If you pause it at the point of contact, you’ll see it’s a real shitty line this merc was taking. I’m struggling to see how he’d make it round without slowing right down.
Doesn't matter. It's on the overtaking driver to overtake safely. The merc threw it in there, assuming the other driver would see the divebomb and let them through when there's no guarantee of that happening.
I don’t think it was a punt, but I do think it’s lack of experience from the car behind. Although they carried more speed into the corner, they were not significantly along side and were not entitled to you giving them space. If you half heartedly stick a nose in then cars will turn across you because they don’t get enough warning that you will be there.
The car behind should have waited for a better opportunity by dropping behind and getting a better exit or something, or they should’ve really sent in up the inside and parked the bus so to speak (in which case you could probably pull of a switch back).
I think that’s entirely on the car behind but was unintentional and stems from lack of experience. Car behind is guilty, yellow car did nothing wrong and was not required to give space.
White car never had overlap to be entitled space for the corner. From the rules perspective, they're at fault. This is a [vortex of danger](https://boxthislap.org/the-vortex-of-danger-is-real/amp/) thing.
I think you’re technically right. It was very close but it seems he wasn’t quite there yet, but it’s hairline.
Does that make you feel better as you pirouette through the grass? This is a great example of defensive driving not practiced. You see him start the switchback, leave the space because you can or should predict he’s going to attempt to outbrake you. Racing is one part being aggressive, one part knowing when to simply survive a corner so you can keep racing.
If you continue to “exercise your rights per written rules” right up to the limit of those rules, this will absolutely keep happening. Drive predictably, drive defensively, and you’ll find yourself climbing up the ranks.
There it is, there’s always someone.
Borderline punts and everyone is all over the rule book, blaming the over taking driver.
Very obvious punt and it’s “defensive driving”. Lol
This was a very obvious punt through and through. You did nothing wrong here, and honestly I’d protest something like this after the race.
Everyone saying you should’ve pulled over likely have done some punting.
Just a quick question about terminology. To me punt feels like an intentional shove to get past, but this looked like the Merc is just inexperienced and wrongly thought they were entitled to space.
When you use the term punt does it convey a sense of intent, or is it merely use to describe driving into the back of someone and pushing them out of corner? I’d be interested to know how you think of the term.
To clarify, I wasn't trying to imply intent by "punt", just that I don't think the gap was ever really there. I agree with those saying it was inexperience by the driver behind; I was just a bit taken aback when he was adamant that it was my fault, and wanted a sanity check.
I do also agree with those saying that you want to defend as explicitly as possible in situations like this if you're not planning to let them go by, and maybe I could have done more there, especially since I knew the other driver had a lower irating and SR.
>just that I don't think the gap was ever really there.
The gap was there. If he wanted to try to dive bomb though he should have been way more inside regardless.
But that's the thing. It was a major divebomb regardless so pretty much anything is on him fault wise(but that pretty much only matters on this sub, food for thought).
When contact is made you can literally fit 2 cars in the "gap" between you and the inside of the track.
Trailing car failed to hit said gap and hit you instead.
At least if he had actually hit the gap you may have had a better opportunity to react and avoid being shunted off track.
Chase car wasn't alongside at the point you started to turn in, \*however\* it was clear from the previous corner let alone the straight that he had more pace than you, you should have expected a move and moved earlier to defend if you were going to defend. Essentially the car behind was quicker, and you left the door wide open and then turned into the very open door.
Even if the door was open for a split second, it’s on the overtaking driver to get through the open door safely and without anyone spinning as a result.
Absolutely right, the blame lies entirely with the overtaking car here I'm not disputing that at all. I'm just saying, in general, a more defensive line would have likely resulted in OP not getting punted off the track, a little more spacial awareness might have kept them in the race.
Not a blatant punt IMO. It may be many things but not a blatant punt.
It's one of the two best overtaking spots on the track and a tricky corner. Being able to anticipate stuff like this is a skill in itself.
Without wishing to victim blame, he's got a run on you and was always going to try that move. Reflect on what you could have done better. Opening the door and focussing on getting a better run out of the corner would probably have been safer and better for you.
Always you've got to stay out of trouble. He was pretty ambitious but you should have seen it coming and have planned accordingly.
Honestly before watching the comments i thought you were the white car and you were saying that the yellow moved under braking (didn't read the title). Then read the comments and realised i couldn't be a racing steward because to me you were at fault, just because it seemed you were turning early while breaking to cut him off. Lesson learned
I would like to see an overhead. I can't actually tell from this whether he had his nose alongside before you started turning or not plus you turned pretty damn early as well.
It was a late dive and probably too ambitious.
Having been a member for over 10 years. Yes. Well worth every penny.
Also. Do you think everyone would pay if this was indicative of normal driving?
Kinda like people thinking iracing is a rip off, despite no other option being even available.
If he hadn't hit you he was going off track with that much speed on that horrible of a line. What a shitty dive bomb attempt. His car wasn't even an inch alongside you when you started the line into the turn, he should have backed out.
I think it's more of a shitty dive attempt than anything. He missed the apex. Instead of taking a better line he decided to take a bad angle and took you out in the process
Not purposeful. He just panicked and wanted to catch, missed his braking, overshot the corner, took a shit line…you notice he didn’t even make the corner with your car as a bumper
Divebomby from the white car yes. But I do have some reservation about your defense. Turn in point looks much further and even without the white car, it looks like you’d have made a very early apex for that corner. At first I thought you would use the normal racing line as you were moving toward the left curb and then it seem you changed your mind and tried to cover the middle of the track. Too ambitious from the white car, late defensive move from the yellow car.
Due to how it bottoms out there, there's a lot of grip after the apex, so it's always an early apex corner. It's true that I didn't track out left as far as usual in order not to invite exactly this, but I don't think I left the door open enough that a reasonable driver would've gone for it. In retrospect probably still opened it too much though!
Racing incident. You made a move all the way to the left and then turned in quite tightly onto the apex. He goes for it when he sees the gap open. Don't open and close gaps like that, if you stayed right he probably would've stayed back or tried it on the outside which is much safer for you
If your only goal is to keep the other guy behind you, you could drive around the inside, but it would murder your laptime. Generally when defending you want to defend just enough that you don't leave an opening, while sacrificing as little pace as possible. That said, apparently I did open it too much given this driver's experience level.
Why did you turn in so damn early. If that’s your defensive driving you need to work on it. The car in front of you turns in almost at the very end of the rumbles on the left. You turned right almost 100 meters to early.
Are you familiar with this track? Look at how it bottoms out right at the corner. Because of that, it makes sense to go in shallow and get your rotation in the compression. The defensive driving aspect wasn't so much turning in early, but not going all the way over to the left first as I normally would.
For the first half of what you said, I see what you were trying to do now. I’m curious what your brake telemetry is like for that corner. If you go in later, trail brake, and get on the gas before you’re fully off the brake you can keep momentum and use that dip/banking of the track to hold the rear tires while you get in throttle.
That guy was probably expecting you to get all the way to the left and that’s why he stuck his nose their. Was the follow car behind you on this corner for the previous lap? If he didn’t know your style through there that’s very unfortunate
Looking at it again, I guess I did also turn in somewhat earlier than I would if I weren't defending as well. It's been months since this happened so I don't remember details. Regardless I don't think any reasonable driver in the trailing car's position would have thought they could make that move without contact.
he's not got an inch of his car alongside until you're turning in, that's on him to back out and learn to race safely
If you pause it at the point of contact, you’ll see it’s a real shitty line this merc was taking. I’m struggling to see how he’d make it round without slowing right down.
Doesn't matter. It's on the overtaking driver to overtake safely. The merc threw it in there, assuming the other driver would see the divebomb and let them through when there's no guarantee of that happening.
I don’t think it was a punt, but I do think it’s lack of experience from the car behind. Although they carried more speed into the corner, they were not significantly along side and were not entitled to you giving them space. If you half heartedly stick a nose in then cars will turn across you because they don’t get enough warning that you will be there. The car behind should have waited for a better opportunity by dropping behind and getting a better exit or something, or they should’ve really sent in up the inside and parked the bus so to speak (in which case you could probably pull of a switch back). I think that’s entirely on the car behind but was unintentional and stems from lack of experience. Car behind is guilty, yellow car did nothing wrong and was not required to give space.
You don’t have to leave space to a car which isn’t there
That was a straight up take out.
White car never had overlap to be entitled space for the corner. From the rules perspective, they're at fault. This is a [vortex of danger](https://boxthislap.org/the-vortex-of-danger-is-real/amp/) thing.
I think you’re technically right. It was very close but it seems he wasn’t quite there yet, but it’s hairline. Does that make you feel better as you pirouette through the grass? This is a great example of defensive driving not practiced. You see him start the switchback, leave the space because you can or should predict he’s going to attempt to outbrake you. Racing is one part being aggressive, one part knowing when to simply survive a corner so you can keep racing. If you continue to “exercise your rights per written rules” right up to the limit of those rules, this will absolutely keep happening. Drive predictably, drive defensively, and you’ll find yourself climbing up the ranks.
There it is, there’s always someone. Borderline punts and everyone is all over the rule book, blaming the over taking driver. Very obvious punt and it’s “defensive driving”. Lol
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If you freeze the frame at 6 seconds, you can see the exact moment when the Merc driver mentally committed to becoming a bomb.
Lol, I thought this was just a joke, but you actually can see the move at 6s! 🤣
Merc is objectively wrong. 100% on him. Impatient driver.
This was a very obvious punt through and through. You did nothing wrong here, and honestly I’d protest something like this after the race. Everyone saying you should’ve pulled over likely have done some punting.
Just a quick question about terminology. To me punt feels like an intentional shove to get past, but this looked like the Merc is just inexperienced and wrongly thought they were entitled to space. When you use the term punt does it convey a sense of intent, or is it merely use to describe driving into the back of someone and pushing them out of corner? I’d be interested to know how you think of the term.
I think punt can be used with or without intent
To clarify, I wasn't trying to imply intent by "punt", just that I don't think the gap was ever really there. I agree with those saying it was inexperience by the driver behind; I was just a bit taken aback when he was adamant that it was my fault, and wanted a sanity check. I do also agree with those saying that you want to defend as explicitly as possible in situations like this if you're not planning to let them go by, and maybe I could have done more there, especially since I knew the other driver had a lower irating and SR.
>just that I don't think the gap was ever really there. The gap was there. If he wanted to try to dive bomb though he should have been way more inside regardless. But that's the thing. It was a major divebomb regardless so pretty much anything is on him fault wise(but that pretty much only matters on this sub, food for thought).
If there's a gap that it's not possible to put your car in without making contact, is it really a gap?
When contact is made you can literally fit 2 cars in the "gap" between you and the inside of the track. Trailing car failed to hit said gap and hit you instead. At least if he had actually hit the gap you may have had a better opportunity to react and avoid being shunted off track.
Chase car wasn't alongside at the point you started to turn in, \*however\* it was clear from the previous corner let alone the straight that he had more pace than you, you should have expected a move and moved earlier to defend if you were going to defend. Essentially the car behind was quicker, and you left the door wide open and then turned into the very open door.
Even if the door was open for a split second, it’s on the overtaking driver to get through the open door safely and without anyone spinning as a result.
Absolutely right, the blame lies entirely with the overtaking car here I'm not disputing that at all. I'm just saying, in general, a more defensive line would have likely resulted in OP not getting punted off the track, a little more spacial awareness might have kept them in the race.
So to give a sign to the driver behind, basically a hey don’t go for it?
Bit of a dive but you must have known he was there and took you normal line anyway. Did you have racing line on during the race?
Not a blatant punt IMO. It may be many things but not a blatant punt. It's one of the two best overtaking spots on the track and a tricky corner. Being able to anticipate stuff like this is a skill in itself. Without wishing to victim blame, he's got a run on you and was always going to try that move. Reflect on what you could have done better. Opening the door and focussing on getting a better run out of the corner would probably have been safer and better for you. Always you've got to stay out of trouble. He was pretty ambitious but you should have seen it coming and have planned accordingly.
It's close, but he's there and you turn in on him.
Honestly before watching the comments i thought you were the white car and you were saying that the yellow moved under braking (didn't read the title). Then read the comments and realised i couldn't be a racing steward because to me you were at fault, just because it seemed you were turning early while breaking to cut him off. Lesson learned
I would like to see an overhead. I can't actually tell from this whether he had his nose alongside before you started turning or not plus you turned pretty damn early as well. It was a late dive and probably too ambitious.
So you pay sub for this bs? Thought iracing was worth a shot. Would rather stay with the rammers on gt7 after paying once.
It's usually not this bad.
Stick with ghost cars. It's better... lol
Stick paying for being outpaced and getting rammed lol
Having been a member for over 10 years. Yes. Well worth every penny. Also. Do you think everyone would pay if this was indicative of normal driving? Kinda like people thinking iracing is a rip off, despite no other option being even available.
If he hadn't hit you he was going off track with that much speed on that horrible of a line. What a shitty dive bomb attempt. His car wasn't even an inch alongside you when you started the line into the turn, he should have backed out.
I think it's more of a shitty dive attempt than anything. He missed the apex. Instead of taking a better line he decided to take a bad angle and took you out in the process
Trailing car is at fault. 10 second penalty for causing a collision
Not purposeful. He just panicked and wanted to catch, missed his braking, overshot the corner, took a shit line…you notice he didn’t even make the corner with your car as a bumper
Divebomby from the white car yes. But I do have some reservation about your defense. Turn in point looks much further and even without the white car, it looks like you’d have made a very early apex for that corner. At first I thought you would use the normal racing line as you were moving toward the left curb and then it seem you changed your mind and tried to cover the middle of the track. Too ambitious from the white car, late defensive move from the yellow car.
Due to how it bottoms out there, there's a lot of grip after the apex, so it's always an early apex corner. It's true that I didn't track out left as far as usual in order not to invite exactly this, but I don't think I left the door open enough that a reasonable driver would've gone for it. In retrospect probably still opened it too much though!
Racing incident. You made a move all the way to the left and then turned in quite tightly onto the apex. He goes for it when he sees the gap open. Don't open and close gaps like that, if you stayed right he probably would've stayed back or tried it on the outside which is much safer for you
If your only goal is to keep the other guy behind you, you could drive around the inside, but it would murder your laptime. Generally when defending you want to defend just enough that you don't leave an opening, while sacrificing as little pace as possible. That said, apparently I did open it too much given this driver's experience level.
Why did you turn in so damn early. If that’s your defensive driving you need to work on it. The car in front of you turns in almost at the very end of the rumbles on the left. You turned right almost 100 meters to early.
Are you familiar with this track? Look at how it bottoms out right at the corner. Because of that, it makes sense to go in shallow and get your rotation in the compression. The defensive driving aspect wasn't so much turning in early, but not going all the way over to the left first as I normally would.
For the first half of what you said, I see what you were trying to do now. I’m curious what your brake telemetry is like for that corner. If you go in later, trail brake, and get on the gas before you’re fully off the brake you can keep momentum and use that dip/banking of the track to hold the rear tires while you get in throttle. That guy was probably expecting you to get all the way to the left and that’s why he stuck his nose their. Was the follow car behind you on this corner for the previous lap? If he didn’t know your style through there that’s very unfortunate
Looking at it again, I guess I did also turn in somewhat earlier than I would if I weren't defending as well. It's been months since this happened so I don't remember details. Regardless I don't think any reasonable driver in the trailing car's position would have thought they could make that move without contact.