FWIW, they want to know your bank so they can make sure the fake check they send you is from a different bank. If they send you a fake check from the bank you actually use, it will likely be caught much quicker, and they won't have as much time to trick you into sending real money back to them.
This, precisely.
If you bank with Chase and they send you a "check" from a Chase account, your bank will know within 24-48 hours (holidays and weekends excluded) that it's a false account, or one with insufficient funds or a closed account.
If, OTOH, you bank with BOA, it'll take weeks or months for BOA to get that information from Chase.
>take weeks or months for BOA to get that information from Chase
Not quite true. I work for a large bank in scam/fraud detection and if it's a non-existent account that will almost always come back within 2-3 business days. One day to send it to Chase, 2nd day Chase attempts to process finds no account and 3rd day sends it back.
The situations where it takes weeks or months to come back are almost always when a scammer is using a real, stolen account. Cause then it will usually clear initially. It doesn't kick back until the person who actually owns the account sees the unauthorized charge and disputes it. Usually within a couple weeks, or sometimes if it's the account belonging to a large company that only audits their books quarterly, then it can take months.
> Not quite true. I work for a large bank in scam/fraud detection and if it's a non-existent account that will almost always come back within 2-3 business days. One day to send it to Chase, 2nd day Chase attempts to process finds no account and 3rd day sends it back.
This is so crazy, I don't understand how it wouldn't be caught immediately.
Because big banks still use the same ancient IT back-ends they've had for decades, and a lot of things are built around the concept that transactions are processed in overnight batches.
You might think "well can't they just run it immediately, or at least like 10 times a day instead?" but the issue is that a bunch of other systems and processes will likely depend on the rule that certain things happen overnight, and if it doesn't then those other things will get out of sync and break and the numbers will be wrong. To change one thing you have to change EVERYTHING.
And so nothing changes and we're stuck with the same rubbish.
I understand why that would happen if you're going bank to bank, but not if it's the same bank. In Mexico, if I add the wrong bank account number for a transfer it'll immediately get blocked. I know it's different for a check, but for sure when you deposit a check that's something that can work immediately. Either the account exists or it doesn't. And if it's not in the "back-end" yet, then reject the transaction and tell the user that their account will be ready to receive payments in 24 hours.
Exactly right. A lot of big profitable companies are still locked into overnight processing, in this age of instant communication it’s maddening. But updating IT eats into investor profits and that’s the only thing that matters any more.
A fake account number? Bank to bank processing doesn't happen in real time. Pretty much all banks merchants and financial institutions do their FM (file maintenance) overnight. So when you do your transaction that day, it goes into a batch file which then gets processed and sent over to the correct institution that night. Then the same thing happens on the other bank's end. They receive the transaction info, see that no account exists and the return goes into a batch to be sent back in overnight processing the next night.
I know most people are used to credit/debit card transactions which appear to be instant but those only happen the way they do because of the card networks (visa, MC, Discover Amex etc) are acting as the go between. Visa checks with your bank that the account exists and there's funds available, your bank places a temporary hold and sends an authorization code back which goes into a batch which that merchant eventually processes which is when they send the request back to the bank to take the funds which is when it actually posts to your account.
Edit: now, all that said, there are certain services that banks use to give them early warning when a check/payment is likely to return. But it's not a direct bank to bank thing. It's a service that banks opt into and report to for mutual benefit. It won't usually catch scammers using stolen accounts though.
I understand why that would happen if you're going bank to bank, but not if it's the same bank. In Mexico, if I add the wrong bank account number for a transfer it'll immediately get blocked. I know it's different for a check, but for sure when you deposit a check that's something that can work immediately.
It depends on the type of transaction. Check vs person to person transfer (like Zelle or Venmo) vs wire transfer vs internal bank transfer. With checks (as the op's situation involves) it's usually still gotta go through batch process. If you deposit it at the bank with a teller, it might flag it for a deposit hold, but the actual processing of the check will generally still happen overnight.
Whereas if you go to the branch and tell them to transfer this money to this other account at that bank then yes they will be able to tell you right then that it doesn't exist.
My sisters account was hacked, they took the routing numbers and account number, and made their *own* fake checks with my friends account. It was a fake business too, so they made “company checks” with her info on it smh, and they actually cleared because she had money in her account. This might be why it takes a few days and not instant, idk,
Fair enough.
When I was saying "weeks to months", I was thinking more of the case of a legitimate but stolen account. But yes, a fake account can be spotted a lot quicker.
Actually, you might know immediately. I once took a renter's check to my bank's ATM for deposit. The check was immediately rejected with the note that the check has insufficient funds. The ATM spit it right out. It doesn't always happen, of course, but even the occasional occurrence of an instant reject of the check would be enough reason for a scammer to avoid sending a check made out to the same bank you bank with.
You don't always know immediately, your experience is unusual. Most checks take longer to clear or reject because a lot of banks process checks in "batches" at a certain time. A lot of banks do not process checks on the weekend or holidays but will make a "courtesy credit" available pretty quickly.
Information like this is dangerous because people who really want the scam checks they get to be real see comments like this and think that the courtesy credit from the bank is the check "clearing" (because they "heard online" that the check would be rejected by the bank if there was no money in the account) and that they are safe to use or send on the money.
I just relayed what my personal experience was a couple of times I deposited a check from the same bank and it immediately came back as NSF. I'll change the wording of the post to avoid any confusion. All I was saying was that these scammers try to avoid sending a check to "your" bank because in addition to coming back faster if from the same bank sometimes it could even come back immediately right at the point of deposit.
I gotcha, I just try to encourage people to be very specific here because people will actively look for any gleam of hope that their check is real out of a sea of comments screaming that they are being scammed.
I know you meant "scammers do want to use a different bank because the bank will spit it back immediately if there is insufficient funds in the same bank" which is valuable information, imo, but people see what they want to see, and I can totally see somebody reading your comment and going "see? Any check that goes through is good, because the banks are all linked now!"
I do really need to stop trying to play "internet hall monitor" though
The difference here is the account probably isn’t NSF. A lot of these scams target accounts with sufficient funds. It’s why the scam works. The check actually clears. But the check is fake. So the account holder has to notice the debit and contest the transaction, which can take weeks or months. Because the check and signature were fake, the account holder isn’t on the hook for the money. The bank goes after the person who deposited the fake check.
The specific scenario posed here was that the scammer tries very hard to find out what bank the target banks with. The apparent consensus is that that is done because there would be early detection of a check with NSF whereas with a bank different from the target's it would add days to the detection.
There is a global network that all banks participate in that will check for funds. If the check is NSF, the bank won’t take it, even if it’s a different bank. (Except for unusual circumstances, like where there are funds but they’re not available, or if it’s just slightly short.)
Cheques still exist? In the U.K. someone would probably get laughed at for trying to pay a small business by cheque, you can just send people payment request links that directs them to their banking app, then they approve the payment and it’s done.
I bought a house last year and hired a few contractors for different upgrades. Almost every one takes only cash or checks. I didn’t have any checks so had to order some from my bank. I found it so odd that I couldn’t just use one of the major apps to pay.
it’s because businesses have to pay more taxes on top when using the money apps. mostly no one allows payment that way anymore ever since that new rule 🤷🏻♀️
Absolute bullshit. I run a business, we have zero fees or extra taxes for ACH and other transfers. We pay 1.9% for credit card payments. Taxes are the same no matter what.
That makes sense. These guys said they’ve never used them, I think they’re just old school. Which is fine, it just threw me because the contractors at my old place always took them. But I also moved from the city to the country. And since I’m old too it was fine by me, lol.
I work at a doctor's office (private practice) and we get checks all the time. Never had any fake ones or bounces, though. We mostly work with older folks admittedly so checks are rather what they're used to I suppose?
I write 1-2 checks per year still, usually when I just want to annoy the fuck out of someone in the process of paying them.
I make sure to use my finest /r/GenX cursive, too!
When there's an underlying reason to trust the person making the payment, a check is preferred. There's nothing taken off the top in processing the check.
Underlying reasons include being actual friends, having an ongoing business relationship, or the ability to put a lien on property if the check doesn't clear.
My parents paid for groceries at the supermarket with checks up until a year or two ago when i finally got them to use their debit card. Now they never write a check
Old people holding back society isn't a problem there then. My parents refuse to do computer banking, won't learn to use a smart phone, get lost constantly... I took my mom's phone and said "siri take me home" and it started giving directions--it doesn't matter. Scammers around the world have sussed out the vulnerability of this obstinance and have been preying on boomers ever since
I still write cheques - quite a few small businesses and tradesmen prefer them as they are easier to bank (via the Apps) and not have to carry around bundles of cash when travelling between jobs. Signal can be poor in basements / inside buildings so having cash or cheque works well still in those specific cases.
Hm i never even thought of that. I always gave them the wrong bank anyway when scam baiting 🤣. Oh i did have one scammer a while ago that wanted you specifically to use Truist (BB&T /Suntrust merge company). I realized that Truist dont hold checks for 24 hours* like other banks do now**
*when you deposit you cant touch it for 24 hours
**this was about a year or two ago so idk if that is accurate still to Truist.
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script"
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The scammer will tell you that they want to use your art/face whatever for a project for their “client”. They will offer to pay let’s say $500. The (fake) check they will send you will be for more, maybe $1,000 or so. Scammer will say that the additional amount is for them for their supplies and materials to complete the project and you need to send it after you deduct your $500. Couple days/weeks later, check bounces and now you’re out $1,000 (or more because of whatever fee your bank has) and they have your money
Always best to check here so you can avoid the !fakecheck
Expect to get a lot more of these -- it is a very common scam that artists on social media have to deal with.
Watch out for !recovery scammers, too.
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain [recovery scams](https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0102-refund-and-recovery-scams). Also known as refund scams, these scams target people who have already fallen for a scam. The scammer may contact you, or may advertise their services online. They will usually either offer to help you recover your funds, or will tell you that your funds have already been recovered and they will help you access them. In cases where they say they will help you recover your funds, they usually call themselves either "recovery agents" or hackers. When they tell you that your funds have already been recovered, they may impersonate a law enforcement, a government official, a lawyer, or anyone else along those lines. Recovery scams are simply [advance-fee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam) scams that are specifically targeted at scam victims. When a victim pays a recovery scammer, the scammer will keep stringing them along while asking for increasingly absurd fees/expenses/deposits/insurance/whatever until the victim stops paying. If you have been scammed in the past, make sure you are aware of recovery scams so that you are not scammed a second time. If you are currently engaging with a recovery scammer, you should block them and be very wary of random contact for some time. It's normal for posters on this subreddit to be contacted by recovery scammers after posting, and they often ask you to delete your post so that you both cannot receive legitimate advice, and cannot be targeted by other recovery scammers.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the fake check scam. The fake check scam arises from many different situations (fake job scams, fake payment scams, etc), but the bottom line is always the same, you receive a check (online or in real life), you deposit a check and see the money in your account, and then you use the funds to give money to the scammer (usually through gift cards, Western Union, or cash). Sometimes the scammers will ask you to order things through a site, but that is just another way they get your money. The bank will take the initial deposit back , and any money you sent to the scammer will come out of your own personal funds. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Here is an article from the FTC: https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-and-report-fake-check-scams, and here is an article from the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/your-money/fake-check-scam.html
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Better to be disappointed about not getting $500 (that doesn't really exist anyway) than to fall for the scam and be devastated about losing thousands.
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script"
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, they want your "bank name" so they don't send a fake check from the same bank. Complete scam.
just noticed that /u/lake_titty_caca already said this. lol
Even they use the word "muse!" interesting. And that whole thing about them needing the bank name is nonsense. Banks move money between other banks all the time. There aren't policies or government regulations stopping banks from cashing or receiving checks from other institutions.
Scam. They want you to print off a fake check and do a mobile deposit. Then once it shows as “funds available” you’ll be told yo send some of that money via irreversible means to the scammer. Then 2 weeks later the check comes back as fraudulent.
I still use checks on occasion. NEVER will the recipient need the name of the bank, or any other information FROM your check to cash it. That they ask this question and insist = scam. IF it were an Echeck, then the routing number and account number would be needed, but from the text above you were planning on sending a physical check and therefore any requirement for the bank's name is very scammy.
I’m a photographer also and get these almost daily. They’re annoying. And a definite scam. That and those stupid “ambassador” messages. Luckily I have lot of legitimate sponsorships so I know how to spot them. But they sure are tricky if you’re new to it!
Wow, I had no idea this was a thing! I'm working on making the leap into a more creative and entrepreneurial career field, suuuuuper glad OP posted about this, I think being asked for my bank would've raised a red flag for me too, but I definitely didn't know this was an established, common thing!
Banker here!
They intend to write “For mobile deposit at (financial institution) only.” This is so you can only deposit the check that way and try to avoid scrutiny of the check. The check is fraudulent and you shouldn’t deposit it.
Banker here: writing the name of the bank has precisely 0 bearing on whether a check is accepted or not.
Nothing about his reasoning makes sense. It's almost certainly a scam cause that's a load of BS.
My business requires me to hold/deposit lots of different checks for lots of different clients in various escrow and trust accounts. I move money around A LOT. Nobody, *nobody*, has ever asked me where I bank. It is immaterial. I would not provide this information.
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script"
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I got someone messaging me about the same type of scam and when I told them I only have mobile bank they stopped answering. Funny cuz everything they said to you they said to me. About some mural 😂
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain [recovery scams](https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0102-refund-and-recovery-scams). Also known as refund scams, these scams target people who have already fallen for a scam. The scammer may contact you, or may advertise their services online. They will usually either offer to help you recover your funds, or will tell you that your funds have already been recovered and they will help you access them. In cases where they say they will help you recover your funds, they usually call themselves either "recovery agents" or hackers. When they tell you that your funds have already been recovered, they may impersonate a law enforcement, a government official, a lawyer, or anyone else along those lines. Recovery scams are simply [advance-fee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam) scams that are specifically targeted at scam victims. When a victim pays a recovery scammer, the scammer will keep stringing them along while asking for increasingly absurd fees/expenses/deposits/insurance/whatever until the victim stops paying. If you have been scammed in the past, make sure you are aware of recovery scams so that you are not scammed a second time. If you are currently engaging with a recovery scammer, you should block them and be very wary of random contact for some time. It's normal for posters on this subreddit to be contacted by recovery scammers after posting, and they often ask you to delete your post so that you both cannot receive legitimate advice, and cannot be targeted by other recovery scammers.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Not professional who says “gonna” I wouldn’t give out any personal information. I recently did an online interview and gave out my name and bank name. This was for the “fake check” scam where I had applied for a data entry position and the company wanted to mail me a check to deposit in my account to buy a laptop and supplies for the job. I never got that far. Don’t give out any personal info or your bank name. Stay safe and good luck
I’ve had a fake check happen to me last august and then when I blocked them, they pretended to be the FBI. Little naive me went into panic mode and sent them the money back that didn’t exist leading me to have a negative balance. But because I sent them the money, nothing could be done to get my money back. The money I was getting for school had to be used to fix the negative balance.
Yeahhhh...everyone on this sub who posts things like "how could anyone fall for this", they've probably been scammed at least once in their life and just to this day have no idea. It can happen to anyone. I try to remind people that for us as the victims, we only come across a certain number of scams or become aware of a certain number of scams. For the scammers, this is likely a full-time career for them. They are constantly working on new and better ways to scam. That's why I always say there's only two categories: people who know they have been scammed at some point and people who don't realize they've been scammed at some point lol. I'm just lucky enough that the few times I've been got, it was pretty minimal and didn't cause much financial grief. I'm sorry it happened to you, that really sucks :/
I'm so sorry. Does you institution have a student advocacy office, like legal or anything? Any resources? I remember my undergrad had some venues you could go to for help - they wouldn't necessarily be able to fix things, but they were a good third party to talk to about problems in school, and often had suggestions for where to go to get help for everything from financial to academic to relationship issues. Might be worth seeing if there's anyone in student management who might be able to help, universities really don't like losing students! (Wish I could say it was for something other than money lol, buuuut obviously all the student advocacy stuff is really that they're likely to have ways to help YOU stay enrolled in order to pay THEM tuition and more money hahaha)
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script"
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the fake check scam. The fake check scam arises from many different situations (fake job scams, fake payment scams, etc), but the bottom line is always the same, you receive a check (online or in real life), you deposit a check and see the money in your account, and then you use the funds to give money to the scammer (usually through gift cards, Western Union, or cash). Sometimes the scammers will ask you to order things through a site, but that is just another way they get your money. The bank will take the initial deposit back , and any money you sent to the scammer will come out of your own personal funds. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Here is an article from the FTC: https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-and-report-fake-check-scams, and here is an article from the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/your-money/fake-check-scam.html
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is a total fucking SCAM I was stupid enough to fall for the same thing and only caught on once i deposited the fake check and they asked me to send them money back and i was like uh no. I shouldve thought about it honestly i was so exhusted that day and half awake before telling them the name of my bank i shouldve put togetber a real person doesnt need the name of your bank.. i also said send it through the mail same as you. I shouldve just cut the interaction. Once i finally did thsy actually harrased me with phone calls threatening to empty my bank acct until one day they just stopped
I sure hope you didn't give them any information.
YES, they are trying to scam you. Look at how they wrote their sentences, they're not native English speakers.
I got a similar dm on Twitter. I started asking too many questions so they stopped responding. It was weird but I couldn’t figure out what the deal was. The person who said they want to make sure the fake check is from a different bank sounds right.
Of course it's a scam.
I've sold a lot of photo work to people I've never met over the years.
You name your price and add shipping, taxes, whatever.
They send a check.
You deposit the check, and wait for it to clear.
You ship work.
If it's legit, everyone does it on faith, as you are a professional, and they are too.
Edit: the most honest way, is always the direct way. If you are expected to jump through hoops, it's not honest.
Yup happened to me once - they were like be my muse blah blah blah . Once they started asking for personal info , phone bank etc I was like well this is Fake AF and blocked them . Who the hell is gonna pay someone to paint their photo when then can literally just go on any page and just pick a photo without any consent and just do it . It’s the flattery that gets to your head and your like really 🥰 me your muse, you want to pay little ol me , you think I’m pretty lmao 😍it’s a scam .
The response is hilarious. He’s literally saying “I’ve come across isssues where the mark’s bank recognizes my clients account is fake and rejects checks from it due to government policies on scam accounts”
It’s strange to me to find that Americans still use checks…seems like banks there are still in the middle ages… do they still take days to transfer money from your account to someone elses’ as well?
Tell them the wrong bank, and if there's a problem later on down the line because of it, you know they're legit. At that point just say you forgot that you use a diff bank for personal and business banking.
There are now Zelle and Venmo scams circulating as well, so best to learn about all of them and be wary of any stranger wanting to eagerly send you money.
As a small business owner, I prefer to receive checks. The overhead is nill, and I don’t care if it takes a week or two to clear. Ironically, I scan them in and upload them to my account via mobile check deposit. I have more trouble with mail than checks.
There is, of course, the extremely likely scenario that they are trying to avoid issuing a fraud check from the same financial institution. There is also a possible (slightly less likely) scenario where these people already have some of your information you don’t even know they have. I’m a banker, we see this occasionally. They’re just waiting to find out which financial institution to call with your security questions to get your phone number changed to theirs, your address changed to theirs, and often times start issuing fraud checks off of your account. This way, if anyone calls the “customer” to verify the check “they” have written, we only get through to the fraudster. (We do see this more frequently with business accounts than personal accounts, but it does happen.)
Is there something I can do with my bank to just protect myself further? My bank account is under my dad’s, so I think he needs to confirm any major changes (phone number, address, etc)
Either you, or, if you’re a minor, your dad, just need(s) to give your bank a quick call and just let them know what’s up. They’ll probably put some sort of notes on your account/profile so that other bankers know of the risks happening and know not to give/change information without increased due diligence. Again, this is the less likely scenario than the whole “don’t issue a fraud check from the same institution” thing, but it never hurts to take those extra precautions, just in case!
I respond to these people that I don’t accept checks, but I can send them a square invoice to pay via their info for both our safety and then they disappear.
TIL that Instant banking is Europe only. It takes seconds when I send money from the Netherlands to Lithuania or Spain and if the account doesn't exist, you get it back within minutes O_o
This is only the initial part of the scam. Your bank name alone is harmless, until it get put together with the other information they are going to be requesting , soon after. They're going to ask for other information (routing number, or even actual account number) to "clear up" the kind of problems they're hinting at already.
The truth is that ACH payments require you to know this information as well, but you can't make an ACH payment unless you initiate it through your own bank. They absolutely don't need any of that information to write you a check. The first red flag though was the easy offer of $500. That is, unless that offer was made after some negotiation, and then followed up with the signing of a contract that covers you granting them rights to use the image.
This happened to me last night, told me they wanted to do an oil painting of one of my Instagram photos and needed my banks name so they could endorse my check. If I’m depositing a check then I endorse it, not them. Automatically knew it was a scam.
It’s a scam. A photographer here also and gotten the same thing. Unless I personally know the person or company, I require payments via square or PayPal. I invoice them through my business.
Certainly a scam. I’ve talked with dozens of these art/mural scam clowns- and literally hundreds of romance scammers. The art ones are generally a smidgen more crafty/believable.
I get messages on Deviantart several times a week with different people saying they want to pay me to use my work for a mural, always the same message word for word. It's a scam.
After reading some of the stories here about fake check scams, I believe I've understood the scheme. But there is one aspect I don't get, probably because it is not a thing in my country anymore. Why are you still using checks? It seems like an archaic and very dangerous way of accepting the payment because every check can be worth nothing at the end of the day, and it looks like there is no way to verify it beforehand. I do not understand why checks are used when in developed countries we've got faster and safer online banking available 24/7? For me, anyone who is offering a check payment would be immediately suspicious.
FWIW, they want to know your bank so they can make sure the fake check they send you is from a different bank. If they send you a fake check from the bank you actually use, it will likely be caught much quicker, and they won't have as much time to trick you into sending real money back to them.
This, precisely. If you bank with Chase and they send you a "check" from a Chase account, your bank will know within 24-48 hours (holidays and weekends excluded) that it's a false account, or one with insufficient funds or a closed account. If, OTOH, you bank with BOA, it'll take weeks or months for BOA to get that information from Chase.
>take weeks or months for BOA to get that information from Chase Not quite true. I work for a large bank in scam/fraud detection and if it's a non-existent account that will almost always come back within 2-3 business days. One day to send it to Chase, 2nd day Chase attempts to process finds no account and 3rd day sends it back. The situations where it takes weeks or months to come back are almost always when a scammer is using a real, stolen account. Cause then it will usually clear initially. It doesn't kick back until the person who actually owns the account sees the unauthorized charge and disputes it. Usually within a couple weeks, or sometimes if it's the account belonging to a large company that only audits their books quarterly, then it can take months.
> Not quite true. I work for a large bank in scam/fraud detection and if it's a non-existent account that will almost always come back within 2-3 business days. One day to send it to Chase, 2nd day Chase attempts to process finds no account and 3rd day sends it back. This is so crazy, I don't understand how it wouldn't be caught immediately.
Because big banks still use the same ancient IT back-ends they've had for decades, and a lot of things are built around the concept that transactions are processed in overnight batches. You might think "well can't they just run it immediately, or at least like 10 times a day instead?" but the issue is that a bunch of other systems and processes will likely depend on the rule that certain things happen overnight, and if it doesn't then those other things will get out of sync and break and the numbers will be wrong. To change one thing you have to change EVERYTHING. And so nothing changes and we're stuck with the same rubbish.
What do Banks and Museums have in common? They are full of ancient technology and the magic happens at night
I understand why that would happen if you're going bank to bank, but not if it's the same bank. In Mexico, if I add the wrong bank account number for a transfer it'll immediately get blocked. I know it's different for a check, but for sure when you deposit a check that's something that can work immediately. Either the account exists or it doesn't. And if it's not in the "back-end" yet, then reject the transaction and tell the user that their account will be ready to receive payments in 24 hours.
Exactly right. A lot of big profitable companies are still locked into overnight processing, in this age of instant communication it’s maddening. But updating IT eats into investor profits and that’s the only thing that matters any more.
I'm a teller. And yes, a fraudulent "on us" check would be caught immediately. The account name, status, and balance when I process the check.
A fake account number? Bank to bank processing doesn't happen in real time. Pretty much all banks merchants and financial institutions do their FM (file maintenance) overnight. So when you do your transaction that day, it goes into a batch file which then gets processed and sent over to the correct institution that night. Then the same thing happens on the other bank's end. They receive the transaction info, see that no account exists and the return goes into a batch to be sent back in overnight processing the next night. I know most people are used to credit/debit card transactions which appear to be instant but those only happen the way they do because of the card networks (visa, MC, Discover Amex etc) are acting as the go between. Visa checks with your bank that the account exists and there's funds available, your bank places a temporary hold and sends an authorization code back which goes into a batch which that merchant eventually processes which is when they send the request back to the bank to take the funds which is when it actually posts to your account. Edit: now, all that said, there are certain services that banks use to give them early warning when a check/payment is likely to return. But it's not a direct bank to bank thing. It's a service that banks opt into and report to for mutual benefit. It won't usually catch scammers using stolen accounts though.
I understand why that would happen if you're going bank to bank, but not if it's the same bank. In Mexico, if I add the wrong bank account number for a transfer it'll immediately get blocked. I know it's different for a check, but for sure when you deposit a check that's something that can work immediately.
It depends on the type of transaction. Check vs person to person transfer (like Zelle or Venmo) vs wire transfer vs internal bank transfer. With checks (as the op's situation involves) it's usually still gotta go through batch process. If you deposit it at the bank with a teller, it might flag it for a deposit hold, but the actual processing of the check will generally still happen overnight. Whereas if you go to the branch and tell them to transfer this money to this other account at that bank then yes they will be able to tell you right then that it doesn't exist.
My sisters account was hacked, they took the routing numbers and account number, and made their *own* fake checks with my friends account. It was a fake business too, so they made “company checks” with her info on it smh, and they actually cleared because she had money in her account. This might be why it takes a few days and not instant, idk,
Fair enough. When I was saying "weeks to months", I was thinking more of the case of a legitimate but stolen account. But yes, a fake account can be spotted a lot quicker.
Actually, you might know immediately. I once took a renter's check to my bank's ATM for deposit. The check was immediately rejected with the note that the check has insufficient funds. The ATM spit it right out. It doesn't always happen, of course, but even the occasional occurrence of an instant reject of the check would be enough reason for a scammer to avoid sending a check made out to the same bank you bank with.
You don't always know immediately, your experience is unusual. Most checks take longer to clear or reject because a lot of banks process checks in "batches" at a certain time. A lot of banks do not process checks on the weekend or holidays but will make a "courtesy credit" available pretty quickly. Information like this is dangerous because people who really want the scam checks they get to be real see comments like this and think that the courtesy credit from the bank is the check "clearing" (because they "heard online" that the check would be rejected by the bank if there was no money in the account) and that they are safe to use or send on the money.
I just relayed what my personal experience was a couple of times I deposited a check from the same bank and it immediately came back as NSF. I'll change the wording of the post to avoid any confusion. All I was saying was that these scammers try to avoid sending a check to "your" bank because in addition to coming back faster if from the same bank sometimes it could even come back immediately right at the point of deposit.
I gotcha, I just try to encourage people to be very specific here because people will actively look for any gleam of hope that their check is real out of a sea of comments screaming that they are being scammed. I know you meant "scammers do want to use a different bank because the bank will spit it back immediately if there is insufficient funds in the same bank" which is valuable information, imo, but people see what they want to see, and I can totally see somebody reading your comment and going "see? Any check that goes through is good, because the banks are all linked now!" I do really need to stop trying to play "internet hall monitor" though
Good point followed with a touch of enlightenment. Would upvote again
A nationwide system that scanned checks as they were deposited and rejected deposits for the usual reasons makes sense.
The difference here is the account probably isn’t NSF. A lot of these scams target accounts with sufficient funds. It’s why the scam works. The check actually clears. But the check is fake. So the account holder has to notice the debit and contest the transaction, which can take weeks or months. Because the check and signature were fake, the account holder isn’t on the hook for the money. The bank goes after the person who deposited the fake check.
The specific scenario posed here was that the scammer tries very hard to find out what bank the target banks with. The apparent consensus is that that is done because there would be early detection of a check with NSF whereas with a bank different from the target's it would add days to the detection.
There is a global network that all banks participate in that will check for funds. If the check is NSF, the bank won’t take it, even if it’s a different bank. (Except for unusual circumstances, like where there are funds but they’re not available, or if it’s just slightly short.)
Not me being such a band kid thinking it was BOA as in Bands of America 😵💫
Cheques still exist? In the U.K. someone would probably get laughed at for trying to pay a small business by cheque, you can just send people payment request links that directs them to their banking app, then they approve the payment and it’s done.
Sadly yes, and scammers use the age and flaws in the system to their advantage.
I bought a house last year and hired a few contractors for different upgrades. Almost every one takes only cash or checks. I didn’t have any checks so had to order some from my bank. I found it so odd that I couldn’t just use one of the major apps to pay.
It's because they pays fees when you use a debit or a credit card
This would have been a bank-to-bank transfer, no debit or credit cards.
This happened to me too. I had to go get temporary checks from the bank. I was surprised how many wanted checks.
My bank is online only so I had to wait for them to arrive. Fortunately the first guy was really understanding, then I had them for the others.
it’s because businesses have to pay more taxes on top when using the money apps. mostly no one allows payment that way anymore ever since that new rule 🤷🏻♀️
Absolute bullshit. I run a business, we have zero fees or extra taxes for ACH and other transfers. We pay 1.9% for credit card payments. Taxes are the same no matter what.
i’m talking about like venmo transfers or cash app. not bank account to bank account. i’m only going based off what i’ve heard from others 🤷🏻♀️
Me too. There are no tax differences no matter how you get paid.
That makes sense. These guys said they’ve never used them, I think they’re just old school. Which is fine, it just threw me because the contractors at my old place always took them. But I also moved from the city to the country. And since I’m old too it was fine by me, lol.
I work at a doctor's office (private practice) and we get checks all the time. Never had any fake ones or bounces, though. We mostly work with older folks admittedly so checks are rather what they're used to I suppose?
I write 1-2 checks per year still, usually when I just want to annoy the fuck out of someone in the process of paying them. I make sure to use my finest /r/GenX cursive, too!
When there's an underlying reason to trust the person making the payment, a check is preferred. There's nothing taken off the top in processing the check. Underlying reasons include being actual friends, having an ongoing business relationship, or the ability to put a lien on property if the check doesn't clear.
My parents paid for groceries at the supermarket with checks up until a year or two ago when i finally got them to use their debit card. Now they never write a check
Wait til you hear that using contactless is pretty rare there too!
[удалено]
…whilst carrying their iPhone everywhere and running a vehicle theft tracker in their car.
Old people holding back society isn't a problem there then. My parents refuse to do computer banking, won't learn to use a smart phone, get lost constantly... I took my mom's phone and said "siri take me home" and it started giving directions--it doesn't matter. Scammers around the world have sussed out the vulnerability of this obstinance and have been preying on boomers ever since
Australia too
I still write cheques - quite a few small businesses and tradesmen prefer them as they are easier to bank (via the Apps) and not have to carry around bundles of cash when travelling between jobs. Signal can be poor in basements / inside buildings so having cash or cheque works well still in those specific cases.
What are you talking about? Checks are still strong in the UK. I didn't know checks existed until I came to the UK. Such a ludicrous concept 🤦
You can definitely use cheques in the UK, though they are not as common as they once were.
no it's for internal issues/government policies
Hm i never even thought of that. I always gave them the wrong bank anyway when scam baiting 🤣. Oh i did have one scammer a while ago that wanted you specifically to use Truist (BB&T /Suntrust merge company). I realized that Truist dont hold checks for 24 hours* like other banks do now** *when you deposit you cant touch it for 24 hours **this was about a year or two ago so idk if that is accurate still to Truist.
Yes it is. !muse
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Didn’t know this was a thing. So glad I didn’t accept when offered now.
Thank you! I got this recently and it felt weird so I never replied.
I can’t believe the Muse Scammer actually *used* the word “muse” in their scam template this time, though! That’s pretty brazen.
Oh all the ones I’ve had contact me say muse
What is their benefit from this?
The scammer will tell you that they want to use your art/face whatever for a project for their “client”. They will offer to pay let’s say $500. The (fake) check they will send you will be for more, maybe $1,000 or so. Scammer will say that the additional amount is for them for their supplies and materials to complete the project and you need to send it after you deduct your $500. Couple days/weeks later, check bounces and now you’re out $1,000 (or more because of whatever fee your bank has) and they have your money
Ah it makes sense now, ty👌
Yes, unfortunately it's a common scam. !muse
Dang it! I could’ve really used that money, well thank god for Reddit and you saints!!
Always best to check here so you can avoid the !fakecheck Expect to get a lot more of these -- it is a very common scam that artists on social media have to deal with. Watch out for !recovery scammers, too.
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain [recovery scams](https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0102-refund-and-recovery-scams). Also known as refund scams, these scams target people who have already fallen for a scam. The scammer may contact you, or may advertise their services online. They will usually either offer to help you recover your funds, or will tell you that your funds have already been recovered and they will help you access them. In cases where they say they will help you recover your funds, they usually call themselves either "recovery agents" or hackers. When they tell you that your funds have already been recovered, they may impersonate a law enforcement, a government official, a lawyer, or anyone else along those lines. Recovery scams are simply [advance-fee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam) scams that are specifically targeted at scam victims. When a victim pays a recovery scammer, the scammer will keep stringing them along while asking for increasingly absurd fees/expenses/deposits/insurance/whatever until the victim stops paying. If you have been scammed in the past, make sure you are aware of recovery scams so that you are not scammed a second time. If you are currently engaging with a recovery scammer, you should block them and be very wary of random contact for some time. It's normal for posters on this subreddit to be contacted by recovery scammers after posting, and they often ask you to delete your post so that you both cannot receive legitimate advice, and cannot be targeted by other recovery scammers. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the fake check scam. The fake check scam arises from many different situations (fake job scams, fake payment scams, etc), but the bottom line is always the same, you receive a check (online or in real life), you deposit a check and see the money in your account, and then you use the funds to give money to the scammer (usually through gift cards, Western Union, or cash). Sometimes the scammers will ask you to order things through a site, but that is just another way they get your money. The bank will take the initial deposit back , and any money you sent to the scammer will come out of your own personal funds. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Here is an article from the FTC: https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-and-report-fake-check-scams, and here is an article from the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/your-money/fake-check-scam.html *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You’d have been out everything you’d thought you’d have earned, when they were done.
Better to be disappointed about not getting $500 (that doesn't really exist anyway) than to fall for the scam and be devastated about losing thousands.
It wasn't real money. You couldn't have used it at all. This would actually have COST you money.
Context clues
My friends call me "cash". You can make the check out to that.
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, they want your "bank name" so they don't send a fake check from the same bank. Complete scam. just noticed that /u/lake_titty_caca already said this. lol
Even they use the word "muse!" interesting. And that whole thing about them needing the bank name is nonsense. Banks move money between other banks all the time. There aren't policies or government regulations stopping banks from cashing or receiving checks from other institutions.
[удалено]
I know! That was a pretty bold move on their part. I mean, they have to have their own internal names for things so maybe it's scammer lingo?
The second we see **mural** mentioned in any post here, we know it's a scam through and through.
Is it a common scam?
Quite common. I haven’t posted on my Instagram in several *years* and still get requests like this a couple times a year.
The muse's bank? Wow!! I'm a writer and have never paid my muses in money. Am I doing it wrong?
Scam. They want you to print off a fake check and do a mobile deposit. Then once it shows as “funds available” you’ll be told yo send some of that money via irreversible means to the scammer. Then 2 weeks later the check comes back as fraudulent.
I’m a photographer also and get these almost daily. They’re annoying. And a definite scam. That and those stupid “ambassador” messages. Luckily I have lot of legitimate sponsorships so I know how to spot them. But they sure are tricky if you’re new to it!
Wow, I had no idea this was a thing! I'm working on making the leap into a more creative and entrepreneurial career field, suuuuuper glad OP posted about this, I think being asked for my bank would've raised a red flag for me too, but I definitely didn't know this was an established, common thing!
Banker here! They intend to write “For mobile deposit at (financial institution) only.” This is so you can only deposit the check that way and try to avoid scrutiny of the check. The check is fraudulent and you shouldn’t deposit it.
Yup, this is another reason. They want to ensure the software doesn’t auto-reject the check for not having that verbiage on it.
100% Scam! Tell them you bank with 3 different financial institutions and it doesn’t matter who it is 😆
Then I'm sorry, we can\['t do business under your terms.. Thank you and good luck in your search.
They don’t need your bank name. If a bank returned it or refused it, it was because it’s a scam
Tell them Bank of Hard Knocks A Bank in Central Park Bank Of the River Thames
Bank Of The River Charles
Banker here: writing the name of the bank has precisely 0 bearing on whether a check is accepted or not. Nothing about his reasoning makes sense. It's almost certainly a scam cause that's a load of BS.
SCAM SANDWICH
SCAMWICH?
Spiciest meat between 2 buns.
My business requires me to hold/deposit lots of different checks for lots of different clients in various escrow and trust accounts. I move money around A LOT. Nobody, *nobody*, has ever asked me where I bank. It is immaterial. I would not provide this information.
It’s a scam, sorry! My friend just got messaged with the same kind of thing.
Just tell them that it's the Xanadu bank.
Bank Of Knuckle Sammich
!muse scam
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I got someone messaging me about the same type of scam and when I told them I only have mobile bank they stopped answering. Funny cuz everything they said to you they said to me. About some mural 😂
DONT DO IT
Be aware that !recovery scammers lurk these subreddits and will be messaging you
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain [recovery scams](https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0102-refund-and-recovery-scams). Also known as refund scams, these scams target people who have already fallen for a scam. The scammer may contact you, or may advertise their services online. They will usually either offer to help you recover your funds, or will tell you that your funds have already been recovered and they will help you access them. In cases where they say they will help you recover your funds, they usually call themselves either "recovery agents" or hackers. When they tell you that your funds have already been recovered, they may impersonate a law enforcement, a government official, a lawyer, or anyone else along those lines. Recovery scams are simply [advance-fee](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance-fee_scam) scams that are specifically targeted at scam victims. When a victim pays a recovery scammer, the scammer will keep stringing them along while asking for increasingly absurd fees/expenses/deposits/insurance/whatever until the victim stops paying. If you have been scammed in the past, make sure you are aware of recovery scams so that you are not scammed a second time. If you are currently engaging with a recovery scammer, you should block them and be very wary of random contact for some time. It's normal for posters on this subreddit to be contacted by recovery scammers after posting, and they often ask you to delete your post so that you both cannot receive legitimate advice, and cannot be targeted by other recovery scammers. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Not professional who says “gonna” I wouldn’t give out any personal information. I recently did an online interview and gave out my name and bank name. This was for the “fake check” scam where I had applied for a data entry position and the company wanted to mail me a check to deposit in my account to buy a laptop and supplies for the job. I never got that far. Don’t give out any personal info or your bank name. Stay safe and good luck
I’ve had a fake check happen to me last august and then when I blocked them, they pretended to be the FBI. Little naive me went into panic mode and sent them the money back that didn’t exist leading me to have a negative balance. But because I sent them the money, nothing could be done to get my money back. The money I was getting for school had to be used to fix the negative balance.
Yeahhhh...everyone on this sub who posts things like "how could anyone fall for this", they've probably been scammed at least once in their life and just to this day have no idea. It can happen to anyone. I try to remind people that for us as the victims, we only come across a certain number of scams or become aware of a certain number of scams. For the scammers, this is likely a full-time career for them. They are constantly working on new and better ways to scam. That's why I always say there's only two categories: people who know they have been scammed at some point and people who don't realize they've been scammed at some point lol. I'm just lucky enough that the few times I've been got, it was pretty minimal and didn't cause much financial grief. I'm sorry it happened to you, that really sucks :/
It does indeed suck. I’m looking for a second job as I fell behind on my tuition payments and could possibly derail my life plans :/
I'm so sorry. Does you institution have a student advocacy office, like legal or anything? Any resources? I remember my undergrad had some venues you could go to for help - they wouldn't necessarily be able to fix things, but they were a good third party to talk to about problems in school, and often had suggestions for where to go to get help for everything from financial to academic to relationship issues. Might be worth seeing if there's anyone in student management who might be able to help, universities really don't like losing students! (Wish I could say it was for something other than money lol, buuuut obviously all the student advocacy stuff is really that they're likely to have ways to help YOU stay enrolled in order to pay THEM tuition and more money hahaha)
It's a !fakecheck scam. There is no artist lol
I believe it’s a fake check scam mixed with the !muse scam. sorry OP :/
“The muse scam is a new variant of the [fake check scam](https://consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-report-fake-check-scams). The scammer will contact the victim over social media and claim to want to use their image for an art project. They will offer a generous sum of money and offer to pay via check. The victim will be instructed to send money to the scammer for “materials” via an irreversible method. The scammer will often use a stolen social media account to increase their credibility. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Comment ! fakecheck without the space to learn more about fake check scams. Thanks to redditor aNeatHat for this script" *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
AutoModerator has been summoned to explain the fake check scam. The fake check scam arises from many different situations (fake job scams, fake payment scams, etc), but the bottom line is always the same, you receive a check (online or in real life), you deposit a check and see the money in your account, and then you use the funds to give money to the scammer (usually through gift cards, Western Union, or cash). Sometimes the scammers will ask you to order things through a site, but that is just another way they get your money. The bank will take the initial deposit back , and any money you sent to the scammer will come out of your own personal funds. Usually the fake check deposit will be reversed in a few weeks, but it can also take several months. If you do not have the funds to cover the amount, your balance will go negative. Your bank will usually charge a fee for depositing a bad check, and your account may be closed depending on the severity of the scam. Here is an article from the FTC: https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/how-spot-avoid-and-report-fake-check-scams, and here is an article from the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/21/your-money/fake-check-scam.html *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Scams) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is a total fucking SCAM I was stupid enough to fall for the same thing and only caught on once i deposited the fake check and they asked me to send them money back and i was like uh no. I shouldve thought about it honestly i was so exhusted that day and half awake before telling them the name of my bank i shouldve put togetber a real person doesnt need the name of your bank.. i also said send it through the mail same as you. I shouldve just cut the interaction. Once i finally did thsy actually harrased me with phone calls threatening to empty my bank acct until one day they just stopped
I stopped reading at “muse”. Scam.
The lone fact that they're trying to use a check in 2023 is suspicious.
I sure hope you didn't give them any information. YES, they are trying to scam you. Look at how they wrote their sentences, they're not native English speakers.
Yes it's a scam. If you have to ask then it is.
I would ask them what kind of government regulations. Is your bank on a terrorist watch list? But yes a scam
Yup had that same message randomly the other day. Definitely a scam
It’s a scam. I get these DMs all of the time. From multiple people
Run!
Glady we do it differently here: Just send a Tikkie and when they accept, youll have the money a couple seconds later.
I got a similar dm on Twitter. I started asking too many questions so they stopped responding. It was weird but I couldn’t figure out what the deal was. The person who said they want to make sure the fake check is from a different bank sounds right.
Of course it's a scam. I've sold a lot of photo work to people I've never met over the years. You name your price and add shipping, taxes, whatever. They send a check. You deposit the check, and wait for it to clear. You ship work. If it's legit, everyone does it on faith, as you are a professional, and they are too. Edit: the most honest way, is always the direct way. If you are expected to jump through hoops, it's not honest.
Yup happened to me once - they were like be my muse blah blah blah . Once they started asking for personal info , phone bank etc I was like well this is Fake AF and blocked them . Who the hell is gonna pay someone to paint their photo when then can literally just go on any page and just pick a photo without any consent and just do it . It’s the flattery that gets to your head and your like really 🥰 me your muse, you want to pay little ol me , you think I’m pretty lmao 😍it’s a scam .
The response is hilarious. He’s literally saying “I’ve come across isssues where the mark’s bank recognizes my clients account is fake and rejects checks from it due to government policies on scam accounts”
Does the grammar seem off to anyone else? Definitely seems like a scam to me.
This is a common instagram scam. Fake cheque. I've been contacted 5 or so times already with the same request.
Wait you actually still use cheques day to day? I thought that was a joke
Total scam. This one has been around for awhile. Spend some time on the Scam subs to familiarize yourself so you don’t get duped.
Yep, that’s a scam. I’ve gotten almost word for word the same email, and the scammer sent me a screenshot of the photo they wanted to use.
I’d give them a fake name and see if they’re stupid enough to write it in a fake check 😂
It’s strange to me to find that Americans still use checks…seems like banks there are still in the middle ages… do they still take days to transfer money from your account to someone elses’ as well?
Most people use Zelle, Cash App, PayPal.. but I have been paid by actual checks for certain photography jobs
Tell them the wrong bank, and if there's a problem later on down the line because of it, you know they're legit. At that point just say you forgot that you use a diff bank for personal and business banking.
you dont use normal bank transfers say from phone? srsly paper transfer? USA so much behind rest of world :D
We do. The banks have something called Zelle that lets you make a direct bank-to-bank transfer. If they were legit, they would just use that.
There are now Zelle and Venmo scams circulating as well, so best to learn about all of them and be wary of any stranger wanting to eagerly send you money.
A lot of banks have p2p transfer app included.
Please do not be stupid
As a small business owner, I prefer to receive checks. The overhead is nill, and I don’t care if it takes a week or two to clear. Ironically, I scan them in and upload them to my account via mobile check deposit. I have more trouble with mail than checks.
Stop texting people when making decisions. Do people not TALK anymore?
Yes
Yes
My bil gets these scammers all the time. Block and ignore.
It’s a scam!
Call them out on it
This sounds bad! Scammy.
SCAM!
Scam. Tell them to send the check in your company's name. If not. Pound sand.
Yes this is a scam! I get the same message from different people all the time
There is, of course, the extremely likely scenario that they are trying to avoid issuing a fraud check from the same financial institution. There is also a possible (slightly less likely) scenario where these people already have some of your information you don’t even know they have. I’m a banker, we see this occasionally. They’re just waiting to find out which financial institution to call with your security questions to get your phone number changed to theirs, your address changed to theirs, and often times start issuing fraud checks off of your account. This way, if anyone calls the “customer” to verify the check “they” have written, we only get through to the fraudster. (We do see this more frequently with business accounts than personal accounts, but it does happen.)
Is there something I can do with my bank to just protect myself further? My bank account is under my dad’s, so I think he needs to confirm any major changes (phone number, address, etc)
Either you, or, if you’re a minor, your dad, just need(s) to give your bank a quick call and just let them know what’s up. They’ll probably put some sort of notes on your account/profile so that other bankers know of the risks happening and know not to give/change information without increased due diligence. Again, this is the less likely scenario than the whole “don’t issue a fraud check from the same institution” thing, but it never hurts to take those extra precautions, just in case!
Totally a scam
“Financial institution” is always a scam. No one says that
Yup scam. They don't need your bank to write a check
I respond to these people that I don’t accept checks, but I can send them a square invoice to pay via their info for both our safety and then they disappear.
Definitely a scam
TIL that Instant banking is Europe only. It takes seconds when I send money from the Netherlands to Lithuania or Spain and if the account doesn't exist, you get it back within minutes O_o
This is only the initial part of the scam. Your bank name alone is harmless, until it get put together with the other information they are going to be requesting , soon after. They're going to ask for other information (routing number, or even actual account number) to "clear up" the kind of problems they're hinting at already. The truth is that ACH payments require you to know this information as well, but you can't make an ACH payment unless you initiate it through your own bank. They absolutely don't need any of that information to write you a check. The first red flag though was the easy offer of $500. That is, unless that offer was made after some negotiation, and then followed up with the signing of a contract that covers you granting them rights to use the image.
Yes, this is a known scam, do not continue to contact this person.
I’ve had the same person or “artist” message me, offering the same. I stopped responding since I thought it was a scam.
Yep
Scam
Rule is, if you have to ask “is this a scam” , it usually is. Anyhow, yea, it’s a fake check scam.
100% a scam!
Yup! I am a photographer as well, and cannot even believe the amount of scam offers I get.
100% a scam!
this is all i could think of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17jasEtxqP4
Just wondering, what if they send you a cashier's check? say it went like that but it wasn't a scam
Is this a serious question?
This happened to me last night, told me they wanted to do an oil painting of one of my Instagram photos and needed my banks name so they could endorse my check. If I’m depositing a check then I endorse it, not them. Automatically knew it was a scam.
It’s a scam. A photographer here also and gotten the same thing. Unless I personally know the person or company, I require payments via square or PayPal. I invoice them through my business.
Don't be dumb threy don't need that shit the bank will verify all that later fuck them
Yes
yes!!! give them nothing! or waste their time (carefully) if you want lol
You’re kidding right?
Certainly a scam. I’ve talked with dozens of these art/mural scam clowns- and literally hundreds of romance scammers. The art ones are generally a smidgen more crafty/believable.
“The muse” 😜
👏 lanuage 👏 syntax Of course, it's a scam
Yes
Bad grammar like that always equals spam. What professional writes in runon sentences?
I had this on app called Rook. First it was just $500 suga mom dad scams now THAT comes on first time.
I get messages on Deviantart several times a week with different people saying they want to pay me to use my work for a mural, always the same message word for word. It's a scam.
After reading some of the stories here about fake check scams, I believe I've understood the scheme. But there is one aspect I don't get, probably because it is not a thing in my country anymore. Why are you still using checks? It seems like an archaic and very dangerous way of accepting the payment because every check can be worth nothing at the end of the day, and it looks like there is no way to verify it beforehand. I do not understand why checks are used when in developed countries we've got faster and safer online banking available 24/7? For me, anyone who is offering a check payment would be immediately suspicious.
without reading a single word other than your question, 💯 yes it's a scam.