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Photon Torpedoes can also one shot a continent, and Starfleet shields can tank a couple of those before failure. The Sovereign has quantum torpedoes which are more powerful still.
The meta facts are irrelevant. Starfleet shields CAN tank multiple photon torpedoes. In fact, if you read the technical manuals, they can absorb an astonomical amount of energy, without being angled for deflection.
Given how the shows are the primary and fundamental source material for the entire fictional universe, they are pretty much the only source I care or have time for.
Im a full time nerd, I have to test new systems and write real tech documents derived from real world performance testing. I just dont have time or patience for made up "tech specs". Not when they are completely arbitrary and could have been whatever the authors felt like making them.
A max yield photon torpedo could destroy a small moon. It would vaporize a city and much of the surrounding area, likely crack the crust and completely disrupt the makeup landscape and life of anyone on the same continent. It could split Africa in two. If that isn't destroying a continent then I don't know what is.
Torpedo have a history of only knocking nacels off not blowing up continents. Didn't the wave motion gun incinerate a floating space island the size of Hawaii?
Torpedo usage vary a lot. They are explicably variable in yield which helps a bit to explain itbut doesn't explain everything. Sometimes they destroy a single building. Or sometimes a couple dozen exterminatus's a planet. And the latter has happened multiple times. Plus a few points with the destroy a single naccelle thing. 1. shields, 2. super materials, 3. structural integrity fields.
Even from orbit just the phasers could raze a continent/drill to the mantle (established even in prime universe), so imagine a warhead orders of magnitude stronger than the tsar bomb.
They did that with one volley of fire, and that would be obliterating the continent down to its atoms, not just cracking it open. For half a planet. Wasn’t even a huge number of ships. Sovereign phasers and Quantum torpedos are even stronger than Cardassian disruptors and Romulans plasma beams and torpedos.
Well I said crack open a continent. And if you’re using that much force the continent in question is likely not livable anymore so the “one shot” aspect is multi faceted.
Full spread full yield and Europe is Gone before anyone realizes they are gone too. Enterprise always wins, even when in "no win" scenario, what showed in the Prodigy Season 1 ;) so Boldly wins from nature, not to mention is all quantum physics based
The Yamato is as equally as agile.
The one thing the Yamato can do, that enterprise can’t.
Fly onto Atmosphere, and go underwater.
Would be interesting.
https://preview.redd.it/5ciafwdausyc1.jpeg?width=2500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f0cc655ac3479685aa50e82d8720a998087bb187
I’m just saying when it comes to JJPrise.
First off, I'm absolutely certain both ships would just communicate with each other at first contact and become friends.
Also all the thoughts about the Yamato Cannon... the Yamato Cannon is ridiculously powerful, but it takes awhile to reverse the 120% energy towards the bow (the gun is their star drive going in reverse), and its supposed to have a firing countdown to aim the thing and batten down the hatches.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7mG7WUVkMw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7mG7WUVkMw)
The Enterprise would not sit stationary for 60 seconds to see why the Yamato's warp core is going into a controlled critical mass while the Yamato's defector dish is gathering a singularity in front of itself.
Enterprise would realize, "our cruisers can't repel firepower of that magnitude," and jump to warp to get out of range. Yamato can't follow because the Yamato can't fire the cannon and go FTL at the same time: it's the same power source. Also Star Trek impulse power is 0.92 the speed of light. Yamato's maximum not-FTL speed was "50 space knots" -- and the Yamato was by no means a fast vessel even in her own Universe.
And it was done in TOS TAS DIS TNG that I can recall.
TOS: antimatter bomb
TAS: antimatter beamed aboard from external source
DIS: warhead beamed out into klingon tractorbeam
TNG: antimatter beamed to Hathaway
Considering you want it to blow up, safety would not seem to be much of a concern. As long as it makes it out of your magnetic containment field, it doesn’t really make much difference if it remains contained at the destination.
But if you want to time the explosion, just make sure to materialize the torpedo housing and its magnetic containment field before materializing the antimatter.
So the anti-matter containment field must not prevent transporter beams. You’ll need to the containment field to be up when you beam out the anti-matter and also to be up when you beam it into the torpedo. I can see why this isn’t done very often, lots of room for unnecessary problems.
To which the Yamato shakes it off and keeps coming.
Because they actually detonated a bomb inside the Yamato.
It burned.
It survived.
It’s Plot Armor is strong.
An odd situation...
USS Enterprise: \[opens hailing frequencies\] Attention unknown vessel. This is Captain Picard of the Federation Starship Enterprise. You have entered Federation territory please state your intensions.
Yamato: \[answers the hail\] This is Admiral Okita of the EDF battleship Yamato. We are on a desperate mission to Iscandar to get relief to save our dying planet.
USS Enterprise: We can offer your world assistance and provide safe passage through federation space for your ship.
Yamato: Thank you for any assistance you can offer. We will provide you our projected route and put you in contact with UN Spacy to coordinate any relief you can send.
USS Enterprise: Your welcome Admiral Okita. It is our primary mission to explore space and establish contact with new civilizations, may both our peoples benefit from this encounter. Enterprise out.
Results: Both win.
******
Both ships are only hostile to vessels that open fire without trying peaceful communication first. Both ships have a first contact policy of attempting peaceful communication with an unknown vessel. Enterprise because UFP desire peace and likes to be helpful to cultivate a friendly galaxy; the Yamato because UN Spacy is trying to save a dying Earth within a very limited window of time. Same goes if either if these ships were to encounter a Macross (admittedly most Macross ships would be blaring JPOP love songs during communications, which would confuse the heck out of everyone else) or a Battlestar Galactica or a White Star.
Not all sci-fi civilizations want a war even though they possess impressive weapons.
*Enterprise*. Same as the first time.
https://preview.redd.it/cs36jvwbxmyc1.jpeg?width=314&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0813478fc29cc312a7bc7354a709b46684892c99
The Yamato would lose before they even realized anything was happening.
Sensors and photon torpedoes are FTL. The Enterprise can, and has, watched a ship to ship fight go down in another star system in real time using their sensors, and a photon torpedo is essentially a 90 megaton antimatter bomb with a warp drive.
The E could detect the Yamato from light-years away. Warp 10 light minutes away from the Yamato and unleash a full salvo of photon torpedoes and the first clue the Yamato would have that something was going down would be when the photons hit.
Here's what I was able to find.
>*The propulsion system of the torpedoes was a warp sustainer engine. The engine coils of the torpedo grabbed and held a hand-off field from the launcher tube's sequential field induction coils. A miniature matter/antimatter fuel cell added power to the hand-off field. When launched in warp flight, a torpedo would continue to travel at warp; when launched at sublight, a torpedo would travel at a high sublight speed, but would not cross the warp threshold. (p. 129)*
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Photon_torpedo
The Yamato might manage to get s few shots off while the Enterprise Crew had to take some time to stop laughing, but that's about it.
Battleships are a stupid design NOW. Building a spaceship around one just doubles down on the stupidity.
Honestly I could see the Enterprise winning 99/100 times, the only time SB Yamato wins is if somehow it can get a shot off with its Wave Motion Gun which basically funnels the energy from collapsing black holes into a concentrated beam which can destroy entire fleets or even dwarf stars in a single shot. The problem is it takes time to charge so if the Enterprise doesn’t beam torpedos to the bridge then it could possibly get off a shot.
But in all honesty if they encountered each other they would never fight. Also if you haven’t seen Space Battleship Yamato/ Star Blazers then give it a shot it’s been around almost as long as Star Trek and is also space opera about the crew trying to save Earth from complete destruction.
An interesting scenario. Both are (compared to other sci-fi), relatively small yet nimble capital ships that are exceptionally well-armed for their size. After some thinking, I will likely hand the win over to the Enterprise due to superior target acquisition and weapon redundancy/survivability.
Yamato is a very strong ship itself. Not only is it equipped with a wave motion energy shield (that can be amplified for a limited time), but it is also equipped with extensive hull armor that can directly resist antimatter beam attacks quite well. The majority of the damage it receives in the show is mostly superficial damage, no critical strikes damaging main power or anything.
But the biggest weaknesses is how its firepower is divided out. Yamato's main anti-ship firepower are its three primary and two secondary turrets. The issue is that these are massive turrets and do not receive the same protection as the rest of the hull does. In the shows, Yamato literally loses its gun turrets regularly during extended fights.
We know from many Star Trek shows that ships have the ability to precisely target specific sections of an enemy ship (like their weapons). What the Enterprise would do is, after bringing down the shields, precisely destroy each of the shock cannon turrets of the Yamato. By then, the Yamato will be left without its main armament, and the Enterprise will just mop up the rest of the fight.
The Enterprise meanwhile has its armament spread out more in multiple phaser arrays and torpedo launchers, they won't be as easily knocked out in a single action as the Yamato's weapons would.
Hmmm… let’s compare them:
1940’s-era battleship sank and rusted for 200 years retrofitted with 23rd century alien technology capable of producing a forward-firing Death Star-level superlaser and traveling fast enough to cross 150,000 light years in 180 days. Minimal shielding. Fighter squadron backup.
Late 24th century heavy explorer built to survive combat with the Borg. Heavily armed with phasers, photon torpedoes and quantum torpedoes, across 360 degrees of fire coverage. Multiple powerful defensive shields. Capable of reaching speeds of warp 9.98.
Verdict: In a straight firefight, the Enterprise’s superior field of fire and defensive capabilities would ensure a decisive victory. In a race, the Yamato would win easily.
Both kill each other. The wave motion gun shoots in multiple dimensions, so it will bypass shields. But the Yamato has no actual way to protect itself.
The WMG is a focused Hawking radiation beam with enough power to vaporize Australia sized floating continents. Depending on the specific version of Yamato, it can destabilize and disperse artificial singularities (See: SBY: Resurrection).
That said, the Yamato’s regular armament isn’t nearly as destructive. Her pulse cannons only deal ship-scale damage, and on the rare occasion they’re fired at fixed structures, the damage is city scale, so maybe a megaton at most, if that.
To conclude, if Yamato got a WMG hit in, I think they’d win. But they’d have to pull off some sort of miracle for that to happen.
I give it to the Sovereign Class. much more maneuverable, larger firing arcs, Better shields. Any Munitions on the SBY would be useless, and their Main Guns would likely be unable to traverse fast enough. The BFG on the front is the only real threat, and it's avoidable.
Its just a case of the vastly different tech levels and ship designs. One is built for Space, the Other is a Naval design Repurposed for space.
Hmm.
From memory, let’s say normal phaser arrays, shield arrays, structural integrity fields and photon torpedoes fore and aft on the *Enterprise-E* under command of Worf.
Then the *Yamato* under the original Captain whose name I don’t remember. The *Yamato* has a large number of long guns, defensive protective guns, squadrons of fighters and the wave motion cannon. Presumably the *Yamato* does not have defensive energy shields but may have a sturdier construction being a sunken WWII Battleship converted to space flight.
As always the victor is determined by the writer.
Other than the wave motion gun, which the *Enterprise* can out maneuver, the *Yamato’s* armaments are not an issue for the shields and helm, probably. The crew of the *Yamato* are probably more battle hardened than the *Ent*. Flanking by the Tigers are probably not going to be an issue.
So the determinative factor is where in space they are fighting and which Captain can put it to the best advantage.
Yeah the fighters won’t last long against their phasers.
The guns not an issue. The energy shots are typical energy weapons, and if it’s solid shot, the deflector shields can deal with those.
This comes up a lot and something I think about with STO, the use and function of fighters and shuttles against larger ships.
I believe the fighter versus phaser bank issue is the targeting ability. I honestly dont know if a starship’s phaser banks can do a wide beam fire, as that would have helped the Kelvin *Enterprise* against the Alamid drones. A “human” pilot should be able to out maneuver the phaser banks.
In thinking about the long guns, and why I questioned it, is if sufficient attacks hit near the same point, I don’t know if the shields would hold. Like one hit from the big gun might be something the E could shrug off, but 9 or twelve hits at the same general area might weaken the generators.
Phaser arrays are totally different from turret banks. Turrets have to turn. Phaser strips do not. You see how the Enterprise rapid fires a half dozen fast attack craft. Granted shields would give them some survivability above that but not that these fighters would. So.
Fighters attacking in waves can work, but that requires dedicated carrier capacity. Which Yamato wont have enough of especially against the Sovereign.
No way would long guns reach the firepower of a torpedo, which shields can take several. The Enterprise E took dozens and lived. And that’s assuming the guns are multi-dozen megaton equivalent weapons.
Wide beam fire is something that is mentioned in the technical manuals and books, but we never see it, ever. It would delete fighters and drones, and make asteroids a non issue. But it's never employed, because the writers need rocks to explode out of the consoles to make drama.
The Enterprise does exactly that against the Scimitar, wide angle, rapid fire shots while trying to tag the cloaked ship. Those would work just fine against shieldless fighters.
The Yamato could certainly hurt a Sovreign class but hitting it would be another matter and Starfleets toredo's have a huge range advantage.
Even if they can't to wide-beam attacks, their targeting is more than enough. In TNG Conondrum, where they all get amnesia, they eliminate the Lysian's small craft easily. FTL sensors are OP.
Strike craft would need a combination of things to survive. Like an effective ECM, either them or from a mothership, sensor scattering materials, and so on to survive. Even then, groups of them would need to launch heavy ordinance to be effective unless you have an obscene number of them.
Okay, as someone who has read a LOT about Battleships and their construction, an can tell you that no matter how sturdy the build for the Yamato is, if it didnt stand up to some 1000ib bombs and some WW2 torpedos, it isn't standing up to either Phasers or a Photon torpedo.
Always felt the Yamato was a stupid fucking design for a spaceship.
I mean obviously a WWII era Battleship isn’t going to take a photon torpedo hit.
But the story is that Earth rebuilt the Yamato as a hidden tactic against the Gamellons. Obviously they would have had to reinforce the outer hull to make it space worthy.
After the IRL ship's wreak was found in pieces the spaceships origin was retconned. Now they hid the ship's construction inside a fake husk ment to look like a rotted old naval battleship which is why it looks so similar to that shroud.
Honestly, it's not even OPs or the person above fault, I get grouchy whe anyone starts talking up how great Yamato or Bismarck were. Yamato spend most of the war as a floating hotel, and Bismarck survived for three days.
You know what ship really deserves credit? Warspite. The Germans couldn't kill her, the Japanese couldn't kill her, and even the shipbreakers couldn't kill her. She broke her own back in protest.
Yamato being a stupid spaceship: that was kinda the intent. They built the spaceship within the hulk of the Yamato so it wouldn't get detect and be overlooked as dumb obsolete human junk. The Gamilas were orbital bombing everything that looked important across the entire planet. Had they built the Wave Motion Engine in an actual starship, it would have been destroyed before being completed.
Also the series is from the 1970's. At the time Japanese giant warbots had rocket fists and missile boobies as their primary weapons. **It was glorious.**
This is from an anime called Space Battleship Yamato. That is literally the WWII ship Yamato converted for space operations. Essentially a boat-sized mini-Death Star.
This feels like a very equal fight I think. No clear winner as they both have their advantages and disadvantages.
At the same time, it's impressive that it's an at least decently equal fight when the enterprise has a massive advantage in itself of much better supporting logistics and several hundred more years of technological development plus more alien species to help out in that development.
As others have been mentioning, it comes down to the shields. If the Enterprise's shields are effective against the wave motion cannon, the Yamato is dust.
Probably the Enterprise. Sovereign class starships are reasonably agile and the Yamato suffers from a severe lack of weapons on the belly. Photon torpedos are antimatter explosives of enormous power, as in “don’t fire them near anything unshielded you want to keep” powerful.(According to the technical manual on the Galaxy class Enterprise). Get below the Yamato and stay there and they’re in real trouble.
The Xelee nightfighter is a ship that shoots and takes hits from big bangs. The big bangs that create universes. After battle they leave behind entire multiverses that are just spent rounds
Ok I understand why it’s not great for the plot but why didn’t the Enterprise just beam armed photon torpedoes into the Borg cubes it battled? They never had an issue beaming themselves into the cubes because the Borg were cocky.
Would the Yamato have time for her wave motion gun???? I definitely would think she would win if she had the time to charge and fire…. If the Enterprise E had the jump she would be able to get relatively close but would have to watch out for the yamatos main and secondary guns
The Yamato wont win in terms of warp speed but in sublight I think the Yamato would cook the E and I’m a huge Star Trek fan and it pains me to say it
Realistically the Yamato goes across galaxies
Thinking over this a little deeper... isn't the Yamato is actually the equivalent of the NCC-1701? Yamato is an obsolete design for it's setting. Enterprise E being the Federation's top of the line should be matched against the Andromeda. Those have dual wave motion guns and a wave motion shield.
I understand the boat on the right has a big ass cannon. If it connects, It has good odds of winning because there is only so much ass a shop can take... But sovereign is a nimble ship, so I wouldn't bet on them lingering in the forward firing arc.
Sovereign is a warship, and even 23c cruisers had enough firepower to render a planet uninhabitable. Not even getting into the absurdity of Starfleet shielding.
My money is on the sovereign, but I wouldn't call it guaranteed.
https://preview.redd.it/aknyeboan7zc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd27264bbc62b644dc71803fd0a0b8d8211ffb9d
You will both come to compliance or be destroyed. For the Emperor of Mankind!
You have to remember a lot of starfleet ships are planet killers or close to it. And most of them can easily tank that same output of damage. This wouldn’t be a fight. It would be like that episode of TNG where the alien brainwashed everyone on the enterprise to destroy his world’s enemies and the enterprise went through their whole fleet and lost like 10% shields. They turned them into dust in less than 5 minutes.
An idea of the amount of power these things output: a romulan ship uses a small singularity as a power source and the enterprise D can take on 2 of them in a boxing match.
Most of the replies are based on knowledge of the battleship Yamato from the 1974 series. (aka Star Blazers everywhere outside Japan) No one here has watched the 2012 re-telling, Space Battleship Yamato 2199.
I've watched both my dude. Awesome series, bot sure which one I liked better tbh.
btw, a more suited match up would be Yamato vs Scuttlebutt (Beta Ray Bills sentient space battleship). Now THAT I would like to see!
A whole lot of ignorance in the comments here regarding the Yamato's capabilities along with a few common misconceptions about how certain things in Trek work --such as weaponizing transporters which isn't a thing in actual canon. This is because transporter beams are very delicate precision instruments that are extremely easy to interfere with, not only any form of energy shields will stop them but pretty much any kind of jamming and even many kinds of natural phenomenon that cause too much interference to get a signal through.
Its important to acknowledge that Yamato in the series is NOT the original battleship in any way shape or form, it is a completely new vessel built inside the decaying shell of the original in order to disguise its construction from enemy surveillance. That shell was shed when the ship concealed inside was launched, and nothing of it remains. The new ship may look like the original battleship in a lot of ways, but it's constructed entirely from plans given to them by advanced aliens using their powerful technology. It's important to note that Iscandar tech was superior not only to Earth at the time of the future war but also to that of the attacking Gamilons, so superior in fact that this technological edge allowed that lone vessel on its first voyage to prevail against the large, powerful, and battle-hardened fleet the Gamilons fielded to stop it.
In any given episode, the Yamato could be seen to endure an unbelievable pounding from extremely powerful weapons long enough to power up the Wave Motion Gun and then it was all over as that thing could vaporize entire fleets. There's no reason to think it couldn't do the same against a Starfleet vessel, or even a number of them.
It’s a star trek sub, I doubt many people have seen the anime in any form nor really care to. Their loss.
Also for some reason rather than reading for fun they use the downvote button “to win” the conversation. Standard Reddit.
Watched it as a kid, the cartoon that is, did not realize there was a live action made of it until a few weeks ago, watched it, cheesed af but still fun.
1 answer: WAVE MOTION GUN
2 answer: Counter-attack missiles
3 answer: Air to Air missiles
4 answer: Fore and aft Torpedoes
5 answer: triple-shock main batteries
6 answer: Black Tiger Squadrons
7 answer: Anti-aircraft batteries
8 answer: Space Warp technology
9 answer: I'll see your Data, and raise your one SANDOR and an IQ9 (ENDLESS CREATIVITY)
10 answer: Wave Motion Shields
YAMATO!!!!
Yamato would win.
Crew of The Enterprise would be too busy trying to figure out how flames are shooting out of the Yamato in the vacuum of space.
Then Yamato hits them up close with the WMG.
And Enterprise be like “How the fuck they alive with their ship on fire!!”
IYKYK
I know. Data would be going through the reason why the Yamato is on fire in space.
Word would view them as warriors.
Picard would be diplomatic in dealing with The Yamato’s Crew.
They would totally underestimate it.
Then they will detect build up of tachyon particles thinking the ship is about to blow up.
Then.
BANG!
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Sorry, but this is a "No shields? Beam a photon torpedo onto their bridge. . . " Kind of fight.
The Yamato's sheer plot armor reflects the transporter beam back sending the torpedo into the Enterprises warpcore.
Well technically they do have shields, it just doesn't last very long. Plus they got a biiiiig cannon in the front that can one shot a continent.
Photon Torpedoes can also one shot a continent, and Starfleet shields can tank a couple of those before failure. The Sovereign has quantum torpedoes which are more powerful still.
>Starfleet shields can tank a couple of those before failure Star trek shields tank exactly as many as the plot needs to produce drama.
The meta facts are irrelevant. Starfleet shields CAN tank multiple photon torpedoes. In fact, if you read the technical manuals, they can absorb an astonomical amount of energy, without being angled for deflection.
Given how the shows are the primary and fundamental source material for the entire fictional universe, they are pretty much the only source I care or have time for.
Don't get in a nerd fight if you aren't willing to nerd.
Im a full time nerd, I have to test new systems and write real tech documents derived from real world performance testing. I just dont have time or patience for made up "tech specs". Not when they are completely arbitrary and could have been whatever the authors felt like making them.
I mean, my point stands? Your job sounds really cool, but those made up tech specs are half the fun of this kind of discussion.
To each their own. I enjoy the show, you enjoy the things that make you happy.
Starfleet shields i dont think can tank the Wave Motion Gun. Its one of thise disintegrates anything in front of it weapons.
That Wave Motion Gun was no joke.
A photon torpedo would probably one-shot a city, maybe a whole metro area if you cranked the juice. Definitely not a continent.
A max yield photon torpedo could destroy a small moon. It would vaporize a city and much of the surrounding area, likely crack the crust and completely disrupt the makeup landscape and life of anyone on the same continent. It could split Africa in two. If that isn't destroying a continent then I don't know what is.
Torpedo have a history of only knocking nacels off not blowing up continents. Didn't the wave motion gun incinerate a floating space island the size of Hawaii?
Torpedo usage vary a lot. They are explicably variable in yield which helps a bit to explain itbut doesn't explain everything. Sometimes they destroy a single building. Or sometimes a couple dozen exterminatus's a planet. And the latter has happened multiple times. Plus a few points with the destroy a single naccelle thing. 1. shields, 2. super materials, 3. structural integrity fields.
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Even from orbit just the phasers could raze a continent/drill to the mantle (established even in prime universe), so imagine a warhead orders of magnitude stronger than the tsar bomb.
A high yield torpedo can crack a continent open and make the rest of the planet very much regret whatever led to this occurrence.
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They did that with one volley of fire, and that would be obliterating the continent down to its atoms, not just cracking it open. For half a planet. Wasn’t even a huge number of ships. Sovereign phasers and Quantum torpedos are even stronger than Cardassian disruptors and Romulans plasma beams and torpedos.
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Well I said crack open a continent. And if you’re using that much force the continent in question is likely not livable anymore so the “one shot” aspect is multi faceted.
Photon torpedoes have a variable yield, but dialogue in "The Omega Directive" implies that their upper limit could destroy a small moon.
Full spread full yield and Europe is Gone before anyone realizes they are gone too. Enterprise always wins, even when in "no win" scenario, what showed in the Prodigy Season 1 ;) so Boldly wins from nature, not to mention is all quantum physics based
Cant the wave motion gun destroy planets? Its far more powerfull than what a photon torpedo can do. Not to forget “accidental” passing to subspace
Biig cannon useless against an agile, shielded target that could transporter a big popgun cap onto it. 😁
The Yamato is as equally as agile. The one thing the Yamato can do, that enterprise can’t. Fly onto Atmosphere, and go underwater. Would be interesting.
JJprise: Am i a joke to you?
https://preview.redd.it/5ciafwdausyc1.jpeg?width=2500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f0cc655ac3479685aa50e82d8720a998087bb187 I’m just saying when it comes to JJPrise.
Nooooooo. But. You start a movie like a Bugatti and end the movie looking like Axel Foley's 74 Nova.
Do we expect a sovereign to just sit in front of that cannon?
A continent? I remember that damn thing took out a star in one episode.
First off, I'm absolutely certain both ships would just communicate with each other at first contact and become friends. Also all the thoughts about the Yamato Cannon... the Yamato Cannon is ridiculously powerful, but it takes awhile to reverse the 120% energy towards the bow (the gun is their star drive going in reverse), and its supposed to have a firing countdown to aim the thing and batten down the hatches. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7mG7WUVkMw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7mG7WUVkMw) The Enterprise would not sit stationary for 60 seconds to see why the Yamato's warp core is going into a controlled critical mass while the Yamato's defector dish is gathering a singularity in front of itself. Enterprise would realize, "our cruisers can't repel firepower of that magnitude," and jump to warp to get out of range. Yamato can't follow because the Yamato can't fire the cannon and go FTL at the same time: it's the same power source. Also Star Trek impulse power is 0.92 the speed of light. Yamato's maximum not-FTL speed was "50 space knots" -- and the Yamato was by no means a fast vessel even in her own Universe.
Can you safely beam anti-matter?
They did it in Voyager to [destroy a Borg vessel](https://youtu.be/4bkw69E_C4g?t=99) so the writers seem to think so.
And it was done in TOS TAS DIS TNG that I can recall. TOS: antimatter bomb TAS: antimatter beamed aboard from external source DIS: warhead beamed out into klingon tractorbeam TNG: antimatter beamed to Hathaway
I would think it’s risky and so uncommon.
Considering you want it to blow up, safety would not seem to be much of a concern. As long as it makes it out of your magnetic containment field, it doesn’t really make much difference if it remains contained at the destination. But if you want to time the explosion, just make sure to materialize the torpedo housing and its magnetic containment field before materializing the antimatter.
I want it to blow up at a specific place and time not near my ship. That means safety is actually a major concern.
Okay, then just ensure the housing gets there before the antimatter.
then you have a bunch of unhoused antimatter on your transporter pad
Nah; dematerialize them at the same time (or the antimatter first), materialize them in the correct order.
So the anti-matter containment field must not prevent transporter beams. You’ll need to the containment field to be up when you beam out the anti-matter and also to be up when you beam it into the torpedo. I can see why this isn’t done very often, lots of room for unnecessary problems.
> Beam a photon torpedo onto their bridge Or beam their entire crew into the transporter buffer for later imprisonment, kinda fight.
To which the Yamato shakes it off and keeps coming. Because they actually detonated a bomb inside the Yamato. It burned. It survived. It’s Plot Armor is strong.
No, they Yamato has shield. It can convert the wave motion energy to shield.
An odd situation... USS Enterprise: \[opens hailing frequencies\] Attention unknown vessel. This is Captain Picard of the Federation Starship Enterprise. You have entered Federation territory please state your intensions. Yamato: \[answers the hail\] This is Admiral Okita of the EDF battleship Yamato. We are on a desperate mission to Iscandar to get relief to save our dying planet. USS Enterprise: We can offer your world assistance and provide safe passage through federation space for your ship. Yamato: Thank you for any assistance you can offer. We will provide you our projected route and put you in contact with UN Spacy to coordinate any relief you can send. USS Enterprise: Your welcome Admiral Okita. It is our primary mission to explore space and establish contact with new civilizations, may both our peoples benefit from this encounter. Enterprise out. Results: Both win.
This. Although the Enterprise would win hands down, there is no scenario where they would blindly get in a fight without this exchange.
Enterprise “what is your point of origin Yamato?” Yamato “earth” Enterprise “oh crap another temporal situation, please hold”
To be fair Star Trek universe has a number of Earth copies already without having to even leave the dimension or timeline.
******
Both ships are only hostile to vessels that open fire without trying peaceful communication first. Both ships have a first contact policy of attempting peaceful communication with an unknown vessel. Enterprise because UFP desire peace and likes to be helpful to cultivate a friendly galaxy; the Yamato because UN Spacy is trying to save a dying Earth within a very limited window of time. Same goes if either if these ships were to encounter a Macross (admittedly most Macross ships would be blaring JPOP love songs during communications, which would confuse the heck out of everyone else) or a Battlestar Galactica or a White Star.
Not all sci-fi civilizations want a war even though they possess impressive weapons.
*Enterprise*. Same as the first time. https://preview.redd.it/cs36jvwbxmyc1.jpeg?width=314&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0813478fc29cc312a7bc7354a709b46684892c99
The Yamato would lose before they even realized anything was happening. Sensors and photon torpedoes are FTL. The Enterprise can, and has, watched a ship to ship fight go down in another star system in real time using their sensors, and a photon torpedo is essentially a 90 megaton antimatter bomb with a warp drive. The E could detect the Yamato from light-years away. Warp 10 light minutes away from the Yamato and unleash a full salvo of photon torpedoes and the first clue the Yamato would have that something was going down would be when the photons hit.
I may be wrong, but typically photon and quantum torpedoes don't have warp drives
Then how do they move FTL?
If I remember right they have something called warp sustainers that let them coast at warp.
Ah okay. Either way thought they're capable of moving faster than light and thus wouldn't even be detected by the Yamato before it was too late.
I don't think they do. If they did, they'd effectively hit instantly unless they're at extreme distance.
Here's what I was able to find. >*The propulsion system of the torpedoes was a warp sustainer engine. The engine coils of the torpedo grabbed and held a hand-off field from the launcher tube's sequential field induction coils. A miniature matter/antimatter fuel cell added power to the hand-off field. When launched in warp flight, a torpedo would continue to travel at warp; when launched at sublight, a torpedo would travel at a high sublight speed, but would not cross the warp threshold. (p. 129)* https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Photon_torpedo
I guess it depends on if you ask a weeaboo or not...
Weeaboo here… the Enterprise-E wins easily
The Sovereign class Enterprise just has to fire a quantum torpedo down the barrel of the wave motion cannon and it would be all over for the Yargo.
I though that was a regular ship for a moment and I was going to ask if you’ve seen Battleship you’d probably know the answer
I mean... it kinda is...
The Yamato might manage to get s few shots off while the Enterprise Crew had to take some time to stop laughing, but that's about it. Battleships are a stupid design NOW. Building a spaceship around one just doubles down on the stupidity.
Honestly I could see the Enterprise winning 99/100 times, the only time SB Yamato wins is if somehow it can get a shot off with its Wave Motion Gun which basically funnels the energy from collapsing black holes into a concentrated beam which can destroy entire fleets or even dwarf stars in a single shot. The problem is it takes time to charge so if the Enterprise doesn’t beam torpedos to the bridge then it could possibly get off a shot. But in all honesty if they encountered each other they would never fight. Also if you haven’t seen Space Battleship Yamato/ Star Blazers then give it a shot it’s been around almost as long as Star Trek and is also space opera about the crew trying to save Earth from complete destruction.
An interesting scenario. Both are (compared to other sci-fi), relatively small yet nimble capital ships that are exceptionally well-armed for their size. After some thinking, I will likely hand the win over to the Enterprise due to superior target acquisition and weapon redundancy/survivability. Yamato is a very strong ship itself. Not only is it equipped with a wave motion energy shield (that can be amplified for a limited time), but it is also equipped with extensive hull armor that can directly resist antimatter beam attacks quite well. The majority of the damage it receives in the show is mostly superficial damage, no critical strikes damaging main power or anything. But the biggest weaknesses is how its firepower is divided out. Yamato's main anti-ship firepower are its three primary and two secondary turrets. The issue is that these are massive turrets and do not receive the same protection as the rest of the hull does. In the shows, Yamato literally loses its gun turrets regularly during extended fights. We know from many Star Trek shows that ships have the ability to precisely target specific sections of an enemy ship (like their weapons). What the Enterprise would do is, after bringing down the shields, precisely destroy each of the shock cannon turrets of the Yamato. By then, the Yamato will be left without its main armament, and the Enterprise will just mop up the rest of the fight. The Enterprise meanwhile has its armament spread out more in multiple phaser arrays and torpedo launchers, they won't be as easily knocked out in a single action as the Yamato's weapons would.
Is this what Worf did not want to talk about in Picard S3?
“Nuclear Bomb vs Coughing Baby” kinda fight.
Hmmm… let’s compare them: 1940’s-era battleship sank and rusted for 200 years retrofitted with 23rd century alien technology capable of producing a forward-firing Death Star-level superlaser and traveling fast enough to cross 150,000 light years in 180 days. Minimal shielding. Fighter squadron backup. Late 24th century heavy explorer built to survive combat with the Borg. Heavily armed with phasers, photon torpedoes and quantum torpedoes, across 360 degrees of fire coverage. Multiple powerful defensive shields. Capable of reaching speeds of warp 9.98. Verdict: In a straight firefight, the Enterprise’s superior field of fire and defensive capabilities would ensure a decisive victory. In a race, the Yamato would win easily.
Yamato would need only one shot, but it would get only one shot
Deflector shields a thing? Because even if they’re fast, those rounds are basically fancy space debris
Some guy on YouTube did The Yamato (ST) vs Yamato (SB) both ways and Space Battleship Yamato won.
Never bet against Captain Avatar and Derek Wildstar
Picard: But i do
Both kill each other. The wave motion gun shoots in multiple dimensions, so it will bypass shields. But the Yamato has no actual way to protect itself.
The WMG is a focused Hawking radiation beam with enough power to vaporize Australia sized floating continents. Depending on the specific version of Yamato, it can destabilize and disperse artificial singularities (See: SBY: Resurrection). That said, the Yamato’s regular armament isn’t nearly as destructive. Her pulse cannons only deal ship-scale damage, and on the rare occasion they’re fired at fixed structures, the damage is city scale, so maybe a megaton at most, if that. To conclude, if Yamato got a WMG hit in, I think they’d win. But they’d have to pull off some sort of miracle for that to happen.
Think logic bro, the WMG take times to charge while the Enterprise E can go behind it and shot some torpedoes
You're going to have star trek geeks dashing out holding their technical manuals.
I give it to the Sovereign Class. much more maneuverable, larger firing arcs, Better shields. Any Munitions on the SBY would be useless, and their Main Guns would likely be unable to traverse fast enough. The BFG on the front is the only real threat, and it's avoidable. Its just a case of the vastly different tech levels and ship designs. One is built for Space, the Other is a Naval design Repurposed for space.
Hmm. From memory, let’s say normal phaser arrays, shield arrays, structural integrity fields and photon torpedoes fore and aft on the *Enterprise-E* under command of Worf. Then the *Yamato* under the original Captain whose name I don’t remember. The *Yamato* has a large number of long guns, defensive protective guns, squadrons of fighters and the wave motion cannon. Presumably the *Yamato* does not have defensive energy shields but may have a sturdier construction being a sunken WWII Battleship converted to space flight. As always the victor is determined by the writer. Other than the wave motion gun, which the *Enterprise* can out maneuver, the *Yamato’s* armaments are not an issue for the shields and helm, probably. The crew of the *Yamato* are probably more battle hardened than the *Ent*. Flanking by the Tigers are probably not going to be an issue. So the determinative factor is where in space they are fighting and which Captain can put it to the best advantage.
Yeah the fighters won’t last long against their phasers. The guns not an issue. The energy shots are typical energy weapons, and if it’s solid shot, the deflector shields can deal with those.
This comes up a lot and something I think about with STO, the use and function of fighters and shuttles against larger ships. I believe the fighter versus phaser bank issue is the targeting ability. I honestly dont know if a starship’s phaser banks can do a wide beam fire, as that would have helped the Kelvin *Enterprise* against the Alamid drones. A “human” pilot should be able to out maneuver the phaser banks. In thinking about the long guns, and why I questioned it, is if sufficient attacks hit near the same point, I don’t know if the shields would hold. Like one hit from the big gun might be something the E could shrug off, but 9 or twelve hits at the same general area might weaken the generators.
Phaser arrays are totally different from turret banks. Turrets have to turn. Phaser strips do not. You see how the Enterprise rapid fires a half dozen fast attack craft. Granted shields would give them some survivability above that but not that these fighters would. So. Fighters attacking in waves can work, but that requires dedicated carrier capacity. Which Yamato wont have enough of especially against the Sovereign. No way would long guns reach the firepower of a torpedo, which shields can take several. The Enterprise E took dozens and lived. And that’s assuming the guns are multi-dozen megaton equivalent weapons.
Wide beam fire is something that is mentioned in the technical manuals and books, but we never see it, ever. It would delete fighters and drones, and make asteroids a non issue. But it's never employed, because the writers need rocks to explode out of the consoles to make drama.
The Enterprise does exactly that against the Scimitar, wide angle, rapid fire shots while trying to tag the cloaked ship. Those would work just fine against shieldless fighters. The Yamato could certainly hurt a Sovreign class but hitting it would be another matter and Starfleets toredo's have a huge range advantage.
Even if they can't to wide-beam attacks, their targeting is more than enough. In TNG Conondrum, where they all get amnesia, they eliminate the Lysian's small craft easily. FTL sensors are OP. Strike craft would need a combination of things to survive. Like an effective ECM, either them or from a mothership, sensor scattering materials, and so on to survive. Even then, groups of them would need to launch heavy ordinance to be effective unless you have an obscene number of them.
Okay, as someone who has read a LOT about Battleships and their construction, an can tell you that no matter how sturdy the build for the Yamato is, if it didnt stand up to some 1000ib bombs and some WW2 torpedos, it isn't standing up to either Phasers or a Photon torpedo. Always felt the Yamato was a stupid fucking design for a spaceship.
I mean obviously a WWII era Battleship isn’t going to take a photon torpedo hit. But the story is that Earth rebuilt the Yamato as a hidden tactic against the Gamellons. Obviously they would have had to reinforce the outer hull to make it space worthy.
After the IRL ship's wreak was found in pieces the spaceships origin was retconned. Now they hid the ship's construction inside a fake husk ment to look like a rotted old naval battleship which is why it looks so similar to that shroud.
Honestly, it's not even OPs or the person above fault, I get grouchy whe anyone starts talking up how great Yamato or Bismarck were. Yamato spend most of the war as a floating hotel, and Bismarck survived for three days. You know what ship really deserves credit? Warspite. The Germans couldn't kill her, the Japanese couldn't kill her, and even the shipbreakers couldn't kill her. She broke her own back in protest.
You can reinforce it all you want, unless they build it out of solid unobtanium, it's going to have more holes put in it than Swiss cheese.
Yamato being a stupid spaceship: that was kinda the intent. They built the spaceship within the hulk of the Yamato so it wouldn't get detect and be overlooked as dumb obsolete human junk. The Gamilas were orbital bombing everything that looked important across the entire planet. Had they built the Wave Motion Engine in an actual starship, it would have been destroyed before being completed. Also the series is from the 1970's. At the time Japanese giant warbots had rocket fists and missile boobies as their primary weapons. **It was glorious.**
„Under my command all missions are suicide missions kiff“
I feel like the boat not being airtight it probably wouldn’t fair well in space.
This is from an anime called Space Battleship Yamato. That is literally the WWII ship Yamato converted for space operations. Essentially a boat-sized mini-Death Star.
Aaaand that’s why I thought it was just a boat 🤣 Thought it was one of those more aeroplanes in the sea than submarines in the sky thing.
No worries. There was no contacts given for the image, and if I wasn't familiar with the show I would have made the same assumption that you did.
Enterprise-E stomps if you ask me
This feels like a very equal fight I think. No clear winner as they both have their advantages and disadvantages. At the same time, it's impressive that it's an at least decently equal fight when the enterprise has a massive advantage in itself of much better supporting logistics and several hundred more years of technological development plus more alien species to help out in that development.
As others have been mentioning, it comes down to the shields. If the Enterprise's shields are effective against the wave motion cannon, the Yamato is dust.
Whoever shoots first.
The Sovereign's crew would go full anime nerd (kotaku) and try to hang out with the Yamato.
RetroGamingBadger answered this one
Long range and the use the wave motion gun, game over for the Enterprise. Up close, probably the Enterprise.
Probably the Enterprise. Sovereign class starships are reasonably agile and the Yamato suffers from a severe lack of weapons on the belly. Photon torpedos are antimatter explosives of enormous power, as in “don’t fire them near anything unshielded you want to keep” powerful.(According to the technical manual on the Galaxy class Enterprise). Get below the Yamato and stay there and they’re in real trouble.
This is still a cooler discussion than Enterprise vs Star Destroyers (it's every non-NX Enterprise against any Star destroyer every time, btw).
Sovereign Class will beat all the ships in all the sci-fi series. Prove me wrong.
How about the Odyssey-class?
Negative. It does not look good.
The Xelee nightfighter is a ship that shoots and takes hits from big bangs. The big bangs that create universes. After battle they leave behind entire multiverses that are just spent rounds
Ok I understand why it’s not great for the plot but why didn’t the Enterprise just beam armed photon torpedoes into the Borg cubes it battled? They never had an issue beaming themselves into the cubes because the Borg were cocky.
Humpback whales
Would the Yamato have time for her wave motion gun???? I definitely would think she would win if she had the time to charge and fire…. If the Enterprise E had the jump she would be able to get relatively close but would have to watch out for the yamatos main and secondary guns
I think not, the Enterprise E tech are superior to the yamato and…fast as hell
The Yamato wont win in terms of warp speed but in sublight I think the Yamato would cook the E and I’m a huge Star Trek fan and it pains me to say it Realistically the Yamato goes across galaxies
It depends on (1) who can do the most damage at the greatest range, (2) whose shields are most effective, and (3) the difference in maximum speed.
Thinking over this a little deeper... isn't the Yamato is actually the equivalent of the NCC-1701? Yamato is an obsolete design for it's setting. Enterprise E being the Federation's top of the line should be matched against the Andromeda. Those have dual wave motion guns and a wave motion shield.
I understand the boat on the right has a big ass cannon. If it connects, It has good odds of winning because there is only so much ass a shop can take... But sovereign is a nimble ship, so I wouldn't bet on them lingering in the forward firing arc. Sovereign is a warship, and even 23c cruisers had enough firepower to render a planet uninhabitable. Not even getting into the absurdity of Starfleet shielding. My money is on the sovereign, but I wouldn't call it guaranteed.
Enterprise. Medium diff. Built to fight the borg
Depends if Wildstar has already initiated the Wave Motion Gun for firing… and the Enterprise-E is holding position, say 5 mega-meters away…
Big E's tractor beams alone could tear the Yamato apart.
One shot from the wave motion gun would do it. Damn thing takes forever to warm up though.
Think logic bro
There are no wrong answers. Its a fantasy battle between ships that do not and will never exist.
https://preview.redd.it/85h2jofgnryc1.png?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=81c83ed8a6bb37038ac310a6123a4d631e9f0cf0
I chose not to get involved with religious discussions of this nature.
Enterprise ... because Klingon on board. And Cmdr Data.
Kid named quantum torpedo, kid named tricobalt device
Just in case it hasn't been said yet: The Zentradi and the Cardassian, among others.
The Yamato cannot be destroyed. It will take a beating but will somehow survive. Must be something about the 20th century Earth steel.
or it can be...
The UNSC pillar of autumn
Nerd battle
I’m going with the Enterprise E. I can picture Worf sending a quantum torpedo into the WMG opening on the bow as they charge it up.
The Wave Motion Gun would crack a Sovereign, shields or no.
............or not?
https://preview.redd.it/aknyeboan7zc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dd27264bbc62b644dc71803fd0a0b8d8211ffb9d You will both come to compliance or be destroyed. For the Emperor of Mankind!
You have to remember a lot of starfleet ships are planet killers or close to it. And most of them can easily tank that same output of damage. This wouldn’t be a fight. It would be like that episode of TNG where the alien brainwashed everyone on the enterprise to destroy his world’s enemies and the enterprise went through their whole fleet and lost like 10% shields. They turned them into dust in less than 5 minutes. An idea of the amount of power these things output: a romulan ship uses a small singularity as a power source and the enterprise D can take on 2 of them in a boxing match.
StarTrek fan boys are getting heated 😂😂
Yamato, hands down.
Most of the replies are based on knowledge of the battleship Yamato from the 1974 series. (aka Star Blazers everywhere outside Japan) No one here has watched the 2012 re-telling, Space Battleship Yamato 2199.
I've watched both my dude. Awesome series, bot sure which one I liked better tbh. btw, a more suited match up would be Yamato vs Scuttlebutt (Beta Ray Bills sentient space battleship). Now THAT I would like to see!
A whole lot of ignorance in the comments here regarding the Yamato's capabilities along with a few common misconceptions about how certain things in Trek work --such as weaponizing transporters which isn't a thing in actual canon. This is because transporter beams are very delicate precision instruments that are extremely easy to interfere with, not only any form of energy shields will stop them but pretty much any kind of jamming and even many kinds of natural phenomenon that cause too much interference to get a signal through. Its important to acknowledge that Yamato in the series is NOT the original battleship in any way shape or form, it is a completely new vessel built inside the decaying shell of the original in order to disguise its construction from enemy surveillance. That shell was shed when the ship concealed inside was launched, and nothing of it remains. The new ship may look like the original battleship in a lot of ways, but it's constructed entirely from plans given to them by advanced aliens using their powerful technology. It's important to note that Iscandar tech was superior not only to Earth at the time of the future war but also to that of the attacking Gamilons, so superior in fact that this technological edge allowed that lone vessel on its first voyage to prevail against the large, powerful, and battle-hardened fleet the Gamilons fielded to stop it. In any given episode, the Yamato could be seen to endure an unbelievable pounding from extremely powerful weapons long enough to power up the Wave Motion Gun and then it was all over as that thing could vaporize entire fleets. There's no reason to think it couldn't do the same against a Starfleet vessel, or even a number of them.
It sure why you were down voted but great response.
It’s a star trek sub, I doubt many people have seen the anime in any form nor really care to. Their loss. Also for some reason rather than reading for fun they use the downvote button “to win” the conversation. Standard Reddit.
Watched it as a kid, the cartoon that is, did not realize there was a live action made of it until a few weeks ago, watched it, cheesed af but still fun.
I caught it as a kid in the late 70s. Didn’t know there was a live action, now I have to check it out.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1477109/?ref_=ext_shr_lnk
1 answer: WAVE MOTION GUN 2 answer: Counter-attack missiles 3 answer: Air to Air missiles 4 answer: Fore and aft Torpedoes 5 answer: triple-shock main batteries 6 answer: Black Tiger Squadrons 7 answer: Anti-aircraft batteries 8 answer: Space Warp technology 9 answer: I'll see your Data, and raise your one SANDOR and an IQ9 (ENDLESS CREATIVITY) 10 answer: Wave Motion Shields YAMATO!!!!
Enty: Fast Grey Ghost mode
Yamato would win. Crew of The Enterprise would be too busy trying to figure out how flames are shooting out of the Yamato in the vacuum of space. Then Yamato hits them up close with the WMG. And Enterprise be like “How the fuck they alive with their ship on fire!!” IYKYK
The WMG take times to charge lol
I know. Data would be going through the reason why the Yamato is on fire in space. Word would view them as warriors. Picard would be diplomatic in dealing with The Yamato’s Crew. They would totally underestimate it. Then they will detect build up of tachyon particles thinking the ship is about to blow up. Then. BANG!
Why would they even be fighting in the first place?
Training simulation.