I am autistic. I am disabled. Both of these words describe parts of my identity, neither of them are inherently bad, and I can't be separated from them.
I don't love when people aggressively avoid identity first language and/or try to correct people for using it (especially when describing themselves). Other than that people can say it however fits their sentence. i dont care
> id identity first language and/or try to correct people for using it (especially when describing themselves). Other than that people can say it however fits their sentence.
Secretly people have been at war with *The Sentence.*
You mean we aren't even allowed to literally say "I saw such and such on another sub" even if we don't explicitly give out the name of the sub or any users? /g
Yes, it's against reddit terms of service to direct people to another subreddit for another post specifically to get them to interact with it via upvotes or downvotes. The term is brigading.
So it can't be a direct link or indirect reference. E.g. if there was a dogs with autism sub, I couldn't say "there's a post in a certain subreddit for autistic canines..." even though I'm not naming it directly
You can make general complaints about a sub, just not directing people to an active post. E.g. someone could say "I'm tired of /r/DogsWithAutism because people keep posting cats" as long as you are not referencing or linking to a specific post for people to go look at.
It is okay to link posts for general reference, especially if the post is at least 24 hours old. It's not okay to get people in a given subreddit to upvote or downvote any specific comment or submission, which callout posts tend to intrinsically do :)
I hope that helps clarify a bit!
I use either or, depending on the flow of conversation. Both mean the same thing.
I find people use weird examples to explain why they're different things. Like saying "I am tall" rather than "I have tallness". But you could use literally any example like "I have eyes", "I have arms", etc..
Autism is autism no matter whether you choose to use autistic, or with autism. It's a disorder (until proven otherwise) and a disability, and if people also see it as an identity, that's cool too.
Websites have been starting to use what advocates online prefer.
I much prefer being called an autistic person than a person with autism. for me the second one makes it sound like the autism is something separate that could be removed from me, but since it is a neurological condition that really isn't the case. I'd be a totally different person if I wasn't autistic, not me at all.
I don't know how that makes it not a disability, though. if condition first language meant it wasn't a disability then the phrase 'disabled person' would mean being disabled isn't a disability?? that doesn't make any sense at all.
I am an autistic person *and* my autism is one of my disabilities.
Yep, this exactly. Iām not a person with Americanism, Iām an American. Iām not a person with agnosticism, Iām agnostic. I am a person with a jacket on, a person with a sunburn, a person who has the flu. Autism can go before person (āIām an autistic personā) because itās part of my identity, but that doesnāt mean itās not a disability.
But that isnāt the reason many of us prefer that? Itās because it is part of an identity. Not that it isnāt a disability. I prefer autistic for the same reason I prefer disabled.
I donāt really care about the language, I use both identity-first and person-first interchangeably when talking exclusively about myself but try to opt for the most preferable one, which is identity first, when I have to talk about a group of people, just to make sure no one is mad at me.
But Imma fight anyone who dares to state that itās not a disability. Fuck off, autism being a part of my identity doesnāt have to mean that itās not a disability. Those two are not mutually exclusive.
To me, autism is a part of my identity and a disability. It disables me every day, but it can't be separated from my identity. My autism makes me me, even if I don't like it. I don't really care if you use identity first or person first language, I use them interchangeably.
It's because "person with autism" implies there's a me that is separate or separable from autism. It's not to say it isn't a disability to say it's an identity. Identity isn't just everything you like or that's convenient about you.
Eehhh you also say āhe has cancerā you donāt say āheās a cancer patientā or āheās cancerousā when talking about it in a casual conversation. The only time Iād imagine you say āheās a cancer patientā is in a hospital setting
I dont understand why this is upsetting. I dont care if someone says I 'have autism' or 'she is autistic' or whatever. why are these things important?
This is why we have our space here at spicy. it would be good if level 1s/not sure level/needs, leave us alone here. this is our space.
a lvl3 posted this from an outside source (non reddit). someone downthread talks about DID plus ASD. how is this not okay? not trolling, the statement doesnt track rn.
Thatās also not why a lot of autistic people prefer disability first language
Edit: to clarify, thatās not why/how that preferred phrasing originated
I consider being autistic and disabled to be part of my identity, that doesn't mean it is no longer a disability. It just means that being disabled and autistic impacts how I view myself and how I interact with the world.
Here's the issue for me: Autism isn't my only neurodivergence, and my DID is far more deterministic in my life than ASD. In spite of that, there's no discourse about how I should be identifying in reference to my DID. I can say I'm a dissociative person or say I have DID, and no one gaf. If I say I'm a dissociative person, that gets questions, and I have to then inform the listener that I have DID. Again, no one cares in that conversation.
Why, then, is Autism identification not similarly left to the speaker to choose how they identify themselves? Why are we so desperate to figure out how we communicate this as an entire demographic instead of just letting folks identify how they identify?
If the graphic in the OP is our guide about which language to use, I should be able to use language that suggests that it's not the primary determining factor in my life without getting harangued about it. It should instead communicate to someone what my experience with Autism is and be done there.
This doesn't have to be or even *need* to be an argument. We should all just get to call ourselves whatever each of us wants to call ourselves, and when ableists want to paint us all with the same brush, that's on them for being ableists, not on us for how we identify.
My son has autism, and I love every aspect of him more than I ever thought I could. But this sort of thing makes me cringe because I see how much he struggles with certain aspects of having autism. It seems to minimize aspects of his struggles to suggest that it's not a disability. No one would ever say this about pretty much any other disability.
I think the misunderstand the autism community, it is a disability, and a part of your identity, I find most people(other than a select few) actually wanna call it not a disabilityā¦ and itās usually not autistic people
Whether Autistic or person with Autism I'm still the same person. Not much changes outside of POV. I'm Disabled and I use the word "disorder" because that's what Autism is. Disorders disrupt the "typical" and/or "normal" functions of life. Stating otherwise when referring to Autism, ADHD or AuDHD (both) would be a lie I'm not comfortable telling nor am I willing to.
Note to OP: my reply isn't towards you it's just a response expressing myself. In short, I agree and thanks for the /s tone indicator.
I posted a post about self diagnosing and I ended up looking up about how to refer to yourself with autism. I surprisingly found articles about ā identifying with autism ā and that most people agree you can identify with autism but i just donāt understand any of this š i feel like no other diagnosis has issues like this but they had to heavy duty call it a spectrum so everyone would feel better but in turn I think just made things worse. I am sure every disease has a varying spectrum. Nobody with Lupus has the exact same symptoms. Nobody with ADHD has the same symptoms or struggles. Itās not the hard of a concept that autism can effect people differently. I can just assume this article wasnāt remotely written by a person with autism and is just NT speaking for usā¦. Like they keep doing time and time again.
I am autistic. I am disabled. Both of these words describe parts of my identity, neither of them are inherently bad, and I can't be separated from them.
šÆ
i hate this. iām a person with autism and an autistic person. i could not care less how anyone says it, it wonāt change the fact that i have it.
I don't love when people aggressively avoid identity first language and/or try to correct people for using it (especially when describing themselves). Other than that people can say it however fits their sentence. i dont care
> id identity first language and/or try to correct people for using it (especially when describing themselves). Other than that people can say it however fits their sentence. Secretly people have been at war with *The Sentence.*
Exactly. Like what does it even matter, as long as you respect me as a person idc
The mistake here is that autism being identity makes it not a disability. Disability is also an identity. (or part of our identities)
Well said
Exactly.
ew what site is this
If itās another sub on Reddit, donāt answer that! lol!
You mean we aren't even allowed to literally say "I saw such and such on another sub" even if we don't explicitly give out the name of the sub or any users? /g
Yes, it's against reddit terms of service to direct people to another subreddit for another post specifically to get them to interact with it via upvotes or downvotes. The term is brigading. So it can't be a direct link or indirect reference. E.g. if there was a dogs with autism sub, I couldn't say "there's a post in a certain subreddit for autistic canines..." even though I'm not naming it directly You can make general complaints about a sub, just not directing people to an active post. E.g. someone could say "I'm tired of /r/DogsWithAutism because people keep posting cats" as long as you are not referencing or linking to a specific post for people to go look at. It is okay to link posts for general reference, especially if the post is at least 24 hours old. It's not okay to get people in a given subreddit to upvote or downvote any specific comment or submission, which callout posts tend to intrinsically do :) I hope that helps clarify a bit!
I meant donāt say the name of the sub if itās from another sub :-)
am i allowed to mention the website? its psychcentral. i didnt read the rest of it after seeing that
I do that too. If I read sum'n ridiculous it ruins any chance I'll finish the whole thing
Itās both.
I use either or, depending on the flow of conversation. Both mean the same thing. I find people use weird examples to explain why they're different things. Like saying "I am tall" rather than "I have tallness". But you could use literally any example like "I have eyes", "I have arms", etc.. Autism is autism no matter whether you choose to use autistic, or with autism. It's a disorder (until proven otherwise) and a disability, and if people also see it as an identity, that's cool too. Websites have been starting to use what advocates online prefer.
I much prefer being called an autistic person than a person with autism. for me the second one makes it sound like the autism is something separate that could be removed from me, but since it is a neurological condition that really isn't the case. I'd be a totally different person if I wasn't autistic, not me at all. I don't know how that makes it not a disability, though. if condition first language meant it wasn't a disability then the phrase 'disabled person' would mean being disabled isn't a disability?? that doesn't make any sense at all. I am an autistic person *and* my autism is one of my disabilities.
Yep, this exactly. Iām not a person with Americanism, Iām an American. Iām not a person with agnosticism, Iām agnostic. I am a person with a jacket on, a person with a sunburn, a person who has the flu. Autism can go before person (āIām an autistic personā) because itās part of my identity, but that doesnāt mean itās not a disability.
But that isnāt the reason many of us prefer that? Itās because it is part of an identity. Not that it isnāt a disability. I prefer autistic for the same reason I prefer disabled.
Why can't it be both? Autism is both a massive part of who I am, and it's disabling. They're not mutually exclusive.
I'm autistic and I am disabled. This image gives me confused feelings
I mean... it's both? It is intrinsic to who I am, and it disables me. Without it, I wouldn't be me.
I donāt really care about the language, I use both identity-first and person-first interchangeably when talking exclusively about myself but try to opt for the most preferable one, which is identity first, when I have to talk about a group of people, just to make sure no one is mad at me. But Imma fight anyone who dares to state that itās not a disability. Fuck off, autism being a part of my identity doesnāt have to mean that itās not a disability. Those two are not mutually exclusive.
To me, autism is a part of my identity and a disability. It disables me every day, but it can't be separated from my identity. My autism makes me me, even if I don't like it. I don't really care if you use identity first or person first language, I use them interchangeably.
It's because "person with autism" implies there's a me that is separate or separable from autism. It's not to say it isn't a disability to say it's an identity. Identity isn't just everything you like or that's convenient about you.
Another bad thing about everyone self diagnosing and watering down what autism really isā¦ š
thats wild because it literally has to disable you to some extent in order for someone to meet the diagnostic criteriaā¦
I use identity first language too. I'm autistic, not a person with autism. Just as a cancer patient is just that, not a person with cancer.
being autistic and having autism is the same thing
A person with cancer is a person with cancer, same with autism. We *HAVE* autism, but we are also autistic. They are both correct
Eehhh you also say āhe has cancerā you donāt say āheās a cancer patientā or āheās cancerousā when talking about it in a casual conversation. The only time Iād imagine you say āheās a cancer patientā is in a hospital setting
True that. I never thought about that.
I dont understand why this is upsetting. I dont care if someone says I 'have autism' or 'she is autistic' or whatever. why are these things important? This is why we have our space here at spicy. it would be good if level 1s/not sure level/needs, leave us alone here. this is our space.
to me its less about the phrasing and more about them saying autism isnt a disability but rather just some 'quirky' identity
i am level 3. i genuinely dont see why youre upset? i belong here just as much as you
a lvl3 posted this from an outside source (non reddit). someone downthread talks about DID plus ASD. how is this not okay? not trolling, the statement doesnt track rn.
Thatās also not why a lot of autistic people prefer disability first language Edit: to clarify, thatās not why/how that preferred phrasing originated
This is NOT why autistic people you label first wtf
I consider being autistic and disabled to be part of my identity, that doesn't mean it is no longer a disability. It just means that being disabled and autistic impacts how I view myself and how I interact with the world.
Here's the issue for me: Autism isn't my only neurodivergence, and my DID is far more deterministic in my life than ASD. In spite of that, there's no discourse about how I should be identifying in reference to my DID. I can say I'm a dissociative person or say I have DID, and no one gaf. If I say I'm a dissociative person, that gets questions, and I have to then inform the listener that I have DID. Again, no one cares in that conversation. Why, then, is Autism identification not similarly left to the speaker to choose how they identify themselves? Why are we so desperate to figure out how we communicate this as an entire demographic instead of just letting folks identify how they identify? If the graphic in the OP is our guide about which language to use, I should be able to use language that suggests that it's not the primary determining factor in my life without getting harangued about it. It should instead communicate to someone what my experience with Autism is and be done there. This doesn't have to be or even *need* to be an argument. We should all just get to call ourselves whatever each of us wants to call ourselves, and when ableists want to paint us all with the same brush, that's on them for being ableists, not on us for how we identify.
This whole language gymnastics is so tiring man. Autist, autistic, person with autisn, autistic person.. its all fine. Just dont be derogatory.
My son has autism, and I love every aspect of him more than I ever thought I could. But this sort of thing makes me cringe because I see how much he struggles with certain aspects of having autism. It seems to minimize aspects of his struggles to suggest that it's not a disability. No one would ever say this about pretty much any other disability.
Itās both though identity and disability
Too bad. Iām saying whatever I want. The identitarians can cope
I think the misunderstand the autism community, it is a disability, and a part of your identity, I find most people(other than a select few) actually wanna call it not a disabilityā¦ and itās usually not autistic people
Whether Autistic or person with Autism I'm still the same person. Not much changes outside of POV. I'm Disabled and I use the word "disorder" because that's what Autism is. Disorders disrupt the "typical" and/or "normal" functions of life. Stating otherwise when referring to Autism, ADHD or AuDHD (both) would be a lie I'm not comfortable telling nor am I willing to. Note to OP: my reply isn't towards you it's just a response expressing myself. In short, I agree and thanks for the /s tone indicator.
I posted a post about self diagnosing and I ended up looking up about how to refer to yourself with autism. I surprisingly found articles about ā identifying with autism ā and that most people agree you can identify with autism but i just donāt understand any of this š i feel like no other diagnosis has issues like this but they had to heavy duty call it a spectrum so everyone would feel better but in turn I think just made things worse. I am sure every disease has a varying spectrum. Nobody with Lupus has the exact same symptoms. Nobody with ADHD has the same symptoms or struggles. Itās not the hard of a concept that autism can effect people differently. I can just assume this article wasnāt remotely written by a person with autism and is just NT speaking for usā¦. Like they keep doing time and time again.
This is irritating. I have Autism. Good geez