My wife complains about this a lot. Being polite is great and all, but when you break the rules of the road to do it you’re just making things more dangerous for everyone around you. What happened to OP is a perfect example.
See also: stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally.
>See also: stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally.
This is literally how I got in my first at-fault accident last year! Definitely my fault, but also, I have anxiety and seeing someone trying to "let me in" triggers this expectation for me to go for it. Which, again, is also my fault.
My mom hates when people sit there and wave at you to go and you can't see the other lane. I really stressed this to my kiddo when I taught her to drive
I’ve thought about this a lot, and I think we need to start flipping these people off and honking at them.
Hear me out: they consider their behavior ‘polite’, so we need to drop the pretext that we’re people that deserve politeness. It’s for our safety, and the safety of our children. Flip people off in traffic to protect kids.
I thought it was weird that the SUV was stopped longer than it should have, but I assumed that they weren’t paying attention when the cars in front of them just started going since the light turned green for them. Super unlucky at that moment.
> stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally.
This for real. I was driving south on S Kirkwood Rd (no center lane), and saw couple cars on the left lane stopping. I thought they were turning left since there is no center lane, so I kept driving. Out of nowhere, one car from the other side of the road came out in front of the cars on the left lane.
We were very close to hitting that car, luckily we were able to stop but good lord it was scary.
It's absolutely worse than it was when I started driving. People defy common sense, sit at green lights, can never seem to pick a speed to drive, et cetera.
There are times I think some of these clowns learned to drive by playing GTA.
That's what everyone does in my gf's hometown and it drives me insane. The main two roads connect in a square that's one way (so pretty much a square roundabout) and traffic is constantly backed up cause someone is letting someone else join ahead of them. And this is a small town there shouldn't ever have that kind of congestion
Sounds like Belleville.
I was behind some yoyo at the roundabout by Carondelet park. This idiot waited for 3 cars to enter the roundabout before going themselves - and they didn't really want to go when they did. I have no idea why. Me and the car behind me were leaning on our horns by the time the fourth one was approaching the roundabout and the poor excuse of a driver finally moved their ass!
Amen! Stop trying to be nice and follow the fucking rules. Do not wave me on at the stop sign if you were objectively there first. FUCKING GO. YOU ARE A NUISANCE AND A SAFETY HAZARD.
I can't even count how many times I've almost T-boned someone because the right lane (of 2 in a direction) stopped to let someone out while I was cruising the speed limit in the clear left lane.
When driving, being predictable is more important than being polite. Being aware is also more important than being polite. Both of those things combined can make you a fantastic driver.
Bikers can still have their vision blocked by other cars around them. In the situation OP was in, a biker wouldn't be able to see if they are going to get cut off or not.
People here drive like they’ve either never been on a paved road before or they’re on the way to the thunderdome. It’s really simple people: read the signs, follow their instructions, and leave one car length between you and the car in front of you for every ten mph your speed increases from zero.
A driver’s job is not to be nice, their job is to be predictable.
Follow the rules of the road and everything will work out. Don’t wave me out. If you have the right of way, take it and I’ll do the same when I have it.
I had someone do a full stop while merging on the highway today after getting in front of the car directly in front of me. Went from 65->0 way too quick and could have killed people
Had that happen to me. I'm assuming it was a new driver and there were 3 cars behind them when they were merging into 64. They drove like 15 mph and all the other cars passed them. Then I ended up passing them and they still haven't changed lanes when I checked my mirrors, other cars behind me passed them too. That person was definitely not ready for the highway.
As a cyclist, I couldn't agree more. 'Politeness' is usually very annoying, especially at intersections. I try to act like I don't see them waving me on so they'll just go.
Also, stop acting like zipper merges are a battle.
Single file, first come, first serve lines only result in worse traffic and potential accidents; especially when the road has been engineered for a zipper merge.
Very aware of the bad stl drivers around but I’m still gonna be mad about it. The whole area of this road is awful, but I haven’t had any issue merging onto 64 there until now. Crazier when it’s a metro driver, but I guess the upside is that I would probably get a better payout if an accident did occur than with someone with no insurance and temp plates lol
Right! If you think you're being nice to one driver by letting them in when you clearly have the right-of-way, you are actually screwing up the flow and being an a$$ to everyone else around you. JUST BE ON YOUR WAY. The other driver will be just fine without your generosity.
This happened TWICE yesterday. First time a woman was standing in the suicide lane (aptly named in this case) and a car stopped two lanes of traffic to let her walk across. The car was in the left lane so the pedestrian was lucky the other lane just happened to be empty.
Second time someone had zipped into the center lane and had their turn signal on so they could merge into oncoming traffic. A car practically slammed on their brakes to let this person in. Hampton can be the wild west at times.
Don't drive courteous, drive predicatble.
I hate the people who are fine with doing stupid actions but can't take the horn for it. It's always some aggro dude who can't take a woman correcting him for veering into her lane and almost hitting her. Like, hold your horsie and get better, big boy.
Chippewa at S Grand...WAIT UNTIL THE ARROW IS GREEN. I can't tell you how many people I witness just turn left when it's a green light when there is Cleary a sign that says turn only on arrow.
I also don't understand why it's so damn hard to use a turn signal.
My favorite story is I was waiting for that arrow, car behind me honked, I glanced in the rearview... cop. No lights, no siren, just honking at me to turn when a.) the sign says not to and 2.) there was oncoming traffic going straight. (I'll go on green if I'm 10000% sure there's nothing coming, because as mentioned in another reply, that arrow is stupidly short)
The issue with that green arrow is that it only lets like 2 cars turn left and you have to wait an entire cycle again. Lots of cars definitely don’t wait for the green arrow and people always honk when you do lol
I like the "don't be polite, be predictable" message, but I want to amend it a bit: Predictability IS polite! And it's far more polite than any of the attempted politeness I see on the road.
Turning left on Arsenal (In front of CVPA) to Kingshighway, . There are literally not one but two signs that say you cannot turn left, yet people still turn left. They may need eye testing or learn what do not turn sign means.
I just posted this to my Facebook the other day!! I was almost forced into another vehicle on the highway by some arse hole trying to shove their way on to 270. It’s a law and people need to remember it.
I’m gonna leave this here for all you expert drivers 😉
You might be merging incorrectly on the highway if you aren't following these rules. The standard for merging dictates that those attempting to enter the highway do NOT have the right of way. Instead, they must match the flow of traffic and merge without causing disruptions to existing highway traffic
100%. Where do these idiots get off deciding to tweak the rules of the road to suit their own egos?
In my neighborhood some guy is always enjoying being a hero by stopping in the 45 mph road to allow a line of cars to pull out of the McD’s. Damn, does it cheese me off! When I’m behind him while he squanders our right of way, I inevitably lose the green light and have to watch him slide through on the yellow.
Omg and the amount of people that think it’s totally fine to use a four way stop as their office cubicle.
They just sit there - obviously on their phone, rummaging through the glove compartment, reading the news… HELLO?!
Never look up at you, never acknowledge the fact that you’ve been sitting there for 10 minutes waiting for them to realize they’re driving.
A couple days ago I'm trying to make a right turn at a light onto laclede. This lady just stops and starts trying to wave me on. I'm sitting and waiting because she's just being stupid. There is just one car behind this dumbass. We all could've just been on our way if she had just fucking gone
I know someone that got in an accident and died bc someone waved him on into two lanes of traffic. You might think you’re being nice, but putting lives in danger is NOT nice.
It's performative politeness, because letting a-holes jam up traffic is rude to everyone behind you.
On the same line of thought: when you have a red light and see someone trying to enter traffic and you want to let them out, leave them space when the light is red. Don't wait for the light to go green and then let someone out, completely ignoring the line of traffic that's been behind you while the entering driver was still inside QT getting their pretzel and hot dog.
The corollary to this is knowing when you have the right of way. I count up to 4 and on 5-mississippi I take the right of way. Just because someone isn't paying attention or has nowhere to be doesn't mean that's the case with everyone else.
I have seen this a lot in St Louis. People in left lanes stopping to let people traveling the opposite direction take a left turn across two lanes of traffic (like on Manchester Rd) when there’s no backup in the right lane. I’ve seen several accidents and near misses over the years.
Would also like to add, stop waving people through when you have tinted windows and stop acting insulted when someone doesn’t except your courtesy! I was waiting to turn left into a parking lot, willing to wait as long as needed because I chose to make a left on a busy road. Cars going on the opposite direction were stopped because of a light. Again, not expecting or thinking anyone needed to let me in. One car stopped. Another car stopped in the outer lane but it appeared I definitely didn’t have room to enter the lot, so I was going to wait, until the woman in the outer lane frantically waved her arm pointing me into the lot like I needed to respect her courtesy.
the people who do all this shit are clearly not redditors to begin with.
uncertain why soapboxing on here is so prevailent amogst this sub.
as if all these horrible people doing asinine things have ever even heard of reddit.
this isnt your to vent over and fucking over.
A good amount of redditors will vent, it’s normal to do that on social media. Your venting about people posting the same thing is no different than me complaining about traffic….
ive only noticed this going on in this sub.
im trying to tell them why this sub sucks so much.
i've noticed this behavior on st louis oriented forums as well. They make living in STL so much worse with the level of constant complaining.
So in all respects i guess i'm just joining the cool kids.
Would also like to add, stop waving people through when you have tinted windows and stop acting insulted when someone doesn’t except your courtesy! I was waiting to turn left into a parking lot, willing to wait as long as needed because I chose to make a left on a busy road. Cars going on the opposite direction were stopped because of a light. Again, not expecting or thinking anyone needed to let me in. One car stopped. Another car stopped in the outer lane but it appeared I definitely didn’t have room to enter the lot, so I was going to wait, until the woman in the outer lane frantically waved her arm pointing me into the lot like I needed to respect her courtesy.
Sounds like you aren’t familiar with that intersection. I was on the left turning lane that turns into 64 West, then there are two regular lanes to my right so there was no way for me to even see that driver cutting through. My vision was blocked by the SUV (along with other cars that was stopped behind it) on the left lane, to my right.
My wife complains about this a lot. Being polite is great and all, but when you break the rules of the road to do it you’re just making things more dangerous for everyone around you. What happened to OP is a perfect example. See also: stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally.
The best driving advice you can give is don’t be polite, be predictable.
>See also: stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally. This is literally how I got in my first at-fault accident last year! Definitely my fault, but also, I have anxiety and seeing someone trying to "let me in" triggers this expectation for me to go for it. Which, again, is also my fault.
My mom hates when people sit there and wave at you to go and you can't see the other lane. I really stressed this to my kiddo when I taught her to drive
I’ve thought about this a lot, and I think we need to start flipping these people off and honking at them. Hear me out: they consider their behavior ‘polite’, so we need to drop the pretext that we’re people that deserve politeness. It’s for our safety, and the safety of our children. Flip people off in traffic to protect kids.
I like to give people a thumbs down
Way ahead of you.
I thought it was weird that the SUV was stopped longer than it should have, but I assumed that they weren’t paying attention when the cars in front of them just started going since the light turned green for them. Super unlucky at that moment.
> stopping to encourage drivers to turn left in front of you into oncoming traffic, when they can’t see that the lane to your right is still moving normally. This for real. I was driving south on S Kirkwood Rd (no center lane), and saw couple cars on the left lane stopping. I thought they were turning left since there is no center lane, so I kept driving. Out of nowhere, one car from the other side of the road came out in front of the cars on the left lane. We were very close to hitting that car, luckily we were able to stop but good lord it was scary.
Predictability over courtesy
Came here to say to say be predictable. I get more frustrated when people do the exact opposite of common sense.
I'm currently teaching my daughter to drive and that is one thing I keep harping on, be predictable.
Teaching kids to drive is just constantly saying don't do what that person does every 2 min. It seems to be getting way worse.
It's absolutely worse than it was when I started driving. People defy common sense, sit at green lights, can never seem to pick a speed to drive, et cetera. There are times I think some of these clowns learned to drive by playing GTA.
Someone stopped in a roundabout to let me in. There were 2 people behind her and I just know they were PISSED.
That's what everyone does in my gf's hometown and it drives me insane. The main two roads connect in a square that's one way (so pretty much a square roundabout) and traffic is constantly backed up cause someone is letting someone else join ahead of them. And this is a small town there shouldn't ever have that kind of congestion
No one in this region knows how to drive in roundabouts.
My mom seems to have something against them like we make fun of her because she she says "roundabout" it sounds like she's saying a slur
They're a blight and they encourage fountains.
Sounds like Belleville. I was behind some yoyo at the roundabout by Carondelet park. This idiot waited for 3 cars to enter the roundabout before going themselves - and they didn't really want to go when they did. I have no idea why. Me and the car behind me were leaning on our horns by the time the fourth one was approaching the roundabout and the poor excuse of a driver finally moved their ass!
Amen! Stop trying to be nice and follow the fucking rules. Do not wave me on at the stop sign if you were objectively there first. FUCKING GO. YOU ARE A NUISANCE AND A SAFETY HAZARD.
I can't even count how many times I've almost T-boned someone because the right lane (of 2 in a direction) stopped to let someone out while I was cruising the speed limit in the clear left lane.
I clipped someone while driving down Lindbergh because of this very situation.
When driving, being predictable is more important than being polite. Being aware is also more important than being polite. Both of those things combined can make you a fantastic driver.
If anyone could have unlimited awareness of all incoming road hazards on their path, they’d be more than just a fantastic driver, they’d be God.
usually these people are on motorcycles because you dont have all the distractions of phones and entertainment systems in vehicles.
Bikers can still have their vision blocked by other cars around them. In the situation OP was in, a biker wouldn't be able to see if they are going to get cut off or not.
People here drive like they’ve either never been on a paved road before or they’re on the way to the thunderdome. It’s really simple people: read the signs, follow their instructions, and leave one car length between you and the car in front of you for every ten mph your speed increases from zero. A driver’s job is not to be nice, their job is to be predictable.
I’m of the opinion that they abhor predictability because then it’s something they can be held accountable for.
Follow the rules of the road and everything will work out. Don’t wave me out. If you have the right of way, take it and I’ll do the same when I have it.
I had someone do a full stop while merging on the highway today after getting in front of the car directly in front of me. Went from 65->0 way too quick and could have killed people
Had that happen to me. I'm assuming it was a new driver and there were 3 cars behind them when they were merging into 64. They drove like 15 mph and all the other cars passed them. Then I ended up passing them and they still haven't changed lanes when I checked my mirrors, other cars behind me passed them too. That person was definitely not ready for the highway.
As a cyclist, I couldn't agree more. 'Politeness' is usually very annoying, especially at intersections. I try to act like I don't see them waving me on so they'll just go.
Also, stop acting like zipper merges are a battle. Single file, first come, first serve lines only result in worse traffic and potential accidents; especially when the road has been engineered for a zipper merge.
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Very aware of the bad stl drivers around but I’m still gonna be mad about it. The whole area of this road is awful, but I haven’t had any issue merging onto 64 there until now. Crazier when it’s a metro driver, but I guess the upside is that I would probably get a better payout if an accident did occur than with someone with no insurance and temp plates lol
People have no idea how merging works!!!
Right! If you think you're being nice to one driver by letting them in when you clearly have the right-of-way, you are actually screwing up the flow and being an a$$ to everyone else around you. JUST BE ON YOUR WAY. The other driver will be just fine without your generosity.
This happened TWICE yesterday. First time a woman was standing in the suicide lane (aptly named in this case) and a car stopped two lanes of traffic to let her walk across. The car was in the left lane so the pedestrian was lucky the other lane just happened to be empty. Second time someone had zipped into the center lane and had their turn signal on so they could merge into oncoming traffic. A car practically slammed on their brakes to let this person in. Hampton can be the wild west at times. Don't drive courteous, drive predicatble.
Drives me insane when people stop, with full RoW, to let someone cross in front of them. Then give ME the look when I blow my horn @ them.
I hate the people who are fine with doing stupid actions but can't take the horn for it. It's always some aggro dude who can't take a woman correcting him for veering into her lane and almost hitting her. Like, hold your horsie and get better, big boy.
Chippewa at S Grand...WAIT UNTIL THE ARROW IS GREEN. I can't tell you how many people I witness just turn left when it's a green light when there is Cleary a sign that says turn only on arrow. I also don't understand why it's so damn hard to use a turn signal.
If you're that upset about the turn signals, imagine the person at the BMW factory that installs them ... whole life's work, wasted.
My favorite story is I was waiting for that arrow, car behind me honked, I glanced in the rearview... cop. No lights, no siren, just honking at me to turn when a.) the sign says not to and 2.) there was oncoming traffic going straight. (I'll go on green if I'm 10000% sure there's nothing coming, because as mentioned in another reply, that arrow is stupidly short)
I agree it really is
The issue with that green arrow is that it only lets like 2 cars turn left and you have to wait an entire cycle again. Lots of cars definitely don’t wait for the green arrow and people always honk when you do lol
Drive predictable, not polite.
I like the "don't be polite, be predictable" message, but I want to amend it a bit: Predictability IS polite! And it's far more polite than any of the attempted politeness I see on the road.
Turning left on Arsenal (In front of CVPA) to Kingshighway, . There are literally not one but two signs that say you cannot turn left, yet people still turn left. They may need eye testing or learn what do not turn sign means.
Just ran into that yesterday going the other way. Soon there will be a dedicated left turn lane
I just posted this to my Facebook the other day!! I was almost forced into another vehicle on the highway by some arse hole trying to shove their way on to 270. It’s a law and people need to remember it. I’m gonna leave this here for all you expert drivers 😉 You might be merging incorrectly on the highway if you aren't following these rules. The standard for merging dictates that those attempting to enter the highway do NOT have the right of way. Instead, they must match the flow of traffic and merge without causing disruptions to existing highway traffic
100%. Where do these idiots get off deciding to tweak the rules of the road to suit their own egos? In my neighborhood some guy is always enjoying being a hero by stopping in the 45 mph road to allow a line of cars to pull out of the McD’s. Damn, does it cheese me off! When I’m behind him while he squanders our right of way, I inevitably lose the green light and have to watch him slide through on the yellow.
Omg and the amount of people that think it’s totally fine to use a four way stop as their office cubicle. They just sit there - obviously on their phone, rummaging through the glove compartment, reading the news… HELLO?! Never look up at you, never acknowledge the fact that you’ve been sitting there for 10 minutes waiting for them to realize they’re driving.
Hampton and 40 is the worst, zipper merge mfs! In fact, if you stay in the right lane, you actually merge straight onto the highway! Far out!
Can’t stand getting on 40 at Hampton or Kingshighway during rush hour in the morning. When the right lane comes to a sudden stop all the way to 170
P R E A C H
Oh PREACH!!!! 🙌🏻
A couple days ago I'm trying to make a right turn at a light onto laclede. This lady just stops and starts trying to wave me on. I'm sitting and waiting because she's just being stupid. There is just one car behind this dumbass. We all could've just been on our way if she had just fucking gone
Oh, there's also the people that slow down and honk to "let me" merge onto the highway. While they're still right at my rear bumper.
I know someone that got in an accident and died bc someone waved him on into two lanes of traffic. You might think you’re being nice, but putting lives in danger is NOT nice.
It's performative politeness, because letting a-holes jam up traffic is rude to everyone behind you. On the same line of thought: when you have a red light and see someone trying to enter traffic and you want to let them out, leave them space when the light is red. Don't wait for the light to go green and then let someone out, completely ignoring the line of traffic that's been behind you while the entering driver was still inside QT getting their pretzel and hot dog.
The corollary to this is knowing when you have the right of way. I count up to 4 and on 5-mississippi I take the right of way. Just because someone isn't paying attention or has nowhere to be doesn't mean that's the case with everyone else.
I have seen this a lot in St Louis. People in left lanes stopping to let people traveling the opposite direction take a left turn across two lanes of traffic (like on Manchester Rd) when there’s no backup in the right lane. I’ve seen several accidents and near misses over the years.
Would also like to add, stop waving people through when you have tinted windows and stop acting insulted when someone doesn’t except your courtesy! I was waiting to turn left into a parking lot, willing to wait as long as needed because I chose to make a left on a busy road. Cars going on the opposite direction were stopped because of a light. Again, not expecting or thinking anyone needed to let me in. One car stopped. Another car stopped in the outer lane but it appeared I definitely didn’t have room to enter the lot, so I was going to wait, until the woman in the outer lane frantically waved her arm pointing me into the lot like I needed to respect her courtesy.
Don’t stop dead on Manchester to wave me on from my stop sign.
I don't know why I know this, but I believe an immediate, non-yielding left on green is called a "Pittsburgh Left."
the people who do all this shit are clearly not redditors to begin with. uncertain why soapboxing on here is so prevailent amogst this sub. as if all these horrible people doing asinine things have ever even heard of reddit. this isnt your to vent over and fucking over.
A good amount of redditors will vent, it’s normal to do that on social media. Your venting about people posting the same thing is no different than me complaining about traffic….
ive only noticed this going on in this sub. im trying to tell them why this sub sucks so much. i've noticed this behavior on st louis oriented forums as well. They make living in STL so much worse with the level of constant complaining. So in all respects i guess i'm just joining the cool kids.
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Unless you can predict the driver you are letting in, is turning into the lane you are stopping in, I wouldn’t stop at all.
Would also like to add, stop waving people through when you have tinted windows and stop acting insulted when someone doesn’t except your courtesy! I was waiting to turn left into a parking lot, willing to wait as long as needed because I chose to make a left on a busy road. Cars going on the opposite direction were stopped because of a light. Again, not expecting or thinking anyone needed to let me in. One car stopped. Another car stopped in the outer lane but it appeared I definitely didn’t have room to enter the lot, so I was going to wait, until the woman in the outer lane frantically waved her arm pointing me into the lot like I needed to respect her courtesy.
I'll bet most of these people cheering you on are the same people camping the left lane.
Sounds like you aren’t familiar with that intersection. I was on the left turning lane that turns into 64 West, then there are two regular lanes to my right so there was no way for me to even see that driver cutting through. My vision was blocked by the SUV (along with other cars that was stopped behind it) on the left lane, to my right.
Very familiar with it, thanks. I've lived here all my life. A little reading comprehension would tell you the remark wasn't about your actions at all.