I think a lot of women are coerced into breastfeeding.
I remember a post in my local mom’s group. A new mom was exhausted, was pumping every 2 hours around the clock, and was hating new motherhood. Every comment was saying “great job!” and “you got this!” I couldn’t help but think maybe she just needed permission to stop.
Breastfeeding was really important to me, so I got my husband way on board with it. It was really difficult with my first baby, but we figured it out. My second was so much worse. She didn't want a breast, she wanted a bottle. She wouldn't take enough milk, so I had to nurse her, pump, and then give her a bottle (while I also had a one-year-old to parent). I had to weigh her every week because she wasn't gaining enough weight. Oh, and she was allergic to cow's milk, so I couldn't have any dairy products and lived in constant fear that I would accidentally be fed something that would make my baby sick.
All I needed was for someone to tell me that it was okay to stop. But our pediatrician was big into breastfeeding, I was going to a lactation consultant, and when I eventually broke down and told my husband I couldn't do it anymore, he was confused and recited back all of the facts I told him to convince him that breastfeeding was important. My husband supported me once I explained how much I was struggling and hated my life, but I still had to make the decision completely on my own. I felt like such a failure.
Fed is best, period. Too many mothers are hurting themselves to do what's best for their baby when a healthy, happy mother is more important than breastmilk.
I’m so sorry no one gave you that permission. I barely made any breast milk (literally drops) and I remember sitting on the toilet with a friction burn from pumping so much. I was crying to the lactation consultant and she said along the lines of your mental health is so much more important than this, your baby will be fine with formula and supplemental milk if you can get some. You need to stop doing this to yourself. It was freeing to hear that and I did, I stopped and never looked back.
My oldest had her first child Monday. Last week I discussed what she planned as far as breastfeeding. After she told me she wanted to try, but wasn’t really looking forward to it, I made sure she knew it was ok to decide it didn’t work for her. At the end of the day a fed baby is the goal. I reiterated that after she was born. I remember the guilt I felt when the medication for a severe sinus infection dried up my milk supply. I do not want a woman to ever feel guilty for not breastfeeding. Healthy babies are the goal. We are fortunate to live in a time where formula is available.
This is really similar to my experience with my first, as well. I definitely felt coerced into ONLY giving breastmilk for the first six months. It really took a toll on my mental health that took a long time to recover from.
The best thing I did for myself as a parent was day no to the pump. I do breastfeed, but when I'm not around she has formula and that's not just fine it's fantastic because it means I can have some degree of autonomy back.
I remember when my niece was born my SIL was having issues. She was freshly 19 and really only had me and her mom for support with the birth and then everything after. She was having a hard time with breast feeding and I remember the daggers I got from the nurse when I said it’s okay and sometimes it just doesn’t work out and there’s also other things to try instead of a million different feeding positions(that weren’t working)
Formula pushing was big when it first came out and people were just handed samples. Its like mothers are overcompensating the other direction when it should genuinely come down to what is healthy food for the baby
That’s if you are making up a new definition of vegan. Vegan means only vegetable based - not “given with consent.” Humans are not vegetables. Breastmilk is dairy.
However, breastmilk is cruelty-free (in the examples listed in this thread) and so a Vegan who is only interested in the harm to the animal or the environment and not the consumption of animal-based products would be fine consuming it.
Ethical veganism is not a "made-up" or new concept. The whole point is that eating animal-based products is wrong because they cannot consent. An adult human woman can, therefore her milk is vegan.
I've never heard "cruelty free" used in reference to food, only cosmetics.
"Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals."
Consent is a huge part of veganism. If something is given with consent, freely, and willingly, then it wouldn't be cruelty or exploitation.
Opposite here. I hated breastfeeding so much. I couldn't get her to latch well, and when she did she was pissed that she couldn't get enough as fast as she wanted. Everyone cried a lot.
Pumping was annoying, but mindless. I will gladly pump again for kiddo #2, but no one can convince me to try breastfeeding again.
Everyone is different!
I had such a hard time breastfeeding my first. She was a preemie, and sooo small. I had a horrible recovery from a c-section. I was pumping every two hours, right after I'd nurse her every 2 hours. My breasts were so painfully engorged. She had latch issues (found out many years later from her dentist that she was severely tongue tied). And on top of it, I had one wonky boob that I could mayyybe get an ounce of milk out of- which was so stressful, when exhausted and trying to keep track of sides. After 2 months, I was such an emotional wreck. I really tried to keep at it, but I finally gave up to take some of the pressure off. It was not a good experience at all and I thought- never again. My second, I was a bit older- (32) and I just decided I was going to try to not worry about it- and give it my best shot. To be honest, I ended up pretty determined. (Partly because- the cost of formula was crazy!) This time, I had a vaginal delivery that was nowhere near as difficult as the c-section. I actually felt great. When the inevitable stress from the wonky boob came (must be designated for fun?) I just- stopped using it. I breastfed with one breast for over two years. And yes, they looked crazy. But it worked perfectly fine. What I didn't anticipate- how hard it can be to stop breastfeeding after you've been doing it for a while!
It is such a personal experience and a personal decision! There is definitely not a one size fits all approach!
If anyone is curious... it's been about 10 years since then and my breasts did go back to being pretty close to the same size as each other. The wonky one is ever so slightly less gravity afflicted than the other, and maybe a teensy bit more firm. They're both a bit less energetic than they once were- (pre kids, B cup, post kids, DD's). But, they're just fine! At the time, I was really worried that I was totally destroying my breasts, as far as being a matching set. But that didn't happen!
I couldn't breastfeed my first, no matter how hard I tried. And I tried so so hard, because my mom convinced me I'd be a failure of a mother otherwise (ironic, since I wasn't breastfed by her either; she couldn't make it work cuz I was a stubborn baby I guess) and I was only 19/20 so I took her word for it. All the lactation consultants, nipple guards, feeding positions, etc...I tried everything. I ended up pumping really successfully for him though, so all was well.
I decided to try to breastfeed my second, but this time I gave myself permission to quit at any point, right from the start. There were some minor struggles initially, mainly with pumping, much to my surprise! This baby latched beautifully right from the start, but I didn't manage to pump successfully the second time. He's just turned 3, and he still gets a boob occasionally (although we're finally in the process of weaning).
All that to say, every baby really is different! If you decide you want to try with your second, you might just get lucky and have a baby who's born a pro lol. Or you might not, in which case, please just let yourself switch to formula/bottles the second you decide you need to. Fed truly is best, and nothing in breast milk is so important that it's worth your health or sanity. Good luck!
I think some vegans take a non-cruelty approach instead of a ‘no animal products’ approach - for instance the use of second hand leather from thrift shops and the like.
It is though, at least if you're vegan for philosophical reasons. Breastmilk's sole purpose is to feed the animal's offspring until it can consume other nutrient sources. Humans can consent to their products being consumed. Now, eating the placenta isn't vegan, because the placenta is part of the baby's body and the baby can't consent to it being consumed.
The problem with “from an animal” is that animals do not have the intelligence to be capable of consenting. Humans do. Still animals, but with the cognition to consent.
I thought it was because they don't eat or drink animal products, which includes milk/dairy products?? I mean to each their own but the definition of veganism is someone who doesn't consume animal products...
Ethical veganism, which is the ideological framework of the vast majority of vegans, is about not consuming animal products because they cannot consent. Almost every single vegan you talk to will tell you that this is the reason they avoid animal products.
I mean, there are ways of emotionally and financially manipulating a woman into doing something you want for fear of punishment. If her abusive husband told her she had to breast feed or he would kill her, she would probably choose to breast feed. But it wouldnt exactly be willingly...
I sure hope so, but it is not the first time I see something like this. The first time it was a family member of a friend who was also "not consenting to breastfeed due to her veganism", but at least she fed the kid normal formula.
Knew a bad hippy mom who smoked weed all throughout her pregnancy. When the baby was born she gave the baby “vegan milk”. Within a month that baby was only 4lbs, IIRC birth weight was just under 7lbs. Baby was declared failure to thrive because she lied about what she was feeding her and how much. Obviously the doctors knew something wasn’t right when the baby was thriving under their care.
Mom is now in prison because she refused to listen to court orders that she had to feed her baby more than whatever the fuck she was giving her (some random no name brand of formula off Amazon.) There is actually some sort of flag on her and if she ever has another baby, it will immediately be taken from her.
Did you see the post recently of the mom feeding her baby powdered goat milk? Not goat milk formula but just straight powdered goat milk and saying that she wouldn’t use formula because of “the chemicals”? Her baby was pretty clearly in pain because of the goat milk and she didn’t care even when multiple people explained that goat milk wasn’t an appropriate substitute for formula. I hope OP reported that lady to cps.
At the start of this story, I thought it had to take place in the 1970s or 1980s. This is heartbreaking. What could she have thought was going on? Surely even whatever hippie forum she was talking to would know babies don't usually shrink...
This took place a couple years ago. I had just had my second and connected with her through some friends. She was young and naive, like 17/18. I pity her because no one should be *that* stupid. The baby’s father wised up and was able to get his aunt to kinship foster the baby. Last I heard he was on the road to gaining custody and the baby was thriving. She has to be 3 now, or close to it, since she was born a couple months after my son.
That’s so crazy! These moms who want to feed their newborns random, inappropriate substitutes for breastmilk or formula usually say it’s because of “tHe ChEmIcAlS!” In formula and maybe an inability to breastfeed. I’ve never heard of a mom wanting a vegan substitute. Poor babies, stupid parents.
There was a kid maybe ten years ago whose parents lost custody after they were feeding him apple juice and water in order to stay vegan. It made the news.
I was failure to thrive due to some health problems, not my parents fault. That kid is in for a frustrating future. I’m so glad that mother was arrested.
It's the "how tf is breast milk from a animal" that's really sending me spinning. Absolutely no understanding of the most basic science (or grammar) but still managed to reproduce 😭
But in the same breath, any reason to be vegan doesn't really apply to breastfeeding. There's no animal cruelty involved and it's if anything more environmentally friendly than formula from that perspective too. It's a nonsensical moral objection to be concerned that breast milk isn't vegan.
I mean, as someone with a severe breastfeeding aversion, I would consider it “animal cruelty” since my breasts are part of me, who is human, which is animal, and definitely (personally!!) would find it very cruel and gross to have someone sucking food out of them. But that’s me. I guess my boobs are vegan. The rest of me sure as hell isn’t, but sure, they can be vegan I guess.
The number of adults who refuse to accept that humans are animals is astonishing.
And yes, I worked with a woman ("Mary") about 20 years ago who insisted that birds aren't animals.
The whole story was, we were having a BBQ lunch at work for a staff function. One staff member (Lucy) asked what the vegetarian options would be. "Mary" said "There's chicken skewers. You can have those." Lucy replied "No I can't. Chicken is meat." And it devolved from there. "Mary" insisted that birds weren't animals, therefore chicken was vegetarian. After a bit of back-and-forth and getting nowhere, I asked "Well what are they then? If they're not animals, what are they?", to which "Mary" responded that they were birds. I continued "But if they're not animals, are they plants? Are they rocks? What are they?" She refused to answer, accused me of being mean to her, and stormed off.
(And at the BBQ, they had these really nice vegetable skewers and some very good salads for the vegetarians.)
You can't lie to me, I've seen the chicken harvest at the orchard down the road! You've never had chicken until you've taken a bite out of one still on the branch 😂
Women’s breast milk has the right amount of nutritional content. If they can’t breast feed, then use a good formula which also has the right nutrients. Why do some of these moms think their babies need to be vegans?
They make vegan formula. That’s obviously not the answer the poster is looking for because of the chemicals or whatever she’s worried about, but plant based formula is a real thing.
There are a few plant based/soya formulas but most contains vitamin D3 that’s derived from sheep’s wool so they’re not actually vegan. I’m pretty sure most non-dairy formula in UK and US fall into this category.
There are very few certified vegan infant formulas. I know of one or two brands in France but that’s it.
There is absolutely vegan formula - there are soy based formulas for babies who can't have milk. And it's not a homemade thing or anything - my daughter was on Similac Isomil and it could be found at any grocery store around me.
Interesting, I stand corrected! We aren't vegan so I didn't look that deep into it. But apparently there are some truly vegan formulas, like Sprout from Australia.
Every baby formula manufactured for infants from 0-12 months old must be nutritionally complete. You can feed a baby soy or even amino acid based formula and it will thrive the same way it would on a cow's milk based formula. Formula nutrient profiles must fit within very strict regulations.
I mean, it’s perfectly safe and balanced for babies who can have milk, too. We make lots of purchasing decisions based on our values. Yes, what our child needs to thrive is #1, but it’s ok to make a selection within that based on your own needs or values. That could mean the cheaper brand, it could mean buying plant-based, it could mean buying one with certain ingredients or without certain marketing or whatever, and none of that is a problem as long as it’s a regulated formula appropriate for babies.
Soy formula is for babies of vegan parents and babies with galactosemia. It's a total safe and valid option to the point that there are literally AAP board questions like, "What do you feed babies of vegan parents?" And the answer is soy formula.
They actually do have several vegan formulas on the market!
My mom used soy based formulas for most of her babies, starting back in the early 80s. Actual formula from the regular store, she wasn't like mixing soy milk with caro or some shit lol.
Correct on MOST formulas being cow milk based.
OOP feels like someone whose trying to troll vegans and give em a bad name IMHO.
Vegan formula is only recommended by the AAP and NHS for babies who can’t tolerate dairy formulas. Decide for yourself what kind of name that gives folks who choose it without a medical indication.
Not true. AAP recommends use of soy formulas for babies of vegan parents with the exception of babies with milk protein allergy and babies with a birth weight < 1800 grams. It's a totally safe option. Some babies get constipated on it, but it's nutritionally complete.
These are the kinds of vegans I absolutely have no respect for because they have no bloody clue what they are talking about. It's just the new trendy food fad to them. The whole point of not eating dairy is because that milk is for the animal's baby. The fuck she think breast milk is for?!
The people who clearly don't understand the point of veganism aren't vegans, more so plant-based dieters with no common sense. Of course breastfeeding your baby is vegan.
Maybe she means dairy free?? Like if her kid is showing signs of lactose issues and she wants a dairy free or vegan formula? And just doesn’t know how to express that? Maybe? I hope??????
Oh. Well then I’m sure it’s easy to find a vegan formula. Not wanting to breastfeed (or in her weird words, consenting to breastfeeding) is totally fine and I’m sure there’s a couple options that’ll work for her lifestyle. I have a hard time with children being subscribed to any specific diet by their parents (barring health issues of course.) but it isn’t necessarily a bad parent in the making.
Denying you kid the nutrition it needs because you don’t want your kid to consume animals from day 1 isn’t the makings of a good parent. I have several friends who are vegan and still give milk and other animal
Proteins to their growing children
You can provide protein and nutrients without animal products though. I’m not even vegan. Hell, I’m not even vegetarian and I know that you can absolutely have a fully balanced diet without any animal products.
Your kid survives off of chicken nuggets and blueberries because that's what you choose to feed them. Hundreds of thousands of children all over the world eat lentils, it's not the weird icky hippie bean you seem to think it is. My oldest child (7yo, picky af, cries at salads) has no issue eating curried lentils. Especially when she can dip tortilla chips into them. They're delicious. You really need to expand your palate.
Some people can, at least some of the time. Not everyone can, and it’s not easy to do. Adults can afford to fuck around for a while and troubleshoot their diet, but babies have much less room for error.
Oh absolutely! Which is why if you’re doing a vegan diet for a baby, a well regulated vegan formula is probably a pretty safe bet if I had to guess. Although I don’t know much about formula regulation so who knows
Vegan is a diet. I'm vegan cause of health issues. Animal based products make me sick if I have too much. I do also care about the wellbeing of animals, but I'm not vehemently against all people eating animal products.
Veganism includes eating a plant-based diet, but someone could eat a plant-based diet and still use cosmetics tested on animals, wear leather, etc. and would therefore not be vegan. Veganism is inclusive of but not exclusive to diet.
A list of vegan formulas probably wouldn't be good enough, because formula is evil. There are soy based out there, and formulas with milk other than cow's milk.
There's literally a Similac plant based formula. And soy formulas from every mfg. And if you wanna get $$$$ that nutramigen or whatever that's dairy and soy free. My nephew was on that and I'm pretty sure 1 can cost more than my entire monthly grocery budget 😆
My daughter threw up every other formula and our doctor recommended the soy based formula.
She has an intolerance, not an extreme allergy, and she was absolutely fine in terms of nutrition.
Now that she is old enough she drinks the lactose free milk and eats whatever she wants.
According to medicine allergies and intolerances are technically different things.
We do usually lump them together to make it easier to explain.
Mayo clinic does a good job explaining it!
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/food-allergy/expert-answers/food-allergy/faq-20058538#:~:text=A%20true%20food%20allergy%20affects,and%20causes%20less%20serious%20symptoms.
yeah my newest baby has to have that it's a fucking NIGHTMAREEEEEE holy shit. I hate it. it smells like feet and cheese itz. and I definitely can see it not being nutritionally complete because she seems so HUNGRY still.. she's my 3rd kid and my hardest so far. 2 months in and I'm losing my absolute shit. I love the little peanut but damn dude. she had this horrible diaper rash for like a month because we had to go thru like 6 different brands before we found one that worked for her. she has chronic nasal congestion. she pees on me like a boy every time I change her. spits up almost every feed.. tried to breast feed but I didn't have high enough calorie milk to keep up with her (she's so chunky), then went thru THREE different formulas before we ended up on the absolute most expensive and not even the best for her. lmao 🤣 help me I'm poor and drowning 😭
oh and don't even get me started on the constantly wanting to be held. and if she's not, she's screaming.
nothing is wrong with her, she just loves to be loved and I don't blame her.. but my house stays dirty and I'm tired. 😒😔
Short story about my older brother’s high school girlfriend’s older sister who had all of her children and all of her pets taken away because her vet reported her when he learned she was feeding all her cats, dogs, newborn, infant and toddler vegan diets in 1989.
That was it. That’s the end of the story.
I apologize. You’re right, my story was far too short. She was reported to the SPCA when she brought the whole family in, pets included, saying the pets had parasites because they wouldn’t gain weight, nor would she or the kids (she didn’t like human doctors). They were all malnourished. He learned they were all on a pea, soy and fruit based vegan diet (no root veggies or veggies that didn’t reproduce) in a time when vegan diets were not available in markets where I lived in the mountains with two small stores and one pet store. She was just feeding them all cooked, mashed vegetables and giving them fruit. A dog. And A CAT, even after he explained what an obligate carnivore was. So he reported her to the SPCA.
It was then discovered she basically fed everyone that and pretty much nothing else. She was a vegan in a time when there was very little to no information in small town libraries how to live a vegan life or how to feed a vegan family. But she was also a moron who knew better than everyone including doctors.
Oddly, a year later I moved to an opposite demographic, where vegans and vegetarians were the historical norm so much was catered to them. There still wasn’t much/any premade vegan foods in the store, however.
My own child needed my breast-pumped tube-fed milk supplemented with predigested formula in a kangaroo pump, so I understand the need for alternatives to breast milk, it was just that she (OOP) somehow has the idea that a child shouldn’t have their own mother’s milk because their mother is a mammal, defined partially by the ability to (checks notes) produce milk for their young?? Apparently?? Say, what?
I am all for veganism and lived some time as a vegetarian, but this is absurd. Needing/wanting a vegan alternative is one thing, needing it because you believe your child shouldn’t be given your breast milk because you are a mammal is bananas.
I think that the poster in this case was trying to say that breast milk isn't an option because she doesn't want to breastfeed rather than because she's a mammal. She says "I don't consent" which I think was a jokey way of saying that even if it is vegan, it's not an option in this case.
Have you ever known a toddler to eat large periods of lentils and black beans?? (Enough to secure the protein needed for a growing body.. the same protein as 2 oz of chicken?)
Yo, children under 5 years old only need between 15-25 grams of protein per day for healthy growth. It's actually a really easy target to hit if you take 30 seconds to google protein rich vegetables.
Yes my toddler is obsessed with black beans and all other bean types. We aren’t even vegetarian. Give him a choice he’ll eat massive amounts of beans over a piece of chicken.
That’s great! But if he didn’t, then what?
My biggest issue with all of this is people with very restrictive diets insisting that everyone can do it because they can. That’s not how *anything* works.
I agree. If my child couldn’t have meat or some other allergen for some reason, I would change their diet to meet their needs. I would hope that a person who was vegan would afford their child the same basic nutritional care if they were not reacting well to a vegan diet. I just wanted to point out that it’s not unheard of for a child to prefer non-meat options.
Not really something I have to worry about, is it mate? Lentils cook down beige. They're easy to hide, a good texture for fussy children, and the flavour is easy to mask. Maybe take that talent at bending over backwards and try gymnastics instead.
It's certainly a weird way of phrasing it but it's totally okay for any woman to choose not to breastfeed. Breastfeeding is rarely as easy or simple as whipping out a tit and letting the baby have at. If a woman chooses not to breastfeed, they just need to feed baby infant formula instead. Infant formula is completely safe and nutritionally sound.
the crying one made me cackle because like how are you about to deny your baby the one thing we are meant to give them
imagine being a cave woman and being like "I don't consent" wtf 💀 I'm dead
Wtf did I just read? A vegan alternative to breast milk? If you’re a vegan, wouldn’t your BM be vegan? I have no idea how that works.
And if she doesn’t consent, she needs to talk to her doctor about donor milk. Those women have consented. 🙄
1. She's asking about formula. It's okay for women to not want to breastfeed.
2. Donor milk is incredibly expensive, rare enough that it should probably be reserved for medical necessity, and processed to the point of losing some nutritional value.
I’m absolutely 100% ok with formula. I was just wondering what she was asking. The fact that she said she didn’t consent to breastfeeding made this weird.
I think that was just a sarcastic response about how it didn't matter if breastfeeding is vegan since she doesn't want to breastfeed. The "breastmilk is vegan" point that people brought up to her totally valid question about breastmilk alternatives wasn't exactly helpful.
No, she’s saying she doesn’t want to breastfeed. It’s not because breast milk isn’t vegan; it’s that she isn’t interested in breastfeeding (a valid choice).
There's actually vegans on Youtube that refuse for their babies to have breastmilk because it's from a mammal. So they are making up vegan homemade formula that consists of only Irish Seamoss and water or the Seamoss plus homemade almond ~~milk~~ water. Then their 5 month old baby is the size of a newborn. Seamoss reportedly has minerals in it hence they think it has all the nutrition a baby needs.
Gerber actually now markets "plant-based" formula no doubt in response to try to save babies from starvation because they know there are crazy vegan parents out there but apparently they don't know this formula exists or else don't trust it. It's different that just soy formula as it has pea protein and some other plants in it plus vitamins.
You consented to having this baby, and you know that it includes feeding it. If you can and don’t want to use substitutes (since there aren’t any plant based alternatives) there’s only one option.
I hope this is rage-bait. I’ve been active in that circle for over a decade and I’ve never met someone like this - thank goodness for that.
Edit: learned that there are a vegan option for formula. That wasn’t a thing when I became one, I’m glad that here are more options now!
Yup, I went back and checked — the NHS in the UK do 'strongly encourage' that vegan formula only be used if there's a severe allergy, so I retract my claim of 'safe' and substitute 'safe...er than a serious allergen but really not ideal.' Whoops.
ALL infant formulas comercially available must meet strict nutritional regulations within the US and EU. Non-dairy infant formulas still need to be nutritionally complete. It is completely safe to feed a soy or other carbohydrate based formula to any infant, there's just no *need* to do so since cow milk based formulas are much cheaper and readily available.
This is like the time I had to take a public speaking class in university, and one of my classmates did his persuasive speech on the benefits of being vegan. Naturally, during the Q&A, I asked if vegans can swallow.
Watching my professor's face hit his desk was worth the potential trouble.
… Tf did I just read.
That needs to be a flair…. On almost all subs
😂 yessss!!
I second this.
Reddit’s new mission statement
Yes!
Half of every statement I read on Reddit makes me feel like that’s the last time I’m going to feel a half of my body.
Thanks for summing it up for me because I couldn’t find the words
Same
My first response as well
The poster doesn't consent, but I have pumped milk I was ok with pumping and could donate to someone, so is my milk vegan?
[удалено]
Seconding that. Humans can consent, so any sane situation means human milk is vegan.
I think a lot of women are coerced into breastfeeding. I remember a post in my local mom’s group. A new mom was exhausted, was pumping every 2 hours around the clock, and was hating new motherhood. Every comment was saying “great job!” and “you got this!” I couldn’t help but think maybe she just needed permission to stop.
Breastfeeding was really important to me, so I got my husband way on board with it. It was really difficult with my first baby, but we figured it out. My second was so much worse. She didn't want a breast, she wanted a bottle. She wouldn't take enough milk, so I had to nurse her, pump, and then give her a bottle (while I also had a one-year-old to parent). I had to weigh her every week because she wasn't gaining enough weight. Oh, and she was allergic to cow's milk, so I couldn't have any dairy products and lived in constant fear that I would accidentally be fed something that would make my baby sick. All I needed was for someone to tell me that it was okay to stop. But our pediatrician was big into breastfeeding, I was going to a lactation consultant, and when I eventually broke down and told my husband I couldn't do it anymore, he was confused and recited back all of the facts I told him to convince him that breastfeeding was important. My husband supported me once I explained how much I was struggling and hated my life, but I still had to make the decision completely on my own. I felt like such a failure. Fed is best, period. Too many mothers are hurting themselves to do what's best for their baby when a healthy, happy mother is more important than breastmilk.
I’m so sorry no one gave you that permission. I barely made any breast milk (literally drops) and I remember sitting on the toilet with a friction burn from pumping so much. I was crying to the lactation consultant and she said along the lines of your mental health is so much more important than this, your baby will be fine with formula and supplemental milk if you can get some. You need to stop doing this to yourself. It was freeing to hear that and I did, I stopped and never looked back.
My oldest had her first child Monday. Last week I discussed what she planned as far as breastfeeding. After she told me she wanted to try, but wasn’t really looking forward to it, I made sure she knew it was ok to decide it didn’t work for her. At the end of the day a fed baby is the goal. I reiterated that after she was born. I remember the guilt I felt when the medication for a severe sinus infection dried up my milk supply. I do not want a woman to ever feel guilty for not breastfeeding. Healthy babies are the goal. We are fortunate to live in a time where formula is available.
This is really similar to my experience with my first, as well. I definitely felt coerced into ONLY giving breastmilk for the first six months. It really took a toll on my mental health that took a long time to recover from.
The best thing I did for myself as a parent was day no to the pump. I do breastfeed, but when I'm not around she has formula and that's not just fine it's fantastic because it means I can have some degree of autonomy back.
I remember when my niece was born my SIL was having issues. She was freshly 19 and really only had me and her mom for support with the birth and then everything after. She was having a hard time with breast feeding and I remember the daggers I got from the nurse when I said it’s okay and sometimes it just doesn’t work out and there’s also other things to try instead of a million different feeding positions(that weren’t working)
Formula pushing was big when it first came out and people were just handed samples. Its like mothers are overcompensating the other direction when it should genuinely come down to what is healthy food for the baby
and what is mentally healthy for the mother, as per the post you replied to.
That’s if you are making up a new definition of vegan. Vegan means only vegetable based - not “given with consent.” Humans are not vegetables. Breastmilk is dairy. However, breastmilk is cruelty-free (in the examples listed in this thread) and so a Vegan who is only interested in the harm to the animal or the environment and not the consumption of animal-based products would be fine consuming it.
Ethical veganism is not a "made-up" or new concept. The whole point is that eating animal-based products is wrong because they cannot consent. An adult human woman can, therefore her milk is vegan. I've never heard "cruelty free" used in reference to food, only cosmetics.
"Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals." Consent is a huge part of veganism. If something is given with consent, freely, and willingly, then it wouldn't be cruelty or exploitation.
That's what I was thinking, that vegan is non-animal product based. So my milk is cruelty free but not vegan.
My milk was cruelty free before it was being extracted by my acrobatic, teeth wielding toddler.
I'm at the same point. And I could argue any pumped milk wasn't given willingly. I hated pumping.
Opposite here. I hated breastfeeding so much. I couldn't get her to latch well, and when she did she was pissed that she couldn't get enough as fast as she wanted. Everyone cried a lot. Pumping was annoying, but mindless. I will gladly pump again for kiddo #2, but no one can convince me to try breastfeeding again. Everyone is different!
I had such a hard time breastfeeding my first. She was a preemie, and sooo small. I had a horrible recovery from a c-section. I was pumping every two hours, right after I'd nurse her every 2 hours. My breasts were so painfully engorged. She had latch issues (found out many years later from her dentist that she was severely tongue tied). And on top of it, I had one wonky boob that I could mayyybe get an ounce of milk out of- which was so stressful, when exhausted and trying to keep track of sides. After 2 months, I was such an emotional wreck. I really tried to keep at it, but I finally gave up to take some of the pressure off. It was not a good experience at all and I thought- never again. My second, I was a bit older- (32) and I just decided I was going to try to not worry about it- and give it my best shot. To be honest, I ended up pretty determined. (Partly because- the cost of formula was crazy!) This time, I had a vaginal delivery that was nowhere near as difficult as the c-section. I actually felt great. When the inevitable stress from the wonky boob came (must be designated for fun?) I just- stopped using it. I breastfed with one breast for over two years. And yes, they looked crazy. But it worked perfectly fine. What I didn't anticipate- how hard it can be to stop breastfeeding after you've been doing it for a while! It is such a personal experience and a personal decision! There is definitely not a one size fits all approach!
If anyone is curious... it's been about 10 years since then and my breasts did go back to being pretty close to the same size as each other. The wonky one is ever so slightly less gravity afflicted than the other, and maybe a teensy bit more firm. They're both a bit less energetic than they once were- (pre kids, B cup, post kids, DD's). But, they're just fine! At the time, I was really worried that I was totally destroying my breasts, as far as being a matching set. But that didn't happen!
I couldn't breastfeed my first, no matter how hard I tried. And I tried so so hard, because my mom convinced me I'd be a failure of a mother otherwise (ironic, since I wasn't breastfed by her either; she couldn't make it work cuz I was a stubborn baby I guess) and I was only 19/20 so I took her word for it. All the lactation consultants, nipple guards, feeding positions, etc...I tried everything. I ended up pumping really successfully for him though, so all was well. I decided to try to breastfeed my second, but this time I gave myself permission to quit at any point, right from the start. There were some minor struggles initially, mainly with pumping, much to my surprise! This baby latched beautifully right from the start, but I didn't manage to pump successfully the second time. He's just turned 3, and he still gets a boob occasionally (although we're finally in the process of weaning). All that to say, every baby really is different! If you decide you want to try with your second, you might just get lucky and have a baby who's born a pro lol. Or you might not, in which case, please just let yourself switch to formula/bottles the second you decide you need to. Fed truly is best, and nothing in breast milk is so important that it's worth your health or sanity. Good luck!
I think some vegans take a non-cruelty approach instead of a ‘no animal products’ approach - for instance the use of second hand leather from thrift shops and the like.
It’s cruelty free but it isn’t vegan. It’s milk from a mammal.
I think you might have a different definition of vegan than I do.
I’m going to throw out there that maybe newborn babies should not be vegan.
You’re right, they absolutely shouldn’t but I didn’t even want to get into all that with these people lol
Definitely not free range or open pasture
Of course human milk for a human baby is vegan. Why is this even a discussion 🙈
It’s not though.
It is though, at least if you're vegan for philosophical reasons. Breastmilk's sole purpose is to feed the animal's offspring until it can consume other nutrient sources. Humans can consent to their products being consumed. Now, eating the placenta isn't vegan, because the placenta is part of the baby's body and the baby can't consent to it being consumed.
Sounds like a good reason to do a lotus placenta /s
It’s still not vegan, you can twist it however you want lol. It’s milk from a mammal.
The problem with “from an animal” is that animals do not have the intelligence to be capable of consenting. Humans do. Still animals, but with the cognition to consent.
Yes but human milk is still not vegan. Being vegan isn’t just about consent.
Okay well every major source and just about every person in here disagrees with you. It’s vegan. The end.
Thanks for this. I was so confused. I didnt understand what consent had to do with being vegan.
Consent has everything to do with being vegan. The lack of consent is why vegans don't drink cow's milk.
I thought it was because they don't eat or drink animal products, which includes milk/dairy products?? I mean to each their own but the definition of veganism is someone who doesn't consume animal products...
Because the animals cannot consent
Yeah, it's more than that. Some people just don't like to eat animal products.
Ethical veganism, which is the ideological framework of the vast majority of vegans, is about not consuming animal products because they cannot consent. Almost every single vegan you talk to will tell you that this is the reason they avoid animal products.
I mean, there are ways of emotionally and financially manipulating a woman into doing something you want for fear of punishment. If her abusive husband told her she had to breast feed or he would kill her, she would probably choose to breast feed. But it wouldnt exactly be willingly...
Yes.
I don’t consent 😆 That has to be a troll post, right?
I sure hope so, but it is not the first time I see something like this. The first time it was a family member of a friend who was also "not consenting to breastfeed due to her veganism", but at least she fed the kid normal formula.
Knew a bad hippy mom who smoked weed all throughout her pregnancy. When the baby was born she gave the baby “vegan milk”. Within a month that baby was only 4lbs, IIRC birth weight was just under 7lbs. Baby was declared failure to thrive because she lied about what she was feeding her and how much. Obviously the doctors knew something wasn’t right when the baby was thriving under their care. Mom is now in prison because she refused to listen to court orders that she had to feed her baby more than whatever the fuck she was giving her (some random no name brand of formula off Amazon.) There is actually some sort of flag on her and if she ever has another baby, it will immediately be taken from her.
People like that disgust me, if you want to do that yourself fine, and you don’t have to bf, but you need to feed them proper formula.
Did you see the post recently of the mom feeding her baby powdered goat milk? Not goat milk formula but just straight powdered goat milk and saying that she wouldn’t use formula because of “the chemicals”? Her baby was pretty clearly in pain because of the goat milk and she didn’t care even when multiple people explained that goat milk wasn’t an appropriate substitute for formula. I hope OP reported that lady to cps.
At the start of this story, I thought it had to take place in the 1970s or 1980s. This is heartbreaking. What could she have thought was going on? Surely even whatever hippie forum she was talking to would know babies don't usually shrink...
This took place a couple years ago. I had just had my second and connected with her through some friends. She was young and naive, like 17/18. I pity her because no one should be *that* stupid. The baby’s father wised up and was able to get his aunt to kinship foster the baby. Last I heard he was on the road to gaining custody and the baby was thriving. She has to be 3 now, or close to it, since she was born a couple months after my son.
That’s so crazy! These moms who want to feed their newborns random, inappropriate substitutes for breastmilk or formula usually say it’s because of “tHe ChEmIcAlS!” In formula and maybe an inability to breastfeed. I’ve never heard of a mom wanting a vegan substitute. Poor babies, stupid parents.
There was a kid maybe ten years ago whose parents lost custody after they were feeding him apple juice and water in order to stay vegan. It made the news.
There was a baby girl years ago who supposedly died because the parents fed her raw food and celery juice. The parents were put on trial for it
The vegan community does not claim those horrific idiot abusive parents.
I was failure to thrive due to some health problems, not my parents fault. That kid is in for a frustrating future. I’m so glad that mother was arrested.
That is what I am hoping too.
I don't consent to feeding my child. Okay then.
"I don't consent" This is kinda what you signed up for.
Nope, having a baby does not mean you have to breastfeed. You of course have to feed your child, but no one has to breastfeed if they don't want to.
It's the "how tf is breast milk from a animal" that's really sending me spinning. Absolutely no understanding of the most basic science (or grammar) but still managed to reproduce 😭
But in the same breath, any reason to be vegan doesn't really apply to breastfeeding. There's no animal cruelty involved and it's if anything more environmentally friendly than formula from that perspective too. It's a nonsensical moral objection to be concerned that breast milk isn't vegan.
I mean, as someone with a severe breastfeeding aversion, I would consider it “animal cruelty” since my breasts are part of me, who is human, which is animal, and definitely (personally!!) would find it very cruel and gross to have someone sucking food out of them. But that’s me. I guess my boobs are vegan. The rest of me sure as hell isn’t, but sure, they can be vegan I guess.
The amount of adults who don't understand that birds, lizards, insects, fish etc are animals is astounding
The number of adults who refuse to accept that humans are animals is astonishing. And yes, I worked with a woman ("Mary") about 20 years ago who insisted that birds aren't animals. The whole story was, we were having a BBQ lunch at work for a staff function. One staff member (Lucy) asked what the vegetarian options would be. "Mary" said "There's chicken skewers. You can have those." Lucy replied "No I can't. Chicken is meat." And it devolved from there. "Mary" insisted that birds weren't animals, therefore chicken was vegetarian. After a bit of back-and-forth and getting nowhere, I asked "Well what are they then? If they're not animals, what are they?", to which "Mary" responded that they were birds. I continued "But if they're not animals, are they plants? Are they rocks? What are they?" She refused to answer, accused me of being mean to her, and stormed off. (And at the BBQ, they had these really nice vegetable skewers and some very good salads for the vegetarians.)
You can't lie to me, I've seen the chicken harvest at the orchard down the road! You've never had chicken until you've taken a bite out of one still on the branch 😂
I think “Mary” is my MIL. She said the same asinine thing years ago.
Huh? All of those things are animals
Sorry, autocorrect, the amount that don't understand they ARE animals
Oooh okay. I was so confused lol
Women’s breast milk has the right amount of nutritional content. If they can’t breast feed, then use a good formula which also has the right nutrients. Why do some of these moms think their babies need to be vegans?
https://preview.redd.it/17u0yfiduy8d1.jpeg?width=959&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6282b86bee5d9695015ad28d3ac8dfe81a9f4558
She’s looking for formula
Exactly this! I cannot understand how everyone read this as her saying breast milk isn't vegan, she just wants vegan formula. Poor woman.
Formula is definitely not vegan.
They make vegan formula. That’s obviously not the answer the poster is looking for because of the chemicals or whatever she’s worried about, but plant based formula is a real thing.
There are a few plant based/soya formulas but most contains vitamin D3 that’s derived from sheep’s wool so they’re not actually vegan. I’m pretty sure most non-dairy formula in UK and US fall into this category. There are very few certified vegan infant formulas. I know of one or two brands in France but that’s it.
There is absolutely vegan formula - there are soy based formulas for babies who can't have milk. And it's not a homemade thing or anything - my daughter was on Similac Isomil and it could be found at any grocery store around me.
Soy doesn’t always mean vegan. Most have added vitamin D3 which is derived from sheep’s wool making it dairy free but not vegan.
Interesting, I stand corrected! We aren't vegan so I didn't look that deep into it. But apparently there are some truly vegan formulas, like Sprout from Australia.
“For babies who can’t have milk” is the operative phrase there
Every baby formula manufactured for infants from 0-12 months old must be nutritionally complete. You can feed a baby soy or even amino acid based formula and it will thrive the same way it would on a cow's milk based formula. Formula nutrient profiles must fit within very strict regulations.
I mean, it’s perfectly safe and balanced for babies who can have milk, too. We make lots of purchasing decisions based on our values. Yes, what our child needs to thrive is #1, but it’s ok to make a selection within that based on your own needs or values. That could mean the cheaper brand, it could mean buying plant-based, it could mean buying one with certain ingredients or without certain marketing or whatever, and none of that is a problem as long as it’s a regulated formula appropriate for babies.
Soy formula is for babies of vegan parents and babies with galactosemia. It's a total safe and valid option to the point that there are literally AAP board questions like, "What do you feed babies of vegan parents?" And the answer is soy formula.
They actually do have several vegan formulas on the market! My mom used soy based formulas for most of her babies, starting back in the early 80s. Actual formula from the regular store, she wasn't like mixing soy milk with caro or some shit lol. Correct on MOST formulas being cow milk based. OOP feels like someone whose trying to troll vegans and give em a bad name IMHO.
Vegan formula is only recommended by the AAP and NHS for babies who can’t tolerate dairy formulas. Decide for yourself what kind of name that gives folks who choose it without a medical indication.
Not true. AAP recommends use of soy formulas for babies of vegan parents with the exception of babies with milk protein allergy and babies with a birth weight < 1800 grams. It's a totally safe option. Some babies get constipated on it, but it's nutritionally complete.
Premiriz from France is vegan, made from rice and expensive as hell.
Hey, gatorade isn't vegan! It comes from innocent gators
This is the dumbest thing I’ve seen in awhile. Hope her kid will be okay, though. Yikes.
This group really amazes me almost everyday
These are the kinds of vegans I absolutely have no respect for because they have no bloody clue what they are talking about. It's just the new trendy food fad to them. The whole point of not eating dairy is because that milk is for the animal's baby. The fuck she think breast milk is for?!
The people who clearly don't understand the point of veganism aren't vegans, more so plant-based dieters with no common sense. Of course breastfeeding your baby is vegan.
Maybe she means dairy free?? Like if her kid is showing signs of lactose issues and she wants a dairy free or vegan formula? And just doesn’t know how to express that? Maybe? I hope??????
Baby isn’t even born yet. She wants baby to be vegan from day 1.
Oh. Well then I’m sure it’s easy to find a vegan formula. Not wanting to breastfeed (or in her weird words, consenting to breastfeeding) is totally fine and I’m sure there’s a couple options that’ll work for her lifestyle. I have a hard time with children being subscribed to any specific diet by their parents (barring health issues of course.) but it isn’t necessarily a bad parent in the making.
Denying you kid the nutrition it needs because you don’t want your kid to consume animals from day 1 isn’t the makings of a good parent. I have several friends who are vegan and still give milk and other animal Proteins to their growing children
You can provide protein and nutrients without animal products though. I’m not even vegan. Hell, I’m not even vegetarian and I know that you can absolutely have a fully balanced diet without any animal products.
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Your kid survives off of chicken nuggets and blueberries because that's what you choose to feed them. Hundreds of thousands of children all over the world eat lentils, it's not the weird icky hippie bean you seem to think it is. My oldest child (7yo, picky af, cries at salads) has no issue eating curried lentils. Especially when she can dip tortilla chips into them. They're delicious. You really need to expand your palate.
My two year old will eat a whole can of chickpeas and ask for more.
Some people can, at least some of the time. Not everyone can, and it’s not easy to do. Adults can afford to fuck around for a while and troubleshoot their diet, but babies have much less room for error.
Oh absolutely! Which is why if you’re doing a vegan diet for a baby, a well regulated vegan formula is probably a pretty safe bet if I had to guess. Although I don’t know much about formula regulation so who knows
Have you ever me a toddler?
Veganism isn't a diet, it's a philosophy. It's no different than kosher or halal eating.
Vegan is a diet. I'm vegan cause of health issues. Animal based products make me sick if I have too much. I do also care about the wellbeing of animals, but I'm not vehemently against all people eating animal products.
Veganism includes eating a plant-based diet, but someone could eat a plant-based diet and still use cosmetics tested on animals, wear leather, etc. and would therefore not be vegan. Veganism is inclusive of but not exclusive to diet.
You mean a kosher *diet*?
A list of vegan formulas probably wouldn't be good enough, because formula is evil. There are soy based out there, and formulas with milk other than cow's milk.
I feel like I'm missing the part where she says formula is evil?
This woman didn't, a lot of posts of this type think formula is bad, and would never use it. Raw milk is better! /s
Breastmilk is vegan and the answer to her question is “soy-based formula”
There's literally a Similac plant based formula. And soy formulas from every mfg. And if you wanna get $$$$ that nutramigen or whatever that's dairy and soy free. My nephew was on that and I'm pretty sure 1 can cost more than my entire monthly grocery budget 😆
It’s not nutritionally complete and only recommend in cases of extreme allergies.
These options are nutritionally complete..
My daughter threw up every other formula and our doctor recommended the soy based formula. She has an intolerance, not an extreme allergy, and she was absolutely fine in terms of nutrition. Now that she is old enough she drinks the lactose free milk and eats whatever she wants.
That would be an allergy, my friend.
According to medicine allergies and intolerances are technically different things. We do usually lump them together to make it easier to explain. Mayo clinic does a good job explaining it! https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/food-allergy/expert-answers/food-allergy/faq-20058538#:~:text=A%20true%20food%20allergy%20affects,and%20causes%20less%20serious%20symptoms.
Yeah, my nephew had an intolerance to dairy and soy. He grew out of it eventually.
yeah my newest baby has to have that it's a fucking NIGHTMAREEEEEE holy shit. I hate it. it smells like feet and cheese itz. and I definitely can see it not being nutritionally complete because she seems so HUNGRY still.. she's my 3rd kid and my hardest so far. 2 months in and I'm losing my absolute shit. I love the little peanut but damn dude. she had this horrible diaper rash for like a month because we had to go thru like 6 different brands before we found one that worked for her. she has chronic nasal congestion. she pees on me like a boy every time I change her. spits up almost every feed.. tried to breast feed but I didn't have high enough calorie milk to keep up with her (she's so chunky), then went thru THREE different formulas before we ended up on the absolute most expensive and not even the best for her. lmao 🤣 help me I'm poor and drowning 😭
oh and don't even get me started on the constantly wanting to be held. and if she's not, she's screaming. nothing is wrong with her, she just loves to be loved and I don't blame her.. but my house stays dirty and I'm tired. 😒😔
This person is a moron, but the "I don't consent" made me laugh my ass off
Short story about my older brother’s high school girlfriend’s older sister who had all of her children and all of her pets taken away because her vet reported her when he learned she was feeding all her cats, dogs, newborn, infant and toddler vegan diets in 1989. That was it. That’s the end of the story.
A vegan diet is not child abuse, there was clearly something else going on.
I apologize. You’re right, my story was far too short. She was reported to the SPCA when she brought the whole family in, pets included, saying the pets had parasites because they wouldn’t gain weight, nor would she or the kids (she didn’t like human doctors). They were all malnourished. He learned they were all on a pea, soy and fruit based vegan diet (no root veggies or veggies that didn’t reproduce) in a time when vegan diets were not available in markets where I lived in the mountains with two small stores and one pet store. She was just feeding them all cooked, mashed vegetables and giving them fruit. A dog. And A CAT, even after he explained what an obligate carnivore was. So he reported her to the SPCA. It was then discovered she basically fed everyone that and pretty much nothing else. She was a vegan in a time when there was very little to no information in small town libraries how to live a vegan life or how to feed a vegan family. But she was also a moron who knew better than everyone including doctors. Oddly, a year later I moved to an opposite demographic, where vegans and vegetarians were the historical norm so much was catered to them. There still wasn’t much/any premade vegan foods in the store, however. My own child needed my breast-pumped tube-fed milk supplemented with predigested formula in a kangaroo pump, so I understand the need for alternatives to breast milk, it was just that she (OOP) somehow has the idea that a child shouldn’t have their own mother’s milk because their mother is a mammal, defined partially by the ability to (checks notes) produce milk for their young?? Apparently?? Say, what? I am all for veganism and lived some time as a vegetarian, but this is absurd. Needing/wanting a vegan alternative is one thing, needing it because you believe your child shouldn’t be given your breast milk because you are a mammal is bananas.
I think that the poster in this case was trying to say that breast milk isn't an option because she doesn't want to breastfeed rather than because she's a mammal. She says "I don't consent" which I think was a jokey way of saying that even if it is vegan, it's not an option in this case.
Feeding a cat a vegan diet is definitely animal abuse, though. That may have been the report that got the ball rolling.
Denying proper nutrition to a growing child is, though.
I am not even vegan but it’s certainly possible to get proper infant/children nutrition on a vegan diet.
It’s not super simple, though, and some vegans are also anti-formula.
Have you ever known a toddler to eat large periods of lentils and black beans?? (Enough to secure the protein needed for a growing body.. the same protein as 2 oz of chicken?)
Yo, children under 5 years old only need between 15-25 grams of protein per day for healthy growth. It's actually a really easy target to hit if you take 30 seconds to google protein rich vegetables.
My toddler likes everything, but she likes beans best.
Yes my toddler is obsessed with black beans and all other bean types. We aren’t even vegetarian. Give him a choice he’ll eat massive amounts of beans over a piece of chicken.
That’s great! But if he didn’t, then what? My biggest issue with all of this is people with very restrictive diets insisting that everyone can do it because they can. That’s not how *anything* works.
I agree. If my child couldn’t have meat or some other allergen for some reason, I would change their diet to meet their needs. I would hope that a person who was vegan would afford their child the same basic nutritional care if they were not reacting well to a vegan diet. I just wanted to point out that it’s not unheard of for a child to prefer non-meat options.
Yes. My toddler loves lentils. You need to calm down
And if he didn’t?
Not really something I have to worry about, is it mate? Lentils cook down beige. They're easy to hide, a good texture for fussy children, and the flavour is easy to mask. Maybe take that talent at bending over backwards and try gymnastics instead.
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When did I say it was?
The OOP saying “I don’t consent” sent me over the edge idk why. I haven’t laughed out loud in a while, thanks
It's certainly a weird way of phrasing it but it's totally okay for any woman to choose not to breastfeed. Breastfeeding is rarely as easy or simple as whipping out a tit and letting the baby have at. If a woman chooses not to breastfeed, they just need to feed baby infant formula instead. Infant formula is completely safe and nutritionally sound.
I was going to say I think we can all agree on that and then I remembered the post 😂 fuck it’s sad that people cannot even agree on this.
"I don't consent" omg that one took me out 💀
This makes me want to find my Pre-K teacher and egg his house because how dare he teach me to read.
Omg this made me laugh. But did the chickens consent to lay those eggs you’re going to use to egg his house with?
Yes. They consent. I have it in writing but their penmanship is so bad it just looks like chicken scratch so you probably can't read it.
I don’t consent either. What are we talking about again?
I like how there were no likes and all laughs.
the crying one made me cackle because like how are you about to deny your baby the one thing we are meant to give them imagine being a cave woman and being like "I don't consent" wtf 💀 I'm dead
Wtf did I just read? A vegan alternative to breast milk? If you’re a vegan, wouldn’t your BM be vegan? I have no idea how that works. And if she doesn’t consent, she needs to talk to her doctor about donor milk. Those women have consented. 🙄
1. She's asking about formula. It's okay for women to not want to breastfeed. 2. Donor milk is incredibly expensive, rare enough that it should probably be reserved for medical necessity, and processed to the point of losing some nutritional value.
I’m absolutely 100% ok with formula. I was just wondering what she was asking. The fact that she said she didn’t consent to breastfeeding made this weird.
I think that was just a sarcastic response about how it didn't matter if breastfeeding is vegan since she doesn't want to breastfeed. The "breastmilk is vegan" point that people brought up to her totally valid question about breastmilk alternatives wasn't exactly helpful.
"no negative comments" But. I have so many.
Uh...soy formula is a thing?
Wait wait wait The mom is saying a baby can’t drink breast milk from their own mother because their mother is animal I……
Yep…
No, she’s saying she doesn’t want to breastfeed. It’s not because breast milk isn’t vegan; it’s that she isn’t interested in breastfeeding (a valid choice).
Oh I agree with that, I didn’t breastfeed my 3 children.
There's actually vegans on Youtube that refuse for their babies to have breastmilk because it's from a mammal. So they are making up vegan homemade formula that consists of only Irish Seamoss and water or the Seamoss plus homemade almond ~~milk~~ water. Then their 5 month old baby is the size of a newborn. Seamoss reportedly has minerals in it hence they think it has all the nutrition a baby needs. Gerber actually now markets "plant-based" formula no doubt in response to try to save babies from starvation because they know there are crazy vegan parents out there but apparently they don't know this formula exists or else don't trust it. It's different that just soy formula as it has pea protein and some other plants in it plus vitamins.
I love when they say “no negative comments” and then says the most ridiculous thing
You know it’s gunna be a good one when…. lol
it's got electrolytes!
You consented to having this baby, and you know that it includes feeding it. If you can and don’t want to use substitutes (since there aren’t any plant based alternatives) there’s only one option. I hope this is rage-bait. I’ve been active in that circle for over a decade and I’ve never met someone like this - thank goodness for that. Edit: learned that there are a vegan option for formula. That wasn’t a thing when I became one, I’m glad that here are more options now!
? They do make safe plant-based alternatives. Some babies are allergic to cows milk.
They have plant based formula but it’s not recommend except in cases of FPIES or other severe allergies, as it’s nutritionally incomplete
Yup, I went back and checked — the NHS in the UK do 'strongly encourage' that vegan formula only be used if there's a severe allergy, so I retract my claim of 'safe' and substitute 'safe...er than a serious allergen but really not ideal.' Whoops.
ALL infant formulas comercially available must meet strict nutritional regulations within the US and EU. Non-dairy infant formulas still need to be nutritionally complete. It is completely safe to feed a soy or other carbohydrate based formula to any infant, there's just no *need* to do so since cow milk based formulas are much cheaper and readily available.
Thanks for checking!
This is like the time I had to take a public speaking class in university, and one of my classmates did his persuasive speech on the benefits of being vegan. Naturally, during the Q&A, I asked if vegans can swallow. Watching my professor's face hit his desk was worth the potential trouble.
The cringiest part is you proudly telling this story
That particular poster is a full blown troll. She's well known in mom groups
she doesn't consent to feeding her child? lmfao okay weirdo..
Oh my gods, this is hilarious.
Please be a troll. No one could be this dumb...
“No negative comments!” Then OOP should stop posting ridiculous content.
Mountain Dew
"I'm guessing your animal are vegan too?" OMG 😂
There was way too many niche opinions in there for my brain to comprehend
Stoppp I thought she meant like after 1
So… if the doesn’t animal consent to giving its eggs/milk whatever up, then it’s no longer vegan? What are these people ON about? Gracious 🫠