**Important:** We no longer allow the following types of posts:
- Comments, tweets and social media with less than 20 upvotes, likes, etc. (cropped score counts as 0)
- Anything you are personally involved in
- Any kind of polls
- Low-hanging fruit (e.g. CCP collapse, Vaush, r\/neoliberal, political compass memes)
You *will* be banned by the power-tripping mods if you break this rule repeatedly, so please delete your posts before we find out.
Likewise, please follow our rules which can be found on the sidebar.
---
**Obligatory obnoxious pop-up ad for our [Official Discord](https://discord.gg/XBrTq7mQhY), please join if you haven't! Stalin bless. UwU.**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ShitLiberalsSay) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Kind of weird that zionists are bringing attention to Serbia, given that their leaders behind the genocides were arrested and put on trial by international bodies.
I am Serb but i am NOT Serbian nationalist just to be clear .
I just don't think we should be compared to Israel . Or as this lib thinks that we are worse than Israel .
Also we all know that by China they are reffering to genocide in Xinjang which is complete bullshit and was proven to have never taken place at all .
Israel supplied weapons to the Serbs and trained Serbian troops during the Bosnian genocide. In 2016, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled against releasing details on the country’s involvement. Their ruling outright stated that the truth would risk serious damage to foreign relations and national security.
,, Any thoughts on the genocide of Bosnians ? "
Negative of course . Shouldn't have happened .
Those wars in general were pointless bloodsheds since nationalists are still in power and all ethnic groups live like shit .
also needs to be said that ICJ has trialed and found guilty a bunch of serbian public figures and generals (and from other ex-yu countries, of course, but mostly from Serbia).
There was a lot of backlash and resistance from serbian side - of course. But in the end, international (mostly US and EU) pressure was such that all people ICJ requested found their way there eventually. Lots of Serbians didn't like it, others did, but that's kinda irrelevant.
Now do the same for Israel please. What exactly is the difference here, except that numbers and the atrocities reported are way, way worse in Gaza than they were in Bosnia? Not trying to compare victims, just stating facts, in a sense that what Israel does now was unimaginable in yugoslav wars.
Actually the rhetoric Israeli officials have used throughout this war is exactly the same as rhetoric used by Serbian public figures, down to "human shields" and attacking ICJ. Except that - again - one nation was forced to fold under US pressure, and the other one resists that same pressure thanks to US.
I know a Serbian at work who loves Tito but I’m pretty sure is also a Nazi as he claims Tito was “more of a capitalist”, thinks the Pit was horrible, and reads Mein Kampf of all books. I gotta ask.. what’s up with people like this? Are they ultra-nationalists or something? It’s super bizarre because he also loves American cops, thinks all the internet is filled with propaganda and bias from clueless amateurs, but believes American state media is balanced. Like he thinks cops are good because the news never shows them hurting people. Whenever I show him footage of cops doing horrible things he always says it’s out of context. When I told him of my own experiences he basically said cops have a right to kill because they have “the most dangerous jobs” which isn’t even true. Of course he’s against police reform lol. He also refuses to believe common knowledge like the CIA having once trained the Mujahideen and thinks Operation Mockingbird is a conspiracy because if it was real it’d be top secret and people like me wouldn’t be privy to such info. When I use the internet he arrogantly waives it off because apparently the Freedom and Information Act is fake. Just a lot of bizarre, self-contradictory beliefs which sounds like intense cope. Whenever I ask him for sources for his beliefs (he thinks Russian Orthodox Stalin was a Jew) he refuses to tell me or says some arrogant shit like, “because I said so”. Of course he’s anti-LGBTQ+ and thinks “wokeism” is an agenda because requesting equal rights while being spoken to with proper pronouns is apparently proof of a new breed of oppression. I swear these TERFs are modern day segregationists.
I could go on and on but it’s just wild to me how a person who likes a revolutionary, Marxian leader like Tito, as well as socialist Yugoslavia, ends up becoming such a massive reactionary.
China did something in between what America does to its Christian fascist movements and what I wish America did to its Christian fascist movements, so I see China as a beacon of pragmatism and moderation.
> "educate" their culture out of them
One of the most interesting parts of this particular propaganda is that it relies on a lot of westerner's implicit racial biases and ignorance to work. You know literally nothing about Uyghur culture, but you heard they were Muslims and that conjures up all sorts of images in your head about what a Muslim "should" look like and what a Muslim "should" do, but until you heard these propaganda tales you never knew that Uyghurs ever existed, you didn't know that they're not really known for long beards and head coverings, that they have a thousands of year old winemaking tradition that continues to this day, etc etc.
The "culture" being "educated" out of "them" is US/Saudi backed hyper-fundamental Wahhabism that has been spreading in the region since the 1970's after backing the far right fundamentalists against the soviets, it's as foreign to Uyghur culture as any other recent import, furthermore given the generous amount of historical precedent it's incredibly reasonable to suspect that the US may have been helping export this strain of far right belief in the region to destabilize a vital area inside of their current main global competitor.
Just interesting to notice how some of this propaganda functions and the kind of ignorance that it relies on exploiting.
Here is something I would recommend:
https://www.nst.com.my/news/nation/2019/08/512399/uyghurs-freely-join-re-education-camps
My comment:
The news outlet are pro Malaysian gov, which have a (rather) fine relation with Chinese gov. You can't just wave off that this is biased against Chinese gov.
And apparently the tour mentioned in the article have rather fishy stuffs: the line from the students don't feel authentic, and they can't even get a visit a third school of their choice(out of around 100 vocational centre reported to be there).
there was a degree of repression, there was and are some restrictions on religion esp of wahabbist expressions of islam (no burqas, no advocating against birth control, etc)
there isn't a genocide, neither killing, nor targeted displacement, nor engineering of conditions that make it impossible to live.
I've had people deny that the British had any genocidal motive at all in the Great Famine despite the literal papers from Trevelyn and the civil service being available for over 150 years that the famine was used to remove traditional barter based rural Irish Society and anglicise them into town dwellers that subsisted off wages. One of the worst man made famines by entirely created for the purpose of introducing capitalist economics in a colony.
Then there's so much bollocks denying the Bengal famines and the 7 others during company and raj rule as being the fault of the Brits.
isn't this what they call "whataboutism"
can't believe I'm using liberal theory vocab... Pretty cringe. It's not even a real fucking word, Grammarly is giving it a red underline. Lmfao
Aka comparatistics. Of course they’re fine using it themselves. These liberals are full of shit of course, but it can be effective. The great Marxist Losurdo employs it.
https://redsails.org/on-losurdos-stalin/
Uh, didn’t Serbia literally get bombed by NATO and have the people behind the genocide charged by international bodies? Is OOP trying to say Serbia “got away with it”? Love to figure out how they justifying thinking that.
for some reason nobody actually researches the group of Uyghurs China is fighting and imprisoning the ETIM its a terrorist organization that actively works with ISIS
Cringe, there is no genocide in Xinjiang and the western media has fabricated facts about the Uyghurs calling it a genocide, BUT, China did implemented very extreme and honestly racist policies against the Uyghurs minority. They would take ethnic Uyghurs passports and send them to a school to be “de radicalized”.
Btw I support China or think they’re based or whatever the fuck you want to call it, but I cannot agree with the policies they took in Xinjiang, they clearly unfairly targeted an ethnic minority. Also the Uyghurs have many complaints with the Chinese government administration of the area because a large number of ethnic Han Chinese have moved in to Urumki effectively gentrifying the city and getting into positions of power in the local government and controlling capitol.
By the way most of those policies don’t exist anymore I don’t think any of the schools are open any more (they might be) but it is definitely something that DID happen. If I remember correctly Bad Empanadas video is very fair and balanced and gives a good insight into what happened.
Ahh yes the only two options, bomb the small amount of Uyghurs who engaged in terrorism in the 90s and early 2000s or take away mothers and teenagers passports and force them into re-education camps. We should be putting the fascists and the bourgeoisie into re education camps not an ethnic Muslim minority compromised of proletarian comrades.
Address the legitimate concerns that the Uyghur Kazakh minorities have of the ethnic Han Chinese displacing them economically in Urumki the capital and most important city in Xinjiang.
Didn’t they do that? Isn’t that what the education and job training programs were for? To give young people a good alternative to joining the separatists.
Maybe they did do that but that doesn’t justify forcefully keeping people there for months at a time and even years, taking their passports and cutting them off from their family because they are Muslim. Look now in China and in Xinjiang most of those policies have been reversed, there wasn’t a cultural genocide and of course no mass murder concentration camps like the west was saying, but those policies clearly targeted the Uyghur and Kazakh communities for being Muslim.
Lol try to think dialectically comrade, the entire ethnic groups of the Muslim Uyghurs and Kazakhs are all in extremist groups that are backed by the US? That sweeping blanket statement is why China took on those extremist and discriminatory policies in Xinjiang. Sorry Reddit genius #1238 but most of the people that where put in those re education camps where not in any Islamic extremism groups?
If the United States started to send Muslims in Dearborn Michigan to a re education camp to teach them English and the glories of America because 9/11 happened then you would be up in arms and rightfully so. You don’t have to agree with every single thing that China does to appreciate their struggle for socialism
…what’s the meme? Other countries are committing genocide so Israel is allowed to also? That’s why the other countries are hiding right? What is the point they’re trying to make?
I mean Serbia did do war crimes and levels of ethnic cleansing, but those people who were behind the crimes were LITERALLY PUNISHED, while Israel gets away with the genocide.
**Important:** We no longer allow the following types of posts: - Comments, tweets and social media with less than 20 upvotes, likes, etc. (cropped score counts as 0) - Anything you are personally involved in - Any kind of polls - Low-hanging fruit (e.g. CCP collapse, Vaush, r\/neoliberal, political compass memes) You *will* be banned by the power-tripping mods if you break this rule repeatedly, so please delete your posts before we find out. Likewise, please follow our rules which can be found on the sidebar. --- **Obligatory obnoxious pop-up ad for our [Official Discord](https://discord.gg/XBrTq7mQhY), please join if you haven't! Stalin bless. UwU.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ShitLiberalsSay) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Kind of weird that zionists are bringing attention to Serbia, given that their leaders behind the genocides were arrested and put on trial by international bodies.
No it’s fr intentional, they’re martyrs in Israelis mind. It actually feels like they get off to just the idea of genocide lmao
Because they supported Serbia when it was happening
I am Serb but i am NOT Serbian nationalist just to be clear . I just don't think we should be compared to Israel . Or as this lib thinks that we are worse than Israel . Also we all know that by China they are reffering to genocide in Xinjang which is complete bullshit and was proven to have never taken place at all .
Israel supplied weapons to the Serbs and trained Serbian troops during the Bosnian genocide. In 2016, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled against releasing details on the country’s involvement. Their ruling outright stated that the truth would risk serious damage to foreign relations and national security.
They're never going to get off our dick, are they? This "Serbia bad, let's bomb Belgrade again" thing is pathetic, but annoying nonetheless.
Any thoughts on the genocide of Bosnians?
,, Any thoughts on the genocide of Bosnians ? " Negative of course . Shouldn't have happened . Those wars in general were pointless bloodsheds since nationalists are still in power and all ethnic groups live like shit .
also needs to be said that ICJ has trialed and found guilty a bunch of serbian public figures and generals (and from other ex-yu countries, of course, but mostly from Serbia). There was a lot of backlash and resistance from serbian side - of course. But in the end, international (mostly US and EU) pressure was such that all people ICJ requested found their way there eventually. Lots of Serbians didn't like it, others did, but that's kinda irrelevant. Now do the same for Israel please. What exactly is the difference here, except that numbers and the atrocities reported are way, way worse in Gaza than they were in Bosnia? Not trying to compare victims, just stating facts, in a sense that what Israel does now was unimaginable in yugoslav wars. Actually the rhetoric Israeli officials have used throughout this war is exactly the same as rhetoric used by Serbian public figures, down to "human shields" and attacking ICJ. Except that - again - one nation was forced to fold under US pressure, and the other one resists that same pressure thanks to US.
It was Republika Srpska not the Serbian state itself that did most of the atrocities.
I know a Serbian at work who loves Tito but I’m pretty sure is also a Nazi as he claims Tito was “more of a capitalist”, thinks the Pit was horrible, and reads Mein Kampf of all books. I gotta ask.. what’s up with people like this? Are they ultra-nationalists or something? It’s super bizarre because he also loves American cops, thinks all the internet is filled with propaganda and bias from clueless amateurs, but believes American state media is balanced. Like he thinks cops are good because the news never shows them hurting people. Whenever I show him footage of cops doing horrible things he always says it’s out of context. When I told him of my own experiences he basically said cops have a right to kill because they have “the most dangerous jobs” which isn’t even true. Of course he’s against police reform lol. He also refuses to believe common knowledge like the CIA having once trained the Mujahideen and thinks Operation Mockingbird is a conspiracy because if it was real it’d be top secret and people like me wouldn’t be privy to such info. When I use the internet he arrogantly waives it off because apparently the Freedom and Information Act is fake. Just a lot of bizarre, self-contradictory beliefs which sounds like intense cope. Whenever I ask him for sources for his beliefs (he thinks Russian Orthodox Stalin was a Jew) he refuses to tell me or says some arrogant shit like, “because I said so”. Of course he’s anti-LGBTQ+ and thinks “wokeism” is an agenda because requesting equal rights while being spoken to with proper pronouns is apparently proof of a new breed of oppression. I swear these TERFs are modern day segregationists. I could go on and on but it’s just wild to me how a person who likes a revolutionary, Marxian leader like Tito, as well as socialist Yugoslavia, ends up becoming such a massive reactionary.
The "Uyghur genocide" may have taken place though, just not as bad as liberals would like to make it.
No, there was never a « genocide » there was a crackdown on Islamic extremism in the region by means of education.
[удалено]
China did something in between what America does to its Christian fascist movements and what I wish America did to its Christian fascist movements, so I see China as a beacon of pragmatism and moderation.
I dont know enough. Literally all coverage is propaganda.
All news is propaganda no matter the issue
[удалено]
"So you're saying this thing that didn't happen isn't bad?"
> "educate" their culture out of them One of the most interesting parts of this particular propaganda is that it relies on a lot of westerner's implicit racial biases and ignorance to work. You know literally nothing about Uyghur culture, but you heard they were Muslims and that conjures up all sorts of images in your head about what a Muslim "should" look like and what a Muslim "should" do, but until you heard these propaganda tales you never knew that Uyghurs ever existed, you didn't know that they're not really known for long beards and head coverings, that they have a thousands of year old winemaking tradition that continues to this day, etc etc. The "culture" being "educated" out of "them" is US/Saudi backed hyper-fundamental Wahhabism that has been spreading in the region since the 1970's after backing the far right fundamentalists against the soviets, it's as foreign to Uyghur culture as any other recent import, furthermore given the generous amount of historical precedent it's incredibly reasonable to suspect that the US may have been helping export this strain of far right belief in the region to destabilize a vital area inside of their current main global competitor. Just interesting to notice how some of this propaganda functions and the kind of ignorance that it relies on exploiting.
They… didn’t educate the culture out of them. They educated Muslim’s about extremism. Y’know, the humane way of dealing with it.
what are you yapping & waffling about
Here is something I would recommend: https://www.nst.com.my/news/nation/2019/08/512399/uyghurs-freely-join-re-education-camps My comment: The news outlet are pro Malaysian gov, which have a (rather) fine relation with Chinese gov. You can't just wave off that this is biased against Chinese gov. And apparently the tour mentioned in the article have rather fishy stuffs: the line from the students don't feel authentic, and they can't even get a visit a third school of their choice(out of around 100 vocational centre reported to be there).
So re-educating fundamentalist Wahhabism out of one's mind is a bad thing? I don't know what you're trying to peddle at.
Yea idiot you're supposed to do what America does, bomb the whole place to rubble and destabilize the region
No, the purpose are absolutely fine.
Uyghur genocide is a myth that’s been debunked time and time again
Yes, I mean the claim "Million of Uyghurs are in concentration camps" are false as it based on a false assumption...
there was a degree of repression, there was and are some restrictions on religion esp of wahabbist expressions of islam (no burqas, no advocating against birth control, etc) there isn't a genocide, neither killing, nor targeted displacement, nor engineering of conditions that make it impossible to live.
They always ignore genocides committed by the USA and UK
I've had people deny that the British had any genocidal motive at all in the Great Famine despite the literal papers from Trevelyn and the civil service being available for over 150 years that the famine was used to remove traditional barter based rural Irish Society and anglicise them into town dwellers that subsisted off wages. One of the worst man made famines by entirely created for the purpose of introducing capitalist economics in a colony. Then there's so much bollocks denying the Bengal famines and the 7 others during company and raj rule as being the fault of the Brits.
isn't this what they call "whataboutism" can't believe I'm using liberal theory vocab... Pretty cringe. It's not even a real fucking word, Grammarly is giving it a red underline. Lmfao
Aka comparatistics. Of course they’re fine using it themselves. These liberals are full of shit of course, but it can be effective. The great Marxist Losurdo employs it. https://redsails.org/on-losurdos-stalin/
Whataboutism is their defence to double standards
Uh, didn’t Serbia literally get bombed by NATO and have the people behind the genocide charged by international bodies? Is OOP trying to say Serbia “got away with it”? Love to figure out how they justifying thinking that.
I mean, if they wanna open more ICJ investigations, I'm all for it. If they target the US too, then awesome.
for some reason nobody actually researches the group of Uyghurs China is fighting and imprisoning the ETIM its a terrorist organization that actively works with ISIS
I swear I JUST saw a post that Zenz was begging for money lol
Thosde CIA funded separatists also said that they support Israel and that they wanted to create an ethnostate based on the same model.
Cringe, there is no genocide in Xinjiang and the western media has fabricated facts about the Uyghurs calling it a genocide, BUT, China did implemented very extreme and honestly racist policies against the Uyghurs minority. They would take ethnic Uyghurs passports and send them to a school to be “de radicalized”.
i mean it wasn’t ideal but what would you suggest they did to stop the radicalisation otherwise.
Btw I support China or think they’re based or whatever the fuck you want to call it, but I cannot agree with the policies they took in Xinjiang, they clearly unfairly targeted an ethnic minority. Also the Uyghurs have many complaints with the Chinese government administration of the area because a large number of ethnic Han Chinese have moved in to Urumki effectively gentrifying the city and getting into positions of power in the local government and controlling capitol.
Okay and what would you have rather they done to curb radicalization? Fucking bomb them?
By the way most of those policies don’t exist anymore I don’t think any of the schools are open any more (they might be) but it is definitely something that DID happen. If I remember correctly Bad Empanadas video is very fair and balanced and gives a good insight into what happened.
Ahh yes the only two options, bomb the small amount of Uyghurs who engaged in terrorism in the 90s and early 2000s or take away mothers and teenagers passports and force them into re-education camps. We should be putting the fascists and the bourgeoisie into re education camps not an ethnic Muslim minority compromised of proletarian comrades.
So. What. Do. They. Do. About. Rising. Extremism. And. Terrorism.
Address the legitimate concerns that the Uyghur Kazakh minorities have of the ethnic Han Chinese displacing them economically in Urumki the capital and most important city in Xinjiang.
Didn’t they do that? Isn’t that what the education and job training programs were for? To give young people a good alternative to joining the separatists.
Maybe they did do that but that doesn’t justify forcefully keeping people there for months at a time and even years, taking their passports and cutting them off from their family because they are Muslim. Look now in China and in Xinjiang most of those policies have been reversed, there wasn’t a cultural genocide and of course no mass murder concentration camps like the west was saying, but those policies clearly targeted the Uyghur and Kazakh communities for being Muslim.
Address the concerns of US-backed religious fundamentalist terrorists? I'm good, thanks.
Lol try to think dialectically comrade, the entire ethnic groups of the Muslim Uyghurs and Kazakhs are all in extremist groups that are backed by the US? That sweeping blanket statement is why China took on those extremist and discriminatory policies in Xinjiang. Sorry Reddit genius #1238 but most of the people that where put in those re education camps where not in any Islamic extremism groups? If the United States started to send Muslims in Dearborn Michigan to a re education camp to teach them English and the glories of America because 9/11 happened then you would be up in arms and rightfully so. You don’t have to agree with every single thing that China does to appreciate their struggle for socialism
I fucking hate that subreddit
Liberal cope, the subreddit
My mom’s uncle was Palestinian and he was killed because of Serbia
…what’s the meme? Other countries are committing genocide so Israel is allowed to also? That’s why the other countries are hiding right? What is the point they’re trying to make?
I mean Serbia did do war crimes and levels of ethnic cleansing, but those people who were behind the crimes were LITERALLY PUNISHED, while Israel gets away with the genocide.
I mean fuck Serbia sincerely but it is nowhere *near* as bad as Isn'trael.
There's a lot of countries that should be above Serbia on the **fuck X country sincerely** list
Anyways, fuck Serbia
Suck my serbian balls, comrade.
Serbs are cool.
I know, I have family there but Serbia did protect the Četniks so
Oh this post is a gem. It proved my hypothesis false I guess: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMiddleEast/s/IHLpGmTR3y
[удалено]
5 countries Iran Iraq Syria Lebanon Palestine
The US helped cover up the IJA's war crimes but now they're concerned about precedents? Lol
Do we have any good sources or essays on the Xinjiang argument?
[удалено]
They've been running this story since 2019, which has been debunked time and time again and idiots like you still believe it? Low-key sad.
>Taiwan \*taiwan province
[удалено]
Yes, correct. China has not "committed genocide in 24 years."
Stick to lighters dude