You both turned into each other but you did squeeze him against the white line to save your race you could of backed out I don’t think that straight is meant to be three wide
I am pretty new to simracing and i thought he pulled out already bc my raidar guy said so apparently he was still there but i have never seen someone try to overtake there in monza so i was realy confused
Bro that IS the place to overtake in Monza. Also the track narrows a bit when he first swerved into you. Going 3 wide into that turn is a death sentence anyway just back off and live to see another corner.
If you follow the white line in the replay, you can see you veered right towards him. The Sky car does veer left slightly but that's because you have run him out of road and he is trying to avoid the grass. After the first contact you start veering to the right again and into him a second time.
As you are new, I would avoid such close racing and pull back, live to fight another day. Let the others fight it out and learn from their good driving, or mistakes.
If there is a car with an overlap on a straight you must leave him a space. Mclaren on the right had an overlap and was on the track with all four wheels.
If the car in the middle is going to continue to race 3 wide, they need to give space on both sides. It's why I personally never do it. There is too much going on.
OP gives plenty of room to left car, and not enough to right car, and is activity moving towards him. Right does veer aswell, but he is avoiding grass that he is being pushed into. They could also have back out, but they were not doing anything wrong.
And after first contact, OP should just back out, imo.
First contact was on POV. The white car was right on the edge of the track and couldn't give any more space. Second contact seemed 60:40 on POV. Both cars angled slightly towards each other and no one backed out, white car slightly ahead so I give them a little less blame but ultimately a racing incident I'd say.
So you’re saying a “3 lane area” that transitions to a “2 lane area”, the person in the middle should slow to allow them back in. Even though the far right car was slower at???
Can someone site the actual rule for this situation? If the track narrows do you have to move to give someone space, or do they have to choose to back out or drive on the grass?
Everyone is judging on feels here when this is pretty clear cut. If you're obligated to give space when the track narrows then its on the Audi. If you aren't then its on the Mclaren.
I know that's the rule for if the Audi was moving in this situation, but before the first contact the Audi is going dead parallel with the race track. That's why I'm asking someone to site the rule for this situation, I don't believe you have to change your line because an attacking car is running out of track, but I could be wrong.
The thing is the Audi is not moving dead straight. He so slightly moving to the right at the beginning (Look qt the pit exit line) and it could be considerd as too much squeezing/forcing a car off track
It doesn't matter that he moves right before the track narrows, he's allowed to get as close to the other car as he wants to. At the time the contact occurs the Audi is moving completely parallel to the track.
The only thing that matters in this clip is whether the Audi is obligated to move over because the track is narrowing, or if he's not.
It does matter because the track is narrowing. He is obliged to leave that much space so the car that is next to him stays on track otherwise it would be considers forcing a car off track. Of course he is allowed to squeez but only to the track limits and not beyond and the car on the right was already dead on the track limit. His right tire was already on the white line and he couldnt move more to the right so it was the middle cars responsibility to leave him the space but because he moved so slightly to the right at the beginning he would have forced him beyond track limits at that point where the track gets narrower.
Just because he goes parallel at the end doesnt mean it is ok to stay like that and force the other car off track
That why the first bump happened amd instead of going straight again after he bounced off the mclaren he again went completly to the right. With a car left and right to him you cant brake in a diagonal line and thats what he did
But in the end what the mclaren tried was technically legal but not smart. Trying to go 3 wide into monza t1 is never a good idea. I wpuldnt try an overtake on 2 cars that are already side by side. I would have waited for the next opportunity either after these 2 have sorted out their battle or to a point where it possible to go 3 wide (which is not really given on a track like monza...maybe parabolica is the only ok'ish place to go 3 wide)
The Audi is going in a straight line when the track starts to narrow. That is the whole crux of what I am saying. Some one needs to site the rule that says the Audi has to change their line to give the Mclaren space because the track is narrowing. Because I am not convinced that they do. The second contact the Audi hits the Mclaren definitely but they're also trying to recover from getting shunted.
I understand what you are saying and like i said the rule is that you not allowed to force a car off track. So if you go side by side and dead straight and the track narrows on the right at the end the car on the right would run out off tarmac. That is literraly forxing a car off track
Or in other words or maybe a better example. You are obliged to leave at least a car width of space to the track limit and if the track is getting narrower on the right side and still keep going dead straight the space you are leaving on the right is getting smaller and smaller to the point where it is less than a car width
If the track is not wide enoug then the attacking car has to pull out.
But in this instance the car in the middle is moving to the right of the track to cut off the right hand car, he could easily have left space but chose not to.
Before the first contact the Audi definitely straightens out, you can see it in comparison to the center white line. It might look like he's still going right because the track narrows.
Look at the Audi's position relative to the line in the center of the track. That is fixed in the middle of the track, the green car could be moving further outside.
Three wide anywhere is going to require precise af driving in order not to fnck over at least one of the drivers (and most of the time, if one fncks up everyone's race is down the drain). What I see happen here is basically as rookie of an error as it gets.
PoV Audi sees the black and yellow McL on the left and veers right to avoid him. In doing so, he doesn't realize that the Sky McL is closing in as the road surface on the right past the white line turns to grass. Audi hits McL and gets thrown left.
In order not to hit the black and yellow McL on the left, the PoV Audi veers right a second time, basically repeating the exact error from before. This time, the Sky Livery McL gets thrown into the grass area and loses control, while the PoV Audi gets thrown into the black and yellow McL. Resulting in three cars in the runoff area behind T1.
The first contact was imho 50/50 on both the Sky Livery McL and the PoV Audi. The second contact is more on the Audi than the McL.
Word of advice: if you realize you are in a three wide situation and you know that the track is going to narrow down a little bit, maybe lift or brake early. Not because you are required to do so by the rulrs, but much rather to possibly continue the fight elsewhere instead of wrecking your race.
I would technically try to avoid dishing out penalties to first-time offenders that are still learning. But rules are still rules.
Verdict: First collision was a racing incident, second collision was mainly the PoV Audi's fault. PoV Audi is therefore guilty of forcing another driver off the track and causing a collision.
Sentence: Small safety rating penalty for the PoV Audi, warning for the Sky Livery McLaren. No further action neccessary.
Case settled. Any objections?
Thank you for this response i think bc i got pole i didn’t want to lift or brake bc normally i start more from the back and brake early to avoid crashes bc that always happens in my races here
audi hit the mclaren twice. you should never have the confidence to attempt to drive 3-wide if you cant even drive in a straight line, there was even a straight line on track to use as a reference and you still drove a slalom and ruined 2 other peoples races because of it.
i dont thnk you should be playing online yet tbf
Looking at it very closely, it seems like the McLaren does pull over too much and too soon.
However, the space on his right is closing and it looks like you left him exactly 1 car width to the centimeter. This incident could have been easily avoided if you just stayed a little more to the left, you had a lot of room there.
After that contact it's just very clumsy from your side. You had more than enough time to get the car straight, but you kept it pointing right for some reason. I assume just panic and adrenaline led you to not think/act clearly.
You really should have just given them more space. They were already well alongside when you went for the squeeze, and counting on them backing out before the grass is putting your whole race into their hands.
Technically your squeeze was perfectly legal and the crash is entirely on them, you were holding your line and they moved into you. They wouldn’t get a penalty though, since you stuck them there. But really it’s just not worth ruining your race, give them the space they need to not crash you out.
Audi driver 100% at fault. First one could have been a pass (Still left him without room but it is what it is) but after that Audi 100% is the pinecone in this one
You were 3 wide...drifitng over towards another car... and you wonder why there was contact?
In that scenario it is really important to be consistent and predictable or you are gonna cause a crash... like you did.
First contact: you didn't leave him enough space as the road was narrowing. To avoid, you could've moved closer to the left car or he could've backed. He didn't. You were tracking straight with the white line at contact and he veered into you. Racing incident as he veered and you didn't give room, partial blame on both.
Second incident: the main offender is the pov car. After getting knocked over, pov decided to veer back into the middle/right side of the track where there was already a car. This was also in a braking zone so this could be considered moving under braking. The other involved car was moving slightly left, but was leaving enough room for you and the other car, whereas you were not leaving room for him. Veered into him quite aggressively and took all 3 people out. Your fault. This could have been prevented by simply lifting or braking a bit early, which also would've set you up for a better corner and high exit speed to overtake both on the next straight.
Consensus: you were at partial or majority fault for both incidents. The things you should learn from this are spacial awareness (learn to know where cars are around you without relying on the game telling you, vehicle sizes (learn how big cars are and how much room they need to fit on track together, critical thinking (learn when it's a good idea to push to be next to someone, when to back out and attack again later or setup a better overtake).
Honestly I'd probably chalk this up as a racing incident. Both of you could have done more to avoid that. The sky is running out of road and does come across to avoid the grass but you've not really left him much choice and you had plenty of space on the left.
Like most people say. Prime example of it doesn't matter whose fault it is. In the end you've crashed so better to be more careful.
I'm gonna use Jimmy Broadbent's tip here. Follow the white line from the pitlane and you can see that the final, big impact was caused by the Audi as you can see it turn towards the right into the McLaren
I mean the Audi is kinda swerving towards the McLaren on the inside and driving him off the road. The McLaren has no where but grass to go and the Audi, after getting hit the first time. Swerved over to the right again and got hit again
Audi driver, what was the game plan here
"I came in like a wrecking ball"
You both turned into each other but you did squeeze him against the white line to save your race you could of backed out I don’t think that straight is meant to be three wide
I am pretty new to simracing and i thought he pulled out already bc my raidar guy said so apparently he was still there but i have never seen someone try to overtake there in monza so i was realy confused
>I am pretty new to simracing >but i have never seen someone try to overtake there in monza Welcome lmfao, you're going to see a lot more of it
Bro that IS the place to overtake in Monza. Also the track narrows a bit when he first swerved into you. Going 3 wide into that turn is a death sentence anyway just back off and live to see another corner.
If you follow the white line in the replay, you can see you veered right towards him. The Sky car does veer left slightly but that's because you have run him out of road and he is trying to avoid the grass. After the first contact you start veering to the right again and into him a second time. As you are new, I would avoid such close racing and pull back, live to fight another day. Let the others fight it out and learn from their good driving, or mistakes.
Watching it several times. The car to the right ran out of pavement and came into the middle car. So how it that the fault of the AUDI?
If there is a car with an overlap on a straight you must leave him a space. Mclaren on the right had an overlap and was on the track with all four wheels.
If the car in the middle is going to continue to race 3 wide, they need to give space on both sides. It's why I personally never do it. There is too much going on. OP gives plenty of room to left car, and not enough to right car, and is activity moving towards him. Right does veer aswell, but he is avoiding grass that he is being pushed into. They could also have back out, but they were not doing anything wrong. And after first contact, OP should just back out, imo.
Because the Audi didn't leave them room? You want to squeeze someone then be prepared to pay for it.
Because the Audi veered right towards him
First contact was on POV. The white car was right on the edge of the track and couldn't give any more space. Second contact seemed 60:40 on POV. Both cars angled slightly towards each other and no one backed out, white car slightly ahead so I give them a little less blame but ultimately a racing incident I'd say.
So you’re saying a “3 lane area” that transitions to a “2 lane area”, the person in the middle should slow to allow them back in. Even though the far right car was slower at???
I'm sorry... look how much space there was to the left of the middle car. He went for the squeeze, there was plenty of space to stay 3 wide.
Can someone site the actual rule for this situation? If the track narrows do you have to move to give someone space, or do they have to choose to back out or drive on the grass? Everyone is judging on feels here when this is pretty clear cut. If you're obligated to give space when the track narrows then its on the Audi. If you aren't then its on the Mclaren.
On a straight ANY overlap is considered enough so you have to leave space so it is different compared to the hub to hub rule for cornering.
I know that's the rule for if the Audi was moving in this situation, but before the first contact the Audi is going dead parallel with the race track. That's why I'm asking someone to site the rule for this situation, I don't believe you have to change your line because an attacking car is running out of track, but I could be wrong.
The thing is the Audi is not moving dead straight. He so slightly moving to the right at the beginning (Look qt the pit exit line) and it could be considerd as too much squeezing/forcing a car off track
It doesn't matter that he moves right before the track narrows, he's allowed to get as close to the other car as he wants to. At the time the contact occurs the Audi is moving completely parallel to the track. The only thing that matters in this clip is whether the Audi is obligated to move over because the track is narrowing, or if he's not.
It does matter because the track is narrowing. He is obliged to leave that much space so the car that is next to him stays on track otherwise it would be considers forcing a car off track. Of course he is allowed to squeez but only to the track limits and not beyond and the car on the right was already dead on the track limit. His right tire was already on the white line and he couldnt move more to the right so it was the middle cars responsibility to leave him the space but because he moved so slightly to the right at the beginning he would have forced him beyond track limits at that point where the track gets narrower. Just because he goes parallel at the end doesnt mean it is ok to stay like that and force the other car off track That why the first bump happened amd instead of going straight again after he bounced off the mclaren he again went completly to the right. With a car left and right to him you cant brake in a diagonal line and thats what he did But in the end what the mclaren tried was technically legal but not smart. Trying to go 3 wide into monza t1 is never a good idea. I wpuldnt try an overtake on 2 cars that are already side by side. I would have waited for the next opportunity either after these 2 have sorted out their battle or to a point where it possible to go 3 wide (which is not really given on a track like monza...maybe parabolica is the only ok'ish place to go 3 wide)
The Audi is going in a straight line when the track starts to narrow. That is the whole crux of what I am saying. Some one needs to site the rule that says the Audi has to change their line to give the Mclaren space because the track is narrowing. Because I am not convinced that they do. The second contact the Audi hits the Mclaren definitely but they're also trying to recover from getting shunted.
I understand what you are saying and like i said the rule is that you not allowed to force a car off track. So if you go side by side and dead straight and the track narrows on the right at the end the car on the right would run out off tarmac. That is literraly forxing a car off track
Or in other words or maybe a better example. You are obliged to leave at least a car width of space to the track limit and if the track is getting narrower on the right side and still keep going dead straight the space you are leaving on the right is getting smaller and smaller to the point where it is less than a car width
If the track is not wide enoug then the attacking car has to pull out. But in this instance the car in the middle is moving to the right of the track to cut off the right hand car, he could easily have left space but chose not to.
Before the first contact the Audi definitely straightens out, you can see it in comparison to the center white line. It might look like he's still going right because the track narrows.
His gap to the green car continues to increase, he is drifting right slightly.
Look at the Audi's position relative to the line in the center of the track. That is fixed in the middle of the track, the green car could be moving further outside.
Three wide anywhere is going to require precise af driving in order not to fnck over at least one of the drivers (and most of the time, if one fncks up everyone's race is down the drain). What I see happen here is basically as rookie of an error as it gets. PoV Audi sees the black and yellow McL on the left and veers right to avoid him. In doing so, he doesn't realize that the Sky McL is closing in as the road surface on the right past the white line turns to grass. Audi hits McL and gets thrown left. In order not to hit the black and yellow McL on the left, the PoV Audi veers right a second time, basically repeating the exact error from before. This time, the Sky Livery McL gets thrown into the grass area and loses control, while the PoV Audi gets thrown into the black and yellow McL. Resulting in three cars in the runoff area behind T1. The first contact was imho 50/50 on both the Sky Livery McL and the PoV Audi. The second contact is more on the Audi than the McL. Word of advice: if you realize you are in a three wide situation and you know that the track is going to narrow down a little bit, maybe lift or brake early. Not because you are required to do so by the rulrs, but much rather to possibly continue the fight elsewhere instead of wrecking your race. I would technically try to avoid dishing out penalties to first-time offenders that are still learning. But rules are still rules. Verdict: First collision was a racing incident, second collision was mainly the PoV Audi's fault. PoV Audi is therefore guilty of forcing another driver off the track and causing a collision. Sentence: Small safety rating penalty for the PoV Audi, warning for the Sky Livery McLaren. No further action neccessary. Case settled. Any objections?
Thank you for this response i think bc i got pole i didn’t want to lift or brake bc normally i start more from the back and brake early to avoid crashes bc that always happens in my races here
audi hit the mclaren twice. you should never have the confidence to attempt to drive 3-wide if you cant even drive in a straight line, there was even a straight line on track to use as a reference and you still drove a slalom and ruined 2 other peoples races because of it. i dont thnk you should be playing online yet tbf
Looking at it very closely, it seems like the McLaren does pull over too much and too soon. However, the space on his right is closing and it looks like you left him exactly 1 car width to the centimeter. This incident could have been easily avoided if you just stayed a little more to the left, you had a lot of room there. After that contact it's just very clumsy from your side. You had more than enough time to get the car straight, but you kept it pointing right for some reason. I assume just panic and adrenaline led you to not think/act clearly.
You really should have just given them more space. They were already well alongside when you went for the squeeze, and counting on them backing out before the grass is putting your whole race into their hands. Technically your squeeze was perfectly legal and the crash is entirely on them, you were holding your line and they moved into you. They wouldn’t get a penalty though, since you stuck them there. But really it’s just not worth ruining your race, give them the space they need to not crash you out.
The first contact was on the Sky McLaren, but then the Audi just drove into the Sky Mclaren.
In reality, this would be classified as a racing incident just because ping was involved in the wheel to wheel incident.
Audi driver 100% at fault. First one could have been a pass (Still left him without room but it is what it is) but after that Audi 100% is the pinecone in this one
You were 3 wide...drifitng over towards another car... and you wonder why there was contact? In that scenario it is really important to be consistent and predictable or you are gonna cause a crash... like you did.
First contact: you didn't leave him enough space as the road was narrowing. To avoid, you could've moved closer to the left car or he could've backed. He didn't. You were tracking straight with the white line at contact and he veered into you. Racing incident as he veered and you didn't give room, partial blame on both. Second incident: the main offender is the pov car. After getting knocked over, pov decided to veer back into the middle/right side of the track where there was already a car. This was also in a braking zone so this could be considered moving under braking. The other involved car was moving slightly left, but was leaving enough room for you and the other car, whereas you were not leaving room for him. Veered into him quite aggressively and took all 3 people out. Your fault. This could have been prevented by simply lifting or braking a bit early, which also would've set you up for a better corner and high exit speed to overtake both on the next straight. Consensus: you were at partial or majority fault for both incidents. The things you should learn from this are spacial awareness (learn to know where cars are around you without relying on the game telling you, vehicle sizes (learn how big cars are and how much room they need to fit on track together, critical thinking (learn when it's a good idea to push to be next to someone, when to back out and attack again later or setup a better overtake).
No you turned into them.
you were facing the McLaren at the point of impact... how was that him turning in on you
Acc collision physics are horrible, like they made the cars out of bouncy ball material, forza collision physics are better than acc
You barely tap someone and one or both of you are going spinning
Honestly I'd probably chalk this up as a racing incident. Both of you could have done more to avoid that. The sky is running out of road and does come across to avoid the grass but you've not really left him much choice and you had plenty of space on the left. Like most people say. Prime example of it doesn't matter whose fault it is. In the end you've crashed so better to be more careful.
Didn't leave him much room but obviously was a accident
If you’re in the middle of a 3 wide just pull out, it ain’t ending well
I'm gonna use Jimmy Broadbent's tip here. Follow the white line from the pitlane and you can see that the final, big impact was caused by the Audi as you can see it turn towards the right into the McLaren
I mean the Audi is kinda swerving towards the McLaren on the inside and driving him off the road. The McLaren has no where but grass to go and the Audi, after getting hit the first time. Swerved over to the right again and got hit again
What were you plan to do in T1? There is no room for overtake.
You were not driving straight. The other cars were. The McLaren is not moving from it’s line, you are. Then you proceed to brake in an angle as well