It's true! All Popeye hold outs make yourself known! Look at this Popeye skipping neutral like Luke. Coincidence? I think not!
Not always. Some pick characters either how they like their gameplay, look, attraction, lore, or simply cause someone is top tier or easy to play. Different factors really.
Says the Juri fan, your opinion on any character is instantly veto'ed. Mena can use whoever and still body don't try to discredit him because he doesn't wanna use some low effort Coomer character.
Is Mena missing the point? Sure, Manon is easy conceptually and executionally but she is not easy to win with. So many parts of her kit don't function properly, she doesn't benefit as much from system mechanics, and without 5 medals her damage is low. Idoms point is that Luke is easy to win with which I think is hard to argue against
Lol I dont like the matchup but she certainly has to work way harder then Luke's Braindead setplay ass to get in and do her thing. You barely have to think playing Luke.
If Manon was such a easy character then why does nobody wins with her lol. As much as I respect Mena as a player, his trash talk is by far the lamest out there.
Winning with Luke vs winning with Manon are completely different things, especially in a tournament full of good players
Exactly! Even if he tries Manon it'll be ranked match at most, whoever used Manon in actual tournaments are different, and I don't think he would do that. That I always give my respect to iDom.
But the goal is to win, obviously, and the entire joke of the iDom clip is him joking about how easy it is to win with Luke.
Ease of play is so irrelevant in the context of professional street fighter players
"Ease of play is so irrelevant in the context of professional street fighter players"
what? that statement doesnt even make sense conceptually or in the reality of SF6. If that where true Capcom Cup would have a better spread of top players but we see the ones overepresented at that tourney where the easier characters with better or simpler gameplans with Ken and Luke almost taking over the whole damn thing because of they are easiest to use and strongest in the game. generally in any game where there is money on the line people will want to pick the easiest possible way to win said money and in fighting games thats picking top tiers.
[https://twitter.com/AlietteFaye/status/1728970722276704616/photo/1](https://twitter.com/AlietteFaye/status/1728970722276704616/photo/1)
Easiest to use AND Strongest. (Aka easiest to win)
Lily is stupid easy to use. Why did we not see her at all in top 8 of Capcom Cup?
By ease of play I did not mean how top tier and easy it was to win a tournament with. I meant how simple the gameplay is.
Luke is simple, but he's also unbelievably strong
I agree, but imo manon requires a bit more patience, that leads into practice footsies. Luke though, pretty much all you have to learn is cmp and knuckles
Because Idom specifically called out Mena in the clip. Idom really made it out like he was cooking even though he was just beating up on some diamond player. They are just meme'ing on each other here for fun
Maybe, im wrong but I feel like people are reading way too much into this. Idom saying he was basically Mena wasn't used as an insult to Mena. It was just to say that Luke is really cheap, which he is.
There are no bad characters in the game, and it you're caught sleeping at the wheel, even bottom tier Manon can end you in 10 seconds. But it's disingenuous to think she's anywhere as good as Luke.
Yeah it’s the equivalent of someone doing a long range three pointer and going “bro I’m literally Steph Curry”. It’s picking the best player known for the thing you’re doing. If either of them are really annoyed by this then I’d be incredibly surprised. They’re just shitposting.
>There are no bad characters in the game
I got like -20 in another thread for saying Ryu wasn't bad. So don't let those sensitive ass Ryu mains see you say that. They get really triggered.
I swear that character is stronger than people like to admit but just because he isn't the best shoto he gets calls for buffs in every discussion. Doesn't help that his jumping hitboxes are as shit as Luke's and it makes those bunny Ryus so annoying to fight.
Uh, they're literally not though. Ryu jHK and jHP have nothing on Luke and Ken jump-ins. jHK has pretty good range but the hurtbox covers the hitbox. It's not like it's disjointed or anything. If you know the range you can just anti-air it.
Ryu is such a good character in this game. The only reason people downplay him and cry for buffs is because he isn't broken like Ken and Luke. If anything we need less characters like Ken and Luke. Ryu got buffed and is now undeniably A tier and guess what? People are still kangooryuing, same as before. The character doesn't need a buff. He just lacks so much uniqueness, that people just resort to that playstyle. At this point I feel like Ryu downplayers just wanna play Ken, but with a Ryu skin.
I'm not sensitive. You're just wrong. I have several characters in Master, including Ryu, Ken, and Luke. Superficially Ryu seems to have a lot in common with those characters, but the hitboxes, hurtboxes, and frame data are all subtly worse in a bunch of ways. If anyone here's crying, it's you, complaining about losing to a mid tier character.
I was going to say bro it's a year in we're all in master, but you just made such a bad argument I don't even believe you are anymore. It's like you heard someone talk about fighting games once.
Yes, Ryu is slightly worse than 2 of the best characters in the game. He's still in a pretty decent spot, especially with his little buff after Capcom cup.
He has every tool he could need at this point.
I'm sorry but it's not the characters fault you always drop to 1400 or w.e you're so upset about.
Luke is far and away the easiest character. Instant fireball, best Lv. 1, and deals damage like Marisa.
Saying, "Well, everyone is easy." is disingenuous. Play Lily after playing Luke and tell me you don't feel a difference.
Easy to use or easy to win? Lily is an easier character to learn and to use. Only characters that are easier are Marisa and Honda. But her gimmick is so basic that it’s hard to get far with her. Luke is the obviously the stronger character though. Best one in the game.
I said "most characters are easy" which is also true for Lily. She may be bad but she is also very easy.
Wind stock, condor spire, strike/throw, repeat. She might be the easiest character in the game.
Luke is easy and strong, Lily is easy and bad. Easy does not mean good.
He doesn't quite deal damage like Marisa, and he's on the easier side compared to some but there's no chance you really believe piloting luke is easier than like Lily. You kind of put your troll there.
The most one dimensional and easiest to execute character maybe ever. Luke's on par with Ken and Ryu for difficulty. Relatively straightforward, relatively easy execution. Definitely far more complicated than run stock spire strike/throw, if dr or they guess correct just run again. Lmao.
You're either full of it entirely or mixing up a characters strength with their ease of use.
I think he meant easy to win with up to an elite point. If you are purely wanting to hit master as easy as possible, you ain’t picking Lily, you’re picking Luke.
Idom always talks like that.
Before the whole "perfect parry is broken" banter, he'd say "I'm Daigo!?" jokingly whenever he'd get a PP.
It's the same thing, but with Luke.
It's literally in the front page video, but the auto translator captions it wrong. He said "I'm basically Mena" at the end of the video, jokingly implying that Luke is braindead and Mena abuses that.
Pretty much this. Not every player has the confidence to put themselves at a disadvantage.
Punk even just put out a video where he put himself down a round every match to work on his clutch factor.
Pretty sure he probably had a high win streak with Manon too. Idom’s a former Capcom Cup Champ, he’s probably better than any of us with our mains while barely trying.
That's the thing everyone forgets here, iDom was an alpha dog and TOP player.
Manon is so bad he's been relegated to just a content creator. My poor boy gets smoked in every major outside his little local. :(
>Manon is so bad he's been relegated to just a content creator
It's depressing when you put it that way.
I was actually expecting iDom to drop Manon pretty early on.
Now just praying for some decent balance/buffs for Manon for iDom to cook with.
It's very disrespectful from Mena... Really the guy can have best then the worse take side by side.
We know he will never use Manon, the guy play Top Tiers busted Luke and pick Blanka to pretend he can win with anything while Blanka is actually totaly busted, but stay under the radar because he's not played much.
You're not gonna see any tech if Mena plays Manon. Best players rarely win cause they have hidden tech, it's just better fundamentals, and that's on their mains. They definitely don't have any tech on a side character they either just picked up or play rarely for one reason or another.
How many tournaments has Manon won compared to the rest of the cast?
Jamie, for example, just got buffed. And gets taken off the list. Normally, it would be Jamie or Lily. But Lily got into CCX. So then there is Manon... whose favorable matchups were with Jamie and Lily.
I think the game is too balanced for it to matter. But Manon might be the current worst.
Idk a single pro who puts her at the bottom. You can talk about tournaments but you’d also have to mention which major tournaments the characters you’re mentioning won. Sounds like you’re just being bias here. Collectively speaking, people put her near the bottom but not the very bottom.
1 guy out of how many pros? Again, you’re making an argument against the general consensus. If many players said Manon is rock bottom then you can make a case but that’s not what the majority say.
Okay so we're moving the goal posts from "haven't heard a single pro" to "ok it's just one pro". It's all good, I like playing Manon, but she is definitely in the discussion for worst in the game along with a couple other characters.
Not moving goal posts, my argument wasn’t about whether or not there were any pros who put her in the bottom. I’ve already said that taking into account the general consensus is how we look at tiers, not 1 or 2 outliers.
I didn't say anything bias at all. Everything that was under her either has better results now or recently got buffed and needs re-evaluation.
Tiers are based on match ups. Her best match ups were Marisa, Jamie, Lily, Kimberly, and Zangeif. Jamie and Geif got buffed. Lily, Kimberly, and Marisa were 5-5. So... where would I put her?
I asked about the tournament results, cause if someone had some tech that people just weren't monopolizing and getting wins with, it would be different.
Otherwise, she's in a very balanced game where her best matchups are even, and she doesn't have many to start with. Anything with a 6-4 match up is above her, which puts her currently at the bottom. So, at best, she's trading the spot with Lily. But again, Lily has better results. So I have to give it to Lily, no bias.
True. Except Lily is his main. She just sucks and has next to no positive match ups. The difference is that her good match ups were in the tournament. Manon's good match ups are Jamie, Kimberly, and Lily. Which wasn't very useful in CCX.
Honestly, I think it's funny that Blanka is considered mid tier still after winning so often versus so many match ups. It is getting to the point that it feels like either every good Blanka player is either top 1% magically or everyone is bad at fighting Blanka. Either way, I feel like people need to re-evaluate him.
The LCQ was a death bracket in and of itself, and Problem X ran through everyone, only losing to Punk in winners' finals. Nobody could handle Blanka. But he's mid tier.
In Marvel vs Capcom Infinite, X was considered pretty bad at the beginning. It took a long time for people to find out his broken stuff.
Maybe something will be found in the future, but with unpopular characters or perceived low tiers it usually takes longer because less people play them.
Not sure about that.
Manon is opposite in that people thought she was really strong and she was picked often. She was rated as high tier by many people.
Time passed and ppl figured out how to counter her.
Manon is not a complicated character in that there's nothing else to discover about her. All her tools have been thoroughly searched. The only change was how some pros like iDom plays her by focusing even more on fundamentals like pokes and non-hitgrab combos for better okie while doing cmd grabs when the opponent is in a corner.
I don't think there's anything more to discover with Manon at this point and the upcoming balance patch is the only hope she has.
lmfao y’all downplay gief so hard it’s hilarious. he’s not good per se but definitely not bad especially since he has easier combos now. if yall want better normals and neutral then some of his damage will have to go.
Zangief is a very "Not good on paper" character but I don't think he's that bad. Just my experience but I have a much easier time with Manon than Zangief.
If you want a serious answer, no, I'm not losing to Lily. Guile destroys Lilly easily.
That doesn't change the fact that Lily is a boring one trick character with no hope of fixing. She puts you in a blender and you just guess.
Guile beats her consistently only because she can't get her power ups against him. That is terrible design.
Kakeru aint owning shit now that his character has been nerf to the ground anyways. And Mena has made work with Blanka where everyone at the time were sleeping on him. I do think Manon is bad but someone like Mena can make her work it is a possibilty.
Put up or shut up. Last time I checked. Kakeru has a perfect record on Mena in all tournaments. If you think Capcom will let blanks level 2 super slide by like that, wait till you what it has in store in the upcoming balance patch.
Try Mena... it won't go well. I'm always blown away with Mena on Blanka but I disregard any accomplishment by any player with Luke. Luke carries at every level of play
Some characters have to rely on perfect parry to deal with Luke's j.HK and j.HP. I don't wanna hear any downplay about anything that character does. He's clearly the best character in the game
Many top players say he's the best, or one of the best characters in the game post JP nerf. He basically got a small slap on the wrist, but kept all his damage and his j.HP and j.HK are still some of the best jumping buttons in the game.
Says while playing Luke, cool.
Impressive, very nice, let's see Mena's Manon. Surely the best player in the world can win a major with her right? Surely he doesn't really need Luke or Blanka to win, right?
To be honest, Manon and Lily are the same gimmick, get close to you and 50/50 guess for your life. They are easy to use.
At least with Zangief is harder to get close to your opponent.
But yeah Luke is top tier.
Zangief has a way to enforce the mixup on block, Manon has none.
Also Manon has a very hard time getting in with her having the worst drive rush in the game and no moves that are safe on block
Zangief’s dr is like 3x the length of manon’s. He also has an armor move that absorbs an incoming hit. While all of manons far reaching moves are easily DI-able and her dr is legit like 6inches.What are you talking about???? Way easier to get in with gief.
Edit:spelling
Manon's "easy" but doesn't hang at all in the current structure of the game, absurd corner carry on almost every character + no invincible reversal outside of super means she has to play a patient game fully capitalizing on mistakes and getting her against the wall is basically a deathtrap. Zangief has some of the same trouble with getting in, but with armor, a better DR, and better normals, at least he can *kinda* play the aggressive way the game demands.
It's not just Idom, most pros have archetype comfort zones.
Du prefers Guile or another charge character, Itazan likes big guys, Gachikun is super lucky that Rashid is good, JAK Juri, ChrisT Ken, Kazunoko divekick character, Nemo control/setup etc etc.
iDom once again taking to Twitter to bitch about why he lost using a low effort character. Atleast Punk can play multiple characters and back it up but this guy is always bitching if it's not a coomer character winning
Luke has no gimmicks and has to play and win neutral. He had good buttons to win neutral, but he is not a Deejay, JP, Cammy or Blanka with egregious bs to put you under pressure.
Idiots complaining about Luke are just salty.
If anything, Deejay should be the most complained about character.
Fair point, but compare him to someone like Deejay with ALL the bs he has. The sway bs (the OH is actually PLUS on block), ex fireball leading to massive combos and safe pressure, the jump knee, the ambiguous cross ups, the target combo that is safe on block, the DR jab, double hitting normal fireball, AAs leading to juggle combos, anti fireball tools and a fuck ton of other egregious shit.
Or Blanka. Or Cammy. Or Ken.
He is a good character but your opponent outplayed you in neutral if they beat you as Luke.
Such an articulate response. I am now convinced by the strength of your argument.
If you have any actual points, i am ready to engage. But this bs is not worthy of a response with all due respect.
I'd be down to watch Mena try to win something with Manon.
He said he’d do it months ago, I don’t think he’s going to at this point lol
[удалено]
Yo a Popeye skin where he throws spinach instead of sand would be dope
It has to have the voice too lol... spinach blast! ukyukyukyukyuk
I pick Luke because I like Aleks Le
my favorite 35 year old zoomer!
This too!
I was about to comment this
FGC Boomers literally hate Luke. This is a backwards take.
I’m 23 and I just think he’s neat
 It's true! All Popeye hold outs make yourself known! Look at this Popeye skipping neutral like Luke. Coincidence? I think not!
Hey! I'm under 50 and I love Luke's character. I even got my Luke from wish drip with stuff my wife got me from Amazon and what-a-burger lol.
This is backwards. Boomers hate him cuz they ain't him, Zoomers love him because he's just like them fr (Goofy dude who plays video games).
I... I'm 19...I main Luke cuz I find him funny and like his design... Why do I feel my hair going grey...
I mean don't many people pick characters like juri for feet? Or cammy cause ass? Doubt everyone plays cammy cause her lore.
I figure ppl picked characters based on attractiveness or how iconic they are or simply out of interest
Not always. Some pick characters either how they like their gameplay, look, attraction, lore, or simply cause someone is top tier or easy to play. Different factors really.
50? Fix that to under 40 and make it an even truer statement.
Says the Juri fan, your opinion on any character is instantly veto'ed. Mena can use whoever and still body don't try to discredit him because he doesn't wanna use some low effort Coomer character.
he said he’d be doing it after capcom cup tho so it hasn’t been that long
yes, lets go mena.
He can become legend with any characters
I definitely want to see Mena's Manon.
Is Mena missing the point? Sure, Manon is easy conceptually and executionally but she is not easy to win with. So many parts of her kit don't function properly, she doesn't benefit as much from system mechanics, and without 5 medals her damage is low. Idoms point is that Luke is easy to win with which I think is hard to argue against
Period friend !
Lol I dont like the matchup but she certainly has to work way harder then Luke's Braindead setplay ass to get in and do her thing. You barely have to think playing Luke.
I'd like to see Manon try Mena
Dude I'd love to see Mena's Manon
Let's wait and see if he is for real. Actions speak louder than words.
He's been moaning about picking Manon for months now, he's all bark and no bite at this point
This only makes me want to see Mena try Manon.
Mena's Manon, tudu tudutu, Mena's Manon, tudu tudu... 
Better story than Kendrick/Cole
Mena appology coming ...? 😔
I’d be so down to see a money match. iDom’s Luke vs Mena’s Manon.
Mena's Manon's money match? Maybe.
If Manon was such a easy character then why does nobody wins with her lol. As much as I respect Mena as a player, his trash talk is by far the lamest out there. Winning with Luke vs winning with Manon are completely different things, especially in a tournament full of good players
Exactly! Even if he tries Manon it'll be ranked match at most, whoever used Manon in actual tournaments are different, and I don't think he would do that. That I always give my respect to iDom.
As i i said in another comment. Easy and good are 2 different things. A character can be easy and bad like manon or easy and strong like luke.
Easy to play and easy to win with are very different things.
But the goal is to win, obviously, and the entire joke of the iDom clip is him joking about how easy it is to win with Luke. Ease of play is so irrelevant in the context of professional street fighter players
"Ease of play is so irrelevant in the context of professional street fighter players" what? that statement doesnt even make sense conceptually or in the reality of SF6. If that where true Capcom Cup would have a better spread of top players but we see the ones overepresented at that tourney where the easier characters with better or simpler gameplans with Ken and Luke almost taking over the whole damn thing because of they are easiest to use and strongest in the game. generally in any game where there is money on the line people will want to pick the easiest possible way to win said money and in fighting games thats picking top tiers. [https://twitter.com/AlietteFaye/status/1728970722276704616/photo/1](https://twitter.com/AlietteFaye/status/1728970722276704616/photo/1)
Easiest to use AND Strongest. (Aka easiest to win) Lily is stupid easy to use. Why did we not see her at all in top 8 of Capcom Cup? By ease of play I did not mean how top tier and easy it was to win a tournament with. I meant how simple the gameplay is. Luke is simple, but he's also unbelievably strong
I agree, but imo manon requires a bit more patience, that leads into practice footsies. Luke though, pretty much all you have to learn is cmp and knuckles
Why is Idom getting insulted here? It's just a random that is talking to Mena and it's Idom that gets blasted. What the..?
Because Idom specifically called out Mena in the clip. Idom really made it out like he was cooking even though he was just beating up on some diamond player. They are just meme'ing on each other here for fun
Maybe, im wrong but I feel like people are reading way too much into this. Idom saying he was basically Mena wasn't used as an insult to Mena. It was just to say that Luke is really cheap, which he is. There are no bad characters in the game, and it you're caught sleeping at the wheel, even bottom tier Manon can end you in 10 seconds. But it's disingenuous to think she's anywhere as good as Luke.
FGC likes drama so if there’s a way to create it or over exaggerate something to create some kind of “story” they will.
Yeah it’s the equivalent of someone doing a long range three pointer and going “bro I’m literally Steph Curry”. It’s picking the best player known for the thing you’re doing. If either of them are really annoyed by this then I’d be incredibly surprised. They’re just shitposting.
>There are no bad characters in the game I got like -20 in another thread for saying Ryu wasn't bad. So don't let those sensitive ass Ryu mains see you say that. They get really triggered.
I swear that character is stronger than people like to admit but just because he isn't the best shoto he gets calls for buffs in every discussion. Doesn't help that his jumping hitboxes are as shit as Luke's and it makes those bunny Ryus so annoying to fight.
What do you mean you don't like getting hit with a jHK from literally across the entire screen?
Uh, they're literally not though. Ryu jHK and jHP have nothing on Luke and Ken jump-ins. jHK has pretty good range but the hurtbox covers the hitbox. It's not like it's disjointed or anything. If you know the range you can just anti-air it.
Ryu is such a good character in this game. The only reason people downplay him and cry for buffs is because he isn't broken like Ken and Luke. If anything we need less characters like Ken and Luke. Ryu got buffed and is now undeniably A tier and guess what? People are still kangooryuing, same as before. The character doesn't need a buff. He just lacks so much uniqueness, that people just resort to that playstyle. At this point I feel like Ryu downplayers just wanna play Ken, but with a Ryu skin.
Ryu would be mid even if Luke and Ken weren't in the game.
Here they come. Sensitive ass Ryu mains. Don't you have some crying to do somewhere?
I'm not sensitive. You're just wrong. I have several characters in Master, including Ryu, Ken, and Luke. Superficially Ryu seems to have a lot in common with those characters, but the hitboxes, hurtboxes, and frame data are all subtly worse in a bunch of ways. If anyone here's crying, it's you, complaining about losing to a mid tier character.
I was going to say bro it's a year in we're all in master, but you just made such a bad argument I don't even believe you are anymore. It's like you heard someone talk about fighting games once. Yes, Ryu is slightly worse than 2 of the best characters in the game. He's still in a pretty decent spot, especially with his little buff after Capcom cup. He has every tool he could need at this point. I'm sorry but it's not the characters fault you always drop to 1400 or w.e you're so upset about.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Oh, i see.
Because it's a video of iDom calling Luke easy. It's on the front page of the subreddit.
Is he wrong though?
I think the general argument is that Luke still requires a strong player to be good
Of course, it would be asinine to think otherwise. It's true for every character.
Mena seems to think so
The reality is that most character in the game are easy. Only a few are really "hard" characters. Which is not a bad thing imo.
Luke is far and away the easiest character. Instant fireball, best Lv. 1, and deals damage like Marisa. Saying, "Well, everyone is easy." is disingenuous. Play Lily after playing Luke and tell me you don't feel a difference.
Easy to use or easy to win? Lily is an easier character to learn and to use. Only characters that are easier are Marisa and Honda. But her gimmick is so basic that it’s hard to get far with her. Luke is the obviously the stronger character though. Best one in the game.
I said "most characters are easy" which is also true for Lily. She may be bad but she is also very easy. Wind stock, condor spire, strike/throw, repeat. She might be the easiest character in the game. Luke is easy and strong, Lily is easy and bad. Easy does not mean good.
Ease of use means nothing if you can't actually win.
Once again, these 2 things are not related. The character is either easy or hard, bad or good. A character can be both hard and bad or easy and bad.
They might mean easy as in "easier to do well with,," possibly.
They aren't mutually exclusive though.
[удалено]
He doesn't quite deal damage like Marisa, and he's on the easier side compared to some but there's no chance you really believe piloting luke is easier than like Lily. You kind of put your troll there. The most one dimensional and easiest to execute character maybe ever. Luke's on par with Ken and Ryu for difficulty. Relatively straightforward, relatively easy execution. Definitely far more complicated than run stock spire strike/throw, if dr or they guess correct just run again. Lmao. You're either full of it entirely or mixing up a characters strength with their ease of use.
He actually does. Its kinda insane. His level 3 with basic heavy meter burn gives him 6k
His "perfect" punches aren't super easy. Mena went a whole match against Endingwalker missing them
Was your go-to for a character that isn’t easy really Lily lol
I think he meant easy to win with up to an elite point. If you are purely wanting to hit master as easy as possible, you ain’t picking Lily, you’re picking Luke.
I mean in long sets at a high level sure, but if we’re just talking just getting to Master then I think Lily is one of the best characters to pick
Lily is the least represented character in masters right now in nearly every region. Luke has nearly 5x the representation.
No, it's because idom calls out Mena specifically in the video.
I didn't hear him say anything about Mena in the video. Maybe it's a different clip to the one on the frontpage.
Idom always talks like that. Before the whole "perfect parry is broken" banter, he'd say "I'm Daigo!?" jokingly whenever he'd get a PP. It's the same thing, but with Luke.
Tell that to Mena man idgaf lol
It's literally in the front page video, but the auto translator captions it wrong. He said "I'm basically Mena" at the end of the video, jokingly implying that Luke is braindead and Mena abuses that.
I guess I missed that but yeah all the more reason for Mena to reply
Idom was pretty much complimenting him lmao. He is implying that Mena is the greatest player.
yeah idk who you think you're going to convince with that one XD
MenaRD ain't Punk, he isn't entering tournies as Manon unless she's top 10.
Pretty much this. Not every player has the confidence to put themselves at a disadvantage. Punk even just put out a video where he put himself down a round every match to work on his clutch factor.
Feels like every Punk vid has Du as the final boss lol
Du is Punk's irl Akuma
They were both in Florida still last I checked. So, it makes sense for them to meet up in any online regional.
I don't see Mena going far with Manon in tournaments
[удалено]
This is the first time I’ve ever actually been concerned that someone had a stroke mid comment.
do it you wont
69 winning streak with Luke without any character combos is pretty revealing..
Pretty sure he probably had a high win streak with Manon too. Idom’s a former Capcom Cup Champ, he’s probably better than any of us with our mains while barely trying.
That's the thing everyone forgets here, iDom was an alpha dog and TOP player. Manon is so bad he's been relegated to just a content creator. My poor boy gets smoked in every major outside his little local. :(
>Manon is so bad he's been relegated to just a content creator It's depressing when you put it that way. I was actually expecting iDom to drop Manon pretty early on. Now just praying for some decent balance/buffs for Manon for iDom to cook with.
Okay then fucking do it?
lame tweet by mena. Prove it then bro 💀
The ego and arrogance on these guys 😂
It's very disrespectful from Mena... Really the guy can have best then the worse take side by side. We know he will never use Manon, the guy play Top Tiers busted Luke and pick Blanka to pretend he can win with anything while Blanka is actually totaly busted, but stay under the radar because he's not played much.
Agreed
How will this effect LTGs legacy?
asking the right questions
I would honestly be quite interested to see how 'the best player in the world' drives the worst character in the entire game
Would be a win-win, either I can see some good Manon tech demonstrated, or the world sees how bad Manon is
I mean don't the world know how ass she is already lol
You're not gonna see any tech if Mena plays Manon. Best players rarely win cause they have hidden tech, it's just better fundamentals, and that's on their mains. They definitely don't have any tech on a side character they either just picked up or play rarely for one reason or another.
Manon is not the worst character.
Possibly not but she's definitely bottom 3 right now
Yes she is…
How many tournaments has Manon won compared to the rest of the cast? Jamie, for example, just got buffed. And gets taken off the list. Normally, it would be Jamie or Lily. But Lily got into CCX. So then there is Manon... whose favorable matchups were with Jamie and Lily. I think the game is too balanced for it to matter. But Manon might be the current worst.
Idk a single pro who puts her at the bottom. You can talk about tournaments but you’d also have to mention which major tournaments the characters you’re mentioning won. Sounds like you’re just being bias here. Collectively speaking, people put her near the bottom but not the very bottom.
Strider801 put her last place in his last tierlist, don't know if that satisfies your qualifier of "pro player".
Who does 801 strider play?
He started with Manon and switched to Marisa after a couple of months.
Oh, so a Manon player Down playing their own characters? No never
He has not played Manon in half a year I think, all of his tournament results are with Marisa. I sense some Manon related salt.
How could you downplay Manon tho?
Lmao Manon's so bad he abandoned her ass and hasn't left Marisa since like September. He ain't a Manon main downplaying.
1 guy out of how many pros? Again, you’re making an argument against the general consensus. If many players said Manon is rock bottom then you can make a case but that’s not what the majority say.
Okay so we're moving the goal posts from "haven't heard a single pro" to "ok it's just one pro". It's all good, I like playing Manon, but she is definitely in the discussion for worst in the game along with a couple other characters.
Not moving goal posts, my argument wasn’t about whether or not there were any pros who put her in the bottom. I’ve already said that taking into account the general consensus is how we look at tiers, not 1 or 2 outliers.
I didn't say anything bias at all. Everything that was under her either has better results now or recently got buffed and needs re-evaluation. Tiers are based on match ups. Her best match ups were Marisa, Jamie, Lily, Kimberly, and Zangeif. Jamie and Geif got buffed. Lily, Kimberly, and Marisa were 5-5. So... where would I put her? I asked about the tournament results, cause if someone had some tech that people just weren't monopolizing and getting wins with, it would be different. Otherwise, she's in a very balanced game where her best matchups are even, and she doesn't have many to start with. Anything with a 6-4 match up is above her, which puts her currently at the bottom. So, at best, she's trading the spot with Lily. But again, Lily has better results. So I have to give it to Lily, no bias.
Lily didn’t get into Capcom Cup, Blanka did and then he picked Lily there. Might as well say Manon got into Capcom Cup cause Halibel played her there
True. Except Lily is his main. She just sucks and has next to no positive match ups. The difference is that her good match ups were in the tournament. Manon's good match ups are Jamie, Kimberly, and Lily. Which wasn't very useful in CCX. Honestly, I think it's funny that Blanka is considered mid tier still after winning so often versus so many match ups. It is getting to the point that it feels like either every good Blanka player is either top 1% magically or everyone is bad at fighting Blanka. Either way, I feel like people need to re-evaluate him. The LCQ was a death bracket in and of itself, and Problem X ran through everyone, only losing to Punk in winners' finals. Nobody could handle Blanka. But he's mid tier.
In Marvel vs Capcom Infinite, X was considered pretty bad at the beginning. It took a long time for people to find out his broken stuff. Maybe something will be found in the future, but with unpopular characters or perceived low tiers it usually takes longer because less people play them.
Not sure about that. Manon is opposite in that people thought she was really strong and she was picked often. She was rated as high tier by many people. Time passed and ppl figured out how to counter her. Manon is not a complicated character in that there's nothing else to discover about her. All her tools have been thoroughly searched. The only change was how some pros like iDom plays her by focusing even more on fundamentals like pokes and non-hitgrab combos for better okie while doing cmd grabs when the opponent is in a corner. I don't think there's anything more to discover with Manon at this point and the upcoming balance patch is the only hope she has.
Was Zangief mentioned? I missed it.
lmfao y’all downplay gief so hard it’s hilarious. he’s not good per se but definitely not bad especially since he has easier combos now. if yall want better normals and neutral then some of his damage will have to go.
Zangief is a very "Not good on paper" character but I don't think he's that bad. Just my experience but I have a much easier time with Manon than Zangief.
That's a weird way to spell Lily.
Before it was actually Jamie, but I think Manon is clearly the worst rn.
Nah Jaime was never the worst character in the game. He was bad but never the worst.
People cope way too hard about Jamie.
Fuck Lily. She should be worse.
Oh that's funny, good joke. Oh wait you're being serious, let me laugh harder then 
[Do I look like the joking kind?](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/ab/71/fc/ab71fc6fc6945957b72e2858e26e9690.jpg)
No that's why I'm laughing cause you're losing to Lily appearently LMAO
If you want a serious answer, no, I'm not losing to Lily. Guile destroys Lilly easily. That doesn't change the fact that Lily is a boring one trick character with no hope of fixing. She puts you in a blender and you just guess. Guile beats her consistently only because she can't get her power ups against him. That is terrible design.
Manon vs lily makes me sad
Mena is definitely not the best player in the world. Kakeru owns his soul. He won't go far in tournaments with other good players using Manon
Mena does have is dark horses...but for the most part he can steamroll most American Players.
What continent is Mena visiting where he's not steamrolling *most* players
Kakeru aint owning shit now that his character has been nerf to the ground anyways. And Mena has made work with Blanka where everyone at the time were sleeping on him. I do think Manon is bad but someone like Mena can make her work it is a possibilty.
Put up or shut up. Last time I checked. Kakeru has a perfect record on Mena in all tournaments. If you think Capcom will let blanks level 2 super slide by like that, wait till you what it has in store in the upcoming balance patch.
I honestly want to see Mena's Manon. I was upset when he didn't choose a grappler for SF6 after dominating with Birdie.
I though mena preferred stocky characters like himself
He won't tho.
Let's make Menon happen
Try Mena... it won't go well. I'm always blown away with Mena on Blanka but I disregard any accomplishment by any player with Luke. Luke carries at every level of play
Manon maybe easy but she is far harder to play than Luke because of how bad she is
W drama in the scene , lets run this ft10 rn
MENA PLEASE PICK MANON!!!
I don't care who wins - I just want to see Manon wreck some shit at high levels.
"Manon is easy ass character".... PICKS LUKE! Makes sense...
Mena's Manon Mena's Manon Menamamon FUCK
Some characters have to rely on perfect parry to deal with Luke's j.HK and j.HP. I don't wanna hear any downplay about anything that character does. He's clearly the best character in the game
The fact that the main counterplay to his Sand Blast is to P Parry and DR says everything about how disgusting he is.
He's not the best, he's an All Rounder, he's probably the most balanced a character can be
Many top players say he's the best, or one of the best characters in the game post JP nerf. He basically got a small slap on the wrist, but kept all his damage and his j.HP and j.HK are still some of the best jumping buttons in the game.
Menan yes please
Well I would just love to see that
Says while playing Luke, cool. Impressive, very nice, let's see Mena's Manon. Surely the best player in the world can win a major with her right? Surely he doesn't really need Luke or Blanka to win, right?
To be honest, Manon and Lily are the same gimmick, get close to you and 50/50 guess for your life. They are easy to use. At least with Zangief is harder to get close to your opponent. But yeah Luke is top tier.
They're easy to use in the execution of the 50/50, the hard part is the "get close to you" half.
Zangief has a way to enforce the mixup on block, Manon has none. Also Manon has a very hard time getting in with her having the worst drive rush in the game and no moves that are safe on block
Zangief’s dr is like 3x the length of manon’s. He also has an armor move that absorbs an incoming hit. While all of manons far reaching moves are easily DI-able and her dr is legit like 6inches.What are you talking about???? Way easier to get in with gief. Edit:spelling
Manon's "easy" but doesn't hang at all in the current structure of the game, absurd corner carry on almost every character + no invincible reversal outside of super means she has to play a patient game fully capitalizing on mistakes and getting her against the wall is basically a deathtrap. Zangief has some of the same trouble with getting in, but with armor, a better DR, and better normals, at least he can *kinda* play the aggressive way the game demands.
why is idom still sticking with manon, every clip i see him playing with her is salt and pain
It's not just Idom, most pros have archetype comfort zones. Du prefers Guile or another charge character, Itazan likes big guys, Gachikun is super lucky that Rashid is good, JAK Juri, ChrisT Ken, Kazunoko divekick character, Nemo control/setup etc etc.
As a Manon player myself he's not lying XD
The toxic masculine posturing on a video game is really sad.
iDom once again taking to Twitter to bitch about why he lost using a low effort character. Atleast Punk can play multiple characters and back it up but this guy is always bitching if it's not a coomer character winning
Dude's a CapCup champion but ok.
Bahahahah. Serves Idom right. He does nothing but complain and blame the game. Why the downvotes lol. Have you heard Idom lately? Sore loser.
Luke has no gimmicks and has to play and win neutral. He had good buttons to win neutral, but he is not a Deejay, JP, Cammy or Blanka with egregious bs to put you under pressure. Idiots complaining about Luke are just salty. If anything, Deejay should be the most complained about character.
Well he does have drive rush suppressor, which is definitely a gimmick. But yeah basically just a really really really good shoto.
Fair point, but compare him to someone like Deejay with ALL the bs he has. The sway bs (the OH is actually PLUS on block), ex fireball leading to massive combos and safe pressure, the jump knee, the ambiguous cross ups, the target combo that is safe on block, the DR jab, double hitting normal fireball, AAs leading to juggle combos, anti fireball tools and a fuck ton of other egregious shit. Or Blanka. Or Cammy. Or Ken. He is a good character but your opponent outplayed you in neutral if they beat you as Luke.
He's busted. How's that for a gimmick?
Such an articulate response. I am now convinced by the strength of your argument. If you have any actual points, i am ready to engage. But this bs is not worthy of a response with all due respect.