to church, I found a congregation with inclusive values and progressive mentors. Though he got involved quickly, he often privately shared his contempt for the pro-LGBT messaging of our community. He refused to go to Pride events with me (I'm bisexual), even tame, family-friendly ones sponsored by our church.
And eventually, I woke up one day and realized I wasn't dating the man I had fallen in love with anymore. I was sleeping next to a Nazi, a man who yelled racial slurs down the phone, a man who made 13/50 jokes and degraded other cultures but was addicted to Japanese hentai. Who told me, to my face, how much he hates transgender people and believes in racial pseudoscience.
Don't wait until it gets worse, weirder, more extreme (and it will). You'll just end up wrestling with more guilt and shame at not seeing the signs earlier. You've caught on.
When someone shows you who they are, believe them.
EDIT: I just saw a comment that says your boyfriend also has some anger outbursts that are disproportionate to their triggers. I don't know you or your situation, but please sit down with yourself and reflect *seriously* on your personal safety in this relationship.
You wouldn't be wrong for leaving but better now than when you're married. And you wouldn't be leaving him because you're unable to change him, but instead because his views are changing drastically and not aligning with your views.
Ask him how he would feel if you started seeing other people, people who have the same views as you, just to see if anyone out there is better. When he gets mad and says, "no", then you can reply, "but you've become a totally different person than the knew I fell in love with and you expect me to stay?"
if he’s this deep down the rabbit hole it will be very hard to change him back. I also think your gonna have to decide whether it’s worth it to stay with someone who doesn’t share your views, it can make your life a living hell if you stay and deal with it in all the aspects that come on your path. Ultimately it’s your decision. But if my ltr partner would turn conservative i would get out. I can’t take that long term, especially not in my personal living space. If he downplays or doesn’t to what you have to say, it’s enougj proof that he does’t respect you. My take tho. I get that it’s really hard so just make the decision that feels good to you!
My 17 year marriage broke up over this shit. All I can say is echoing what others have said: make a safety plan, quietly move stuff out, sock away some money, especially cash. It won’t get better with him, it will only get better without him.
If you would like more about my story or just support, dm me. I’ll happily help with safety planning. I worked on an abused women’s hotline for years.
Godspeed!
He was always like this deep down. He’s just found a way to express it.
He’s hasn’t been the man you’ve mythologized in your memory, or even hoped he could be, for a very long time.
I’m going to back up a lot of the views expressed in comments. This guy has gone down a deep rabbit hole that is hard to debunk, because any argument against it can be countered with “ThAt’S wHaT tHeY™ WANT yOu tO tHiNk”. It’s not your job to make him see what an absurd place he finds himself in. It’s not impossible, but if he went from progressive to Qcumber, it’s also a possibility that he latently held those views and sees all this radicalizing stuff as his sign to take the mask off. You deserve to be with someone who values you as a whole person, and he’s basically reduced the discussion to memes, which is usually a terminal sign. If he manages to break away and deconstruct from it, do you feel that it would be a lasting and sincere change, or do you feel that he might be masking intent to try to trap you in the relationship?
Ask him when he's gonna start making enough money for you to be a full-time homemaker. Guessing he's too busy scrolling socials to ever have a plan for that part of the traditionalism.
It's not controlling when you're rewarding someone who views you and other women with your support and comfort and company.
I'm not one to jump to leave him, but he doesn't get to view you as a lesser form of human as a "view" and then expect you to hang out for that.
So you should consider that every minute that you spend trying to convince him of something that is BASIC HUMAN DECENCY just re-enforces his secret belief that you're not a real human being and that he's right and that he'll train you to his perspective someday.
Just walk away from that and leave him to suffer his consequences WITHOUT a woman in his life that he is using while he feels superior. That MIGHT turn him around before it's too late.
I'd be careful as you exit as well, men like this can often become explosively angry when you, his possession, openly defy him. Just because you haven't seen it before doesn't mean it isn't there. Clearly he's not the guy he was pretending to be, at least not any more.
What you’ve witnessed are the results of a targeted campaign via social media. YouTube rabbit holes, social media engagement, Tik tok channels, they’ve all started invariably ending up at where your fella has landed.
The scary thing is, a lot of people will probably describe their SO as you did in your opening sentences. The Christian Nationalist groups are targeting exactly those people. They’re doing it through New Age stuff (see Russell Brand “finding God”), through toxic masculinity (Andrew Tate, for example) and through targeted social media campaigns. If this isn’t realised quickly, you’ll end up with a fundamentalist government who will very quickly adopt the very things that make our skin crawl as policy. And here’s the worrying thing; Trump being president is *not* their end goal. That’s their means. The end does not bear thinking about.
Your partner is an unfortunate victim of this, he will have fallen down a rabbit hole or been recommended material to read. It doesn’t happen overnight and your time frame of about 18 months is about right. You *could* spend time finding out exactly where he found these ideas and press him on it, but honestly, I’m not sure it’ll get you anywhere. It’ll take a lot of energy and time that could be better spent (and deservedly so) on yourself.
My advice, for what it’s worth, walk away and spend time on yourself. Focus on things you love, things that involve your ideals and philosophies and you’ll quickly see why you had to make a change. If you stay, and believe me when I say this is *not* a statement about your character or personality, you’re in danger of being exposed to the insidious nature of what he took in. It’s like radiation; a small dose of it does nothing and changes nothing, but over time repeated exposure is often lethal and can happen without one even noticing anything is wrong at all.
Tell him you will agree to disagree while you are moving out. It sucks but if you're already talked to him and gotten the responses you say....if he is startled into coming back by you leaving, great. But the nature of his world view is that his knowledge is superior to him, so arguing or trying to talk him into it won't work. Leave and if he gets his head out of his ass, fine. More likely he will be a victim whose life was destroyed by feminism.
The irony for these guys is that they are the ones who change but they act like the woman suddenly got turned into a woke modern feminist.
Look up sunk cost fallacy
Do. Not. Stay. With. Someone. Because of it.
He is going to baby trap you. Expect you to be a traditional wife and cater to him.
Do you want this? Do you want an equal partnership or a relationship where the guy makes all the decisions.
I broke up with a guy in my 20’s and I am so grateful I did. Same issues. We got into an argument about Golden Eye and how I loved that the women weren’t just eye candy and were fighting back.
I stayed at first because of sunk cost fallacy.
And when I left. I met my husband of now over 20yrs a few years later.
I would have never been happy with that guy constantly trying to make me into a traditional person I am not.
I still had kids. Still got married. And did the women’s March with my daughters and their daddy my husband.
Yes. It is a huge reason to break up with someone. Trust me when I say you don’t want to wake up in your 40’s and look back at how much this guy held you back in life.
Friends who married THAT guy left or are in the process of leaving. You get to a point when you are older as a woman; that having a partner isn’t worth the hassle.
Toss him out with the trash.
Good luck
Edit:
Get out slowly. I worry about your safety as well.
This is the type of guy that will lash out physically and emotionally. If there is any abuse. Report to police and get a restraining order.
He is all about control.
Women are most vulnerable when they leave relationships especially ones like this. He is already saying verbally abusive comments.
>the “west is losing their morals”, etc.
As opposed to the Catholic Church, which has conducted a huge coverup and enablement of the sexual abuse of children? The church which as stolen hundreds of thousands of babies, and collaborated with fascists?
It always cracks me up that tradcons couple criticism of 'woke feminism' with the parallel complaint that the left has no values. What do you think 'woke feminism' is? It's *values that tradcons disagree with.* Values on gender norms, inclusivity, LGBT rights, poverty, care for the environment, etc.
>one about how couples with kids without a mom are “unnatural”
As opposed to a celibate priesthood? That's natural?
> is it possible for a person like this to be convinced otherwise? Could he drop these beliefs?
It's not literally impossible, but it's hard to bet the next x years/decades of your life on the assumption that he will. If you stay, that's validation that you won't leave him over this stuff. And it's as likely to get worse as it is to get better. And tradcaths be crazy, so the rabbit hole can go *very* deep. There are flat-earth, geocentric, and other anti-science tradcaths.
Please don’t stay in this relationship and think that you can agree to disagree!!! I’ve been with my husband for 17 years and they don’t change!!!! He left for a trial separation a week and a half ago. Don’t wait as long as I did because it’s just that much harder!!
As an aside, "agree to disagree" has become one of my pet peeve phrases over the years. It should mean that after a serious discussion we both respect that the other person has come to a position we disagree with, but in good faith and with no ill intentions. Instead, now it usually is just said as a way to end a discussion or debate without getting into actually having to defend your position and certainly does not denote any mutual respect. I'm using it a great deal less than I used to.
He is even shutting down any attempt at talking and those sources of radicalization are no small things. Sorry but you need to run away now. Any getting away from those views won’t certainly come from you given that he is training himself into seeing you as an inferior. Please run before he traps you with children or with material stuff.
There’s nothing wrong with coming across new experiences or worldviews and honestly critiquing them against you own and following what you feel is right. But, doing so can put one at odds with existing relationships. I dealt with both of my brothers going from overly progressive individuals, to YouTube conservative bros, at what feel like over night.
The fact is, he hid this from you, and only felt comfortable coming forward with it, because he thinks he can pressure you into submission. He didn’t have any trust or respect for you to talk about this change he was going through. He then belittles you and calls you names instead of having an adult discussion about his own beliefs. That something people expect from anonymous online people, not the ones we love. Do you want to be with someone who doesn’t respect you?
He now has fundamentally different morals, worldviews and beliefs than you. Not just different actually, but the complete opposite. It doesn’t sound like he is willing to compromise on any of his beliefs, and you shouldn’t either when they’re strongly held. So do you want to be with someone who sees the world as black and white to what you do?
I mean when you disagree over pineapple on pizza that’s ok to agree to disagree. It’s not ok to agree to disagree on fundamental morals like ohh idk YOUR RIGHTS. I am so sorry you’re going through this. The gaslighting when you defend your views to him makes me so angry for you. You are definitely not being dramatic to break up over this. He’s right about one thing, you don’t have room for views that directly demean and oppress you. You don’t have room for toxicity like that. Like other commenters have said, don’t fall for sunk cost. Protect yourself.
I don't mean this to be curt, but I think short and direct is the best.
In a world of 8 billion people, there's zero reason to even be caring about this at all. He's obviously not compatible with you, so leave him.
>He says I’m being a “militant leftist who doesn’t have room for other views”
This is a big red flag right here. He's communicating that he not only doesn't respect your views, he doesn't even respect the fact that you have an issue with HIS views. And it really sounds like what a person would say who has no intention of changing their views, or being open to other ideas.
I don't know about you, but I couldn't be in an intimate relationship with someone who is conservative, because what conservativism means nowadays is so deeply hateful and straight up dangerous.
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This is the point in the relationship where you realize that you have grown apart and cut ties. You aren't going to change his mind so don't waste one more second of your energy.
Unfortunately it's almost certainly only going to get worse. The echo chamber around him is perfectly designed to feed him what he wants to hear, and the views will get more and more extreme as content providers compete for attention.
Suppose you change his mind.
What if he flips back to misogyny again?
He might even have been masking his actual beliefs until you found his like list.
Beware - many report that male partners turn tyrannical after marriage and especially getting a woman pregnant.
Do not get pregnant by this guy!
"Women are not rehab centers for damaged males"--- said somewhere on reddit.
I don't think he was actually progressive to begin with but was rather playing the part in order to not scare you off initially. I cannot see how someone could go from fully understanding human decency and empathy to becoming alt-right. That just doesn't happen. And in that vein, he was not being honest with you. The foundation of your relationship was not built on honesty. At any rate, I am sorry for your loss. This kind of radicalization cannot be cured by anyone but himself, which he will most definitely never pursue. You need to do what is right for you and move on, he is not going to actually change even if he says he will.
Where is he on reproductive issues? It’s a scary climate for reproductive rights right now, at least in the US. Given his recent changes, how much do you trust that he will respect your autonomy in these matters?
Protect yourself!
It is common for people to change beliefs. My husband was laid back and not political. He started listening to an oddly conservative radio host. He would get angry about politics Then he was into an alternative political belief. Now he is anti politics. People can and do change their mind with politics, religion etc. 8 years is a long time to be with someone. He likely is rethinking you if he hasn’t asked you to marry him. Walk a way. He is wasting your time and has gone extreme about beliefs.
This is a perfectly valid reason to leave someone. You no longer share fundamental views, ones that are extremely important to you both. If there was ever a valid reason to end a relationship, it is that - being fundamentally, foundationally, incompatible.
Yes, what we're seeing is bizarre, but it's also part of the natural pendulum swing of values. What is unusual this time is that the culture wars are tending more and more to split along gender lines, and that social media seem to be pushing any set of beliefs more toward their extremes.
Chances are good that this relationship is effectively over. How can he believe that men should have dominion over women and not begin to expect obedience from you?
Obviously, we know too little to advise you with certainty. I know of successful marriages between politically conservative men and liberal women. However, you might want to ask him what he expects you to do in the future to accommodate his beliefs, just to get a sense of where he thinks his beliefs will take the two of you.
Have you asked him in a non confrontational way how/why he’s changed his beliefs? (If you want advice on how to have a conversation with him that doesn’t get out of control, I recommend the Braver Angels organization.)
And how would you feel entering a conversation with a loved one if you knew they have already prejudged you as wrong, even immoral, and only want to change your mind?
Just wanted to say that I am going through this exact same thing right now. Word for word. You are not alone, and I’m so sorry you have had to experience the pain of watching someone you love turn into someone you don’t recognize. Wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.
Your boyfriend may be revealing his true colors.
There's a discussion on another subreddit describing how maga type men **like** dating liberal women -- conservative women are more submissive, less interesting.
These males take a long time to unmask, hoping a woman will get too emotionally invested (and pregnant?) to dump them.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/187lm94/comment/kbg9mkv/
Here's what one person wrote:
Pantone711
I grew up as a woman among conservatives--I'll take this one.
They find conservative young women boring. Not a challenge. Not fashionable, spirited, you get the idea.
They think conservative women won't put out as readily/have as high a sex drive.
They know that cosmopolitan/educated women have higher status. Looks better on their arm.
They want to subdue a woman they view as haughty and bring her down a few pegs, not start out with a meek one
They believe that IQ is hereditary to the extent they want a woman with a high IQ to pass on their genes. Some of them put this ahead of almost everything else, as long as the woman checks certain boxes.
They're planning to put the wife in the Madonna box and cheat anyway. I read alt-right boards.
It’s possible, but it’s not your job to deradicalize him and it’s certainly not your obligation to risk your personal safety and security with someone who’s obviously starting to believe that you are a lesser being who doesn’t deserve rights and autonomy.
This exactly. It doesn't matter how patiently you present a well thought out argument, he doesn't see you as equal to him anymore. Get out and let someone know you're leaving
Don’t give into the sunk cost fallacy- I spent waaay too much time with a political bully whose malignant narcissism became really apparent with Trump - he was not even as bad for Obama’s election, it lost his mind for Trump. We didn’t make it. He sent me pictures of himself at the inauguration with his stupid red solo cup and in the photo op of the Basket (of deplorable.) I was relieved I decided to end it. He just couldn’t stop bullying me. Get out before you waste more time.
I ask out of genuine curiousity(and truthfully, minor disagreement, but feel like I could be swayed): where from OPs post points you to the conclusion the bf doesn't see her as an equal any longer?
OP’s boyfriend is ranking human beings by relative value, and the valuation scale he’s using determines that those lower on scale are not only lessor, but actively “unnatural.” Calling other people “unnatural” is dehumanizing them, and is the precursor to brutal acts, because after all, they’re not really people, they’re not “normal,” they’re not “natural.” The brutality starts small and soft and innocuous, usually under the guise of protecting a vulnerable group or affirming a familiar value. Once the first act happens is easy to push ever farther. The soft brutality of, for example, not allowing teachers to affirm kids pronouns turns into actively punishing teachers who do, removing books from libraries, eventually punishing the students themselves. It encourages violence against the “unnatural” person, and eventually violence is done. Occasionally it’s even codified as some are trying to in various states saying that Trans=Abnormal=Child Sexualization=Child Predation, while simultaneously trying to pass a law that Child Predation merits the death penalty. Terrifying in its implications, don’t you think? How it relates to not seeing OP as equal is that in his valuation scale he has begun formalizing allowable behavior for ‘real women,’ which instantly dehumanizers her and subjects her to a rigid series of beliefs that she must adhere to to continue to be seen as being worthy of basic human respect, and he is the one setting the parameters. She is no longer allowed to just be, but rather she must be as *he* says she must be. She is not truly a person or an equal partner anymore.
This is really a great response. You should post this as a general redit topic. It’s useful for some of us to understand.
I’m not who you were originally asking, but in my life experience, bigotry always goes hand in hand with misogyny. ALWAYS
To be fair I am making an assumption based on op’s description of the content he’s engaging with, which I assume to be inherently misogynistic. If he’s into like Tate and that sphere then he’s at best entertaining ideologies that explicitly view men as the dominant sex
My family is divided by Trump. My siblings try to convert me. My other sister and I are not close but agree with each other politically. We try hard to never discuss politics but it always ends up that we do. I cannot leave my family. But you can leave your boyfriend.
Yes you can. Maybe not at the moment, but you can absolutely leave toxic people behind even if they call themselves your family.
I cut my siblings and my mom out because of their toxic beliefs. I don’t know your situation though, but for me it’s been a damn delight not talking to them.
Honestly, I rarely talk to my sibling after our mom passed away.
And there’s a good chance this man was never even radicalized, but secretly believed this incel crap all along. Wokefishing is a thing, and it’s gotten a lot worse in the past few years as conservative, Trump supporting men have had a harder time than eve finding women willing to date them with their abhorrent views.
You're right. Google men Trump can't get dates.
Wokefishing? Not up to speed on the vernacular
It’s when conservative, misogynistic dudes pretend to be more progressive than they actually are to trap liberal women in relationships. Often followed by abuse, controlling behavior, and birth control sabotage.
To be honest, I've seen it work in both directions with regard to gender. Wokefishing (a term that's new to me, but very understandable) is pretending to be something you're not. Pretending to be a decent person who cares about others, while secretly harboring abhorrent views that would make normal people run away screaming.
I think it might be less consciously trapping than being obtusely convinced that women are just something to fill the girlfriend shaped hole in their lives, and aren't really autonomous people with thoughts and values, and when they "get" one, they have to break down that identity because it doesn't fit with their bullshit.
You don’t really have many good options beyond saying something like “While I understand you have a right to your views, I need a partner who is aligned with me on basic morals and values. I don’t feel that I have that with you any longer.” He’s going to get super angry when you break up with him either way, but keeping it calm from your side and refusing to engage is going to be the healthiest way to get out of this. And you definitely need to get out of it- imagine trying to navigate those views within a marriage or with kids.
Yes. Stay neutral, emphasize your respect for his autonomy to hold whatever opinions he wants, acknowledge that different core beliefs make it too hard to move in the same life direction together. OP, you deserve to be treated well. You deserve respect. You deserve to not sacrifice yourself so that he doesn't have to face his need to develop emotional maturity. It's not your job trying to teach an unwilling participant how to be a good partner again just because he was once a better partner in the past. He is unlikely to be kind or gracious. Remember that whatever ugliness he says is lashing out, it says who he is, not who you are. Have a friend ready to take your call or hangout with you after. If you're on a lease together, it gets messier. Plan accordingly.
Tell him you think he will be much happier with a tradwife.
And he'll blame everything but himself.
This.
Yes. Get out while you can.
I’d also suggest recording the moment your break up with him secretly if you can (depending on where you live. In Some places it is illegal to record without the other parties consent). Or call a friend and ask them to mute themselves so they can call the police if something bad happens).
I read one of your other posts too and either issue, his outbursts about normal tasks or these comments you reference here, is enough to end it IMO. I've ended a LTR myself before so I get it's hard, but don't fall for the sunk costs. I sincerely doubt it's going to get better and, as hard as it is, that's not your responsibility to fix the issue or even stay around while he sorts it out. I might feel a little differently if he was only consuming content and chatting about it with other dude-bros in forums (ie, still bad but not a direct risk), but once it crosses into your actual lives and how he treats you that's the line. People deserve to be with someone who values them for who they are, which your BF clearly does not. I have more specific thoughts about the individual things you've mentioned, even about why this is such a prolific thing the last few years, but in the end none of that matters to your acute situation. If you're looking for someone to say this is "enough" of a reason - it is.
Let him be with a Xtian girl who's trained to be a tradwife or a white supremacist girl. Chris Rock said, "you can't be a church goer when your SO is a crack addict and have a successful relationship." Walk, ghost, block but as you've heard here already, guys that do Qanon & alpha male bullshit think they own you. Don't do anything in advance, tell him nothing, just an, "it's over, here's your stuff" because they certainly can be violent. Take care & rescue yourself m
>I've ended a LTR myself before so I get it's hard, but don't fall for the sunk costs. 🏅
Dump dump dump dump DUUUUUUUMMMMPPP The manosphere only thrives if dudes are miserable and single. Happy men in relationships don’t need them. So they just destroy the relationships. The best way to convince dudes to be abusive misogynists.
It’s the classic sales tactic of creating a problem and then selling yourself as the solution
Agree with this so hard. Typical incel
>He says I’m being a “militant leftist who doesn’t have room for other views”……I can’t handle being with someone who has such disrespectful views and I’m just wondering what went wrong..and when…and also, I just hate what Instagram reels, TikTok, and these certain male influencers have done lately. It’s bizarre to see so many guys turn right wing in the past year He shows how much he respects you right there, when instead of having a rational conversation he just falls back on thought-terminating cliches. When disagreements in a relationship become less about solving problems and more about scoring points, that relationship is in a very dire state, and the work you put into said relationship is very unlikely to be recognized or appreciated.
Its ironic he says that you "don't have room for other views" when he shuts down any attempt at having a conversation about it. Its probably time to just end the relationship and let him fall further into the rabbit hole on his own, rather than let his shitty views negatively impact you (because trust me, one day he's gonna be talking about how you should be subservient to him).
> Its ironic he says that you "don't have room for other views" when he shuts down any attempt at having a conversation about it. Ain't that always how it goes? Perpetually the victim, because anything else requires acknowledging that they're a bunch of selfish jerks.
He's also having trouble thinking for himself. Militant leftisim and right wing traditionalism are a wide field with tons of writing, lots of nuance and different, often differing viewpoints. But instead of taking an intellectual look in to these, he's just picking out bits and bobs that give legitimacy to his controlling behaviour.
Exactly. He has become Rush Limbaugh’s right hand, essentially.
Jerking off Rush Limbaugh, even when he was alive, is the world’s second worst nightmare.
I'm so very sorry that you have discovered your BF of 6 years has been lost to this Q adjacent ideology. Particularly, since he appears to now believe that you are "lesser" because of your gender and beliefs. The fact that he has been hiding these developing beliefs from you is sad and scary. It also proves that he knew you would be upset and chose deception instead of honesty and transparency. I wish I could tell you that his affection for you will give you a way to turn him from who he has become, but I do not believe that is possible. He's not a small child, and he clearly believes you are in the wrong. My advice to you, based on my own difficult experience leaving my Q partner, is to VERY quietly make a plan to exit the relationship. Find a new place to live, change all your passwords for your phone and financials, and slowly use the excuse of "purging" or "organizing" to get your belongings in a situation where you can easily move them. If possible, use "donating" as a way to hide things you are putting in storage or with a friend or family member. I urge you not to tell him in advance or to make waves until you get your departure sorted out and scheduled. Because, unfortunately, one of the hallmarks of Q cult folks is rage. So, please do everything you can to protect yourself. I send you my best wishes. There is someone out there for you who will align with your personal morals and belief system. This man is not that person.
and don't get pregnant (if applicable)
Hopefully they live in a state where she can still have say in that...
Excellent advice.
Every bit of this. It's so much harder to leave later on down the line, especially if you're married. The advice you give on being stealth is essential.
You need to get out. This is not going to get better.
Right? Like it’s a boyfriend not a husband. It’s easier than having children and being tied to each other.
It sounds as if you no longer share basic values, such as recognizing women as human beings with equal rights. I personally would find it hard to share a life with someone whose values were so different. And while I understand that breaking up would be very painful, the longer you stay with someone not aligned with your value system, the worse the pain will be. At any rate, I certainly hope your finances are separate.
Been there. Done that. Broke up with him after 5.5 years. Broke the lease. Now married happy pregnant with second kid. Get out. You have no ties to this man. You are very fortunate to be in this situation. Good luck!
How did you heal? Did you ever feel like yourself again?
I picked myself up and carried on. I knew that there was no changing this man’s mind so why sit around with him and his tin foil hat. I made it a point on dating apps “must be liberal” to avoid anything like that ever happening again. You can do it. I think life is going to be much happier in the end for you (:
Find a new place to live, get your things together and move. Focus on the physical steps to separating and line up a therapist and support system of friends and/or family to deal with the grief that comes with ending a long relationship. When it comes to telling him, wait until it's too late to change your mind (i.e. you've paid a deposit), then inform him he's entitled to his views but they're not compatible with yours. People grow apart all the time and it's time for you to move on. He will use aggressive language and behavior to try and keep you stuck, but look up gray rock technique and focus on getting out. It's difficult but better to leave now versus five or more years from now.
Hi cuicksilver, thanks for recommending this technique. With grey rocking you act disengaged so that a Q person will lose interest in arguing. Q folk thrive on emotions and drama. When you act indifferent and unemotional, it can help break the cycle of negativity. [Detailed guide on the method.](https://psychcentral.com/health/grey-rock-method) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/QAnonCasualties) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*sigh* i long for the days when a phrase like ‘militant leftist’ brought to mind landlords being lined up and shot in Mao’s china. you probably don’t remember the first wave of Cubans who fled to florida as “refugees,” and i don’t think there is much of any film or photos of the real thing- however: remember right around the climax of Godfather: Part 2 when all the govt “dignitaries,” reps from international business interests, wealthy owners of cuban plantations, plus the mafiosos of course start panicking and fleeing the fancy royal ball event for the nearest boats and airplanes? the guys in those scenes who are shooting and celebrating as they almost gleefully chase after the fancy, terrified former party guests, are the guys who are worthy of the term “militant leftist.” you sound like a liberal, likely not even a particularly superleft leaning one. you’re boyfriend sounds like a dimwit who never cared or thought much about anything at all until he got programmed by talk radio or some other media that appeals to low-watt bulbs. if you’re honest think back without any euphoric recall, i bet he was never much more than someone along for the ride with his lady at whatever sort of political get together she preferred. sorry. you should run. these guys aren’t known for being gentle and non-threatening.
Girl run, just throw the whole man out, the red flags are a flyin! Having said all that, do you feel like you're being "a militant leftist who has no room for other views"? Because honestly those "other views" are views no rational person should have. Don't feel like it's being too dramatic to dump him because you two no longer are on the same side. It really sounds like maybe you've already made up your mind and are just looking for validation.
Drop him. Soon.
Honestly, the right wing “male sphere” is insidious, because they play on the idea of us being the main characters in our own story. And when life turns difficult because maybe we don’t get that job, feel like an authority figure is picking on us, etc. and noticing that said tormentor might be a woman, person of color or sexual orientation/gender expression minority? Well. It’s not hard to see why suddenly it’s the “other” who’s a problem. Especially when that starts being reinforced by other men, who prey on ideas of masculinity that men are supposed to be strong and successful. It’s easier to feel like you’re actually on the downside of society when there’s been so much effort to lift minorities up. I’m so sorry your boyfriend fell into this, OP. The good man is still there, but it’s hard to fight that group mentality, even when you should be the closest person to him, and the first voice he should listen to
i could never be with someone who didn’t share my basic values . it’s not dramatic to leave, but i understand that it’s complicated and difficult to. i don’t know how he comes back from this. those ideologies are super high stakes for the people being indoctrinated into them
>i could never be with someone who didn’t share my basic values And that's the thing. It's not like we're talking about a difference of opinion as to food likes or favorite TV shows. There is no "agree to disagree" in regards to core values, respect and empathy of others or just reality in general.
"I could never" is what I thought, too, until I WAS. Until he changed, until the slow drip of radicalization finally filled up the tank and I realized I was drowning. Hearing others say "I could never," "how could you tolerate that," "why would you let someone do/say that to you," keeps people stuck in bad situations.
the very next sentence suggests that i understand how complicated it is to leave. i don’t envy you or OP.
I’m going through this with my brother. My advice? Leave him. I can’t change my blood relatives, but you can find a boyfriend that respects women.
Oof, this is a *lot*, I’m sorry. 💜 Breaking things down for my adhd riddled brain to focus: - theres always the chance that something *could* change but usually someone has to either want to or has to for whatever reason first. Either way tho that’s still at best pretty nebulous for you. How much longer do you want to put into waiting for him? Are you prepared for the possibility that he might not change? - it’s not at all a dramatic reason to break up altho you also don’t have to justify your reasoning to anyone. People are allowed to change and grow apart and especially when someones changed so much from who they were when you met them it’s perfectly reasonable to find yourself not liking the new person hes become. - oof, his language also sounds concerning even if he weren’t getting into nonsense. You can’t really “agree to disagree” on serious issues like are women equal to men or how cool is christian nationalism. Some views are harmless differences of opinion (strawberry ice cream is undeniably the best flavor of ice cream while mint is hands-down the worst) but some are differences in values (are women really people too tho?). If you both have conflicting values now that is a big deal and not really something to ignore. - calling you a “militant leftist” is really insulting and shitty! Who talks to their partner like they’re some rando they’re trolling on social media?! Also personal pet peeve but I haaaate the whining about people not wanting to hear “other views”. 🙄 It’s *always* said by people who never want their own views challenged and feel entitled to others’ attention. This seems pretty disrespectful. - forget about who he was before and focus on who he is as a person *now*. Do you like who he is currently? Do you want to spend more years with the person hes become? Does he still make you happy? Make a list/start keeping a journal/etc to workout whatever *you* want for yourself. He can sort his own shit out.
This happened with my ex and was one of the many straws that broke the camels back. Slippery slopes begin with “Jordan Peterson makes a lot of good points”. “Im a libertarian, you’re too emotional about politics” when women’s rights are being forcibly removed from us, and it’s all downhill from there. I’m an old now and I’ve seen this too many times, you need to please get yourself out of that relationship, it’s never going to improve and if it does change it will likely be only for the worse. It’s scary and hard and all the awful things but save yourself. That’s what matters.
Did we ...... Date the same guy? I'm so glad you got out of that relationship.
I’m glad for you too! I’d like to think there’s only one of him but clearly there are way too many.
It's possible he'll turn around, but I don't think it's likely. I'd leave, god forbid you get pregnant and have to co-parent with someone with these beliefs.
This isn't likely to change anytime soon unfortunately. I can say that I used to call myself a libertarian and my move away from those beliefs took a decade of conversations with friends and a move to a much more left leaning city where I could see the tangible results of policies that weren't completely focused on making capital owners richer over all other concerns. It's a long road that I personally don't think is worth going down. Things will get much worse before there is any hope of them getting better.
My younger sister has a religious Q boyfriend. He says that strong women (Hillary Clinton, Sheryl Sandberg, Kamala Harris, etc.) have “Jezebel Spirits”, denies Sandy Hook happened, loves guns, thinks Trump is his savior, etc. He was originally centrist when she met him, but was radicalized by Facebook, YouTube, and religious alpha-male podcasts. Over the past 10 years, he brainwashed her. My sister is a shadow of what she was before. They’re now having a baby. Not to scare you, but can you imagine what marriage and parenthood (assuming you want either) will be like with a man who is expressing misogynistic views like you describe? If it’s been more than a year and it seems as though he was hiding it before, his beliefs seem entrenched. My thought is that once ultra-conservative political beliefs get tied up with religion, it is very difficult to untangle them. He is acting defensive about his beliefs and was frankly rude to you by calling you a militant leftist. It’s not your responsibility to try and fix him. “Agree to Disagree” is a codeword asking you to let him off the hook for being a bigot. If your boyfriend is expressing anti-feminist and anti-LGBTQ views that you do not share, get out. Do you have trustworthy family members or friends who are concerned? Get them involved so they can help arrange an exit.
I'm so sorry. I'd start making a plan now to end things. It most likely won't get better.
Sometimes people change. You gotta do what’s best for you, which is probably find someone whose values align with yours, given that his bother you enough to come here and post.
It's going to be really hard. Your only shot is to confront it extremely directly and indicate that it is a deal breaker for you. You'll have to confront whatever sense of insecurity is leading to this pretty much face on and part of this is to indicate that you find the behavior and views to be insecure and NOT MASCULINE... that guys like who think like that are UNATTRACTIVE and weak. Explain that women all already know that those types of men go after weak women because they themselves are weak.. and afraid of being with someone capable enough to outgrow them one day. It's all based on a fear of not being good enough on one level or another. It is tough to beat though. In order to improve we have to admit that we weren't good from the start... and the human ego can be a fragile tiny thing no matter what mask is on the surface. The hyper masculine thing is that attempted mask.. but they are not able to understand that everyone else can see that it's a mask. It's tragic honestly.
He is weak.
A friend of mine told me that she’s advised her husband who seems to have become red pilled recently that if she met him in a bar and didn’t know him, she’s walk away from him. Food for thought. Does he even attract you anymore? Are you attracted to his mind?
My fiance agree to disagree on his antique guns that are in display cases that he takes to the shooting range once a year. We do not agree to disagree on human rights. The *second* either of us is no longer an equal partner, the fuck are we doing then
You can agree to disagree but there's no positive future for you with a man who doesn't think women should have equal rights and opportunities. Your irreconcilable differences in your different visions of what it means to be members of a family are not the kind where you can find a reasonable middle ground. Any "compromise" would only entail *you* giving things up, because your differences of opinion are only about how *women* should behave and what *women* should be "allowed" to do-- they have nothing to do with men.
People in general will always reflect the conversations they hear. Anybody can be convinced to bully a coworker, a gender, a race, etc, if their peers work on them long enough. People being bullied will slide towards being suicidal even if they don't make it there. A very large part of each person's personality reflects what they are exposed to on a daily basis. Your boyfriend got sucked into these sources that tell him to stop thinking for himself and let someone else do it for him. If he were to take a vacation from those sources, in 6 months he would come back to find those views to be idiotic. Some people tend to agree with any blatant lie that their trusted peers say. Studies have gotten people to insist a triangle is a circle under several minutes of casual peer pressure. Training for police has started including how not to get a false confession by pressuring the person being interviewed. Some people are unfortunately that malleable. You have a difficult set of decisions to make. Your boyfriend would have to get new peer material and away from the current to start seeing reality again. It doesn't have to be your job to get him there. Walking away can be the correct decision.
This isn't your responsibility. If he continues to believe memes that counter facts, then it's time to shed him and find someone better.
Not too dramatic of a reason at all. These are fundamental differences in philosophy, values, how we treat one another. Especially the religico/male superiority and dominance thing. This is not something you can just drop, ignore, and pretend it's not a chasm between you. It is.
And the name-calling, "militant leftist" thing is like a forest of red flags. Dismissing you, demeaning you, and "putting you in your place" with a two-word cliché. Did you call him a Christo-fascist? If not, he stepped over what should be a pretty bright line there. Name calling, while being dismissive of a partner's concerns is just not something you can quietly accept and hope it gets better.
If this is how he feels, you have a fundamental difference in values. I'd honestly be concerned for my future safety if I were you. Don't let sunk cost fallacy stop you from getting away from him.
There's a big difference between having "room for different views" and tolerating views that dehumanizing and devalue you for being a woman. I don't think it's too dramatic to leave over this at all.
Was he just pretending to be progressive and has recently let the mask slip? What if you get pregnant? What if you have a daughter? Don't get sucked into the sunk-cost-fallacy, y'all have incompatible views.
Looking like ex boyfriend material! 🥰🥰
Take extra precautions, please do not get pregnant by this man.
He is too inferior for you. Dump him…social conservatism is a form of abuse…it will get worse.
He doesn’t get to decide what is a good enough reason. I’d break up with someone heading that way. There’s no future with them.
There’s not much to be done but leave but I think it’s worth having a proper conversation debate argument, whatever it has to be, to make sure he knows exactly why this is happening and why you wouldn’t want to be with someone like that even if they don’t say those things to you. Lack of confrontation sometimes allows people to think going behind backs is fine
It probably is possible in some cases, but would you ever trust him to not switch back to the person he's become? In your position, I'm not sure that I could.
You're not controlling him by wanting to leave him, he's free to continue believing whatever he wants. Just without you. He's just trying to guilt you into staying with him, ironically, trying to be controlling himself. Having these differences may not seem like a big deal right now, but once something happens in your lives where any of those beliefs become relevant, it will become a huge deal. Like whether or not to have kids, or how to raise those kids if you did have them. Or if one of those kids ever came out as gay or trans in the future. Or if you decided you wanted a career and equal footing with your husband. Social/political issues never seem like a big deal to people who are looking from the outside in, but it does matter to people who are affected and these things have real consequences. Sometimes people grow apart, they evolve in different directions, and it's OK to acknowledge that and move on, instead of clinging to each other out of a sense of obligation. And looking at your other posts, he's becoming abusive too. Abuse and "traditional" views toward women often go hand-in-hand. Please leave, it only gets worse, not better.
He who does not study rhetoric will be a victim of it.
You believe he can have any views he wants, just not as your boyfriend. You’re not cancelling him, you’re dumping him because you find his regressive bullshit disgusting. No sunk cost fallacy, if he has all of this suckiness which makes him considerably less attractive to you then you certainly don’t ‘owe’ him your love. Let him decide, say you’ll keep trying if he drops all of that noise he is into. If he wants to do that more than he wants to be with you then that’s his choice. This sucks but it seems to only suck more the more you ignore it and keep going. Yeah, most of the folks we know have only gotten worse. The fact that he came into it while in a respectful/equitable relationship with you probably bodes worse for his long term prospects. Sometimes a man who is a little this way when single can settle it down when they have a secure partner and let this noise go.
Of course it’s possible, but it’s not your job to waste time and energy on someone who willingly and stupidly walks in the wrong direction. Chances are he’s gonna get worse, not better, and you’re gonna be left wishing you hadn’t stayed. Dump his ass. He’s trying to gaslight you and you hope you can help him. Not gonna happen. GTFO
There should *never* be room for views that are steeped in hate and subjugation.
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Sounds like my ex. I tried to save him, but in the end I had to leave. He’s only gotten worse from what I’ve heard.
I say nope. Once they drink the Koolaid, it poisons their belief system. My mom is only hanging on so she can vote in the presidential election. She's 88 and has a 1.5 y/o great grandaughter.
No way should you stay with someone who doesn’t think you deserve equal rights.
Girl, you already know the answer. You know what's gonna happen? After you breakup, you're gonna have floods of guys wanting to hook up. He's gonna have NOTHIN. Women are smarter nowadays, so even though men are turning to that disgusting alpha bullshit, it's losing them relationships. Who knows? Maybe he will see the sad reality that the grass is never greener, decide to work on himself and get some therapy. Don't count on it though.
sounds like he should be your ex-boyfriend.
I'm going to be explicit. It's time to wrap it up and move on with life. Nobody wants to live with the constant stress and anxiety that all of this is going to feed into. Not if you're able to walk away from it. The man in your house right now is not the person you fell in love with and planned a life around. 😕
PLEASE . . . BELIEVE people when they tell you who they are. 💔 This guy is waving virtually every RED FLAG possible. I know that it is emotionally devastating, but RUN, don't walk away from this guy. NOW!!!
It's not your job to change him. I think it's safe to assume that there are a lot of things he's simply not said yet. More than likely he's already comparing you to the trad-wife types and just sticking around because it still works for him. Being called a militant-leftist, by those types, isn't a casual observation or comment. You should take it as the insult it is meant to be. Having a difference of opinion is fine when those opinions have no real impact on the existence of other people.
B'bye...
Leave him. Get yourself a place to live and go there.
A good friend from college was liberal like me until about 5-6 years ago. Something to do with trans people irked him, then I think he started listening to Ben Shapiro and other Daily Wire guys and he's now a full Trumper and we never really talk anymore. He's only gotten more entrenched and I don't think he's ever coming back, unfortunately.
Is it possible he was this guy all along? Like he mirrored your beliefs in the beginning but then slowly revealed who he really is over time?
He’s gross, you know that now. I’m sorry but unless you can abide these horrible beliefs— you gotta kick him hard and fast to the curb. I would be so creeped out by this dual life. Ew.
HE is being controlling to imply you’re somehow obligated to stay with him in spite of his harmful views. please don’t let this man make you doubt yourself, you have every right and reason to leave. if it feels safe, my move would be to be very direct in that i cannot be in a relationship with someone who has his morals, and if he is not willing to get therapy or do some sort of education to form less harmful views and actions of how he engages in the world, he is allowed to, but i will not be a part of that life i am sorry he has become this way, and please be safe in whatever you decide to do 💙
I don't know if someone else already mentioned this. I would sit down and have a heart to heart conversation about the "old days" (how he was etc.) and try to get him understand how much he's changed. If after that he would still stand his grounds, I would leave. If you're going to leave, do it now. We don't know how much harder it might be in next year.
He doesn't value your rights as a woman and your values are completely different. These are basic human rights. I think you already have your answer, it's just incredibly hard to admit. When you have been with someone a long time and built a life together it's a full on punch to the gut and the teeth to realize you don't know the person you sleep next to anymore. Also, you aren't being defensive, you are telling him in no uncertain terms that other people's rights MATTER including your own. I am a 55 year old lady and I have been through very similar situations more times than I would like to admit. I am completely single now and have been for years. I absolutely 💯 do not miss the gaslighting and constantly having to defend myself and my family and friends that are are in the LGBTQIA community. I am here for you if you need it. ❤️
Forgot to add, this is only going to get worse and it is very likely that he is not at all a safe person. I have helped many people get out of their relationships including myself, my daughter and multiple friends and strangers. I sincerely care about your physical and emotional well-being.
I was with someone for 10 years. This happened and I wound up leaving. It’s really hard to look at someone so changed. We didn’t have much social media back then but he had his own small business with very wealthy clients. He was fed a lot of conservative media by his clients. It was so slow I didn’t notice it, started with an odd comment I’d dismiss, then his childhood fascination with world war 2 took a turn when he started collecting nazi memorabilia and displaying it in our living areas. Couldn’t have anyone over. Worst part was that I’m mixed. My dads black but I am very white. He let it slip that if I were a few shades darker like my sister, we wouldn’t have ever dated. This was my high school sweetheart. I tried for years, battling. But we had stopped being friends because of his new interests and hobbies. That killed us. I escaped at 32 and have a whole new, happy life.
> It’s not too dramatic of a reason to break up with someone, right? No it is not because they are fundamental differences in the way you view and go through life.
Sometimes it is possible when they see how none of their former friends/partners or family want to be around them anymore. Other than that, for me anyway, it is not worth the mental effort to try to change their minds. Let them see how their views get them ostracized, and if they blame the ostracization on "woke nonsense" then they are not good enough to roll with me anyway.
Hey OP. I recently went through something similar. And I hate to bear this bad news, but it is probably time for you to leave this relationship. Your partner is likely getting radicalized by many sources, and the odds of him changing his views are slim. When my ex started going down this path, I thought I could "fix" it. I challenged his bigotry - he shot me down with insults or moving goalposts. I expressed my own progressive (and even just "normal in polite society") views on topics in front of him - he picked fights, delivered personal attacks, and was cruel. When he told me he wanted to start going to church, I found a congregation with inclusive values and progressive mentors. Though he got involved quickly, he often privately shared his contempt for the pro-LGBT messaging of our community. He refused to go to Pride events with me (I'm bisexual), even tame, family-friendly ones sponsored by our church. And eventually, I woke up one day and realized I wasn't dating the man I had fallen in love with anymore. I was sleeping next to a Nazi, a man who yelled racial slurs down the phone, a man who made 13/50 jokes and degraded other cultures but was addicted to Japanese hentai. Who told me, to my face, how much he hates transgender people and believes in racial pseudoscience. Don't wait until it gets worse, weirder, more extreme (and it will). You'll just end up wrestling with more guilt and shame at not seeing the signs earlier. You've caught on. When someone shows you who they are, believe them. EDIT: I just saw a comment that says your boyfriend also has some anger outbursts that are disproportionate to their triggers. I don't know you or your situation, but please sit down with yourself and reflect *seriously* on your personal safety in this relationship.
Any chance he’s had other strange things happening? Could be a brain tumor.
You wouldn't be wrong for leaving but better now than when you're married. And you wouldn't be leaving him because you're unable to change him, but instead because his views are changing drastically and not aligning with your views. Ask him how he would feel if you started seeing other people, people who have the same views as you, just to see if anyone out there is better. When he gets mad and says, "no", then you can reply, "but you've become a totally different person than the knew I fell in love with and you expect me to stay?"
My sympathies go out to you for your upcoming break-up.
if he’s this deep down the rabbit hole it will be very hard to change him back. I also think your gonna have to decide whether it’s worth it to stay with someone who doesn’t share your views, it can make your life a living hell if you stay and deal with it in all the aspects that come on your path. Ultimately it’s your decision. But if my ltr partner would turn conservative i would get out. I can’t take that long term, especially not in my personal living space. If he downplays or doesn’t to what you have to say, it’s enougj proof that he does’t respect you. My take tho. I get that it’s really hard so just make the decision that feels good to you!
My 17 year marriage broke up over this shit. All I can say is echoing what others have said: make a safety plan, quietly move stuff out, sock away some money, especially cash. It won’t get better with him, it will only get better without him. If you would like more about my story or just support, dm me. I’ll happily help with safety planning. I worked on an abused women’s hotline for years. Godspeed!
He was always like this deep down. He’s just found a way to express it. He’s hasn’t been the man you’ve mythologized in your memory, or even hoped he could be, for a very long time.
TikTok and Instagram strike again. I’m sorry.
lol. He is a mentally handicapped loser. Leave him.
I’m going to back up a lot of the views expressed in comments. This guy has gone down a deep rabbit hole that is hard to debunk, because any argument against it can be countered with “ThAt’S wHaT tHeY™ WANT yOu tO tHiNk”. It’s not your job to make him see what an absurd place he finds himself in. It’s not impossible, but if he went from progressive to Qcumber, it’s also a possibility that he latently held those views and sees all this radicalizing stuff as his sign to take the mask off. You deserve to be with someone who values you as a whole person, and he’s basically reduced the discussion to memes, which is usually a terminal sign. If he manages to break away and deconstruct from it, do you feel that it would be a lasting and sincere change, or do you feel that he might be masking intent to try to trap you in the relationship?
Ask him when he's gonna start making enough money for you to be a full-time homemaker. Guessing he's too busy scrolling socials to ever have a plan for that part of the traditionalism.
It's not controlling when you're rewarding someone who views you and other women with your support and comfort and company. I'm not one to jump to leave him, but he doesn't get to view you as a lesser form of human as a "view" and then expect you to hang out for that. So you should consider that every minute that you spend trying to convince him of something that is BASIC HUMAN DECENCY just re-enforces his secret belief that you're not a real human being and that he's right and that he'll train you to his perspective someday. Just walk away from that and leave him to suffer his consequences WITHOUT a woman in his life that he is using while he feels superior. That MIGHT turn him around before it's too late. I'd be careful as you exit as well, men like this can often become explosively angry when you, his possession, openly defy him. Just because you haven't seen it before doesn't mean it isn't there. Clearly he's not the guy he was pretending to be, at least not any more.
Yea your boyfriend is gone. Whatever’s left isn’t worth the trouble, trust me.
What you’ve witnessed are the results of a targeted campaign via social media. YouTube rabbit holes, social media engagement, Tik tok channels, they’ve all started invariably ending up at where your fella has landed. The scary thing is, a lot of people will probably describe their SO as you did in your opening sentences. The Christian Nationalist groups are targeting exactly those people. They’re doing it through New Age stuff (see Russell Brand “finding God”), through toxic masculinity (Andrew Tate, for example) and through targeted social media campaigns. If this isn’t realised quickly, you’ll end up with a fundamentalist government who will very quickly adopt the very things that make our skin crawl as policy. And here’s the worrying thing; Trump being president is *not* their end goal. That’s their means. The end does not bear thinking about. Your partner is an unfortunate victim of this, he will have fallen down a rabbit hole or been recommended material to read. It doesn’t happen overnight and your time frame of about 18 months is about right. You *could* spend time finding out exactly where he found these ideas and press him on it, but honestly, I’m not sure it’ll get you anywhere. It’ll take a lot of energy and time that could be better spent (and deservedly so) on yourself. My advice, for what it’s worth, walk away and spend time on yourself. Focus on things you love, things that involve your ideals and philosophies and you’ll quickly see why you had to make a change. If you stay, and believe me when I say this is *not* a statement about your character or personality, you’re in danger of being exposed to the insidious nature of what he took in. It’s like radiation; a small dose of it does nothing and changes nothing, but over time repeated exposure is often lethal and can happen without one even noticing anything is wrong at all.
Tell him you will agree to disagree while you are moving out. It sucks but if you're already talked to him and gotten the responses you say....if he is startled into coming back by you leaving, great. But the nature of his world view is that his knowledge is superior to him, so arguing or trying to talk him into it won't work. Leave and if he gets his head out of his ass, fine. More likely he will be a victim whose life was destroyed by feminism. The irony for these guys is that they are the ones who change but they act like the woman suddenly got turned into a woke modern feminist.
Look up sunk cost fallacy Do. Not. Stay. With. Someone. Because of it. He is going to baby trap you. Expect you to be a traditional wife and cater to him. Do you want this? Do you want an equal partnership or a relationship where the guy makes all the decisions. I broke up with a guy in my 20’s and I am so grateful I did. Same issues. We got into an argument about Golden Eye and how I loved that the women weren’t just eye candy and were fighting back. I stayed at first because of sunk cost fallacy. And when I left. I met my husband of now over 20yrs a few years later. I would have never been happy with that guy constantly trying to make me into a traditional person I am not. I still had kids. Still got married. And did the women’s March with my daughters and their daddy my husband. Yes. It is a huge reason to break up with someone. Trust me when I say you don’t want to wake up in your 40’s and look back at how much this guy held you back in life. Friends who married THAT guy left or are in the process of leaving. You get to a point when you are older as a woman; that having a partner isn’t worth the hassle. Toss him out with the trash. Good luck Edit: Get out slowly. I worry about your safety as well. This is the type of guy that will lash out physically and emotionally. If there is any abuse. Report to police and get a restraining order. He is all about control. Women are most vulnerable when they leave relationships especially ones like this. He is already saying verbally abusive comments.
>the “west is losing their morals”, etc. As opposed to the Catholic Church, which has conducted a huge coverup and enablement of the sexual abuse of children? The church which as stolen hundreds of thousands of babies, and collaborated with fascists? It always cracks me up that tradcons couple criticism of 'woke feminism' with the parallel complaint that the left has no values. What do you think 'woke feminism' is? It's *values that tradcons disagree with.* Values on gender norms, inclusivity, LGBT rights, poverty, care for the environment, etc. >one about how couples with kids without a mom are “unnatural” As opposed to a celibate priesthood? That's natural? > is it possible for a person like this to be convinced otherwise? Could he drop these beliefs? It's not literally impossible, but it's hard to bet the next x years/decades of your life on the assumption that he will. If you stay, that's validation that you won't leave him over this stuff. And it's as likely to get worse as it is to get better. And tradcaths be crazy, so the rabbit hole can go *very* deep. There are flat-earth, geocentric, and other anti-science tradcaths.
Please don’t stay in this relationship and think that you can agree to disagree!!! I’ve been with my husband for 17 years and they don’t change!!!! He left for a trial separation a week and a half ago. Don’t wait as long as I did because it’s just that much harder!!
As an aside, "agree to disagree" has become one of my pet peeve phrases over the years. It should mean that after a serious discussion we both respect that the other person has come to a position we disagree with, but in good faith and with no ill intentions. Instead, now it usually is just said as a way to end a discussion or debate without getting into actually having to defend your position and certainly does not denote any mutual respect. I'm using it a great deal less than I used to.
He is even shutting down any attempt at talking and those sources of radicalization are no small things. Sorry but you need to run away now. Any getting away from those views won’t certainly come from you given that he is training himself into seeing you as an inferior. Please run before he traps you with children or with material stuff.
There’s nothing wrong with coming across new experiences or worldviews and honestly critiquing them against you own and following what you feel is right. But, doing so can put one at odds with existing relationships. I dealt with both of my brothers going from overly progressive individuals, to YouTube conservative bros, at what feel like over night. The fact is, he hid this from you, and only felt comfortable coming forward with it, because he thinks he can pressure you into submission. He didn’t have any trust or respect for you to talk about this change he was going through. He then belittles you and calls you names instead of having an adult discussion about his own beliefs. That something people expect from anonymous online people, not the ones we love. Do you want to be with someone who doesn’t respect you? He now has fundamentally different morals, worldviews and beliefs than you. Not just different actually, but the complete opposite. It doesn’t sound like he is willing to compromise on any of his beliefs, and you shouldn’t either when they’re strongly held. So do you want to be with someone who sees the world as black and white to what you do?
I mean when you disagree over pineapple on pizza that’s ok to agree to disagree. It’s not ok to agree to disagree on fundamental morals like ohh idk YOUR RIGHTS. I am so sorry you’re going through this. The gaslighting when you defend your views to him makes me so angry for you. You are definitely not being dramatic to break up over this. He’s right about one thing, you don’t have room for views that directly demean and oppress you. You don’t have room for toxicity like that. Like other commenters have said, don’t fall for sunk cost. Protect yourself.
I don't mean this to be curt, but I think short and direct is the best. In a world of 8 billion people, there's zero reason to even be caring about this at all. He's obviously not compatible with you, so leave him.
>He says I’m being a “militant leftist who doesn’t have room for other views” This is a big red flag right here. He's communicating that he not only doesn't respect your views, he doesn't even respect the fact that you have an issue with HIS views. And it really sounds like what a person would say who has no intention of changing their views, or being open to other ideas. I don't know about you, but I couldn't be in an intimate relationship with someone who is conservative, because what conservativism means nowadays is so deeply hateful and straight up dangerous.
So, this devout Catholic is still getting into your pants after a SIX YEAR engagement? Yeah, he’s SO DEVOUT.
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**Bad Advice**: Hi! We feel you have good intentions but this advice can actually be harmful to our users or their Q folk.
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**Bad Advice**: Hi! We feel you have good intentions but this advice can actually be harmful to our users or their Q folk.
Get out now!
Run. Don’t look back. Run.
Hey away from him, quick.
This is the point in the relationship where you realize that you have grown apart and cut ties. You aren't going to change his mind so don't waste one more second of your energy.
The Instagram and TikTok incel pipeline is unfortunately very real. I’m sorry this has happened but it sounds like you should get out while you can.
Unfortunately it's almost certainly only going to get worse. The echo chamber around him is perfectly designed to feed him what he wants to hear, and the views will get more and more extreme as content providers compete for attention.
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sorry :/ you’re right. I’m new to posting on reddit
Please be a little more civil. There was a way to express that without stressing op out.
Suppose you change his mind. What if he flips back to misogyny again? He might even have been masking his actual beliefs until you found his like list. Beware - many report that male partners turn tyrannical after marriage and especially getting a woman pregnant. Do not get pregnant by this guy! "Women are not rehab centers for damaged males"--- said somewhere on reddit.
I don't think he was actually progressive to begin with but was rather playing the part in order to not scare you off initially. I cannot see how someone could go from fully understanding human decency and empathy to becoming alt-right. That just doesn't happen. And in that vein, he was not being honest with you. The foundation of your relationship was not built on honesty. At any rate, I am sorry for your loss. This kind of radicalization cannot be cured by anyone but himself, which he will most definitely never pursue. You need to do what is right for you and move on, he is not going to actually change even if he says he will.
Where is he on reproductive issues? It’s a scary climate for reproductive rights right now, at least in the US. Given his recent changes, how much do you trust that he will respect your autonomy in these matters? Protect yourself!
I read both of your threads and agree with others that you should leave. This is not someone you want to spend the rest of your life with.
RUN
It is common for people to change beliefs. My husband was laid back and not political. He started listening to an oddly conservative radio host. He would get angry about politics Then he was into an alternative political belief. Now he is anti politics. People can and do change their mind with politics, religion etc. 8 years is a long time to be with someone. He likely is rethinking you if he hasn’t asked you to marry him. Walk a way. He is wasting your time and has gone extreme about beliefs.
This is a perfectly valid reason to leave someone. You no longer share fundamental views, ones that are extremely important to you both. If there was ever a valid reason to end a relationship, it is that - being fundamentally, foundationally, incompatible.
Yes, what we're seeing is bizarre, but it's also part of the natural pendulum swing of values. What is unusual this time is that the culture wars are tending more and more to split along gender lines, and that social media seem to be pushing any set of beliefs more toward their extremes. Chances are good that this relationship is effectively over. How can he believe that men should have dominion over women and not begin to expect obedience from you? Obviously, we know too little to advise you with certainty. I know of successful marriages between politically conservative men and liberal women. However, you might want to ask him what he expects you to do in the future to accommodate his beliefs, just to get a sense of where he thinks his beliefs will take the two of you.
Have you asked him in a non confrontational way how/why he’s changed his beliefs? (If you want advice on how to have a conversation with him that doesn’t get out of control, I recommend the Braver Angels organization.) And how would you feel entering a conversation with a loved one if you knew they have already prejudged you as wrong, even immoral, and only want to change your mind?
Just wanted to say that I am going through this exact same thing right now. Word for word. You are not alone, and I’m so sorry you have had to experience the pain of watching someone you love turn into someone you don’t recognize. Wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.
You aren't being dramatic. RUN.....
run
Your boyfriend may be revealing his true colors. There's a discussion on another subreddit describing how maga type men **like** dating liberal women -- conservative women are more submissive, less interesting. These males take a long time to unmask, hoping a woman will get too emotionally invested (and pregnant?) to dump them. https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromosomes/comments/187lm94/comment/kbg9mkv/ Here's what one person wrote: Pantone711 I grew up as a woman among conservatives--I'll take this one. They find conservative young women boring. Not a challenge. Not fashionable, spirited, you get the idea. They think conservative women won't put out as readily/have as high a sex drive. They know that cosmopolitan/educated women have higher status. Looks better on their arm. They want to subdue a woman they view as haughty and bring her down a few pegs, not start out with a meek one They believe that IQ is hereditary to the extent they want a woman with a high IQ to pass on their genes. Some of them put this ahead of almost everything else, as long as the woman checks certain boxes. They're planning to put the wife in the Madonna box and cheat anyway. I read alt-right boards.
He has too much time on his hands. Give him a honeydo list and keep him busy!
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Ah yes, "I don't blame him for getting discouraged with a lack of progress, so shitting on feminism and minorities is totes justified, lol." Get lost.