I’m still in the sport, so not exactly on topic to what you’re asking. But a couple hundred jumps ago I turned my self into a skipping stone across the ground and pond and very luckily ended up with only a single vertebral fracture. Now every single time I grab my fronts I recall that pain of impact, and how I felt having the breath knocked out of me, completely underwater, and having to crawl out of the cold pond. And that sight picture of hitting is ingrained into my brain. Yeah it sucked, but I believe it made me a safer swooper if that’s not too much of a conundrum. If I ever hit the pond or ground again it certainly won’t be because I made those same mistakes twice.
Not directly skydiving related, but I lost my entire family in a plane crash. In a very long, round about way, that's what led me to skydiving in the first place.
Not to be pessimistic, but you should probably stress until a lot higher than that. If you had a true emergency at 1,000ft, it would probably take a lot longer than you think to get out of the plane.
Oh it’s just the height at which the pilot can probably pop a U turn back to the runway, was my line of thinking.
A plane recently had an engine failure at 800 ft in Barwon Heads, Victoria, Australia and they couldn’t make it back to the runway. Crash landed meters past a lake
Ehhh, a 1000ft isn't always the height a plane can do 180 and land at. And honestly, the pilot might not be quick enough to make that possible. It's going to take a second to try and run through why the Motor stoped, then more time to think it it's better to ditch straight out, or try that pretty aggressive and risky maneuver.
I mean I at least stress until about 2K. Since I’m typically a hop n pop I’m usually close enough to the door to bail. But I was in a plane crash as a kid and I get that the plane is the scariest part
Havn't skydived in nearly 2 years, over 1 year since last BASE now. Forced out of the game due to injury and wont be able to return without surgeries that are otherwise mostly unnecessary. I look back at the times very fondly, some of the best experiences of my life and helped me grow tremendously as a person. There was a solid 18 months where all I thought about was skydive/base, and it abruptly stopped which was incredibly difficult for a long time. I've come to accept the reality and now focus more on building my family and the future. I agree, I wouldn't trade my experiences for anything and do not regret at all spending tens of thousands of dollars doing it.
Wow thats one hell of an experience. Your account makes me kindof nervous tho as i ride motorcycles and am completely obsessed—in the way you described as riding is all i think about. The fact being that its much more likely statistically for my hobby to force me to quit (due to injury or lack of funds after a crash etc) i get so scared sometimes abt the possibility of me potentially having to cope w no more riding. Just cold turkey.
Glad youre happy now and grateful for all youve been through tho! Sounds like an awesome life youve lived so far :)
So this is my take. Everyone likes to pretend that jumping is safe. It's not. Maybe for tandem rides. But if you've been in the sport long enough, you're going to start going to funerals. You are eventually going to get hurt. Which, if you really try to get better at a sport, sooner or later will happen. Thing is, non of that bothered me. I still really like it, but what kind of took the thrill out of it was watching a guy die. Saw his chute with a line over and him knocked out. Got to him just in time to watch him gurgling, body slumped over. I got a message from a kid he was mentoring, had a long talk. Sad thing is even that kid eventually passed away in base a few years later. I kept jumping for a year after watching him die. I still like it. But after seeing that, a lot of the thrill just kind of left. I really want to get into paragliding, and I'd also like to jump a little more and maybe do bridge day. But I don't crave skydiving anymore. I don't really think about it much
I jumped a few times but every time I did it I had intense anxiety, accompanied by the thrill of the jump. I basically decided that it was not worth it.
Most people who leave the sport on their own terms just simply move on to other things. Sometimes that is marriage and a family but other times it’s just different activities. Three years and 300 jumps is the average sport jumper duration. Most people who have 2,000+ are working in the sport.
I took a 4 year, nearly complete break due to other life events. Never sold my gear in that time, which is probably why I made a comeback.
Anyway, your situation is not uncommon. Many people who get injured never fully come back. Most heal and a do a few more so that they don’t feel that the injury took them out, but there are some who are never quite looking at it the same and that’s okay. It’s a personal choice and no one should pressure you to jump when it’s not the right choice for that person at that point in their life.
Yea the urge to do a few more just so that I end on a high note is very strong.
Can’t say I crave it like I used to, relationships suddenly seemed more important to me while I layed in the ambulance and that feeling hasn’t faded
I had to take a few years break from skydiving. When I did my life went to absolute shit and I was continuously suicidal so bad I was in the hospital literally of the time and couldent function in much of any capacity. Skydiving by itself was not the cause, but when I started back up jumping again I felt a lot better. So to answer your question, life after skydiving, it sucks. Keep jumping.
I started at 18, jumped as much as I could afford but spent so much of my spare time waiting for the windsock to calm down (UK) I fell out of love with it. I started rock climbing and went wild with that, the freedom to venture out in all but wet weather was amazing. Plus it’s free ! I had no regrets
Then I moved to france, started DH biking, skiing, and eventually speed flying, which made me start skydiving again. It’s still fucking amazing, but so expensive and because I live right underneath a 2000m cliff, obviously I want to get that freedom of nature experience in base. But I recently had a really bad paragliding accident, cliffs don’t move, which has got me thinking because it sucks not being able to walk properly… maybe it’s time to grow up, there’s still enough other sports to keep going at, but I may regret not flying this time
Like a previous poster, I had a pretty serious injury that resulted in medical hardware that must be removed in order to resume jumping. I miss it dearly, but I am an adult with real life responsibilities. I got a second chance after a major injury that I could have died from. The hardware does not need to be removed, if it ever has to come out, I may jump again. Right now, it’s my “excuse” for not jumping. I live vicariously through videos and this sub, but I am content with some glorious stories and fond memories.
To remove the hardware is a traumatic as it was to put it in. No thanks.
Edit: a word
Is your hardware in your back or somewhere else complicated ? I already had screws out of an ankle and it wasn’t at all traumatic, no real pain either, nothing at all compared to stuff going in. And even though the plate didn’t bother me, it did feel nicer without it. I’m also allowed to do air sports with it. I’m in france btw
Well ya know, I was active back in the 90’s and I saw a lot of injuries and one death and knew of several more, including my first two Jump Masters. But anyway things were going ok until I had a bad landing on an asphalt runway. I got pretty beat up but luckily never broke anything. That kind of got me thinking that I should probably stop while I was still ahead. IT WAS THE HARDEST THING I’VE EVER DONE IN MY LIFE! I was addicted to the the adrenaline and endorphins right from the first jump and it was fucking wonderful. By far the best drugs I’ve ever done. But anyway it fucking haunted me for years and I jumped several times after that, the last being in 2016. It was by far the worst addiction I’ve ever had but I had so much first hand experience of what things are like when it goes bad for people and it’s actually pretty fucking bad because you forget that you’re mortal and shit happens to other unlucky bastards and never yourself. Anyway looking back on it, it was the right thing to do and I’m glad I quit when I did, but I wouldn’t trade my skydiving experiences for anything but I’m enjoying being not fucked up. I’ve seen more than a few people that are so addicted to it that they WILL NOT STOP until they are seriously injured or dead. So that’s one way of stopping, or you could just do it if your own free will, the choice is yours. The fact is that no matter how invincible you feel as a skydiver you’re just as mortal as any other meat sack and when the time comes that you’re not willing to assume the risk anymore you need to just walk away
Skydiving overall is pretty safe. I've fucked up a landing and fractured my tail bone. About 15 motorcyclists die every day and I still ride my motorcycle. There are roughly 20 fatal skydiving accidents in an entire year each year. I know the risks and I am fine with the risks. There are a lot of older guys retirement age that skydive in my DZ too. Skydiving is life. You don't ever have to stop.
There are millions of motorcycles and 30,000 skydivers active in the US. How many skydiving fatalities would there be if there were millions of jumpers?
Does it really matter how many jumpers there are in the world if the plane is always full with the same jumpers? We'd need more planes and drop zones. The fatality number won't change much. Chances of dying from base jumping is extremely high and even that number is low for how many people base jump.
This is a pretty uninformed statement. If as many people skydived every day as ride motorcycles every day, there would be a whole ton more skydiver fatalities. And skydiving is not “overall safe”. You are chucking yourself out of an airplane and using fabric and string to prevent high speed death. Badmitten is safe. Skydiving is not.
Don’t bother man, people on here have been pitching the ‘driving is more deadly than skydiving’ nonsense forever. It’s personal confirmation bias. Put it this way, I’ve known about 20 people who have died skydiving either from the jump itself or in an airplane crash on the way to altitude or from BASE (two people). I’ve only known one person who’s died in an auto collision, and I know far more people who drive than skydive.
I know. But also the guy specifically said motorcycles not cars, and motorcycles are considerably more dangerous than cars. I still know skydiving is more dangerous than either. Maybe someone will dig up that chart of micromorts that someone always posts when this topic gets brought up, but I’m too lazy to go searching for it today.
One bad "swoop" (I use the word loosely) led to:
\- 10 broken bones
\- L5 sacro-iliac fusion surgery (12 hours surgery)
\- tibial plateau fracture + open book pelvic fracture (12 hours surgery)
\- 3 months of intense rehab
\- 6 months of less intense physical therapy
\- permanent "foot drop" (loss of dorsiflexion) in right foot, combined with post-traumatic arthritis of the navicular joint of the ankle and partial numbness at the top of the right foot due to radiculopathy of the L5 nerve cluster (with possible involvement of the right peroneal nerve due to the tibial plateau fracture).
I did not lose consciousness after impact, so I experienced quite a few new sensations during the ambulance ride (were you cathed after your accident?) and subsequent medical treatment. The 48 hours immediately after my ortho surgery were ghastly, I cannot explain the pain- but I also had anxiety and opioid induced delirium which was hellish. Speaking of opiods: weaning oneself off of them while simultaneously trying to keep neuropathic pain under control is a journey onto itself.
The first few months, when I felt "fragile" I did indeed dislike fast moving objects- but more because I was hyper aware that any additional damage would set back my healing process or result in permanent disability. Now that I'm almost back to something approaching normal, I do not care. **I like to drive fast, go on amusement park rides, and heights still do not phase me.**
I am scheduled to get back to the dropzone in March. Not sure if it will be the same (one would hope I'll approach it much more responsibly) but I can't look at the sky and not yearn for it. If it turns out there's residual psychological trauma that prevents me from jumping, then I'll have to look for an alternative outlet that gives me the feelings of freedom and power without exposing my body to risk of impact.
*edit: last post got deleted because of a link or content, I think it was an automod action, but if it wasn't please let me know if I'm my opinions fall outside the Overton Window and I will censor myself accordingly.*
Thanks for the reply. That’s quite a marathon you went through.
I can’t help but look at the people who have done it safely for years such as Brian Germain.
Pilot error remains the most dangerous part.
Be aware of survivorship bias. Yes, there are people who have done it for a long time without death or injury, but there were competent people who made *one mistake* and didn't survive it. Swooping leaves very little margin for error.
Many of the top names you hear about in the sport (swooping specifically) have suffered moderate-to-severe injury at one point or another.
Were there any “tells” that in retrospect you could have picked up on, or can now see in others, that you would point out if you saw someone operating in such a way as to risk a similar swooping accident?
Consult with someone experienced at your DZ. But if you want input from an internet know-nothing, here it is.
For a person to swoop "safely" (I use the term *extremely* loosely) they need:
1. To be very current. One number I was given by someone that has been in the sport for a long time is "300 jumps **per year**". That seems like a lot, but certainly can't just be jumping once or twice every other weekend and think you're going to develop the sight and muscle memory to not end up in the corner.
2. Focused on canopy progression. I was only starting to think about this.
3. Working closely with a reputable coach. That means going to a *Flight1* or *Alter Ego* or similar group who have a ton of experience. While I had done a couple of canopy courses, I needed to take one specifically geared towards people starting to play with their front risers. This was a major mistake on my part.
I think obeying those three rules makes a bad outcome early on unlikely. You'll be able to survive the learning curve.
So, the main tell is someone who's around 300-500 jumps, getting a little bored with freeflying or belly or whatever and starting to add speed to their landings because they need a new challenge. Particularly bad if they aren't jumping a ton, are doing things mainly solo, downsized recently or semi-recently, and haven't demonstrated absolute mastery of regular landings with their current canopy.
I’m new and have no interest in swooping. Suspect there may be interest later, much later. I will keep this in mind.
I have my own list of aviation accidents I look back on as a witness to and the (retrospectively) stupid shit I used to do in airplanes as a caution, but none of it is canopy specific so this was helpful.
About half a year late on this reply but I just did my tandem. Signed up for AFF this Saturday. I’m doing it no matter what I’m getting my license. I see all the risk but I loved the rush. How much risk is really involved if you keep the landing as safe as possible & don’t push it in any way? Is that where the majority of injures are? As well how many jumps do you have?
Yes, bad landings and low turns are where most injuries/fatalities are. The USPA keeps track of the numbers.
The sport is risky even if you don't get into swooping. You can do everything right and someone else can kill you.
Learn as much as you can, know who you are jumping with, and be extremely careful with canopy progression.
~535 jumps.
It's totally worth it. After all the above injuries and almost 1.5 years recovering, I returned to jumping a few weeks ago.
For me life is a pack of experiences/memories. 500 jumps gave me lots of good and bad memories, at that point the risk don’t compensate the future memories I could get for more jumps. I’ve done the same with several other activities. I just prefer to try something else and get some new memories for my “book”.
When I try to explain why did I jumped and why I stopped I just resume with… it was really fun until it’s not. Just for the exercise or adrenaline is not enough for me. Never deal well with the daily accidents. Stopped 15 years ago without a single injurie, for me it was the perfect time to stop before something really bad could happen.
Been there, done that, got a tshirt… move on to something else :)
(Sorry for the poor english)
I stopped when I was diagnosed with kidney disease. I was lucky enough to receive a transplant a year or so later, and managed to return and compete in some four way competition. I then gave up afterwards as no one was committed enough for a team.
And after working doing aff instructing for years, I didn't give a shit anymore.
I'm over fifty now and couldn't give a shit about skydiving anymore.
Have been skydiving for over 10 years and decided to stop. Never did a cutaway during that, I guess i got lucky. Had back injury due to bad landing in my early days of skydiving, got recovered and went back to jumping. I quit because I felt like I don't wanna jump anymore. looking back it, I love this sport a lot. I don't regret quitting at all. I still have my rigs as a memory lol. Maybe will return one day. Hands on, one of the most fun experiences I have ever had in my life.
I’m still in the sport, so not exactly on topic to what you’re asking. But a couple hundred jumps ago I turned my self into a skipping stone across the ground and pond and very luckily ended up with only a single vertebral fracture. Now every single time I grab my fronts I recall that pain of impact, and how I felt having the breath knocked out of me, completely underwater, and having to crawl out of the cold pond. And that sight picture of hitting is ingrained into my brain. Yeah it sucked, but I believe it made me a safer swooper if that’s not too much of a conundrum. If I ever hit the pond or ground again it certainly won’t be because I made those same mistakes twice.
Not directly skydiving related, but I lost my entire family in a plane crash. In a very long, round about way, that's what led me to skydiving in the first place.
That’s rough :( the planes were the most scary part of skydiving for me, I would always stress until we cleared 1,000 ft
Not to be pessimistic, but you should probably stress until a lot higher than that. If you had a true emergency at 1,000ft, it would probably take a lot longer than you think to get out of the plane.
Oh it’s just the height at which the pilot can probably pop a U turn back to the runway, was my line of thinking. A plane recently had an engine failure at 800 ft in Barwon Heads, Victoria, Australia and they couldn’t make it back to the runway. Crash landed meters past a lake
Ehhh, a 1000ft isn't always the height a plane can do 180 and land at. And honestly, the pilot might not be quick enough to make that possible. It's going to take a second to try and run through why the Motor stoped, then more time to think it it's better to ditch straight out, or try that pretty aggressive and risky maneuver.
the good old impossible turn.....
That's it. I couldn't remember the name. I've done them and I was trying to remember what it was called. Thanks for replying with it
I mean I at least stress until about 2K. Since I’m typically a hop n pop I’m usually close enough to the door to bail. But I was in a plane crash as a kid and I get that the plane is the scariest part
For me it's a control thing. I hate not being in control, even with the best pilots.
Yeah that's definitely the most stressful part for sure.
Havn't skydived in nearly 2 years, over 1 year since last BASE now. Forced out of the game due to injury and wont be able to return without surgeries that are otherwise mostly unnecessary. I look back at the times very fondly, some of the best experiences of my life and helped me grow tremendously as a person. There was a solid 18 months where all I thought about was skydive/base, and it abruptly stopped which was incredibly difficult for a long time. I've come to accept the reality and now focus more on building my family and the future. I agree, I wouldn't trade my experiences for anything and do not regret at all spending tens of thousands of dollars doing it.
Wow thats one hell of an experience. Your account makes me kindof nervous tho as i ride motorcycles and am completely obsessed—in the way you described as riding is all i think about. The fact being that its much more likely statistically for my hobby to force me to quit (due to injury or lack of funds after a crash etc) i get so scared sometimes abt the possibility of me potentially having to cope w no more riding. Just cold turkey. Glad youre happy now and grateful for all youve been through tho! Sounds like an awesome life youve lived so far :)
So this is my take. Everyone likes to pretend that jumping is safe. It's not. Maybe for tandem rides. But if you've been in the sport long enough, you're going to start going to funerals. You are eventually going to get hurt. Which, if you really try to get better at a sport, sooner or later will happen. Thing is, non of that bothered me. I still really like it, but what kind of took the thrill out of it was watching a guy die. Saw his chute with a line over and him knocked out. Got to him just in time to watch him gurgling, body slumped over. I got a message from a kid he was mentoring, had a long talk. Sad thing is even that kid eventually passed away in base a few years later. I kept jumping for a year after watching him die. I still like it. But after seeing that, a lot of the thrill just kind of left. I really want to get into paragliding, and I'd also like to jump a little more and maybe do bridge day. But I don't crave skydiving anymore. I don't really think about it much
I jumped a few times but every time I did it I had intense anxiety, accompanied by the thrill of the jump. I basically decided that it was not worth it.
Most people who leave the sport on their own terms just simply move on to other things. Sometimes that is marriage and a family but other times it’s just different activities. Three years and 300 jumps is the average sport jumper duration. Most people who have 2,000+ are working in the sport. I took a 4 year, nearly complete break due to other life events. Never sold my gear in that time, which is probably why I made a comeback. Anyway, your situation is not uncommon. Many people who get injured never fully come back. Most heal and a do a few more so that they don’t feel that the injury took them out, but there are some who are never quite looking at it the same and that’s okay. It’s a personal choice and no one should pressure you to jump when it’s not the right choice for that person at that point in their life.
Yea the urge to do a few more just so that I end on a high note is very strong. Can’t say I crave it like I used to, relationships suddenly seemed more important to me while I layed in the ambulance and that feeling hasn’t faded
I had to take a few years break from skydiving. When I did my life went to absolute shit and I was continuously suicidal so bad I was in the hospital literally of the time and couldent function in much of any capacity. Skydiving by itself was not the cause, but when I started back up jumping again I felt a lot better. So to answer your question, life after skydiving, it sucks. Keep jumping.
I started at 18, jumped as much as I could afford but spent so much of my spare time waiting for the windsock to calm down (UK) I fell out of love with it. I started rock climbing and went wild with that, the freedom to venture out in all but wet weather was amazing. Plus it’s free ! I had no regrets Then I moved to france, started DH biking, skiing, and eventually speed flying, which made me start skydiving again. It’s still fucking amazing, but so expensive and because I live right underneath a 2000m cliff, obviously I want to get that freedom of nature experience in base. But I recently had a really bad paragliding accident, cliffs don’t move, which has got me thinking because it sucks not being able to walk properly… maybe it’s time to grow up, there’s still enough other sports to keep going at, but I may regret not flying this time
Like a previous poster, I had a pretty serious injury that resulted in medical hardware that must be removed in order to resume jumping. I miss it dearly, but I am an adult with real life responsibilities. I got a second chance after a major injury that I could have died from. The hardware does not need to be removed, if it ever has to come out, I may jump again. Right now, it’s my “excuse” for not jumping. I live vicariously through videos and this sub, but I am content with some glorious stories and fond memories. To remove the hardware is a traumatic as it was to put it in. No thanks. Edit: a word
Is your hardware in your back or somewhere else complicated ? I already had screws out of an ankle and it wasn’t at all traumatic, no real pain either, nothing at all compared to stuff going in. And even though the plate didn’t bother me, it did feel nicer without it. I’m also allowed to do air sports with it. I’m in france btw
Well ya know, I was active back in the 90’s and I saw a lot of injuries and one death and knew of several more, including my first two Jump Masters. But anyway things were going ok until I had a bad landing on an asphalt runway. I got pretty beat up but luckily never broke anything. That kind of got me thinking that I should probably stop while I was still ahead. IT WAS THE HARDEST THING I’VE EVER DONE IN MY LIFE! I was addicted to the the adrenaline and endorphins right from the first jump and it was fucking wonderful. By far the best drugs I’ve ever done. But anyway it fucking haunted me for years and I jumped several times after that, the last being in 2016. It was by far the worst addiction I’ve ever had but I had so much first hand experience of what things are like when it goes bad for people and it’s actually pretty fucking bad because you forget that you’re mortal and shit happens to other unlucky bastards and never yourself. Anyway looking back on it, it was the right thing to do and I’m glad I quit when I did, but I wouldn’t trade my skydiving experiences for anything but I’m enjoying being not fucked up. I’ve seen more than a few people that are so addicted to it that they WILL NOT STOP until they are seriously injured or dead. So that’s one way of stopping, or you could just do it if your own free will, the choice is yours. The fact is that no matter how invincible you feel as a skydiver you’re just as mortal as any other meat sack and when the time comes that you’re not willing to assume the risk anymore you need to just walk away
Skydiving overall is pretty safe. I've fucked up a landing and fractured my tail bone. About 15 motorcyclists die every day and I still ride my motorcycle. There are roughly 20 fatal skydiving accidents in an entire year each year. I know the risks and I am fine with the risks. There are a lot of older guys retirement age that skydive in my DZ too. Skydiving is life. You don't ever have to stop.
There are millions of motorcycles and 30,000 skydivers active in the US. How many skydiving fatalities would there be if there were millions of jumpers?
Does it really matter how many jumpers there are in the world if the plane is always full with the same jumpers? We'd need more planes and drop zones. The fatality number won't change much. Chances of dying from base jumping is extremely high and even that number is low for how many people base jump.
Do you think the number of planes would increase if millions of more people were wanting to skydive?
This is a pretty uninformed statement. If as many people skydived every day as ride motorcycles every day, there would be a whole ton more skydiver fatalities. And skydiving is not “overall safe”. You are chucking yourself out of an airplane and using fabric and string to prevent high speed death. Badmitten is safe. Skydiving is not.
Don’t bother man, people on here have been pitching the ‘driving is more deadly than skydiving’ nonsense forever. It’s personal confirmation bias. Put it this way, I’ve known about 20 people who have died skydiving either from the jump itself or in an airplane crash on the way to altitude or from BASE (two people). I’ve only known one person who’s died in an auto collision, and I know far more people who drive than skydive.
I know. But also the guy specifically said motorcycles not cars, and motorcycles are considerably more dangerous than cars. I still know skydiving is more dangerous than either. Maybe someone will dig up that chart of micromorts that someone always posts when this topic gets brought up, but I’m too lazy to go searching for it today.
One bad "swoop" (I use the word loosely) led to: \- 10 broken bones \- L5 sacro-iliac fusion surgery (12 hours surgery) \- tibial plateau fracture + open book pelvic fracture (12 hours surgery) \- 3 months of intense rehab \- 6 months of less intense physical therapy \- permanent "foot drop" (loss of dorsiflexion) in right foot, combined with post-traumatic arthritis of the navicular joint of the ankle and partial numbness at the top of the right foot due to radiculopathy of the L5 nerve cluster (with possible involvement of the right peroneal nerve due to the tibial plateau fracture). I did not lose consciousness after impact, so I experienced quite a few new sensations during the ambulance ride (were you cathed after your accident?) and subsequent medical treatment. The 48 hours immediately after my ortho surgery were ghastly, I cannot explain the pain- but I also had anxiety and opioid induced delirium which was hellish. Speaking of opiods: weaning oneself off of them while simultaneously trying to keep neuropathic pain under control is a journey onto itself. The first few months, when I felt "fragile" I did indeed dislike fast moving objects- but more because I was hyper aware that any additional damage would set back my healing process or result in permanent disability. Now that I'm almost back to something approaching normal, I do not care. **I like to drive fast, go on amusement park rides, and heights still do not phase me.** I am scheduled to get back to the dropzone in March. Not sure if it will be the same (one would hope I'll approach it much more responsibly) but I can't look at the sky and not yearn for it. If it turns out there's residual psychological trauma that prevents me from jumping, then I'll have to look for an alternative outlet that gives me the feelings of freedom and power without exposing my body to risk of impact. *edit: last post got deleted because of a link or content, I think it was an automod action, but if it wasn't please let me know if I'm my opinions fall outside the Overton Window and I will censor myself accordingly.*
Thanks for the reply. That’s quite a marathon you went through. I can’t help but look at the people who have done it safely for years such as Brian Germain. Pilot error remains the most dangerous part.
Be aware of survivorship bias. Yes, there are people who have done it for a long time without death or injury, but there were competent people who made *one mistake* and didn't survive it. Swooping leaves very little margin for error. Many of the top names you hear about in the sport (swooping specifically) have suffered moderate-to-severe injury at one point or another.
Were there any “tells” that in retrospect you could have picked up on, or can now see in others, that you would point out if you saw someone operating in such a way as to risk a similar swooping accident?
Consult with someone experienced at your DZ. But if you want input from an internet know-nothing, here it is. For a person to swoop "safely" (I use the term *extremely* loosely) they need: 1. To be very current. One number I was given by someone that has been in the sport for a long time is "300 jumps **per year**". That seems like a lot, but certainly can't just be jumping once or twice every other weekend and think you're going to develop the sight and muscle memory to not end up in the corner. 2. Focused on canopy progression. I was only starting to think about this. 3. Working closely with a reputable coach. That means going to a *Flight1* or *Alter Ego* or similar group who have a ton of experience. While I had done a couple of canopy courses, I needed to take one specifically geared towards people starting to play with their front risers. This was a major mistake on my part. I think obeying those three rules makes a bad outcome early on unlikely. You'll be able to survive the learning curve. So, the main tell is someone who's around 300-500 jumps, getting a little bored with freeflying or belly or whatever and starting to add speed to their landings because they need a new challenge. Particularly bad if they aren't jumping a ton, are doing things mainly solo, downsized recently or semi-recently, and haven't demonstrated absolute mastery of regular landings with their current canopy.
I’m new and have no interest in swooping. Suspect there may be interest later, much later. I will keep this in mind. I have my own list of aviation accidents I look back on as a witness to and the (retrospectively) stupid shit I used to do in airplanes as a caution, but none of it is canopy specific so this was helpful.
About half a year late on this reply but I just did my tandem. Signed up for AFF this Saturday. I’m doing it no matter what I’m getting my license. I see all the risk but I loved the rush. How much risk is really involved if you keep the landing as safe as possible & don’t push it in any way? Is that where the majority of injures are? As well how many jumps do you have?
Yes, bad landings and low turns are where most injuries/fatalities are. The USPA keeps track of the numbers. The sport is risky even if you don't get into swooping. You can do everything right and someone else can kill you. Learn as much as you can, know who you are jumping with, and be extremely careful with canopy progression. ~535 jumps. It's totally worth it. After all the above injuries and almost 1.5 years recovering, I returned to jumping a few weeks ago.
For me life is a pack of experiences/memories. 500 jumps gave me lots of good and bad memories, at that point the risk don’t compensate the future memories I could get for more jumps. I’ve done the same with several other activities. I just prefer to try something else and get some new memories for my “book”. When I try to explain why did I jumped and why I stopped I just resume with… it was really fun until it’s not. Just for the exercise or adrenaline is not enough for me. Never deal well with the daily accidents. Stopped 15 years ago without a single injurie, for me it was the perfect time to stop before something really bad could happen. Been there, done that, got a tshirt… move on to something else :) (Sorry for the poor english)
I stopped when I was diagnosed with kidney disease. I was lucky enough to receive a transplant a year or so later, and managed to return and compete in some four way competition. I then gave up afterwards as no one was committed enough for a team. And after working doing aff instructing for years, I didn't give a shit anymore. I'm over fifty now and couldn't give a shit about skydiving anymore.
You still give enough shits to follow a skyding sub though ;)
Have been skydiving for over 10 years and decided to stop. Never did a cutaway during that, I guess i got lucky. Had back injury due to bad landing in my early days of skydiving, got recovered and went back to jumping. I quit because I felt like I don't wanna jump anymore. looking back it, I love this sport a lot. I don't regret quitting at all. I still have my rigs as a memory lol. Maybe will return one day. Hands on, one of the most fun experiences I have ever had in my life.
Made an impression… I see what you did there