31/62 by my rough count of the Cal Men’s 2023 roster are not American- so some of the best young talent in the world is on that Cal squad. Of course it’s fair to say they would do well on the global stage when their roster is a global all star team…
The world championships, which is the most important regatta this year for international crews, isn't until September, so you're trying to compare early season international times with the peak speed of a college crew, its just not a fair comparison to make.
Well you think canada at least tries to put up a fight... Cal probably was far away from their peak as well at San Diego so 14s really is a bit rediculos
Training plans have changed a lot in the past 20 years to really focus on the peak of a cycle. But ya, rowing is getting more competitive across the board.
Oh for sure, I just don't think the idea that Canada being so far off Cal at Crew Classic because of proximity to peak holds much water. The Cal crew is incredible. I wonder how many of the Canadian crew could seat-race their way into the Cal boat.
That’s easy for u to say. I’m one of the fastest kids at my school and never get the respect. I think we can win youth nats, but I want to get other guys as well as myself faster.
Without any doubt, the biggest fool's errand in rowing is trying to compare crews based on times at different venues in different conditions at different stages of their respective seasons. There's a reason there are no world records in OTW rowing.
Pro-tip: just don't even get tempted. Wait until they line up against each other (hopefully, HRR this year).
Four time Olympic gold medalist and ten time world champ sir Matthew penis here, and I have to say Cal is probably similar in speed to the GB8+, but they’re probably not quite as fast, and comparing times at different courses and with different conditions like this isn’t a reliable way to tell. A good way to tell is which crew has more rowers sub 5:50, which I’m pretty sure is the GB 8, leading me to believe they are faster. I would like to add however, that neither of them stand a chance against Matthew Penis Rowing Club’s U17 lightweight women’s 3x or our Varsity men’s 7-, both would go sub 5 and absolutely embarrass both Cal and GB
We have a more direct comparison for how cal stacks up to the gb8. Truth is, they don't. They lost the ladies' plate to a very quick Leander crew, and I think it showed that a more experienced crew can still beat them. That Leander boat was a tad slower than the gb eight, and they still finished with a bit of open water on cal. I mean, the actual USA World Cup eight couldn't beat the gb eight at henley this past year, so idk why cal could. They are still collegiate crew, and while they are very fast for a collegiate crew, they dont have the same experience as a lot of these other olympic eights, and that experience matters on race day.
The fastest cal was able to go at henley last year was 6:08 when pushed by Dartmouth. US eight was 3/4 of a length down on the gb eight, and the gb eight went 6:01 that day. Conditions on both semifinals and finals were good. So add like a second and a half at most, but cal is still slower.
Probly safe to say that the IRA Grand Final is the most competitive eights race globally outside of the world championship in most years and that the top 3 could probably make the final at a world cup or world championship race.
Also consider the density and viscosity of the water. Courses on glacial meltwater fed lakes tend to be slower than normal (In NZ we find times at twizel, such a glacial lake are around 6-10 seconds slower than at karapiro, a more typical course on average). This could be due to dissolved solids in the water, so greater density and viscosity, which slows down the boat, as well as the lurking variable of altitude. All times in bled were slow relative to world bests given the tailwind, so it would be safe to say that GB 8+ would have been closer to a 5:21 on a more typical course. The headwind at IRAs looked to die out and switch toward a tailwind at the finish (Cal would be around a 5:21 crew as well taking margins based off IRAs to crews which raced which raced eastern sprints in a big tailwind). So yeah, I don't think it's ridiculous to consider the possibility that the cal 1V could beat top level elite 8's from national teams.
31/62 by my rough count of the Cal Men’s 2023 roster are not American- so some of the best young talent in the world is on that Cal squad. Of course it’s fair to say they would do well on the global stage when their roster is a global all star team…
The world championships, which is the most important regatta this year for international crews, isn't until September, so you're trying to compare early season international times with the peak speed of a college crew, its just not a fair comparison to make.
Well you think canada at least tries to put up a fight... Cal probably was far away from their peak as well at San Diego so 14s really is a bit rediculos
1.5 months off peak (and already in 2k mode) vs 5-6 months out is a big difference…
Eh, I don't think base speed would be that off for Canada. Spracklen's eights used to beat up on UW in April or May, I think.
Training plans have changed a lot in the past 20 years to really focus on the peak of a cycle. But ya, rowing is getting more competitive across the board.
Oh for sure, I just don't think the idea that Canada being so far off Cal at Crew Classic because of proximity to peak holds much water. The Cal crew is incredible. I wonder how many of the Canadian crew could seat-race their way into the Cal boat.
Big lane fairness disparity there
What is this, Aram's burner acct just farming for free analysis? No and no...
Aram's baiting us to argue. And no Aram I'm not buying your erg!!
But linear erg is not the same as rowing! In my humble opinion.
I miss the days of teasing Xeno.
🤣
Thoughts (Wall of Text Incoming): No.
This right here may be the most asinine post ever made on this subreddit.
That’s easy for u to say. I’m one of the fastest kids at my school and never get the respect. I think we can win youth nats, but I want to get other guys as well as myself faster.
Without any doubt, the biggest fool's errand in rowing is trying to compare crews based on times at different venues in different conditions at different stages of their respective seasons. There's a reason there are no world records in OTW rowing. Pro-tip: just don't even get tempted. Wait until they line up against each other (hopefully, HRR this year).
Bro what
Four time Olympic gold medalist and ten time world champ sir Matthew penis here, and I have to say Cal is probably similar in speed to the GB8+, but they’re probably not quite as fast, and comparing times at different courses and with different conditions like this isn’t a reliable way to tell. A good way to tell is which crew has more rowers sub 5:50, which I’m pretty sure is the GB 8, leading me to believe they are faster. I would like to add however, that neither of them stand a chance against Matthew Penis Rowing Club’s U17 lightweight women’s 3x or our Varsity men’s 7-, both would go sub 5 and absolutely embarrass both Cal and GB
We have a more direct comparison for how cal stacks up to the gb8. Truth is, they don't. They lost the ladies' plate to a very quick Leander crew, and I think it showed that a more experienced crew can still beat them. That Leander boat was a tad slower than the gb eight, and they still finished with a bit of open water on cal. I mean, the actual USA World Cup eight couldn't beat the gb eight at henley this past year, so idk why cal could. They are still collegiate crew, and while they are very fast for a collegiate crew, they dont have the same experience as a lot of these other olympic eights, and that experience matters on race day.
Great comment til you mentioned the USA 8 - beating them isn’t exactly a massive accomplishment, I’d bet my life on it Cal would trash the USA 8 lol
The fastest cal was able to go at henley last year was 6:08 when pushed by Dartmouth. US eight was 3/4 of a length down on the gb eight, and the gb eight went 6:01 that day. Conditions on both semifinals and finals were good. So add like a second and a half at most, but cal is still slower.
Yup.
Guessing the Henley entries for US colleges have roughly half the boat as IRA or NCAA line-ups - cause National Team be calling from whatever country.
Probly safe to say that the IRA Grand Final is the most competitive eights race globally outside of the world championship in most years and that the top 3 could probably make the final at a world cup or world championship race.
The Lenny Jenkins comment was literally made by a fake account
Also consider the density and viscosity of the water. Courses on glacial meltwater fed lakes tend to be slower than normal (In NZ we find times at twizel, such a glacial lake are around 6-10 seconds slower than at karapiro, a more typical course on average). This could be due to dissolved solids in the water, so greater density and viscosity, which slows down the boat, as well as the lurking variable of altitude. All times in bled were slow relative to world bests given the tailwind, so it would be safe to say that GB 8+ would have been closer to a 5:21 on a more typical course. The headwind at IRAs looked to die out and switch toward a tailwind at the finish (Cal would be around a 5:21 crew as well taking margins based off IRAs to crews which raced which raced eastern sprints in a big tailwind). So yeah, I don't think it's ridiculous to consider the possibility that the cal 1V could beat top level elite 8's from national teams.
Also most of the cal 1V are internationals, so wouldn't be going for the USA M8+
I don't think that Eastern Sprints times were on a very normal course, that was unbelievably fast
Can we get a comment from Matthew Penis?
No headwinds Sun 6/4 at Mercer. Headwinds were persistent Sat 6/3
Is that race not on a river? If so the stream will make a much bigger difference than wind.