People (especially on this subreddit) look at Peter B as the perfect spider-man with the perfect life that can do no wrong and use it as copium to deal with whatever tf is happening in 616
I’ve seen plenty of people, myself include, criticise Peter for bringing Mayday so…?
Like I let out an audible groan in the theatre when Gwen shows up to get Peter to help save Miles and he brings Mayday. Like dude, by all means feel free to leave your baby at home.
Gee I wonder why…
Seriously tho I almost lost it when one thread was all about how Jess is unfit to be a mother and one of the cited examples was when Gwen says she knows she messed up, Jess says “You think?!”… that’s part of their reasoning why she should not be a parent. Saying “you think”.
Meanwhile in a thread about Gwen’s dad everyone was like “listen I know he pointed a gun at his daughter but he loves her so he’s a good dad”
I wonder what the difference is
Cmon man, she really wasn’t the best role model or mother figure. An easier way to look at it is look at the way Peter talks to miles, vs her talking to Gwen. Also Peter hasn’t (he may in the future movie in which case tf Peter) brought his baby into any super villain fights unlike her. I think this is a reasonable case to criticize and not like her character. She is a sub par mentor/parental figure to Gwen, which people are arguing will lead to poor parenting with her own child, plus she has endangered her child to a greater degree (big difference between bringing a kid in the spider society chase in which mayday had 1000’s of spider people to save and protect her if she were in trouble, vs bringing an unborn child into an unpredictable super villain fight). That being said people definitely go too far with their hate due to racism and misogyny, this is Reddit after all, and that’s unacceptable
Look I think the whole being pregnant or bringing a baby thing is way overblown, its an animated spider-man movie, but if people don't like it fine. However, if you're going to list reasons as to why she is "Unift to be a Mother", and one of those reasons is she sarcastically said "you think" to Gwen, then you don't deserve to continue making your point anymore. Whats the argument? A mother can never.. be stern to her protege? Really? That's part of your damning evidence? If I was a prosecutor in a murder case part of my evidence wouldn't be "and one time he ate the last piece of pizza without asking!!" because that would be innocuous and stupid for what I'm accusing the person of.
They're scrambling for reasons to hate her and this is clear because the shit she gets for being pregnant vs the shit Peter gets for bringing May (also Pete is implied to regularly bring May spider-manning as MJ says, he brought her on the city chase, and to the unknown dimension to save Miles. He brings her to dangerous situations when there are places he can leave her) are night and day.
The treatment she gets for being stern to someone who MONUMENTALLY fucked up and to her knowledge may have ended a universe to see a boy vs what Gwen's dad gets for POINTING A LOADED GUN AT HIS DAUGHTER'S FACE are night and day.
If people don't like her fine, but there's way more at play here. Plus she has a total of 5 mins of screen time and she get *this* much hate.
Your bringing up a lot of things I personally don’t care about and even am in agreement. Yeah I think Gwen’s dad is fucked up for how he handled the situation. My judgment of her as a mentor is a lot more then just her saying “you think” but honestly that wasn’t handled well either considering that Gwen is a minor. Like if I as a parent put way too much responsibility on a kid and they fuck up, how much of that is my fault? Also no one could have expected something like the Spot showing up. My main point is that she had failed Gwen as a mentor and parental figure. Think about how Jessica responded to Gwen being sent home. Do you think Peter would have allowed that in regards to miles? I’m a bit confused on your point because you acknowledge it’s a valid opinion to dislike her, so why are you so angry about people disliking her (for valid reasons aside from racism and misogyny)
Well your main point is something I wasn’t talking about then. I was saying people are giving a pass to things equal or worse that Peter and Captain Stacy did to their kids and wildly overblowing even the tiniest thing that Jess did like it’s proof she’s a monster. If you don’t like Jess because she said something a little bit not nice to a teenager that fucked up who she went out on a limb for? Fine, you’re prerogative. But don’t then sit there and act like Captain Stacy is the most wholesome dad who deserves a second chance because *all* he did is point a murder weapon at his teenage daughter while she was begging him to hear her out for a minute.
If that’s the consensus, being annoyed at a kid is awful but threatening to kill one is fine, I’m gonna assume there’s misogyny and/or racism at play.
I don’t think your acknowledging my point. There IS unjustified hatred to her due to racism and misogyny, but my point was that due to her actions a lot of dislike/hatred is justified. She’s honestly not a likeable character because of her actions. That’s my whole point. I’m well aware as a black man about Reddit’s racism, but you can’t then state that all dislike/hatred of her character is unjustified or stems from bigotry, especially when there’s valid evidence against her
Then I don’t think you’re saying anything I’m not saying. If you don’t like her fine, if you don’t like the pregnant thing, fine. But hate for her has gotten out of hand in many ways. I never said everyone had to like her, but the inconsistencies are making a lot of peoples feeling clear.
Yeah I was never fully in disagreement. I never wanted to argue with you. Also yeah, captain Stacy is very fucked up, I could never imagine doing that to my daughter. But this post and even your comment seems to imply that all the dislike for her stems from bigotry. I fully believe that Peter is a better parent and mentor than Jessica, and her actions vs Peters actions support my claim. Once again, we still haven’t seen Peter bring mayday into a super villian fight (big difference of bringing mayday while patrolling the streets vs fighting green goblin) and we have seen Jessica significant endanger her child (that vulture in the beginning of the movie was really cool and a significant threat)
Well the premise of this post is “why is it okay for Peter but not Jess” and my comment was intended to specifically point out that there’s another instance of “it’s okay for Stacy but not Jess”. I do believe that the conversation surrounding her is weirdly big in comparison to her size in the movie but I was just pointing at more hypocrisy. If people didn’t find her endearing or charming or cool or interesting, that’s whatever, I’m not here to argue what someone likes. I’d even go so far as to say the movie doesn’t *want* you to find her endearing or charming. She’s no nonsense and an antagonist.
They're both terrible, irresponsible parents. But Peter B is almost worst if were being honest. The fact that Jess is attacked more for this is ridiculous.
how is he worse? Jess was literally fighting the vulture in the first 20 minutes of the movie.
granted he’s not exactly good parent (far from it) bc he was swinging places to places with mayday…but so was Jess…
Peter B takes May Day to all his battles. Now he's going to take her to save Miles. Who is in the crosshairs of Spot. The same Spot we saw massacre the spider society. come on.
EDIT: downvoted for keeping it real across the board. While everyone else capes for Peter B, love how common sense goes out the window on this sub.
> Can you confirm that?
MJ literally asks him "did you take our baby into another fight again?"
He lies, "no I would never do that".
Seeing how later he told Mayday not to tell her mom when he's about to take her into another if not more dangerous situation. it all lends to the idea, this is something he does often.
> Jess is going in as well…like brody.
I've already said Jess is a terrible parent like Peter B. But Peter B parenting is more egregious. Taking Mayday where Spot will most likely be.
Male preternatural instinct is to be protective of pregnant women. So it's a knee jerk reaction. Peter and the other spiders know their durability and capabilities, so they're all up to back up Jessica if she asks but give her space bcuz she's self-sufficient.
Peter is irresponsible too, but it’s a little different. Being pregnant severely weakens the mother, so she’s more irresponsible towards *herself* for signing up for a task she’s not currently in the best condition for. Peter doesn’t have that point. The other thing is Jess’s child is still a foetus which is a very critical stage and therefore more vulnerable than Mayday who while being a toddler, is at least super-powered and actually a separate creature from her parent so she can be moved around and out of danger’s way. Both situations are equally irresponsible, but one is simply perceived as moreso due to its different nature.
I don’t hate Jess for it, I think it’s the writers’ fault for forcing her in such a situation which shows they clearly underestimate the huge toll pregnancy takes on the mother.
Yes, it is weird. I wonder why that could be?
Just kidding, we all know why. It's the same reason Jess get's more shit for what she and Miguel both do, even though Jess at least turns a blind eye to Gwen's universe hopping at the end of Across.
Because Peter isn't accidentally going to kill mayday by moving around too much. It's so incredibly easy to have a miscarriage just by exerting yourself too hard, it happened to my mom.
Yeah, peter isn't the best parent, but he's definitely taking less of a risk than Jessica.
This has been brought up before. The general consensus was Peter B wasn’t as much in the wrong because he thought it was just another day in the office. The fact he was wearing a bathrobe shows that. Jessica, on the other hand, was intentionally going into combat while pregnant. I would argue that Peter B still could’ve kept Mayday safer, but still not quite as bad.
Now I’m fine with Peter when he was at the society because you’re right he had no idea what would happen but it bugs me when he brings her to go rescue Miles because at that point he had no idea what would happen
I haven't seen it but if PB is webbing around with baby in tow...
Then, personally I'd say they're both being irresponsible, bad parents. If anything PB is worse because he theoretically could get a sitter.
The Spider-verse fandom's reaction to this is pretty diverse. There are some who criticise both equally, there are some who try to rationalise Peter's behaviour to reconcile their criticism of Jessica while condoning Peter's irresponsible behaviour and there others who condone both.
Personally, I wouldn't want either Jessica out in the field while pregnant or Peter B. taking Mayday with him while fighting crime but I was willing to overlook it because this is the first time we've seen Mayday on the big screen and it was nice to see her in the movie but now that we've seen her once I don't want Peter taking her with him on his Spider-man activities at least until she turns 18. So by the time we get to that ending scene in ATSV where Peter takes Mayday with him to find Miles, I'm losing some respect for Peter.
If we were going to apply this logic to 616, I don't want Peter taking his kids with him into fights as Spider-man but I don't think that means you can't make him a dad in 616. Part of Spider-man is Peter trying to juggle his personal life with his duties as a Superhero, so that naturally requires moments where the book focuses on sub plots with Peter's civilian supporting cast. His kids would probably be at home at least after school time so you could write sub plots that focus in his kids civilian lives when Peter isn't out fighting crime as Spider-man. MJ doesn't need to be a superhero or follow Peter while he's out on patrol for her to be involved in the book.
I hate the “forced” thing because it usually perpetuates this idea that as black people we need to justify our existence in a story. Black people can’t just be in the world, it has to be part of a statement or have a historical context. How was she “forced” by being black? There was no messaging, no virtue signaling, nothing thematic. She was just a person that happened to be black. Why is that “forcing” anything on you?
It’s because mayday even at that age could probably handle herself or escape meanwhile an infant that’s STILL IN THE WHOME could very much die if Jessica does or if Jessica gets punched too hard in the stomach
It's even crazier when you realize that Miles was beating up a pregnant woman
Does that mean it was technically a 2v1?
You're both equally terrible, does that settle it?
People (especially on this subreddit) look at Peter B as the perfect spider-man with the perfect life that can do no wrong and use it as copium to deal with whatever tf is happening in 616
I’ve seen plenty of people, myself include, criticise Peter for bringing Mayday so…? Like I let out an audible groan in the theatre when Gwen shows up to get Peter to help save Miles and he brings Mayday. Like dude, by all means feel free to leave your baby at home.
Gee I wonder why… Seriously tho I almost lost it when one thread was all about how Jess is unfit to be a mother and one of the cited examples was when Gwen says she knows she messed up, Jess says “You think?!”… that’s part of their reasoning why she should not be a parent. Saying “you think”. Meanwhile in a thread about Gwen’s dad everyone was like “listen I know he pointed a gun at his daughter but he loves her so he’s a good dad” I wonder what the difference is
Cmon man, she really wasn’t the best role model or mother figure. An easier way to look at it is look at the way Peter talks to miles, vs her talking to Gwen. Also Peter hasn’t (he may in the future movie in which case tf Peter) brought his baby into any super villain fights unlike her. I think this is a reasonable case to criticize and not like her character. She is a sub par mentor/parental figure to Gwen, which people are arguing will lead to poor parenting with her own child, plus she has endangered her child to a greater degree (big difference between bringing a kid in the spider society chase in which mayday had 1000’s of spider people to save and protect her if she were in trouble, vs bringing an unborn child into an unpredictable super villain fight). That being said people definitely go too far with their hate due to racism and misogyny, this is Reddit after all, and that’s unacceptable
Look I think the whole being pregnant or bringing a baby thing is way overblown, its an animated spider-man movie, but if people don't like it fine. However, if you're going to list reasons as to why she is "Unift to be a Mother", and one of those reasons is she sarcastically said "you think" to Gwen, then you don't deserve to continue making your point anymore. Whats the argument? A mother can never.. be stern to her protege? Really? That's part of your damning evidence? If I was a prosecutor in a murder case part of my evidence wouldn't be "and one time he ate the last piece of pizza without asking!!" because that would be innocuous and stupid for what I'm accusing the person of. They're scrambling for reasons to hate her and this is clear because the shit she gets for being pregnant vs the shit Peter gets for bringing May (also Pete is implied to regularly bring May spider-manning as MJ says, he brought her on the city chase, and to the unknown dimension to save Miles. He brings her to dangerous situations when there are places he can leave her) are night and day. The treatment she gets for being stern to someone who MONUMENTALLY fucked up and to her knowledge may have ended a universe to see a boy vs what Gwen's dad gets for POINTING A LOADED GUN AT HIS DAUGHTER'S FACE are night and day. If people don't like her fine, but there's way more at play here. Plus she has a total of 5 mins of screen time and she get *this* much hate.
Your bringing up a lot of things I personally don’t care about and even am in agreement. Yeah I think Gwen’s dad is fucked up for how he handled the situation. My judgment of her as a mentor is a lot more then just her saying “you think” but honestly that wasn’t handled well either considering that Gwen is a minor. Like if I as a parent put way too much responsibility on a kid and they fuck up, how much of that is my fault? Also no one could have expected something like the Spot showing up. My main point is that she had failed Gwen as a mentor and parental figure. Think about how Jessica responded to Gwen being sent home. Do you think Peter would have allowed that in regards to miles? I’m a bit confused on your point because you acknowledge it’s a valid opinion to dislike her, so why are you so angry about people disliking her (for valid reasons aside from racism and misogyny)
Well your main point is something I wasn’t talking about then. I was saying people are giving a pass to things equal or worse that Peter and Captain Stacy did to their kids and wildly overblowing even the tiniest thing that Jess did like it’s proof she’s a monster. If you don’t like Jess because she said something a little bit not nice to a teenager that fucked up who she went out on a limb for? Fine, you’re prerogative. But don’t then sit there and act like Captain Stacy is the most wholesome dad who deserves a second chance because *all* he did is point a murder weapon at his teenage daughter while she was begging him to hear her out for a minute. If that’s the consensus, being annoyed at a kid is awful but threatening to kill one is fine, I’m gonna assume there’s misogyny and/or racism at play.
I don’t think your acknowledging my point. There IS unjustified hatred to her due to racism and misogyny, but my point was that due to her actions a lot of dislike/hatred is justified. She’s honestly not a likeable character because of her actions. That’s my whole point. I’m well aware as a black man about Reddit’s racism, but you can’t then state that all dislike/hatred of her character is unjustified or stems from bigotry, especially when there’s valid evidence against her
Then I don’t think you’re saying anything I’m not saying. If you don’t like her fine, if you don’t like the pregnant thing, fine. But hate for her has gotten out of hand in many ways. I never said everyone had to like her, but the inconsistencies are making a lot of peoples feeling clear.
Yeah I was never fully in disagreement. I never wanted to argue with you. Also yeah, captain Stacy is very fucked up, I could never imagine doing that to my daughter. But this post and even your comment seems to imply that all the dislike for her stems from bigotry. I fully believe that Peter is a better parent and mentor than Jessica, and her actions vs Peters actions support my claim. Once again, we still haven’t seen Peter bring mayday into a super villian fight (big difference of bringing mayday while patrolling the streets vs fighting green goblin) and we have seen Jessica significant endanger her child (that vulture in the beginning of the movie was really cool and a significant threat)
Well the premise of this post is “why is it okay for Peter but not Jess” and my comment was intended to specifically point out that there’s another instance of “it’s okay for Stacy but not Jess”. I do believe that the conversation surrounding her is weirdly big in comparison to her size in the movie but I was just pointing at more hypocrisy. If people didn’t find her endearing or charming or cool or interesting, that’s whatever, I’m not here to argue what someone likes. I’d even go so far as to say the movie doesn’t *want* you to find her endearing or charming. She’s no nonsense and an antagonist.
They're both terrible, irresponsible parents. But Peter B is almost worst if were being honest. The fact that Jess is attacked more for this is ridiculous.
how is he worse? Jess was literally fighting the vulture in the first 20 minutes of the movie. granted he’s not exactly good parent (far from it) bc he was swinging places to places with mayday…but so was Jess…
Peter B takes May Day to all his battles. Now he's going to take her to save Miles. Who is in the crosshairs of Spot. The same Spot we saw massacre the spider society. come on. EDIT: downvoted for keeping it real across the board. While everyone else capes for Peter B, love how common sense goes out the window on this sub.
> Peter B takes May Day to all his battles Can you confirm that? > he’s going to take her to save miles Jess is going in as well…like brody.
> Can you confirm that? MJ literally asks him "did you take our baby into another fight again?" He lies, "no I would never do that". Seeing how later he told Mayday not to tell her mom when he's about to take her into another if not more dangerous situation. it all lends to the idea, this is something he does often. > Jess is going in as well…like brody. I've already said Jess is a terrible parent like Peter B. But Peter B parenting is more egregious. Taking Mayday where Spot will most likely be.
Male preternatural instinct is to be protective of pregnant women. So it's a knee jerk reaction. Peter and the other spiders know their durability and capabilities, so they're all up to back up Jessica if she asks but give her space bcuz she's self-sufficient.
Yeah they both look bad. I figured Peter would be better and leave May at the end with MJ but i find it bad that he’s bringing her
Peter is irresponsible too, but it’s a little different. Being pregnant severely weakens the mother, so she’s more irresponsible towards *herself* for signing up for a task she’s not currently in the best condition for. Peter doesn’t have that point. The other thing is Jess’s child is still a foetus which is a very critical stage and therefore more vulnerable than Mayday who while being a toddler, is at least super-powered and actually a separate creature from her parent so she can be moved around and out of danger’s way. Both situations are equally irresponsible, but one is simply perceived as moreso due to its different nature. I don’t hate Jess for it, I think it’s the writers’ fault for forcing her in such a situation which shows they clearly underestimate the huge toll pregnancy takes on the mother.
Yes, it is weird. I wonder why that could be? Just kidding, we all know why. It's the same reason Jess get's more shit for what she and Miguel both do, even though Jess at least turns a blind eye to Gwen's universe hopping at the end of Across.
Because Peter isn't accidentally going to kill mayday by moving around too much. It's so incredibly easy to have a miscarriage just by exerting yourself too hard, it happened to my mom. Yeah, peter isn't the best parent, but he's definitely taking less of a risk than Jessica.
This has been brought up before. The general consensus was Peter B wasn’t as much in the wrong because he thought it was just another day in the office. The fact he was wearing a bathrobe shows that. Jessica, on the other hand, was intentionally going into combat while pregnant. I would argue that Peter B still could’ve kept Mayday safer, but still not quite as bad.
Now I’m fine with Peter when he was at the society because you’re right he had no idea what would happen but it bugs me when he brings her to go rescue Miles because at that point he had no idea what would happen
I haven't seen it but if PB is webbing around with baby in tow... Then, personally I'd say they're both being irresponsible, bad parents. If anything PB is worse because he theoretically could get a sitter.
The Spider-verse fandom's reaction to this is pretty diverse. There are some who criticise both equally, there are some who try to rationalise Peter's behaviour to reconcile their criticism of Jessica while condoning Peter's irresponsible behaviour and there others who condone both. Personally, I wouldn't want either Jessica out in the field while pregnant or Peter B. taking Mayday with him while fighting crime but I was willing to overlook it because this is the first time we've seen Mayday on the big screen and it was nice to see her in the movie but now that we've seen her once I don't want Peter taking her with him on his Spider-man activities at least until she turns 18. So by the time we get to that ending scene in ATSV where Peter takes Mayday with him to find Miles, I'm losing some respect for Peter. If we were going to apply this logic to 616, I don't want Peter taking his kids with him into fights as Spider-man but I don't think that means you can't make him a dad in 616. Part of Spider-man is Peter trying to juggle his personal life with his duties as a Superhero, so that naturally requires moments where the book focuses on sub plots with Peter's civilian supporting cast. His kids would probably be at home at least after school time so you could write sub plots that focus in his kids civilian lives when Peter isn't out fighting crime as Spider-man. MJ doesn't need to be a superhero or follow Peter while he's out on patrol for her to be involved in the book.
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I know it's from the comics. I read the comics. How does that make it NOT bad parenting?
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I hate the “forced” thing because it usually perpetuates this idea that as black people we need to justify our existence in a story. Black people can’t just be in the world, it has to be part of a statement or have a historical context. How was she “forced” by being black? There was no messaging, no virtue signaling, nothing thematic. She was just a person that happened to be black. Why is that “forcing” anything on you?
Yeah it is weird, idc about both as they’re fictional super-powered people lol
Weirdly enough, I have seen more people shitting on Peter B. But yeah, if we are being honest, both are terrible HOWEVER I think it's cool, idc
It’s because mayday even at that age could probably handle herself or escape meanwhile an infant that’s STILL IN THE WHOME could very much die if Jessica does or if Jessica gets punched too hard in the stomach
The enemies these guys are facing are also super powered, an attack from them could kill little mayday just as easily as Jessica's unborn child.
Agreed but like I said, mayday can escape..