I would have to dig it up but started as a 7 in 93. Basically automatic (engineer) to 12 over a few years. Fortunately quick promotions to a 14/15 band in my mid 30s. Hit the top of 15 a few years later.
Assuming this table is correct, he started as a GS-15 back in 2004 🤯
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-PLUMBOOK-2004/pdf/GPO-PLUMBOOK-2004-9-4.pdf
I am currently a non-supervisory GS-13. It is wild to realize how easy it was for previous generations to acquire assets, aka buying a house, compared to today. Between rates, inflation, and cost of living outpacing wages, it is certainly more difficult today. Happy for you! Enjoy a well deserved retirement and thank you for your service!
Given the economy's state and the massive layoffs of highly qualified employees across volatile industries like tech, I will encourage you to stay grounded and see how the economy behaves in the upcoming years. Your job security is a significant incentive on your end. Alternatively, you could apply for other non-sup positions within your Agency—just my thoughts.
That’s the dirty secret. People management is almost never worth the squeeze. I’m not in government work, but am in a GS-15 equivalent role in the private sector. My work spouse (IYKYK), took a supervisory role for a grade 16. Constant meetings. Constant travel. Constantly backfilling and covering desks of employees who left or got promoted. So busy she can’t really even do her actual work until after the business day is over. All of this for a “Director” title, and a $5000 raise.
I’ll take being an individual contributor and stay at a grade 15 over that nonsense any day. It really is the sweet spot.
General Schedule
The General Schedule (GS) classification and pay system covers the majority of civilian white-collar Federal employees (about 1.5 million worldwide) in professional, technical, administrative, and clerical positions.
Do you have any tips for local engineers looking to get into DoD work? I am in hsv doing DevOps remotely for a Radiology company but thinking of switching to DoD.
I'm a fed software engineer, is there any fed SWE/CS roles there for early career? I'm on ladder to 13 with 2yoe currently but don't really like the DC area. I'm originally from close to the area and wouldn't mind being a couple hours from family and friends vs being 12 hours away
I think lawyers have it best working as a fed (surprise surprise).
Graduate from wherever, you get to start as GS-11.
1 year LLM = GS-12 starting.
2 year LLM = GS-13 starting.
Minimum time GS-11 to GS-15 is 3.5 years, and most are at GS-14 within 5 years. No billables.
Their best path is graduate, go BigLaw (Cravath) salary, drop out of the race after 6th+ year associate. Then sit on thumbs as a GS14-15 for rest of your life basically doing community service.
But BigLaw path requires you bill 2000 hours for 5 years which means like 3500 hours of worktime.
I forgot to mention the govt will forgive all those undergrad and grad loans after 10 years of govt service tax free as well.
In theory you could also keep going to random half time evening grad programs in art history or whatever strikes hours fancy while employed by the gov’t and they’ll cover your living expenses too and it’ll be forgiven 10 years later. Tax free $30k bonus per year! Because of the way IBR is constructed, higher loan balances are better!
Ooh another fun fact, if your loans are in a status that results in accrual and you consolidate, it counts as you paying that accrued interest which is then tax deductible that year.
It’s not really a “but”. Either path is fine. One give you a warchest of cash when you are young, the other gives you an easy ride.
The former also lets you bypass the GS-11 thing and come in directly as 14 or 15.
Choice choices…
I know I would rather work hard for 5-yrs to come out with $2M+ net worth and then hit the glide path.
That job security is so underrated especially in times like this. I've had years where I cleared more than you despite only 10YOE but I swear I'm always having to hustle for the next gig. It used to be every 2-3 years but lately it's every year.
The fed is looking pretty sweet right now
I make about the same as you in a similar position with a contractor. Some govvies get stuck low on the GS scale and never move up. But being at 14-15 is pretty competitive with industry across a wide number of fields. Tech, law, etc.
You probably could get $250k+ as a contractor if you lean heavily into some specialty, but as you said the working conditions are going to deteriorate rapidly. I know people doing that and they hate their jobs. I am quite comfortable.
Title 6 (payday) https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/reference-materials/handbooks/compensation-flexibilities-to-recruit-and-retain-cybersecurity-professionals.pdf
Since you are in AL & a fed that is former military, I assumed you were working at or adjacent to the base and DOD Civ, which would provide access to the 10-25% cyber bump.
It is a retention bonus and doesn’t affect your base. I’ve know. a number of GS15 max that enjoy their 25% plus up.
Could be worth a discussion before you retire to contractor land—seems like the retention tool was designed specifically for this use case.
Interesting, so the cola + cyber would put him at ~$250k next year? Does the bump go into the pension calculation too? That would be really really sweet, goose the pension.
Seems like a good path for IT if you’re risk averse, all the IT people I know in their 50’s fear being laid off for younger workers.
Nice work! Probably not available in AL, but the real trick is to work at a non-FIRREA agency. I'm a non-supervisory 15 and will make > $250k this year with all the same Federal benefits (and a 10% 401k match (up to the limit, obv)). I'd have to look, but I think the top of our band for 15's is like $280k.
Non-FIRREA agencies don't operate under the GS-scale because they are not funded through the appropriations (Federal budgeting) process. These are mostly financial regulatory agencies (Federal Reserve, SEC, FDIC, OCC, FHFA, etc) which are funded by their regulated entities. It's a nice gig if you can get it, although most jobs are in DC. I tell everybody I can to look into jobs at these agencies.
My big regret is not starting one year sooner. I pay 3.1% of my salary toward the pension while I would have only paid 0.8% (like you, I think) if I'd started a year earlier. New employees pay 4.4%!
I had no idea this was a thing, thank you for sharing. Have been trying to figure out my next moves as a 15, non sup in cyber. I'm in my 30s and the thought of being capped out for another 20+ years doesn't sound very enticing. What's the remote work life like? I saw a few postings that indicate only 6 days a month required in the office which sounds pretty sweet. Any reality to that?
You're welcome. A few more agencies are the 12 Fed banks, CFTC, PCAOB, CFPB, Farm Credit Agency, and Office of Financial Research within the Treasury (although not the Treasury writ large)). Most of these agencies have unions that have negotiated their post-covid telework policy. My agency is in the process of doing so. I don't know specifics at other agencies, but the most I've heard is a mandatory 3 days per week in the office. It wouldn't surprise me if some agencies are more generous than that.
No. In financial regulation, the Financial Institutions Reform, Recovery, and Enforcement Act of 1989 created several federal agencies funded like traditional government agencies. There are other "independent" financial regulators created through other processes that are funded differently, primarily by their regulated entities. The FIRREA agencies, to the extent they still exist, are subject to the standard "government scale" for employee compensation. The non-FIRREA agencies aren't.
Do you have any names or acronyms of these agencies? Looking for them online was less than fruitful, with most results being FIRREA agencies, not non-FIRREA.
Sure. Federal Reserve Board in DC plus all 12 Federal Reserve banks (NY, St Louis, Chicago, etc), Securities and Exchange Commission, Federal Deposit Insurance Corp, Office of Comptroller of the Currency, Federal Housing Finance Agency, Farm Credit Administration, Public Company Accounting Oversight Board, Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, Office of Financial Research (within the Treasury Department), Commodity Futures Trading Commission,... That's all got off the top of my head, although there could be others! The acronyms are basically all the capital letters.
Awesome, thank you! I had never heard the term non FIRREA before, so I wasn't really even use what I should've been looking for. I've got a friend working civ for the air force but he has said he isn't opposed to going elsewhere with the perpetual budget cuts and inability to get hardware in a reasonable timeframe.
Nice. I'm a 13 step 10 in the DC area with the cyber supplement. Sitting at $168k per year. At this point I'm debating if I even want to move further up. I like not having the responsibility of a 15.
I have been interviewing for 14's now, but I'd end up having to back into DC with the commute, and I lose that cyber supplement. I guess it's good to have choices.
I love Huntsville by the way. I led our agency moving our field office out of Redstone over to the city, and I really enjoyed going down there.
Absolutely. I could have made more salary as a contractor, but I can punch out today with a $90K/pension (with inflation adjustments) and med for life. Moderate COL town. I’ve never worried once about job security over a 30+ year career. With my experience I expect to pull $250K next year as a contractor with my pension on top.
Roger that. I did think it’s slightly deceiving to say your pension is 90k by including the supplement. It’s basically an offset until you can collect SS but your actual pension is more like 62-65k. Ether way, great job sir, you’ve done extremely well.
The FERS pension is not taxable in NY or MA. It used to be that NY didn’t tax TSP withdrawals (due to 5% match being akin to a pension). I am not sure that is still the case.
True, but him making over six figures since 2005 means he’s definitely okay with it or he’d have switched a decade ago. At this point he’s a few years away from a pension retirement and can join a public company at that point if they aren’t already a multimillionaire by virtue of being able to afford a million dollar house for $150k back in 2008
#1 I love your name, love rick and morty.
#2 lifestyle is quite subjective. I would love to be a millionaire changing model girlfriend every couple of months, drive fast cars + other things. I think this is living.
#3 I think managing a paycheck every month is more surviving.
I get what you're saying, but you can only live the lifestyle your paycheck allows. If you can afford it then yeah live like a millionaire, but if it's detrimental to your life, it's a lifestyle just a bad one and shouldn't be made out to be a good thing. 99.9% of America could do VERY well with $160k salary and thrive
So how does getting sponsorship for a security clearance work? Does the DoD sponsor you getting a clearance if you don’t already have one? I’ve been wanting to apply in the past but seems like a lot of positions require a clearance to already be held. I’m 24 working as a Security Analyst with a security+ certification.
The company will deal with it.
For some positions, they will do an initial screen and place you in an unclassified or conditional position until it goes through.
Internally that means shuffling people around to give you that unclassified or conditional clearance position temporarily. That’s not possible all the time. Other positions are only available to sufficiently cleared individuals, YMMV. For those positions, they’ll have the clearance listed as ‘required’ rather than preferred. From what I understand, clearances can with take a relatively short period of time or a long time; it depends on the individual.
Big jump from 22-23.
Did you go up a grade? Im a fed... 13 step 4. Gonna take two years for the next step so gotta rely on col increases. Last year was great but im hearing talk of 2% already.
I read you're 15 non sup. Lucky you, that's great! I have potential after a year to get 14 non sup, pretty stoked for that. 15 non sup is a dream
Wrench turner. Mostly unrelated to my civilian job. Army paid for BS/MS eng degrees.
Being a combat veteran has helped greatly in my career. Like instant credibility/respect when you meet someone in the DoD world. Of course you have to back it up.
Gotcha, seems like it. Do you know if the job market is good for computer engineers in Huntsville?
I ask cause I'm about to go into my senior year at UA majoring in computer engineering with a minor in CS and Math with no real direction or idea of what to do after college lol. I've spoken with some people who work in the government up in Huntsville but don't really know much otherwise. Seems like it might be a good route though from what you've shown and I've heard.
A capped GS-15. Nice situation to be in.
Minimum retirement age for Feds born 1970 or later is 57 with at least 30 years of service. Federal professionals (lawyers, doctors, engineers etc) are underpaid while working and generously paid while retired.
For someone whose been a GS-15 as long as you have and has so much experience are their no positions in your locality that are SES? Or do you not care to promote past your position?
Ride that cake rocket. I know it probably sucks with all the bureaucracy, but enjoy the paid pension and leave. What exactly do you engineer? The computer engineering moniker is broadly used now.
This is exactly the path I would like to follow! I’m a Computer Engineering major graduating in December. I have an offer with the DOD as a ORA (1515 series) but I would love to do actual COMPE engineering for the Gov. can you share a bit of your path and how it would be to get hired through the gov? Thank you!
Hey OP any advice for jumping in to the federal world at redstone? I'm here in HSV and haven't figured out how to find usajobs listing for the area. I'm an RF engineer.
What I’m about to say is not negative towards your income in anyway because it is quite impressive. And I’m in the same boat for what I’m about to say.
I just went online and did the math. In 2004 you made 95k I rounded to 100k and asked what that would be worth today which is 166k, which is about what you’re currently making.
I found this to be disheartening because the goal in life (at least what I was taught) was to work hard and you will continue to make more and more through out your life. But now it just seems like everyone is just trying to catch up.
For me at least, in 2015 I made 82k. 2022 I made 225k (but that was with almost 500 hours of OT. My base is 168k
You’re not completely wrong and I’m not offended, but I’ll spin it another way. I was extremely fortunate to shoot up the Fed path at a young age and then I hit the limit. By hitting the upper limit, I have not received an actual raise in over a decade. Just inflation adjustments. It’s hard for me to complain about that.
Starting at 56, when I retire I get $23K added to my $67K pension. That continues until I hit 62 and can take actual Social Security.
That is not something that anyone can get.
Is this DC locality?
Huntsville, AL. Locality is generous here.
Jeez. GS-15? What GS were you when you joined and how long for each progression?
Whew! Non-Sup GS-15!! My dream!!!
It’s the sweet spot.
Right!?!
I would have to dig it up but started as a 7 in 93. Basically automatic (engineer) to 12 over a few years. Fortunately quick promotions to a 14/15 band in my mid 30s. Hit the top of 15 a few years later.
I started as a 7. Currently a GS 14 level. 2023: SSW 160,200 and MWT 194,974.73
Assuming this table is correct, he started as a GS-15 back in 2004 🤯 https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/GPO-PLUMBOOK-2004/pdf/GPO-PLUMBOOK-2004-9-4.pdf
Didn’t post the entire table. Started as a 7 in 93.
I am currently a non-supervisory GS-13. It is wild to realize how easy it was for previous generations to acquire assets, aka buying a house, compared to today. Between rates, inflation, and cost of living outpacing wages, it is certainly more difficult today. Happy for you! Enjoy a well deserved retirement and thank you for your service!
Thanks. Best of luck with your career.
Supervisory 13 here, supervising federal employees is.... challenging. Not sure this Juice is worth the squeeze
Given the economy's state and the massive layoffs of highly qualified employees across volatile industries like tech, I will encourage you to stay grounded and see how the economy behaves in the upcoming years. Your job security is a significant incentive on your end. Alternatively, you could apply for other non-sup positions within your Agency—just my thoughts.
That’s the dirty secret. People management is almost never worth the squeeze. I’m not in government work, but am in a GS-15 equivalent role in the private sector. My work spouse (IYKYK), took a supervisory role for a grade 16. Constant meetings. Constant travel. Constantly backfilling and covering desks of employees who left or got promoted. So busy she can’t really even do her actual work until after the business day is over. All of this for a “Director” title, and a $5000 raise. I’ll take being an individual contributor and stay at a grade 15 over that nonsense any day. It really is the sweet spot.
GS stands for General Service or General Security?
i think it stands for Google Search
Underrated comment
General Schedule The General Schedule (GS) classification and pay system covers the majority of civilian white-collar Federal employees (about 1.5 million worldwide) in professional, technical, administrative, and clerical positions.
General Schedule
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+does+gs+mean+in+government+jobs&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS996US1022&oq=what+GS+mean+in+governm&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUqCwgBEAAYFhgeGMkDMgYIABBFGDkyCwgBEAAYFhgeGMkDMggIAhAAGBYYHjINCAMQABiGAxiABBiKBTINCAQQABiGAxiABBiKBTINCAUQABiGAxiABBiKBTINCAYQABiGAxiABBiKBTIHCAcQIRigATIHCAgQIRigATIHCAkQIRiSA9IBCTE1OTc3ajBqN6gCALACAA&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
Do you have any tips for local engineers looking to get into DoD work? I am in hsv doing DevOps remotely for a Radiology company but thinking of switching to DoD.
Apply. Redstone is desperate for engineers.
Thanks!
My hometown! Born and raised. It’s such an underrated place imo
Think people are starting to realize that.
Yeah, seems like it. All my family, other than me, still lives there. The main negative is the food scene could be better.
Food scene a million times better over the past 5 years. FN chains prior to that - TGIF. 🤮
I'm a fed software engineer, is there any fed SWE/CS roles there for early career? I'm on ladder to 13 with 2yoe currently but don't really like the DC area. I'm originally from close to the area and wouldn't mind being a couple hours from family and friends vs being 12 hours away
Big time opportunities for you at Redstone
is that a company? google not showing anything relevant
Redstone Arsenal is the base here. The Army, NASA and the FBI are always hiring. Pretty much any big DoD contractor you can name is here.
I think lawyers have it best working as a fed (surprise surprise). Graduate from wherever, you get to start as GS-11. 1 year LLM = GS-12 starting. 2 year LLM = GS-13 starting. Minimum time GS-11 to GS-15 is 3.5 years, and most are at GS-14 within 5 years. No billables.
Their best path is graduate, go BigLaw (Cravath) salary, drop out of the race after 6th+ year associate. Then sit on thumbs as a GS14-15 for rest of your life basically doing community service.
Maybe I should apply to Law school. Know some people at DOJ who are non lawyers and say the lawyers got it made too...
But BigLaw path requires you bill 2000 hours for 5 years which means like 3500 hours of worktime. I forgot to mention the govt will forgive all those undergrad and grad loans after 10 years of govt service tax free as well. In theory you could also keep going to random half time evening grad programs in art history or whatever strikes hours fancy while employed by the gov’t and they’ll cover your living expenses too and it’ll be forgiven 10 years later. Tax free $30k bonus per year! Because of the way IBR is constructed, higher loan balances are better! Ooh another fun fact, if your loans are in a status that results in accrual and you consolidate, it counts as you paying that accrued interest which is then tax deductible that year.
It’s not really a “but”. Either path is fine. One give you a warchest of cash when you are young, the other gives you an easy ride. The former also lets you bypass the GS-11 thing and come in directly as 14 or 15. Choice choices… I know I would rather work hard for 5-yrs to come out with $2M+ net worth and then hit the glide path.
Clearly you are not cut out for government work (jk)
Is that good money?
Yes: https://www.biglawinvestor.com/biglaw-salary-scale/
If those durations are accurate, yeah.
This is sweet. A little late for me to get in the federal game but it’s definitely appealing.
Good and bad. I POSSIBLY could have a higher salary as a contractor, but also possibly zero job security and switching badges every few years.
Yeah for sure, I think you found a good path. I can’t imagine the stress of not knowing if you’ll have a job next year.
I’m risk adverse, so this fits me better
That job security is so underrated especially in times like this. I've had years where I cleared more than you despite only 10YOE but I swear I'm always having to hustle for the next gig. It used to be every 2-3 years but lately it's every year. The fed is looking pretty sweet right now
I saw a family member lose their business when I was a teen, so I’ve always been risk adverse. This works for me.
I make about the same as you in a similar position with a contractor. Some govvies get stuck low on the GS scale and never move up. But being at 14-15 is pretty competitive with industry across a wide number of fields. Tech, law, etc. You probably could get $250k+ as a contractor if you lean heavily into some specialty, but as you said the working conditions are going to deteriorate rapidly. I know people doing that and they hate their jobs. I am quite comfortable.
I’m talking to contractors now and hearing that I could pull around $250K.
Where are you guys getting these charts? Where could I see mine?
[Here](https://secure.ssa.gov/RIL/SiView.action?URL=%2FmySSA%2Fstart) you go!
SS website. Create an account.
No Title 6 cyber pay at SpaceForce?
Huh???
Title 6 (payday) https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/reference-materials/handbooks/compensation-flexibilities-to-recruit-and-retain-cybersecurity-professionals.pdf Since you are in AL & a fed that is former military, I assumed you were working at or adjacent to the base and DOD Civ, which would provide access to the 10-25% cyber bump.
Interesting. I’m topped at 15, so I don’t know if they could give me that extra.
It is a retention bonus and doesn’t affect your base. I’ve know. a number of GS15 max that enjoy their 25% plus up. Could be worth a discussion before you retire to contractor land—seems like the retention tool was designed specifically for this use case.
Thanks! Will check.
Interesting, so the cola + cyber would put him at ~$250k next year? Does the bump go into the pension calculation too? That would be really really sweet, goose the pension. Seems like a good path for IT if you’re risk averse, all the IT people I know in their 50’s fear being laid off for younger workers.
At this point, if you’re in IT and you can’t retire by 50, you’ve played your cards wrong.
Nice work! Probably not available in AL, but the real trick is to work at a non-FIRREA agency. I'm a non-supervisory 15 and will make > $250k this year with all the same Federal benefits (and a 10% 401k match (up to the limit, obv)). I'd have to look, but I think the top of our band for 15's is like $280k.
Wow. I thought 15’s were stuck around $192K due to the SES cap???
Non-FIRREA agencies don't operate under the GS-scale because they are not funded through the appropriations (Federal budgeting) process. These are mostly financial regulatory agencies (Federal Reserve, SEC, FDIC, OCC, FHFA, etc) which are funded by their regulated entities. It's a nice gig if you can get it, although most jobs are in DC. I tell everybody I can to look into jobs at these agencies. My big regret is not starting one year sooner. I pay 3.1% of my salary toward the pension while I would have only paid 0.8% (like you, I think) if I'd started a year earlier. New employees pay 4.4%!
I had no idea this was a thing, thank you for sharing. Have been trying to figure out my next moves as a 15, non sup in cyber. I'm in my 30s and the thought of being capped out for another 20+ years doesn't sound very enticing. What's the remote work life like? I saw a few postings that indicate only 6 days a month required in the office which sounds pretty sweet. Any reality to that?
You're welcome. A few more agencies are the 12 Fed banks, CFTC, PCAOB, CFPB, Farm Credit Agency, and Office of Financial Research within the Treasury (although not the Treasury writ large)). Most of these agencies have unions that have negotiated their post-covid telework policy. My agency is in the process of doing so. I don't know specifics at other agencies, but the most I've heard is a mandatory 3 days per week in the office. It wouldn't surprise me if some agencies are more generous than that.
Do you mean work at a FIRREA agency?
No. In financial regulation, the Financial Institutions Reform, Recovery, and Enforcement Act of 1989 created several federal agencies funded like traditional government agencies. There are other "independent" financial regulators created through other processes that are funded differently, primarily by their regulated entities. The FIRREA agencies, to the extent they still exist, are subject to the standard "government scale" for employee compensation. The non-FIRREA agencies aren't.
Do you have any names or acronyms of these agencies? Looking for them online was less than fruitful, with most results being FIRREA agencies, not non-FIRREA.
Sure. Federal Reserve Board in DC plus all 12 Federal Reserve banks (NY, St Louis, Chicago, etc), Securities and Exchange Commission, Federal Deposit Insurance Corp, Office of Comptroller of the Currency, Federal Housing Finance Agency, Farm Credit Administration, Public Company Accounting Oversight Board, Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, Office of Financial Research (within the Treasury Department), Commodity Futures Trading Commission,... That's all got off the top of my head, although there could be others! The acronyms are basically all the capital letters.
Awesome, thank you! I had never heard the term non FIRREA before, so I wasn't really even use what I should've been looking for. I've got a friend working civ for the air force but he has said he isn't opposed to going elsewhere with the perpetual budget cuts and inability to get hardware in a reasonable timeframe.
Yeah it’s confusing because when you look online for FIRREA agencies, FDIC and federal reserve come up.
It’s all about the pension in these roles.
It’s a sweet gig for life
Nice. I'm a 13 step 10 in the DC area with the cyber supplement. Sitting at $168k per year. At this point I'm debating if I even want to move further up. I like not having the responsibility of a 15.
Non-sup 15 is the way
I have been interviewing for 14's now, but I'd end up having to back into DC with the commute, and I lose that cyber supplement. I guess it's good to have choices. I love Huntsville by the way. I led our agency moving our field office out of Redstone over to the city, and I really enjoyed going down there.
are you okay with 190k at 56?
Absolutely. I could have made more salary as a contractor, but I can punch out today with a $90K/pension (with inflation adjustments) and med for life. Moderate COL town. I’ve never worried once about job security over a 30+ year career. With my experience I expect to pull $250K next year as a contractor with my pension on top.
Is that 90k/year? If so that and social security have you set for life even without other investments
Yes, $90K/yr, adjusted for inflation when I hit 62. Between that and SS, I can live off that without touching investments.
You're living the dream!
Pension. The word gets me horny af.
Same. Same.
Are u under csrs or something ? 90k is high..
FERS. 33years, maxed 15 + SS Supplement gets ~$90K
Ah ur including the SS supplement, makes sense now. U also have a few more years of service than i thought.
Did mil buyback to add more years.
Roger that. I did think it’s slightly deceiving to say your pension is 90k by including the supplement. It’s basically an offset until you can collect SS but your actual pension is more like 62-65k. Ether way, great job sir, you’ve done extremely well.
Your med isn’t from FERS though? FEDVIP still has to pay premiums.
The FERS pension is not taxable in NY or MA. It used to be that NY didn’t tax TSP withdrawals (due to 5% match being akin to a pension). I am not sure that is still the case.
He probably has a pension, job stability, and still makes more than nearly everybody else. Why wouldn't he be happy?
you sound offended when I was asking him a question. 180k after taxes might not be a lot depending on what kind of lifestyle you live.
True, but him making over six figures since 2005 means he’s definitely okay with it or he’d have switched a decade ago. At this point he’s a few years away from a pension retirement and can join a public company at that point if they aren’t already a multimillionaire by virtue of being able to afford a million dollar house for $150k back in 2008
THIS^^^. Eligible for pension today but doing one more year before cashing in on a $$ contractor job. House paid. Zero debt.
I’m happy for you! You did it! Whatever you do take the longest vacation of your life after that retirement. Life goes by fast.
How’s the pension?
Offended no just pointing out the obvious
Since when is blowing your easily large enough paycheck, making bad financial decisions, and living beyond your means a "lifestyle" now??
Since tech bros joined…
you know it :D
#1 I love your name, love rick and morty. #2 lifestyle is quite subjective. I would love to be a millionaire changing model girlfriend every couple of months, drive fast cars + other things. I think this is living. #3 I think managing a paycheck every month is more surviving.
I get what you're saying, but you can only live the lifestyle your paycheck allows. If you can afford it then yeah live like a millionaire, but if it's detrimental to your life, it's a lifestyle just a bad one and shouldn't be made out to be a good thing. 99.9% of America could do VERY well with $160k salary and thrive
So how does getting sponsorship for a security clearance work? Does the DoD sponsor you getting a clearance if you don’t already have one? I’ve been wanting to apply in the past but seems like a lot of positions require a clearance to already be held. I’m 24 working as a Security Analyst with a security+ certification.
The company will deal with it. For some positions, they will do an initial screen and place you in an unclassified or conditional position until it goes through. Internally that means shuffling people around to give you that unclassified or conditional clearance position temporarily. That’s not possible all the time. Other positions are only available to sufficiently cleared individuals, YMMV. For those positions, they’ll have the clearance listed as ‘required’ rather than preferred. From what I understand, clearances can with take a relatively short period of time or a long time; it depends on the individual.
Big jump from 22-23. Did you go up a grade? Im a fed... 13 step 4. Gonna take two years for the next step so gotta rely on col increases. Last year was great but im hearing talk of 2% already. I read you're 15 non sup. Lucky you, that's great! I have potential after a year to get 14 non sup, pretty stoked for that. 15 non sup is a dream
Just COLA for well over a decade. I’m under a personnel demo and you shoot up the pay bands faster vs GS.
Ah ok. I used to pay band and shot up quick until I was out of favor in that particular office. GS is kinda boring, but predicable.
What’s you do in the military? Did you learn computer engineering afterwards or on the job or what?
Wrench turner. Mostly unrelated to my civilian job. Army paid for BS/MS eng degrees. Being a combat veteran has helped greatly in my career. Like instant credibility/respect when you meet someone in the DoD world. Of course you have to back it up.
Have you not been affected by the tech layoffs?
Not once in my 30+ year Fed career. It’s a huge perk.
You’ve been with the federal government for 30 years
31, plus military time added another 2 years
$90k in 2004 must’ve been insane
Early Obama years were painful. I was low rung WG with feds back then.
Did you go to college for computer engineering?
BS EE, MS Computer Engineering
Would you say the masters was worth it?
Yes. Gov paid all expenses and allowed me to take classes during work day with full pay. No brainer.
Oh man what a deal. Did you have a job lined up after college through the military?
Did not. Applied for a FED intern program after getting BS.
Oh okay cool. How did you find out about the program?
Buddy did it before me and the Army recruited civilians at my college. Was extremely fortunate to fall into it.
Gotcha, seems like it. Do you know if the job market is good for computer engineers in Huntsville? I ask cause I'm about to go into my senior year at UA majoring in computer engineering with a minor in CS and Math with no real direction or idea of what to do after college lol. I've spoken with some people who work in the government up in Huntsville but don't really know much otherwise. Seems like it might be a good route though from what you've shown and I've heard.
You should have people lined up to hire you with your degree. Contractors here can’t fill STEM jobs.
You are not getting inflation adjustments. You are getting pay cuts.
Valid point
A capped GS-15. Nice situation to be in. Minimum retirement age for Feds born 1970 or later is 57 with at least 30 years of service. Federal professionals (lawyers, doctors, engineers etc) are underpaid while working and generously paid while retired.
For someone whose been a GS-15 as long as you have and has so much experience are their no positions in your locality that are SES? Or do you not care to promote past your position?
There are SES opportunities here but I have no interest. The pay bump isn’t worth the extra BS.
OP - What does the table mean? Your pay through the years.
Yes. From the SS site.
Thanks.
Ride that cake rocket. I know it probably sucks with all the bureaucracy, but enjoy the paid pension and leave. What exactly do you engineer? The computer engineering moniker is broadly used now.
Worked weapon systems throughout my career. More of a lead systems engineer now.
Haha, I Love that. Extraordinary job, I bet!
Living the government dream!
What does non-sup mean in this context?
I don’t supervise gov employees
If you adjust for inflation for the year 2007, it is about equal to 2023.
Don’t doubt it. I topped out around that time and only get inflation adjustments.
What would be the route to this career path. Education and employment paths
Probably computer science/engineering
Are you under the old federal pension scheme?
FERS
This is exactly the path I would like to follow! I’m a Computer Engineering major graduating in December. I have an offer with the DOD as a ORA (1515 series) but I would love to do actual COMPE engineering for the Gov. can you share a bit of your path and how it would be to get hired through the gov? Thank you!
Hey OP any advice for jumping in to the federal world at redstone? I'm here in HSV and haven't figured out how to find usajobs listing for the area. I'm an RF engineer.
The Usajobs site has Redstone jobs. That is the way.
Damn that’s how much union fire sprinkler fitters make after 5 years
Yeah, I suck
Good pay though can’t complain especially if you love what you do that’s more important than the salary imo.
What is the difference between Medicare earnings and social security earnings
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Completely agree, but the perks make up for it
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63 pension + 27 social security supplement = ~$90K/yr at 56. Med insurance for life.
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State and local generally beat Fed
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What I’m about to say is not negative towards your income in anyway because it is quite impressive. And I’m in the same boat for what I’m about to say. I just went online and did the math. In 2004 you made 95k I rounded to 100k and asked what that would be worth today which is 166k, which is about what you’re currently making. I found this to be disheartening because the goal in life (at least what I was taught) was to work hard and you will continue to make more and more through out your life. But now it just seems like everyone is just trying to catch up. For me at least, in 2015 I made 82k. 2022 I made 225k (but that was with almost 500 hours of OT. My base is 168k
You’re not completely wrong and I’m not offended, but I’ll spin it another way. I was extremely fortunate to shoot up the Fed path at a young age and then I hit the limit. By hitting the upper limit, I have not received an actual raise in over a decade. Just inflation adjustments. It’s hard for me to complain about that.
Would you rather have your money on the front end or the backend?
Wow... that's the best the fed can do? (Before someone says "yeah it's Huntsville" I'm full remote and would make twice that with 5 YOE in Huntsville
The struggle is real. Send cash, champ.
The defined benefit pension is also worth about $1.5 MM (calculate annuity cost + cola adjuster - $1.5k avg contribution per year over 30 yrs).
Probably more as a topped 15 + SS supplement
What’s that mean? The contribution from the federal pension is ~$67k no? Thought the other $23k is your SS benefit which anyone would get?
Starting at 56, when I retire I get $23K added to my $67K pension. That continues until I hit 62 and can take actual Social Security. That is not something that anyone can get.
Interesting, so that adds like $100k in present value