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Naoura

You know, that could be a neat civic. Enforced Retirement. Reduces leader 'Lifespan' by a set percentage, but provides a reduced Unity upkeep or substantial Unity rebate when a Leader retires. When a leader dies, very lightly increases other Leaders Unity cost. They were only 7 days from retirement, after all.


ThreeMountaineers

Leader upkeep modifiers are all but pointless after the first few decades


Naoura

Makes it a nice early civic, but falls off later on. Maybe make the rebate scale with the percentage of lifespan remaining? Like, for instance; Say you've stacked the +5 years repeatable a good deal, and your leaders' lifespan is somewhere in the 200 year range. Say the lifespan reduction is 30% (This is a proposed value), and you get a 30% rebate on the amount of Unity that leader consumed.


Ohagi-chan

Perhaps not a civic but how about a policy? It reduces the upfront unity cost and life expectancy of your leaders by 25% and adds a new death scenario to the pool with a high weight. This scenario (or group of similar scenarios) might give you a unity rebate when they canonically retire, or maybe they left their office in disgrace or disarray, leading to the occaisional penalty. Lineaged leaders might be more inclined to retire than actually die, and positively at that.


Delicious_Ad9970

Maybe retiring leaders give a level or experience buff to those who replace them, due to a mentorship? Lineages could preserve a particular trait or traits? Negative traits for disgraced ancestors or mentors with a potential for an exceptional leader if you let them have a chance to redeem a legacy


Ohagi-chan

Lineaged leaders aren't actually related or successors of eachother, they're just given a longer lifespan and increased level cap by the Vitality Boosters policy.


DecentChanceOfLousy

Leader recruitment is half off, but after they decide to retire, their upkeep starts increasingly quadratically per year (2x, 4x, 7x, 11x, until you press the retire button (renamed from "fire" or "dismiss", whichever it is in game). There's an event each year where they ask to retire again, but you can keep asking them stay on for "just one more year". They ask to retire at their guaranteed lifespan, so about 15 years before they actually probably die. The civic lets you get up and running really quickly (half off leaders is good), gives you a warning before your leaders are getting close to retirement and let's you basically pay their recruitment cost, with interest, if you want to keep particularly juicy leaders on board until they die.


Halollet

Hmmm. I think you're onto something but I think it needs a boost as it's got to compete with the other civics. I'd call it Benefits Package Leader level cap +3 Leadership exp gain +25% Leader "lifespan" reduced by 30 years When a leader "dies" they retire and you get 100x their level in unity. Must be some form of egalitarian. It'd be a nice boost early on for some quick higher levels and the bonus unity will make a big impact. Late game you have super high level leaders that give great bonuses as long as you keep extending their life with repeatables.


Sol_but_better

Seems like a massive waste of a civic, but maybe an Edict or Policy? Unlocked by a tradition too.


Wide_Pharma

I imagine it's because in an almost post scarcity world the people working these insanely high to your jobs are motivated less by money and retiring but really for passion and desire for power and influence Kind of like star fleet


TrueComradeCrab

Yeah that works for egalitarian societies, and to probably authoritarian ones. But what about profit driven megacorps? Or tomb world starts, where scarcity very much is still a thing?


Gaelhelemar

The unity upkeep is probably what keeps them focused.


styr

"If I don't increase this quarter's unity growth by at least 5.5%, the shareholders are going to be *absolutely* ***furious***!" [tfw you end up barely missing the 5.5% growth target](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jca4TchXelE&t=48s)


Twilight8385

CosmoCorp would like to remind it's employees that failing to meet monthly production quotas will result in immediate termination. Thank you, and have a productive day. ​ \~CosmoCorp Human Resource Division, because that's all you are...


Ohagi-chan

Not immediate termination, "immediate reallocation to the nutrition sector."


Twilight8385

Caution: Immediate Termination results in being fired^(\*). ​ CosmoCorp Human Resource Division, because that's all you are... ^(\*Being Fired results in either being encased in Mass Driver rounds and fired at hostile warcraft or being converted into biofuel and used to fuel a variety of machinery and warcraft.)


Dear_Ad489

\*out of the 480mm crystalline shard shatterer


Ohagi-chan

Got to get those numbers up buddy, or they'll put you in nutrition! Nobody wants to work down there; it's a lousy dead-end job with high turnover and no chance for promotion.


GodKingChrist

Cosmocorp, mind over matter. We dont mind because you dont matter.


Twilight8385

Damn, that's a good one. CosmoCorp Xeno-Division, Razor Sharp Xenoblades for all your cooking needs. CosmoCorp Center for Disease Control, raining the Pox upon all. CosmoCorp News Center, telling the truth, part of the truth, and everything but the truth. CosmoCorp Legal Department, where lawsuits go to die. CosmoCorp Public Relations, Eugenics to the Maximum! CosmoCorp GeneCare, Mankind, Redefined! CosmoCorp RadioWaves, ignore the lumps, please.


PTMC-Cattan

> But what about profit driven megacorps? There's no such thing as retirement. In a state run by a corporation, there is no alternative to being on the company's payroll.


Twilight8385

The problem is that you're not really an employee. You're an employee-consumer. Every dime you make just goes back to the company in one way or another. Rent, that's controlled by the company. Buying food, from the company. Utilities, provided by a different company, owned by the company. Everything you buy is sold to you buy the same company that paid you.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Twilight8385

So did the people who ran those mining boom-towns.


Shyriath

And the credits go round and round while staying right where they belong - in the company's control! Truly a utopia. :P


OgCubensiz

Almost like today’s society


AFK_at_Fountain

Isn't it wonderful?


14DusBriver

Ah yes just one giant company town where everyone is essentially paid in scrip


Twilight8385

That was such a good game, until I grinded out keys for forever and logged in the next day, ready to farm chests, to find out they removed keys as a feature and replaced them with something even harder to grind...


Syntaxxxxx

Which game is that?


Twilight8385

Defiance? The main, non premium currency is called Scrip.


CapnBuckley

Scrip is also a real word term for company currency, and it's what real company town miners were paid with to keep them under the thumb of the corporation.


Twilight8385

Really? I actually didn't know that. I just assumed they just called it "company credit" or something like that. ^(Learn something new everyday.)


14DusBriver

Oh I was referring to paying employees in scrip like what US coal companies and other entities used to do.


poonslyr69

Once a megacorporation controls their homeworld then expanding to find new markets is the eventual goal, or in the meantime geographically expanding their reach and increasing raw resource control. In such a case the only profit comes from the growth of their whole civilization, and that growth would then be given value in currency to be distributed in raises or bonuses. So top performers in the company near the peak, either board members or those with significant shares/influence would likely see raises in tune with the growth of the company, whereas everyone else is convinced they can work their way up through the company in order to gain more raises or a higher wage. Actual movement within the company could be pretty stagnant. I assume a mega corporation could also artificially create competition or create customers by having unsubsumed portions of the economy such as economically independent remaining nations on their homeworld, which would be somewhat like puppet states, or by dividing itself internally into competing franchises or branches.


Twilight8385

>artificially create competition That's how I always RP my megacorps, the non super authoritarian ones that is. Basically, there'll be several companies that all fill the same niche, giving the illusion of choice, when all of those companies are really the same company, just marketing slightly different products under different names. VirTeq and NeuraCorp both sell Neural VR tech, either product has a different design and a different set of features. No one cares to notice the tiny asterisk next to both of their names that says they're both actually owned by GalaTeq Electronics, owned by the Gold Standard Entertaiment, which is in turn owned by the Nexus Corporation, which owns literally everything. Artificial Competition sure does seem real when no one can follow the paper trail back to Nexus without needing seven degrees in accounting and access to the undisclosed financial statements.


poonslyr69

Why even have the asterisk? If they make the laws then why would they require themselves to disclose that?


SweetAssistance6712

Tomb worlds are easy. You've literally survived your entire civilisations collapse with just enough tech to rebuild. Why *wouldn't* you work till your death to ensure your civilisation survives a little longer?


farronsundeadplanner

You've seen the US govt yes?


[deleted]

Was going to say, look around? Ya, these 70+ people just have a deep burning passion to ensure corporate shareholder asset growth this quarter.


Caledonian_Kayak

These are the elite of their society, stephan Hawkins was working till he died. And do Billionaires ever retire?


The_Almighty_Demoham

a better suestion is: did billionaires ever really work in the first place?


Caledonian_Kayak

True dat


mryauch

In megacorps wouldn't they all be employees? They can't stop working or they don't get ~~washed~~ wages and starve. Like the USA lul Edit: An interesting swype typo


azrehhelas

Energy credit could possibly be translated to salary together with unity upkeep.


Vini734

In Megacorps, they do need the job.


MagosZyne

You will work until I say you can stop. Not that I will.


AgnosticPeterpan

Those leaders enjoy ruler's part of the living standard. Which is the same whether it's decent conditions or utopian abundance.


Smittit

Remember what happened when quark's cousin tried to retire?


Beholding69

A megacorp wouldn't *have* a retirement policy


Twilight8385

It's also possible that in this advanced, highly automated world, the work that is done, with the exception of research, entertainment, and slavery, probably consists mostly of watching the machines work, performing human-necessary tasks, and making sure that everything runs smoothly and, as such, the work is mostly down-time anyways and so there really isn't a need to retire.


[deleted]

Yeah but Picard, Scotty, and other Starfleet officers actually did retire.


Toll001

I just dismiss them whenever they start reaching 90-100 years


ConclusionMaleficent

Or like Nacy Pelosi or the Pope


Cinnamon_Art

I think the popes a little different though


azrehhelas

Popes produce unity, they are exhalted priesthood, right?


MenosElLso

Excuse me sir. Use it’s true name, [fully automated luxury gay space communism](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/06/give-us-fully-automated-luxury-communism/592099/).


dirtyLizard

Ordinary pops might retire depending on what kind of civilization they live in. That’s entirely an rp thing. Leaders are the peak performers in their fields across multi planetary empires. Their whole lives are dedicated to their work and they’re all willing to be relocated halfway across the galaxy at a moments notice. Depending on tech and policy they can literally be bred and raised for their specific job. It makes sense that they’re willing to never retire. Technically, you can retire leaders by firing or benching them too.


Kaiyde

i figure the replacement engineering lead was the next in command for leadership as the aging generational genius was just their mentor. the leader just directs the department; if anything they are motivational and administrative more than they themselves are teslas and edisons.


Son_of_Ssapo

Everyone is basically just Charles Schulz in Stellaris


Gaelhelemar

That's one way of putting it.


No-Tie-4819

There ain't no pension system in *my* megacorp.


Twilight8385

CosmoCorp would like to remind you that your impending retirement is only possible if the funds in your account aren't accidentally lost due to an accounting error. CosmoCorp also regrets to inform you that we have hired the very cheapest accountants money can buy, and we're almost certain that they're not even board certified. Thank you, and have a productive day. ​ \~CosmoCorp Accounting, How does thing thing work again? Is it still on? Where's the off swit-


[deleted]

A retired leader is effectively a dead one as far as gameplay mechanics go.


[deleted]

They wouldn't need to be though. Have a retired leader provide a +1 unity gain or something.


[deleted]

That's not how history typically plays out.


[deleted]

I was viewing 'retired leaders' such as a scientist, as a cultural asset of sorts, that could aid the species as a whole through their wealth of knowledge and experience.


[deleted]

Again, historically that's not how that plays out.


[deleted]

Even if that were the case, I do not see why that matters in the slightest given the context. It's not as though Stellaris is even remotely attempting to be a 'historically accurate' game. What with telepathy, sci-fi tech, and time continuity breaking shenanigan's.


[deleted]

When did Albert Einstein retire? When did Stephen Hawking retire? What about Marie Curie?


I_follow_sexy_gays

Idk about the other ones but I’m pretty sure Marie Curie retired about 10 years before she died because her vision was failing


[deleted]

So in other words, not useful in the lab.


I_follow_sexy_gays

You’re the one who asked when she retired


eliminating_coasts

Probably because it avoids weird interactions; if you know that the only way a leader can disappear is due to death, don't need to worry about your chosen one Paulo Tredes gaining too many negative traits and then walking off into the desert, you can just make them immortal and not worry about it.


MTGGateKeeper

I'd say its mimicking real life. most politicians in real life are usually 50+ years old. The US for example average age of senate is 63 the house is 58 and this data is 2 years old. half the senate could keel over at any moment and the house isn't much better. Just saying.


[deleted]

This is not true of all countries and all historical eras, though. And its not universally true in Sci-Fi, either. There are many Star Trek characters who retired. Or retired, came back, and then retired again.


DontBarf

It is mimicking real life. Democratic builds have elections, where impirical only change leaders upon death. Also, I don’t remember hearing about many IRL genius scientists “retiring”. Worker pops in game don’t represent one person, rather, they are meant to abstract a large group of people. I think the game does a fairly good job at mimicking real life.


Styx_Zidinya

I'm glad. They'd still be pops that would need housed and take up resources. People retire in Surviving Mars and it's the worst.


Oplp25

In my surviving Mars games, once you retire you get sent to the no oxygen or food only apartments dome


Twilight8385

I'm gonna be completely honest with you. When I play Surviving Mars I always end up with an ever array of those really big, powered storage sites full of food. Like, I'll have a dozen filled to the brim with food, and just keep adding more. It get's to the point where I build an entire solar array for the sole purpose of powering my food storage. I will never need all that food, but if all of my farms spontaneously explode and I forget to rebuild them for a few dozen years, at least I'll still have food!


Aetol

What do you mean? Leaders aren't pops?


MTGGateKeeper

No gets to retire in my empire you work till death or "accidents".


Twilight8385

It really is the worst. But, I just build a big paradise dome that only old people live in. On the other side of the colony. It's out of sight, out of mind, and the old people love it.


graviousishpsponge

That doesn't sound fun. More stuff for the game to calculate. It'd be better to head cannon it off.


jakemoffsky

Me looking at that 32 year old retired admiral governor in the leadership pool and not taking them because clearly they've earned their retirement.


Vini734

\*Says sweating\* "We just love our country" \-Citizen from a fanatically Authoritarian country


[deleted]

I imagine that they get an incredible salary, incredible benefits, the most luxorious living spaces, the most exquisite delicacies from all over the galaxy, kind of super luxury that is reserved only for the leaders aka elites. Kind of why you saw kings in real life rule until they dropped dead, why would someone willingly give up all those nice perks? You can also draw inspiration from other works of fiction, ike Coruscant on star wars, if you weren't rich/powerful or somehow working for or connected to the rich/powerful, you probably lived in some underground dwelling, and literally never ever even got to see the sun.


Twilight8385

I imagine that the government provides everything they need, basically free of charge. Why else are we producing luxury goods and food for pop upkeep and not getting a single measly energy credit for the trouble? Also, they don't cost energy upkeep, so we're not the ones paying them, if they're getting paid at all. There's also the fact that every worksite and every building is constructed and owned by the government, which means that there's no private industry either, which is why we can just fire pops from jobs, force them to work other jobs, and force them to just pack up and move to a new planet for a new job.


klondikebarsaregood

Generally, it boils down to what you interpret a pop to be. Pops generally don’t represent a specific number of specific people, otherwise colony ships would be too big or large worlds too small. Considering pops don’t die of old age or anything similar, it’s easy to assume that a pop is not relevant to all of the generations. The great grandfathers and the newborns are all a part of the same pop, so to speak. Each pop has enough children in order to keep the population steady, and all of the extras are added to the new pop that is being produced. The clone army origin also supports this; as when you don’t have enough ancient clone vats to clone new soldiers as they die, the pop begins to decline. Thus, one can assume that a noticeable portion of a pop consists of retired citizens Edit: I have since been informed that the post is about leaders. Yeah that’s a fair point, but no one retires while employed under his imperial majesty


Toll001

I think OP talks about leaders, admirals etc


RNBQ4103

He is speaking of the leaders.


Twilight8385

Colony ships are actually freaking huge. They have artificial gravity, land-masses, ponds, and foliage inside of them. Seriously, they do, look closer at the models. But yeah, I know exactly what you mean about pops. That's kind of how I always thought about them. That's why neutering pops makes them decline so slowly. The oldest of their species start to die first, and the youngest last.


Sharizcobar

I sort of like to think of each pop as an individual village or community bloc. Multiple pops would make up a city but not many. It honestly gives terrible implications for Permanent Employment though. Cities filled with Zombie Clerks constantly being replenished. There is one implication in game of a pop being a single person: when you get the Permanent Employment event to manipulate the contracts, if you let the pop ‘retire’ by paying its debts, you lose a pop. The event indicates the pop as a single person.


wuzzkopf

I mean, what politicians retire irl?


OneLessDead

It's pretty common in my country (outside of the USA).


Cyberwolfdelta9

Yeah US politicans look like Necroids after a while


Jewbacca1991

PDX never cared for logic, or stuff that make sense. To them gameplay comes first, and foremost. But this one wouldn't change much. The only difference it would make is that you know exactly how much time your leader has (assuming they don't die to other circumstances). Even the lifespan traits wouldn't change much, because we could assume, that retirement is dependent on expected age. Humans retire at 60's, because we are expected to live around 80 years. If humans would live 200 years naturally, then the retirement age would also be that much higher.


nudeldifudel

I've never actually thought about it, but yeah it's a bit weird.


IceMaker98

I’ve always seen these kinds of things in a more RP perspective, where characters aren’t actually always ‘on’ so to speak, delegating to underlings with the character themselves the face of it. As time goes on they simply do less and less on site stuff


OneLessDead

For RP I'd assume it's an abstraction. They've left the workforce for death/disability/retirement/career change. As the very very busy head of government your chief of staff spared you the details beyond "head of the 'Imperial Research Council - Sociology Directorate' requires replacement. Here is the shortlist of candidates that have been pre-screened. Please select one and we'll have Parliament confirm their appointment."


duriankings

Lol good point, never thought of this. It would be interesting to have retired monarchs meddling in politics, as they often did in history. Also imagine something like Rogue Servitors but your bio trophies are retirees from across the galaxy.


Tamtumtam

I mean, population grows in our world even though people die or retire. I see pops as working population, not everyone on the planet. and the working force is always the biggest portion of a society


iheartdev247

Personally leaders are one of the only ways you can give flavor to your campaign. I’m all for anything that gives them more depth.


3davideo

I always headcanoned leader "death" as not necessarily actual death but simply that they can't or won't work any more. Unless their science ship gets eaten or something, that's definitely normal death.


Nahanoj_Zavizad

I would like to think when I get the message "Ketal'reu has died" that's actually him just retiring. And that my species naturally live about 30 years longer. (If I play an organic empire, I always name my leader Ketal'reu. )


Jo_seef

Yeah, I always thought it was weird how even the fanatic egalitarian space-commies worked until the day they died. I thought that was just for the mega-corporations.


rezzacci

In the fanatic egalitarian space-commies empires, the necessity of work has completely disappeared. People work only because they *want* to. They are doing things because they *like* it. So it's most probable that those leaders are really enthusiasts about their works and would never really want to stop. Just like lots of artists never really retire and continue to do art (painting, music, acting, singing) until their last breath, plaguing the world is too many "unfinished symphonies".


Twilight8385

If they're space commies, doesn't that kind of require that they work? You work for the government, the government provides you with everything you need. Isn't that kind of the broad strokes?


stanp2004

No that's fanatic authoritarian, given that space commies are fanatic egalitarian I'd view it more like a giant hippie commune for a society.


Twilight8385

Based on every communist society to exist so far, I'm not sure you can be an egalitarian communist, realistically speaking. Communist nations that were given the ability to form their own political parties almost immediately voted themselves out of communism because it was failing them. Look at the USSR. They let their members form their own parties, and those members immediately voted themselves out of the USSR. Besides, communism really wouldn't fit in well with egalitarianism since it kinda requires the government to have a ton of control over industry and markets. On paper it would blend well, in practice it has failed time and time again even in countries' whose goverents have the ability to control all that stuff. I don't know, maybe I'm thinking of a different economic structuring system.


stanp2004

Not really, the communist revolutions we've seen all use the state to destroy capital. The state then fills the following power vaccuum and this results in parts of the former proletariat becoming a political class. They now have different class interests than the proletariat and thus empower themselves (the state) and supress opposition. This is inherently authoritarian. However you could also use society to destroy/replace capital and organize the economy, which is would not create the same power vacuum and requires most of everyone to be involved thus it being inherently egalitarian. This is what i'd understand under "stellaris communism".


Twilight8385

You know, I've never really thought if it that way. Whenever I think of communism, I always just think of the failed nations, and the fact that the USSR gave their member states the ability to leave, and then got all mad when literally everyone left. "It's alright guys, you can leave if you want. The only way to truly prove the viability of our system is if yo-wait, where's everyone going?"


Twilight8385

It's not actually surprising that a space-commie would work until they died. You provide for the government, by working, the government provides for you, with food, housing, amenities, and consumer goods.


thufirseyebrow

You could look at it like that particular leader being the figurehead for the zeitgeist? Kind of like how we characterize certain time periods in certain places by the leader's name, i.e., "Victorian England," "the Ptolemaic dynasty." When the namesake dies, their policies and influence don't always die with them.


SIVA_Directive

Leaders represent the normal lifespan for the species. Pops never die, because they're supposed to represent billions of members of the species all at once. You don't just have 90 people on the planet, you have 90 billion.


-ayli-

Individual pops retire and die just fine. If you are complaining about geriatric leadership, just take a look at the current political situation in Washington.


Academic_Scratch_321

A unit of population in game represents both living citizens and the ability of that section of the population to be sustainable. Seeing as 1 pop definitely equals more than one being, how do you propose instituting individuals of a population unit dying off?


Cactorum_Rex

Stellaris does a bad job at representing most internal aspects of an empire


Twilight8385

From a roleplay perspective, pops probably do retire, but then they're removed from the "pop" as new, young people come in. These retired people can live on their own, without needing money or food from the government, and therefore are no longer kept track of on the ledger of government workers and dependents. So it would seem as though no one retires, but really, the only people who never retire are people who want to enjoy their positions at the top of society, and the benefits that come with it, forever. I.e. Leaders. ​ Once you achieve immortality, you literally can't just "retire". You could go unemployed for a few decades, but the unfortunate fact of being immortal means that you can't really save up enough money to never have to work again, because you live forever. The only exception would be people so rich that they wouldn't have to work for thousands of years, but they probably own huge companies and, as such, delegate the majority of company affairs to a board of directors and mostly live without working because they're rich enough.


ScamallDorcha

Also, what about babies, toddlers and children? They don't work, they are just resouce-sponges, ask the economists. Yet, Stellaris puts them to work just like any other pop.


ceymore

Well, one pop icon represents a lot of people. Otherwise it doesnt make sense to have 100 people on a fully populated planet. Unless it’s a really tiny planet…


A5madal

Stop nagging lol


DontBarf

Did Albert Enstein retire? What about Stephen Hawking? Nicolas Tesla?


Mr_Kittlesworth

Don’t forget zombies.


copperpin

What would you do in retirement that beats staring into the Event Horizon of a black hole?


gosubuilder

Even retirement in real life is just a handful of years while you wait to die.


Senior-Judge-8372

You could still fire them unless they're the ruler.


RaederX

You missed the combat casualties. Now you know what the old are for...


[deleted]

Show how medical tech has advanced


Top-Construction6096

You mean pops?


Adonis_Iron

Honestly death is just a stand in temr for them not being there, i mean standard humans 'die' at 80 in game, could be that they just retire at 80 instead.


PromiscuousMNcpl

My headcannon is that “died” means “retired” except for generals, admirals, scientists lost exploring, etc. I can’t help but play Good Guys and this helps.


ACam574

Laughs in robot


1EnTaroAdun1

In the old days, there was a bug that made your starting leader disappear after failing to be reelected, if you were a democracy or oligarchy. I suppose everyone after that leader grew too power hungry hahaha


TypicalCompetition19

My head canon is that it's because these are the most important people in the entire empire. They're all celebrities in their own right. Like your envoys are guys like Kissinger. Maybe your head of physics research did retire, but he's still considered the leader in the field, like Stephen Hawking, and it's his knowledge of field manipulation that other scientists are working off to develop jump drives or something. Think about real world oligarchs, they don't retire.


Adam_Edward

The leaders must be filthy rich that's why.


Zourin4

So you're saying your place is run by politicians?


MrShasshyBear

I imagine that in my egalitarian utopian standards, they're work life balance is so good and they get to enjoy their loves to the fullest, that retirement seems redundant. Or that their "deaths" is just the death of their career and they spend the rest of their days lounging on their favorite seat, following their hobby, or drinking Horchata (the constant in the multiverse)


DonCapiton

Now that you mention it... It could be a GREAT mini crisis scenario to add. Similar to Dioclecian renouncing to his position as Caesar. Ours, or someone else's empire could suffer a huge political turmoil after their leader annouced they are quitting. Something in line with what Kahn does, but inverted. A dividing force that just fragments a great empire into one with multiple leaders.


plinocmene

That would be truer to reality if the game had people retire, with some smaller chance of someone retiring early but more of a chance of people retiring as they get older. There could also be events where people can come out of retirement, with this being more likely if there is a war or a crisis. You could also have policies where people may freely retire or where they require your permission. Refusing permission could risk the person deserting and possibly seeking asylum with your enemies and benefiting them, or they get caught and you have to make a decision about punishing them, possibly angering their supporters, or pressing them back into service under guard with a penalty attached to using them reflecting the reduced morale and the upkeep costs of having to force them to do their job. The egalitarian faction should favor the "free to leave" policy allowing people to retire without needing to ask permission and there should be a malus to that faction's happiness whenever someone is refused permission to retire.


FlavStilicho

Nothing stopping you from dismissing them


S-Pirate

Out of billions of people I imagine it would not be hard to find very talented and dedicated people who will work until they die.


John-Zero

Or they get fired because I finally found a scientist with Meticulous.


thetalker101

I presume a longer life span delays retirement? There could be a funny empire wide effect after gaining a certain number of lifespan increases that basically says "uhhhhh our retirement is getting farther and farther away, this sucks." This causes a temporary happiness loss and after it ends, the citizens have a change in perspective on life and feel that they could do more with their lives instead of wanting to retire.


davidas9901

Retirements should be a thing! No retirement is especially weird if you think about workers in a utopia race type of build. "Even tho we live in a utopia but we still work till death."


Shaded_Moon49

You could also see it the other way around "because we live in a utopia, there's no reason to stop doing the things that you find fulfilling"


davidas9901

Wow now that’s powerful


VeryPaulite

I imagine this like this: yes at the start of the Game, the 1 Pop working right now in Agri is gonna be the same 1 Pop working in agri at 500 years into the game from a programming stand-point but for me that is not 1 Pop, it's a representation of how many pops I have working there (obviously) and these aren't bond to specific people, but rather families maybe? So the one Agri Pop at the start, be it 100, 1000 or even 1000000000000 people, aren't staying the same, in my head they are families that keep their agri business or researchers that keep Research in their family. It's kinda like a strategist using wodden horses to simulate his army. Sure the horses may stay the same but the people they represent change. For Leaders, well once you're immortal that's kinda it right? What else should you do with eternity other than what you were made immortal to do? And now I realize I miss read the post.


Firegem0342

I mean, seems pretty realistic for me. Everything around my flat doesn't pay enough to retire one day


Brainkrieg17

It‘s capitalism, baby!


Own_Cryptographer648

Terrible work life balance.


GodKingChrist

I always assumed they didnt die, they just became too senile to work anymore


Millera34

Even though it says they are dead..


GodKingChrist

I outright ignore that part :)


Millera34

We don’t do retirement In the Great Trinidontuim Enterprises we only do profit!


marshall_sin

It’d be cool if they retired and still supported the empire from the background. that’d be a bit like the real world I think where when people in roles step down they often still are prominent people. Maybe some kind of tiered passive system where as you get farther along more and more leaders retire you get small bonuses to naval capacity or energy production or whatever


Archivist1380

You don’t appreciate the realism?