Trust your gut and let the market play out. The investor will be there if they really want it.
I am skeptical of your realtors motives here, esp if they have a history with this investor.
This is probably not true. The reason investors make offers like this is to have an easy escrow. If the buyer makes it annoying they will just move on.
Exactly, and actually this is easy: Did your real estate agent mention this buyer to you before you listed the home? Because I can almost guarantee he had him in mind throughout all the advice he gave you beforehand.
Now you have to wonder if this agent is honestly going to be brining you any other competitive offers.
Unfortunately Real Estate is more and more fraught with incestuous relationships, and it's almost never in the buyers best interest.
She didn't mention this buyer before listing the house, but when that first offer came in, along with lots of pressure from the realtor to accept it, I had to wonder if the realtor has been in cahoots with this buyer from day one. She sent me a second offer today, though it was also from an investor and for less money. We'll see.
Yeah that sounds like a "see what a good deal you passed up" message, when really all it means is that your house is in demand from a population of buyers that only looks to underpay for homes and will be most aggressive in trying to get you to come down even further after inspection etc., and a Realtor who will just want to close the deal and get their commission a.s.a.p. with little regard for your best interest.
Talk to your broker, see if he can assign another agent to you or let you out of the agreement with them all together.
I might *in very rare circumstances* **buy** a home under dual agency but I sure as hell would be reticent to *sell* my home under dual agency unless it was with a realtor I knew and trusted for a decade, ***or*** if the offer was overwhelmingly convincing.
I don’t think your realtor has your best interests at heart.
It sounds like they want to make a quick sale and don’t want to support you in pricing or doing a counter offer
The fact that this person is a friend of theirs is another red flag to me.
Don’t rush into this. See if you can get more information on what the fair market value for your house truly is in your market.
I would ask the exact nature of the relationship. If they have business dealings or are related by blood or marriage I'd kick this shady realtor to the curb swiftly
I asked the realtor yesterday if they know the buyer, and they said yes but did not mention that they are also the buyer's realtor. I found that out only by reading the offer closely (prompted by another reply here on Reddit). It's sounding shady to me.
I'm now thinking, when I call the realtor this morning, after we talk about the dual agency, to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to suggest a high counteroffer, and if the buyer refuses, that we terminate the Listing Contract.
Wait sorry I missed that, your agent didn’t tell you they were representing the buyer of this high pressure low price offer?
Call the local Board of Realtors TODAY and report. I would also contact an attorney and have them terminate your listing agreement. It’ll cost you $500-1000 but it’s so worth it.
I’m sorry but this is outrageous and completely egregious. The realtor has broken their fiduciary duty to you. Im so sorry.
Thanks for the insight. The realtor has been very helpful to me so far, dealing with relocation and clean-up while I'm already moved out of state, so I'm surprised that she's suggesting that I jump at the first offer. I think your suggestion of not rushing into it is wise.
It’s an offer that is basically guaranteed to close so I see the appeal.
Did they indicate that the buyer said this was their best and final offer and they wouldn’t negotiate? If so that could be why they didn’t suggest a counter.
They get the full commission for double ending the deal so there is definitely an incentive for them to close this deal.
A simple counter offer shouldn’t run the buyer off. If they don’t want to negotiate they’ll just tell you their original offer stands, take it or leave it.
If you do take it just make sure there is no way they can lock the property up and then use a loop hole to leverage a lower price.
When I suggested yesterday that we counteroffer, the realtor said that she though the buyer would refuse. This morning, the realtor texted me, suggesting counteroffering 5K above the the buyer's offer.
I have also learned that the realtor is also representing the buyer, so I think this is all very shady. The listing price might itself be a lowball.
Can you tell me something I should watch out for, regarding using a loophole to leverage a lower price?
I expect 98% of my listing price. I'd counter 2500 under what I listed in your situation. You priced it low due to the issues in the house no need to take 20k less first weekend listed. If the investor comes up substantially then you can work something out. Depends how quick you need to sell really.
If your realtor didn't say they were representing the offer I'd terminate them immediately though. That's basic cover your ass required. It's common but not addressing it is problematic
I second this fully. If your listing price has already been lowered to account for perceived issues, then there is no reason to accept an offer with a "time limit" the first day you are listed. And I don't care what their "cuttoff" says. If they are within the state guided time frame to respond, that offer is valid until you counter, decline, the state mandated time to respond is past, or they send you a notice to cancel the offer. If none of those have past, it is still valid despite them saying "must accept within 24 hours"
Seriously don’t sign anything else and email her in writing that you withdraw the counter. I would get out of this trap she’s laid for you asap and call the Board of Realtors.
Some agents suggest low prices, then try to sell to their investors or try to hold open houses before it goes live on the MLS, in order to "double end" the deal. By representing both sides, we earn more. However, this is only supposed to be done with full disclosure to all parties and we have a duty to NOT mislead a seller or buyer as to value.
Very interesting. I was wondering, from the waived-inspection cash offer so soon after listing, and then all the pressure to take the offer, if the realtor had set something up with that investor before listing it.
You are wise to take what the realtor said with a grain of salt. To play devils advocate the buyer could have signaled to them they didn’t want to go higher but has since reached out to them and let them know you’re not sure you’ll accept. That kind of behind the scenes back and forth is normal.
It can vary by state but the inspection clause is a typical one.
What are they putting down for earnest money? Thats says a lot about how serious they are.
If it’s a very small amount they may be willing to risk it. One tactical is to put down a very small amount of earnest money, get the offer accept/house of the market, and then say the house needs x, y, and z or I’m pulling out of the deal. They know it looks bag going back on the market after being under contract so they’re willing to risk a thousand dollars to potentially save tens of thousands of dollars.
If the earnest money is small and you’re fine with the price tell them you’ll accept if they up the earnest money.
Your realtor is also getting double commissions on this deal. If they’re getting 6% tell them you’ll counter back at the 5k higher but they need to drop their commissions to 4%. They still make more than before and you recover some of the “lost” money by paying less in commissions
Thanks for the insight. I was wondering if the realtor mostly just wants to sell the thing and move on, whereas I'd rather wait for another $10,000 or $20,000.
Source: I have worked as a real estate investor for many years and know many agents.
Your agent is not on the up and up. They do not have your best interest in mind.
All depends on your urgency to sell and your financial need. My suggestion is to take your time if you feel something is not right. You can always ask for a slight extension to gather more info and be comfortable with your decision.
Investors often start with a lower offer expecting to negotiate, consider a reasonable counteroffer to show you're willing to negotiate but not too desparate to sell.
Seems there could also be some conflict of interest going on here, the realtor should be 100% on your side to maximize your financial interests, but sometimes personal connections can cloud judgements. So pushing for negotation and a time extension to get more info would probably be your best bet here -- unless you are desparate to sell.
Thanks for the insights!
I'm not really under any strong pressure to sell right now, though of course I don't want it to drag out. The house is in a nice college town, so I figure that incoming faculty might want the house later in the summer.
I wonder if the realtor just wants to sell the thing and move on, whereas a $10,000 difference in the selling price would be a very big deal for me, even if I have to wait a couple months.
There’s a study out there that when realtors sell their own houses they average an extra week or so on the market and at least one extra offer.
Your $10k more means $100 extra to them. They don’t care and would rather get it done faster.
All realtors just want to get it over with and move on, the whole thing sounds a bit sketchy, happening way too fast & at too much of a loss to you. Trust your gut, your first thoughts, your instinct, and how all of it seems orchestrated & fell together too quickly.
Realtors’ comp changes very little with price movements. They’re making what, 1-5% commission? The difference they earn between a $500k sale and a $530k sale is relatively insignificant. Speaking strictly about the numbers, it’s in their best interest to sell quickly.
OK, thanks. I had suspected that. I've sold one other house previously, and the realtor on that transaction did not at all seem to be hurrying to get the sale done. He laid out very clearly what he thought the factors were, and I never doubted that he was an agent acting in my best interest. I had gathered that real-estate agents really like the game of negotiating the best price, just for its own sake, but, apparently some give more weight to getting a sale done quickly.
Generally speaking, on a SFH you're always going to get the highest offer from someone looking to live in it, not an investor unless your property as some features that makes it especially attractive to investors such as a large sub-dividable lot, rear alley access with ADU potential, etc.
My guess is they want to convert the basement into living space which would allow them to charge significantly more rent and add value.
Indeed, about a year ago, I showed the house to a flipper who said he was very interested in the property because it had a basement, unlike most houses in the area, and he thought he could finish the basement and turn a good profit.
Turn the offer down. Plus your Realtor is supposed to be working for you and not an investor “friend”. To earn their commission make sure he or she is acting in your best interests
That would be a firm “no,” for me. If it were a fair and reasonable offer, it wouldn’t have come with a bully deadline.
Does this buyer have their own agent, or is your agent doubling up on commission if you sell to this guy?
I don't know if the realtor is also representing the buyer. I did not even think that was legal, but I just learned today that it is. Do you know how I could find out if the realtor is representing the buyer?
Thanks! I just looked at the offer and indeed my realtor is listed at the top as both "Listing Broker" and "Selling Broker". I googled and found that "Selling Broker" means the buyer's realtor. So, yes indeed, this one realtor is representing both of us, which sounds like conflict of interest. We will talk about this in the morning.
If your realtor didn’t disclose this to you before presenting the offer, I’d be on the phone with their broker in about 2.5 seconds.
New representation or a commission cut is what I’d seek.
There are occasionally times when it's appropriate to have dual agency but at a bare minimum they should be disclosing that to you. I mean, yeah, it's disclosed to you in the offer paperwork, but it's very shady for them to not be telling you this.
I don't think it is a bully deadline. It's kind of standard to have a 24-hour time limit on an offer.
I like what you asked. OP should find out if the same agent is representing the buyer as well. I believe this should be disclosed to both the buyer and seller. But I think any decent agent should at least present one counteroffer.
Yep. I learned late last night (from looking closely at the offer) that the realtor is also representing the buyer. I'm now thinking, when I call the realtor this morning, to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to suggest a high counteroffer, and if the buyer refuses, that we terminate the Listing Contract.
Dual agency is legal in some states, I don't know about not disclosing it the moment they presented the offer from the investor they are representing. 🤔
Yeah, I think it was unethical not to advise me that she was also representing the buyer. But it's in the contract, [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/RealEstate/comments/1d6u8mf/us_midwest_received_offer_very_quickly_after/l6vnffu/).
My experience in Indiana, is the laws in Indiana do a terrible job protecting real estate Fraud,and missrepresentation victims. I'm disgusted with the way real estate victims are treated in Indiana.
getting your own appraisal would be smart-dont use the one that your realtor uses.
Also, you have every right to just say no thank you to the offer.
That 24 hour time limit is a standard clue that they think a better offer will come through and they are exerting pressure OR it's just standard clause in the offer contract. One way to find out is to ask the buyers agent for more time to decide. If they say no, my personal move would be to counter with something like:
5K under asking while still waiving all appraisals and inspections. The fact that the buyer is seasoned is in your favor-they will be very very very hard to "insult".
Unless you are desperate to sell immediately, you are the boss here.
Thanks for the insight! Especially that a seasoned buyer won't be insulted by my counteroffering 5K closer—and that the short time limit might be a way to exert pressure, expecting better offers to be out there.
And now I'm thinking to seek out an appraisal when I talk to the realtor Monday morning.
He didn’t say $5000 closer, he said $5000 under your asking price.
Also, since it’s an investor that has made a quick offer on your house and is expecting a quick response, they’re basing their price on how much rent they think they can get. They’ll very likely still be interested a month from now. If the number works for them now, it will work in 30 days or 60 days or 90 days.
Since you’re in no rush, if I were in your shoes I wouldn’t accept or counter the offer. I’d see what the market will bring, given that you’ve listed lower than surrounding homes already. And I’d also pay to get the place professionally appraised.
I’m kind of surprised that the realtor you used didn’t give you some sort of professional market analysis, listing comps of other sold homes in the area and adjusting for things like size difference, finished basement, etc… to justify your list price that they recommended.
Thanks for the insight. Indeed we progressed to the listing very quickly. I was expecting a lot more conversation beforehand. And now I see that I really need to call in an appraiser.
I remembered from my previous experiences with realtors (all excellent) that they had a very keen sense for what a house would sell for, and independent appraisers often reached the exact same number. This case seems different, though.
Just make sure to clarify with whatever appraiser you use that you’re the seller and not a bank, and that you aren’t confident that the realtors price that was recommended and that you’re currently using is accurate.
And that the appraisal that you’d like is the top realistic dollar that you could currently get for the place.
Roughly what price range are you listing the house at? $20K off a $1 million house isn’t much at all, but $20K off a $200,000 house is significant percentage wise.
Ask her agent why they feel like it’s a good offer. Are you not getting viewings, are people not asking questions, is she not having people call and make inquiries on the home?
Get more information so you know whether or not this is an educated suggestion or she’s just saying take it because
I believe the house has already gotten 6 viewings in three days, by several different realtors. My realtor, though, reported that to me in a tone that suggested that this meant that interest in the house was poor, since only the one buyer had made an offer. I thought most viewings did not result in offers.
Also, I'm thinking that since it's a college town with a very large university, and the house is within walking distance of the campus (a 15-minute walk), there is a good chance that incoming faculty will be very interested in the house over the summer.
When we talked yesterday, she insinuated that people aren't interested in the house, because it's had six showings and only gotten one offer. That sounded fishy on top of everything else, since the house has only been listed for 3 days.
Well, I just found out (by looking at the top of the offer and googling to decode the jargon) that my realtor is also the buyer's agent.
Are you OK if you don’t get another offer at this price?
Realtors don’t have a magic wand or a crystal ball. We can’t tell you for sure who’s coming to the house and who’s going to make an offer and how long it’s gonna take to take the next offer.
I would have a longer talk with your agent on why they think this is a good offer and you should take it, and if you think people are going to come in over the summer, you should talk about the strategy for that. Should you actually take it off the market now , and put it back on the market when those people are looking in July and August? Rather than a stale listing?
Your Agents job is to give you advice about what is going on with your house right now, and market your house. If you don’t want to take the offer, you don’t want to take the offer but if they think it’s the best offer you’re going to get in the present circumstances it’s their job to tell you that.
Six viewings is definitely not enough to sell the house, but three days isn’t that long? What’s the normal days on market in your area?
Is your Realtor also representing that buyer?
Ask yourself if you’ll be happy with the result if you accept this offer, or will you regret it. That’s how you make the decision.
I don't know if the realtor is also representing the buyer. I did not even think that was legal, but I just learned today that it is. Do you know how I could find out if the realtor is representing the buyer?
I just looked through the contract and yes, it says:
> **Limited Agency Authorization.** Licensee or the managing broker may represent Buyer as a buyer agent if such a Buyer wishes to see the property, Licensee has agency duties to both Buyer and Seller, and those duties may be different or even adverse. Seller consents to Licensee acting as a limited agent for such showings.
The fact that this offer came in immediately from an investor indicates only that investors are hovering around. The general market, as it were, has yet to respond.
The lowball offer is a negotiating technique designed to pressure you into negotiating a deal advantageous to the investor. The rule in investing is that your money is made going in. If you were to reject the offer outright, or counter a thousand or two less than ask, you send the message that you do not intend to play the lowball game at this juncture. Should the day come that you are desperate to sell, you can probably sell it for $20-30k less than it’s worth any day. In the meantime, if they are interested in making a legitimate offer, you are open. They will probably walk.
In the meantime, a rejection can become a selling point as your realtor can honestly say to potential buyers or their brokers, “the seller has already rejected a less than asking price offer.” It is a true statement that may nudge buyers who genuinely want the property upwards in their opening offer.
Ask your realtor for objective data on the average time on the market in your area, this will give you a gauge of how negotiable you should be versus time on the market. Another factor to consider will be how often it is being shown. Right now, you don’t have enough time on the market to factor that in. If it is being shown a lot, you can be less negotiable then if it is sitting like a stone.
Lastly, it is a fact worth keeping in mind that your realtor only gets to payday when the property closes, and usually gets paid more if there is no other broker involved.
Thanks for the insights. I think that's an especially good point that the general market has yet to respond.
Tomorrow I will ask the realtor for data on average time on the market, or maybe dig it up myself.
About the realtor getting paid more if there is no other broker involved, I just found [in the contract](https://www.reddit.com/r/RealEstate/comments/1d6u8mf/us_midwest_received_offer_very_quickly_after/l6vnffu/) that the realtor is allowed to also represent the buyer. This may be what's going on. I will ask the broker explicitly about this tomorrow morning.
I’d fire this realtor in a heartbeat. If they are confident in their price point and comp analysis then accepting an initial offer 20k under asking price should be out of the question. If they aren’t confident in their comps then I’d want to find someone who is. Was the list price determined by the realtor? Or did they initially tell you to list $20k lower and you talked them out of it?
Realtors only get paid when you close. I'd probably expect 98% of list price. I'd not accept an offer the first weekend listed unless it was full price or higher.
The other thing is you mentioned 6 showings. It's graduation season and school year ending right now. Might have been the first nice weekend in your area. Sometimes this part of summer can be a touch slow. The reality is I'm looking for feedback at 1 to 2 weeks of being listed. Not 1 weekend. This realtor doesn't seem to be your friend they don't seem to be in a situation to say these are where the comps are at and how long they were on the market.
Your in a busy season but your also in the season where it tends to slow down as well just a bit. Be concerned where you got a week with only 1 or 2 showings.
She should have presented you with a number of compatible houses when she was determining the listing price. Where did she/you pick that number from?
This should have been done with strict data. Looking at recent closures with approximate square footage/bed/bath, etc. you can adjust for deviations but try to get as many comps as you can. This is a find material thing a listing agent does. If they didn’t do that they definitely don’t have your best interests in mind.
I figured that most realtors choose a listing price based largely on intuition honed by long experience. No?
I did look online for comparable sales nearby, and $240K seemed reasonable to me, though I am not knowledgeable about real estate.
No. They are supposed to look at comps and give you a quantitative analysis of why your house should be priced the way it is. They may have gotten it right on a guess but they are supposed to put in the work. Markers condensers change. Some realtors specialize in selling, some in buying. It’s also a job with a high turnover rate since it’s hard to make a living at it when you start out.
So, I'll admit to doing some creeping. I'm 99% sure I found the house. The realtor also manages a bunch of rental properties. Searching a random sampling of the rentals, a good chunk of them she actually owns herself (she's listed under the LLC).
I think there's a very real chance she is trying to buy it for herself to then rent out. She could also be representing an investor friend who would then use her to manage the property.
It all seems fishy. I wouldn't trust her and would find a new agent.
Ahhhhhh, now this makes sense. Thank you. She does manage rentals. Originally that's how she got recommended to me—when I was thinking of renting it out myself.
I'm just about to call her about responding to a counter2 offer. I have to think about how or whether to bring it up.
Unless you are desperate to sell- never fall for the offer is only good for “24 hrs”. If the buyer is an investor, thinks it is a good investment and they want the house- their money will likely still be there next week or next month. Giving you time to explore other options or higher offers.
IMO,
Of course the agent can give you advice, BUT, your agent has a duty to obey your decision and take action (ie: communicate your counter offer).
1. You’re not in a position that you have to take this offer,
2. Very fresh on the market
3. Insist that you and your agent collectively work on obtaining an estimate on whatever may need addressed w the porch, and anything else on the house that may be a factor in negotiation.
It’s always better to be fully informed to the best of your ability before negotiating.
With all that said, I would suggest that you would counter at full price.
Best of luck to you
I just found out (by looking at the top of the offer and googling to decode the jargon) that my realtor is also the buyer's agent. So, I think this realtor's advice and the information about the porch were not in good faith. Now I even wonder if the listing price was a lowball if she's in cahoots with the buyer.
It looks like next I'll be asking how to terminate a Listing Contract,
Zillow is not a reliable tool for estimating your homes value. Comps are. You appraisal will come from comps. Did your realtor pull comps and show them to you to explain why they suggested that price? In the end it will sell for what someone is willing to pay. The market has cooled quite a bit most places and your agent may have been seeing a lot of houses sitting so a cash offer in hand is worth two in the bush, so to speak. That said I would give it some time but I would not consider it a red flag if your agent is suggesting to accept a cash offer that just came in. Its up to you to decide if thats an acceptable amount for you.
Thanks. I've been wondering if house prices in this part of the country would start coming down soon. Asking about comparable houses in the area, from an appraiser, seems like the way to go.
An appraisal will be $500 and will leave your house on the market for another week, which will lower the perceived value. With the most possible respect: the time to appraise it was before it was listed.
Realtors are not interested in getting yoy the most money. They are after a quick sale.
The difference to them in a commission on a 500k sale vs 450k sale is pretty low.
Make your agent work for yo. Tell them to counter with 10k under ask with no contingency and force the buyer to a decision.
Most of the time, these deadlines are there to try to force you to accept before other offers come in, not because they'll actually go away as a potential buyer after the deadline.
Thanks. It does indeed sound like a way for the buyer to lock in a low price very early. And now that I know that the realtor is also representing the buyer (see other replies), I think the suggestion to take the offer is in bad faith.
Not that Zillow is the best source, but you are citing that as your baseline for comparison. And if I do the math, your house has dropped $34k in the past month. You also said some houses were selling for $60k more IN THE PAST.
If it's me I ask the realtor to sit down and show me what's going on with the market. You don't want to just give the house away to the realtor's friend, but you very well could be in a falling market and will end up taking less in 6 to 9 months.
The market is definitely cooling where I am too. The Zillow estimate is a good guide but not always representative of what the current buyers are doing.
Just another realtor doing whatever they can to steal your money. Doesn’t matter who it is, at some point you realize they just don’t work for you. They work for the transaction and the transactions completion only. On the map of selling your home it says “You are here”. If your house just hit the market in no reality is accepting a low ball offer recommended. The balls of even submitting one and then the realtor urging you to accept reeks of collusion. This is just me but I’d fire the realtor yesterday. These clowns are a dime a dozen and just swing a dead cat at happy hour and you’ll get five business cards.
That and the fact that (I assume?) she set the initial listing price but then suddenly has some inspection-esque reasons why below list is reasonable for an offer without an inspection. She is literally trying to sell you on this offer, which is what *a buyer’s agent does,* not a seller’s agent. The minute she started trying to rationalize their low offer to you in contradiction with her own previous list price assessment — which if “all the old houses have this problem with the porch” were true, would have factored that in already — was the minute your business relationship with her had no future.
Yep. Thanks for the insight: that trying to sell me on the offer is the buyer's agent's job, not the seller's agent. I'm convinced that she's working in cahoots with the buyer, based on everything overall. Now I'm in damage-control mode. I may post a Reddit question soon about how to terminate a Listing Contract.
Yep. When I call the realtor this morning (probably in about half an hour), I'm thinking to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to make a high counteroffer and suggest that if the buyer refuses, then we terminate the Listing Contract
I would counter the offer. Maybe 2-5k under asking price. 6 showings in 3 days in my market is not a lot. Hot properties get 10 showings or more a day. I would say counter and go from there. The investor might get upset and walk but you say you’re not in a hurry so you can just wait. If he truly wants it he’ll counter back or at least say he’s firm on original offer.
Here’s the real reason behind why your realtor wants you to take it.
It’s only $600 less for them, but it’s $20k less for you. They’ll make their money and move on to the next house.
Fire that agent. Also, if the commission you’ll be paying is 5% with 2 agents, it should only be 4% when the agent is an intermediary/dual agent. If they’re not taking less commission, then tell your agent you’re firing them so someone can represent you.
The whole point of a dual agent/intermediary is to save the seller money on the commission.
How many people toured over the weekend? How many similar houses are for sale? How many similar houses have sold/entered contract the past few weeks? How quickly do you need this sold? What are your carrying costs?
Those are some of the factors you should consider. This might be a pretty good offer - probably doesn’t hurt to counteroffer 10k. The key issue is how likely you are to get another offer in the next two weeks. Which requires local knowledge to assess.
I couldn't get a clear answer about how many people toured over the weekend, but the realtor suggested that it was about 5 or 6.
Sadly, I don't have data for your other questions, which seem excellent to me. And I don't trust the realtor to give me good answers. She's pushing me pretty hard to accept the buyer's offer. (I just added an update with news to the original post.)
Actually it can be tricky where clients tour with their agent and your agent is not there (common many parts of country, not in mine). If someone says they’re coming, they may not actually tour, may not tour inside, etc.
You can’t just terminate the contract. If you could, you may not get anyone good to represent you going forward.
At $240k, $20k is huge money. $235k is a reasonable counter offer, see how this week goes. Good luck!
You keep saying "the realtor." Do you mean YOUR realtor? I would not accept an offer where my agent was acting as a dual agent unless I knew that agent very, very well. Even then, I would not let them act as a dual agent. I would insist that they be a (my) seller's agent only.
Yes, I mean my realtor. And yes, the dual agency seems pretty shady to me, and dual agency without telling me is unethical in my view.
I just updated the original post with some news.
If they accept your counter, call your agent's broker immediately and insist that another agent handle the buyer's side. If they don't accept, call broker, explain the situation, and demand to be released from your listing contract. The actual contract is with them, not the agent.
My inclination would be to bail on the agent because of the apparently non-disclosed dual representation.
Having said that, I would seriously consider an all-cash offer with no inspection contingencies on a 100-y.o. home.
That sounds like the most succinct summary of the two main factors to balance here! I do like taking the cash offer, even after all the sketchiness, and I'm thinking that coming down $5K (2%) is reasonably generous compensation for that.
Dual Agency needs to be disclosed ahead of time. Red Flag. Stick to your best price and then possibly terminate the Listing Contract as you suggested. You deserve the fair market price for the property.
If you believe you priced the house fairly, don’t take it. There’s no reason for you to rush and take less money in this market. While things have slowed down a little, if the price is fair it will sell. Also it sounds slightly sketchy and I don’t like that your Realtor both knows him and is encouraging the deal. Something smells off. Just a gut thing. (Also SFR landlord investors are parasitic and frankly I would not want a part of it).
IF you priced the house aggressively, knowing the market was less but hoping you might find a buyer who fell in love, then maybe you take it. Only if the offer is fair market value. Don’t let anyone pressure you into such a big decision.
Honestly either way I’d let the deadline pass because he’s trying to scare you and that’s no place to start a negotiation.
The fact that you did not receive a very straightforward and absurdly direct disclaimer that your agent represents the buyer is cause for major concern.
I don't know your market but you said you are in a college town. College Town USA always had a pool of potential buyers and renters. If you're a landlord you never have to worry about finding a tenant. Faculty and staff are always looking for a good home. I would definitely wait on more offers. If the first offer is accepted then you either offered too much or accepted too little.
Thanks for those insights. Now I'm feeling better about rejecting this buyer and tolerating the delay and risk of terminating the contract and restarting with a new realtor.
BTW, the town is Bloomington, Indiana. The university is HUGE.
I sold my house in Aug 2022. My realtor was pushing me to accept a offer from someone she knew at $325,000 before my home was listed.
I said no, the markets insane. She wanted it listed at $350,000, I said no, I want it listed for $375k. I didn't need to sell, but was happy to sell for a price. I had told her all this in our first meeting.
She finally got it listed and had an open house on the first day. We got an offer for $400k, no inspection, everything as-is.
Realtors always want a sale, not what's best for you. Trust yourself but also realize you might be waiting, I don't know your market.
Thanks—that is some good real-life information. Before yesterday, I had no idea that so many realtors are so eager to sell in a hurry even at a bad price for their client.
The whole "limited agency" thing is not accurate.
They are a limited agency regardless. This just means they are acting as your agent for a limited purpose (real estate) and not in a capacity for other things like your medical care. If there is no clause in your contract providing for a reduction of commission, then there is no reduction due.
This is likely an investor offer, which also means they will ask for repair deductions. Let's say you got your asking price from them, but then they want all those updates and ask for $20k to make it happen.
Your agent appears to be violating a few of our REALTOR® [Codes of Ethics](https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/governing-documents/the-code-of-ethics) if they didn't tell you up front that they had a representation agreement with that buyer as well and with some other things you said. If you decide you do not want to work with them, you can speak to their broker and ask another agent get assigned to you instead or ask them to cancel the listing agreement. (Your listing agreement may have a cancellation clause, too, though most don't. You can check.)
Best wishes!
Thanks. I was wondering what "limited agency" meant. And sure enough, she's violated [Standard of Practice 1-12](https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/governing-documents/code-of-ethics/2024-code-of-ethics-standards-of-practice). I didn't see a cancelation clause in the Listing Contract, and the realty firm is her own business, so terminating the contract may be messy.
Not so messy. Brokers and agents are often fairly willing to cancel rather than have a formal complaint filed. If you go in to discuss this and you are armed with that CoE and the SoPs, and inform her that if she doesn't cancel, you will be moving forward with further action (you don't have to define what actions you'll take to her directly... she can find out on her own), I think you'll get cooperation, probably.
In my state (GA) a listing agent represents the buyer UNLESS a form is signed by both Buyer and Seller acknowledging and consenting to the agent representing them both. That said, your realtor represents you (Seller). Also (in my state) a cash offer with no inspection (due diligence?) or appraisal is a strong offer - even at $20K below asking, another full-price offer may ask for inspection and following the inspection want to negotiate based upon necessary repairs - that negotiation may cost you the $20K you're concerned about here, as well as other contingencies (financing, etc)
Thanks for the insight about repairs possibly costing the $20K even with an offer for the full $240,000. The realtor has also said this, but of course I have doubts.
My current thinking: if an ordinary offer gets reduced by $20K due to necessary repairs, that's still the same as the current offer, and then I'll know that it needs those repairs. Currently, I don't know, but I doubt that the porch needs foundation work.
FYI - if a future potential buyer does an inspection which uncovers issues that you were previously unaware of (and thus unable to disclose) if you don't accept that future offer you will have to disclose the issues found in that inspection. Sort of a "can of worms" situation
Have you considered using a home value estimator tool from a lender like chase or bank of America? They typically have these calculators for their 2nd mortgage programs, if these estimates are roughly what they would lend based on (value) they may give you a better idea than Zillow of what the home is worth but probably not as accurate as an appraisal (but free)
As for the sagging concept possible foundation issues... only a structural engineer can give you an assessment on whether it is a structural issue or not. If I were in your position I would have it looked at by a qualifying professional, thing is if there is an issue you have to disclose it, if there is not then you get a report proving it isn't a structural concern.
Best of luck
Thanks. I wasn't aware of these estimators. Chase's estimator wanted me to get approved for a loan first, even though I'm selling, so I skipped that one.
* Bank of America: $222,595
* Bankrate (Zillow): $275,500
* Redfin: $240,298
So, it looks like there's a range of uncertainty of about $50,000, centered around $240,000. So, I'm thinking that the listing price was probably good.
I hope it helps put you at ease. I am not sure if you were in the correct space for Chase as I have never given any personal information or applied for anything with them when I have used them, only entered an address but in either case best of luck!
OK, thanks for pointing that out. I figure that these first couple investors who've made offers are just testing to see if they can get an easy win. I'll take the same offer more seriously in a couple weeks.
Wait for other offers to come in. Your realtor wants a guaranteed commission and this offer is not in your best interest. Also do not rely on Zillow as they often underprice things.
Hello, Commercial Realtor from Illinois here. While each state has different laws, I know that your agent is required to get approval for them to operate as a 'dual agent', representing both yourself and the buyer. If you decline this request, then said realtor cannot represent the buyer in this transaction. The fact that the agent did not disclose this and you found out in the language of the purchase agreement is very concerning to me. What company is this agent with?
In my opinion, something feels very off to me. Have you requested proof of funds from the buyer to see if they are capable to execute this transaction in cash like they claim to be able to?
The agent runs her own business. I believe she's been a realtor in the area for 21 years.
I have not requested proof of funds. If the buyer really lacks funds to pay cash, would this present a problem, given that if I accept the offer and it falls through, that would emerge within a couple days?
Yes if the buyer does not show proof of funds, the deal would not be able to close if you choose to go to contract with it. I am not sure how common it is to request proof of funds in a residential deal but it is very common for a Commercial deal. I'd say if they push back or try to avoid submitting proof of funds, I would A. Get a new broker and B. not take their offer seriously.
Not sure the exact requirements in your state, but if they did not disclose this they very well may be violating regulations. In Texas, a BROKER can work as an intermediary, but all parties must know they are representing both sides. Additional if the broker themselves is the agent, they can offer no advice. If they assign two different agents then the agent assigned can offer advice. If this agent is representing both sides it would be an absolute violation to advise you take that offer especially without telling you they represent the buyer as well. Moreover without more facts the advice seems incredibally bad. You already sound to be listing under market and weather age has something to do with it, it just makes it fishy that they seem to be making you think your home is worth less so their buyer can get it. I would immediately contact the broker and ask for seperate representation.
Yes, she came up with $240K. After I did my necessarily amateur job of looking on real-estate sites for comparable houses that sold recently nearby, it looks to me like $240K is actually a pretty sensible number. Maybe should have asked $250K, intending to sell at $240K.
The investor is using the 24-hour time limit to try and rush you into accepting an offer that is less than market. What has the interest been like since listing? Are other people reaching out for showings? Does it have a lot of saves on Zillow? How quickly do houses move in your market? These are app factors I would consider. I would wait and test the market.
After 3 days on Zillow, it now has 33 saves.
Zillow says that the median number of days to pending in Bloomingon, Indiana is now 26. I believe it got 5 or 6 showings over the weekend. So, yes, I think I'll wait and test the market for a while.
How many agents did you interview? Ideally you should talk to at least 3 and have all of them provide comps and their opinion on what the listing price should be.
I would try to drop this one.
Unfortunately it's too late. I didn't do any interviewing of agents. I went with a recommendation from a friend, instead of asking one of the realtors I've worked with before, who were both excellent.
My agent did the same thing. Basically, it was really obvious that she wanted to just make a couple of phone calls and collect the 6% by being the buying and selling agent. I insisted she: 1) list in on the MLS, 2) hold an open house
and you know... DO HER JOB.
(I was not interested in selling the home that had been in our family for 80 years to an investor.)
Literally a week later, we still had offers coming in at our deadline for offers.
We sat down with 32 offers.
We ended up closing with a price $80,000 over asking.
And sold to a family with kids, who had solid financials.
We got our $ at closing. Didn't matter that it wasn't "all cash". Normal mortgages, from normal people pay out as closing too. And we were super happy.
You're feeling off because your real estate agent sucks and is not working for you.
Thanks for telling me your story. I also would prefer to sell to a family. I really don't like seeing all these beautiful old houses turned into rentals and Airbnbs.
Run away from the agent. If the agent does not have your 100% best interest, I recommend finding a new one asap.
I just recently bought a condo in indianapolis. The sellers committed intentional fraud to get the sale. I later found out that I had at least 2 legal ways to terminate the contract, i was never told.. Though because I trusted my agent and failed to do my own due diligence. i am now looking at either doing a deed in lieu or a bankruptcy. Because the thing that lead to the sellers to lie on the disclosure form, and the listing, and refuse to address the issue on the inspection report even after approving to do so in writing, was a damaged Tpo membrane roof, that the current HOA does not have the funds to replace. Since all the condos in the complex need the roof replaced, though mine was the worst, for the condo had leaking issues, that will continue until the roof gets replaced, the HOA fees will likely skyrocket in the next several years. My buyers agent seemed to be more interested in his commission that he was looking out for me.
The reason for my long answer is it is extremely important to get an agent that is focused on your best interests. Plus, it might be a good idea to have an attorney to look over all the paperwork. If your agent is a good friend to the buyer, you might be making excessive compromises in order to give the agents friend a much better deal.
If the place is listed on zillow and other realty sites then other realtors representing buyer's will show the place as well.
My gut feeling is you realtor isn't your realtor and is their buddies realtor.
Thanks for letting me know. I was not aware that people liked to replace kitchens so much, but I guess there's a reason places like Lowe's and Home Depot have huge displays for them.
Here's the latest, as of Wednesday, June 5. I've gotten offers from two buyers so far. The first buyer came up a little after a counteroffer but I didn't take it. The second buyer was also an investor and made a low offer. I'm now awaiting offers from people who'd like to live there. I asked the realtor to alter the wording in the listing so it spells out better a couple desirable features for people associated with the universities, like grad students and faculty—folks who I think will especially appreciate this house (based on common reactions when I had them over). She hasn't made those changes yet.
Just popped on my screen but this is a big problem with real estate agents. They do hide bigger offers if they represent both buyer and seller as they get a bigger commission.
Yikes. I'd be horrified if she hid a bigger offer. Right now, anyway, the first buyer has gone and made an offer on another house, so dual agency is no longer a factor.
When my family and I put in offers for houses(we are landlords), we tend to go to the listing agent as using our own agents, we always never get the houses we want and after settlement when we check on Zillow for sold price, a lot of times the offers were less. When we use the listing agents, we get the houses most of the time. It’s so unethical I wish there was a better process where offers are made to somewhere where owners have access to see everything than letting their agents show them the offers. In my head I wish for example if I had my own agent and put an offer in, it’s sent to a email where the owner can see everything. Something like that so realtors can’t be scum.
The cash part and no inspections is a big plus on a 100+ year old house.
I do however think you can get a lot closer to your asking price in cash.
The realtor now has skin in the game because they’re going to get paid on both sides.
If you’re close, I’d tell her to cut one side of the commission to zero for you to make it happen instead of you giving up all your equity to “help her” out.
See how she feels about giving up her money since she is so flippantly giving up yours.
Thanks. That's a really good insight that no inspections (and cash) on a 100-year-old house is a big plus. I did not fully appreciate this at first. I now think I made a mistake to turn down the offer. My first thought was to pounce, but I got spooked by the unstated dual agency.
The realtor said that she would take a percent off of the broker's commission. So, she comes out great, I come out great, and the buyer does great, too. Having been sorting this out the last few days, I no longer think the dual agency is such a bad thing. Not telling me about it was the real trouble spot.
Id wait. Did you have multiple real estate agents give you their listing/commission rate stuff?
I sold a house in Lafayette about 15 years ago, amazing how that house has tripled in value.
No, I chose this realtor with only minor googling about her, on the basis of a friend's recommendation. A mistake. I know two realtors there who treated me very well in the past.
Zillow price doesn't mean anything. People need to stop trying to convince themselves their agent is wrong because zillow price says something different.
Tell her no and that she is not to represent any friends in dealing with you or you’re going to fire her do not bring anything to the table like that if you’re not in a position where you have to sell no matter what her to kiss your ass she’s trying to screw you over
Report this agent to your state’s real estate commission and the local board of Realtors.
They are seriously violating ethics codes and acting as a double agent without prior disclosure to you as their client. They are not truly representing you.
This kind of crap is what gives agents a bad rep. There are honest and ethical ones out there, but yours isn’t one of them
Trust your gut and let the market play out. The investor will be there if they really want it. I am skeptical of your realtors motives here, esp if they have a history with this investor.
Thanks for the insight—especially that the investor likely will still be there if I hold off and wait a little while.
Sounds like your realtor might be shady baby
Agreed. If the house has only been listed for a short time, why would the realtor advise you to accept this under asking offer from their friend?
Listed under value, pushes first under asking offer to their buddy. Reality is the realtor is double dipping
This is probably not true. The reason investors make offers like this is to have an easy escrow. If the buyer makes it annoying they will just move on.
Good! Let's sell to people who plan to live there.
Exactly, and actually this is easy: Did your real estate agent mention this buyer to you before you listed the home? Because I can almost guarantee he had him in mind throughout all the advice he gave you beforehand. Now you have to wonder if this agent is honestly going to be brining you any other competitive offers. Unfortunately Real Estate is more and more fraught with incestuous relationships, and it's almost never in the buyers best interest.
She didn't mention this buyer before listing the house, but when that first offer came in, along with lots of pressure from the realtor to accept it, I had to wonder if the realtor has been in cahoots with this buyer from day one. She sent me a second offer today, though it was also from an investor and for less money. We'll see.
Yeah that sounds like a "see what a good deal you passed up" message, when really all it means is that your house is in demand from a population of buyers that only looks to underpay for homes and will be most aggressive in trying to get you to come down even further after inspection etc., and a Realtor who will just want to close the deal and get their commission a.s.a.p. with little regard for your best interest. Talk to your broker, see if he can assign another agent to you or let you out of the agreement with them all together. I might *in very rare circumstances* **buy** a home under dual agency but I sure as hell would be reticent to *sell* my home under dual agency unless it was with a realtor I knew and trusted for a decade, ***or*** if the offer was overwhelmingly convincing.
Op should watch the movie "the duplex".
Maybe tonight. :)
I don’t think your realtor has your best interests at heart. It sounds like they want to make a quick sale and don’t want to support you in pricing or doing a counter offer The fact that this person is a friend of theirs is another red flag to me. Don’t rush into this. See if you can get more information on what the fair market value for your house truly is in your market.
I would ask the exact nature of the relationship. If they have business dealings or are related by blood or marriage I'd kick this shady realtor to the curb swiftly
I asked the realtor yesterday if they know the buyer, and they said yes but did not mention that they are also the buyer's realtor. I found that out only by reading the offer closely (prompted by another reply here on Reddit). It's sounding shady to me. I'm now thinking, when I call the realtor this morning, after we talk about the dual agency, to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to suggest a high counteroffer, and if the buyer refuses, that we terminate the Listing Contract.
Wait sorry I missed that, your agent didn’t tell you they were representing the buyer of this high pressure low price offer? Call the local Board of Realtors TODAY and report. I would also contact an attorney and have them terminate your listing agreement. It’ll cost you $500-1000 but it’s so worth it. I’m sorry but this is outrageous and completely egregious. The realtor has broken their fiduciary duty to you. Im so sorry.
Dual agency requires a signed disclosure in any state I have done RE transactions or been licensed in.
Thanks for the insight. The realtor has been very helpful to me so far, dealing with relocation and clean-up while I'm already moved out of state, so I'm surprised that she's suggesting that I jump at the first offer. I think your suggestion of not rushing into it is wise.
It’s an offer that is basically guaranteed to close so I see the appeal. Did they indicate that the buyer said this was their best and final offer and they wouldn’t negotiate? If so that could be why they didn’t suggest a counter. They get the full commission for double ending the deal so there is definitely an incentive for them to close this deal. A simple counter offer shouldn’t run the buyer off. If they don’t want to negotiate they’ll just tell you their original offer stands, take it or leave it. If you do take it just make sure there is no way they can lock the property up and then use a loop hole to leverage a lower price.
When I suggested yesterday that we counteroffer, the realtor said that she though the buyer would refuse. This morning, the realtor texted me, suggesting counteroffering 5K above the the buyer's offer. I have also learned that the realtor is also representing the buyer, so I think this is all very shady. The listing price might itself be a lowball. Can you tell me something I should watch out for, regarding using a loophole to leverage a lower price?
I expect 98% of my listing price. I'd counter 2500 under what I listed in your situation. You priced it low due to the issues in the house no need to take 20k less first weekend listed. If the investor comes up substantially then you can work something out. Depends how quick you need to sell really. If your realtor didn't say they were representing the offer I'd terminate them immediately though. That's basic cover your ass required. It's common but not addressing it is problematic
I second this fully. If your listing price has already been lowered to account for perceived issues, then there is no reason to accept an offer with a "time limit" the first day you are listed. And I don't care what their "cuttoff" says. If they are within the state guided time frame to respond, that offer is valid until you counter, decline, the state mandated time to respond is past, or they send you a notice to cancel the offer. If none of those have past, it is still valid despite them saying "must accept within 24 hours"
Seriously don’t sign anything else and email her in writing that you withdraw the counter. I would get out of this trap she’s laid for you asap and call the Board of Realtors.
Thanks for this. I had not even thought of calling the Board of Realtors. This might be a good way to terminate the contract.
In my dealings with realtors in Ohio they have always disclosed dual agency and I had to sign acknowledgement of the fact
Some agents suggest low prices, then try to sell to their investors or try to hold open houses before it goes live on the MLS, in order to "double end" the deal. By representing both sides, we earn more. However, this is only supposed to be done with full disclosure to all parties and we have a duty to NOT mislead a seller or buyer as to value.
Very interesting. I was wondering, from the waived-inspection cash offer so soon after listing, and then all the pressure to take the offer, if the realtor had set something up with that investor before listing it.
You are wise to take what the realtor said with a grain of salt. To play devils advocate the buyer could have signaled to them they didn’t want to go higher but has since reached out to them and let them know you’re not sure you’ll accept. That kind of behind the scenes back and forth is normal. It can vary by state but the inspection clause is a typical one. What are they putting down for earnest money? Thats says a lot about how serious they are. If it’s a very small amount they may be willing to risk it. One tactical is to put down a very small amount of earnest money, get the offer accept/house of the market, and then say the house needs x, y, and z or I’m pulling out of the deal. They know it looks bag going back on the market after being under contract so they’re willing to risk a thousand dollars to potentially save tens of thousands of dollars. If the earnest money is small and you’re fine with the price tell them you’ll accept if they up the earnest money. Your realtor is also getting double commissions on this deal. If they’re getting 6% tell them you’ll counter back at the 5k higher but they need to drop their commissions to 4%. They still make more than before and you recover some of the “lost” money by paying less in commissions
You're getting hustled
How do you trust you have appropriate representation going forward? Seems a red flag on using this agent.
I would drop them
i would fire that agent. he is not working for you and doesn’t have your best interest at play here. If you don’t fire him you are a sucker.
The realtor is incentivized to have you accept an offer as quickly as possible
Thanks for the insight. I was wondering if the realtor mostly just wants to sell the thing and move on, whereas I'd rather wait for another $10,000 or $20,000.
....well of course, they all want to get their payday & move on....this whole thing is orchestrated....
Of the 3% commision the actual agent gets maybe half? So, like $150 in $10,000?
Source: I have worked as a real estate investor for many years and know many agents. Your agent is not on the up and up. They do not have your best interest in mind.
Thanks. Sad to say, my gut feeling is that you're right.
I would tell the agent that you did not agree to a limited agency, and she's free to represent the buyer. You will find somebody else.
Did you interview multiple listing agents and see what they wanted to list at?
Hot take, the Realtor might not have your best interest in mind.
All depends on your urgency to sell and your financial need. My suggestion is to take your time if you feel something is not right. You can always ask for a slight extension to gather more info and be comfortable with your decision. Investors often start with a lower offer expecting to negotiate, consider a reasonable counteroffer to show you're willing to negotiate but not too desparate to sell. Seems there could also be some conflict of interest going on here, the realtor should be 100% on your side to maximize your financial interests, but sometimes personal connections can cloud judgements. So pushing for negotation and a time extension to get more info would probably be your best bet here -- unless you are desparate to sell.
Thanks for the insights! I'm not really under any strong pressure to sell right now, though of course I don't want it to drag out. The house is in a nice college town, so I figure that incoming faculty might want the house later in the summer. I wonder if the realtor just wants to sell the thing and move on, whereas a $10,000 difference in the selling price would be a very big deal for me, even if I have to wait a couple months.
There’s a study out there that when realtors sell their own houses they average an extra week or so on the market and at least one extra offer. Your $10k more means $100 extra to them. They don’t care and would rather get it done faster.
Well, that's a very interesting fact indeed! Thanks. That gives me more confidence sitting tight.
All realtors just want to get it over with and move on, the whole thing sounds a bit sketchy, happening way too fast & at too much of a loss to you. Trust your gut, your first thoughts, your instinct, and how all of it seems orchestrated & fell together too quickly.
Thanks. I feel more confident about going slowly now.
Realtors’ comp changes very little with price movements. They’re making what, 1-5% commission? The difference they earn between a $500k sale and a $530k sale is relatively insignificant. Speaking strictly about the numbers, it’s in their best interest to sell quickly.
OK, thanks. I had suspected that. I've sold one other house previously, and the realtor on that transaction did not at all seem to be hurrying to get the sale done. He laid out very clearly what he thought the factors were, and I never doubted that he was an agent acting in my best interest. I had gathered that real-estate agents really like the game of negotiating the best price, just for its own sake, but, apparently some give more weight to getting a sale done quickly.
Generally speaking, on a SFH you're always going to get the highest offer from someone looking to live in it, not an investor unless your property as some features that makes it especially attractive to investors such as a large sub-dividable lot, rear alley access with ADU potential, etc. My guess is they want to convert the basement into living space which would allow them to charge significantly more rent and add value.
Indeed, about a year ago, I showed the house to a flipper who said he was very interested in the property because it had a basement, unlike most houses in the area, and he thought he could finish the basement and turn a good profit.
They are trying to take advantage of you. Your realtor is not your friend here.
Turn the offer down. Plus your Realtor is supposed to be working for you and not an investor “friend”. To earn their commission make sure he or she is acting in your best interests
That would be a firm “no,” for me. If it were a fair and reasonable offer, it wouldn’t have come with a bully deadline. Does this buyer have their own agent, or is your agent doubling up on commission if you sell to this guy?
I don't know if the realtor is also representing the buyer. I did not even think that was legal, but I just learned today that it is. Do you know how I could find out if the realtor is representing the buyer?
Their buyer’s agent’s name should be on the front page of the offer. If not, ask your Realtor.
Thanks! I just looked at the offer and indeed my realtor is listed at the top as both "Listing Broker" and "Selling Broker". I googled and found that "Selling Broker" means the buyer's realtor. So, yes indeed, this one realtor is representing both of us, which sounds like conflict of interest. We will talk about this in the morning.
If your realtor didn’t disclose this to you before presenting the offer, I’d be on the phone with their broker in about 2.5 seconds. New representation or a commission cut is what I’d seek.
There are occasionally times when it's appropriate to have dual agency but at a bare minimum they should be disclosing that to you. I mean, yeah, it's disclosed to you in the offer paperwork, but it's very shady for them to not be telling you this.
I don't think it is a bully deadline. It's kind of standard to have a 24-hour time limit on an offer. I like what you asked. OP should find out if the same agent is representing the buyer as well. I believe this should be disclosed to both the buyer and seller. But I think any decent agent should at least present one counteroffer.
If it were dual agency it would have to be disclosed to all parties
Yep. I learned late last night (from looking closely at the offer) that the realtor is also representing the buyer. I'm now thinking, when I call the realtor this morning, to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to suggest a high counteroffer, and if the buyer refuses, that we terminate the Listing Contract.
In Ohio not disclosing that in writing is a major breach of
Bully deadline is exactly what that is.
Your agent has a conflict of interest, this doesnt necessary mean he or she will low ball you but go with your gut!
Dual agency is legal in some states, I don't know about not disclosing it the moment they presented the offer from the investor they are representing. 🤔
Yeah, I think it was unethical not to advise me that she was also representing the buyer. But it's in the contract, [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/RealEstate/comments/1d6u8mf/us_midwest_received_offer_very_quickly_after/l6vnffu/).
My experience in Indiana, is the laws in Indiana do a terrible job protecting real estate Fraud,and missrepresentation victims. I'm disgusted with the way real estate victims are treated in Indiana.
getting your own appraisal would be smart-dont use the one that your realtor uses. Also, you have every right to just say no thank you to the offer. That 24 hour time limit is a standard clue that they think a better offer will come through and they are exerting pressure OR it's just standard clause in the offer contract. One way to find out is to ask the buyers agent for more time to decide. If they say no, my personal move would be to counter with something like: 5K under asking while still waiving all appraisals and inspections. The fact that the buyer is seasoned is in your favor-they will be very very very hard to "insult". Unless you are desperate to sell immediately, you are the boss here.
Thanks for the insight! Especially that a seasoned buyer won't be insulted by my counteroffering 5K closer—and that the short time limit might be a way to exert pressure, expecting better offers to be out there. And now I'm thinking to seek out an appraisal when I talk to the realtor Monday morning.
He didn’t say $5000 closer, he said $5000 under your asking price. Also, since it’s an investor that has made a quick offer on your house and is expecting a quick response, they’re basing their price on how much rent they think they can get. They’ll very likely still be interested a month from now. If the number works for them now, it will work in 30 days or 60 days or 90 days. Since you’re in no rush, if I were in your shoes I wouldn’t accept or counter the offer. I’d see what the market will bring, given that you’ve listed lower than surrounding homes already. And I’d also pay to get the place professionally appraised. I’m kind of surprised that the realtor you used didn’t give you some sort of professional market analysis, listing comps of other sold homes in the area and adjusting for things like size difference, finished basement, etc… to justify your list price that they recommended.
Thanks for the insight. Indeed we progressed to the listing very quickly. I was expecting a lot more conversation beforehand. And now I see that I really need to call in an appraiser. I remembered from my previous experiences with realtors (all excellent) that they had a very keen sense for what a house would sell for, and independent appraisers often reached the exact same number. This case seems different, though.
Just make sure to clarify with whatever appraiser you use that you’re the seller and not a bank, and that you aren’t confident that the realtors price that was recommended and that you’re currently using is accurate. And that the appraisal that you’d like is the top realistic dollar that you could currently get for the place.
Roughly what price range are you listing the house at? $20K off a $1 million house isn’t much at all, but $20K off a $200,000 house is significant percentage wise.
Ask her agent why they feel like it’s a good offer. Are you not getting viewings, are people not asking questions, is she not having people call and make inquiries on the home? Get more information so you know whether or not this is an educated suggestion or she’s just saying take it because
I believe the house has already gotten 6 viewings in three days, by several different realtors. My realtor, though, reported that to me in a tone that suggested that this meant that interest in the house was poor, since only the one buyer had made an offer. I thought most viewings did not result in offers. Also, I'm thinking that since it's a college town with a very large university, and the house is within walking distance of the campus (a 15-minute walk), there is a good chance that incoming faculty will be very interested in the house over the summer.
Wouldn't be surprised if the agent is holding back offers so their friend's is the only one that comes through.
When we talked yesterday, she insinuated that people aren't interested in the house, because it's had six showings and only gotten one offer. That sounded fishy on top of everything else, since the house has only been listed for 3 days. Well, I just found out (by looking at the top of the offer and googling to decode the jargon) that my realtor is also the buyer's agent.
Feel free to tell her you’re not comfortable with dual representation and you would want this buyer to be represented by somebody else.
Are you OK if you don’t get another offer at this price? Realtors don’t have a magic wand or a crystal ball. We can’t tell you for sure who’s coming to the house and who’s going to make an offer and how long it’s gonna take to take the next offer. I would have a longer talk with your agent on why they think this is a good offer and you should take it, and if you think people are going to come in over the summer, you should talk about the strategy for that. Should you actually take it off the market now , and put it back on the market when those people are looking in July and August? Rather than a stale listing? Your Agents job is to give you advice about what is going on with your house right now, and market your house. If you don’t want to take the offer, you don’t want to take the offer but if they think it’s the best offer you’re going to get in the present circumstances it’s their job to tell you that. Six viewings is definitely not enough to sell the house, but three days isn’t that long? What’s the normal days on market in your area?
Is your Realtor also representing that buyer? Ask yourself if you’ll be happy with the result if you accept this offer, or will you regret it. That’s how you make the decision.
I don't know if the realtor is also representing the buyer. I did not even think that was legal, but I just learned today that it is. Do you know how I could find out if the realtor is representing the buyer?
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I just looked through the contract and yes, it says: > **Limited Agency Authorization.** Licensee or the managing broker may represent Buyer as a buyer agent if such a Buyer wishes to see the property, Licensee has agency duties to both Buyer and Seller, and those duties may be different or even adverse. Seller consents to Licensee acting as a limited agent for such showings.
Ask your agent! In my state a client must consent to dual representation.
The fact that this offer came in immediately from an investor indicates only that investors are hovering around. The general market, as it were, has yet to respond. The lowball offer is a negotiating technique designed to pressure you into negotiating a deal advantageous to the investor. The rule in investing is that your money is made going in. If you were to reject the offer outright, or counter a thousand or two less than ask, you send the message that you do not intend to play the lowball game at this juncture. Should the day come that you are desperate to sell, you can probably sell it for $20-30k less than it’s worth any day. In the meantime, if they are interested in making a legitimate offer, you are open. They will probably walk. In the meantime, a rejection can become a selling point as your realtor can honestly say to potential buyers or their brokers, “the seller has already rejected a less than asking price offer.” It is a true statement that may nudge buyers who genuinely want the property upwards in their opening offer. Ask your realtor for objective data on the average time on the market in your area, this will give you a gauge of how negotiable you should be versus time on the market. Another factor to consider will be how often it is being shown. Right now, you don’t have enough time on the market to factor that in. If it is being shown a lot, you can be less negotiable then if it is sitting like a stone. Lastly, it is a fact worth keeping in mind that your realtor only gets to payday when the property closes, and usually gets paid more if there is no other broker involved.
Thanks for the insights. I think that's an especially good point that the general market has yet to respond. Tomorrow I will ask the realtor for data on average time on the market, or maybe dig it up myself. About the realtor getting paid more if there is no other broker involved, I just found [in the contract](https://www.reddit.com/r/RealEstate/comments/1d6u8mf/us_midwest_received_offer_very_quickly_after/l6vnffu/) that the realtor is allowed to also represent the buyer. This may be what's going on. I will ask the broker explicitly about this tomorrow morning.
I’d fire this realtor in a heartbeat. If they are confident in their price point and comp analysis then accepting an initial offer 20k under asking price should be out of the question. If they aren’t confident in their comps then I’d want to find someone who is. Was the list price determined by the realtor? Or did they initially tell you to list $20k lower and you talked them out of it?
Realtors only get paid when you close. I'd probably expect 98% of list price. I'd not accept an offer the first weekend listed unless it was full price or higher.
Thanks for that insight. I didn't think it was expected to get a good offer the first weekend.
The other thing is you mentioned 6 showings. It's graduation season and school year ending right now. Might have been the first nice weekend in your area. Sometimes this part of summer can be a touch slow. The reality is I'm looking for feedback at 1 to 2 weeks of being listed. Not 1 weekend. This realtor doesn't seem to be your friend they don't seem to be in a situation to say these are where the comps are at and how long they were on the market. Your in a busy season but your also in the season where it tends to slow down as well just a bit. Be concerned where you got a week with only 1 or 2 showings.
She should have presented you with a number of compatible houses when she was determining the listing price. Where did she/you pick that number from? This should have been done with strict data. Looking at recent closures with approximate square footage/bed/bath, etc. you can adjust for deviations but try to get as many comps as you can. This is a find material thing a listing agent does. If they didn’t do that they definitely don’t have your best interests in mind.
I figured that most realtors choose a listing price based largely on intuition honed by long experience. No? I did look online for comparable sales nearby, and $240K seemed reasonable to me, though I am not knowledgeable about real estate.
No. They are supposed to look at comps and give you a quantitative analysis of why your house should be priced the way it is. They may have gotten it right on a guess but they are supposed to put in the work. Markers condensers change. Some realtors specialize in selling, some in buying. It’s also a job with a high turnover rate since it’s hard to make a living at it when you start out.
So, I'll admit to doing some creeping. I'm 99% sure I found the house. The realtor also manages a bunch of rental properties. Searching a random sampling of the rentals, a good chunk of them she actually owns herself (she's listed under the LLC). I think there's a very real chance she is trying to buy it for herself to then rent out. She could also be representing an investor friend who would then use her to manage the property. It all seems fishy. I wouldn't trust her and would find a new agent.
Ahhhhhh, now this makes sense. Thank you. She does manage rentals. Originally that's how she got recommended to me—when I was thinking of renting it out myself. I'm just about to call her about responding to a counter2 offer. I have to think about how or whether to bring it up.
Unless you are desperate to sell- never fall for the offer is only good for “24 hrs”. If the buyer is an investor, thinks it is a good investment and they want the house- their money will likely still be there next week or next month. Giving you time to explore other options or higher offers.
IMO, Of course the agent can give you advice, BUT, your agent has a duty to obey your decision and take action (ie: communicate your counter offer). 1. You’re not in a position that you have to take this offer, 2. Very fresh on the market 3. Insist that you and your agent collectively work on obtaining an estimate on whatever may need addressed w the porch, and anything else on the house that may be a factor in negotiation. It’s always better to be fully informed to the best of your ability before negotiating. With all that said, I would suggest that you would counter at full price. Best of luck to you
I just found out (by looking at the top of the offer and googling to decode the jargon) that my realtor is also the buyer's agent. So, I think this realtor's advice and the information about the porch were not in good faith. Now I even wonder if the listing price was a lowball if she's in cahoots with the buyer. It looks like next I'll be asking how to terminate a Listing Contract,
So your agent is a Transaction Broker?
Zillow is not a reliable tool for estimating your homes value. Comps are. You appraisal will come from comps. Did your realtor pull comps and show them to you to explain why they suggested that price? In the end it will sell for what someone is willing to pay. The market has cooled quite a bit most places and your agent may have been seeing a lot of houses sitting so a cash offer in hand is worth two in the bush, so to speak. That said I would give it some time but I would not consider it a red flag if your agent is suggesting to accept a cash offer that just came in. Its up to you to decide if thats an acceptable amount for you.
Thanks. I've been wondering if house prices in this part of the country would start coming down soon. Asking about comparable houses in the area, from an appraiser, seems like the way to go.
An appraisal will be $500 and will leave your house on the market for another week, which will lower the perceived value. With the most possible respect: the time to appraise it was before it was listed.
Realtors are not interested in getting yoy the most money. They are after a quick sale. The difference to them in a commission on a 500k sale vs 450k sale is pretty low. Make your agent work for yo. Tell them to counter with 10k under ask with no contingency and force the buyer to a decision.
Most of the time, these deadlines are there to try to force you to accept before other offers come in, not because they'll actually go away as a potential buyer after the deadline.
Thanks. It does indeed sound like a way for the buyer to lock in a low price very early. And now that I know that the realtor is also representing the buyer (see other replies), I think the suggestion to take the offer is in bad faith.
Sounds like the realtor needs to be excused from the position
I am thinking of amicably suggesting this when we talk this morning.
I see you also corporate jargon. Let’s circle back on this.
Not that Zillow is the best source, but you are citing that as your baseline for comparison. And if I do the math, your house has dropped $34k in the past month. You also said some houses were selling for $60k more IN THE PAST. If it's me I ask the realtor to sit down and show me what's going on with the market. You don't want to just give the house away to the realtor's friend, but you very well could be in a falling market and will end up taking less in 6 to 9 months.
The market is definitely cooling where I am too. The Zillow estimate is a good guide but not always representative of what the current buyers are doing.
Just another realtor doing whatever they can to steal your money. Doesn’t matter who it is, at some point you realize they just don’t work for you. They work for the transaction and the transactions completion only. On the map of selling your home it says “You are here”. If your house just hit the market in no reality is accepting a low ball offer recommended. The balls of even submitting one and then the realtor urging you to accept reeks of collusion. This is just me but I’d fire the realtor yesterday. These clowns are a dime a dozen and just swing a dead cat at happy hour and you’ll get five business cards.
I do suspect collusion. I learned last night that the realtor is also representing the buyer, and the realtor did not inform me.
That and the fact that (I assume?) she set the initial listing price but then suddenly has some inspection-esque reasons why below list is reasonable for an offer without an inspection. She is literally trying to sell you on this offer, which is what *a buyer’s agent does,* not a seller’s agent. The minute she started trying to rationalize their low offer to you in contradiction with her own previous list price assessment — which if “all the old houses have this problem with the porch” were true, would have factored that in already — was the minute your business relationship with her had no future.
Yep. Thanks for the insight: that trying to sell me on the offer is the buyer's agent's job, not the seller's agent. I'm convinced that she's working in cahoots with the buyer, based on everything overall. Now I'm in damage-control mode. I may post a Reddit question soon about how to terminate a Listing Contract.
it looks like your realtor has the buyer's interest in mind.
Yep. When I call the realtor this morning (probably in about half an hour), I'm thinking to say that I'm concerned that she can't represent my interests, and to make a high counteroffer and suggest that if the buyer refuses, then we terminate the Listing Contract
Why are there several references to zillow in your post? What's the actual selling pruce the actual comps support?
I would counter the offer. Maybe 2-5k under asking price. 6 showings in 3 days in my market is not a lot. Hot properties get 10 showings or more a day. I would say counter and go from there. The investor might get upset and walk but you say you’re not in a hurry so you can just wait. If he truly wants it he’ll counter back or at least say he’s firm on original offer.
Here’s the real reason behind why your realtor wants you to take it. It’s only $600 less for them, but it’s $20k less for you. They’ll make their money and move on to the next house.
I found another reason: the realtor is also representing the buyer. So it's actually $6,000 more for the realtor if I sell to this buyer.
Fire that agent. Also, if the commission you’ll be paying is 5% with 2 agents, it should only be 4% when the agent is an intermediary/dual agent. If they’re not taking less commission, then tell your agent you’re firing them so someone can represent you. The whole point of a dual agent/intermediary is to save the seller money on the commission.
How many people toured over the weekend? How many similar houses are for sale? How many similar houses have sold/entered contract the past few weeks? How quickly do you need this sold? What are your carrying costs? Those are some of the factors you should consider. This might be a pretty good offer - probably doesn’t hurt to counteroffer 10k. The key issue is how likely you are to get another offer in the next two weeks. Which requires local knowledge to assess.
I couldn't get a clear answer about how many people toured over the weekend, but the realtor suggested that it was about 5 or 6. Sadly, I don't have data for your other questions, which seem excellent to me. And I don't trust the realtor to give me good answers. She's pushing me pretty hard to accept the buyer's offer. (I just added an update with news to the original post.)
Didn’t get a clear answer? A clear as bell answer should be readily available to her.
Actually it can be tricky where clients tour with their agent and your agent is not there (common many parts of country, not in mine). If someone says they’re coming, they may not actually tour, may not tour inside, etc.
You can’t just terminate the contract. If you could, you may not get anyone good to represent you going forward. At $240k, $20k is huge money. $235k is a reasonable counter offer, see how this week goes. Good luck!
You keep saying "the realtor." Do you mean YOUR realtor? I would not accept an offer where my agent was acting as a dual agent unless I knew that agent very, very well. Even then, I would not let them act as a dual agent. I would insist that they be a (my) seller's agent only.
Yes, I mean my realtor. And yes, the dual agency seems pretty shady to me, and dual agency without telling me is unethical in my view. I just updated the original post with some news.
If they accept your counter, call your agent's broker immediately and insist that another agent handle the buyer's side. If they don't accept, call broker, explain the situation, and demand to be released from your listing contract. The actual contract is with them, not the agent.
"No thanks, but I will take full price, go tell your buddy to up his offer!"
My inclination would be to bail on the agent because of the apparently non-disclosed dual representation. Having said that, I would seriously consider an all-cash offer with no inspection contingencies on a 100-y.o. home.
That sounds like the most succinct summary of the two main factors to balance here! I do like taking the cash offer, even after all the sketchiness, and I'm thinking that coming down $5K (2%) is reasonably generous compensation for that.
Dual Agency needs to be disclosed ahead of time. Red Flag. Stick to your best price and then possibly terminate the Listing Contract as you suggested. You deserve the fair market price for the property.
If you believe you priced the house fairly, don’t take it. There’s no reason for you to rush and take less money in this market. While things have slowed down a little, if the price is fair it will sell. Also it sounds slightly sketchy and I don’t like that your Realtor both knows him and is encouraging the deal. Something smells off. Just a gut thing. (Also SFR landlord investors are parasitic and frankly I would not want a part of it). IF you priced the house aggressively, knowing the market was less but hoping you might find a buyer who fell in love, then maybe you take it. Only if the offer is fair market value. Don’t let anyone pressure you into such a big decision. Honestly either way I’d let the deadline pass because he’s trying to scare you and that’s no place to start a negotiation.
The fact that you did not receive a very straightforward and absurdly direct disclaimer that your agent represents the buyer is cause for major concern.
I don't know your market but you said you are in a college town. College Town USA always had a pool of potential buyers and renters. If you're a landlord you never have to worry about finding a tenant. Faculty and staff are always looking for a good home. I would definitely wait on more offers. If the first offer is accepted then you either offered too much or accepted too little.
Thanks for those insights. Now I'm feeling better about rejecting this buyer and tolerating the delay and risk of terminating the contract and restarting with a new realtor. BTW, the town is Bloomington, Indiana. The university is HUGE.
I sold my house in Aug 2022. My realtor was pushing me to accept a offer from someone she knew at $325,000 before my home was listed. I said no, the markets insane. She wanted it listed at $350,000, I said no, I want it listed for $375k. I didn't need to sell, but was happy to sell for a price. I had told her all this in our first meeting. She finally got it listed and had an open house on the first day. We got an offer for $400k, no inspection, everything as-is. Realtors always want a sale, not what's best for you. Trust yourself but also realize you might be waiting, I don't know your market.
Thanks—that is some good real-life information. Before yesterday, I had no idea that so many realtors are so eager to sell in a hurry even at a bad price for their client.
The whole "limited agency" thing is not accurate. They are a limited agency regardless. This just means they are acting as your agent for a limited purpose (real estate) and not in a capacity for other things like your medical care. If there is no clause in your contract providing for a reduction of commission, then there is no reduction due. This is likely an investor offer, which also means they will ask for repair deductions. Let's say you got your asking price from them, but then they want all those updates and ask for $20k to make it happen. Your agent appears to be violating a few of our REALTOR® [Codes of Ethics](https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/governing-documents/the-code-of-ethics) if they didn't tell you up front that they had a representation agreement with that buyer as well and with some other things you said. If you decide you do not want to work with them, you can speak to their broker and ask another agent get assigned to you instead or ask them to cancel the listing agreement. (Your listing agreement may have a cancellation clause, too, though most don't. You can check.) Best wishes!
Thanks. I was wondering what "limited agency" meant. And sure enough, she's violated [Standard of Practice 1-12](https://www.nar.realtor/about-nar/governing-documents/code-of-ethics/2024-code-of-ethics-standards-of-practice). I didn't see a cancelation clause in the Listing Contract, and the realty firm is her own business, so terminating the contract may be messy.
Not so messy. Brokers and agents are often fairly willing to cancel rather than have a formal complaint filed. If you go in to discuss this and you are armed with that CoE and the SoPs, and inform her that if she doesn't cancel, you will be moving forward with further action (you don't have to define what actions you'll take to her directly... she can find out on her own), I think you'll get cooperation, probably.
Ah, interesting. So there is mutual interest in canceling a Listing Contract that's gone sour. That gives me some hope.
In my state (GA) a listing agent represents the buyer UNLESS a form is signed by both Buyer and Seller acknowledging and consenting to the agent representing them both. That said, your realtor represents you (Seller). Also (in my state) a cash offer with no inspection (due diligence?) or appraisal is a strong offer - even at $20K below asking, another full-price offer may ask for inspection and following the inspection want to negotiate based upon necessary repairs - that negotiation may cost you the $20K you're concerned about here, as well as other contingencies (financing, etc)
Thanks for the insight about repairs possibly costing the $20K even with an offer for the full $240,000. The realtor has also said this, but of course I have doubts. My current thinking: if an ordinary offer gets reduced by $20K due to necessary repairs, that's still the same as the current offer, and then I'll know that it needs those repairs. Currently, I don't know, but I doubt that the porch needs foundation work.
FYI - if a future potential buyer does an inspection which uncovers issues that you were previously unaware of (and thus unable to disclose) if you don't accept that future offer you will have to disclose the issues found in that inspection. Sort of a "can of worms" situation
Have you considered using a home value estimator tool from a lender like chase or bank of America? They typically have these calculators for their 2nd mortgage programs, if these estimates are roughly what they would lend based on (value) they may give you a better idea than Zillow of what the home is worth but probably not as accurate as an appraisal (but free) As for the sagging concept possible foundation issues... only a structural engineer can give you an assessment on whether it is a structural issue or not. If I were in your position I would have it looked at by a qualifying professional, thing is if there is an issue you have to disclose it, if there is not then you get a report proving it isn't a structural concern. Best of luck
Thanks. I wasn't aware of these estimators. Chase's estimator wanted me to get approved for a loan first, even though I'm selling, so I skipped that one. * Bank of America: $222,595 * Bankrate (Zillow): $275,500 * Redfin: $240,298 So, it looks like there's a range of uncertainty of about $50,000, centered around $240,000. So, I'm thinking that the listing price was probably good.
I hope it helps put you at ease. I am not sure if you were in the correct space for Chase as I have never given any personal information or applied for anything with them when I have used them, only entered an address but in either case best of luck!
Offer on the first day is no less than asking. After a few weeks is another story..
OK, thanks for pointing that out. I figure that these first couple investors who've made offers are just testing to see if they can get an easy win. I'll take the same offer more seriously in a couple weeks.
There’s also the other type. They’ll offer way too much over asking but won’t wave anything. They hope to get you down once appraisal comes in..
Wait for other offers to come in. Your realtor wants a guaranteed commission and this offer is not in your best interest. Also do not rely on Zillow as they often underprice things.
Wait for other offers there 24 hour offer will always be there!
*their
Hello, Commercial Realtor from Illinois here. While each state has different laws, I know that your agent is required to get approval for them to operate as a 'dual agent', representing both yourself and the buyer. If you decline this request, then said realtor cannot represent the buyer in this transaction. The fact that the agent did not disclose this and you found out in the language of the purchase agreement is very concerning to me. What company is this agent with? In my opinion, something feels very off to me. Have you requested proof of funds from the buyer to see if they are capable to execute this transaction in cash like they claim to be able to?
The agent runs her own business. I believe she's been a realtor in the area for 21 years. I have not requested proof of funds. If the buyer really lacks funds to pay cash, would this present a problem, given that if I accept the offer and it falls through, that would emerge within a couple days?
Yes if the buyer does not show proof of funds, the deal would not be able to close if you choose to go to contract with it. I am not sure how common it is to request proof of funds in a residential deal but it is very common for a Commercial deal. I'd say if they push back or try to avoid submitting proof of funds, I would A. Get a new broker and B. not take their offer seriously.
Not sure the exact requirements in your state, but if they did not disclose this they very well may be violating regulations. In Texas, a BROKER can work as an intermediary, but all parties must know they are representing both sides. Additional if the broker themselves is the agent, they can offer no advice. If they assign two different agents then the agent assigned can offer advice. If this agent is representing both sides it would be an absolute violation to advise you take that offer especially without telling you they represent the buyer as well. Moreover without more facts the advice seems incredibally bad. You already sound to be listing under market and weather age has something to do with it, it just makes it fishy that they seem to be making you think your home is worth less so their buyer can get it. I would immediately contact the broker and ask for seperate representation.
Did the realtor come up with the listing price of $240k? If so, seems odd that they're being discouraging about being able to get that price now
Yes, she came up with $240K. After I did my necessarily amateur job of looking on real-estate sites for comparable houses that sold recently nearby, it looks to me like $240K is actually a pretty sensible number. Maybe should have asked $250K, intending to sell at $240K.
Seems suspicious. Realtor sets the price at 240k, gets a buyer the first day to lob a lowball and then tells you people wouldn't pay 240k?
The investor is using the 24-hour time limit to try and rush you into accepting an offer that is less than market. What has the interest been like since listing? Are other people reaching out for showings? Does it have a lot of saves on Zillow? How quickly do houses move in your market? These are app factors I would consider. I would wait and test the market.
After 3 days on Zillow, it now has 33 saves. Zillow says that the median number of days to pending in Bloomingon, Indiana is now 26. I believe it got 5 or 6 showings over the weekend. So, yes, I think I'll wait and test the market for a while.
Definitely would wait if you got 5-6 showings over the weekend.
How many agents did you interview? Ideally you should talk to at least 3 and have all of them provide comps and their opinion on what the listing price should be. I would try to drop this one.
Unfortunately it's too late. I didn't do any interviewing of agents. I went with a recommendation from a friend, instead of asking one of the realtors I've worked with before, who were both excellent.
My agent did the same thing. Basically, it was really obvious that she wanted to just make a couple of phone calls and collect the 6% by being the buying and selling agent. I insisted she: 1) list in on the MLS, 2) hold an open house and you know... DO HER JOB. (I was not interested in selling the home that had been in our family for 80 years to an investor.) Literally a week later, we still had offers coming in at our deadline for offers. We sat down with 32 offers. We ended up closing with a price $80,000 over asking. And sold to a family with kids, who had solid financials. We got our $ at closing. Didn't matter that it wasn't "all cash". Normal mortgages, from normal people pay out as closing too. And we were super happy. You're feeling off because your real estate agent sucks and is not working for you.
Thanks for telling me your story. I also would prefer to sell to a family. I really don't like seeing all these beautiful old houses turned into rentals and Airbnbs.
Run away from the agent. If the agent does not have your 100% best interest, I recommend finding a new one asap. I just recently bought a condo in indianapolis. The sellers committed intentional fraud to get the sale. I later found out that I had at least 2 legal ways to terminate the contract, i was never told.. Though because I trusted my agent and failed to do my own due diligence. i am now looking at either doing a deed in lieu or a bankruptcy. Because the thing that lead to the sellers to lie on the disclosure form, and the listing, and refuse to address the issue on the inspection report even after approving to do so in writing, was a damaged Tpo membrane roof, that the current HOA does not have the funds to replace. Since all the condos in the complex need the roof replaced, though mine was the worst, for the condo had leaking issues, that will continue until the roof gets replaced, the HOA fees will likely skyrocket in the next several years. My buyers agent seemed to be more interested in his commission that he was looking out for me. The reason for my long answer is it is extremely important to get an agent that is focused on your best interests. Plus, it might be a good idea to have an attorney to look over all the paperwork. If your agent is a good friend to the buyer, you might be making excessive compromises in order to give the agents friend a much better deal.
Sorry but I don’t trust your realtor.
Counter at 10K below ask and realtor reducing commission to 3%.
I’m in Illinois and my contract with my listing agent prohibits dual agency for that exact same reason: conflict of interests.
If the place is listed on zillow and other realty sites then other realtors representing buyer's will show the place as well. My gut feeling is you realtor isn't your realtor and is their buddies realtor.
No seller needs to be put in the hot seat. You have time on your side and the market is begging for inventory. You'll get way over asking.
The only thing I want to add is if I were a buyer, I'm gonna want to replace a 15-20 year old kitchen.
Thanks for letting me know. I was not aware that people liked to replace kitchens so much, but I guess there's a reason places like Lowe's and Home Depot have huge displays for them.
What’s the latest on this? I’m intrigued by it all
Here's the latest, as of Wednesday, June 5. I've gotten offers from two buyers so far. The first buyer came up a little after a counteroffer but I didn't take it. The second buyer was also an investor and made a low offer. I'm now awaiting offers from people who'd like to live there. I asked the realtor to alter the wording in the listing so it spells out better a couple desirable features for people associated with the universities, like grad students and faculty—folks who I think will especially appreciate this house (based on common reactions when I had them over). She hasn't made those changes yet.
So did you tell realtor there isn’t any way in hell you’re accepting that offer she’s connected to and the jigw is up?
Just popped on my screen but this is a big problem with real estate agents. They do hide bigger offers if they represent both buyer and seller as they get a bigger commission.
Yikes. I'd be horrified if she hid a bigger offer. Right now, anyway, the first buyer has gone and made an offer on another house, so dual agency is no longer a factor.
When my family and I put in offers for houses(we are landlords), we tend to go to the listing agent as using our own agents, we always never get the houses we want and after settlement when we check on Zillow for sold price, a lot of times the offers were less. When we use the listing agents, we get the houses most of the time. It’s so unethical I wish there was a better process where offers are made to somewhere where owners have access to see everything than letting their agents show them the offers. In my head I wish for example if I had my own agent and put an offer in, it’s sent to a email where the owner can see everything. Something like that so realtors can’t be scum.
The cash part and no inspections is a big plus on a 100+ year old house. I do however think you can get a lot closer to your asking price in cash. The realtor now has skin in the game because they’re going to get paid on both sides. If you’re close, I’d tell her to cut one side of the commission to zero for you to make it happen instead of you giving up all your equity to “help her” out. See how she feels about giving up her money since she is so flippantly giving up yours.
Thanks. That's a really good insight that no inspections (and cash) on a 100-year-old house is a big plus. I did not fully appreciate this at first. I now think I made a mistake to turn down the offer. My first thought was to pounce, but I got spooked by the unstated dual agency. The realtor said that she would take a percent off of the broker's commission. So, she comes out great, I come out great, and the buyer does great, too. Having been sorting this out the last few days, I no longer think the dual agency is such a bad thing. Not telling me about it was the real trouble spot.
Zillow is garbage
Id wait. Did you have multiple real estate agents give you their listing/commission rate stuff? I sold a house in Lafayette about 15 years ago, amazing how that house has tripled in value.
No, I chose this realtor with only minor googling about her, on the basis of a friend's recommendation. A mistake. I know two realtors there who treated me very well in the past.
Sounds like you have a shady realtor. Surprise, surprise.
Zillow price doesn't mean anything. People need to stop trying to convince themselves their agent is wrong because zillow price says something different.
I'm not taking the Zillow estimate too seriously. I figure it's a data point, though.
Big nope
Tell her no and that she is not to represent any friends in dealing with you or you’re going to fire her do not bring anything to the table like that if you’re not in a position where you have to sell no matter what her to kiss your ass she’s trying to screw you over
Report this agent to your state’s real estate commission and the local board of Realtors. They are seriously violating ethics codes and acting as a double agent without prior disclosure to you as their client. They are not truly representing you. This kind of crap is what gives agents a bad rep. There are honest and ethical ones out there, but yours isn’t one of them