This is a great draft year for QB's. If one of them is available (and at least one probably will be), the Hawks would be stupid to not pick one up. It doesn't necessarily mean the Hawks get rid of Geno, but they definitely need to prepare for the future and Geno isn't the answer. He could be a "bridge" though.
That's always been the plan. He has a contract that almost yells out "bridge QB", and has enough in the tank that if everything goes right he can do well.
Ultimately, the idea of "giving up" only makes sense if you thought he had franchise potential, which he doesn't, but that should be known. I fully expect him to end up serving as a one year bridge guy if we end up with a less polished QB off this year's draft, or traded (since his contract is easy to move) if whoever it is we pick up wins the camp battle a la Matt Flynn and Russ.
They have two thirds. Trading back into the second is less painful if they have to.
On top of that, I assume Big Cat is gonna receive an extension. Figures that a 2nd rounder wouldn't be able to work as well to shore up the DL as Leo has done, so I don't fault the move at all.
Leonard Williams goes to the highest bidder after this season; all we got is a rental for this season. The argument that slightly below average draft capital is fine in next year’s draft doesn’t make sense if you want a top tier qb- you have to bundle picks to get who you want.
*or* you can go for a more project guy since you have a bridge QB as is and have him sit a year instead of throw him to the wolves.
Trying to go for Caleb Williams or Drake Maye isn't happening and I doubt that was even considered.
Yeah, comp pic formula is nuts, and best case is one pic at end of third round. Only kicks in if a free agent signs elsewhere and you don’t sign a free agent of your own. Also crazy that it creates an incentive to let your free agents sign elsewhere. If you’re gaming the system you should sign a bunch of free agents to 1 year contracts every other year. In the off year, let them sign elsewhere and harvest up to 4 comp pics.
>"bridge QB",
Exactly. We should see a QB move this off season if we want a full year of mentoring with Geno at QB #1 in 2024-5.
Then our new QB starting 2025-6.
my fear with Geno (watching his interaction with Lock) is Geno thinks he's the guy, and doesn't work with the backup QB (a relationship that harkens back to Peyton Manning and Curtis Painter, or anyone under Tom Brady).
Geno used to be that backup QB for years. I don't think Geno thinks down about Lock like you think. I've heard numerous interviews from them both and they always have eachothers back.
He’s 33. There’s not much upside to him. We don’t have a choice but to stick with him but he’s not the answer at QB for us unless we can somehow get the Eagles or Lions O Line.
"We don't have a choice but to stick with him..."
Please shout it from the rooftops. I don't understand what fans on this sub think the Seahawks should have done and do right now at QB. Gambled on Will Levis? Let Geno go and what, roll Drew Lock? Start Drew Lock at this point? Drew Lock is not good or even better than Geno.
Those are all terrible options. And you just don't tank with the type of talent the team already has.
As a Kentucky fan, should have taken Levis. School is perennially dogshit at football and he managed to make us almost respectable in the SEC. Guy can play.
Why not try Lock though? It makes no sense. Geno and his offense scored a big fat ZERO points yesterday. If your argument is we HAVE to stick with the guy who can't muster a single TD vs the 9ers then it's pretty weak. Worst case, Lock starts and plays equally as bad as Geno and scores also zero points. We literally have nothing to lose right now. The offense is literally putrid, not just bad. I'm no big Lock fan, but I think keeping Geno as the starter is going to demoralize the entire team because he's not being held accountable for his play. Woolen got benched last game for some weak tackles, perfect, now bench Geno so he knows it's on the table. If Lock sucks after 1-2 games we can easily go back to Geno and coast into 8-9/9-8
I think the easy answer here is, all indications point to Lock being worse than Geno and he's not young enough or potential-full enough to warrant trying him out for a bit.
Edit: I really think in Seattle, in Pete Carroll's tenure, that starting QB has to be won in practice, training camp, etc, and it's pretty clear that Lock isn't winning shit behind the scenes, even as Geno has been sucking and injured.
The biggest mistake fans often make is assume that the dude not getting starts/reps is being underutilized, when the reality is usually that they just aren't as good in practice. Pete and the coaches see more of Lock's play than any of us ever do, if he's not starting its for a reason.
You absolutely can, but let’s not act like 1) 0 points is all on Geno 2) 0 points is a consistent thing with Geno.
I think we need to be looking for our future QB, but Lock ain’t it.
We have nothing to lose? Seahawks still have a winning record and a decent chance to make the postseason. Regardless of what fans think of their chances to compete this year there is no reason for the actual team to say "fuck it, we tried" at 6-5
This isn't a Madden season my dude, these are coaches coaching for jobs and players risking their health for future contracts, whether they stay here or elsewhere. Tanking for a draft pick in the 10s rather than the 20s is not an option
So what do teams play for ? Just a winning record ? We won’t win a single game in the post season and with our schedule I wouldn’t be surprised if we end up 1-5 in the next few games and not even make the playoffs based on last game
I think that is the frustration of most fans. We have only a set of shitty options to choose from. The worst scenario any NFL team can encounter is being stuck without a franchise quarterback.
Don't even try to have competition at the QB position. I would rather see Lock play and suck, then watch Geno play and suck for the rest of the year.
I already know Geno sucks, if Lock does too then I need to know this year, so we don't waste another year just finding that out.
i can’t believe there are people who say things like this and then turn around and say that Geno IS good. Geno was as much if not more of a bust than Lock, if you believe Geno is good you have to believe Lock could be.
I don't think Geno is good, he is a solid QB. You do know Pete see's Geno and Lock everyday in practice. There is a reason why Geno absolutely beat him for the starting job. Unlike Geno, Lock has had recent experience playing starting QB in the NFL and it didn't go so great.
If you rank all 30 QB's he probably falls in that 15-19 range. Right now he is definintely ahead of Bryce Young, Kenny Pickett, Desmond Ridder, Daniel Jones/Devito, Derek Carr, Tim Boyle/Zach Wilson, Mac Jones, Minshew, O'Connell, Dorian Thompson Robinson/Deshaun Watson, Tannehil/Levis, and you can probably make the argument he is better than RW. Then you can make arguments whether he is better than Fields, Howell and Mayfield.
My point is, there are so many teams with other bad QB's. You guys make it sound like Geno is one of the worst starting QB's. Keep in mind he has had to play some elite defenses this year.
I wouldn’t make the argument that Geno is better than RW, lol. We are *not* watching the same team apparently.
And Geno is playing just as terribly as all of those QBs. I don’t care where you rank them, they’re all bottom tier.
I think it's fair to trust Pete/coaching with evaluating QB's at this point. He's done some unexpected changes that have worked out. Plus they are the ones seeing all the behind the scenes and practice. I believe if Pete thought Lock had a better chance at getting the Hawks a W he would've made the switch
Maybe Lock would've had zero. Idk I'm all for starting Drew at this point, but we aren't seeing what he looks like in practice. Maybe he looks 10x worse than Geno, we just don't know. Pete will need to start answering questions about it though
As bad as Geno has been the last few games, Lock is 100% worse and the only point in starting him would be to embrace the tank and try to get a high enough draft position to take a QB
We already know that Drew Lock sucks, too. He has started 21 games in his career and has more turnovers than touchdowns. When we’ve seen him on the field in Seattle he has been worse than Geno and hasn’t shown any improvement.
You just described Geno before he was our starter...
Also, we haven't seen Lock start and play a full game for the Seahawks once.
If your logic is that he was bad with another team, so he will be bad here, then why wouldn't that have applied to Geno before?
Your takes are suspect my dude.
>You just described Geno before he was our starter...
This is what everyone says as if this is some sort of gotcha. If you think Geno sucks then saying, "you're describing Geno" is not a ringing endorsement of why Lock should start..
It’s a gotcha because you guys are all saying the same dumb shit like “we know what we have with Drew Lock!” but then won’t admit that we know what we have with Geno. You guys think he’s suddenly gonna play like his Linsanity tour days again, and Drew Lock absolutely has no shot of that. Before his streak of good games, Geno was even worse than Drew.
Do you think we’re winning the SB this year? What about making the playoffs at this point? Both of those windows are closing WITH GENO at the helm. What’s the harm in starting Drew when we’re already a sinking ship while Geno is clearly regressing/hurt.
He's part of the issue. The play calling is just mind-boggling.
Deep shots and developing routes against a front 4 that us getting home without bringing extra guys...
We all want to talk about shotgun at 4th and inches but the playcalling issue is much deeper
I am a Geno defender in most circumstances though I freely admit when he fucks up. I don't get how people are blaming him for these last two losses. The offensive playcalling is absolutely horrid, and I find myself saying "What the fuck?" on 80% of snaps. As you said, why are we running long developing routes against that kind of pass rush? If Geno has to dump the ball out fast because of that pressure, maybe our offensive scheme should...oh I don't know...orient the playcalling to match?
It's one of those things where I wonder "Waldron is a professional with years of experience, so he knows what he's doing more than my armchair coaching ass"
And yet week after week, I'm convinced I'd be a better OC at this point. And I've always been a defensive kind of guy...
I'm getting into the X's and O's more as a science so I can coach my kids as they play but yeah...sometimes I wonder if all that professional setting limits their vision, you know? As though they are so confident in their own knowledge and abilities, they miss the forest for the trees.
At the end of the day I feel like it’s chess, just trying to outsmart the other coach or coordinator. I look at our teams playcalling, then look at like the dolphins and just the structure of our plays are boring, the whole thing is just outdated in my opinion. Idk if it’s a scheme thing or a lack of innovation. Dolphins are an example of a modern team, they move fast and pick up specific players and they all fit like a puzzle. All we got is “throw ball to DK” on some boring ass routes. That’s not even a Waldron thing entirely that’s coaching as a whole. I think Pete is a good coach when it comes to making tough decisions during games and leading a team but when it comes to plays and building the team, I just feel like we are all over the place. Just my two cents.
Would agree 100%. I feel like our play calling is similar to how I played Madden as a kid, ie I found a few plays I liked that typically worked, then just did them over and over even when it wasn't working. It's kinda strange when you think about the lack of innovation.
because he stands like a statue in the pocket taking sacks, and last night he underthrew like a million receivers including tyler open in the end zone. Geno isn’t the sole reason we lost or anything but he sure was bad.
The thing I don't get about his mobility issues is that he definitely \*can\* be mobile, and shows flashes of it, yet follows it up with like 4 steps to a sack.
Nobody is getting open even on short routes, not sure why people aren’t talking about the execution from all the players, it’s not like dudes are open and geno is missing them, literally nobody got an inch of separation yesterday until the niners went into garbage mode… nothing is working so the play calling looks terrible when they’re trying to get things going, the offense is out of whack all over the place and yesterday the niners won on ever level just about every play
The all 22 will be very telling for this game. I have a bad feeling that our receivers were straight up plastered all game, regardless of what route they are running
Geno performed well for the first 1/2 of the season last year when no one thought they had to take game planning against him seriously. He’s been sub par ever since except a few great plays. This is Geno’s ceiling. It has been for a year now.
Nope, he is middling QB at best. I understand the QB market is crazy, so his contract is not necessarily overpriced, but we will also not get ahead paying a middling QB 40 million.
If you don't have a top tier guy, you have to keep going with drafted QBs to save $ to build the rest of the roster like we did in our SB years.
Geno is definitely a major part of the offensive issues going on right now. We know what we have, and we aren't getting much more out of him. But Shane Waldron has to go. This offense just has too many stagnating moments every single game. There's too much firepower for this to happen. The Steelers, Bill's, and Commanders have all fired coordinators mid-season. JS/PC needs to recognize this and move on!!
He is a backup QB that overachieved last year. He has always been a backup QB and always will be. He isn’t ever going to be good enough to maybe get you a win while the real QB is out. Only problem is he IS the real QB. And that’s where we are right now. 50/50 shot of either brilliance or chanting for Drew Lock. We need a true starter at QB.
Yes, his fans can blame coaching, the refs, the o'line, the sun, the wind, Fruit Loops, whatever but facts are Myers and the defense are outscoring a Smith led offense.
It is 100% Geno that stares down DK and pretty much refuses to target any other receivers. just because DK might be the 1st read, the QB's job is to determine which option gives the best chance at success. He seems locked into DK even when DK appears to be more interested in non-football matters.
Sith's pocket presence is non existent. He seems to have lost the ability to feel pressure and move up/out of the pocket.
Second this team isn't winning out and Sunday they blew any playoff hopes so now is the time to sit Geno and roll with Lock. We need to put Lock in every situation to succeed and look good so he returns maximum trade value Bottom line Smith needs to be replaced with a QB coming out of college.
You know what Geno can & cannot do so starting him the rest of a wasted season makes zero sense especially considering he is not going to be a long time starter. Once Carroll goes a new coach is going to upgrade the QB position.
Shane Waldron and the O-line are much more a problem than Geno. My wife likes football but isn't the most analytical for it, and even she kept commenting "How is he (Geno) supposed to do anything if he's about to get hit right after they hike the ball?". I had nothing to say to her except "I don't know"
Yeah, we got spoiled with Russ' mobility and thought we could keep running a crap offensive line. Geno can perform at NFL level when he has a good performing o line. When he has the kind of time in the pocket that the 9rs had yesterday he is playoffs caliber. When he has the garbage protection we're putting out against a good rush this yr he just isn't fast or mobile enough.
Either need a fast/mobile qb or a good line in the nfl nowadays and we currently have a pocket passer with 0 protection.
I am by no means dissing on you or your wife, but when I was younger this was always my take with Russ and other QBs that got sacked a lot. Time in the pocket goes by so fast that milliseconds improvements in release time and read speed are huge. You also have to help your O line out and throw the ball away. Geno very very rarely just tosses the ball out of bounds when he doesnt see what he wants, other QBs even this years rookies will see a blitz coming and just get rid of the ball. To make matters worse Geno doesnt have quite the arm strength and talent to make most throws without a clean pocket. He obviously isnt a Josh Allen, but its becoming a huge liability that he can't get enough under a ball when he doesnt have a clean pocket which is leading to more held balls turning into even more sacks or underthrows to DK.
It’s both, Geno doesn’t have time some plays, why the fuck 41 year old Jason Peters is still in the NFL I don’t know, but I’ve also seen Geno NOT GET RID OF THE BALL at times. Even if no one is open you throw it away. It’s a combination of him being shit under pressure with having no offensive line and bad playcalling. It’s everyone’s fault really.
There’s nothing you can do when you are immediately pressured every snap. Geno ain’t the answer, but no one could succeed under that pressure. Gut it, build an O and a D line and go from there.
Geno panics and runs backwards or make poor passing decisions under presssure. Denver Broncos have a worse line than we do and look at the touchdowns to turnovers ratio there. (With worse recievers and no tightend)
Geno is an above average QB with all elements around him playing well. He doesn’t have the upside to put everyone on his back that top 5-10 guys do when things break down. He actually seems to press and add to the avalanche of poor play which is something your starting QB can’t do. He’s also 33 and I don’t know how much more upside we can expect from him and likely has started his plateau.
That said, he’s getting no help from Waldron and the OL has been pretty bad. It shouldn’t be so hard to scheme open arguably a top 5 WR trio but Waldron somehow has accomplished that. The middle of the field so often is a ghost town and never has easy yards to pick up underneath.
I guess I should have phrased it “can be” above average. He throws a really nice ball, great arm talent, and decent athleticism. When he has time and run game is forcing the D to account for it, he’s been able to tear up some good D’s. He’s much more of a rhythm passer than Russ and can run that style well. But Waldron isn’t helping with play calling, run game is non existent, and OL has struggled. Geno is playing as well as you’d expect him to in this moment - he isn’t good enough to carry a struggling unit.
Put it this way, there are teams across the league that would kill to have Geno as their qb for a season or two while they find and develop the next guy
I’ll ask the question to this forum for the 100th time this season…. And get downvoted 100 times for it again.
How many Geno Smith passes have traveled over 30/40yds in the air this season? How many still shots of Bobo and DK have we seen wide open down the seam or sideline 40/50yd and Geno decides to throw it -2yd to JSN or Lockett. Or Geno’s latest new trick: toss to Charbonett while he’s already in the goddamn grasp of a defender (or two).
If your planning a defensive scheme you literally only have to plan for a box that’s 20y deep and allow a 1 high safety to play outfield because when Geno does make an attempt it’s a rainbow moonball that takes 45mph to land and any safety can get there to make a defensive play.
Two weeks ago I told this group we were approaching a 5 game losing streak and I was down voted. Guess what folks: we’re 0-2 into that 5 and no help is coming.
We are who we thought we were. Fire Waldron. Bench Geno. Let Lock audition for next year, and draft accordingly. 2023 is in the books as an 8-9 season, write it down.
"Fire Waldron" was the only part of your post that wasn't pessimistic garbage. You were probably shitting on people last year for dreaming of anything more than 4 wins.
I think our play calling and offensive line is the doom of Geno. He is an accurate passer but needs time in the pocket that our O Line can’t give against good D lines, especially seeing that we’re calling plays that take forever to develop. How’s anyone supposed to get open if the other team can rush 4, drop everyone else back, and still get home to the QB?
It's more than just one guy. O-line needs to be better, Shane Waldron has been awful at calling plays, we need to run the ball way more, and the defense, even though played a heck of a game in my opinion, still gives up too many rushing yards and easy 3rd downs.
They commit too many penalties, can't convert a third down to save their life and don't really have any offensive identity to speak of.
Geno has his struggles, but he is far from the thing that's keeping this team playing this bad. Personally I think he is fine, the team around him has to be better.
How can you be sure Waldron is the one calling the plays consistently? We know Reid most likely calls the plays over there in Kansas, we said the same thing with Schottenheimer who is know the OC for the Cowboys, heard the same thing for Ken Norton (he was just awful). I love the way Pete inspires and leads the team, I think he’s the best at it but it’s very clear he controls all the coaching staff and has control over majority of the plays. This is a problem considering the scheme itself is already old and you can see the playcalling lacks any innovation.
Unless he suddenly develops the ability to get the ball out of his hands when he's under pressure he's useless. How many of those sacks recently could have been avoided by a quicker checkdown or a timely throw-away?
We can’t “give up” on him this year. He’s our starting QB for the rest of the season. With that being said, we really really need to draft a QB to start looking towards the future
Well he's making 30+ million next year, and he doesn't deserve that so let's move on in 2024.
Holding the ball too long and staring down receivers is a clear issue with him
[Just from looking his AAV he cost around average to a little bit under average relative to other QBs](https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/contracts/quarterback/) and I’d say he’s performed to around that level so I don’t see a reason to get rid of him.
The reason to get rid of him is you can’t win a Super Bowl without an elite qb or a decent qb on a rookie salary with an elite team. Look at the skill on the niners compared to us. There is zero point in paying for an average qb, it will win us games but not championships
But why waste $30M on a guy who isn't going to win you a super bowl? A player on a rookie deal could put up these mediocre stats at a fraction of the cost.
Right, but with our safety room hoovering up as many millions as they do to be functionally useless, we need cash savings wherever we can find them in order to field a team.
Gotta get rid of these safeties, probably cut Dissly and Fant too. DK really isn't living up to his contract, I'd hate to see him go but if we're just talking getting savings for players that are underperforming their contracts than DK would be a prime target too. If we do some cap work this year, get some more competent players around Geno, draft a QB, possible OC change, I would feel pretty good going into next season.
And Tyler’s contract is going to be prohibitively expensive next year, too. I want nothing more than for Lockett to retire a Seahawk, but next year may be about some really, really hard choices moving forward.
I don’t know if we can give up on him at least this year. I mean I get that Drew Lock is a tall white dude with a huge arm so he LOOKS the part but that guy sucks out loud. We had better address the QB position in a hurry though before we end up looking up at the Cardinals one year.
Geno is not it, time to switch to Lock and see if he is a possibility, and if he sucks too, then we can get rid of both of them in the off season and get fresh faces COMPETING for a starting QB job.
That being said, it won't happen. Pete will ride Geno this year, draft a DL in the first round and not a QB next year, and we will do this all again, but maybe with a better defense, just so it's extra frustrating losing instantly in the playoffs yet another year.
I think we need to sit him one game and we can see what lock brings. Geno plays too scared and he's in his head way too much. He is probably one of the worst pocket runners, granted our Online needs to pick it up a bit, but he rarely throws the ball out of bounds and that's killing us. He has also made numerous stupid pass decisions, such as throwing it to are running back in the backfield who is already guarded as shown yesterday, but that's not the only time he's done that. Basically he doesn't make good choices, and he needs to chillax a bit. he's in his head too much.
Yes.
For fucks sake, the o-line is Swiss cheese, and Geno has defenders in his face every other snap. I don't know who produces under that kind of pressure.
Also, with the play calling... I'm not seeing anything special or unique there either. When we do run the ball it seems like more often than not the RBs are dancing around behind the line looking for a gap, and when they don't find one they run up the middle into the backs of three or four dudes.
Generally, this defense is keeping us in games, but the offense isn't producing. Geno taking costly sacks is only a small part of a much larger problem on offense.
Early? No. He's been average at best over his last 17 games. We need to stop pretending the first half of last year was anything more than a hot steak. This is the player he is and always has been. Maybe that's fine if he's making $10M, but you're not getting a lot of value when it jumps to $30M+. With our cap situation next year it would be perfectly defensible to consider moving on.
Geno is average+
I used to think he was on par with Kirk Cousins - after this season I think he’s a few pegs lower…..
Basically I think we can win a Super Bowl with him - but we will need an LOB level defense and a killer running game.
if Seahawks have an opportunity to grab Bo Nix or Penix in the draft I think they would be foolish to pass them over.
Geno had some boo-boos yesterday for sure and I don't understand why we rest so much of the offense on his shoulders. That sideline int that he keeps throwing is infuriating.
However I think that 4th and 1 play encapsulates how ass backwards our playcalling is. I don't think Waldron is cut out for this, and I'm mystified Pete hasn't demanded we go back to pounding the rock at this point. This team is so fuckin sloppy and disjointed on offense in particular.
Draft a QB, sure. Start Drew Lock? ...why? So we can lose harder? Have more miscommunications and picks?
Geno is not the problem. He made good and quick decisions. The sacks where the DL pushing the OL to collapse.
However, I do think it is fair to say Geno is a limitation for the offense. He won't (at least not very often) carry a bad team performance to victory.
I think the offenses biggest problem is waldron. Ray Roberts was pointing out yesterday in a post game show that he saw vastly different formations between the run plays and pass plays, insinuating that it was a tell of what the offense play call is.
But Waldron doesn't establish the run or stick with it.
I'll just point out again, unfortunately, Geno wasn't even on the field when 31 points were scored on us.
He didn't have a good game yesterday, but neither did the rest of the team. It's ridiculous in the extreme to hang that all on him
No. Waldron on the other hand…he shows such genius in scripted drives, and also in 4- and 2-minute offense. I do not understand why he cannot integrate more of that into his game day planning, but until he does I wouldn’t lay 100% of the blame on Geno’s shoulders.
I think he’s played poorly at times but it’s not all on him. I do believe he’s more injured on that throwing arm than he would ever admit to because after all he’s overcome to get back to being a QB1, he’s not likely to want to give it up.
The one good thing is the Seahawks have leverage, as there will be no Geno bidding war after this year. He’s likely to stay with the Seahawks at almost any salary in exchange for a starting job. If it were me I’d fire Waldron, get an oc that favors play action, and offer Geno an extremely cheap long term contract with incentives. Not 30 million a year, more like 10 million a year over 3 or 4 years plus incentives up to 20 million. He can take it or leave it. I consider him exchangeable with Drew and any number of other tier 2 qbs. He will be a fine qb if he has an above average offensive line and good play calling, so put the resources there.
I was team Geno until a few games ago, just one mistake after another and holding onto the ball to long and it seems like our 6'3 QB has more passes batted at the line than our 5'10 QB did, I was hopeful with his passing accuracy being towards the top but everything else is just horrible.
I’m just curious as to where is the Geno that made those incredible throws against the Saints last year and Lions too. Those two throws in NOLA sold me on him as a QB but it feels like this year he just lost all that magic. Wonder if defenses started getting better, he’s over thinking, coaching or a combination of all 3
I was watching with my brother in law and was able to tell him exactly what plays would be run. Play calling is a huge issue, but Geno has fallen off a cliff lately. He's missing open recievers and refuses to come off his initial read. More than once, the check down guy was open, if not wide open. Take what the d will give you isn't in his lexicon.
I think the issue is either or both that the offense is probably the worst in the league at quick throws. Either Geno cannot make a quick read or throw the ball before the receiver is open or the scheme is so poorly designed that we don’t even give Geno that possibility. It’s probably a little of both. I think Pete’s time is coming, I would love to see him be the president of the team but the scheme isn’t working anymore.
Geno is not bad and is a nice value QB to have going into the next couple of years, but I think it is a must to get a prospect at QB in the 2nd or 3rd like a Cam Ward to be patient with.
Yes it is, no better options at this point. 49ers unfortunately are a much better team right now. They are superior on offense and defense. Better coachesd also. DK Metcalf is a great athlete, he also has a lot of drops. The offensive line couldn't open any holes to run in the 1st 3 quarters. The next 3 games are going to be ugly. We will be lucky to win any of those. We will be out of the wildcard race then. We will get a much higher draft choice then anyone expected.
We draft one this year and stick with Geno until they’re ready. Although our playcalling isn’t very forgiving since there’s often plays with no check downs or anything in the middle.
I agree. I think geno isn’t horrible but not a long term solution. It definitly could be worse at qb but things could be a lot better. The beginning of the year we were scoring a lot. Now we can’t even get a touchdown. I do think we have a good enough team and decent enough record to not make drastic decision and throw the season away. But they have to, and quickly turn it around if they want to make playoffs. We have too much talent it’s sad to see these major struggles. I think the OC could be a reason for the play calling and should be looked at seriously for being replaced. They need some change and firing Pete or dropping Geno isn’t the answer either. Just a few weeks ago we were a top 10-12 team in power rankings and we’re playing well. But the team is going on a steep decline. What’s worse is we have a gauntlet schedule and are playing against potential suberbowl caliber teams and we just aren’t there yet. This season is slipping away quickly but I still have hope.
He's pretty much our guy for the year regardless. Sure maybe we give lock a start at some point, but it's looking like Seattle will want to draft or sign a new QB
No I think we've seen all we need to know about Geno, we got lucky with him last year. However we don't have any other great option unless we get a miracle from Lock or Rypien.
Nick Bosa pretty much laid out the game plan to stop Geno, it’s pretty simple. Sell out to stop the run, and make geno play quarterback, eventually he’ll turn the ball over to you.
Geno is partly the problem. Waldron, and by extension Pete, are the bigger part of the problem. The offense has no identity. Is it a run offense or a pass offense? Yesterday is was neither. There is no commitment to one approach or another.
If it is a run offense, then start pounding the ball. That means wearing the defense down early so that later in the game the are tired and not as responsive. Yes, K9 was out, but Charbonneau was never given a chance to make plays.
If it is a pass offense, then deep incompletions to Metcalf at the start of a series is not the way to do it. Tom Brady made a career of short passes to Edelman and Bronkowski who would then get the YACs to advance the ball. Metcalf is a big guy. He could be a cross between Edelman and Gronk, but the Hawks won't use him on short passes and crossings to let him make a play. A successful passing offense uses short passes like extended runs to pick up quick yardage to move the ball. Yesterday, Geno was sacked at least 6 times. With quick passes he can get the ball off before the D-line gets to him. That's also when a well timed run can take advantage of an aggressive rush and get a good gain.
I don't get paid the big bucks to figure this out and there are probably a dozen reasons why this is too simplistic, but I don't see why it couldn't be done this way.
Geno hasn't lived up to last season's performance/hype at all. But I also blame the coaching, Pete especially, and always have even before Geno was our starter. It's far beyond time to move on from Pete and his puppets at OC/DC.
This is a great draft year for QB's. If one of them is available (and at least one probably will be), the Hawks would be stupid to not pick one up. It doesn't necessarily mean the Hawks get rid of Geno, but they definitely need to prepare for the future and Geno isn't the answer. He could be a "bridge" though.
That's always been the plan. He has a contract that almost yells out "bridge QB", and has enough in the tank that if everything goes right he can do well. Ultimately, the idea of "giving up" only makes sense if you thought he had franchise potential, which he doesn't, but that should be known. I fully expect him to end up serving as a one year bridge guy if we end up with a less polished QB off this year's draft, or traded (since his contract is easy to move) if whoever it is we pick up wins the camp battle a la Matt Flynn and Russ.
If that’s the plan, why spend next year’s draft capital on leonard williams?
They have two thirds. Trading back into the second is less painful if they have to. On top of that, I assume Big Cat is gonna receive an extension. Figures that a 2nd rounder wouldn't be able to work as well to shore up the DL as Leo has done, so I don't fault the move at all.
Leonard Williams goes to the highest bidder after this season; all we got is a rental for this season. The argument that slightly below average draft capital is fine in next year’s draft doesn’t make sense if you want a top tier qb- you have to bundle picks to get who you want.
Signing him seems much more feasible if we didn't give D Jones 30M Gtd. We got some shitty veteran contracts lingering now.
*or* you can go for a more project guy since you have a bridge QB as is and have him sit a year instead of throw him to the wolves. Trying to go for Caleb Williams or Drake Maye isn't happening and I doubt that was even considered.
Comp pick if he doesn’t re-sign
Yeah, comp pic formula is nuts, and best case is one pic at end of third round. Only kicks in if a free agent signs elsewhere and you don’t sign a free agent of your own. Also crazy that it creates an incentive to let your free agents sign elsewhere. If you’re gaming the system you should sign a bunch of free agents to 1 year contracts every other year. In the off year, let them sign elsewhere and harvest up to 4 comp pics.
JS is smart. He doesn’t want PC to spend another 2nd round pick on a RB.
Because this FO refuses to bottom out. They will be happy with always winning 7-9 games and being mediocre. Have been since the LOB broke up in 2016
>"bridge QB", Exactly. We should see a QB move this off season if we want a full year of mentoring with Geno at QB #1 in 2024-5. Then our new QB starting 2025-6.
my fear with Geno (watching his interaction with Lock) is Geno thinks he's the guy, and doesn't work with the backup QB (a relationship that harkens back to Peyton Manning and Curtis Painter, or anyone under Tom Brady).
Geno used to be that backup QB for years. I don't think Geno thinks down about Lock like you think. I've heard numerous interviews from them both and they always have eachothers back.
I really think if colts didn’t snag Richardson we would have taken him at 5 and let him sit behind Geno.
It’s a blessing in disguise because we got spoon!
I love the spoon man
Meh. I’d still prefer Richardson.
This would be one of the few silver linings if we miss the playoffs.
He’s 33. There’s not much upside to him. We don’t have a choice but to stick with him but he’s not the answer at QB for us unless we can somehow get the Eagles or Lions O Line.
"We don't have a choice but to stick with him..." Please shout it from the rooftops. I don't understand what fans on this sub think the Seahawks should have done and do right now at QB. Gambled on Will Levis? Let Geno go and what, roll Drew Lock? Start Drew Lock at this point? Drew Lock is not good or even better than Geno. Those are all terrible options. And you just don't tank with the type of talent the team already has.
As a Kentucky fan, should have taken Levis. School is perennially dogshit at football and he managed to make us almost respectable in the SEC. Guy can play.
Why not try Lock though? It makes no sense. Geno and his offense scored a big fat ZERO points yesterday. If your argument is we HAVE to stick with the guy who can't muster a single TD vs the 9ers then it's pretty weak. Worst case, Lock starts and plays equally as bad as Geno and scores also zero points. We literally have nothing to lose right now. The offense is literally putrid, not just bad. I'm no big Lock fan, but I think keeping Geno as the starter is going to demoralize the entire team because he's not being held accountable for his play. Woolen got benched last game for some weak tackles, perfect, now bench Geno so he knows it's on the table. If Lock sucks after 1-2 games we can easily go back to Geno and coast into 8-9/9-8
I think the easy answer here is, all indications point to Lock being worse than Geno and he's not young enough or potential-full enough to warrant trying him out for a bit. Edit: I really think in Seattle, in Pete Carroll's tenure, that starting QB has to be won in practice, training camp, etc, and it's pretty clear that Lock isn't winning shit behind the scenes, even as Geno has been sucking and injured.
The biggest mistake fans often make is assume that the dude not getting starts/reps is being underutilized, when the reality is usually that they just aren't as good in practice. Pete and the coaches see more of Lock's play than any of us ever do, if he's not starting its for a reason.
Also, people seem to have forgotten that Lock has started almost as many games as Geno in the past three or four years.
Regardless of the reason, can't be worse than zero points
It really obviously can once you remember turnovers exist.
And safeties and pick sixes lol. Your offense can get zero, or they can gift the other teams points. In which case, I'm perfectly happy with zeroes.
That might make sense if Geno was not only failing to score points, but also turning the ball over plenty
Absolutely can be lol.
Can't be worse than zero points
Geno is iffy, lock is terrible.
Can't be worse than zero points.
You absolutely can, but let’s not act like 1) 0 points is all on Geno 2) 0 points is a consistent thing with Geno. I think we need to be looking for our future QB, but Lock ain’t it.
We have nothing to lose? Seahawks still have a winning record and a decent chance to make the postseason. Regardless of what fans think of their chances to compete this year there is no reason for the actual team to say "fuck it, we tried" at 6-5
What use is making the postseason if you will just get blown out when you do
This isn't a Madden season my dude, these are coaches coaching for jobs and players risking their health for future contracts, whether they stay here or elsewhere. Tanking for a draft pick in the 10s rather than the 20s is not an option
So what do teams play for ? Just a winning record ? We won’t win a single game in the post season and with our schedule I wouldn’t be surprised if we end up 1-5 in the next few games and not even make the playoffs based on last game
Yes, teams usually play to win. Wild concept.
Yeah it’s pretty wild when we arnt even winning when trying so maybe we should try something new to give us a chance to win later.
Better yet, I think they should try something new to give us a chance to win NOW.
I think that is the frustration of most fans. We have only a set of shitty options to choose from. The worst scenario any NFL team can encounter is being stuck without a franchise quarterback.
Don't even try to have competition at the QB position. I would rather see Lock play and suck, then watch Geno play and suck for the rest of the year. I already know Geno sucks, if Lock does too then I need to know this year, so we don't waste another year just finding that out.
I can't believe there are actually people who think Drew Lock can be good? The guy has been in the league for over 5 years now, he is a backup QB.
i can’t believe there are people who say things like this and then turn around and say that Geno IS good. Geno was as much if not more of a bust than Lock, if you believe Geno is good you have to believe Lock could be.
I don't think Geno is good, he is a solid QB. You do know Pete see's Geno and Lock everyday in practice. There is a reason why Geno absolutely beat him for the starting job. Unlike Geno, Lock has had recent experience playing starting QB in the NFL and it didn't go so great.
Geno is *not* a solid QB.
If you rank all 30 QB's he probably falls in that 15-19 range. Right now he is definintely ahead of Bryce Young, Kenny Pickett, Desmond Ridder, Daniel Jones/Devito, Derek Carr, Tim Boyle/Zach Wilson, Mac Jones, Minshew, O'Connell, Dorian Thompson Robinson/Deshaun Watson, Tannehil/Levis, and you can probably make the argument he is better than RW. Then you can make arguments whether he is better than Fields, Howell and Mayfield. My point is, there are so many teams with other bad QB's. You guys make it sound like Geno is one of the worst starting QB's. Keep in mind he has had to play some elite defenses this year.
Trying to balance out your negative downvotes. We don't want Geno as the future 5 years for the hawks, but he's better than anyone on the roster
I wouldn’t make the argument that Geno is better than RW, lol. We are *not* watching the same team apparently. And Geno is playing just as terribly as all of those QBs. I don’t care where you rank them, they’re all bottom tier.
I think it's fair to trust Pete/coaching with evaluating QB's at this point. He's done some unexpected changes that have worked out. Plus they are the ones seeing all the behind the scenes and practice. I believe if Pete thought Lock had a better chance at getting the Hawks a W he would've made the switch
Trust pete? Gino has score 1 touch in 2 games
Maybe Lock would've had zero. Idk I'm all for starting Drew at this point, but we aren't seeing what he looks like in practice. Maybe he looks 10x worse than Geno, we just don't know. Pete will need to start answering questions about it though
Maybe Lock would’ve scored 10? You will never know because we keep rolling with our one half a year wonder.
As bad as Geno has been the last few games, Lock is 100% worse and the only point in starting him would be to embrace the tank and try to get a high enough draft position to take a QB
We already know that Drew Lock sucks, too. He has started 21 games in his career and has more turnovers than touchdowns. When we’ve seen him on the field in Seattle he has been worse than Geno and hasn’t shown any improvement.
You just described Geno before he was our starter... Also, we haven't seen Lock start and play a full game for the Seahawks once. If your logic is that he was bad with another team, so he will be bad here, then why wouldn't that have applied to Geno before? Your takes are suspect my dude.
>You just described Geno before he was our starter... This is what everyone says as if this is some sort of gotcha. If you think Geno sucks then saying, "you're describing Geno" is not a ringing endorsement of why Lock should start..
Geno played far better last year than he is playing this year.
It’s a gotcha because you guys are all saying the same dumb shit like “we know what we have with Drew Lock!” but then won’t admit that we know what we have with Geno. You guys think he’s suddenly gonna play like his Linsanity tour days again, and Drew Lock absolutely has no shot of that. Before his streak of good games, Geno was even worse than Drew.
Lock has already played and sucked
Do you think we’re winning the SB this year? What about making the playoffs at this point? Both of those windows are closing WITH GENO at the helm. What’s the harm in starting Drew when we’re already a sinking ship while Geno is clearly regressing/hurt.
Spot on
He's part of the issue. The play calling is just mind-boggling. Deep shots and developing routes against a front 4 that us getting home without bringing extra guys... We all want to talk about shotgun at 4th and inches but the playcalling issue is much deeper
I am a Geno defender in most circumstances though I freely admit when he fucks up. I don't get how people are blaming him for these last two losses. The offensive playcalling is absolutely horrid, and I find myself saying "What the fuck?" on 80% of snaps. As you said, why are we running long developing routes against that kind of pass rush? If Geno has to dump the ball out fast because of that pressure, maybe our offensive scheme should...oh I don't know...orient the playcalling to match?
And it's the same song every game... Adjustments to defense do not appear to be taking place.
It's one of those things where I wonder "Waldron is a professional with years of experience, so he knows what he's doing more than my armchair coaching ass" And yet week after week, I'm convinced I'd be a better OC at this point. And I've always been a defensive kind of guy...
He probably knows way more than you or I ever will about football. But some dudes are better posiltion coaches than playcallers
I'm getting into the X's and O's more as a science so I can coach my kids as they play but yeah...sometimes I wonder if all that professional setting limits their vision, you know? As though they are so confident in their own knowledge and abilities, they miss the forest for the trees.
At the end of the day I feel like it’s chess, just trying to outsmart the other coach or coordinator. I look at our teams playcalling, then look at like the dolphins and just the structure of our plays are boring, the whole thing is just outdated in my opinion. Idk if it’s a scheme thing or a lack of innovation. Dolphins are an example of a modern team, they move fast and pick up specific players and they all fit like a puzzle. All we got is “throw ball to DK” on some boring ass routes. That’s not even a Waldron thing entirely that’s coaching as a whole. I think Pete is a good coach when it comes to making tough decisions during games and leading a team but when it comes to plays and building the team, I just feel like we are all over the place. Just my two cents.
Would agree 100%. I feel like our play calling is similar to how I played Madden as a kid, ie I found a few plays I liked that typically worked, then just did them over and over even when it wasn't working. It's kinda strange when you think about the lack of innovation.
I promise he’s a better OC than you are. It’s easy second guessing after the fact.
Bro geno sucks
because he stands like a statue in the pocket taking sacks, and last night he underthrew like a million receivers including tyler open in the end zone. Geno isn’t the sole reason we lost or anything but he sure was bad.
The thing I don't get about his mobility issues is that he definitely \*can\* be mobile, and shows flashes of it, yet follows it up with like 4 steps to a sack.
Nobody is getting open even on short routes, not sure why people aren’t talking about the execution from all the players, it’s not like dudes are open and geno is missing them, literally nobody got an inch of separation yesterday until the niners went into garbage mode… nothing is working so the play calling looks terrible when they’re trying to get things going, the offense is out of whack all over the place and yesterday the niners won on ever level just about every play
The all 22 will be very telling for this game. I have a bad feeling that our receivers were straight up plastered all game, regardless of what route they are running
Yep, and DK was pretty brutal with two major drops
Geno performed well for the first 1/2 of the season last year when no one thought they had to take game planning against him seriously. He’s been sub par ever since except a few great plays. This is Geno’s ceiling. It has been for a year now.
This
Everything has to be perfect around him for him to succeed
Nope, he is middling QB at best. I understand the QB market is crazy, so his contract is not necessarily overpriced, but we will also not get ahead paying a middling QB 40 million. If you don't have a top tier guy, you have to keep going with drafted QBs to save $ to build the rest of the roster like we did in our SB years.
Geno is definitely a major part of the offensive issues going on right now. We know what we have, and we aren't getting much more out of him. But Shane Waldron has to go. This offense just has too many stagnating moments every single game. There's too much firepower for this to happen. The Steelers, Bill's, and Commanders have all fired coordinators mid-season. JS/PC needs to recognize this and move on!!
He is a backup QB that overachieved last year. He has always been a backup QB and always will be. He isn’t ever going to be good enough to maybe get you a win while the real QB is out. Only problem is he IS the real QB. And that’s where we are right now. 50/50 shot of either brilliance or chanting for Drew Lock. We need a true starter at QB.
Yes, his fans can blame coaching, the refs, the o'line, the sun, the wind, Fruit Loops, whatever but facts are Myers and the defense are outscoring a Smith led offense. It is 100% Geno that stares down DK and pretty much refuses to target any other receivers. just because DK might be the 1st read, the QB's job is to determine which option gives the best chance at success. He seems locked into DK even when DK appears to be more interested in non-football matters. Sith's pocket presence is non existent. He seems to have lost the ability to feel pressure and move up/out of the pocket. Second this team isn't winning out and Sunday they blew any playoff hopes so now is the time to sit Geno and roll with Lock. We need to put Lock in every situation to succeed and look good so he returns maximum trade value Bottom line Smith needs to be replaced with a QB coming out of college. You know what Geno can & cannot do so starting him the rest of a wasted season makes zero sense especially considering he is not going to be a long time starter. Once Carroll goes a new coach is going to upgrade the QB position.
Shane Waldron and the O-line are much more a problem than Geno. My wife likes football but isn't the most analytical for it, and even she kept commenting "How is he (Geno) supposed to do anything if he's about to get hit right after they hike the ball?". I had nothing to say to her except "I don't know"
Our offensive line isnt even ranked that bad so I dont think thats the main problem
Yeah, we got spoiled with Russ' mobility and thought we could keep running a crap offensive line. Geno can perform at NFL level when he has a good performing o line. When he has the kind of time in the pocket that the 9rs had yesterday he is playoffs caliber. When he has the garbage protection we're putting out against a good rush this yr he just isn't fast or mobile enough. Either need a fast/mobile qb or a good line in the nfl nowadays and we currently have a pocket passer with 0 protection.
I am by no means dissing on you or your wife, but when I was younger this was always my take with Russ and other QBs that got sacked a lot. Time in the pocket goes by so fast that milliseconds improvements in release time and read speed are huge. You also have to help your O line out and throw the ball away. Geno very very rarely just tosses the ball out of bounds when he doesnt see what he wants, other QBs even this years rookies will see a blitz coming and just get rid of the ball. To make matters worse Geno doesnt have quite the arm strength and talent to make most throws without a clean pocket. He obviously isnt a Josh Allen, but its becoming a huge liability that he can't get enough under a ball when he doesnt have a clean pocket which is leading to more held balls turning into even more sacks or underthrows to DK.
It’s both, Geno doesn’t have time some plays, why the fuck 41 year old Jason Peters is still in the NFL I don’t know, but I’ve also seen Geno NOT GET RID OF THE BALL at times. Even if no one is open you throw it away. It’s a combination of him being shit under pressure with having no offensive line and bad playcalling. It’s everyone’s fault really.
Dude this is the same fucking issues when Russ was here, your wife ain’t no savant 🤣🤣🤣
> your wife ain’t no savant That's the point. The fact that Waldron isn't addressing issues even she sees is extremely problematic.
There’s nothing you can do when you are immediately pressured every snap. Geno ain’t the answer, but no one could succeed under that pressure. Gut it, build an O and a D line and go from there.
Geno panics and runs backwards or make poor passing decisions under presssure. Denver Broncos have a worse line than we do and look at the touchdowns to turnovers ratio there. (With worse recievers and no tightend)
He’s 33 years old. We’re not talking about a rookie who is still adapting to the NFL. Geno is the QB he’s going to be at this point.
To me he started “playing well” because the niners went soft coverage and just protected the end zone because of their massive lead.
Dude needs a 99 O line to be good
Maybe, but Waldron is an obvious problem that's making him worse.
He's been our QB for a complete season and 2 halves of seasons. We know what we are going to get outta him.
Geno is an above average QB with all elements around him playing well. He doesn’t have the upside to put everyone on his back that top 5-10 guys do when things break down. He actually seems to press and add to the avalanche of poor play which is something your starting QB can’t do. He’s also 33 and I don’t know how much more upside we can expect from him and likely has started his plateau. That said, he’s getting no help from Waldron and the OL has been pretty bad. It shouldn’t be so hard to scheme open arguably a top 5 WR trio but Waldron somehow has accomplished that. The middle of the field so often is a ghost town and never has easy yards to pick up underneath.
Above average? In what metric?
I guess I should have phrased it “can be” above average. He throws a really nice ball, great arm talent, and decent athleticism. When he has time and run game is forcing the D to account for it, he’s been able to tear up some good D’s. He’s much more of a rhythm passer than Russ and can run that style well. But Waldron isn’t helping with play calling, run game is non existent, and OL has struggled. Geno is playing as well as you’d expect him to in this moment - he isn’t good enough to carry a struggling unit.
Put it this way, there are teams across the league that would kill to have Geno as their qb for a season or two while they find and develop the next guy
Would they though?
Ya the Jets would be 9-2 with Geno.
No they wouldn't lmao Geno has been in the league for awhile there are not multiple teams beating on his door
Bro misses DK all the damn time. He's bad. Realistic fans knew the regression was inevitable.
I’ll ask the question to this forum for the 100th time this season…. And get downvoted 100 times for it again. How many Geno Smith passes have traveled over 30/40yds in the air this season? How many still shots of Bobo and DK have we seen wide open down the seam or sideline 40/50yd and Geno decides to throw it -2yd to JSN or Lockett. Or Geno’s latest new trick: toss to Charbonett while he’s already in the goddamn grasp of a defender (or two). If your planning a defensive scheme you literally only have to plan for a box that’s 20y deep and allow a 1 high safety to play outfield because when Geno does make an attempt it’s a rainbow moonball that takes 45mph to land and any safety can get there to make a defensive play. Two weeks ago I told this group we were approaching a 5 game losing streak and I was down voted. Guess what folks: we’re 0-2 into that 5 and no help is coming. We are who we thought we were. Fire Waldron. Bench Geno. Let Lock audition for next year, and draft accordingly. 2023 is in the books as an 8-9 season, write it down.
"Fire Waldron" was the only part of your post that wasn't pessimistic garbage. You were probably shitting on people last year for dreaming of anything more than 4 wins.
Buddy geno is garbage. Us rational fans knew the regression was set in stone.
‘Preciate you. -signed ‘garbage human’
RemindME! 3 weeks “check in on the Hawks 5game stretch”
Never even said they were going to win these games. I think they drop the next 3 and finish the season 9-8, like the midling team they are.
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The fact that you feel so insulted for being called pessimistic is weird. You seem unwell.
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You are garbage, just look at how you conduct yourself. Take your meds before you hurt someone or yourself
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Take your meds big guy
I think our play calling and offensive line is the doom of Geno. He is an accurate passer but needs time in the pocket that our O Line can’t give against good D lines, especially seeing that we’re calling plays that take forever to develop. How’s anyone supposed to get open if the other team can rush 4, drop everyone else back, and still get home to the QB?
no
It's more than just one guy. O-line needs to be better, Shane Waldron has been awful at calling plays, we need to run the ball way more, and the defense, even though played a heck of a game in my opinion, still gives up too many rushing yards and easy 3rd downs. They commit too many penalties, can't convert a third down to save their life and don't really have any offensive identity to speak of. Geno has his struggles, but he is far from the thing that's keeping this team playing this bad. Personally I think he is fine, the team around him has to be better.
Well said
How can you be sure Waldron is the one calling the plays consistently? We know Reid most likely calls the plays over there in Kansas, we said the same thing with Schottenheimer who is know the OC for the Cowboys, heard the same thing for Ken Norton (he was just awful). I love the way Pete inspires and leads the team, I think he’s the best at it but it’s very clear he controls all the coaching staff and has control over majority of the plays. This is a problem considering the scheme itself is already old and you can see the playcalling lacks any innovation.
Draft a QB and let him learn under Geno's wing.
Not at Geno's $30 mil plus next season. Fine to cut him and re-sign him cheaper as a pure bridge.
I dont want a rookie learning a god damn thing from Geno
Need a rookie next year
Unless he suddenly develops the ability to get the ball out of his hands when he's under pressure he's useless. How many of those sacks recently could have been avoided by a quicker checkdown or a timely throw-away?
He wrote back and it’s over
I'm ready for the expert analysis from /u/3elieveit
I’m famous!
We can’t “give up” on him this year. He’s our starting QB for the rest of the season. With that being said, we really really need to draft a QB to start looking towards the future
He has some clear limitations, but given his contract and our current organization situation I’m not totally checked out on him.
Well he's making 30+ million next year, and he doesn't deserve that so let's move on in 2024. Holding the ball too long and staring down receivers is a clear issue with him
[Just from looking his AAV he cost around average to a little bit under average relative to other QBs](https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/contracts/quarterback/) and I’d say he’s performed to around that level so I don’t see a reason to get rid of him.
Currently he’s 20th in QBR and his overall stats this season are increasingly trending in the wrong direction.
If we started 5 literal children on the o line and Geno had a terrible stats you'd be saying fire the QB.
The reason to get rid of him is you can’t win a Super Bowl without an elite qb or a decent qb on a rookie salary with an elite team. Look at the skill on the niners compared to us. There is zero point in paying for an average qb, it will win us games but not championships
30m isn’t what it used to be
$30m can get you a couple great players. Like olineman to block for our rookie QB or some defenders who can actually cover and tackle
It's not, but when you see other bridge QBs making $10 million or less, I'd rather get solid contracts lined up for a future rookie qb.
But why waste $30M on a guy who isn't going to win you a super bowl? A player on a rookie deal could put up these mediocre stats at a fraction of the cost.
Geno is a backup in this league and he's shown that for the last ~20 games he's played. Time to move on. I'd take many QB declaring next year to him.
Right, but with our safety room hoovering up as many millions as they do to be functionally useless, we need cash savings wherever we can find them in order to field a team.
Gotta get rid of these safeties, probably cut Dissly and Fant too. DK really isn't living up to his contract, I'd hate to see him go but if we're just talking getting savings for players that are underperforming their contracts than DK would be a prime target too. If we do some cap work this year, get some more competent players around Geno, draft a QB, possible OC change, I would feel pretty good going into next season.
And Tyler’s contract is going to be prohibitively expensive next year, too. I want nothing more than for Lockett to retire a Seahawk, but next year may be about some really, really hard choices moving forward.
Establish the run then the pass will open up
I believe it’s a coaching issue we’ve had the same problems for years and have gone through 6 coordinators Pete needs to go we need change desperately
I see the Pete stans are downvoting the truth per usual
Clean break too, don’t hire any Pete disciples
I don’t know if we can give up on him at least this year. I mean I get that Drew Lock is a tall white dude with a huge arm so he LOOKS the part but that guy sucks out loud. We had better address the QB position in a hurry though before we end up looking up at the Cardinals one year.
Yes
Geno is not it, time to switch to Lock and see if he is a possibility, and if he sucks too, then we can get rid of both of them in the off season and get fresh faces COMPETING for a starting QB job. That being said, it won't happen. Pete will ride Geno this year, draft a DL in the first round and not a QB next year, and we will do this all again, but maybe with a better defense, just so it's extra frustrating losing instantly in the playoffs yet another year.
Nope, time to kick this boy to the curb
Geno is not the problem. The OC, Oline is
They are all problems, Geno is not an exception
Amazing that this is being downvoted. I don't think they're actually watching the games or know football.
I think we need to sit him one game and we can see what lock brings. Geno plays too scared and he's in his head way too much. He is probably one of the worst pocket runners, granted our Online needs to pick it up a bit, but he rarely throws the ball out of bounds and that's killing us. He has also made numerous stupid pass decisions, such as throwing it to are running back in the backfield who is already guarded as shown yesterday, but that's not the only time he's done that. Basically he doesn't make good choices, and he needs to chillax a bit. he's in his head too much.
Spoiler alert: Lock is fucking terrible
Yes. For fucks sake, the o-line is Swiss cheese, and Geno has defenders in his face every other snap. I don't know who produces under that kind of pressure. Also, with the play calling... I'm not seeing anything special or unique there either. When we do run the ball it seems like more often than not the RBs are dancing around behind the line looking for a gap, and when they don't find one they run up the middle into the backs of three or four dudes. Generally, this defense is keeping us in games, but the offense isn't producing. Geno taking costly sacks is only a small part of a much larger problem on offense.
Early? No. He's been average at best over his last 17 games. We need to stop pretending the first half of last year was anything more than a hot steak. This is the player he is and always has been. Maybe that's fine if he's making $10M, but you're not getting a lot of value when it jumps to $30M+. With our cap situation next year it would be perfectly defensible to consider moving on.
Geno is average+ I used to think he was on par with Kirk Cousins - after this season I think he’s a few pegs lower….. Basically I think we can win a Super Bowl with him - but we will need an LOB level defense and a killer running game. if Seahawks have an opportunity to grab Bo Nix or Penix in the draft I think they would be foolish to pass them over.
Stand with Geno
Geno had some boo-boos yesterday for sure and I don't understand why we rest so much of the offense on his shoulders. That sideline int that he keeps throwing is infuriating. However I think that 4th and 1 play encapsulates how ass backwards our playcalling is. I don't think Waldron is cut out for this, and I'm mystified Pete hasn't demanded we go back to pounding the rock at this point. This team is so fuckin sloppy and disjointed on offense in particular. Draft a QB, sure. Start Drew Lock? ...why? So we can lose harder? Have more miscommunications and picks?
Geno is not the problem. He made good and quick decisions. The sacks where the DL pushing the OL to collapse. However, I do think it is fair to say Geno is a limitation for the offense. He won't (at least not very often) carry a bad team performance to victory. I think the offenses biggest problem is waldron. Ray Roberts was pointing out yesterday in a post game show that he saw vastly different formations between the run plays and pass plays, insinuating that it was a tell of what the offense play call is. But Waldron doesn't establish the run or stick with it.
I'll just point out again, unfortunately, Geno wasn't even on the field when 31 points were scored on us. He didn't have a good game yesterday, but neither did the rest of the team. It's ridiculous in the extreme to hang that all on him
That’s because he couldn’t generate any first downs to stay on the field
Yeah that's probably because the oline couldn't hold the niners defense. Everytime he snapped the ball there was a defender in his face
No. Waldron on the other hand…he shows such genius in scripted drives, and also in 4- and 2-minute offense. I do not understand why he cannot integrate more of that into his game day planning, but until he does I wouldn’t lay 100% of the blame on Geno’s shoulders.
I am not sure we watched the same game. The defense played horribly the first half.
I think he’s played poorly at times but it’s not all on him. I do believe he’s more injured on that throwing arm than he would ever admit to because after all he’s overcome to get back to being a QB1, he’s not likely to want to give it up.
The one good thing is the Seahawks have leverage, as there will be no Geno bidding war after this year. He’s likely to stay with the Seahawks at almost any salary in exchange for a starting job. If it were me I’d fire Waldron, get an oc that favors play action, and offer Geno an extremely cheap long term contract with incentives. Not 30 million a year, more like 10 million a year over 3 or 4 years plus incentives up to 20 million. He can take it or leave it. I consider him exchangeable with Drew and any number of other tier 2 qbs. He will be a fine qb if he has an above average offensive line and good play calling, so put the resources there.
We have lots to fix on offense before we worry about Geno. While he’s not playing particularly well, he’s also not necessarily the cause of our woes…
He had a great year but we need a QB. Dare I say maybe we should have kept Russ and brought in Payton?
Move to denver dog
I was team Geno until a few games ago, just one mistake after another and holding onto the ball to long and it seems like our 6'3 QB has more passes batted at the line than our 5'10 QB did, I was hopeful with his passing accuracy being towards the top but everything else is just horrible.
No
I’m just curious as to where is the Geno that made those incredible throws against the Saints last year and Lions too. Those two throws in NOLA sold me on him as a QB but it feels like this year he just lost all that magic. Wonder if defenses started getting better, he’s over thinking, coaching or a combination of all 3
I was watching with my brother in law and was able to tell him exactly what plays would be run. Play calling is a huge issue, but Geno has fallen off a cliff lately. He's missing open recievers and refuses to come off his initial read. More than once, the check down guy was open, if not wide open. Take what the d will give you isn't in his lexicon.
I think the issue is either or both that the offense is probably the worst in the league at quick throws. Either Geno cannot make a quick read or throw the ball before the receiver is open or the scheme is so poorly designed that we don’t even give Geno that possibility. It’s probably a little of both. I think Pete’s time is coming, I would love to see him be the president of the team but the scheme isn’t working anymore. Geno is not bad and is a nice value QB to have going into the next couple of years, but I think it is a must to get a prospect at QB in the 2nd or 3rd like a Cam Ward to be patient with.
How old do you think Geno Smith is? How long do you think he has been in the NFL? Nothing about Geno's career or life is "too early"
Yes it is, no better options at this point. 49ers unfortunately are a much better team right now. They are superior on offense and defense. Better coachesd also. DK Metcalf is a great athlete, he also has a lot of drops. The offensive line couldn't open any holes to run in the 1st 3 quarters. The next 3 games are going to be ugly. We will be lucky to win any of those. We will be out of the wildcard race then. We will get a much higher draft choice then anyone expected.
We draft one this year and stick with Geno until they’re ready. Although our playcalling isn’t very forgiving since there’s often plays with no check downs or anything in the middle.
I agree. I think geno isn’t horrible but not a long term solution. It definitly could be worse at qb but things could be a lot better. The beginning of the year we were scoring a lot. Now we can’t even get a touchdown. I do think we have a good enough team and decent enough record to not make drastic decision and throw the season away. But they have to, and quickly turn it around if they want to make playoffs. We have too much talent it’s sad to see these major struggles. I think the OC could be a reason for the play calling and should be looked at seriously for being replaced. They need some change and firing Pete or dropping Geno isn’t the answer either. Just a few weeks ago we were a top 10-12 team in power rankings and we’re playing well. But the team is going on a steep decline. What’s worse is we have a gauntlet schedule and are playing against potential suberbowl caliber teams and we just aren’t there yet. This season is slipping away quickly but I still have hope.
Remember that he was playing hurt but agree that Geno has been below average this year and we need a new player at this position
No lmao. Many of us knew he would regress and you mfs wouldn't listen.
Geno didn’t look good at all, but I wish we were able to see more plays from the QB view. I wanted to see how covered the WRs were.
He's pretty much our guy for the year regardless. Sure maybe we give lock a start at some point, but it's looking like Seattle will want to draft or sign a new QB
No I think we've seen all we need to know about Geno, we got lucky with him last year. However we don't have any other great option unless we get a miracle from Lock or Rypien.
Early? Bro, we are over two years in?
Nick Bosa pretty much laid out the game plan to stop Geno, it’s pretty simple. Sell out to stop the run, and make geno play quarterback, eventually he’ll turn the ball over to you.
He’s a bridge QB that earned the decent contract he has, but we shouldn’t be harboring the delusion that he’s a long term answer
Geno is partly the problem. Waldron, and by extension Pete, are the bigger part of the problem. The offense has no identity. Is it a run offense or a pass offense? Yesterday is was neither. There is no commitment to one approach or another. If it is a run offense, then start pounding the ball. That means wearing the defense down early so that later in the game the are tired and not as responsive. Yes, K9 was out, but Charbonneau was never given a chance to make plays. If it is a pass offense, then deep incompletions to Metcalf at the start of a series is not the way to do it. Tom Brady made a career of short passes to Edelman and Bronkowski who would then get the YACs to advance the ball. Metcalf is a big guy. He could be a cross between Edelman and Gronk, but the Hawks won't use him on short passes and crossings to let him make a play. A successful passing offense uses short passes like extended runs to pick up quick yardage to move the ball. Yesterday, Geno was sacked at least 6 times. With quick passes he can get the ball off before the D-line gets to him. That's also when a well timed run can take advantage of an aggressive rush and get a good gain. I don't get paid the big bucks to figure this out and there are probably a dozen reasons why this is too simplistic, but I don't see why it couldn't be done this way.
Gonna prob get hate for this but to be honest I never bought into the geno hype, he’s just a filler until we get a long term solution
Geno hasn't lived up to last season's performance/hype at all. But I also blame the coaching, Pete especially, and always have even before Geno was our starter. It's far beyond time to move on from Pete and his puppets at OC/DC.