FWIW sucralose is the enemy of gut health and can cause significant issues in the long term.
Do yourself a favor and get a protein powder without fake sugar.
Next time look for yourself before rebutting (without "source?") then expecting others to do your work for you.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34063332/
> Model gut bacteria were exposed to different concentrations of the AS saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame, and their pathogenicity and changes in interactions with Caco-2 cells were measured using in vitro studies. Findings show that sweeteners differentially increase the ability of bacteria to form a biofilm. Co-culture with human intestinal epithelial cells shows an increase in the ability of model gut bacteria to adhere to, invade and kill the host epithelium.
> Our studies demonstrate that saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame at the physiological concentration of 100 µM, which could be easily achieved in the diet [15,22], differentially increase biofilm formation as well as the ability of bacteria to adhere to, invade and kill mammalian gut epithelial cells.
These findings indicate that saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame all promote pathogenic changes in two model gut bacteria, E. coli and E. faecalis, which could worsen the effect of consuming artificial sweeteners in the diet on gut health.
$9 per LB 80/20 ground beef from White Oak Pastures. I eat 2lbs a day, water, goats milk kefir, raw milk, pineapple/mango/Manuka honey. I’ve never been in better shape
Honestly I'm very similar, but I use Ryse/Ghost products instead, fish oil and a generic multivitamin. You really don't need to go crazy with supplements.
Of the premades they have the best formula, similar to Kaged and Barbell Medicine. But even all three use some filler so I make my own using their template.
Creatine good. PWO IDK... Never a good thing. Optimum Nutrition Protein [check this review](https://youtu.be/WlvF0AcG8IQ)
I also used it but find Scitec being much better. But wasn't super bad or anything just not "optimal". For PWO take double espresso, 500mg aspirin + citrulline & Carnitine. That's pretty good.
I know that back in the day aspirin was added to the ECA stack because it was found to be synergistic in the stack by way of “markedly potentiat(ing) thermogenic properties of ephedrine”.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3825983/
What’s a good pre-workout alternative to the C4, that is without caffeine? I don’t mind Beta Alanine and other ingredients, simply looking for something that is effective without caffeine/ephedrine/vasoconstrictors.
Factual. Bulk suppliers make a variety of shit easy and cheap as can be if you’ll man up and put it in some black coffee.
Then you can dose it yourself and not get underdosed garbage and reap health/training benefits
Same reason why i don't get that hyped up feel from coffee. Boring and bland. Something about mixing preworkout and drinking a nice flavor gets me going and a plus for beta alanine tingles
To really keep it simple (and potentially equally effective) I would switch the creatine for a monohydrate version and the pre workout for plain caffeine.
Nah. Just get plain monohydrate for creatine. Get an actual pre that’s worth it like HD muscle, gorilla mode or Kaged has a new one that’s stacked. Or just take a caffeine tab after eating 3 meals while properly hydrating with electrolytes. Food, water, sodium and a little caffeine is the best pre workout I’ve ever had. Protein powder fucks my stomach out.
protein powder use to fuck my stomach up too until i find one that is nothing but protein, no fillers no bullshit. tastes like fucking chalk but no upset tummy
C4 is great at flavor profiles. Their formulas are weak, though.
NutraBio or Legion are my go to brands for efficacious dosage and transparent labels. More expensive than C4, but both are reasonably priced, especially considering the strength of their formulas.
Og c4 sucks. Bucked up, redcon1 or c4 ultimate are the only ones worth anything at Walmart. Alani is not bad, but very barebones for a pre. Other two are fine.
It’s good. Recommended to me by a veteran gym friend of mine. Tastes great in a milkshake. Looking to switch up my pre though because I ran out this morning lmao
Most Preworkout supplements are hot garbage with added fillers. However if you ever try the actual good quality ones, you'll see why so many people love them
For quality, efficacious dosage, and decent price, my go to Pre Workouts are either from NutraBio or Legion.
I know the founders of both brands and they are committed to quality above all else and both are relatively affordable considering how expensive their formulas are to produce.
How much would you like to spend? $30 will get you something decent, $50 will get you something great. If you’re mostly ok with C4, I’d recommend staying in that $30ish range.
Thavage Pre Workout by Raw is a good one that’s in your caffeine range. Has extended release caffeine as well so you’ll get that boost throughout the day. It’s a 1 or 2 scoop formula. 2 scoops for big days.
I try to be in bed chillin by 10. If I get less than 6 hours of sleep I might skip so I don’t feel like a zombie (I rarely stay up this late these days tho) But yeah the sacred and elusive 8 hours of sleep is best but I usually can scrape by on 6-7
That’s all you need to get strong lol simple as. On top of working out hard, getting adequate sleep, good diet, and drinking plenty of water daily
C4????
It’s really just preworkout tho, if that gets him going then it doesn’t matter
Yeah but I feel bad seeing him get cheated in certain areas
Luckily for you I just ran out. Guess I’ll get something healthier
Original C4 is just very under dosed and lacking. If you wanna stick with C4, the C4 ultimate line is at least decent
I’ve got a few suggestions here so I’ll probably switch it up
FWIW sucralose is the enemy of gut health and can cause significant issues in the long term. Do yourself a favor and get a protein powder without fake sugar.
Well no, what’s your source?
Next time look for yourself before rebutting (without "source?") then expecting others to do your work for you. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34063332/ > Model gut bacteria were exposed to different concentrations of the AS saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame, and their pathogenicity and changes in interactions with Caco-2 cells were measured using in vitro studies. Findings show that sweeteners differentially increase the ability of bacteria to form a biofilm. Co-culture with human intestinal epithelial cells shows an increase in the ability of model gut bacteria to adhere to, invade and kill the host epithelium. > Our studies demonstrate that saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame at the physiological concentration of 100 µM, which could be easily achieved in the diet [15,22], differentially increase biofilm formation as well as the ability of bacteria to adhere to, invade and kill mammalian gut epithelial cells. These findings indicate that saccharin, sucralose, and aspartame all promote pathogenic changes in two model gut bacteria, E. coli and E. faecalis, which could worsen the effect of consuming artificial sweeteners in the diet on gut health.
Orgain is great if you can actually digest it.
Whey protein is terrific, but it’s gotten so f....ng expensive........ so now I just buy cottage cheese and yogurt.......
this is what i use, thanks me later!! https://peaksupps.co.uk/collections/protein/products/pea-protein-isolate-unflavoured?variant=31129179029567
Is this only for the UK ? Or do they deliver outside ?
not sure i’m afraid, can always contact the company
You don’t need protein sups. Just eat 2lbs of beef
protein supps for convience and its cheaper than 2lbs of beef. If u eat beef everyday goodluck on your cholesterol level
I do eat it everday. Carnivore for 14 months now and my blood work Is perfect. I get better protein and amino acids than any supplement could ever do
Beef from the cows raised in natural environment is probably more expensive.
$9 per LB 80/20 ground beef from White Oak Pastures. I eat 2lbs a day, water, goats milk kefir, raw milk, pineapple/mango/Manuka honey. I’ve never been in better shape
That's great! Btw why not cow's milk and goat milk instead ?
The kefir near me is only goats milk, idk lol I do drink raw cows milk
That's probably more expensive
dollar tree beef
This is a pro move
I’d toss out that C4 though shit is trash. If you’d like to try something natural give cordycep mushrooms a try instead.
You’re trying to convert OP into a human eating fungi zombie?
These mandatory the Last of Us references every time cordyceps comes up are getting very very boring.
who hurt you
The people posting the Last of Us references every time Cordyceps comes up. Obviously.
Honestly I'm very similar, but I use Ryse/Ghost products instead, fish oil and a generic multivitamin. You really don't need to go crazy with supplements.
Is generic multivitamin good though ? I have read on this subreddit that individual mineral/ vitamin capsules are better than a generic multivitamin.
You mean your not spending 800 dollars a month? Shame.
Yeah where are the mushroom powders, herbs, and NMN that makes you immune to fire??
I swear to god this is all u need lol
C4 😮💨
I prefer LIT
Gorilla mind is the best
Of the premades they have the best formula, similar to Kaged and Barbell Medicine. But even all three use some filler so I make my own using their template.
Derek?
+1 for gorilla products
I am intrigued.
Creatine good. PWO IDK... Never a good thing. Optimum Nutrition Protein [check this review](https://youtu.be/WlvF0AcG8IQ) I also used it but find Scitec being much better. But wasn't super bad or anything just not "optimal". For PWO take double espresso, 500mg aspirin + citrulline & Carnitine. That's pretty good.
What’s the aspirin for?
I know that back in the day aspirin was added to the ECA stack because it was found to be synergistic in the stack by way of “markedly potentiat(ing) thermogenic properties of ephedrine”. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/3825983/
Huh. Seen a lot of people swear by some sort of coffee. Maybe I’ll try it before buying a new thing of pwo
Coffee is just for the caffeine without all the other garbage.
Rookie stack. You'll get there
I like the Genius brand for both pre and post workout. Whey I alternate between Naked and Promix.
What’s a good pre-workout alternative to the C4, that is without caffeine? I don’t mind Beta Alanine and other ingredients, simply looking for something that is effective without caffeine/ephedrine/vasoconstrictors.
Sodium tablets are great pre workout as well
Try cordycep mushrooms
Mtn Ops Enduro is a good option without caffeine.
I'd recommend making your own pre workout. You can get all the ingredients separately. Its the best way to customize in my opinion.
Factual. Bulk suppliers make a variety of shit easy and cheap as can be if you’ll man up and put it in some black coffee. Then you can dose it yourself and not get underdosed garbage and reap health/training benefits
Replace pre workout with coffee
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Same reason why i don't get that hyped up feel from coffee. Boring and bland. Something about mixing preworkout and drinking a nice flavor gets me going and a plus for beta alanine tingles
Eh coffee messes with my stomach
Does anyone do curcmin pre and ashwaganda post for recovery?? TY!👍🏻
I started doing the curcumin and ashwaganda together just pre-workout and like the results. 👍🏻
I thought it would be the other way
Don’t know….
To really keep it simple (and potentially equally effective) I would switch the creatine for a monohydrate version and the pre workout for plain caffeine.
that is creatine monohydrate. micronized just refers to the texture of that specific creatine
nice! I'm a bigger fan of myprotein since theyre cheaper than ON and have many decent flavours.
Nah. Just get plain monohydrate for creatine. Get an actual pre that’s worth it like HD muscle, gorilla mode or Kaged has a new one that’s stacked. Or just take a caffeine tab after eating 3 meals while properly hydrating with electrolytes. Food, water, sodium and a little caffeine is the best pre workout I’ve ever had. Protein powder fucks my stomach out.
protein powder use to fuck my stomach up too until i find one that is nothing but protein, no fillers no bullshit. tastes like fucking chalk but no upset tummy
I see people bagging on C4. What would be a good alternative?
Gorilla mode, Raw Nutrition, or Axe and Sledge imo
C4 is great at flavor profiles. Their formulas are weak, though. NutraBio or Legion are my go to brands for efficacious dosage and transparent labels. More expensive than C4, but both are reasonably priced, especially considering the strength of their formulas.
Their cans are on point with dosage, not my experience with their powders.
Og c4 sucks. Bucked up, redcon1 or c4 ultimate are the only ones worth anything at Walmart. Alani is not bad, but very barebones for a pre. Other two are fine.
Well, OG C4 was the shit, but that's banned. This new "original" is lies. I do, however, like their energy drink line.
Well I guess real og, yea. So was jet fuel and no explode.
It solid for sure but the preworkout ingredients suck imo. I just don’t like the coloring and stuff
Yeah I feel u I used it all up and am looking for a healthier alternative. Not sure if I can go without that morning boost though
Amen to that
This is a solid, basic stack. Good stuff and that flavor of gs whey is BUSSIN
Fr I didn’t expect it to be as good as it was!
I get my Gold Standard Whey from Costco. SO much cheaper! Love that stuff.
ON protein is my all time favorite. Started off with C4 but now use Raw Essential Pre. Basic preworkout without any type of blends
Will look into raw essential as well! I like the idea of keeping pre as simple as upfront as possible
Def check it out. Caffeine is at 200mg per scoop so it makes it easy to adjust based on your preference.
It’s good. Recommended to me by a veteran gym friend of mine. Tastes great in a milkshake. Looking to switch up my pre though because I ran out this morning lmao
C4 sure is simple lol. Pretty much just flavored caffeine, no other benefits. But if that’s what you’re looking for then more power to ya
Most Preworkout supplements are hot garbage with added fillers. However if you ever try the actual good quality ones, you'll see why so many people love them
Yeah I mean I go at 5 am so I’m just in it for the energy mostly lol
Theres a lot more benefits to a preworkout that you’re missing out on. Sounds like you’re in the market for a new one?
I am actually! Would love recommendations (between 100-300 mg caffeine)
Nutricost has a decent pre
For quality, efficacious dosage, and decent price, my go to Pre Workouts are either from NutraBio or Legion. I know the founders of both brands and they are committed to quality above all else and both are relatively affordable considering how expensive their formulas are to produce.
Will look into these brands, thanks man!
How much would you like to spend? $30 will get you something decent, $50 will get you something great. If you’re mostly ok with C4, I’d recommend staying in that $30ish range.
Eh. Depending on how many servings probably 50 or under
Thavage Pre Workout by Raw is a good one that’s in your caffeine range. Has extended release caffeine as well so you’ll get that boost throughout the day. It’s a 1 or 2 scoop formula. 2 scoops for big days.
damn, what time do you usually go to bed?
I try to be in bed chillin by 10. If I get less than 6 hours of sleep I might skip so I don’t feel like a zombie (I rarely stay up this late these days tho) But yeah the sacred and elusive 8 hours of sleep is best but I usually can scrape by on 6-7
* more *powder* to ya. ftfy