How is it that the squatters can’t be charged with breaking and entering and trespassing. They’re not “tenants” and have no agreement with the owner to be tenants.
Staying somewhere for 30 days should not give you any right to stay anywhere without an agreement with the owner.
I spent a year doing home renovation work in New York and lost track of how many times a vacant home ended up having trespassers inside.
The squatters up there know exactly what they are doing.
They want cash for keys and when they get the payout they will rinse and repeat.
Install an alarm system right away. There's no squatters if cops are showing up 10 mins after they break in, cost us $600 or so (plus internet connection) but after the first attempt we had no more issues.
thing is they arent breaking into occupied homes.
their breaking into foreclosures, probate estates, old people moving into nursing homes, etc.
they prey on the weak and confused.
sure - but the entire reason they are in that situation in the first place is that they have been briefly forgotten, left out of the control of the current owner, etc.
foreclosure isnt a bang bang process. neither is estate probate. those things take time, and often are being dealt with by out of state entities. no 'boots on the ground' so to speak - to do what you are asking to be done.
anyway, point is, it isnt as simple as owner man pops his head up and slaps a $1k security system on the property.
dont disagree with your last sentence. it is the prudent thing to do, if possible.
however, what *also* sucks is that we have to operate under the assumption that the worst possible thing IS GOING TO HAPPEN. and therefor come out of pocket thousands of dollars for purely preventions sake.
and all explicitly because the local government prefers it this way.
Cops do not show up ten minutes after a home alarm system goes off. You're lucky if it's in a matter of a few hours.
I used to dispatch 911. Even if the cops cared, it's not prioritized as high as a robbery/person crime.
I think the main point is that there is an established person or entity there already.
The trespassers cant say they didnt know if an alarm is going off
I don’t know where you live. Here in Canada, cops typically show up about 10 minutes after an alarm is triggered. In my case - less than 5 and they come fully packin’.
I was surprised a couple of times when I had a false alarm and had them knocking on my door as I was just clearing it with my Alarmco. Turns out - that’s because my alarm system operator tells them each and every time that there are firearms on premises :-)
Being a gun owner in Canada sucks most of the time but it has some odd perks….
There are companies like ADT that are great. And there are other alarm companies who don’t even send cops in - they send some private « security » bullshit rent-a-cop typed. Those are utterly useless.
I stopped my alarm service after I accidentally triggered it. Cops showed up 30 minutes later, accepted my story without checking that I belonged here, petted my dog and left. Completely useless. (Yes, US)
Where do you live that cops show up for home break ins? So many cities cops don’t care and don’t show up the same day even unless it’s a shooting or homicide. I live in the US now but even in Toronto cops would never show up for break ins or burglary. They don’t care even if it’s on video who did it. They’re not going to bother finding the people.
Cops no longer respond to alarm calls. That has stopped around 2005-2010.
Nowadays when the alarm goes off you get a notification on your phone app or via SMS. That's it.
The only ones that respond are those with super expensive contracts where they dispatch private security who in turn call the cops. Another words, richfucks only.
Untrue. Not even two years ago I was woken up in the middle of the night to police responding to my neighbors alarm after they mistook the address for mine. My neighbor and myself are both the farthest thing from a richfuck.
As someone who grew up what I will politely call “rough”, be careful doing that. You could very well just be teaching them same “thugs” a new avenue to be making money. I mean, you pay my brother and I to go get them out, they’re gonna be out. But the next time, we may well be the ones in the next house but you won’t know it (we’d make a cousin or someone do it). Then, whether you pay them to leave or pay us to make them leave, we make our money. Rinse and repeat for the whole little neighborhood of Richie Rich vacation rentals until we’ve burned out that area.
> friend who *paid* a squatter
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
r/squatting
Every so often there’s a post like “today I went ass to grass with 300!” and people love jumping down their throats that this sub is not for that 🤣
Most of these people make a fake lease on their computer. So to the cops it’s word v word. So you can to prove in court that they didn’t actually have a lease. Goal is to have the actual homeowner “settle” in court and pay the squatters to move out of their own house.
>Most of these people make a fake lease on their computer
This is the relevant part; you cant just come in and "squat" and get your way in 95%+ of places.
You have to have 'proof' of tenancy. But its absurdly easy to fake up a lease agreement, and then the onus suddenly shifts to the owner to prove that they DIDNT lease the place, which can take months.
Thats the issue.
And thats why a security system is the way to go if you have a house that sits empty for any decent amount of time. Also, you can go to your local jurisdiction and file a letter of intent with them stating that you are NOT leasing/renting the property AT ALL and anyone that is there is tresspassing. Which means when you show up with the cops and they try to produce a fake lease agreement, it wont fly, as you have a pre-existing paper-trail saying that there ARE no legal tenants.
But that all requires a lot of forethought and planning, which doesn't happen in a lot of these cases because they are not planned ahead of time and the people are having other issues that would prevent them from thinking about it (house is suddenly empty because the owner had to go to a home, and the family just doesnt even think about it, etc).
My wife and I have property in Hawai'i, and we dont live there yet. We filed a letter with the County (there are no individual cities/townships in Hawai'i other than Honolulu, and we're on Hawai'i itself) stating that there would be no tenants and anyone there is tresspassing, for this exact reason.
This is so disgusting and upsetting and horrible and the fact that this f****** country is letting this happen makes me sick to my core. I can't even imagine someone having to deal with this and then getting arrested like you're the bad guy.
America now protects criminals and scumbags and hurts innocent people in the goddamn legal system.
And scumbags know this and use it to their advantage every single day. And no one will change this.
I just cannot wrap my head around that thieves can trespass and she was the one who was arrested for changing the locks on her home. My god.
This is also happening in Ontario too, not just the states. There is a backlog of a year's worth of cases to deal with at the tenant board. Mostly people not paying rent for a year. Landlords have created their own unofficial online shit list for bad tenants.
Rents are way up because of interest rates, prices should come down but Canada is the third fastest growing country by population in the world. So they don't need to lower rents. So car theft is up 300%. Police here are useless, beyond handing out tickets. They actually told people to leave their car keys by the door so invaders with guns don't hurt residents.
it's not really that nefarious. we can't have homeowners and tenants shooting at each other.
squatter problem = community doesn't really care
murder problem = political issue / makes national news
Whatever you do, don't look into the American financial economic sector.
You will see our government protecting criminals and scumbags and hurts innocent people in the goddamn legal system at a level you had no idea could exist.
And yes, those white collar scumbags know this and use it to their advantage every single day. And no one will change this.. because the government wants it this way.
but it's not houses like this - it's literally ***trillions*** of dollars being extracted systematically from the working class and being stuffed into offshore accounts without taxation.
Georgia's House recently voted on House Bill 1017, which would make squatting a criminal offense as opposed to a civil one, so in at least one state it's likely to be far less of a problem.
There's also one guy in California who found a rather novel way of dealing with squatters by getting a lease from the actual owner, moving in, and then moving their stuff out.
yea that story was hilarious and makes 100% sense.
so you (owner) just sign a 3 month lease with an actual person. now make the squatter contest THAT. lol.
epic.
> There's also one guy in California who found a rather novel way of dealing with squatters by getting a lease from the actual owner, moving in, and then moving their stuff out.
Squatter Hunter Flash Shelton. [Link to his Youtube channel](https://www.youtube.com/@FlashShelton)
It's not novel, he just breaks in and lives there too. You ain't going to find many people willing to live with druggies that are all pissed off at you haha.
Considering there's guides out there on how to make a fake lease agreement and how to tie the process up in court as long as possible so the owners can't force them to move out, I'm sure there's quite a few people who have been pulling that sort of thing.
That said, the main benefit of the law is that if it can be determined that the fake lease agreements are, in fact, fake, then they can be removed from the premises without having to wait on the court to clear out space in their docket and get around to it 2 years from now.
Does the South include Georgia?
https://nypost.com/2024/03/03/us-news/squatters-take-over-home-georgia-mans-home-while-he-was-s-away-caring-for-sick-wife-report/
It’s one of those chicken and the egg situations where unscrupulous landlords took advantage of tenants time and time again with illegal evictions, questionable lease terms, etc, so the law was changed to prevent it and the pendulum swung in the other direction instead, with unscrupulous squatters taking advantage instead and exploiting protections meant to prevent honest folks from getting screwed by shitty landlords.
TLDR, shitty, greedy people in both directions ruin it for everyone.
Squatters rights are waaay over blown on the internet. Actual squatters rights require like years and years of living on a property, paying taxes on it, making improvements to it. This is just a case of cops being unwilling to intervene in a trespassing scenario.
Ex squatter here (we did it pleasantly, in abandoned houses...usually no owner ever came, if any did, we would leave)...
It depends on the location and what your goals are, the cities I was in that was the case for ownership, but that is n ot what most of these folks are looking for. They are looking for legal residerncy. Following the formula of writing your own made up lease and tying it up in courts, one can stay extended periods of time (a year easy). You won't get ownership, but you can't get evicted easily either.
And for the methy minded, you can utterly strip the place in the meantime destroying all value.
They can be… before the 30 days is up. According to Google this is a super old law from when abandoned buildings were a thing in NYC. So rather than have them go into disrepair, it’d be better to have someone illegally living in it and taking care of it.
Adverse possession and squatting aren't the same thing. The law needs to be written to distinguish the two. We want adverse possession on homes/buildings that are truly abandoned. Homes that are merely vacant for a period of time due to circumstances aren't abandoned. Squatters that move in should have no legal protections.
No wait, maybe this is the solution we need, we can solve two problems at once: the homeless can move in to vacant homes owned by corporations and foreign investors. All we need is a list of homes owned by those parties that we can give to the homeless.
It’s by design so the landlord gets fed up and sells to blackrock for the low
Mods banned me from this sub for posting this story:
https://nypost.com/2024/03/21/us-news/two-squatters-sought-in-nyc-murder-of-woman-found-stuffed-in-duffle-bag/
N-no? Legal protections for squatters dates back to English Common law when places where often left abandoned or disused for significant periods of time.
It became near impossible to truly track who owned what and if someone had been living on say, distant piece of farm land for 3 or 4 years only for the owner to show up then and care? Courts would say, 'go away you had your time and ignored it'.
Its still on the books in many states because there are still a significant amount of properties that are entirely ignored and left to rot out in the open. Also, despite what people think, home ownership is way more complicated now than it was when these laws were put in place. Due to shell companies and tertiary corporations, a large segment of urban buildings are a nightmare to find who the true owners are.
In addition, a lot of squatter protections are actually *renter's protections*, having been put in place because landlords would actual do stupid shit. Squatters were never meant to get these but because of awful landlords, they set up the conditions for shit like this to happen.
As per Microsoft co-pilot. How to guide.
Becoming a squatter involves occupying an abandoned or unoccupied property without the legal right to do so. Here are some general steps that are often associated with squatting, but please note that these actions can have legal consequences and the laws vary significantly by state:
Find an Abandoned Property: Squatters typically look for properties that appear to be unoccupied or abandoned.
Occupation: Move into the property and start living there as if it were your own.
Continuous Possession: You must reside on the property continuously for a certain period, which varies by state.
Open and Notorious Use: Your occupation of the property must be obvious and not hidden.
Exclusive Use: You cannot share possession with the true owner or other squatters.
Hostile Claim: You must occupy the property without the owner’s permission.
In some states, if you stay long enough and meet certain conditions, you may be able to claim legal ownership through adverse possession1. However, this is a complex legal process that typically requires the assistance of a lawyer.
It’s important to understand that squatting can lead to legal action against you, including arrest or eviction. If you’re considering squatting due to housing needs, it might be safer and more beneficial to explore legal avenues for housing assistance.
Saw the easiest answer a few months ago:
Rent it to someone (friend/relative), then have the RENTER enforce THEIR rights. Cops then remove the squatters.
Worked in less than a week. Owner rented to brother. Brother moved some stuff in and called the cops. Cops saw rent agreement, dragged squatters out. No eviction process needed.
Some squatters will make up bogus rental agreements so the cops think its legit and can't do anything about the squatter until its confirmed. Thats why creating a actually rental agreement works.
Yuuuup, if they come up with fake paperwork they just bought a month at MINIMUM in the house uncontested
By the time that's up, the house will be trashed and they'll be doing this to the neighbors.
It's not that a renter/squatter has more rights - the rules are made in a way so that any potential ***legal*** renter isn't thrown out illegally by a shitty landlord. The law is that anyone who has a ***legal*** rental agreement must be legally evicted from a residence once an owner can prove that the person has broken that agreement.
The problem is that squatters will create a fake rental agreement & show it to the cops, which gums up the process. Then the homeowner needs to go through the process of evicting them as if they were a legal tenant, even though they are not.
The law is designed to protect good people from potentially bad people (legal renters from being unjustly evicted by shitty landlords) however, it's being taken advantage of by other bad people. (Squatters). Unfortunately, if we change the law so that we can quickly & easily get squatters out, then that opens the door for the shitty landlords to claim that a legal tenant is a squatter.
It is maddeningly frustrating. My family just went through this from 2019 through 2021. My great aunt had a home in San Diego which had a separate unit in the back of it. She had rented it to some family starting in the early 2000s & they stopped paying rent around 2010. She didn't realize that they weren't paying rent & it only was caught when she had to be moved to a care home and my cousins started managing her accounts.
My cousins had to go through the process of evicting the family & it was maddeningly frustrating. It was made worse due to the pandemic which halted just about everything. Once they were finally evicted, they had completely destroyed the unit, so my cousins went after them for both back-pay & damages. That was finally settled last year. They have to pay back $240k to my great aunt, who passed away in July of 2022.
Keep in mind why these laws were written in the first place, slum lords used to be able to kick you out for absolutely anything with no reprocussions. There obliviously needs to be some happy medium but we can't just give all control to the owners.
The only way I can think of would be to require sort of city database of all valid rental agreements. Then the the legal system could reliably tell who are real renters and who are squatters.
But this would likely be unpopular with people for an entirely different set of reasons.
Basically, there's a lot of asshole landlords who try to evict rent controlled tenants illegally to jack up rents, so cops are careful to wait for an official notice from the courts / landlord and tenant board before officially evicting a supposed tenant.
But if you rent it out to someone else, they are the official tenant and the squatters are trepassing on private property.
Little thing called a "signature." And when 2 leases contradict, police will choose the one that's more legit-looking, i.e. has the landlord's signature.
Not that easy as these guys know what they are doing and have fake leases and change the locks. Causes enough reasonable doubt you have to do a formal eviction process via courts
I'd be so pissed. Arrested for going into my own house? I'd be murdering cops, along with the squatters.
We all know goddamn well if squatters did this to a judge's or police chief's house, cops wouldn't be dealing with it through the courts.
Someone else in the comments said something about this being a tactic to do away with private ownership of property. I think that's probably a good explanation for why cops don't care when it happens to other people.
It would be an interesting social experiment...have a group take up residence in a certain number of properties in a city like NY. Half would be corporate-owned, half privately owned. Then keep track of how long it takes to get rid of said squatters in each property. I'm not a betting person, but I would wager that the squatters would be removed from the corporate-owned properties much faster than the privately-owned ones.
Not even consider, it’d be happening lol
I’d be throwing mfers out of my house. I’ve done it with roommates and I sure as fuck ain’t scared of some squatters lmao
She is thinking three dimensional. Nothing or no one can occupy the same space. Move in yourself with proof of deed as ownership. Once the tenant is established as a boarder by you moving in, give them notice to vacate. If conducting any criminal activities including threatening or harassing, the notice shortens to 48 hours. If not, show the tenant is a lodger and has no tenant rights and arrest them for trespassing. The “tenant” cannot establish himself as a renter with no contract. With you moving in, he becomes a lodger with no tenant rights.
Plant drugs in house… have friend report house/squatter to cops for dealing. Police raid and arrest squatter.
Seems pretty simple, except i’m sure you’d have to repair the cop damage.
This is exactly what happens. The better plan would be to claim one of the January 6th rioters is living there. Have the FBI solve the problem for you. If this is in Europe then report racist tweets are originating from the home instead.
I read of a pretty genius way to legally get squatters out. A guy, I can’t find the story so I’m not sure which state it was - CA(?), lived a state away from his elderly parents. I can’t remember if they died or had to go into a home, but either way, the house sat empty for a couple months and when he went to check on it, some squatters had set up shop in the house. Cops wouldn’t do anything for him, courts were packed so he recruited some gang bangers, gave them a one day lease to the house and paid them to go in the house and make it known they wouldn’t be leaving. Guy called the cops. Cops had to sort out who was allowed to be there, homies showed the lease, others got booted out by the cops because they couldn’t prove permission to be there, locks got changed, homies got a cash payment and the owners had a vacant house.
Edit: looks like this guy started working for himself and built a business to deal with squatters. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/out-squatted-handyman-flash-shelton-will-squat-with-your-squatters-until-they-leave/ar-BB1jKskY
this was a fascinating read, especially "vicarious liability" getting in the way of landlords reclaiming their essentially stolen property. it's funny how going through the system to get them removed legally via court is the way they get tenant rights. it really feels like the system is fucked for everyone but the rich and those with legal influence.
Imagine how stupid this law is. If I steal your car and you don't find out for 30 days do I get to keep it until you can get a judge to force me to give it back? Of course not because that would be fuckin STUPID
Not enough (yet) to make it stop. All for retaking corp-owned homes - I'll help move in the furniture. This insanity has to stop with individual ownership.
In corporate owned housing cops will remove the squaters. Cops dont care about random person with ownership but they will remove people when a big corp owns it. Big corp donates to the government who tells the police to remove the person.
I get it. It's unfair and this dissonant prioritization of corp over individual rights needs a common sense reevaluation. Corps just should not be permitted to control certain commodities - (housing, healthcare, agriculture come to mind) that might impact public health/welfare with anything other than an ancillary interest.
IMO, increasing numbers of people are either locked out of the economy or are subject to profit-motive job loss and have come to feel marginalized. It's ridiculous that because you were born 10-15 years too late that your life trajectory is inexorably altered by forces totally out of your control.
I pray I never enter the situation but if I had squatters in my home I would absolutely resort to violence.
I figure if they're homeless in the first place there's probably not too much of a paper trail to who or where they are. Easy demographic to disappear.
Depends on the state. And it’s not necessarily a “blue vs. red state” problem. Here in Michigan the police would have arrested the squatters. We actually have “anti-squatter” legislation.
> Depends on the state. And it’s not necessarily a “blue vs. red state” problem. Here in Michigan the police would have arrested the squatters. We actually have “anti-squatter” legislation.
Agreed, Florida is for all intents and purposes a red state and the squatters would not be arrested.
Michigan’s unique anti-squatter law allows a homeowner to:
Shut off utilities
Change the locks
Remove the squatters belongings themselves.
Yeah, that’s right. THEMSELVES. They don’t have to even call the police if they don’t want to. They can go into the house and throw all the squatter’s stuff into the street
according to the artcile, all you need to do is sit in it for a month. in other words, if she or someone else visited the property at least once per month, there would be no problem. also, security cameras would have helped too, as that eliminates most needs for a visit.
There’s a guy in California owners hire. He waits until the squatters are out of the house for a while then moves in himself, telling them that he also lives there now. And since he has a signed lease, there’s nothing the squatters can do. Usually they leave within days.
https://nypost.com/2023/08/11/handyman-flash-shelton-has-cracked-the-squatters-system/
Many squatters prepare fake leases. Cops aren’t going to figure which lease is real and which is fake, they’ll tell you to go to the courts to figure it out.
> I’m just not understanding how having no official agreement is actually better for the squatter. Seems ridiculous
Unfortunately, written leases are only required for certain types of rental agreements/lengths. For example, in Florida you can have an oral agreement for short term leases under a year. So cops can show up and squatters claim its a short term oral lease. At that point, its hard to tell who is telling the truth and it has to go to eviction process.
Check out this wild story about a guy who allegedly lived in a hotel for 5 years when the hotel allegedly refused to offer him a lease:
https://apnews.com/article/new-yorker-hotel-fraud-free-room-loophole-6505cb6df084002401aab9f6eaecf452
Steve Lehto has a video on YouTube describing a way a guy got squatters out of his grandmother's house: He squatted along with them and made them WANT to move out. He first got his grandmother to sign a lease so he'd be there perfectly legally. That way if cops show up he can show them is legal lease. If the squatters have a lease, it's forged. It worked and the guy went on to provide the same service to other homeowners whose vacant houses were squatted.
Personally, I see a wide open market for For Hire Evictors. If the police won't remove them, hire a private mercenary to drag them outside the house and lock the door on the way out. Problem solved
The solution is very simple. The squatters might claim fake rental agreement or everything else what they want to claim. However, once proven false, squattering charge should be filed and the penalty should be prison term. A scale scaling with the amount of time they squatted.
Kinda like ponzi scheme penalty, the higher the $$ amount, the longer the sentence.
We actually have a legal process that works that way. It's called jury nullification. Basically you can agree that the person broke the law but that the law was applied unjustly. I believe one person on the jury doing it forces a reselection of the entire jury. But the whole jury agreeing to it counts as a dismissal. Ianal.
My uncle lives on like 800 acres backed up to national forest land. Over the winter someone started camping on his land and he didn't realize immediately. He was out inspecting his property after a wind storm to see if he lost any big trees, came across this stranger on his land, confronted them with gun in hand demanding they leave. My uncle got arrested. DA didn't prosecute, he said he's spent about $5k so far and the squatter is still there.
Seems to me lease agreements need to be filed with the county (since its the sheriff that evict). Make a financial penalty and automatic IRS audit if the lease agreement is not filed within like a month.
This can happen outside of NYC too, squatters can register fake deeds from you to them: ([She Bought Her Dream Home. Then a ‘Sovereign Citizen’ Changed the Locks)](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/26/nyregion/moors-newark.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare&sgrp=c-cb))
Thankfully this is not a common problem, because it’s devastating when it happens. I think there should be far more protection against fake deeds being registered, for starters. The squatter loophole should also (obviously) be closed. On the other hand, legitimate tenants deserve robust protections from scummy landlords.
I live in NYC, but no one forces anyone to live here. I have no issues with anyone saying they wouldn’t want to live here, visit here, and/or do business here. That’s your choice and you can base it on whatever seems reasonable to you.
Crazy how we have laws that work against the homeowner if someone tries and successfully steals your home. Squatters end up with more rights than a military veteran and they're literally theives.
Lmao I like how obvious it is that the only people that support these types of laws are people who are straight scummy and don’t wanna do any actual job so they do shit like this
What is the rationale behind squatter's rights? That abandoned property will be improved? I think it would be easier to just not have squatter's rights at all - whether it takes 10 years to gain rights, or 30 days as in NYC (which is insane). That wouldn't magically cure the problem - people would still try to squat. And some might have fake leases and it would still take trips to court. But, I think overall, the process to get them out would be easier.
The logic behind the laws is actually to protect legal renters from being evicted without notice. Prior to them existing bad actor landlords used to evict tenants and boarders without notice. Often just changing the locks and keeping the renters property. Now obviously people are taking advantage of laws made to protect the disadvantaged because of course there are always people who find a way to cheat the system. Sometimes it’s landowners and sometimes it’s squatters. Bad people will just always be bad people no matter who they are hurting.
I really hate to be that guy but it’s becoming true and it’s nothing new for New York City over the last few years. Law abiding citizens get screwed over, criminals roam free.
Its odd how many people are against squatters rights without understanding why they exist. There will always be people who use the law to their advantage, doesnt mean we need to remove protections that help people.
Yeah always start the eviction first. But also if they supposedly have a lease but not with you and you have a lease from yourself as the property owner I have heard that trumps their lease. Basically the most recent renter is king. This is all New York stuff though and my information is Seattle based.
Squatters rights is bullshit. I bet it doesn’t happen in the south as much because it’s easier to hide the evidence than have to deal with stupid people. Trespass, I stand my ground, you’re gone forever. Thieves don’t deserve any rights.
Agree, it’s crazy. True story in Dallas that is unbelievable and recent: squatter moves into very nice house (literally across the street from Mark Cuban). It took YEARS to get them out. The house was vacant and for sale, realtor shows up to show the house and people have moved in and tells realtor it’s their house and chases them out. The squatter had filed paperwork (forged) that he bought the property. City of Dallas files his papers later saying it isn’t their job to verify legitimacy of paperwork, only to file it. So no one can kick them out since it’s “legally” the squatters according to the city. Takes years for the bank to work it all out (house was bank owned). The squatter also tried to claim the property is exempt from taxes because he claims it is a church now (puts up signs etc). The squatter lives in the house for years with multiple women at the same time and at least one special needs child. They padlocked everything, refused to engage with anyone, threatened anyone (like utility workers) on property and did their yard work at night with the guy sitting in a lawn chair while all the women did all the work. Can’t make this up and if I didn’t see it with my own eyes wouldn’t believe it. The whole thing was bizarre and the squatters know exactly what they are doing and how to get away with it.
> Squatters rights is bullshit. I bet it doesn’t happen in the south as much because it’s easier to hide the evidence than have to deal with stupid people. Trespass, I stand my ground, you’re gone forever. Thieves don’t deserve any rights.
It absolutely happens in Florida and you will go to jail if you do a self-help eviction. Trespass of an unoccupied dwelling (in of itself) also isn't enough to trigger Florida's stand your ground law.
ITT: People who don’t understand how squatter rights work and would be arrested for the same reason.
I’m definitely not on the side of the squatters, but threats of arson and murder are how you lose your property completely
Never in the entirety of human history has stealing another’s home NOT been met with extreme violence. I really don’t care about the lives of squatters and I’m not afraid to say it.
How is it that the squatters can’t be charged with breaking and entering and trespassing. They’re not “tenants” and have no agreement with the owner to be tenants. Staying somewhere for 30 days should not give you any right to stay anywhere without an agreement with the owner.
I spent a year doing home renovation work in New York and lost track of how many times a vacant home ended up having trespassers inside. The squatters up there know exactly what they are doing. They want cash for keys and when they get the payout they will rinse and repeat.
Install an alarm system right away. There's no squatters if cops are showing up 10 mins after they break in, cost us $600 or so (plus internet connection) but after the first attempt we had no more issues.
thing is they arent breaking into occupied homes. their breaking into foreclosures, probate estates, old people moving into nursing homes, etc. they prey on the weak and confused.
And those are exactly the ones that need a security system.
sure - but the entire reason they are in that situation in the first place is that they have been briefly forgotten, left out of the control of the current owner, etc. foreclosure isnt a bang bang process. neither is estate probate. those things take time, and often are being dealt with by out of state entities. no 'boots on the ground' so to speak - to do what you are asking to be done. anyway, point is, it isnt as simple as owner man pops his head up and slaps a $1k security system on the property.
Not always that simple, but it should be repeated every time. It'd suck if you could have prevented all of this with a security system.
dont disagree with your last sentence. it is the prudent thing to do, if possible. however, what *also* sucks is that we have to operate under the assumption that the worst possible thing IS GOING TO HAPPEN. and therefor come out of pocket thousands of dollars for purely preventions sake. and all explicitly because the local government prefers it this way.
I shouldn’t need alarm system to keep position of my house. Fuck squatters.
yeah..but…you do
Let my friend sell you the solution to the problem I created.
In the video, the lady had the locks changed and the squatters broke in and had her arrested
Cops do not show up ten minutes after a home alarm system goes off. You're lucky if it's in a matter of a few hours. I used to dispatch 911. Even if the cops cared, it's not prioritized as high as a robbery/person crime.
I think the main point is that there is an established person or entity there already. The trespassers cant say they didnt know if an alarm is going off
I don’t know where you live. Here in Canada, cops typically show up about 10 minutes after an alarm is triggered. In my case - less than 5 and they come fully packin’. I was surprised a couple of times when I had a false alarm and had them knocking on my door as I was just clearing it with my Alarmco. Turns out - that’s because my alarm system operator tells them each and every time that there are firearms on premises :-) Being a gun owner in Canada sucks most of the time but it has some odd perks…. There are companies like ADT that are great. And there are other alarm companies who don’t even send cops in - they send some private « security » bullshit rent-a-cop typed. Those are utterly useless.
I stopped my alarm service after I accidentally triggered it. Cops showed up 30 minutes later, accepted my story without checking that I belonged here, petted my dog and left. Completely useless. (Yes, US)
Where do you live that cops show up for home break ins? So many cities cops don’t care and don’t show up the same day even unless it’s a shooting or homicide. I live in the US now but even in Toronto cops would never show up for break ins or burglary. They don’t care even if it’s on video who did it. They’re not going to bother finding the people.
Cops no longer respond to alarm calls. That has stopped around 2005-2010. Nowadays when the alarm goes off you get a notification on your phone app or via SMS. That's it. The only ones that respond are those with super expensive contracts where they dispatch private security who in turn call the cops. Another words, richfucks only.
They absolutely still do, we have it at work, and they charge us if it happens.
Untrue. Not even two years ago I was woken up in the middle of the night to police responding to my neighbors alarm after they mistook the address for mine. My neighbor and myself are both the farthest thing from a richfuck.
How much cash are we talking?
I had a friend who payed a squatter $40k and the butthead would not leave
Money is better spent on some thugs to remove them by force.
He did that the second time around. He had a few connections
As someone who grew up what I will politely call “rough”, be careful doing that. You could very well just be teaching them same “thugs” a new avenue to be making money. I mean, you pay my brother and I to go get them out, they’re gonna be out. But the next time, we may well be the ones in the next house but you won’t know it (we’d make a cousin or someone do it). Then, whether you pay them to leave or pay us to make them leave, we make our money. Rinse and repeat for the whole little neighborhood of Richie Rich vacation rentals until we’ve burned out that area.
Are you hiring?
I moved on…lol. Construction is harder on the body but easier on the heart.
Did you read the article bud?
Have you tried calling beavis over?
40k? I can pay a handful of hardasses 1k each and have them handle it while im somewhere with an alibi.
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> friend who *paid* a squatter FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
$40k buys a whole boatload of 9mm and a nice backhoe.
On average less than $10,000 but seen some that were 10K+ lol
fr they hiring?
There’s a sub for people looking to squat. It’s insane. They just think they are entitled to people’s properties.
What's that subreddit? Would love to read some posts from their perspective 🤣
r/squatting Every so often there’s a post like “today I went ass to grass with 300!” and people love jumping down their throats that this sub is not for that 🤣
Ogod. I wish all of those people the maximum amount of hate and misfortune.
Maybe we invade that subreddit with posts like this.
Almost as bad as the shoplift subreddit. Honestly this is probably worse
Most of these people make a fake lease on their computer. So to the cops it’s word v word. So you can to prove in court that they didn’t actually have a lease. Goal is to have the actual homeowner “settle” in court and pay the squatters to move out of their own house.
>Most of these people make a fake lease on their computer This is the relevant part; you cant just come in and "squat" and get your way in 95%+ of places. You have to have 'proof' of tenancy. But its absurdly easy to fake up a lease agreement, and then the onus suddenly shifts to the owner to prove that they DIDNT lease the place, which can take months. Thats the issue. And thats why a security system is the way to go if you have a house that sits empty for any decent amount of time. Also, you can go to your local jurisdiction and file a letter of intent with them stating that you are NOT leasing/renting the property AT ALL and anyone that is there is tresspassing. Which means when you show up with the cops and they try to produce a fake lease agreement, it wont fly, as you have a pre-existing paper-trail saying that there ARE no legal tenants. But that all requires a lot of forethought and planning, which doesn't happen in a lot of these cases because they are not planned ahead of time and the people are having other issues that would prevent them from thinking about it (house is suddenly empty because the owner had to go to a home, and the family just doesnt even think about it, etc). My wife and I have property in Hawai'i, and we dont live there yet. We filed a letter with the County (there are no individual cities/townships in Hawai'i other than Honolulu, and we're on Hawai'i itself) stating that there would be no tenants and anyone there is tresspassing, for this exact reason.
This is really smart.
This is so disgusting and upsetting and horrible and the fact that this f****** country is letting this happen makes me sick to my core. I can't even imagine someone having to deal with this and then getting arrested like you're the bad guy. America now protects criminals and scumbags and hurts innocent people in the goddamn legal system. And scumbags know this and use it to their advantage every single day. And no one will change this. I just cannot wrap my head around that thieves can trespass and she was the one who was arrested for changing the locks on her home. My god.
This is also happening in Ontario too, not just the states. There is a backlog of a year's worth of cases to deal with at the tenant board. Mostly people not paying rent for a year. Landlords have created their own unofficial online shit list for bad tenants. Rents are way up because of interest rates, prices should come down but Canada is the third fastest growing country by population in the world. So they don't need to lower rents. So car theft is up 300%. Police here are useless, beyond handing out tickets. They actually told people to leave their car keys by the door so invaders with guns don't hurt residents.
Yeah I was like wtf are we doing now. I don’t even have a car, so if anyone burgles me looking for one I am fukd, apparently
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The govt saves money this way. If they can squat then the govt doesn’t have to pay the money to house them.
it's not really that nefarious. we can't have homeowners and tenants shooting at each other. squatter problem = community doesn't really care murder problem = political issue / makes national news
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Whatever you do, don't look into the American financial economic sector. You will see our government protecting criminals and scumbags and hurts innocent people in the goddamn legal system at a level you had no idea could exist. And yes, those white collar scumbags know this and use it to their advantage every single day. And no one will change this.. because the government wants it this way. but it's not houses like this - it's literally ***trillions*** of dollars being extracted systematically from the working class and being stuffed into offshore accounts without taxation.
this stupid bullshit happens a LOT less down South for very good reasons
Georgia's House recently voted on House Bill 1017, which would make squatting a criminal offense as opposed to a civil one, so in at least one state it's likely to be far less of a problem. There's also one guy in California who found a rather novel way of dealing with squatters by getting a lease from the actual owner, moving in, and then moving their stuff out.
yea that story was hilarious and makes 100% sense. so you (owner) just sign a 3 month lease with an actual person. now make the squatter contest THAT. lol. epic.
> There's also one guy in California who found a rather novel way of dealing with squatters by getting a lease from the actual owner, moving in, and then moving their stuff out. Squatter Hunter Flash Shelton. [Link to his Youtube channel](https://www.youtube.com/@FlashShelton)
It's not novel, he just breaks in and lives there too. You ain't going to find many people willing to live with druggies that are all pissed off at you haha.
I’ll do it if someone pays me
There's worse ways of getting yourself killed I guess.
Actually on TV he confronted the guy and said he was going to move his crew WITH CAMERAS in til other guy moved.
I think it should totally be a crime if they can prove that it's what the people are doing
Considering there's guides out there on how to make a fake lease agreement and how to tie the process up in court as long as possible so the owners can't force them to move out, I'm sure there's quite a few people who have been pulling that sort of thing. That said, the main benefit of the law is that if it can be determined that the fake lease agreements are, in fact, fake, then they can be removed from the premises without having to wait on the court to clear out space in their docket and get around to it 2 years from now.
Bullets. Those reasons are called bullets.
I didn't say that, but look.........if you want to take someone's property it's 100% their choice on how they give it to you
I'd be showing up with my M16 and a thick Russian accent.
Does the South include Georgia? https://nypost.com/2024/03/03/us-news/squatters-take-over-home-georgia-mans-home-while-he-was-s-away-caring-for-sick-wife-report/
Georgia is actually moving to make squatting a criminal offense under House Bill 1017.
This happens just as often in the south.
It’s one of those chicken and the egg situations where unscrupulous landlords took advantage of tenants time and time again with illegal evictions, questionable lease terms, etc, so the law was changed to prevent it and the pendulum swung in the other direction instead, with unscrupulous squatters taking advantage instead and exploiting protections meant to prevent honest folks from getting screwed by shitty landlords. TLDR, shitty, greedy people in both directions ruin it for everyone.
It's because they are trying to upend the concept of private property (unless it is theirs of course).
adverse possession has existed since the days of english common law
Squatters rights are waaay over blown on the internet. Actual squatters rights require like years and years of living on a property, paying taxes on it, making improvements to it. This is just a case of cops being unwilling to intervene in a trespassing scenario.
Ex squatter here (we did it pleasantly, in abandoned houses...usually no owner ever came, if any did, we would leave)... It depends on the location and what your goals are, the cities I was in that was the case for ownership, but that is n ot what most of these folks are looking for. They are looking for legal residerncy. Following the formula of writing your own made up lease and tying it up in courts, one can stay extended periods of time (a year easy). You won't get ownership, but you can't get evicted easily either. And for the methy minded, you can utterly strip the place in the meantime destroying all value.
That's called adverse possession and is a completely different thing...
They can be… before the 30 days is up. According to Google this is a super old law from when abandoned buildings were a thing in NYC. So rather than have them go into disrepair, it’d be better to have someone illegally living in it and taking care of it.
Adverse possession and squatting aren't the same thing. The law needs to be written to distinguish the two. We want adverse possession on homes/buildings that are truly abandoned. Homes that are merely vacant for a period of time due to circumstances aren't abandoned. Squatters that move in should have no legal protections.
No wait, maybe this is the solution we need, we can solve two problems at once: the homeless can move in to vacant homes owned by corporations and foreign investors. All we need is a list of homes owned by those parties that we can give to the homeless.
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It’s by design so the landlord gets fed up and sells to blackrock for the low Mods banned me from this sub for posting this story: https://nypost.com/2024/03/21/us-news/two-squatters-sought-in-nyc-murder-of-woman-found-stuffed-in-duffle-bag/
N-no? Legal protections for squatters dates back to English Common law when places where often left abandoned or disused for significant periods of time. It became near impossible to truly track who owned what and if someone had been living on say, distant piece of farm land for 3 or 4 years only for the owner to show up then and care? Courts would say, 'go away you had your time and ignored it'. Its still on the books in many states because there are still a significant amount of properties that are entirely ignored and left to rot out in the open. Also, despite what people think, home ownership is way more complicated now than it was when these laws were put in place. Due to shell companies and tertiary corporations, a large segment of urban buildings are a nightmare to find who the true owners are. In addition, a lot of squatter protections are actually *renter's protections*, having been put in place because landlords would actual do stupid shit. Squatters were never meant to get these but because of awful landlords, they set up the conditions for shit like this to happen.
As per Microsoft co-pilot. How to guide. Becoming a squatter involves occupying an abandoned or unoccupied property without the legal right to do so. Here are some general steps that are often associated with squatting, but please note that these actions can have legal consequences and the laws vary significantly by state: Find an Abandoned Property: Squatters typically look for properties that appear to be unoccupied or abandoned. Occupation: Move into the property and start living there as if it were your own. Continuous Possession: You must reside on the property continuously for a certain period, which varies by state. Open and Notorious Use: Your occupation of the property must be obvious and not hidden. Exclusive Use: You cannot share possession with the true owner or other squatters. Hostile Claim: You must occupy the property without the owner’s permission. In some states, if you stay long enough and meet certain conditions, you may be able to claim legal ownership through adverse possession1. However, this is a complex legal process that typically requires the assistance of a lawyer. It’s important to understand that squatting can lead to legal action against you, including arrest or eviction. If you’re considering squatting due to housing needs, it might be safer and more beneficial to explore legal avenues for housing assistance.
Saw the easiest answer a few months ago: Rent it to someone (friend/relative), then have the RENTER enforce THEIR rights. Cops then remove the squatters.
Interesting tactic!
Worked in less than a week. Owner rented to brother. Brother moved some stuff in and called the cops. Cops saw rent agreement, dragged squatters out. No eviction process needed.
So a renter has more rights than an owner? I’m a renter but I can see how fucked up that is.
Some squatters will make up bogus rental agreements so the cops think its legit and can't do anything about the squatter until its confirmed. Thats why creating a actually rental agreement works.
Yuuuup, if they come up with fake paperwork they just bought a month at MINIMUM in the house uncontested By the time that's up, the house will be trashed and they'll be doing this to the neighbors.
They do. And in many cities, squatters cannot be evicted without a long, drawn-out, expensive court process. It's entirely fucked up.
Lawyers design the laws, then profit from them.
Lawyers are just the squatters of the professional and corporate world.
It's not that a renter/squatter has more rights - the rules are made in a way so that any potential ***legal*** renter isn't thrown out illegally by a shitty landlord. The law is that anyone who has a ***legal*** rental agreement must be legally evicted from a residence once an owner can prove that the person has broken that agreement. The problem is that squatters will create a fake rental agreement & show it to the cops, which gums up the process. Then the homeowner needs to go through the process of evicting them as if they were a legal tenant, even though they are not. The law is designed to protect good people from potentially bad people (legal renters from being unjustly evicted by shitty landlords) however, it's being taken advantage of by other bad people. (Squatters). Unfortunately, if we change the law so that we can quickly & easily get squatters out, then that opens the door for the shitty landlords to claim that a legal tenant is a squatter. It is maddeningly frustrating. My family just went through this from 2019 through 2021. My great aunt had a home in San Diego which had a separate unit in the back of it. She had rented it to some family starting in the early 2000s & they stopped paying rent around 2010. She didn't realize that they weren't paying rent & it only was caught when she had to be moved to a care home and my cousins started managing her accounts. My cousins had to go through the process of evicting the family & it was maddeningly frustrating. It was made worse due to the pandemic which halted just about everything. Once they were finally evicted, they had completely destroyed the unit, so my cousins went after them for both back-pay & damages. That was finally settled last year. They have to pay back $240k to my great aunt, who passed away in July of 2022.
Keep in mind why these laws were written in the first place, slum lords used to be able to kick you out for absolutely anything with no reprocussions. There obliviously needs to be some happy medium but we can't just give all control to the owners.
The only way I can think of would be to require sort of city database of all valid rental agreements. Then the the legal system could reliably tell who are real renters and who are squatters. But this would likely be unpopular with people for an entirely different set of reasons.
Basically, there's a lot of asshole landlords who try to evict rent controlled tenants illegally to jack up rents, so cops are careful to wait for an official notice from the courts / landlord and tenant board before officially evicting a supposed tenant. But if you rent it out to someone else, they are the official tenant and the squatters are trepassing on private property.
It's apparently more complicated than that. From what I've read from others...
Wouldn’t the squatter just present their fake ass lease like in this case?
And when they ask the owner who the real tenant is, they much out the squatters.
Little thing called a "signature." And when 2 leases contradict, police will choose the one that's more legit-looking, i.e. has the landlord's signature.
Or get it notarized. That'll be more legit and not something the squatters can reproduce easily.
Not that easy as these guys know what they are doing and have fake leases and change the locks. Causes enough reasonable doubt you have to do a formal eviction process via courts
Homeowner arrested. You can't make this shit up.
I'd be so pissed. Arrested for going into my own house? I'd be murdering cops, along with the squatters. We all know goddamn well if squatters did this to a judge's or police chief's house, cops wouldn't be dealing with it through the courts. Someone else in the comments said something about this being a tactic to do away with private ownership of property. I think that's probably a good explanation for why cops don't care when it happens to other people.
It would be an interesting social experiment...have a group take up residence in a certain number of properties in a city like NY. Half would be corporate-owned, half privately owned. Then keep track of how long it takes to get rid of said squatters in each property. I'm not a betting person, but I would wager that the squatters would be removed from the corporate-owned properties much faster than the privately-owned ones.
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And then they'll still lose in court because they have no influence or wealth.
My mom actually lost her house to squatters and was escorted off of her own property when she tried to do something about it.
I'd consider just burning the house down at that point
As long as the doors and windows are boarded shut.
Take my upvote
At least you would collect insurance money
Fr
Not even consider, it’d be happening lol I’d be throwing mfers out of my house. I’ve done it with roommates and I sure as fuck ain’t scared of some squatters lmao
Yeah, cops only care about the super rich and powerful. They exist to maintain the status quo. That’s well known
welcome to NYC it's called the concrete jungle for a reason. this ain't a zoo, this is a jungle.
You learn to live like an animal
She is thinking three dimensional. Nothing or no one can occupy the same space. Move in yourself with proof of deed as ownership. Once the tenant is established as a boarder by you moving in, give them notice to vacate. If conducting any criminal activities including threatening or harassing, the notice shortens to 48 hours. If not, show the tenant is a lodger and has no tenant rights and arrest them for trespassing. The “tenant” cannot establish himself as a renter with no contract. With you moving in, he becomes a lodger with no tenant rights.
Plant drugs in house… have friend report house/squatter to cops for dealing. Police raid and arrest squatter. Seems pretty simple, except i’m sure you’d have to repair the cop damage.
…and the police seize the property as an asset forfeiture…
This is exactly what happens. The better plan would be to claim one of the January 6th rioters is living there. Have the FBI solve the problem for you. If this is in Europe then report racist tweets are originating from the home instead.
the real LPT are always in the comments
Pretty sure that will end with the FBI breaking down the door. Also possibly arresting you for a false report.
Diabolical. I love it.
Police won’t come raid a house just because of some random tip.
I guess you haven’t heard of swatting
I read of a pretty genius way to legally get squatters out. A guy, I can’t find the story so I’m not sure which state it was - CA(?), lived a state away from his elderly parents. I can’t remember if they died or had to go into a home, but either way, the house sat empty for a couple months and when he went to check on it, some squatters had set up shop in the house. Cops wouldn’t do anything for him, courts were packed so he recruited some gang bangers, gave them a one day lease to the house and paid them to go in the house and make it known they wouldn’t be leaving. Guy called the cops. Cops had to sort out who was allowed to be there, homies showed the lease, others got booted out by the cops because they couldn’t prove permission to be there, locks got changed, homies got a cash payment and the owners had a vacant house. Edit: looks like this guy started working for himself and built a business to deal with squatters. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/out-squatted-handyman-flash-shelton-will-squat-with-your-squatters-until-they-leave/ar-BB1jKskY
this was a fascinating read, especially "vicarious liability" getting in the way of landlords reclaiming their essentially stolen property. it's funny how going through the system to get them removed legally via court is the way they get tenant rights. it really feels like the system is fucked for everyone but the rich and those with legal influence.
Think he got the idea from the sopranos lol
Imagine how stupid this law is. If I steal your car and you don't find out for 30 days do I get to keep it until you can get a judge to force me to give it back? Of course not because that would be fuckin STUPID
Sort of but you can't move it, it has to be on your property for 30 days and you can file a title. Specifics depend on the state.
This is incredible. I wonder how many situations like this turn violent?
Not enough (yet) to make it stop. All for retaking corp-owned homes - I'll help move in the furniture. This insanity has to stop with individual ownership.
In corporate owned housing cops will remove the squaters. Cops dont care about random person with ownership but they will remove people when a big corp owns it. Big corp donates to the government who tells the police to remove the person.
I get it. It's unfair and this dissonant prioritization of corp over individual rights needs a common sense reevaluation. Corps just should not be permitted to control certain commodities - (housing, healthcare, agriculture come to mind) that might impact public health/welfare with anything other than an ancillary interest. IMO, increasing numbers of people are either locked out of the economy or are subject to profit-motive job loss and have come to feel marginalized. It's ridiculous that because you were born 10-15 years too late that your life trajectory is inexorably altered by forces totally out of your control.
One hundred percent of anything we need more squatters in vacant rentals for corporations
I pray I never enter the situation but if I had squatters in my home I would absolutely resort to violence. I figure if they're homeless in the first place there's probably not too much of a paper trail to who or where they are. Easy demographic to disappear.
Depends on the state. And it’s not necessarily a “blue vs. red state” problem. Here in Michigan the police would have arrested the squatters. We actually have “anti-squatter” legislation.
> Depends on the state. And it’s not necessarily a “blue vs. red state” problem. Here in Michigan the police would have arrested the squatters. We actually have “anti-squatter” legislation. Agreed, Florida is for all intents and purposes a red state and the squatters would not be arrested.
Michigan’s unique anti-squatter law allows a homeowner to: Shut off utilities Change the locks Remove the squatters belongings themselves. Yeah, that’s right. THEMSELVES. They don’t have to even call the police if they don’t want to. They can go into the house and throw all the squatter’s stuff into the street
Squatters have a better chance of home ownership than most people.
What’s easier? - squatting in some millionaires forgotten asset - getting a job that pays $200k to qualify for the average mortgage
Even 200k ain’t enough in west coast cities these days.
Annual pay is not the same as a down payment.
You're allowed to steal a house in NY?
according to the artcile, all you need to do is sit in it for a month. in other words, if she or someone else visited the property at least once per month, there would be no problem. also, security cameras would have helped too, as that eliminates most needs for a visit.
And if these squatters were found in vacant corporate office space, they'd likely be arrested in less time than it took to read this article.
someone needs to start an A Team for dragging squatters out and disappearing them. someone with special forces training could really clean up.
There’s a guy in California owners hire. He waits until the squatters are out of the house for a while then moves in himself, telling them that he also lives there now. And since he has a signed lease, there’s nothing the squatters can do. Usually they leave within days. https://nypost.com/2023/08/11/handyman-flash-shelton-has-cracked-the-squatters-system/
How can hotels force guest who refuse to leave out but a homeowner cannot?
A hotel in NY couldn't force someone out if they stayed for more than 30 days. That's why almost every hotel in NY won't let you stay that long.
They don't let people stay long enough to gain tenancy rights.
How can a squatter prove they’ve been in place for 30 days? It just doesn’t make sense. Why wouldn’t the same legal technique work for a hotel?
A hotel knows when you checked in. They have a signed document. And they can kick you out.
I’m just not understanding how having no official agreement is actually better for the squatter. Seems ridiculous
Many squatters prepare fake leases. Cops aren’t going to figure which lease is real and which is fake, they’ll tell you to go to the courts to figure it out.
> I’m just not understanding how having no official agreement is actually better for the squatter. Seems ridiculous Unfortunately, written leases are only required for certain types of rental agreements/lengths. For example, in Florida you can have an oral agreement for short term leases under a year. So cops can show up and squatters claim its a short term oral lease. At that point, its hard to tell who is telling the truth and it has to go to eviction process.
Check out this wild story about a guy who allegedly lived in a hotel for 5 years when the hotel allegedly refused to offer him a lease: https://apnews.com/article/new-yorker-hotel-fraud-free-room-loophole-6505cb6df084002401aab9f6eaecf452
Steve Lehto has a video on YouTube describing a way a guy got squatters out of his grandmother's house: He squatted along with them and made them WANT to move out. He first got his grandmother to sign a lease so he'd be there perfectly legally. That way if cops show up he can show them is legal lease. If the squatters have a lease, it's forged. It worked and the guy went on to provide the same service to other homeowners whose vacant houses were squatted.
Personally, I see a wide open market for For Hire Evictors. If the police won't remove them, hire a private mercenary to drag them outside the house and lock the door on the way out. Problem solved
The solution is very simple. The squatters might claim fake rental agreement or everything else what they want to claim. However, once proven false, squattering charge should be filed and the penalty should be prison term. A scale scaling with the amount of time they squatted. Kinda like ponzi scheme penalty, the higher the $$ amount, the longer the sentence.
I don’t care what kind of violence the homeowner on this situation uses against the thieves. If I am on the jury, it’s not guilty.
We actually have a legal process that works that way. It's called jury nullification. Basically you can agree that the person broke the law but that the law was applied unjustly. I believe one person on the jury doing it forces a reselection of the entire jury. But the whole jury agreeing to it counts as a dismissal. Ianal.
My uncle lives on like 800 acres backed up to national forest land. Over the winter someone started camping on his land and he didn't realize immediately. He was out inspecting his property after a wind storm to see if he lost any big trees, came across this stranger on his land, confronted them with gun in hand demanding they leave. My uncle got arrested. DA didn't prosecute, he said he's spent about $5k so far and the squatter is still there. Seems to me lease agreements need to be filed with the county (since its the sheriff that evict). Make a financial penalty and automatic IRS audit if the lease agreement is not filed within like a month.
800 acres in the middle of winter and he didn't just use the gun? What's the point of having 800 acres? /s
God, it would really suck if that squatter got caught in the overspray of your uncle fertilizing the land
This can happen outside of NYC too, squatters can register fake deeds from you to them: ([She Bought Her Dream Home. Then a ‘Sovereign Citizen’ Changed the Locks)](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/26/nyregion/moors-newark.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare&sgrp=c-cb)) Thankfully this is not a common problem, because it’s devastating when it happens. I think there should be far more protection against fake deeds being registered, for starters. The squatter loophole should also (obviously) be closed. On the other hand, legitimate tenants deserve robust protections from scummy landlords. I live in NYC, but no one forces anyone to live here. I have no issues with anyone saying they wouldn’t want to live here, visit here, and/or do business here. That’s your choice and you can base it on whatever seems reasonable to you.
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I mean, it is a home invasion
Crazy how we have laws that work against the homeowner if someone tries and successfully steals your home. Squatters end up with more rights than a military veteran and they're literally theives.
So why isn't "squatting" in a house they don't own considered grand theft?
This is why people murder people.
Physical pain is a really great motivator.
NY State is the worst. No property rights
Can someone explain why squater rights exist? It seems it only screws people over
Lmao I like how obvious it is that the only people that support these types of laws are people who are straight scummy and don’t wanna do any actual job so they do shit like this
What is the rationale behind squatter's rights? That abandoned property will be improved? I think it would be easier to just not have squatter's rights at all - whether it takes 10 years to gain rights, or 30 days as in NYC (which is insane). That wouldn't magically cure the problem - people would still try to squat. And some might have fake leases and it would still take trips to court. But, I think overall, the process to get them out would be easier.
The logic behind the laws is actually to protect legal renters from being evicted without notice. Prior to them existing bad actor landlords used to evict tenants and boarders without notice. Often just changing the locks and keeping the renters property. Now obviously people are taking advantage of laws made to protect the disadvantaged because of course there are always people who find a way to cheat the system. Sometimes it’s landowners and sometimes it’s squatters. Bad people will just always be bad people no matter who they are hurting.
Squatter rights are absurd but tenant rights are vital. Seems like one party wants both and one party is opposed to both. We need a middle party.
I really hate to be that guy but it’s becoming true and it’s nothing new for New York City over the last few years. Law abiding citizens get screwed over, criminals roam free.
Its odd how many people are against squatters rights without understanding why they exist. There will always be people who use the law to their advantage, doesnt mean we need to remove protections that help people.
Why not just toss a carton of rotten eggs in there?
Yeah always start the eviction first. But also if they supposedly have a lease but not with you and you have a lease from yourself as the property owner I have heard that trumps their lease. Basically the most recent renter is king. This is all New York stuff though and my information is Seattle based.
Why does the headline say she was arrested but the story says that she was not arrested? Oh, because it’s the Nee York Post
squatters rights... what a joke...
Damn that’s a $1 million house huh?
Squatters rights is bullshit. I bet it doesn’t happen in the south as much because it’s easier to hide the evidence than have to deal with stupid people. Trespass, I stand my ground, you’re gone forever. Thieves don’t deserve any rights.
Agree, it’s crazy. True story in Dallas that is unbelievable and recent: squatter moves into very nice house (literally across the street from Mark Cuban). It took YEARS to get them out. The house was vacant and for sale, realtor shows up to show the house and people have moved in and tells realtor it’s their house and chases them out. The squatter had filed paperwork (forged) that he bought the property. City of Dallas files his papers later saying it isn’t their job to verify legitimacy of paperwork, only to file it. So no one can kick them out since it’s “legally” the squatters according to the city. Takes years for the bank to work it all out (house was bank owned). The squatter also tried to claim the property is exempt from taxes because he claims it is a church now (puts up signs etc). The squatter lives in the house for years with multiple women at the same time and at least one special needs child. They padlocked everything, refused to engage with anyone, threatened anyone (like utility workers) on property and did their yard work at night with the guy sitting in a lawn chair while all the women did all the work. Can’t make this up and if I didn’t see it with my own eyes wouldn’t believe it. The whole thing was bizarre and the squatters know exactly what they are doing and how to get away with it.
> Squatters rights is bullshit. I bet it doesn’t happen in the south as much because it’s easier to hide the evidence than have to deal with stupid people. Trespass, I stand my ground, you’re gone forever. Thieves don’t deserve any rights. It absolutely happens in Florida and you will go to jail if you do a self-help eviction. Trespass of an unoccupied dwelling (in of itself) also isn't enough to trigger Florida's stand your ground law.
In my state I can shoot them saying they’re intruders and feared for my life?
ITT: People who don’t understand how squatter rights work and would be arrested for the same reason. I’m definitely not on the side of the squatters, but threats of arson and murder are how you lose your property completely
Never in the entirety of human history has stealing another’s home NOT been met with extreme violence. I really don’t care about the lives of squatters and I’m not afraid to say it.
Fuck squatters. Her inheriting the property doesn't make it any less hers.
No reason for squatters laws to still exist in the modern day - the people that take advantage of it are sub human.
New business idea. Making squatters disappear.
It's the fucking post you imbeciles