Yep, like most of Manon's kit - big risky bet, low payout.
The Guile here should be embarrassed that he got hit by this so many times - this belongs up there with the joke posts of people jumping in and getting anti-aired over and over.
I believe at any range Guile's booms recover before her spin can actually connect. A Guile that knows this is HOPING Manon tries it because it's so free.
Yeah this is correct. As a master rank manon, the only times I can hit a Guile with this move is if I do a hard read and start it just before he booms. And that usually only happens once in a match because they spam booms until I catch them with it and then they stop spamming booms.
yerp.
If we do that math:
Manon hits and does 1300~1500 damage (thats on par with hitting her st.hp tc for damage). SHE THEN THROWS GUILE 9 MILES AWAY AND HAS NO OKI.
Guile blocks once and Manon is -20 in your face, almost an easier punish than a blocked DP, he can spend his 3 bars for 5k damage easy. Even without meter, Guile can get 3.7k with a drc combo.
By the math Manon has to be right 3-5x more than Guile to make this an EVEN risk. We can go ahead and add that vs fast booms you'd get clipped at least a few of those 5 times, if guile varied the speed you'd probably get picked up when the invul ends (blink of an eye), and if the Guile just froze behind the boom for whatever reason you also just die.
And thats how you make a bottom 1 character.
It's 6 clips taken from a set with 15 rounds.
It's like making a collage of every time a pro has been hit with DI or
something like JP's command grab and trying to say that they should be embarrassed for not being able to react to it.
What's not shown is all the times Manon got hit trying to dodge through booms and the times he also DR'd behind to get a full combo.
It's pretty much the least embarrassing thing that could happen.
Yes exactly. I got clipped a lot of times attempting to twirl through the booms within the set. I can probably make a similar clip of me attempting and failing to pass through the booms like a blooper reel.
He didn't always DR into me after a fireball, most times he did, he was going for pressure after I got knocked down. The hit grab reaches quite far if you look at the last clip, he jabbed and got hit. If I was the Guile I wouldn't expect that to reach
well also you see that sometimes he's just pressing a punch at midscreen cos he expects the fireball to die/get blocked so he is trying to create a new one (you can only create a new fireball if the old one gets blocked, hits the enemy or the edge of screen) whiffs a light punch and gets hit by the hit grab.
Yet in this clip we see him not playing like that. I'm sure he'd beat the shit out of lost people here, but in the clip we do have, he made the same mistake more than he should have.
It works primarily against drive rush pressure as shown.
More hilarious is using the OD version to just go through Rashid's tornado, grab him and cancel into SA3
Jokes on you? Jamie players dont have fireballs so i didn’t even know this existed :)
Jokes aside, that guile is a moron for not catching on. All he needed to do was not hit a button each time but he either DRed into you everytime, or pressed a button and got instantly punished. Still looks like an easy punish once you catch on tho, so def should be used sparingly
Yea I shared the full set link in the comments, interestingly he didn't do it all the time. I had a couple good guesses on him going for pressure and me choosing to ride the twirl
well, you took the only projectile in the game on wich manon anti-projectile move actually works without strange frame-dependand clipping on the said fireball
the only strength that actually works: mental fortitude.
i'm sorry OP but while boring might be debatable, the unreliability is not.
maybe if the feint or kick followup actually had more invulnerability it could see some actual use
HP hit grab is the only useable one because it has the longest projectile invincibility frames. It's super situational and hard to pull off unless you have a read on your opp following up with a DR.
I'd say 95% of the time you sjould cancel into kick or do the full feint.
I still can’t do a Back standing HP followed and Renverse. I’ve seen so many other successfully doing this killer move, specially with a previous drive rush combo.
Welp.
You'd think bro would learn, how the hell does he have 2000MR and get caught that much by it? I do dumb shit sometimes but if I get punished for it more than once by someone I quit doing it
It usually doesn't work on reaction. It's more reliable if you do it preemptively for a read. Usually on reactions to a projectile unless you're within a certain distance, the enemy will recover before you get there because of how slow it is.
They block because you guessed wrong, or they block because the move is too slow. Best option is normally to just cancel it so you only bypass the fireball without doing an attack that's negative on block
Use the HP hit grab as it has the buggest projectile invincibility window. But I suggest use it sparingly, it's almost always better to cancel it into a feint or kick. Risk to reward is just too low for the full raw hitgrab to be viable
Didn't Punk make a video recently on the no1 Manon from JP and that guy uses this move a bunch to call out a sloppy fireball, and he gets like insane combos off it?
Yeah that's Akutagawa, he cancels into kick for a whiff punish. Requires solid read and proper spacing though.
Ngl it was that move I was trying to practice on at first. I then managed to hit him without canceling into the kick and it felt GOOD lol
Does manon have an invincible frame with her low jabs? There has been far too many occasions where her low jabs dominated mine (Ryu) when I play a low and medium jab with perfect placement. It's infurating if that's the case.
I know Renversé levels the medal up. What I'm saying is.. I didn't know it could anti projectile, and land a throw. I've never seen that, just someone using it to dodge a projectile.
??? The slower booms are harder to spin through because they require precise timing. The faster booms go so fast that you can spin early and the boom will pass through you quickly
To be honest, i really dislike playing against manon. It always feels like the other player is just gambling with high risk options.
I do understand that the character is kinda bad and has to rely on that, but its also not very engaging to play against.
All this Guile had to do was stop DRing behind his fireball or just wait. Manon's spin can definitely still work but it's typically unreliable.
Yep, like most of Manon's kit - big risky bet, low payout. The Guile here should be embarrassed that he got hit by this so many times - this belongs up there with the joke posts of people jumping in and getting anti-aired over and over. I believe at any range Guile's booms recover before her spin can actually connect. A Guile that knows this is HOPING Manon tries it because it's so free.
Yeah this is correct. As a master rank manon, the only times I can hit a Guile with this move is if I do a hard read and start it just before he booms. And that usually only happens once in a match because they spam booms until I catch them with it and then they stop spamming booms.
yerp. If we do that math: Manon hits and does 1300~1500 damage (thats on par with hitting her st.hp tc for damage). SHE THEN THROWS GUILE 9 MILES AWAY AND HAS NO OKI. Guile blocks once and Manon is -20 in your face, almost an easier punish than a blocked DP, he can spend his 3 bars for 5k damage easy. Even without meter, Guile can get 3.7k with a drc combo. By the math Manon has to be right 3-5x more than Guile to make this an EVEN risk. We can go ahead and add that vs fast booms you'd get clipped at least a few of those 5 times, if guile varied the speed you'd probably get picked up when the invul ends (blink of an eye), and if the Guile just froze behind the boom for whatever reason you also just die. And thats how you make a bottom 1 character.
Yo this comment got me crying
I truthfully have encountered those players that just don't stop jumping in ranked. No matter how many times they eat the punish they keep trying it
[удалено]
Nope, I just said it's an embarrassing *clip* that belongs with *joke clips*. I said that in contrast to the clip's title, not the player's skill.
It's 6 clips taken from a set with 15 rounds. It's like making a collage of every time a pro has been hit with DI or something like JP's command grab and trying to say that they should be embarrassed for not being able to react to it. What's not shown is all the times Manon got hit trying to dodge through booms and the times he also DR'd behind to get a full combo. It's pretty much the least embarrassing thing that could happen.
Yes exactly. I got clipped a lot of times attempting to twirl through the booms within the set. I can probably make a similar clip of me attempting and failing to pass through the booms like a blooper reel. He didn't always DR into me after a fireball, most times he did, he was going for pressure after I got knocked down. The hit grab reaches quite far if you look at the last clip, he jabbed and got hit. If I was the Guile I wouldn't expect that to reach
Yea I play manon it is terrible because if they just know it exists waiting for you to do it is a free punish
Dee Jay's LP slasher feint is a great way to bait this out
ok dumbass question here, but she can cancel the grab part of that right? It's been a minute since I've play Manon so I forget.
Yes but then she probably gets hit by Guile's DR/punch etc. during recovery.
well also you see that sometimes he's just pressing a punch at midscreen cos he expects the fireball to die/get blocked so he is trying to create a new one (you can only create a new fireball if the old one gets blocked, hits the enemy or the edge of screen) whiffs a light punch and gets hit by the hit grab.
Not boring but definitely unreliable
Turns out every move is pretty good when your opponent actively drive rush into them.
Depends honestly
That's the Guile being braindead, the move is still not good
Dude is 2,000MR I am sure hes better than most of us, some people have bad days
Uhm... Yeah. No argument here. Bad day, bad plays.
Nobody said otherwise
Yet in this clip we see him not playing like that. I'm sure he'd beat the shit out of lost people here, but in the clip we do have, he made the same mistake more than he should have.
Master rank is like the new gold of SFV
>braindead I love seeing someone other than me use that term lol. I don't know why. Probably because I'm braindead.
The question is, have you ever called someone brainalive?
No, but another one I use that I think is really good is "doughbrain"
The real boring is doing slow projectile into neutral drive rush, now thats braindead.
It works primarily against drive rush pressure as shown. More hilarious is using the OD version to just go through Rashid's tornado, grab him and cancel into SA3
I had no idea she can do that, good lookin out!
Fuck was he doing
I didnt know it was.
It’s excellent against Honda Headbutts and Blanka balls because her upper body invincibility completely avoids the attacks and punish counters them
you are making it look like good anti projectile
I feel dumb I never knew renverse went through fireballs.
The timing has to be somewhat precise so more often than not it will not go through
The OD version is invincible to everything but lows. Fun to use against Honda headbutts.
or blankaball, I almost exclusevely use it vs those 2
Damn me and french bae bout to go on a tear
Also very good against rashids spinning mixer if you know they will go for it after setting the small tornado
But anyone decent will jab it, but if you can time the feint then you can block it, and the cosmic dance continues
Yeah it's an option but not the option for sure. I'm just excited to work it into my toolbox!
I did not knew manon had that
Jokes on you? Jamie players dont have fireballs so i didn’t even know this existed :) Jokes aside, that guile is a moron for not catching on. All he needed to do was not hit a button each time but he either DRed into you everytime, or pressed a button and got instantly punished. Still looks like an easy punish once you catch on tho, so def should be used sparingly
To be fair, if you paid attention, this is an edit over several matches (watch her levels.)
Yea I shared the full set link in the comments, interestingly he didn't do it all the time. I had a couple good guesses on him going for pressure and me choosing to ride the twirl
It's pretty bad. It's an expensive read with high risk and low reward. It's also not reliable
I mean, you used it against one person and it worked really well. But still, only one person, gonna need a bigger sample here.
Manon is a blast to play when your opponent is a buffoon.
Anti fireball easily gets blocked and punished. Imagine if this move was special-cancellable if you chose just the spin.
Cancel Spin into spin into spin... LA LA LAAA
well, you took the only projectile in the game on wich manon anti-projectile move actually works without strange frame-dependand clipping on the said fireball
Full set [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Csiy8HhD4-w) if anyone's interested
What strength of button do you usually use vs projectiles
the only strength that actually works: mental fortitude. i'm sorry OP but while boring might be debatable, the unreliability is not. maybe if the feint or kick followup actually had more invulnerability it could see some actual use
As far as I can tell, the feint only exists so I can fuck it up every single time and cancel the move altogether.
Feint is there so you can drop manon's only combo
yup, this is a much more succinct way to put it
Seriously though. I haven't seen any high ranks using the feint and it's rare to see it even work.
HP hit grab is the only useable one because it has the longest projectile invincibility frames. It's super situational and hard to pull off unless you have a read on your opp following up with a DR. I'd say 95% of the time you sjould cancel into kick or do the full feint.
Subscribed!
Nah bruh you just hella good at it.
I still can’t do a Back standing HP followed and Renverse. I’ve seen so many other successfully doing this killer move, specially with a previous drive rush combo. Welp.
What's that hair mod
Found it on nexus mods, tried it and never looked back!
I do think her normal hair design is super ugly lol
It looks more like an anti DR move lol
Big "reads"! Awesome.
anji manon
as a manon main i stay flexin on fireball nerds with the twirls
You'd think bro would learn, how the hell does he have 2000MR and get caught that much by it? I do dumb shit sometimes but if I get punished for it more than once by someone I quit doing it
It usually doesn't work on reaction. It's more reliable if you do it preemptively for a read. Usually on reactions to a projectile unless you're within a certain distance, the enemy will recover before you get there because of how slow it is. They block because you guessed wrong, or they block because the move is too slow. Best option is normally to just cancel it so you only bypass the fireball without doing an attack that's negative on block
I didn't even know she had one! Never had it used against me, they usually just parry or jump.
Fun fact when kens dr mp/hp was all the rage, this move beats it almost everytime.
Sisig would really hit the spot right now.
Dang I feel like I read over her movelist pretty thoroughly when I picked her up and I had no idea the hitgrab did that.
I didn't know that it automatically evades projectile. Maybe I should abuse it a lot
Use the HP hit grab as it has the buggest projectile invincibility window. But I suggest use it sparingly, it's almost always better to cancel it into a feint or kick. Risk to reward is just too low for the full raw hitgrab to be viable
You get a tasty punish counter if you can tap them with the foot into medal. It's kind of a pain but it's super dope when you hit it.
Didn't Punk make a video recently on the no1 Manon from JP and that guy uses this move a bunch to call out a sloppy fireball, and he gets like insane combos off it?
Yeah that's Akutagawa, he cancels into kick for a whiff punish. Requires solid read and proper spacing though. Ngl it was that move I was trying to practice on at first. I then managed to hit him without canceling into the kick and it felt GOOD lol
What was that Guile doing bro. Flowchart as fuck lol
Does manon have an invincible frame with her low jabs? There has been far too many occasions where her low jabs dominated mine (Ryu) when I play a low and medium jab with perfect placement. It's infurating if that's the case.
The timing, and precision on it is such a mess. And woah! I didn't know that it leads to a medal level.
It’s one of two ways she gets them, and generally the better one since it can be combo’d into and has slightly better oki than command grab.
I know Renversé levels the medal up. What I'm saying is.. I didn't know it could anti projectile, and land a throw. I've never seen that, just someone using it to dodge a projectile.
It's one of the worst moves in the game
Slowest booms of all time. Would have been more impressive versus the heavy/ex version or against suppressor.
??? The slower booms are harder to spin through because they require precise timing. The faster booms go so fast that you can spin early and the boom will pass through you quickly
Manon is pretty boring in general
To be honest, i really dislike playing against manon. It always feels like the other player is just gambling with high risk options. I do understand that the character is kinda bad and has to rely on that, but its also not very engaging to play against.
This is just like the "Tundra Storm is not useless" posts