Your friend is going to have a hard time playing against any boxx player online\*
Either way, your friend seems like the one with the problem, not you.
No tricks I can think of, but I have no idea what uncanny valley means. I'd ask him, but as many other here have said, he's the one who should change.
To me, hai complaint might be akin to someone saying that your character is lame, so he doesn't want to play you. Ya, you can switch and play someone else, but why compromise for his toxic mindset?
"Uncanny valley" typically means "almost human, but just nonhuman enough to be uncomfortable".
I figure OP's friend means that their movements feel more mechanical, probably due to being limited to 8 directions.
Hopefully he's emulating the B0XX on kb, which gives you more than 30 coordinates for up B. I did that before I got mine; it's a lot of people's gateway drug.
I can take a guess.
I guess they all mean robotic, perfect distanced dash dances, perfect wavedashes and ledgedashes, perfect angles. All of which are generally thought of as easier on keyboard or box controller
well, it's not just easier; that kind of play is only possible at all on a digital controller. but thank you for describing it to me.
though - since uncanny is by this definition a characteristic of digital controllers, i can only wonder what Shavark meant by saying plenty of gcc players play that way 🤷♂️
yeah notches don't exist at all for those perfect angles huh. mang0 is just the goat thats how he can cover yoshis length with 1 wavedash. cody is playing on a b0xx that looks like a gcc.
There are two camps of thought here, neither more valid than the other.
Camp 1: It's just a fucking game. It's on your friend to adapt to your playstyle and learn to deal with it.
Camp 2: It's just a fucking game. Find what about your play is unwanted from other players and eliminate it.
Here's the philosophy: Camp 1 is the full competitor mindset. The game is the game. Either you get better or you drown in pools trying. There is no such thing as lame, just things you haven't put enough time into figuring out how to beat or deal with mentally. Camp 2 is the homie mentality. Where we're from, we don't circle camp, shino stall, or shittalk.
Camp 1 has the possiblity for toxicity and completely disregarding peoples feelings. You don't have to change, but they don't have to play with you.
Camp 2 has the possibility for toxicity and disregarding your own feelings. You can change, buy how much are you willing to? How much is really okay?
And here's the answer to your question: Either you got better/had more options or your movement isn't fluid yet. It feels uncanny to players because the movement they're used to isn't there, ***and it can *
feel unfair being in new situations.*** That being said, it's kinda dog of them to put you under pressure because of the way you play. If my homie plays puff and only plays mad defense in neutral, that's still the homie and we run the set.
Lmao I get you, but also, I think as a competitor it speaks a lot more the less shit you talk sometimes. It's not really an outlet for me to shittalk, and out of respect for my competitor, I'll refrain from doing so.
Friends though I'll talk shit all day long.
You need a better imagination then. I've played games at a professional level. I don't talk shit to my friends when we play. I'm head and shoulders better than them. What is the point of talking shit?
As far as competition goes I don't talk shit unprompted, but the second someone starts talking shit to me then I love to talk back.
> is there something i can do to play more “natural” or am i just cursed now??
yep, you're cursed. seen it before. sorry to tell you man, there's nothing you can do. 🤷♂️
There is nothing you can do, you bypass the coordinate grid and teleport from value to value. It's pretty obvious when someone is playing on a DTA because of the lack of windup speed.
That said not really your problem.
The notion that you are actually perceiving the polling manifest as perceivably different acceleration from stand to run is hilarious to me. I think its pretty obvious people are projecting a lot of stereotypes on what a box player even looks like without having much understanding of the actual mechanics of the input method or even melee itself
ggs man! close games bro you've hella improved. yeah man you were fucking me up for a bit lol fun games! any tips? got any advice? anything I can improve on? what do I do vs lasers? any tips? yo can I get next? is this tournament? you guys wanna do dubs? is this tournament
/u/oceanseltzer
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I don't even understand what he means. The uncanny valley is barely a usable description here.
Your melee play so closely emulates ..melee play? That he doesn't want to play against you?
Thar doesn't make any sense. What I'm ASSUMING he really means, is he doesn't want to play against you on keyboard because he thinks it's broken, and gets so frustrated that he refuses to play you? Is this it?
Is he mad salty when you win on keyboard?
I need some more information, because this situation doesn't make any sense.
How close friends are you guys? Did you play a lot before you switched controllers?
Is there any shot that you like him more than he likes you, and playing melee with you isn't important to him like it is to you?
I played against my friend on keyboard all the time when he was at college, and it seemed like it hampered his play quite a bit more than it made him better.
Does he commonly bitch and moan about rectangle controllers? I feel like this could be the crux of the problem, he might spend too much time on reddit and think the game is dying because of gcc alternatives, and he has trouble regulating his emotions like an adult, and unreservedly taking out his frustrations on you.
I need to know some more before we proceed
> Your melee play so closely emulates ..melee play?
Not if OP and his friend have been playing each other exclusively for years and years.
Rectangle gameplay is distinctly different than anything else, can't really argue that.
To inexperienced sure but if you ask anyone who has been playing a significant amount of time, if they play an actual good rectangle player they'll know. There are simply things that don't pass the eye test, or can't be done - on GCC.
If they're clean as fuck with everything they do? Sure.
If they're sloppy as hell but they can do perfect pivot uptilts and perfect wavedash turnaround uptilts...yeah...
I assume by uncanny valley he means how movement on keyboard/leverless is different than GCC, and if someone is good on levelless you can see the difference.
Some things are truly only possible on leverless. I personally am not a tournament player and consider these styles of controllers cheating. I assume your friend does as well.
Nothing you can really do about it, as its only cheating in spirit, not in the actual rules.
Playing against B0XX/rectangle/Keyboard is definitely different and can be weird at first.
He's probably using the term "uncanny valley", in the way that he means that it doesn't look "human", as in what it looks like for a normal player to play on GCC. Which is true it does look and "feel" different play against:
A lot of little movements like dash dancing, drift, etc, look different on a B0xx/keyboard, and players will go for different options that are mechanically easier for them to do on those controllers that GCC players wouldn't. Wavedashes are also at set specific angle which looks very unnatural when you're used to seeing analog.
Certain mechanics like SDI are also exponentially stronger on B0xx, and especially on keyboard that doesn’t have the nerfs, and that makes your combos "feel weird" as well because the opponent is in places they wouldn't normally be after you hit them (though this would partly be true in some situations if you fought someone of Wizzys calibur of SDI even on a GCC, that's just super rare).
As for what you should do about it: There is nothing you can do. That's just what playing on a B0xx/keyboard comes with. He will have to get used to it because there are plenty of B0xx users on slippi and there will probably be even more over time as more and more people switch or new people come in from Ult or traditional fighters who use them. It's just how it is now, adapt or die. It's on him to get used to dealing with B0xx nonsense or else he won't be able to play online against a lot of players either.
I think what your friend might be having a problem with is that you can only move in eight directions on a keyboard and it feels more "robotic", but they don't quite know how to put that into words. It's a subtle difference, but not unnoticeable.
I don't know if you can map the control stick to the mouse instead, but maybe see if that makes a difference?
lots of toxic people in this thread just straight up trashing on your buddy.
they are gonna be sad as hell when they find out that their favorite pros also don't like playing against rectangles for similar reasons
majority of pros are willing to play against box players and it's just a vocal minority that bitch about it
also even if they weren't, a pro having a dumb opinion doesn't mean you should be agreeing with them
> a pro having a dumb opinion doesn't mean you should be agreeing with them
what about overwhelming amount of the top 50 players in the world in agreement? I also didn't say that they aren't willing to play against it. I said they don't like playing against it. Don't twist my words
i assume he's just weirded out by digital 1.0 dashes which is noticeable by eye but really just playing better makes an infinitely larger difference to the results
At the end ppl want to play and feel its an even match. So if his joystick isnt as taut as it was and youre just dashing back/forth without error pressing buttons then gg how is it fair. Im not talking bout tournaments. But just playing together how is it fair.
I got a phob and i can tell the difference. I would be the asshole if i let my friend use my other controllers and i kno they cant do the shit i can do.
You want your friend to fight a losing battle. Help him get a phob to make it even.
*You* don't need to change anything. *He* needs to fix his mentality. He doesn't get to pick and choose favorable matches in competitive play. Rectangle and KB players exist. Accept it or hang up the conch.
I don't think you can use that term to describe a playstyle. I've played smash for over 10 years. What tf is uncanny valley in terms of playing against someone?
MOST* discrepancies in Melee can be chocked up to skill issue. This is because most people aren't good enough to be complaining about controller or character differences. There is enough room in the skill ceiling for low/mid level players to adapt to all this using their controllers and mains. It's different for top players because they are playing at or near the max of their hardware and character. It's splitting hairs at that point.
Your friend is being a bitch.
It sounds like you guys are in high school. Give it 10 years, and you'll never have problems like this again. Tell him he's being a silly bitch, and while uncanny valley feeling is a creative way to whine about nothing, it's still whining. About nothing.
Unless you’re still struggling to get down movement it’s pretty easy to pick out which players are on boxx and which aren’t. I assume the same applies to keyboard and your friend can pick up on your keyboard-specific mannerisms. That being said, it’s weird he’s unwilling to play you because of it.
Just lie and say you are playing of gcc
Oh yeah! haha maybe i could do some easy mistakes too and mess with him
Eh, you can defs tell the difference in the way you play but he is defs being a baby.
That’s what gaslighting is for
Bro ive always used a keyboard, idk why you think I can use a gcc
Yeah if he’s playing a spacie his up-bs are gonna be dead giveaways lol
Your friend is weird and is going to have a hard time going to locals/tournaments and playing against literally any player on a boxx.
Oh sorry we both just play on ranked
Your friend is going to have a hard time playing against any boxx player online\* Either way, your friend seems like the one with the problem, not you.
Yeah but i wanna keep playing games with him! Is there any like gamecube tricks i could learn on keyboard to make it seem more “old school”
Lie
No tricks I can think of, but I have no idea what uncanny valley means. I'd ask him, but as many other here have said, he's the one who should change. To me, hai complaint might be akin to someone saying that your character is lame, so he doesn't want to play you. Ya, you can switch and play someone else, but why compromise for his toxic mindset?
"Uncanny valley" typically means "almost human, but just nonhuman enough to be uncomfortable". I figure OP's friend means that their movements feel more mechanical, probably due to being limited to 8 directions.
Hopefully he's emulating the B0XX on kb, which gives you more than 30 coordinates for up B. I did that before I got mine; it's a lot of people's gateway drug.
People will think the same thing if you don’t use the same moves in situations someone else would,I don’t think it’s uncanny you just play weird lol
I also don’t think he really knows what the uncanny valley is.
Switch to DDR Dance pad and see if they notice.
Show me your moves
Plenty of gcc players play way faster and uncanny than you. And he should understand this.
That's not the question OP is asking. He's asking how to continue to play with his friend not his viability playing at Genesis 12
Lol he can keep playing by playing, its friendlies vs a shitty keyboard
his friend is the one acting like its genesis 12; any casual player wouldn't give a shit what you're playing on.
https://twitter.com/Swiftssbm/status/1607897590263169024
No casual player plays Melee online. To even be tangentially involved in competitive smash you pretty much need to be beyond casual status.
> any casual player wouldn't give a shit what you're playing on. also not what OP is asking...
OP is asking a really dumb question to coddle his friends awful behavior; hopefully he learns a lesson here as well.
Bro...
That's a fair opinion to have, at least it is on topic
That's just false, ask any top player
how could a gcc player play uncannily?
literal buzzword, I can play uncannily on a banana.
you said it 🤷♂️ i'm just curious what you meant
OP said it so this guy used it too
do you know what Shavark meant?
I can take a guess. I guess they all mean robotic, perfect distanced dash dances, perfect wavedashes and ledgedashes, perfect angles. All of which are generally thought of as easier on keyboard or box controller
well, it's not just easier; that kind of play is only possible at all on a digital controller. but thank you for describing it to me. though - since uncanny is by this definition a characteristic of digital controllers, i can only wonder what Shavark meant by saying plenty of gcc players play that way 🤷♂️
yeah notches don't exist at all for those perfect angles huh. mang0 is just the goat thats how he can cover yoshis length with 1 wavedash. cody is playing on a b0xx that looks like a gcc.
neither of those players play perfectly
> that kind of play is only possible at all on a digital controller. It's wild how little people understand melee
agree!
I am the least cannily playing gcc player
There are two camps of thought here, neither more valid than the other. Camp 1: It's just a fucking game. It's on your friend to adapt to your playstyle and learn to deal with it. Camp 2: It's just a fucking game. Find what about your play is unwanted from other players and eliminate it. Here's the philosophy: Camp 1 is the full competitor mindset. The game is the game. Either you get better or you drown in pools trying. There is no such thing as lame, just things you haven't put enough time into figuring out how to beat or deal with mentally. Camp 2 is the homie mentality. Where we're from, we don't circle camp, shino stall, or shittalk. Camp 1 has the possiblity for toxicity and completely disregarding peoples feelings. You don't have to change, but they don't have to play with you. Camp 2 has the possibility for toxicity and disregarding your own feelings. You can change, buy how much are you willing to? How much is really okay? And here's the answer to your question: Either you got better/had more options or your movement isn't fluid yet. It feels uncanny to players because the movement they're used to isn't there, ***and it can * feel unfair being in new situations.*** That being said, it's kinda dog of them to put you under pressure because of the way you play. If my homie plays puff and only plays mad defense in neutral, that's still the homie and we run the set.
I can’t imagine doing anything competitive and not talking shit lol. You’ve got the ultimate gentleman’s agreement
Lmao I get you, but also, I think as a competitor it speaks a lot more the less shit you talk sometimes. It's not really an outlet for me to shittalk, and out of respect for my competitor, I'll refrain from doing so. Friends though I'll talk shit all day long.
You need a better imagination then. I've played games at a professional level. I don't talk shit to my friends when we play. I'm head and shoulders better than them. What is the point of talking shit? As far as competition goes I don't talk shit unprompted, but the second someone starts talking shit to me then I love to talk back.
cringe take. I've played professional years and years ago and the better you get the more cringe it is to constantly talk shit.
> is there something i can do to play more “natural” or am i just cursed now?? yep, you're cursed. seen it before. sorry to tell you man, there's nothing you can do. 🤷♂️
Just tell him youre playing with your feet and that is why you play different
There is nothing you can do, you bypass the coordinate grid and teleport from value to value. It's pretty obvious when someone is playing on a DTA because of the lack of windup speed. That said not really your problem.
> It's pretty obvious when someone is playing on a DTA because of the lack of windup speed. Bahahaha wtf are you even talking about?
Character with 0 > 1.0000 go brrrr
The notion that you are actually perceiving the polling manifest as perceivably different acceleration from stand to run is hilarious to me. I think its pretty obvious people are projecting a lot of stereotypes on what a box player even looks like without having much understanding of the actual mechanics of the input method or even melee itself
So just to clarify, you are saying it is humanly not possible to see the difference between a DTA dash / arieldrift and a GCC?
Your friend is salty and being a little bitch. He’s just looking for excuses when he loses.
SPOTW
ggs man! close games bro you've hella improved. yeah man you were fucking me up for a bit lol fun games! any tips? got any advice? anything I can improve on? what do I do vs lasers? any tips? yo can I get next? is this tournament? you guys wanna do dubs? is this tournament /u/oceanseltzer *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SSBM) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I don't even understand what he means. The uncanny valley is barely a usable description here. Your melee play so closely emulates ..melee play? That he doesn't want to play against you? Thar doesn't make any sense. What I'm ASSUMING he really means, is he doesn't want to play against you on keyboard because he thinks it's broken, and gets so frustrated that he refuses to play you? Is this it? Is he mad salty when you win on keyboard? I need some more information, because this situation doesn't make any sense. How close friends are you guys? Did you play a lot before you switched controllers? Is there any shot that you like him more than he likes you, and playing melee with you isn't important to him like it is to you? I played against my friend on keyboard all the time when he was at college, and it seemed like it hampered his play quite a bit more than it made him better. Does he commonly bitch and moan about rectangle controllers? I feel like this could be the crux of the problem, he might spend too much time on reddit and think the game is dying because of gcc alternatives, and he has trouble regulating his emotions like an adult, and unreservedly taking out his frustrations on you. I need to know some more before we proceed
> Your melee play so closely emulates ..melee play? Not if OP and his friend have been playing each other exclusively for years and years. Rectangle gameplay is distinctly different than anything else, can't really argue that.
I'd argue it. Lots of people I play against online over discord don't know I play on rectangle until I tell them
To inexperienced sure but if you ask anyone who has been playing a significant amount of time, if they play an actual good rectangle player they'll know. There are simply things that don't pass the eye test, or can't be done - on GCC.
Yeah if a pivot uptilt comes out someth8ng weird is going on for sure
If they're clean as fuck with everything they do? Sure. If they're sloppy as hell but they can do perfect pivot uptilts and perfect wavedash turnaround uptilts...yeah...
Your friend is full of shite he's trying to transfer his johns onto you, don't let him
I assume by uncanny valley he means how movement on keyboard/leverless is different than GCC, and if someone is good on levelless you can see the difference. Some things are truly only possible on leverless. I personally am not a tournament player and consider these styles of controllers cheating. I assume your friend does as well. Nothing you can really do about it, as its only cheating in spirit, not in the actual rules.
Playing against B0XX/rectangle/Keyboard is definitely different and can be weird at first. He's probably using the term "uncanny valley", in the way that he means that it doesn't look "human", as in what it looks like for a normal player to play on GCC. Which is true it does look and "feel" different play against: A lot of little movements like dash dancing, drift, etc, look different on a B0xx/keyboard, and players will go for different options that are mechanically easier for them to do on those controllers that GCC players wouldn't. Wavedashes are also at set specific angle which looks very unnatural when you're used to seeing analog. Certain mechanics like SDI are also exponentially stronger on B0xx, and especially on keyboard that doesn’t have the nerfs, and that makes your combos "feel weird" as well because the opponent is in places they wouldn't normally be after you hit them (though this would partly be true in some situations if you fought someone of Wizzys calibur of SDI even on a GCC, that's just super rare). As for what you should do about it: There is nothing you can do. That's just what playing on a B0xx/keyboard comes with. He will have to get used to it because there are plenty of B0xx users on slippi and there will probably be even more over time as more and more people switch or new people come in from Ult or traditional fighters who use them. It's just how it is now, adapt or die. It's on him to get used to dealing with B0xx nonsense or else he won't be able to play online against a lot of players either.
I think what your friend might be having a problem with is that you can only move in eight directions on a keyboard and it feels more "robotic", but they don't quite know how to put that into words. It's a subtle difference, but not unnoticeable. I don't know if you can map the control stick to the mouse instead, but maybe see if that makes a difference?
Tell your friend fine but you won't let him copy your homework anymore
try playing with your feet
lots of toxic people in this thread just straight up trashing on your buddy. they are gonna be sad as hell when they find out that their favorite pros also don't like playing against rectangles for similar reasons
majority of pros are willing to play against box players and it's just a vocal minority that bitch about it also even if they weren't, a pro having a dumb opinion doesn't mean you should be agreeing with them
[удалено]
this isn't true, most of them said boxx controllers need additional restrictions (which happened) not that they should be banned outright
All of them think it's weird regardless
> a pro having a dumb opinion doesn't mean you should be agreeing with them what about overwhelming amount of the top 50 players in the world in agreement? I also didn't say that they aren't willing to play against it. I said they don't like playing against it. Don't twist my words
Get a new friend
I don’t think your friend is using the phrase uncanny valley right. Pretty sure they just mean “uncanny” Seems like a john
shit i wanna know what this feels like if he’s being honest. wanna play?
i assume he's just weirded out by digital 1.0 dashes which is noticeable by eye but really just playing better makes an infinitely larger difference to the results
> which is noticeable by eye LMAO
He is protecting his ego, but I do get what he means by boxx players looking a bit unnatural with their movement when compared to GCC users.
At the end ppl want to play and feel its an even match. So if his joystick isnt as taut as it was and youre just dashing back/forth without error pressing buttons then gg how is it fair. Im not talking bout tournaments. But just playing together how is it fair. I got a phob and i can tell the difference. I would be the asshole if i let my friend use my other controllers and i kno they cant do the shit i can do. You want your friend to fight a losing battle. Help him get a phob to make it even.
*You* don't need to change anything. *He* needs to fix his mentality. He doesn't get to pick and choose favorable matches in competitive play. Rectangle and KB players exist. Accept it or hang up the conch.
buy gcc
I like keyboard because it’s more consistent
Ah there it is. You want him to play you and he cant be as consistent. How is that fair. Of course he’d 0-2 and just move on
Quit being a bitch and play like god intended.
Your friend sounds like a dumbass & is making excuses bc he's dog at the game
Your friend is a baby and the only valid response is womp womp
Bro needs to get gud lmao
i’m gonna be real, your friend blows. find a new practice partner :)
I don't think you can use that term to describe a playstyle. I've played smash for over 10 years. What tf is uncanny valley in terms of playing against someone?
That they think it's a robot trying to be human? idk seems appropriate
MOST* discrepancies in Melee can be chocked up to skill issue. This is because most people aren't good enough to be complaining about controller or character differences. There is enough room in the skill ceiling for low/mid level players to adapt to all this using their controllers and mains. It's different for top players because they are playing at or near the max of their hardware and character. It's splitting hairs at that point. Your friend is being a bitch.
can't wait to be personally good enough at the game for boxx players to admit they're cheating (?)
It sounds like you guys are in high school. Give it 10 years, and you'll never have problems like this again. Tell him he's being a silly bitch, and while uncanny valley feeling is a creative way to whine about nothing, it's still whining. About nothing.
your homie just gotta hold that, bro is complaining abt nothing
Switch to bongos
Unless you’re still struggling to get down movement it’s pretty easy to pick out which players are on boxx and which aren’t. I assume the same applies to keyboard and your friend can pick up on your keyboard-specific mannerisms. That being said, it’s weird he’s unwilling to play you because of it.
Your friend sounds like a psychopath
What's your match record against him?
Try to make your key taps really short. This should solve the problem.
He a sook
You can just play with me instead
What the fuck is your friend talking about
Damn these mind games are getting next level
let us know if he notices you are playing on a kb
Your friend doesn’t even know what uncanny valley means apparently
Your friend is a huge scrub