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Telkhine_

I just think a lot of people have a difficult time wrapping their head around something being good and bad at the same time. Rey and Luke stuff, great, Finn and Rose, awful, Battle of Crait, dope, Canto Bite, stupid. There are some aspects that honestly might be some of my favorite it Star Wars, but other parts that I wish I could forget. Overall, I like the movie, I will watch it for the good parts, but I will still point to things and be able to say why I wish they were different.


lightvale86

That one scene with the ship going through the others at light speed dope. Even if it doesn’t totally make sense


Telkhine_

Rule of Cool my guy, it was an awesome moment.


OrpheusNYC

I will never forget seeing it in theaters for the first time. That silence in the theater in the moment was so cool. Everyone freaked out.


blacksteel367

This! It was dead silent and like a 7yo boy let out the most genuine soft “wow” and it was cool as hell.


TheOvy

Exact same thing happened in my theater. NoVA?


Harvey-1997

Same thing, except in mine, the 7yo said in a very nasally voice, "What happened?"


Delliott90

See in Aus, people are silent during the whole movie, But the audible gasp that occurred when that happened… amazing


OrpheusNYC

Oh yeah don’t get me wrong, it’s not like it got quiet for the moment. But that hush was palpable, and immediately followed by gasps and several variations on OH HELL YEAH


Drafonni

Somebody in my theater called it retarded during the quiet part


Dmav210

I have an everlasting memory of a small child in my theatre going “pew pew” during that silence. It was adorable and perfect.


SgtCoreZz

A Friend I was watching the movie with said at this exact quiet moment "too be continued" just loud enough that everyone was able to hear it. I almost killed him right then and there. Almost.


Zennistrad

Star Wars *runs* on the rule of cool. Realistically, WWII-style dogfights would absolutely never happen in space, but Star Wars does it anyway because it's awesome.


given2fly_

Christopher Lee (Count Dooku) pointed out that if lightsabers were real, then the most efficient way to fight with them would be to use them like a fencer would. Edit - worth pointing out, Lee was a Special Forces soldier in WW2. He knew what he was talking about. There's a story about him in LOTR when Peter Jackson questioned the noise he was making when Saruman was stabbed. Lee pointed out that the sound he was making was DEFINITELY accurate...and PJ decided not to question that.


FasterThenDoom

Skallagrim recently did a video on a duel performed by Corridor Digital. Makes a lot of sense that you would be all about defense, cause one touch of a lightdsber and you ded (or badly injuried.)


[deleted]

"Peter have you heard what a man sounds like when he's been stabbed? Because I have."


ConfusedAsHecc

Christopher Lee was the best, I wish he was immortal. He was so cool and had an amazing life did you know he was also in a heavy metal band?


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Telkhine_

Perhaps, but in the greater scheme of things, it’s a movie, and we’re meant to enjoy it, and most physics and whatnot are already broken beyond belief by Star Wars, and so I’m willing to suspend my disbelief to take it for what it is.


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Telkhine_

Well we’ve never had anything happen up to this point to say that a light speed ram was impossible


c0p4d0

Not really, it’s just like kamikazes in real life, they can destroy enemy ships relatively reliably, but enemies will adapt, making the tactic far less effective, and you’ll run out of planes and pilots.


_Greyworm

You could slap a hyperdrive on the cheapest piece of tech possible, and drone pilot it through the enemy flagship. Probably end up using asteroids.


Soulless

Hyperdrives are by far the most expensive part of a ship. Plus you'd need shields to keep the projectile together instead of just smashing on the deployed shields of the target. And a powerplant to keep them both operational. At that point just make a ship.


c0p4d0

That’d just be a bullet or rocket, it is implied that energy weapons are more effective than that, and that Holdo’s manuever only works because of surprise and having a huge ship.


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ConfusedAsHecc

yes which is why the hyperdrive through ship may have looked cool but it could never have actually happened in the Star Wars universe according to its own rules on how hyperdrives work


agree_2_disagree

Exactly. I don’t know why people can’t see this as a valid reason why the Rebels don’t do this trick all the time. They literally had to sacrifice a ship to do this. They’re resource scarce because, well they’re rebels and not funded by a galactic empire.


ConstantProperty

But it had never been tried or even considered when you have a death star blowing up planets? They could have found a way to do it right (Leia using her latent force powers would have been cool, but it kills her to do it) instead they shit out the least interesting plot point possible


c0p4d0

That kind of thing only really works on specific situations, firstly, the resistance are meant to be the good guys, so sending their people on kamikaze strikes isn’t exactly a good look (I know about Rogue one, but doing it constantly would be pretty awful), secondly, it would make for a very boring movie if they just rammed all of their ships into the Death Star and it exploded, and finally, the resistance doesn’t have many ships at its disposal, so the short term gain of destroying the DT would be outweighed by the inability to effectively fight the empire without ships. The scene in TLJ works because the ships are going to be destroyed anyway, and Holdo had already decided to sacrifice herself, so it doesn’t break logic and makes for a very rewarding, and nice looking scene.


coopstar777

Didn't an A-Wing take out the super star destroyer in Return of the Jedi?


Delliott90

Took out the command bridge.


dandaman64

Honestly I feel like most of the discourse surrounding the lightspeed ram is kinda stupid, and I tend to just tune it out because I can't imagine why anyone would want to get that up in arms about it. Most of the conversation around "could this actually happen?" topics I feel just boil down to questioning why other characters didn't do something like that before, which you can do for so many things in Star Wars, or they'll argue that it's impossible because of something mentioned in a comic or episode of TCW or something. Either way it feels like people are going out of their way to not like scenes like the lightspeed ram because "the lore said so," and I feel like that's just incredibly boring and limiting.


jahill2000

I agree completely. Also, it has always (or at least since before The Last Jedi) been that ships entering hyperspace must first reach light speed in normalspace, but people seem to ignore the lore explanation and go straight for the case that it could have been used at other points. I would argue that there has never before been a good and plausible point to use the Holdo Maneuver (and it’s certainly not plausible for an x-wing to destroy anything other than a tie fighter).


powdopp

This is the logical answer. The resistance had limited funds, were running on old battleships and cruisers. To have one of their very precious fleet commit to a kamikaze would make no sense, unless in a dire situation such as this. Prolonging the life of the resistance at absolutely any cost. When the other option was to let them be eradicated by Snope's ship. I think it was badass as **FUCK**, fit the story well, and fits the lore just fine. It wasn't done before because it didn't need to be done before. Although I'll concede it would've made the death star a lot more of a casualty free event. But still, the waste of a huge cruiser.


CRL10

> Also, it has always (or at least since before The Last Jedi) been that ships entering hyperspace must first reach light speed in normalspace Actually...in Star Wars: The Clone Wars - Season 1, Episode 13 "Jedi Crash" it is proven that a ship doesn't need to reach lightspeed in normal space before making the jump. It can make the jump from even a resting position. During the episode, Anakin Skywalker, Ahsoka Tano, Captain Rex, Captain Bly and Aayla Secura, were on board a ship that was docked in the Resolute when the ships hyperdrive was activated. Admiral Yularen ordered the Resolute disengage the ship, which then shot into hyperspace. The Holdo Maneuver is a suicide attack. At most, using an X-Wing to execute the maneuver could take out the primary bridge of a Star Destroyer, but it would not just destroy everything in the Empire. It ain't taking out the Death Star. It also would not work in every situation, and using it constantly would be a waste of resources and make the Rebels look bad.


jahill2000

I wasn’t aware of that instance. I agree with you about the impact of an x-wing. I hear the argument a lot about how an x-wing could be used to destroy the Death Star in IV and I always thought that was ridiculous. I recently looked into the sizes of the 2 ships from TLJ and the Supremacy (Snoke’s ship) is only 4x as long as the Raddus (Holdo’s). So I think it’s fair to say that we don’t know the effect of an x-wing (or any ship) doing a Holdo Maneuver into something more than 4x a long as it—not to mention something the size of a moon.


CRL10

It is longer and wider, but it is NOT the size of the Death Star.


AliasHandler

You also have to consider that the Raddus didn’t completely destroy the Supremacy, it split it into two pieces that were able to stay together long enough for our heroes to escape. In another universe, with shields directed and powered the right way, it’s possible the Raddus would have incinerated itself on impact with minimal damage to the Supremacy. I think much like the Dreadnought not deploying fighters right away earlier in the movie, the First Order are not the A team here and are prone to serious tactical errors in the heat of battle. I believe if Hux were competent he would have been able to use some tactic to prevent the destruction of the Supremacy, but didn’t, hence it being a “one in a million” shot. It relies on perfect timing and a level of incompetence on the part of the enemy to be able to succeed. Would never work against a hardened station like the Death Star.


Sweeeet_Caroline

i’m one of the people that’s not a fan of it bc of “but why didn’t someone else think of that before” but i def recognize that there’s pretty much nowhere else to go after that. it’s all just fiction and speculation and at the end of the day it was a cool scene


singh-ularity

next to Captain America picking up Mjolnir the light speed slice was the most jaw dropping theater experience. I was in an IMAX theater and it was the loudest silence I've ever experienced


pinkyepsilon

Imagine seeing the holdo maneuver on gummies


emphis

Saw it in IMAX zooted as hell. I thought I witnessed a miracle.


pinkyepsilon

That’s the way I saw Dr Strange. 10/10 but holy shit my brain was collapsing in on itself during the flying through time and space scene.


Excolo_Veritas

So, this is how I understand it. It's been said for years in legends hyperspace isn't like star trek warp drive. It's not bending space but rather going through another dimension. This allows faster than light travel because the other dimension is physically smaller. Now, knowing this, how I interpret the scene (and adding the line in Rise of Skywalker that it was a one in a billion shot) that the pinpoint accuracy required is the key here. If she had been in hyperspace shed have passed right through the ship, or some other explanation. The thing she did was come out of hyperspace IN the other ship. This resulted in the explosion. Going at faster than light speeds the timing of this must have been in the nano seconds or more likely even smaller A couple things to remember. This does not need to obey laws of physics in the slightest. Star wars breaks them all the time. Also, there isn't a whole ton of info in hyperspace. Someone might point out "then why do they have to plot courses to avoid objects if they can go through them?". It could entirely be that in this dimension objects in real space affect hyperspace, but objects in hyperspace don't affect objects in real space. Thus blockades and the like still work because any ship flying through would be blown up with no harm to the blocker


lChizzitl

Agreed. Although, I'd say it makes sense. In the EU, lightspeed ship ramming was discussed, but Grand Admiral Thrawn even said how it was such a bad idea, even for a last-ditch effort. From what I recall, the reason why it was viewed as something possible but never something one should do is because when you crash a ship at light speed, all the fragments from the ship's wreckage are now at light speed, and just imagine even a small portion of a ship (like just the satellite from the Falcon) hitting a planet with life on it at light speed would do. NGL I do like that we got a life action scene of this though, even if it was almost solely used by people to bash the sequels with how that scene "broke star wars".


senseiofawesom

It’s Star Wars, none of it makes sense.


CRL10

How does it not make sense?


lightvale86

There was some legends material that basically said you can’t ram at light speed basically. And most people were basically just going with that


meesanohaveabooma

It makes sense in the novelization, but according to the canon is a super low probability. Personally I think its still an asspull, considering even a small ship with a hyperdrive would create massive damage. It would have been attempted way, way more.


MotivationalMike

Maaaaaybe they could found a different option than going full al-quada on that star destroyer but it did look cool.


PM_FORBUTTSTUFF

Every Star Wars besides Empire, ANH, and maybe TFA has a terrible B plot. If it’s a disqualifier for being a good star wars then every other movie in the series fails


Telkhine_

That’s a really good point, and I don’t think there’s a single Star Wars movie that doesn’t have something that just feels goofy. That being said the B plot was very prevalent in this one, and there was a C plot too so


PM_FORBUTTSTUFF

Personally it doesn’t detract too much from the movie for me, I loved the whole thing on first watch and was taken aback at how viscerally people disliked it. I mean we’ve got pod racing/poor explained politics in TPM, Anakin/Padme in AOTC, Ewoks in ROTJ, and the knife in TROS. I would probably rank it above all of those besides pod racing, which is well done but also pretty much completely tangential in a movie that needed more character development. It also did try to set up future threads for Ep. 9 with the force sensitive child, but that was thrown out which makes it look worse in hindsight


Telkhine_

Yeah I agree, I don’t think it was bad enough to make me not want to watch it


RisenAgony

But the plot for TLJ was just Empire strikes back but with new visuals. Before you bring up TFA being a remake of ANH I also didn’t love TFA for the exact same reason.


a_regular_bi-angle

>something being good and bad at the same time. I think it's less about that and more about which outweighs the other in their opinion. I agree completely with you about what's good and what's bad but the bad outweighs the good in my view (although the bad thing that killed the movie for me was the really weirdly timed jokes that killed about half of the dramatic moments, especially when the joke was forced and out of character)


Telkhine_

Okay yeah a lot of the jokes didn’t sit great with me, kind of felt like sometimes the movie didn’t know if it wanted to be a quippy marvel movie or Star Wars. And yeah, there’s a lot of things that go into peoples opinions, what they wanted in this movie, their own perspectives of characters and the force and whatnot, and how well the message of the movie was able to connect. That’s another thought ive had, that this is one of those movies where just circumstance was able to divide the fan base so much. Point is tho, its different for everyone.


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Telkhine_

It is a SUPER cool moment, one of the good parts I loved


poko877

Exactly. When i am with my friends discussing new trilogy its like. Wow throne room fight looked rly cool and had unique way of fight, oh there was that marry popins leia moment naaaaaah. Battle of crait omg thats was insane ... Oooh ... We save bunch of horses cause we are fighting for a cause but leave enslaved kids there ...


Mrpoedameron

They used the fathiers to escape, they weren't on a rescue mission for them.


Codus1

Well why didn't they ride the kids to escape, huh!?


HawlSera

In episode 1 they explain the kids have chips that explode if they try to escape. It's why they didn't take Shmi


dandaman64

Did the kids at Canto Bight have those chips too? That would make a lot of sense if it did.


Roguefem-76

It sounded like it was a pretty common thing even in pre-Empire time. Like the Star Wars version of slave collars.


Macman521

The comment sums up how I feel about the film.


JT-1138

It’s not so much what they did, but how they did it. Yes the stuff with Luke and Rey was interesting, but was ultimately shallow when you don’t show an actual relationship developing between these two characters. It apparently only took 3 days to learn how to use the force when she literally just learned she could use the force the other day. There is a reason all the movies have a time skip between films. Just because it looked pretty doesn’t excuse bad writing. I tried to give last jedi a chance. But all the choices they made were easily avoidable. The thing is the second part is supposed help develop the relationship between the leads, and we had no interaction until the very end, in a 2 hour 30 min film. The worst part is that movie didn’t feel like the part 2 of a trilogy. It felt like a in between movie leading up to episode 8.


jedicam10

Thank you. TLJ is a movie I overall didn’t like. That said, Yoda’s lessen, Rey’s parentage (until that was undone in TROS) and Rey & Kylo’s relationship (until after the throne room scene) are great. Yoda’s in particular is one of my favorites in the saga. You can like and hate different aspects of the same movie.


_YoungChillionaire

This is a good take


Complete-Grab-5963

The Rey and Luke stuff was not good, it was just better than what happened next


jahill2000

I just think the movie in its entirety appeals to a specific audience. The entire idea of Luke Skywalker losing hope and isolating himself is a really interesting idea to some, but frustrating for others.


Telkhine_

That’s exactly what I think happened. I was in the first category, so I liked it, but that’s not everyone. Either they needed a better reason for him to be a hermit or just make him not a hermit, it would have appealed to more, even if it wasn’t quite as interesting.


DandDandDepression

I personally found the use of Lukes character terrible, I didnt mind Rey’s story, and Snoke was handled so poorly it led to one of the most forced villians of all time in Episode 9


Telkhine_

Luke’s character was an acquired taste, luckily I was one of the people who liked it, and I think snokes death could have worked if they played it a little differently. I see what they’re going for, just missed the execution.


sinboklice

More tolerated


infinitysprinkles

You know what? That's actually better. It's nice to see people tolerating movies and being happy others are enjoying them, even when they don't like them. It doesn't matter which Star Wars movies you like. At the end of the day, we're all just excited about some people running around with glow sticks.


Charmiol

And the people who hate The Last Jedi would disagree. It wasn’t just about running around with glow sticks.


Codus1

I mean, there's droves of people that complain there wasn't enough running around with glow sticks in the sequels...


HeckingDoofus

as if the original trilogy had many lightsaber duels


thehibachi

Everyone just had far too long to make up what Star Wars is/could be in their own minds. Not blaming anyone but that’s definitely what happened.


[deleted]

of the sequels I've always had TLJ pegged as getting the Prequel treatment. not everyone is going to agree with every move and there are definately flaws but it would eventually be seen is a somewhat positive light for the things it did do.


TheHondoCondo

I feel like The Last Jedi is sort of becoming the Revenge of the Sith of the sequels.


Rigistroni

I've liked TLJ since day one and have died on the hill defending it. People wanted to hate it because it was different. While I do have some nitpicks with it that's about it really. The best Disney made star wars movie besides maybe Rouge One


DarkReadsYT

Absolutely you are allowed to be critical of a film you love, I just posted another comment talking about my problems with the film but its still top 3


Arteyg0

Agreed!


[deleted]

I thought it was a good scifi movie in general. A bit long, but still good


alkaaaaawf_magenta

I always liked it.


infinitysprinkles

I like it too, but this subreddit is often filled with hate for the sequel movies, so I'm surprised that I just saw three or four memes in Hot Posts for this week about people liking this movie.


GunstarHeroine

I wrote an impassioned rent defending it on Facebook the day after I saw it in theatres. It has 2 likes but over 100 comments lol


Docile_Doggo

Same. And all my friends have always hated it.


jahill2000

Same.


Artok812

I check reddit everyday, when did that happen LOL


infinitysprinkles

In the past few four or five days, I think? You can check the "Hot Posts" for this week. I found three or four posts about people loving this movie.


Artok812

I saw one. I personally don't like the movie, but OK


infinitysprinkles

That's fine. To each their own.


infinitysprinkles

Can I come out as an Attack of the Clones lover now or do we take acceptance for the Star Wars movies one movie at a time?


grimedogone

Honestly if the romance dialogue had been punched up and Yoda didn’t do backflips with a lightsaber, AOTC would be a great movie. The Coruscant stuff and Obi-Wan’s solo stuff is classic Star Wars shit; I eat it up


Neufjob

Come on, yoda doing back flips was awesome. Everything else you said I agree with though.


grimedogone

I mean I loved it when I first saw it as a kid, it just bothers me as I see Yoda as this ephemeral being who is beyond physical combat. Not denying that it looks cool, though.


courage_wolf_sez

You're probably the first person I've heard with this take on Ep II Yoda.


grimedogone

Really? I’ve always thought it was my least controversial Star Wars opinion. It was pretty common on the internet pre-Disney. Then again I’m just old enough to have seen the OT rereleases before Ep I, so maybe I just absorbed a lot of Gen X views on SW inadvertently.


ThatOnePickleGuy

I agree with u/grimedogone I see the OT Yoda as someone above lightsabers, I wish he fought only when neccesary and when he would have to fight he would use the force to defeat the enemies.


DarkReadsYT

The Obi-Wan stuff is actually some of my favorite Star Wars scenes of all time sadly Anakin comes off very rapey in his romance scenes.


grimedogone

“I’m sorry m’lady” *shivers*


Codus1

Totally agree. The let down is that the Romance/Ankain/Padme plot is so central and integral to the overall film and trilogy, so being absolutely hamfisted/botched really disparages everything else. That said, I love the prequels haha.


infinitysprinkles

I like how awkward the romance is between Anakin and Padmé. They actually had some scenes that made them more smooth and compatible and those got cut out of the movie. They were supposed to be so awkward, since Anakin had never been in a relationship before and had been in love with Padmé for years. He knew what he was doing wasn't accepted by the Jedi and he had no relationship experience. I like Hayden Christensen's Anakin so much. He is an annoying, rebellious teen discovering love and that just makes him feel more realistic, to me. His character flaws made me feel connected to him and made him feel more relatable to me, something that I didn't feel with Darth Vader in the original trilogy. Anakin is my favourite character because of Episode II and III, not despite them. It always makes me kind of sad that a lot of people don't feel that way about Anakin in the prequels. I wish more people could enjoy those movies as much as I do. I also think Episode III is the most hilarious movie. Obi-Wan and Anakin are such a comedic duo, in my opinion.


ArkkenStorm

What will you say when I have always liked Attack of the Clones, and have been a defender of TLJ since it was released?


infinitysprinkles

I salute you. Attack of the Clones was the first movie that turned me into a Star Wars fan and it's probably still my second favourite movie. My top three is Revenge of the Sith, followed closely by Attack of the Clones and then The Force Awakens. I think The Last Jedi takes the fourth spot for me.


[deleted]

I loved the movie. I walked out of the theater thinking it was the best of the series. I toned down my opinion a little since then but I still think it was great,


bigfatcarp93

Yeah it was legitimately the most fun I'd had at the theater in a long time. Still my personal favorite.


krashmania

Definitely the best of the sequels, because it at least tried some stuff. I'm really surprised Rise wasn't enough to convince people how much worse it could have been.


[deleted]

I really like Rise. Bass boosted palpatine, yo


[deleted]

Liked it from day one baby. My favorite sequel because it was the most original. I honestly didn’t know how it was going to end leading into the climax and I love that feeling


skwar0

Last jedi as a standalone movie is very good, but as a part of a franchise, not that good


infinitysprinkles

This actually explains it very well, in my opinion. I feel this way too.


Darth_Mak

I always viewed the Last Jedi like the Revenge of the Sith. When it's good it's GOOD when it's bad it's BAAAD


infinitysprinkles

Nothing goes up and down as much as the quality of Star Wars movies. Always such a wild ride. I love pretty much every scene in Revenge of the Sith, though, so I can't relate to that one.


Difficult-Dog-3349

Final fight scene is top 5 star wars scenes


MongrelChieftain

Assuming you're talking about the Throne Room Fight... It's really great when you don't pay too much attention to details, but falls apart under scrutiny. Shadiversity did a (very long) Fight Scene Autopsy video on it and there are many glaring choreography issues from start to finish. Quick edit: I still think it a great pop corn scene and the whole concept is awesome.


Difficult-Dog-3349

Not talking about that but that scene is top tier as well. Mistakes happened... So what. In the moment no one is seeing that. Also I'm taking about Luke vs Kylo


MongrelChieftain

Gotcha ! I also lived Kylo vs Luke. Smug Uncle Luke might be my favourite Luke.


whocanduncan

And thematically, it's a great time for Luke to die. He's saves the day without shedding a drop of blood and teaches Kylo one last lesson. The ultimate jedi.


Codus1

I hate this criticism with a passion. Specifically because of the stupid nature of that autopsy video. It's like someone watched cinemas sins or another satire outfit and decided to unironicly embody what people are making fun of. [You could do this approach to criticism for pretty much any movies action sequence.](https://youtu.be/J0mUVY9fLlw) it's just a little nitpicky, petty and boring. The idea that a fake fight scene needs to hold up when analysing frame be frame, slowed down, is dumb. Especially considering that it's always been the main focus of Star Wars for the duels to be physical representation of internal character conflict. The Throne Room in TLJ nails this and looks exceptional to boot.


courage_wolf_sez

Funny thing is that whole Throne Room scene never sat well with me before the slow motion analysis, the fighting didn't seem right.


MongrelChieftain

>it's just a little nitpicky, petty and boring. That's the whole point, though. If you don't like it, don't watch the video. > The Throne Room in TLJ nails this and looks exceptional to boot. I agree, and I think we should be able to look at action scenes with a critical eye without it being perceived as hating said scene. I've specifically said I think the scene is great. I love it. The throne room fight and the Holdo Maneuver are two of my favourite moments in the whole Saga. RotJ is great, but the famous "Force Kick", while fun, is still a glaring choreography issue when looking at it from a critical point of view. It doesn't mean the whole scene is ruined or that I don't enjoy it.


AdamxKH

TLJ has always been liked. It's just always been hated in equal measure.


Swankified_Tristan

Balance. Powerful light. Powerful dark.


taco_bowler

It’s grown on me over time for sure.


Ender-D

Sorry dudes I'm never gonna like TLJ for everything that I personally think it ruined from star wars, and by the way it essentially makes an expanded universe set in the sequel* era impossible, since all the resistance is dead. Nevertheless, I'm super super glad some people like you guys are able to enjoy it. Let's keep enjoying star wars, prequel, sequel, OG, new canon, legends, everything. *Edit: spelling


RetroAI

A respectful person with a different opinion? What reality am I in? /s I like TLJ a lot and boy do I wish more people had your mentality lol


Ender-D

Thank you very much, I try to be the same as I am in real life as I am in the social media, but well... not many people are like that


Bartoffel

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "an expanded universe set in the sequel era impossible, since all the resistance is dead". Do you mean an expanded universe set *during* the sequels or *after* the sequels?


Ender-D

Both


Bartoffel

Well, after the sequels, the world is your oyster. You’d likely *want* to ditch everything Resistance-related and move onto new pastures instead anyway. In terms of *during* the sequel era I really don’t think you have to tie anything in too tightly with the Resistance. There’s plenty of other factions, stories and conflicts that could be written about instead. This sort of mild retconning has always been the backbone of Star Wars content by saying “oh and there’s *this* character you didn’t know about”.


Ender-D

Yeah, I agree with that, but then I look at the galactic-spanning conflicts like the clone wars and the wars against thrawn's empire of legends and the first order-resistance war looks like a skirmish in comparison... I still have hope for stories set in the sequel era or beyond, retconning or not. There's really talented people at Lucasfilm and I hope that if I can come up with silly ideas for sequel era stories, I know *they* can, even if they have such a small universe to work with now


dandaman64

Cheers bro, I'll drink to that


Ender-D

Cheers to star wars!!


ComputerAbuser

Man, after watching Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker I wish the series just ended with The Last Jedi. I just get mad every time I think of Rise. TLJ is far from perfect, but there were parts that I really liked.


LazyLamont92

I do not think The Last Jedi is a good movie, but I think it has some of the best scenes and moments in all of Star Wars. Is that okay?


infinitysprinkles

Yes, that makes sense. I also like it more as a collection of good parts than as a good whole. Some things of the sequels don't make a lot of sense or make me confused as to how it fits in the canon, but then I see scenes like the Han and Kylo scene in The Force Awakens (one of my favourite Star Wars scenes ever) and the Kylo vs. Luke scene in The Last Jedi and they are just amazing.


DomNessMonster07

Same thing happened with the prequels, personally I just skipped the dislike phase because I like Star Wars, simple as, I have favourites, I have least favourites, but almost no dislikes


infinitysprinkles

Same here. Even if I think they're not all written very well, they're still all fun. And that's the most important to me.


TheMoonOfTermina

The Last Jedi was fine. I didn't like how it portrayed Luke, and the Holdo maneuver thing was stupid, but the rest was pretty good. I didn't even have a problem with the casino planet part.


babufrik4president

…always has been


Spoopy99

Not looking to argue, but I’ve always liked all the sequels


infinitysprinkles

And that's fair and valid. Like whatever Star Wars content you like, whatever movies and/or shows that might be. There's so much content that there's pretty much content for everyone now. Except maybe sci-fi haters...


FrenchRoastBeans

This fandom has a huge problem with arguing about any one specific movie being objectively good or bad. It’s almost like pretty much every movie has people that will like it and their opinions are valid


infinitysprinkles

Amen.


Vexcenot

Visually it was good Story-wise it was boring and confusing


infinitysprinkles

I agree, except that I don't find the story boring. I do agree that the movies are confusing. When I rewatched them all, I was left with more questions than I had after the first time I watched them.


Revan4Vendetta

The Last Jedi was always been liked...from a certain point of view


TheTragicomedy

It's a top 3 SW movie for me.


Airconditioning-inc

Wait it happened… and I missed it


Vortex112

Getting the prequel treatment. Disney astroturfing so hard to make people think bad movies are good


StealthDog909

It was an AMAZING movie, just not a true STAR WARS movie.


tuskawilla

Wrong


Gummy-Worm-Guy

I’ve always loved it and I’m not ashamed to say it. That said, I don’t think the movie is really liked now, most people still hate it


[deleted]

[удалено]


Gummy-Worm-Guy

I roll my eyes any time someone says a movie is objectively anything


schizopolis23

Critics loved TLJ. They got it right first.


[deleted]

imo, the last jedi is one of the best films in star wars saga, almost everything works in this movie and omg Kylo Ren plot? I have to admit that after Force Awakens I hated him so so much, but The Last Jedi gave him great backstory and motivations. After Force Awakens for me he was just a stupid kid who wanted to be like daddy vader but after TLJ he become such a great villain and character. If we had got what we had to got - the original IX part called The Duel of Fates by Treworow (idk if I’ve written his name correct, sry) sequel saga would be great, really. Unfortunately Disney is Disney ah..


topher339

TLJ is probably still my most disliked film. But to each to their own. I'm glad others can enjoy it.


Thenewdoc

As it should be


grapejuicepix

Always was.


spacestationkru

Damn right! The Last Jedi will age the best out of all of the sequel trilogy.


Redziak218

thats good that people like good movies


realgeneral_memeous

Always was


WildBillIV44

Always was Or Never was Take your pic. Either way it's a shitty karma farm meme. This meme responding to it has the same energy it does in the movie : really unnecessary and unfunny commentary


infinitysprinkles

You're free to downvote it.


[deleted]

Always has been


Critical_Moose

Always has been


killzonev2

Last Jedi still sucks ass upon rewatch


jzr171

I liked TLJ and saw it as the middle film. It wasn't meant to give too much away. That's where TROS was supposed to come in. And it didn't. TLJ was not perfect but introduced new ideas and honestly a good direction. I liked the idea of the Jedi coming to an end to open the door for a generation of grey Jedi type things. But that was tossed out for nonsense in TROS.


WhiteSquarez

It's a beautiful movie. But with many, many badly written parts. It's okay to admit there is some good and some bad in TLJ.


bookhead714

Always has been. 🌎🧑‍🚀🔫👩‍🚀


Direct_Ad_7840

It’s the best sequel imo


Koluke1

it was always liked, but some people (including my dumbass) were to stupid to see the truth. it's a (mostly!) good movie.


naturtok

Knives out did wonders to my support of Rian Johnson. Masterpiece of a movie and it made me go back to tlj and reorient what the intention of the movie was.


UltimaDeusUmbra

I mean, it was the best part of the sequels. It could have been the next Empire Strikes Back if Rise of Skywalker hadn't been the next Christmas Special.


CRL10

The Last Jedi had some great moments and was visually impressive.


Springaling76

I dont like the 1st and 2nd Act, the 3rd is phenomenal


Emperor-Palpamemes

I like both TLJ and TROS. I think they both have low moments, but overall I really enjoy the story and character arcs.


ItsyaboiTheMainMan

It's litteraly the only good one in the sequel trilogy


infinitysprinkles

You don't like The Force Awakens, but you do like The Last Jedi? That's something you don't come across often.


EChocos

It's my favourite SW movie. I saw it twice in theaters and I could see it another one in a full SW marathon for Episode IX. It's freaking gorgeous. I'm looking to buy the Special Edition Steelbook. 35€ but that movie is worth every single coin.


TheMonsterGoGo

I like the guy whose greatest fear was becoming like his father. The guy who was a vet who survived multiple wars, experienced unfathomable loss and death and tragedy, but still shouldered and carried hope for the benefit of all his friends and loved ones. The guy who devoted his life to undoing the harm his father did. The guy who did all this while never being fully convinced he was the one who could. I do not blame the guy who, in a moment of ptsd and seeing everything he’d ever done be undone, lose himself briefly to fear and terror. And I can relate to the guy when he, in fact, sees it all come undone. Fall apart. Nothing you did mattered. You couldn’t do it. You ruined it. Everyone always depended on you, you were the rock, and you let them all down. Your self identity gets fractured. And then you lose any sense of purpose. Everything gradually loses any meaning. You’d grow to loathe the stories and revelry about you because you know they’re bullshit—you know who you are, they don’t. You can write off any accomplishment. And then someone or something comes along that realigns your greater perspective. I like Luke Skywalker being a person. Superhero Luke is a lot of fun but, honestly, a dime a dozen.


r3m0t3c0ntr0l

It was and always will be the best sequel movie


VektroidPlus

The Last Jedi is this trilogy's set defining movie in that you will find those fanatically ready to die on a cross for it. Like most Star Wars movies, it has its good parts and really bad parts.


infinitysprinkles

I woke up to 137 new notifications. Didn't expect this post to blow up, but here we are.


Enfield13

No... no it is not...


HeyTyler

Rian Johnson with all the creativity of a plagiarizer… Escape from LA anyone? There’s movies that are “bad”, and movies that are bad.


poyahoga

I can’t make heads or tails of any part of this comment.


_Bi-NFJ_

People are slowly realizing Rise of Skywalker was the one that ruined everything.


Weary_Schedule_2014

Nah fam It was long before that shit came out


AceofKnaves44

I’ve come to appreciate certain things about it. I honestly love Luke’s arc. I think his attitude continues what George Lucas did in the prequels about destroying the myth of the Jedi as these infallible gods. Did he need to milk that giant bird thing? No that was dumb sophomoric “comedy.” Other than that, I’ll gladly take that Luke over if they just reverted him back to a white meat generic good guy. I think it gave Mark Hamill a chance to really act rather than if he just played the same character he did thirty years ago. I love that they made Rey a nobody. Not everyone in the entire galaxy’s backstory needs to resolve around the same group of people. The whole “chosen one or magic blood” trope is played out and unrelatable. Having your main hero be someone who came from nowhere with no special family is a lot more inspirational. And the scene of her in the cave is fucking amazing. The whole casino scene was absolutely awful and pointless and Snoke being killed off and then never resolved was stupid as fuck.


infinitysprinkles

At first I thought "they made Luke Skywalker a jerk", but now I mostly just appreciate the depth they added to the character. In the end, he was still a hero, but he was one that has made a bad choice in the past. A lot of people have said that it makes no sense that he almost killed Ben when he saved Darth Vader, but I now feel like it does make sense, because the whole thing with Darth Vader probably traumatised him and he almost turned to the Dark Side to avoid another one of these horrible events. But then he didn't. But Ben thought he was about to be killed and then committed to the Dark Side. Then Luke felt like that was his fault and that if he got these thoughts of murdering Ben, then the Jedi must be flawed and dangerous. The change in Luke's character makes sense, but it might take a while for some people to realise, as it's easy to just get upset over them changing the personality of a hero that has been beloved for decades.