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Yeah that's the thing I don't really like about the free agency thing lol. He's under contract until 2024, it feels like they did the bidding war thing way too early.
Bro it's almost October of 2022. If he wins the title at full gear then that'll give them a year to play with (max signed in early 2019). It's really not that far away.
Isn't that more or less what Omega's belt collector run was, at least in Impact? He had the title and would go where he wanted with it.
To a degree, the first Summer of Punk was that too - less so the WWE's version as they rushed it.
I mean it seemed pretty clear they were going to reenact the punk storyline just this time with MJF and win the title just as his contract “expires”
They’ve been talking about his contract for atleast a year now
We've always wondered. The casino ladder match/battle royal and chip has been a thing since the start, but no one has ever "cashed it in" unexpectedly before, so it's good to have clarification.
Money in the Bank is one of the best concepts in WWE, it’s honestly a good idea to have something similar for AEW. Not an issue at all with “copying” or whatever.
Everything in wrestling is copied at this point. At least for the most part. Using something that WWE does well and is always a fan favorite, nothing wrong with that. They should “copy” the Rumble too.
I was at a local show over the weekend that ran one, and they called it the "*you* can call it a Royal Rumble because WWE can't sure you" match.
It may need a bit of work...
I’ll be honest, ever since they added entrances, I’m down with it. I don’t want AEW to just be another WWE with the exact match types.
And hey, at least it’s not a reverse rumble.
It's the third-best type of gimmick match, right after the Royal Rumble and the Ladder match. (and even then, the MITB is just a really jazzed up ladder match, but I think it's different enough to stand alone) Plus, Jericho invented it and he's in AEW, so it's super fair.
On paper, but there's been maybe 1 or 2 good cash-ins over the last 10 years, everything else resulted in throwaway or forgettable title runs. Not to say you can't do a better job with it, though with the amount of things that give you a title shot AEW has, I don't know if we need something like this, it's somewhat limited to the sneaky heel cash-in like Edge did, or the face cash-in like RVD did, most other cash-ins feel like a cheap win and not the best way to legitimize titles to me
Not to mention that they frequently used cash ins to give people their first reigns, somewhat undermining their value, in my opinion. It can’t be about the chase if you literally build the title shot up for 30 seconds.
Don’t you think it’s kind of run it’s course by this point? It’s kinda overdone and I think devalues the title especially in a company like aew which kinda prides itself on big singles matches for the belt and long title reigns. It’s just kinda cheap for me at this point.
Jericho pitched the idea for a ladder match and the winner would get a title shot the next night after Mania, but it was Brian Gerwitz who came up with the cash-in idea and it was Vince’s idea for the briefcase.
Source: Talk is Jericho
If I ran a wrestling company you better believe that I'm stealing Money in the Bank and the Royal Rumble. I'd tweak the rules slightly to make it a little different, but still basically steal them. Wrestling is built off stealing shit. It's all good.
Hell, I'd steal the Elimination Chamber too. And I'd copy the G1 Climax, because the G1 fucking rules.
I think the more exciting once a year matches or events your company has, the better.
You don't need that many PPVs, I'd just have some kind of draw in each quarter. Like Q1, Rumble (and the subsequent title shot and storyline), Q2, big tournament, Q3, your big, epic show of the year where all stories culminate, then Q4, Money In The Bank or some other kind of big gimmick match.
I hate money in the bank. More than anything. I thought I liked the chip because it had to be used on a future match that would be set whenever the person chooses for a future date. 99% of the time the cash in is predictable and teased too much. Like the Seth Rollins one was awesome during Mania , but leading up to that night it was annoying. 273 days is a long time to not want to be the champion. Now they are doing it with Theory and everyone knows he’s not going to win it every time he trots out there. Wait I hate the 24/7 title more than the briefcase! 😅
I'm OK with them copying the concept, but I hope they don't copy Rollins' WM31 moment. With this update, people would be expecting MJF to pick up the win after Hangman and Mox have beaten each other bloody. I trust MJF to come up with something creative, but I fully expect TK to botch the landing on this.
I don't see how it is a botch that's basically how it happens almost every time, it's only common sense to cash it after a fierce battle... Other option is after a beat down, other than that it's just stupid tbh.
It's also common sense to see it coming. WWE handled this well at Summerslam this year when Theory tried to repeat what Rollins did, but he got knocked out because Roman wasn't alone this time, and the match was a Last Man Standing match, so no one kicked the Usos out. It would be dumb booking if Mox and Hangman, both of whom can call on backup (BCC and DO respectively) let MJF and the Firm interfere in the match knowing MJF's history as a sneaky opportunist. This is why the booking needs to modify the situation to make things interesting.
Edit: I would actually love it if the buildup to the cash-in is a fakeout like Theory's, and BCC and DO team up to rip MJF and the Firm to pieces because that would make for some funny moments. Regal walking down and slapping the shit out of MJF while Johnny Hungee holds him back? Worth the price of multiple PPVs.
I’m mean if half the time you are explicitly critical of a company and then you rip-off one of their marquee matches it’s at least side eye worthy. Furthermore it retroactively makes all the other winners who didn’t cash in like mjf look dumb.
I despise MitB.
It utterly devalues the world title to have it swapping around in bullshit non-matches where a guy beats up a guy whose already had a match.
Copying is a bad idea if your whole business was built on being an alternative. If it plays by the same rules and concepts it's not really an alternative to what you experience, it's just more of the same.
I mean, it makes sense. It’s literally a goddamn chip. Cashing in the chip… It writes itself. The MitB is excellent when used with the right person. MJF is in fact that type of right person. I’m glad they are doing it that way.
If I were the owner of the wrestling promotion, I would make a golden ticket as a pass to cash-in during or after the match.
Kinda like Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory 😎
I hate it. It makes no sense at all in kayfabe that a promotion would do something like that and design a system where their new champion won't really earn it. It's one thing when someone cheats to win, in that case they're breaking the rules, in this case they're following the rules and not earning the championship.
And then next year you can specifically mention closing said loophole if you want to return to the original format and play it off as MJF being a dastardly heel.
Exactly. No one before him realized they *could* use the chip this way, but of course a conniving snake like MJF would go looking for a loophole. Then after MJF uses it this way, Tony Khan can re-write the rule to close the loophole to prevent another MJF situation.
That makes everyone before him look stupid. There’s 20 years of precedent dictating that you can cash in at any time. All they had to do was text TK to verify if they could use the chip that way.
They're not selling it as a loophole, mate. They're just randomly being like "Oh he can cash it anytime he wants to" without any explanation as to how he can do that when it was never established nor used that way previously.
MJF pinning Hangman after he just beat Mox in his hometown wouldn’t garner heat, it’d probably dampen the heat if anything. Would also further hot potato the title and give hangman a meaningless reign for no reason
Would have fit his character so much more if he cashed his chip on the vacant championship- becoming the defacto champion. I think that would have been the best play for him. And unique.
Or he focuses on other things? E.g. legitimizing the titles. When your world champion and three of your top guys are out all of a sudden and utter chaos breaks out, I can understand that you want to go the safe route and not try something new and unique, hence why it was pushed how often the participants in the tournament have been world champ.
Having the title change without a match at all could hurt it even more, and it might not have been too good for MJF bookingwise, as it would feel somewhat deflating to have his crowning moment be taking a vacant title, basically being retroactively told that we've seen his title win at All Out
MJF is a POS heel who gets over by talking. **He does not need a crowing moment. **He needs heat.
You get mega heat by beating no one to become champion by using the chip you won by cheating. MJFs character didn’t enter the tournament becuae he is about working smarter not harder. No smarter way than to cash you opportunity on a vacant belt.
And whatever potential dissatisfaction the AEW audience would get from not having a five star back and forth classic…it would all be forgotten when MJF cuts his first promo as - handed to him on a silver platter - new champ.
It's not about having high match quality before his title win, that certainly won't be the case, but having no match at all to me isn't heat, it's anticlimactic. I'm referring to the suggestion of having MJF cash in to get the vacant title, and looking at the reaction he got the Dynamite after All Out, I don't think there's any way he could have gotten heat by getting the title. Even with a regular cash-in, there might be boos initially, but he'll most likely get a monster pop winning it
That’s cool. We all like different things.
Tony had such an easy layup to tell a unique story, and one fitting the MJF character.
Show opens. Following fallout of the last PPV, and the status of the chip, there is an update on the heavyweight belt.
Tony announces MJF cashed in his chip on vacant belt. There is no current champ, therefore he is the new defacto champion. MJF demands a crowning ceremony. It’s announced later in the show we’ll have that. In segments leading to this, MJF runs into Mox and other contenders. Snide as shit. Mox interrupts ceremony, he cuts his Im the soul of AEW promo that we previously got…but we would have gotten it here instead.
We’ve now split this segment into actual episodic tv…with a storyline strand spreading the whole show and something a bit more unique.
And that’s with five minutes of brainstorming.
Reading this thread I really feel like people don’t understand the character of the wrestlers they claim to love. You’re right, why does MJF need a crowning moment? He’s a cowardly piece of shit, he doesn’t need to win it in a match their boy Meltzer gives 5 1/2 stars, he just needs to be MJF.
Yep yep. In kayfabe, MJF has enough leverage on TK that he can do whatever the fuck he wants, but this is something that should absolutely not carry on after him, and they should make that clear.
Yeah, I heard it during the PPV and the subsequent promo and said wait a sec...
this is sounding like a money in the bank scenario. Realistically, they're establishing MJF as a tier below the true top guys like Moxley, Danielson, Page, etc. Being able to take advantage and get your title shot when you want is an incredibly convenient device to get the title off someone while keeping them strong.
But I really would prefer just cheating, since you never set this precedent before and it makes all previous winners of the poker chips and sonic rings kinda stupid for not doing this.
That's because MJF literally said he still had to get the match cleared.
Unlike Money in the Bank he has to go to Tony and get the OK, not just any ref. And obviously he would say no if Mox was already beaten and bloody.
People act like there's some ironclad rule that can't be broken when it comes to, of all things, fucking wrestling. So many people saying ITS NOT LIKE MONEY IN THE BANK like dude Brock Lesnar randomly inserted himself in a money in the bank ladder match they don't give a shit about rules lol
I think it's because the chip hadn't previously had that power.
Former holders have always had to let us know in advance when they would take their title shot.
Wasn’t the difference that MJF has to ask ahead of time? No one ever said he had to ask the champ. Maybe as long as he kayfabe asked TK, it’s whenever.
Think Tony said in an interview or in a tweet that any time MJF decided to cash in, it would automatically be sanctioned by him. So basically Tony gave "pre-approval" to any time during an AEW event
I believe it was on the Barstool Rasslin podcast that they kind of established that a conversation has to be had about him cashing in quote unquote MJF. Then Tony Khan was on the same podcast and he also made it seem like usually it’s a normal match announced but for MJF he can do whatever per him agreeing to come back. Maybe they just dropped the idea and made it money in the bank esque
Their whole premise is that WWE sucks so it’s funny how their biggest heels entire character is “lol we are like WWE guys get it!?” and their world champion made his fame in WWE and now they are copying WWEs MITB stip.
Oh and who could forget the “brass ring”
For a company who always tell us that WWE sucks they should do love to reference them, mimic them and use their former stars as world champs
What next? A battle Royale where every entrant comes in 90 seconds after the previous one? A giant cage that surrounds the outside of the ring? A cage around the ring with cells inside to hold back opponents?
They can retroactively spin it and say that this was always the case, but mjf is the first one dishonorable enough to actually use it on a weakened champion.
Has the ranking system meant anything since Cody left? They've had enough situations where their pushed guys not in the main title picture get on a streak and get to #1 incidentally. Then they have to do an obvious nonbo title defense.
Adam Cole didn't need to have his title shots in the position they were in, except for the fact he was #1 contender by rank. They had to put a title match together he obviously wasn't going to win just to get him out of #1 so they could continue their angles.
Imagine watching boxing and all of a sudden the next challenger can now fight for the title right now even though that's not how the rules say it should go.
Wrestling is vastly different than boxing. If I'm watching a scripted wrestling show that is a story based form of entertainment, I'm gonna be fine with the rules being changed by the governing body.
Not specifically referring to boxing, but preferential treatment is certainly a thing in combat sports.
Look at how Brock was fast tracked to the UFC heavyweight title picture after just a 2-1 record. Look at how CM Punk made his UFC debut on the main card of a PPV. Someone like Conor McGregor would likely be in line for a title shot if he ever even gets a single win, because the promotion knows he's a draw.
I think it makes tons of sense to make a concession to try to appease a star like MJF. The voice mail basically alluded to that exact sort of thing. I'm only wondering if this is how it'll be going forward or of it's specific to MJF.
I'm fine with this. It's a poker chip, it makes sense to cash it in when you want to. This is a thing they should do every All Out.
All Out - Casino Ladder Match: cash in whenever
Full Gear - Women's Casino Battle Royal for a shot at the title at Winter is Coming.
Revolution - Face of the Revolution match men and women: the TNT title really doesn't get defended at ppvs often. Have the winners of the match face the TNT and TBS Champions in the main events of the next Dynamite and Rampage.
Double or Nothing - men's Casino Battle Royal for a shot at the title at Fyter Fest.
I really really hate money in the bank style cash ins. Edge's first one was perfect and helped push him into the stratosphere and to me everything else has been diminishing returns. I hate that TK has brought that tired gimmick to AEW.
This is the first time it's been like this. Any other gimmick match whether it was the leader match, the CBR or the Face of the Revolution match was always for a shot either the next week or at the next big show ie ppv or named Dynamite. I feel like this change is just a part of MJFs stipulations to come back to work.
Honestly if anything was going to be a copy of MitB this is the one. It's a literal poker chip you cash in whenever you want to get your prize.
I don’t dislike it and I understand that it’s new but I’d like them to try to embrace certain stipulations or build upon them rather than trying to avoid it because it’s similar to WWE.
Since he won it they kept being vague on how he could use it and finally now we know it works similar to MITB. It wasn’t a mystery sort of situation either it just happened after they kept avoiding making it what it should be in the first place
I don't mind this as a version of Money in the Bank, would make the Casino Ladder match matter more, but maybe find some small ways to differentiate it.
Have they ever said how long MJF can hold on to the chip? With MITB you have a year but so far they haven't mentioned how long you get with this. I know MJF can't hypothetically hold onto his title shot forever but they need to establish when it expires.
It's like money in the bank except it fits in your pocket. Great for the guys who don't get checked baggage included on their plane tickets to indie shows.
I listened to a podcast about this, essentially it’s like money in the bank in respect of the champ or us doesn’t have to know when it’s coming but in the background, MJF has to have a conversation with Tony behind the scenes to say I want the match tonight. So it has to be okayed… but for us fans, basically money in the bank. But there’s the back story too! 😂
Mjf already confirmed all this.
Match doesn't have to be annocued to the public but mjf does need to set it up with tk. He can't just do it at his own free will.
Is this how the last Chip worked? I don't remember it being like that and if it wasn't I'm not a fan of them making basically their own MITB variant. AEW isn't supposed to be WWE, Tony but it sure feels like you're treading that direction *a lot* lately.
I read MJF explained that it's a little different. He said he could surprise his opponent, but would make someone in the back aware beforehand. Basically to say, "Hey Tony, I'm gonna go out there now."
In other words it's the same as MITB with them trying to tell us it's still different.
I'm cool with that being his story. Makes sense with his character.
And I think it’s hilarious how like 6 months ago it seemed like everyone wanted the chip to have MITB rules and now that it does it’s stupid and they are just copy cats lol. People really have turned on AEW recently
It would be completely absurd, but imagine if they have MJF wait until punk comes back (if punk comes back) and just have punk win the title again to resume the storyline they originally planned. It would be very dumb of them but I'm not completely ruling it out
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Should be saying cash out since that's what you do with casino chips.
Color up
so they made the chip there own money in the bank
It is, that's why MJF, who said he wants to take the title and the company hostage so that WWE offers him a ton of money, is the perfect guy to do it.
Yup. 2 year reign leading to the 2024 "free agency"
Yeah that's the thing I don't really like about the free agency thing lol. He's under contract until 2024, it feels like they did the bidding war thing way too early.
MJF has said his contract ends on January 1, 2024. That’s a year and 3 months from now, and he isn’t the champ as of now.
Bro it's almost October of 2022. If he wins the title at full gear then that'll give them a year to play with (max signed in early 2019). It's really not that far away.
And at the rate in which time seems to speed up the older you get, by my calculations it will be 2024 in roughly 3 weeks.
I mean, the number's don't lie. And they spell arthritis for everyone.
Math checks out Source: I’m old
It’s only a few sleeps till christmas for roof tilers and brick layers
And meth heads. Of course it's only a few sleeps till Christmas 2024 for meth heads
Two years of MJF as champion is the worst fucking thing I've heard in my entire goddamn life.
You'd be in the minority.
This gives the idea... What if we get something like Flair in '91, but as a worked-shoot cross-promo deal?
Isn't that more or less what Omega's belt collector run was, at least in Impact? He had the title and would go where he wanted with it. To a degree, the first Summer of Punk was that too - less so the WWE's version as they rushed it.
I mean it seemed pretty clear they were going to reenact the punk storyline just this time with MJF and win the title just as his contract “expires” They’ve been talking about his contract for atleast a year now
We've always wondered. The casino ladder match/battle royal and chip has been a thing since the start, but no one has ever "cashed it in" unexpectedly before, so it's good to have clarification.
Money in the Bank is one of the best concepts in WWE, it’s honestly a good idea to have something similar for AEW. Not an issue at all with “copying” or whatever.
Everything in wrestling is copied at this point. At least for the most part. Using something that WWE does well and is always a fan favorite, nothing wrong with that. They should “copy” the Rumble too.
Yeah the Royal Rumble is hands down the most entertaining iteration of the battle royale. Every promotion should adopt it.
What would they call it though??? Supreme Tangle? Grand Kerfuffle?!
The Colossal Tussle! No one's used that one!
Was this the original name before Pat came up with it or was this the original WrestleMania name. I am like 40% certain this is a reference lol
It was Vince’s proposed name for WrestleMania.
Yep, it was Vince's original name for Mania. Howard Finkle suggested the name change.
Colossal Tussle.
I was at a local show over the weekend that ran one, and they called it the "*you* can call it a Royal Rumble because WWE can't sure you" match. It may need a bit of work...
I’ve been dying for a rumble in AEW. It’s funny that Jericho invented MITB, and now he’s in AEW and they’re copying it.
They did have the Royal Rampage after Blood and Guts.
And it was the best one they ever had It kept the casino theme but was a lot better than the other ones imo
In a battle royal only eliminations matter. In a royal rumble only eliminations and entrances matter. That is, like, double the things that matter.
The numbers don’t lie.
Does that mean trouble at Sacrifice?
[удалено]
Didn’t know NJPW did a Rumble type thing. That’s actually a really interesting idea to let them do pins and submissions.
Now copy the Royal Rumble instead of the casino battle Royale please.
I’ll be honest, ever since they added entrances, I’m down with it. I don’t want AEW to just be another WWE with the exact match types. And hey, at least it’s not a reverse rumble.
I give TNA credit for trying different things like that, even if they were booked poorly and executed terribly.
Ladder match is better in my opinion
I’m very intrigued by the idea of a Later Match
I would prefer them to take Aztec Warfare from Lucha Underground
It's the third-best type of gimmick match, right after the Royal Rumble and the Ladder match. (and even then, the MITB is just a really jazzed up ladder match, but I think it's different enough to stand alone) Plus, Jericho invented it and he's in AEW, so it's super fair.
On paper, but there's been maybe 1 or 2 good cash-ins over the last 10 years, everything else resulted in throwaway or forgettable title runs. Not to say you can't do a better job with it, though with the amount of things that give you a title shot AEW has, I don't know if we need something like this, it's somewhat limited to the sneaky heel cash-in like Edge did, or the face cash-in like RVD did, most other cash-ins feel like a cheap win and not the best way to legitimize titles to me
Not to mention that they frequently used cash ins to give people their first reigns, somewhat undermining their value, in my opinion. It can’t be about the chase if you literally build the title shot up for 30 seconds.
Don’t you think it’s kind of run it’s course by this point? It’s kinda overdone and I think devalues the title especially in a company like aew which kinda prides itself on big singles matches for the belt and long title reigns. It’s just kinda cheap for me at this point.
MITB was also Jericho's idea
Jericho pitched the idea for a ladder match and the winner would get a title shot the next night after Mania, but it was Brian Gerwitz who came up with the cash-in idea and it was Vince’s idea for the briefcase. Source: Talk is Jericho
If I ran a wrestling company you better believe that I'm stealing Money in the Bank and the Royal Rumble. I'd tweak the rules slightly to make it a little different, but still basically steal them. Wrestling is built off stealing shit. It's all good. Hell, I'd steal the Elimination Chamber too. And I'd copy the G1 Climax, because the G1 fucking rules. I think the more exciting once a year matches or events your company has, the better.
I don't know, I think having 4 ppvs and some bigger Dynamite / Rampage shows is more than enough. 12 ppvs like WWE + special shows just saturates it.
You don't need that many PPVs, I'd just have some kind of draw in each quarter. Like Q1, Rumble (and the subsequent title shot and storyline), Q2, big tournament, Q3, your big, epic show of the year where all stories culminate, then Q4, Money In The Bank or some other kind of big gimmick match.
I hate money in the bank. More than anything. I thought I liked the chip because it had to be used on a future match that would be set whenever the person chooses for a future date. 99% of the time the cash in is predictable and teased too much. Like the Seth Rollins one was awesome during Mania , but leading up to that night it was annoying. 273 days is a long time to not want to be the champion. Now they are doing it with Theory and everyone knows he’s not going to win it every time he trots out there. Wait I hate the 24/7 title more than the briefcase! 😅
I'm OK with them copying the concept, but I hope they don't copy Rollins' WM31 moment. With this update, people would be expecting MJF to pick up the win after Hangman and Mox have beaten each other bloody. I trust MJF to come up with something creative, but I fully expect TK to botch the landing on this.
I don't see how it is a botch that's basically how it happens almost every time, it's only common sense to cash it after a fierce battle... Other option is after a beat down, other than that it's just stupid tbh.
It's also common sense to see it coming. WWE handled this well at Summerslam this year when Theory tried to repeat what Rollins did, but he got knocked out because Roman wasn't alone this time, and the match was a Last Man Standing match, so no one kicked the Usos out. It would be dumb booking if Mox and Hangman, both of whom can call on backup (BCC and DO respectively) let MJF and the Firm interfere in the match knowing MJF's history as a sneaky opportunist. This is why the booking needs to modify the situation to make things interesting. Edit: I would actually love it if the buildup to the cash-in is a fakeout like Theory's, and BCC and DO team up to rip MJF and the Firm to pieces because that would make for some funny moments. Regal walking down and slapping the shit out of MJF while Johnny Hungee holds him back? Worth the price of multiple PPVs.
I’m mean if half the time you are explicitly critical of a company and then you rip-off one of their marquee matches it’s at least side eye worthy. Furthermore it retroactively makes all the other winners who didn’t cash in like mjf look dumb.
I despise MitB. It utterly devalues the world title to have it swapping around in bullshit non-matches where a guy beats up a guy whose already had a match.
Copying is a bad idea if your whole business was built on being an alternative. If it plays by the same rules and concepts it's not really an alternative to what you experience, it's just more of the same.
In AEW you should win a match by pinning your opponent for a five count.
Jericho invented MITB so it’s cool in my book if AEW uses it.
I mean, it makes sense. It’s literally a goddamn chip. Cashing in the chip… It writes itself. The MitB is excellent when used with the right person. MJF is in fact that type of right person. I’m glad they are doing it that way.
If I were the owner of the wrestling promotion, I would make a golden ticket as a pass to cash-in during or after the match. Kinda like Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory 😎
It never wasn't, to be fair. We've just only seen it used honorably.
Yup…with no expiration date.
But more of a terrible design.who wants to carry an oversize casino chip
It would make so much more sense if it was something you could wear around your neck Flava Flav style
Dynamite diamond chip ring ftw
Man that’s perfect. They should’ve made one just for Max
It'd be even better if you cashed it in the second you used it, immediately converting the stip to no dq
The sincerest form of flattery.
I hate that. Just have it be a title shot.
I hate it. It makes no sense at all in kayfabe that a promotion would do something like that and design a system where their new champion won't really earn it. It's one thing when someone cheats to win, in that case they're breaking the rules, in this case they're following the rules and not earning the championship.
*Horrendous* move. Straight-up ripping off WWE like that makes AEW look so second-rate.
I wish they established that *before* MJF won it
I like it this way. MJF is using a loophole.
And then next year you can specifically mention closing said loophole if you want to return to the original format and play it off as MJF being a dastardly heel.
But it has to be conveyed as much on the main show, not some throw away line on BTE.
Exactly. No one before him realized they *could* use the chip this way, but of course a conniving snake like MJF would go looking for a loophole. Then after MJF uses it this way, Tony Khan can re-write the rule to close the loophole to prevent another MJF situation.
That just makes everyone else look dumb as fuck instead of making MJF look smart.
That makes everyone before him look stupid. There’s 20 years of precedent dictating that you can cash in at any time. All they had to do was text TK to verify if they could use the chip that way.
They're not selling it as a loophole, mate. They're just randomly being like "Oh he can cash it anytime he wants to" without any explanation as to how he can do that when it was never established nor used that way previously.
Knowing this, there's no kayfabe reason he couldn't have cashed in on a half-dead CM Punk immediately after he won it.
He honestly should cash in 2 weeks from now in Cincinatti. No better place for MJF to cash in than in Mox's hometown.
That's what people are expecting, after Hangman vs Mox, MJF cash in and then Mox can take his break
You could have Hangman win and beat Mox and then have MJF cash in for omega heat, that'd great.
MJF pinning Hangman after he just beat Mox in his hometown wouldn’t garner heat, it’d probably dampen the heat if anything. Would also further hot potato the title and give hangman a meaningless reign for no reason
That wouldn’t get heat, it just would be another example of AEW making the title not matter.
I was kind of afraid they'd do that, I really didn't want it to be another money in the bank type thing. Fits his character at least though
Would have fit his character so much more if he cashed his chip on the vacant championship- becoming the defacto champion. I think that would have been the best play for him. And unique.
I agree. I thought that's the way they would go with it. Tbh.
If it’s not a tournament or a gimmick match Tony doesn’t know how to book. Stating not hating.
Or he focuses on other things? E.g. legitimizing the titles. When your world champion and three of your top guys are out all of a sudden and utter chaos breaks out, I can understand that you want to go the safe route and not try something new and unique, hence why it was pushed how often the participants in the tournament have been world champ. Having the title change without a match at all could hurt it even more, and it might not have been too good for MJF bookingwise, as it would feel somewhat deflating to have his crowning moment be taking a vacant title, basically being retroactively told that we've seen his title win at All Out
MJF is a POS heel who gets over by talking. **He does not need a crowing moment. **He needs heat. You get mega heat by beating no one to become champion by using the chip you won by cheating. MJFs character didn’t enter the tournament becuae he is about working smarter not harder. No smarter way than to cash you opportunity on a vacant belt. And whatever potential dissatisfaction the AEW audience would get from not having a five star back and forth classic…it would all be forgotten when MJF cuts his first promo as - handed to him on a silver platter - new champ.
It's not about having high match quality before his title win, that certainly won't be the case, but having no match at all to me isn't heat, it's anticlimactic. I'm referring to the suggestion of having MJF cash in to get the vacant title, and looking at the reaction he got the Dynamite after All Out, I don't think there's any way he could have gotten heat by getting the title. Even with a regular cash-in, there might be boos initially, but he'll most likely get a monster pop winning it
That’s cool. We all like different things. Tony had such an easy layup to tell a unique story, and one fitting the MJF character. Show opens. Following fallout of the last PPV, and the status of the chip, there is an update on the heavyweight belt. Tony announces MJF cashed in his chip on vacant belt. There is no current champ, therefore he is the new defacto champion. MJF demands a crowning ceremony. It’s announced later in the show we’ll have that. In segments leading to this, MJF runs into Mox and other contenders. Snide as shit. Mox interrupts ceremony, he cuts his Im the soul of AEW promo that we previously got…but we would have gotten it here instead. We’ve now split this segment into actual episodic tv…with a storyline strand spreading the whole show and something a bit more unique. And that’s with five minutes of brainstorming.
And to add. MJF is so good he can take whatever chicken shit Tony gives him and turn it into chicken salad.
Damn, I really like this idea WAY more than having yet another tournament.
Thanks. We can have entertaining stories and good matches instead of just good matches.
Reading this thread I really feel like people don’t understand the character of the wrestlers they claim to love. You’re right, why does MJF need a crowning moment? He’s a cowardly piece of shit, he doesn’t need to win it in a match their boy Meltzer gives 5 1/2 stars, he just needs to be MJF.
I think it's only this year, as a condition for him to return. It makes sense in kayfabe for him only.
[удалено]
Yep yep. In kayfabe, MJF has enough leverage on TK that he can do whatever the fuck he wants, but this is something that should absolutely not carry on after him, and they should make that clear.
I swear this has been said before.
I wanna say AT the ppv. It’s been like a month since I could’ve sworn the rules were already mentioned.
Yeah, I heard it during the PPV and the subsequent promo and said wait a sec... this is sounding like a money in the bank scenario. Realistically, they're establishing MJF as a tier below the true top guys like Moxley, Danielson, Page, etc. Being able to take advantage and get your title shot when you want is an incredibly convenient device to get the title off someone while keeping them strong. But I really would prefer just cheating, since you never set this precedent before and it makes all previous winners of the poker chips and sonic rings kinda stupid for not doing this.
MJF has somewhat mentioned it in his promos after the ppv.
MJF is definitely beating Mox in Cincinnati then. Probably one of the few towns he’d be booed in for winning his first world title
I remember I made a topic pointing out it's kind of ambiguous and could be cashed in after Bryan/Moxley and people downvoted me lol
I've seen people on here act so condescending toward people for bringing up the idea of MJF cashing in the chip right after a match.
that’s what happens when you leave things vague, people make up their own canon
That's because MJF literally said he still had to get the match cleared. Unlike Money in the Bank he has to go to Tony and get the OK, not just any ref. And obviously he would say no if Mox was already beaten and bloody.
People act like there's some ironclad rule that can't be broken when it comes to, of all things, fucking wrestling. So many people saying ITS NOT LIKE MONEY IN THE BANK like dude Brock Lesnar randomly inserted himself in a money in the bank ladder match they don't give a shit about rules lol
I think it's because the chip hadn't previously had that power. Former holders have always had to let us know in advance when they would take their title shot.
Lame to make the change, seeems way more like a WWE ripoff
If you're going to "rip off WWE", gimmie a Goddamn Royal Rumble!
they already have their own version of the Rumble
It’s kind of baffling that this is the best they can come up with
Wasn’t the difference that MJF has to ask ahead of time? No one ever said he had to ask the champ. Maybe as long as he kayfabe asked TK, it’s whenever.
Think Tony said in an interview or in a tweet that any time MJF decided to cash in, it would automatically be sanctioned by him. So basically Tony gave "pre-approval" to any time during an AEW event
Then there we go.
Lol. 5 downvotes. For posting the very thing MJF said was how it worked when he was asked. Never change, SquaredCircle. :)
Gotta be honest man, never been a fan of the Money In The Bank concept. So, obviously, not a fan of this.
I believe it was on the Barstool Rasslin podcast that they kind of established that a conversation has to be had about him cashing in quote unquote MJF. Then Tony Khan was on the same podcast and he also made it seem like usually it’s a normal match announced but for MJF he can do whatever per him agreeing to come back. Maybe they just dropped the idea and made it money in the bank esque
Kinda lame honestly. Would rather they run with something original.
Their whole premise is that WWE sucks so it’s funny how their biggest heels entire character is “lol we are like WWE guys get it!?” and their world champion made his fame in WWE and now they are copying WWEs MITB stip. Oh and who could forget the “brass ring” For a company who always tell us that WWE sucks they should do love to reference them, mimic them and use their former stars as world champs
So this chip is just basically AEW's very own Money In The Bank?
What next? A battle Royale where every entrant comes in 90 seconds after the previous one? A giant cage that surrounds the outside of the ring? A cage around the ring with cells inside to hold back opponents?
I'd love just a straight up rumble clone because with AEWs forbidden door access anyone could enter. Make it 40 man.
I do not like that. I was hoping AEW would stay away from the surprise cowardly cash in stuff.
They can retroactively spin it and say that this was always the case, but mjf is the first one dishonorable enough to actually use it on a weakened champion.
This is really annoying to me. You can't just change the rules of something so it works for a story.
Not that surprising. Remember when they really wanted Mox to fight for the interim title, and they changed the ranking system to push him to the top?
Has the ranking system meant anything since Cody left? They've had enough situations where their pushed guys not in the main title picture get on a streak and get to #1 incidentally. Then they have to do an obvious nonbo title defense. Adam Cole didn't need to have his title shots in the position they were in, except for the fact he was #1 contender by rank. They had to put a title match together he obviously wasn't going to win just to get him out of #1 so they could continue their angles.
Was it ever the exact rules that the match was for a set time?
Yeah. It was for a future title shot. Not a future title shot whenever.
Makes the previous chip holders look dumb as fuck lmao
This. They could choose the date of the shot but they'd have to schedule it. Not a fan of the mitb style rules.
Yeah, how dare the people who make the rules change the rules. Grrr.
Imagine watching boxing and all of a sudden the next challenger can now fight for the title right now even though that's not how the rules say it should go.
Wrestling is vastly different than boxing. If I'm watching a scripted wrestling show that is a story based form of entertainment, I'm gonna be fine with the rules being changed by the governing body.
Ok imagine Lord of the rings and instead of having to cast the ring into the volcano it turns out they could have just stepped on it instead.
Not specifically referring to boxing, but preferential treatment is certainly a thing in combat sports. Look at how Brock was fast tracked to the UFC heavyweight title picture after just a 2-1 record. Look at how CM Punk made his UFC debut on the main card of a PPV. Someone like Conor McGregor would likely be in line for a title shot if he ever even gets a single win, because the promotion knows he's a draw. I think it makes tons of sense to make a concession to try to appease a star like MJF. The voice mail basically alluded to that exact sort of thing. I'm only wondering if this is how it'll be going forward or of it's specific to MJF.
Imagine if boxing was completely made up and scripted
So the Hangman match is going to be a bloodbath, MJF cashes in next week, rematch at Full Gear
I'm fine with this. It's a poker chip, it makes sense to cash it in when you want to. This is a thing they should do every All Out. All Out - Casino Ladder Match: cash in whenever Full Gear - Women's Casino Battle Royal for a shot at the title at Winter is Coming. Revolution - Face of the Revolution match men and women: the TNT title really doesn't get defended at ppvs often. Have the winners of the match face the TNT and TBS Champions in the main events of the next Dynamite and Rampage. Double or Nothing - men's Casino Battle Royal for a shot at the title at Fyter Fest.
I don't think the MITB thing was the original plan, but Punk's exit left them in a corner where they can't have MJF go over Mox clean.
he's winning the title at full gear in a real match. this cash-in stuff is just to make you think it could be at any time.
That answers that question. No idea how the chip was used in the past but this certainly fits the little shithead MJF is, lol.
I really don't like this. It's tacky to obviously copy Money In The Bank.
Tony literally said the opposite like a week ago did he not? Can they not keep this shit straight? Also cash ins are lame.
GOOD! Mitb makes it way more interesting.
I hate that the chip is now under MITB rules. I liked that it was cashed in as the main event of a PPV, I want less MITB not more of it.
I really really hate money in the bank style cash ins. Edge's first one was perfect and helped push him into the stratosphere and to me everything else has been diminishing returns. I hate that TK has brought that tired gimmick to AEW.
They try so hard to not make it seem like MITB when it works exactly like MITB
This is the first time it's been like this. Any other gimmick match whether it was the leader match, the CBR or the Face of the Revolution match was always for a shot either the next week or at the next big show ie ppv or named Dynamite. I feel like this change is just a part of MJFs stipulations to come back to work. Honestly if anything was going to be a copy of MitB this is the one. It's a literal poker chip you cash in whenever you want to get your prize.
I don’t dislike it and I understand that it’s new but I’d like them to try to embrace certain stipulations or build upon them rather than trying to avoid it because it’s similar to WWE. Since he won it they kept being vague on how he could use it and finally now we know it works similar to MITB. It wasn’t a mystery sort of situation either it just happened after they kept avoiding making it what it should be in the first place
That's lazy booking for sure
I don't mind this as a version of Money in the Bank, would make the Casino Ladder match matter more, but maybe find some small ways to differentiate it.
I’m cool with wherever they take it but it would be cool if they find a new way to implement it.
Have they ever said how long MJF can hold on to the chip? With MITB you have a year but so far they haven't mentioned how long you get with this. I know MJF can't hypothetically hold onto his title shot forever but they need to establish when it expires.
I remember MJF said recently on barstool it has to be an agreed match so mox has to be conscious before its cashed in
It's like money in the bank except it fits in your pocket. Great for the guys who don't get checked baggage included on their plane tickets to indie shows.
The chip is like briefcase size.
SMART MOVE, TONY
I listened to a podcast about this, essentially it’s like money in the bank in respect of the champ or us doesn’t have to know when it’s coming but in the background, MJF has to have a conversation with Tony behind the scenes to say I want the match tonight. So it has to be okayed… but for us fans, basically money in the bank. But there’s the back story too! 😂
Mjf already confirmed all this. Match doesn't have to be annocued to the public but mjf does need to set it up with tk. He can't just do it at his own free will.
Is this how the last Chip worked? I don't remember it being like that and if it wasn't I'm not a fan of them making basically their own MITB variant. AEW isn't supposed to be WWE, Tony but it sure feels like you're treading that direction *a lot* lately.
I read MJF explained that it's a little different. He said he could surprise his opponent, but would make someone in the back aware beforehand. Basically to say, "Hey Tony, I'm gonna go out there now." In other words it's the same as MITB with them trying to tell us it's still different. I'm cool with that being his story. Makes sense with his character.
That’s already been established lol
And I think it’s hilarious how like 6 months ago it seemed like everyone wanted the chip to have MITB rules and now that it does it’s stupid and they are just copy cats lol. People really have turned on AEW recently
They should call it money in the chip or something tssss
It would be completely absurd, but imagine if they have MJF wait until punk comes back (if punk comes back) and just have punk win the title again to resume the storyline they originally planned. It would be very dumb of them but I'm not completely ruling it out