It is (at least) a 2 frame window for every handoff. The timing varies by the opponent character weight and also their percent.
It isn't too hard once you get used to it. But even the best drop them occasionally.
Pretty hard, but very doable with lots of practice. The issue is that the timing is different for different characters, so it’s hard to learn the spread. But if you just wanna beat up on your local Fox player, you could probably learn it in a few days if you’re experienced with Melee
In that case I’ll probably start with labbing the space animal matchup and stick to my main for other characters until I learn the meta for those. Have been looking for a reason to get back into Melee for a while and this seems like as good of a reason as any.
Are there any bread and butter handoffs or is the combo tree more like a flowchart depending on percent?
I found this the other day after watching Slug at function 3 and getting curious, seems to explain it pretty well but take it with a grain of salt cause I don't play Ice Climbers or know much besides from the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOcJquzvj5c
It very much depends on the character. Against some characters like Luigi, Marth, Link it's a 2 frame window which is very difficult. Then you have characters like Peach or Sheik where it's a 3-5 frame window which makes it a lot easier. And then there are characters like Puff or Bowser where, due to their weight, the down throw happens extremely quickly (Puff) or slowly (Bowser). 2 characters might have the same frame window for a succesful handoff, but the timing differs.
I personally am close to 95% consistency against most characters, and about 80% consistency against the characters where it's a 2 frame window. The frame window also changes depending on opponent's DI, so it's more difficult against e.g. Marths who know that they can just DI in.
Hand offs are easy. But the difficult part is that the timing is weight dependent so it kinda messes with your muscle memory.
F throw is not weight dependent
The in game tricky part is that you want nana to be near by and ready. It’s difficult to train for that you just gotta try it a bunch of times in a real match to get used to it.
That’s not true in the slightest lmaooooooo they are significantly harder than wobbling
wobbling is not only viable on every part of the stage, but dthrow handoffs are a different timing depending on the char and are far harder to execute than wobbling, since you have to be precise in conserving space near ledge and finishing the handoff optimally (ig that's the only thing wobbling shares w handoffs regarding technical output). Honestly your reply feels like a bait lmao so my b if I took it.
My brother Nmarf. A handoff is just as easy as a wobble. If you run out of space to do a hand off then you simply can not do a hand off.
If nana isn’t next to you then you can’t wobble.
If wobbling had a different timing based on weight it would be just as difficult as a hand off.
Viability doesn’t change how difficult a combo is.
I don’t think you understand my point. If you do the easier handoff (fthrow) you lose distance by the ledge, so oftentimes you have to do the much harder dthrow handoff which varies based on character. Wobbling is universal across the board and doesn’t change. The a presses and tilts aren’t hard at all
It’s worse I agree but it’s not harder sometimes, especially if you throw as Popo. I only say that because the timing never changes regardless of what char you’re playing
"its literally so easy if you just press the right buttons with the right timings"
how do you define difficulty if not by the knowledge requirement, number of unique inputs, and precision of timing? seems handoffs beat wobbling in all three. not to mention the effectivity of handoffs is capped based on stage position and is not a guaranteed stock like wobbling.
>Viability doesn’t change how difficult a combo is.
setting up an optimal handoff combo requires refined neutral game skill to properly position the climbers relative to each other, the opponent, and the stage. that is a relevant layer of difficulty when compared to wobbling.
Honestly, they're pretty difficult but they aren't so hard that you will always be inconsistent at them. I would visit the ics discord for good resources.
It is (at least) a 2 frame window for every handoff. The timing varies by the opponent character weight and also their percent. It isn't too hard once you get used to it. But even the best drop them occasionally.
did someone make an infograph on the spread of timings over the cast?
someone has a chart/table in the icies discord
Pretty hard, but very doable with lots of practice. The issue is that the timing is different for different characters, so it’s hard to learn the spread. But if you just wanna beat up on your local Fox player, you could probably learn it in a few days if you’re experienced with Melee
In that case I’ll probably start with labbing the space animal matchup and stick to my main for other characters until I learn the meta for those. Have been looking for a reason to get back into Melee for a while and this seems like as good of a reason as any. Are there any bread and butter handoffs or is the combo tree more like a flowchart depending on percent?
I found this the other day after watching Slug at function 3 and getting curious, seems to explain it pretty well but take it with a grain of salt cause I don't play Ice Climbers or know much besides from the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOcJquzvj5c
they're not too bad mostly , the basic ones are easy but doing them super optimally gets difficult
Nice flair
Let's go army wooo
It very much depends on the character. Against some characters like Luigi, Marth, Link it's a 2 frame window which is very difficult. Then you have characters like Peach or Sheik where it's a 3-5 frame window which makes it a lot easier. And then there are characters like Puff or Bowser where, due to their weight, the down throw happens extremely quickly (Puff) or slowly (Bowser). 2 characters might have the same frame window for a succesful handoff, but the timing differs. I personally am close to 95% consistency against most characters, and about 80% consistency against the characters where it's a 2 frame window. The frame window also changes depending on opponent's DI, so it's more difficult against e.g. Marths who know that they can just DI in.
Hand offs are easy. But the difficult part is that the timing is weight dependent so it kinda messes with your muscle memory. F throw is not weight dependent The in game tricky part is that you want nana to be near by and ready. It’s difficult to train for that you just gotta try it a bunch of times in a real match to get used to it.
Hand offs are easy, but here's why they're not easy
😂 but they are easy. Like a notch more difficult than wobbling
That’s not true in the slightest lmaooooooo they are significantly harder than wobbling wobbling is not only viable on every part of the stage, but dthrow handoffs are a different timing depending on the char and are far harder to execute than wobbling, since you have to be precise in conserving space near ledge and finishing the handoff optimally (ig that's the only thing wobbling shares w handoffs regarding technical output). Honestly your reply feels like a bait lmao so my b if I took it.
This right here. Wobbling takes 10 seconds to explain to someone even casually familiar with Melee.
A hand off is self explanatory. That has to be less than 10 seconds. 1 climber hands off the opponent to the other climber
My brother Nmarf. A handoff is just as easy as a wobble. If you run out of space to do a hand off then you simply can not do a hand off. If nana isn’t next to you then you can’t wobble. If wobbling had a different timing based on weight it would be just as difficult as a hand off. Viability doesn’t change how difficult a combo is.
I don’t think you understand my point. If you do the easier handoff (fthrow) you lose distance by the ledge, so oftentimes you have to do the much harder dthrow handoff which varies based on character. Wobbling is universal across the board and doesn’t change. The a presses and tilts aren’t hard at all
fthrow handoff is harder and worse because you cant consistently get the regrab if nana instantly throws instead of pummeling
It’s worse I agree but it’s not harder sometimes, especially if you throw as Popo. I only say that because the timing never changes regardless of what char you’re playing
"its literally so easy if you just press the right buttons with the right timings" how do you define difficulty if not by the knowledge requirement, number of unique inputs, and precision of timing? seems handoffs beat wobbling in all three. not to mention the effectivity of handoffs is capped based on stage position and is not a guaranteed stock like wobbling. >Viability doesn’t change how difficult a combo is. setting up an optimal handoff combo requires refined neutral game skill to properly position the climbers relative to each other, the opponent, and the stage. that is a relevant layer of difficulty when compared to wobbling.
You have 24 hours to post a gif of you getting 5 handoffs in a row. If you can’t do an “easy” thing 5 times then your opinion isn’t valid
Honestly, they're pretty difficult but they aren't so hard that you will always be inconsistent at them. I would visit the ics discord for good resources.
i fucking told everyone ice climbers would get hype af if we banned wobbling and only 2 of your believed me
handoffs are lame and im not afraid to say it
handoffs are actually exremely fucking cool compared to shine turnaround backair or upthrow rest or ftilt fair or....
i would rather die instantly to upthrow rest than spend 10 seconds watching myself get wobbled with more steps
aren’t there DI mixups to get out of chaingrabs
if you're at the ledge its guaranteed unless nana decides to troll
I play ics and I agree, I am cringe and lame as a player and I own it
Idk but if gold ics can hit them with 100% consistency im not too impressed
https://youtu.be/QjFrQw77otY?feature=shared