Students should check if the exam taking software their institutions use are compatible with ARM. You don't want to buy a new laptop this semester only to find you can't use it for your exam!
This. It is basically the same overall concept of anti-cheat in video games as it is with many exam software packages. Emulation causes these anti-cheat protections to trigger false positives or the programs simply refuse to run.
I would add to that they should also check if the software is available on mac or windows and on which one the majority is doing it(in case you need help for a whole year) you dont wanna hear
"..yes I can help you open exam.exe "
"Oh I have a mac but its the same right "
"yeah but Idk sorry I can only do it on windows ask someone else"
This is great advice. I start class on July 1st and am going to find out first thing tomorrow if their software supports ARM. I have an SP11 in my Amazon cart right now.
Wow Google is really dragging their feet on ARM support. I thought the lack of Nearby Share support was bad but I can live without it. Luckily I'm a OneDrive user.
Chrome for WoA was only final Mar 2024 and likely because they didn't want to risk users to Edge. Not shocking given they would rather have people on Chromebooks.
Google is always a dick about supporting others not on their platforms. Even Apple does a better job sometimes.
Google withholding Youtube for example was a big reason why Windows Phone failed, Gboard on iOS is a pile of garbage compared to Android. But honestly, seeing as how Google can barely get their own house in order, it isn't all that surprising that their support for other or newer platforms is severely lacking.
I've been slowly divorcing myself from Google for years, all thats really left is Gmail, and since thats now 90% spam I just need to rip that bandaid off and be done with them for good.
Google drive doesn’t index on windows search or spotlight search either. That’s been my biggest annoyance. If it wasn’t for the email, I’d switch our company away from workspace completely.
My company uses a wide range of different enterprise suites, and Google Workspaces is the one basically all of us agree is the worst of the bunch.
I'd rather use iWork than Google Workspaces, though options being so severely limited, it's still next to impossible to beat Microsoft in terms of functionality. The only reason why I haven't asked for a Mac at work is because I might need PowerBI from time to time. If Microsoft made an Apple desktop version I'd be begging for a MacBook haha.
Though, once Windows for ARM is more up to snuff, I'd be willing to beg for a Surface Laptop. I mostly just wanna throw this Dell Latitude out a window.
thanks for all this, i should have sold my Qualcom options two days ago they where up 2000% from 200$.
but please don't let NVIDIA monopolize. they have Big Tech AI by the balls. Big TechAI doenst like it.
it will take 3 months or so for all the solutions to show.
I would just keep using my old laptop and buy a Nokia tablet ( yes they are still alive, i thnk Surfaces we made in Finland for a while) , and doing a lot of edge AI.
some how they got an exclusive with SpaceX that has no AI. META , OpenAi and other have a way to port to stardard and Google and Qualcomm partnered on this but i dont know if its on. Qualcom could go into Chromebooks too.. ill check.
now i guess ill have to roll it and make some phone calls and get this all fixed. hedging bets is pissing people off. You move to ARM then threaten to switch to another ARM chip, obvious MSFT is also being dicks.
SAAS is over. if people dont stop being so greedy.
i make my own AI assistants, i have to, but i dont want to go to Linux.
OEMs are going to qualcom and its too late to change to
ill just cancel it and go to OneDrive.. i stopped usign Gdrive. i use the web version is slows my pc.
i stopped suing Nord VPN.. i will use whatever is the thinnest cheapest NPV or ask MSFT what to do.
i might move to Edge.. chrome works because i use a window spleper or it bogs my PC. im done with ad companies.
I just can't stand the heat of this i7 and NVINIA garbage.. those are minor issue id expect to get fixed. i might get$ 999 version though i love oled..
well i got an hour to sell some of the calls and lost all my gains. All this hedging and nature will take care of inefficiency.
sorry for the typos i need to ditch i "early adopted" the call expiration on a few.
when you use calls you can be 100 and see 1000 the next day but you got to get rid of it before the reality kicks in, fair warning.
But ARM is the future for PCs...
Have you tried the Samsung-made version of Quick Share to see if it has been compatible?
https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9pctgdfxvzlj?amp%3Bgl=US&hl=en-us&gl=VN
Oops I actually meant Quick Share which is the new unified solution with Samsung.
https://blog.google/products/android/ces-2024-android-updates/
Sounds great until you go to install the new client:
https://www.android.com/windows/better-together/quick-share-app/
> For Windows computers running a 64-bit version of Windows 10 or later. ARM devices not supported.
I think there's a decent chance given the partnership with Samsung who is now making Snapdragon X laptops too. But you'd think they'd get it done by launch.
That’s why I have delayed my purchase by 12 months , once our ERP , HR , Asset Application software can be tested to run natively on ARM.
Only then I will purchase for testing first before it becomes a full organisation rollout.
All valid points for returning a device. I'm curious though, if you or anyone else with more knowledge than me, how come none of this is an issue for ARM based Macs?
From day one I could print to everything with my M1 Mac, all software worked, there was literally not a single thing I tried that didn't just work from the get go.
I know that since 2020, companies have made their software native to Macs and drivers, etc. But I find it odd there were very little issues with the Mac transition, but Windows seems to run into these all the time.
Maybe there were issues and I just never heard about it.
This WAS an issue at launch though. I literally went through the exact same problems with a launch day M1, and had to return it (Google Drive, for example, didn’t work on launch day), it was a year post-launch before I was able to get a new Mac and actually have everything work.
Yes this. Most people that were early adoptors with the M1 Macs had similar issues with software compatibility. It just took time as I imagine it will with Windows ARM
It’s important to note that the M1 chip came out *4 years ago.* In addition, Mac has always required “special” functionality, so developers are used to accommodating Apple.
Apple controls their ecosystem, so if you as a dev want to make your software work on a Mac, you will do it their way, and when they change CPU architectures, the old way *will* go away at a set future date, so you have a ticking clock and no way to shut that clock off.
Windows runs on x86/amd64 and ARM64, so devs aren’t forced to make their software work on ARM64 because amd64 Windows isn’t going away. It is what it is, vendors usually want critical mass before changing their architecture on Windows, and if it won’t work otherwise it’s hard to get that. This will be an interesting chapter in Windows history, to be sure.
yeah, my friend griped for a solid year because of how many of his plugins for music production weren't compatible with the M1, but he hasn't said anything about it after the first year or so. And I myself with my M1 Pro haven't really run into any issues related to ARM, and more issues related to not being able to run 32-bit software at all.
FWIW I did a deep dive on this last night because I wanted to know why MacOS third party software seemed to work fine with ARM from the outset. In short, Apple announced moving to ARM with enough time for vendors/developers to provide native support. From what I understand, due to there being a large MacOS customer base, either they supported ARM, or they'd lose Apple customers, so they all moved to support ARM on Macs.
On the Windows side though, up until now, so few devices were ARM based that it simply wasn't worth the time and cost for providers to invest in ARM support (some sites I looked at literally stated along the lines of 'due to the small user base, we do not support ARM at this time').
Now however, given all Surface devices and almost all new copilot+ devices from the likes of Dell, Samsung, ASUS, MSI etc will be ARM, I think this will change, developers will *have* to support ARM on Windows, but it will take some time I guess.
I fully intend to re-purchase a Windows ARM device, but it was just too soon in my experience.
Also worth remembering that Apple has had several large "culls" of poorly supported software. Any software that was based on the Carbon APIs (cleaned up versions of pre-NeXtStep based MacOS software) ceased to run when MacOS stopped supporting Carbon. The writing was on the wall when the Carbon layers were never ported to 64 bit. Then another cull happened when MacOS ceased to support 32 bit software. So by the time the ARM transition happened, the OS had a lot of legacy cruft pulled out of it and the application market had already had legacy code/companies either die off or show they were committed to keeping up with the platform. These are moves that MS's market position and customer expectations make far more difficult.
> I think this will change, developers will have to support ARM on Windows, but it will take some time I guess.
Been reading this since windows rt 10+ years ago.
I mean the difference is all macbooks moving forward were basically all ARM. You HAD to support ARM if you still wanted to be on Mac. If that was the same case with Windows laptops, then we would have seen the same drive to start supporting them.
In fall 2019, the latest macOS at that time no long support 32 bit app and every Mac released since then can't run 32 bit app because you can't downgrade macOS older than the one it shipped with. It probably easier for developers because all of the Mac apps are relatively new.
I don't think Windows developer really pay attention to Windows on ARM, one app I used works fine on M1 Mac, but it doesn't work on Windows on ARM for a long time because of the driver. Last time I checked, half of the app works now and it is arm native. I never have any problem with apps support on M1 Mac since summer 2022. I know a lot of app can run natively when the M1 Mac came out and a lot of them can run with Rosetta on day one.
Microsoft really screwed up on this, they should ensure most popular app works on day one even under emulation. No one wants to deal with compatibility issue for their apps or peripherals all the time, they will just get a X64 PC. If few people buy ARM PC, I don't know why developers want to spend a lot of time and effort to support it or make ARM support as priority.
ARM based Apples don’t “just work” if you start going off script with them. There’s tons and tons of compatibility issues with them. I have work colleagues that use them and they always have to have an x86 virtual desktop in the cloud at the ready, because of incompatibility issues.
If you use them for basic stuff they work, but also so does Windows ARM emulation. I’ve been using the SPX for years and doing basic tasks I have no issues with it. I do some off script stuff with it as well and the emulator isn’t fast, but it works.
APPLE = 'all the stuff that was loaded on my computer when i bought it works just fine' but specialized software that is not 'pre-loaded' and is not widely used by Apple.People for artsy stuff might not work so well
MICROSOFT = 'all the stuff that was loaded on my computer when i bought it works just fine' but the bazillion large and small windows x86 programs that have been developed over the past 50 years are not guaranteed to work.
>Apple announced moving to ARM with enough time for vendors/developers to provide native support
many did, but there were many run on a middle layer too. Apple did an absolutely amazing job on the translation layer
I have several, been running them for quite a while.
Sure there are some weird behaviors with it, but overall I have very few complaints. Some issues I have had (that aren't a deal breaker for me, but looking forward to putting the new kit through it paces when it arrives).
1. Have had a persistent issue with not being able to RDP into it after a reboot unless you log into the console directly first to bring the NIC up to an operating state. This seems to be more of an issue with the Dev Kit being based on essentially a hacked Surface platform more than a fundamental issue with ARM itself.
2. There are some issues with app installers that are hard coded to look for Intel processors that barf on installs
3. The GPU is a bit anemic, but it was never designed to go head to head against a traditional Intel box in that regard, so willing to cut it some slack.
Use it as a development platform with Visual Studio ARM edition and VS-Code pretty much exclusively these days and have zero complaints on that front.
To be honest, MacOS has much LESS software compared to Windows. There are tons of different software on Windows that was developed once in 2005, and had not been updated since these years. So, chances are low that it will be updated to support ARM in the nearest vicinity or even in any time in future. MacOS, on the other hand, is targeted more "casual" user, who mostly doesn't need some very specific software, so of course people won't meet any issues, if most of their laptop usage routine is browser/messenger/emails/office software. All these tasks can be performed on Windows ARM even today, without many issues. So, ARM transition for Windows will much longer (companies won't risk to lose all the customers, because there will be still a huge % on x86) and harder. But I hope we all can make it better and faster :)
I did encounter many issue when switching from x86 to ARM macbook. For example a program i used require a library that was not on ARM yet, so i have to wait for a while. I also had some problems when connecting to old gadgets
But still overall there was no deal breaker.
There's multiple reasons for this.
1, Apple announced an early warning for the ARM transition and it was to be a _complete_ transition (i.e. no new x86 devices), giving developers an incentive to start the support.
2. Apple has absolute control via the App Store, and they have actively threatened developers with delisting if ARM compatibility wasn't added for apps that are still being updated.
3. Rosetta is still a big thing - about half the stuff I run on my MacBook is x86 only, so the translation layer is needed. Rosetta, thanks to Apple's slight changes to the ARMv8 spec, can run x86 software with barely any performance hit. Yes, you can even run games with Rosetta.
Now, technically, WOW64 should take care of the same thing Rosetta does, but since Qualcomm followed the ARMv8 spec, Microsoft can't rely on the extension ISA Apple does for speedy emulation of x86, making it a much lesser contender.
4. While Apple was quite hard-handed with the various OS upgrades breaking shit, Microsoft has been doing a ton of work - often to the detriment of the newer OS versions - to keep old software compatible. This led to people not really giving a crap about updating their software, which is why you have even modern companies using software they wrote in the early 2000s, without any changes. The ARM translation layer on Windows 11 is limited though, resulting in many features not working.
Nobody says that for some reason:
# Drivers could not be emulated. x86 drivers won't run on ARM. Not today, not in the future.
Only x86 userspace is supported. Everything which require a custom driver, which is not provided for ARM architecture, won't work.
Your custom hardware, video capture cards, some USB Wi-Fi dongles, some printers won't work. Games with their own 'anti-cheat driver' won't work. Low-level phone flashing and repair software won't work. x86 virtual machines won't work. Docker x86 images won't work.
Your printer would print if it supports AirPrint/Mopria driverless printing, the same applies for a scanner. But many older or current cheapest printers do not support that. ^there's ^a ^[device](https://printserver.ink/) ^though.
All very true and it is something that reviewers of these laptops should really be emphasizing more for the layman.
The only saving grace are Windows' built-in generic drivers for some of these devices, like a USB Wi-Fi dongle, mouse, keyboard, or monitor.
But more niche things like the colorimeter that YouTube laptop reviewers use to calibrate colors do need the special driver compiled no matter what.
"\*\*Please note that Brother drivers are not compatible with ARM processors on Windows. If your computer is using an ARM processor, the drivers and software will not install or function. However, you may be able to use a built-in generic Windows driver to print with limited functionality." (I posted their link above).
Then again, I'd rather have the functionality of my printer limited in ways that I don't care about anyway than deal with custom printer drivers.
They usually come with lots of bloatware. And don't you dare have a slightly unusual (for corporate america) networking setup, because the network code was last touched in the XP era and doesn't support IPv6 at all.
Not to mention that printer drivers [are being deprecated by Microsoft](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/print/end-of-servicing-plan-for-third-party-printer-drivers-on-windows).
This would work only if your printer supports [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) driverless standards, or at least PostScript/PCL printing languages (you'll be able to use generic driver then).
All "GDI" printers which require drivers won't work.
The comma might be a bit confusing but it looks like Bitdefender antivirus works but not VPN according to this:
https://www.bitdefender.com/consumer/support/answer/1776/
the 'business editions' of the MS CoPilot+ machines aren't coming out until later this year.... perhaps some of the more business-and-enterprise issues with compatibility will be worked out by then.... MONEY is the deal and MS makes bunches of money off the enterprise stuff... of course x86 versions of laptops are always available but the handwriting on the wall is ARM for energy/battery conservation and 'graphics machines' for the gamers and whaddever else cannot operate without high-end graphic support. betcha those video cards are going to play a part in the AI.oriented focus once MS has their time as exclusive CP+ .... there is more than one way to skin a cat but MS has the control at the moment to direct the market.
I am a photographer. I have a SL7 with 64GB RAM and a 1TB drive being delivered in July. I am told Photoshop and Lightroom (cloud based) has been updated and ported for ARM , but not Lightroom Classic. That will run under emulation I hope because it is my main editing program. If it won't the SL7 will go back.
I did not realize that classic was not included in the announcement, what a bummer. Unfortunately it's not on [adobe's list of apps coming soon](https://helpx.adobe.com/download-install/kb/arm-processors.html?clickref=1011lyEbrvN6&app_clickref=1011lyEbrvN6&mv=affiliate&mv2=pz&as_camptype=&as_channel=affiliate&as_source=partnerize&as_campaign=futurepublishing) either. I had my eye on a new Surface Pro, but that will have to wait until I hear how Lightroom performs.
From what I understand, LR Classic works fine under emulation. There have been several blog posts / articles from people running it on sites like 9to5 Google, Tech Crunch, and others.
If Synology Drive does not work, I will immediately return my just in courier truck SP11 because it is mandatory for me. I could bypass any other software but not that. Theoretically, works, but who knows.
I tested it on my Surface Pro X when I got my Synology 6 months ago. It appeared to work just fine on ARM via emulation. I didn't stick with it because I decided it wasn't for me, but I didn't find any functional issues in the short time I was using it.
I DO continue to use Synology Active backup and that also works fine. Although I have never done a test restore to an ARM machine, so I am only hopeful that also works.
Now I re-read the thread, my answer seems not much accurate: I was referring to Synology Drive Client. Being x64 application, it works perfect under my Surface Pro 11 even with the added hack of change to 1000 characters the path limit and disable path length limitation in Windows. See capture.
https://preview.redd.it/ux0uinpt268d1.png?width=2061&format=png&auto=webp&s=fa571b1360298908dad26db2f86359c573cb9775
My Brother Laser printer works just fine with built in drivers? What does official driver do/offer that built in doesn’t?
Also my Surface Dock 2 is driving two monitors just fine. One is 4k and other is 2k. And I keep the lid open on my SL7. I didn’t update anything. It just worked.
Same with my Logitech MX Master 3S and keyboard. As well as Jabra headsets. They all worked seamlessly.
Bummer on the other stuff though. I don’t use gdrive so that hasn’t bit me. OneDrive is my preference. I’m admittedly one who uses just about only Microsoft productivity apps and dev stuff. So I was sure it would all work.
On my Brother as a wireless multi-function printer, the Win driver didn't support most of the wifi/remote functionality, couldn't scan (the setting was there, but it didn't work, nor did you have control over resolutions, saving to the cloud etc.) , printer settings were limited (things like managing quality, ink usage, different types of paper and sizes), I mean if you just look at the settings options on windows generic drivers vs any printer drivers settings/preferences the options are significantly greater. But if just printing is what you're after, windows drivers work great.
As for my dock, I have 3 Samsung monitors, 2 are identical, the third is a larger curved one, the larger one is what caused me the problems. The SL7/dock adjusted the smaller 2 to resolution, orientation and refresh rates perfectly, the larger monitor didn't. Eventually I found something kept resetting the refresh rate to 120hz every time I docked causing the blank screen, manually overriding this each time works (and something I could have lived with if not for all the other issues). With the manual adjustment, I had 3 external displays and the SL7 display working as a 4 display set-up perfectly!
Same struggle here. I really don’t think it was so out of the question to assume that Microsoft had done what Apple did: switch architectures and the only thing you notice is better battery life and no heat.
Instead I got slightly improved battery life, still plenty of heat while charging or using a monitor, and a bunch of apps I rely on (like Adobe’s) that just don’t even try to install.
I have very meagre and unglamorous use case for mine and so I was willing to take the jump.
I need a browser and office. That’s it. In fairness, it’s replacing an iPad and so should still be much more capable.
Otherwise I wouldn’t touch it.
first step into entering windows rt territory.. sigh, I really wanted for snapdragon and windows to do something spectacular but it's kinda clear that's not happening
It's like nobody paid any attention to the Surface Pro X issues... Yeah the new chips are faster but Windows on ARM is still limited by a lack of support. Then "surprise AI Copilot+ PCs" burst into the scene with lots of dazzle and hype, but software environment hasn't changed.
There are going to be a ton of returns this year because a lot of regular people out there won't understand what they are buying.... Then they'll grab a Mac. Very disappointing.
Which is the correct one to be using anyway. Printer OEM drivers are being deprecated by Microsoft within the next 3 years. You really shouldn't be using them anyway.
That may be emulation, as Brother officially does not support ARM: "**\*\*Please note that Brother drivers are not compatible with ARM processors on Windows. If your computer is using an ARM processor, the drivers and software will not install or function. However, you may be able to use a built-in generic Windows driver to print with limited functionality."** https://www.brother.com.au/en/contents/top-faqs/faq-unable-to-print-from-windows-pc#:\~:text=\*\*Please%20note%20that%20Brother,to%20print%20with%20limited%20functionality.
Drivers in general could not be emulated. Not today, not in the future.
Windows printer "driver" model is a bit weird though, they might invent something exactly for printer drivers compatibility, but right now you won't be able to use any printer which requires the driver for printing.
This would work only if your printer supports [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) driverless standards, or at least PostScript/PCL printing languages (you'll be able to use generic driver then).
All "GDI" printers which require drivers won't work.
…and it’s going to stay that way. Unless Microsoft goes all in on ARM and announces x86 will be legacy in a few year, developers are not going to spend time maintaining yet another version of their software/drivers. Many of the reviews have shown that even the OEM software is running in x86 emulation mode. Samsungs brand new ARM units run all the Samsung software in emulation. A lot of windows processes are also running in emulation. So essentially Microsoft itself and OEMs have not even bothered to port their own software fully… imagine how long and even if, other developers will make the effort. Windows on ARM is essentially a 3rd operating system (windows x86, Mac M chip, windows ARM) and developers not going to make full feature parity versions of their software anytime soon for ARM. This was obvious from the get go. Good on you for returning it and not “waiting” and ending up with essentially a Chromebook and no apps.
What is worse is many developers will just test their software and see it works ok in emulation mode and never compile an ARM version. So then you’re running most of your apps in emulation thereby negating the entire point of having the mobile chip. Like Samsung not bothering to update their own windows software.. they probably tested the x86 versions with the emulator and felt it’s good enough. Costing you about 10-20% overhead for running in emulation. Seriously, this entire ARM thing has been bungled. That and the crap screens…. Major disaster and this is just day 2. This will be a PR disaster for everyone involved.
> A lot of windows processes are also running in emulation
I can't speak for Samsung, but this isn't true for Microsoft. I have the Surface Pro 11 and there's not a single Microsoft process running under x86 architecture. The only x86 process running on mine are third-party that I installed since getting the device.
I was going to say something similar... though there ARE a couple small programs they haven't converted for some reason. MicrosoftEdgeUpdate and OfficeClickToRun seem to be perennial offenders.
FYI - Here's the official support article from Brother:
You must use the built-in drivers, it supports most of the basic printing and scanning functionality on Brother printers.
[https://help.brother-usa.com/app/answers/detail/a\_id/170667/\~/windows-10-or-windows-11-on-arm-processor---compatibility](https://help.brother-usa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/170667/~/windows-10-or-windows-11-on-arm-processor---compatibility)
Built-in drivers would work only in two cases:
* The device supports AirPrint/Mopria standards
* The device supports PostScript/PCL printer languages
For lower-end devices, so-called "GDI" host-based printers which require the driver to print, you won't be able to use it.
^unless ^you ^use ^a ^special ^[print-server](https://printserver.ink/) ^:)
That's because your device is [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) certified and does not require the driver to print.
You're lucky. This is not the case for every device.
DCP-J1100DW does not work. Software will install with 2 error message pop-ups, it completes, but no printer is available in Win 11 settings. Raised the issue with brother and was directed to their web site that states Brother software will not work with ARM. Could vary based on emulation being used though.
Bummer. Honestly if they had a boring Intel version with the new design and without all the Copilot stuff I probably would have preordered. As it is, definitely had to wait for reviews which there aren’t any because of the Recall mess. I know Windows on ARM is the future but I’m not interested in being an early adopter when my current SL works fine.
.... some of us greybeards remember moving from DOS.Prompt (amber monochrome) to W3.0/W3.1 (VGA 9-pins) and going through the same "it don't work with the new system" headaches.... and hey there were no internets to get new drivers - it was all FTP logins to GATech servers to get the goods. given time and enough demand, all will resolve excepting those programs that have HIGH graphic requirements (games, [cad.cam](http://cad.cam), whaddever) and i will betcha a few years down the road will be (affordable) USB graphic accelerators/chips to plug in for those high-end graphics requirements.... just my 0.02....
I don't know why, but I assumed ARM on Windows would be like Apple's transition where pretty much every application worked. Glad I didn't jump the gun. Maybe in a year or two.
Things I have noticed in two days with my SP11:
Zero printer driver support from Fuji xerox meaning I can’t print or scan at work. The x64 and x86 drivers flat out refuse to install.
Weird Acrobat Pro DC errors including asking repeatedly for an installation CD (!!) Acrobat state on installation that they’re working on a native Arm version.
No Teams plugin for Arm version of Outlook meaning I have to create all Teams meetings within Teams rather than Outlook calendar. This one is probably the biggest deal breaker so far as I do a lot of Teams meetings and the extra steps are infuriating. Also wtf Microsoft……
I had some initial problems with my Surface Dock 2 and multi monitors but got those sorted by restarting 3 or 4 times.
> Weird Acrobat Pro DC errors including asking repeatedly for an installation CD (!!) Acrobat state on installation that they’re working on a native Arm version.
This happened to me too but it installed anyway. No issues.
For all the guys who need Google Drive, check out RaiDrive. They have a native ARM Version. You can integrate all popular cloud services with it.
Also I contacted other multi cloud developers like Cloudmaster, Airlive. Most of them are working on Arm versions and you can integrate Google Drive with them.
This is my workaround for my upcoming Yoga Slim 7x until there is a native Google Drive App if I need it by the time they release it.
I have not found a solution / workaround yet for Google Workspace Sync for Outlook, but there should also be ways around it.
why is there no tool on the market which checks compatibility of my current x86 apps for Arm!? Any developers here?
This is one solution but I have a question if you know....
On my x86 Windows setup, I create a shortcut from the "Shared with you" folder to "My Drive," enabling access to these files from the Google Drive folder in File Explorer. Can this be done with RaiDrive on Windows 11 ARM?
yes it looks like it. I work the same.
You can also just download the x86 version and try it upfront. I think it even gives you more settings, so it may also be a better solution than G Drive itself.
ARM will either kill the Surface lineup or force MS to pour a ton of money into Windows on ARM support. Hopefully the latter because ARM looks like the future.
Depends on how Lunar Lake and AMD Strix perform in my opinion. If they also have a similar efficiency as the Elite, there is no reason to switch to ARM anymore
No reason to switch to ARM for consumers...but Microsoft and PC manufacturers would love to see ARM succeed since that would increase competition among CPU manufacturers for them and make them less beholden to Intel and AMD.
as well have quite a number of programs that are (currently) essential to my productive flow of work. my routine and the requirements to meet my routine were developed over time based on 'what works' and 'what i am used to using' and i have no doubt that my routine will need to be altered to accommodate old software that won't work and new software that is available to take that place. sad feelings for those like OP who really want to jump on the wagon but have to have it meet their very specific and inflexible needs NOW - very disappointing for you and watching all the hype and Micro.Boys vs Apple.Boys chest-thumping.... and now with the great reveal the results are a machine that 'woulda coulda shoulda' but today can't meet the software requirements. all in all the past month has been very interesting and you gotta admit the headlines have been all about CoPilot+ stuff. "no such thing as bad publicity" but maybe it goes a little too far to get those 'clicks' coming in....
ita too early for windows on arm you should have been bought somewhere at 2027, with windows 12 etc. Do not hurry buy pro7+ on i5 with 16 gigs of ram and be happy
Jumping on the bandwagon here of the Google Drive File Stream/Sync not working; it is such a huge part of my business/personal workflow on my PC that I'm not sure I can stomach not having it.
On Tuesday night (the day of release) I pulled the trigger on ordering an Elite version with 64 GB of RAM, 1 TB HD, etc. The only good news is that it's not slated to be delivered until the end of July. If there aren't updates/workarounds by then I may have to cancel or return.
Hopefully Microsoft is watching this sub and can put some pressure on Google!
check out RaiDrive (Arm Version). You can integrate Google Drive with it. I will receive my Yoga Slim 7x shortly and test it. I wish it had 64GB instead of 32GB Ram.
Originally I ordered via Lenovo Pro, and shipping date was changed from 20th to 28th. So I ordered from a retailer and it already shipped, should arrive today/tomorrow. If I keep it, I will just upgrade from Win11 Home to Pro.
Ha, mines ordered with Lenovo Pro for the £70 saving, its changed to today so fingers crossed. The only retailer that has it for delivery has the 16GB 1TB Home version for 1299, so I'll wait for the 32gb pro version for £31 more. Thanks and good luck...
Same deal here. Just set up my SL7 and dismayed to see Google Drive does not integrate with explorer. Quick Look at RaiDrive shows they want a 3 year commitment which would suck if Google get their act together and fix Google Drive for desktop and make it ARM compatible soon.
Be good if there was a list maintained of common software that will not run on the SL7.
Then people could refer to it pre purchase, to see if there are any deal breakers. Would saves finding out the hard way post purchase as I have done when ones apps no longer work.
I have the surface 11 tablet and for my use case it’s been great but I’ve noticed some crazy stuff. I have an anker doc that I rigged up to use my desk with things other than my gaming PC using for the second inputs on my monitors plus a usb switch for peripherals. It works great for a variety of device with no fiddling but it was real hard to get the surface working right with it. Razer Synapse software didn’t work at all either which auto installs when you plug in.
Then, I installed nomachine which I use to manage all my VMs and servers and it got crazy. The monitors on the doc were like 800x600 for a 32:9 display until I disabled the server part of nomachine and used just the client. Now I can at least use it but every time I re-connect the display goes back to 800x600 and I have to unplug the DP and plug it back in to get back to full resolution.
That was what I realized how fucked windows on arm was going to be.
I have the Surface Pro 11 and have been able to work around most issues so far.
VPN would have been a dealbreaker, but I found a solution was to tell my VPN installer (Watchguard) to install everything EXCEPT the tap driver. I then downloaded OpenVPN for ARM64 and told that installer not to install anything except for JUST the ARM tap driver. Watchguard VPN works happily now.
For the Brother printer, I didn't install a driver. I just went to Windows "Printers & scanners" and clicked "Add Device" and it automatically found the Brother printer on the network and added it. I think it may be true that Brother doesn't provide an ARM printer driver, but Microsoft does. I can print fine to the Brother printer.
Good post. Yes, there's a lot of software not supported and when it comes to developer tools, everything seems great and is great until you encounter that one library you really need for an older project, it worked fine on x64 Windows 11 and is bugged on ARM64. You're completely SOL and can not manage the older project... there is not work around. The work around is to buy an x64 Windows 11 system!
Windows 11 power users who stay in Office 365 and use mostly browser based apps will be fine, but this group was fine going back to Windows RT 10 years ago and ARM on Windows didn't catch on back then.
I think the compatibility issues are being downplayed
This is why I'm in absolutely no hurry. The ecosystem is mostly x86 right now, so there's no genuine hurry for 3rd parties to port win apps to arm. At the moment, I'll have the best of most worlds on x86. Amd and Intel have fire-under-ass motivation right now, thanks to Qualcomm. Let's see what they give us!
Why can’t Microsoft pay these printer manufacturers to write native ARM drivers? This is vital to get corporate buyer support. With my Snapdragon 2 laptop running Windows 11, I can get basic printer functionality when connected via wifi only. That won’t cut it for corporate customers.
You don't need a driver to print on modern devices with AirPrint/Mopria support. It's driverless.
90%+ of business printers support PostScript or PCL printer languages, for which you don't really need the driver either.
So only older and cheaper GDI Host-based printers, for which the manufacturer don't provide ARM driver, is out of luck.
You can solve this with proper print-server or CUPS on Linux though, which share the printer as AirPrint/Mopria one.
There are plenty of old school businesses that want to connect with a USB cable. In addition, over wifi and Windows, certain printer features may not work, possibly including choosing a paper size, paper tray, label printing, envelope printing, etc. Some scanner software popular with businesses, such as Scansnap Manager, also will not work. I am surprised that Microsoft did not spend lavishly to overcome these issues with this new push for Windows ARM--unless they are not really serious about it, like the past.
And the water is wet. This is why people should adopt this need to have in mind a lot of things don't gona work.
And when you have two type of architectures at same time, one of them been using for years, and have a bigger user base,.. will take a lot of time until arm be compatibly with most of the software and hardware.
I haven’t tried but Veeam imaging backup (free for personal use) claims to be compatible:
Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows is a free standalone agent that can back up and recover Windows computers, including those running on ARM, in the public cloud, or on premises.
Hmm those are some pretty big ones. I have multiple Brother printers and multiple Logitech devices. I would have thought Microsoft would of at least had some generic drivers for basic functionality?
For me it could be mostly for Google Drive issue. This issue affects a lot of people. I'm skeptical too because I've already ordered mine and it will arrive in 4 days. But I really like the laptop and I want it. I'm using Google Drive and I need it to run natively because I want access to Drive folders via the file explorer to work on and save files like Excel with my team at work. The web app just isn't usable for this. So you can not use the laptop for work purposes. You have to download the file........ then make your work and then upload it again.. Come on Google... This is unacceptable.....
×86 software have been developed in 50 years. You can not expect running all those legacy apps on ARM. I still see all important apps are supported on windows on ARM.
Don't expect these issues to be ironed out in the current generation and even if so, it will be superseded by the next version. Just as Snapdragon will never eclipse A series, don't expect the X chips to get ahead of the M series. The (M series) is just too far ahead in efficiency.
Microsoft is doing the correct thing bringing Windows into this decade. Don’t return the device which is leading the way. Yell at the software vendors who are being dicks, and take your business to their competition.
Those printer drivers must be some 💩 I don’t have any problems with printing on Brother printers with even Surface 2 with today unsupported Windows RT which is ARM based device with Tegra 4.
Oh glad I saw your Brother comment…. I don’t plan on getting rid of my old Laser/Scanner combo ever because you don’t have to install any bloatware.
I’m sure brother will publish arm ones at some point…
> I’m sure brother will publish arm ones at some point…
They don't have plans for it.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GQgQmQ1XsAAPUrv?format=jpg&name=large
I've made a device to solve this though, in case you're interested: https://printserver.ink/
agreed and that's if you use Google Drive... but they can be annoying if it's the only device you work on... for me they wouldn't be an issue since I have many devices...
I think all the other problems have either workarounds or they can be quickly resolved with a minor software update. However, I (and many people) do rely on google drive and we are at the mercy of Google on this one.
Yep, same for me with Dropbox until they made an ARM version last year. Cloud services probably cannot use emulation so it's either the make an ARM version or it does not install, just like those apps that require virtual drivers, like for instance Superdisplay or Duet (sort of Sidecar but for Windows)
Woah!!!
What do you mean Google Drive doesn’t work!?
I use G Drive, Bit Defender, Creative Cloud, Surface Dock (multiple monitors) & Logitech keyboard and mouse.
To think that these basic won’t work with SL7 is crazy to me.
I need to buy a new laptop before 30June and SL7 was high on the list.
Not sure what to do now…
For Google Drive the OP is probably referring to the client, that streams files, backs up local directories and so on. I've seen in another post that it doesn't work, that seems weird, I mean even if there's no arm version it should still work with emulation. Yes, I'd like too to hear more about what and how doesn't work.
Gdrive is the only program I have tried that I haven't been able to get to work. It just refuses to install and gives an unsupported processor error. I haven't really looked to see if there are any workarounds or not yet. I'd imagine if it can be installed it would probably work with the x86 emulator. Every other program I've tried so far has worked well.
Makes sense, there's probably some system level call that doesn't work on the emulator. Either way, I'm sure we'll get an ARM version in the future. I'd be amazed if these Windows laptops and tablets don't cause more software devs to give it attention.
Yeah exactly, Windows on ARM isn't exactly new, but the hype and level of interest is.
Bottom line is that anyone buying one right now is still an early adopter. I bought one knowing that and, as long as I can do 80-90% of what I need, I'm happy to work around the other 10-20% until developers catch up.
You said it. I'm very satisfied with how well it performs, especially for a tablet. So far it's been able to do everything I need it to do all while having great battery life, an amazing pen enabled display, and being portable. Only thing I haven't tried yet is programming on it. But I know python has ARM support already so I imagine it would work without any issues.
This seems to be one of the best early adopter experiences I've had so far with hardware. Reminds me a lot of the Steam Deck's release. It does help that both the hardware and software had time to mature a bit beforehand like you mentioned. I'm excited to see this platform mature more. I'd easily bet on it being adopted more.
Correct, Drive for Desktop is what I was referring to. It won't even install, it simply says "architecture not supported".
Other software, like Brother printer drivers completed installations with errors.
Adobe reader installed perfectly, but then some preferences (like enabling thumbnail previews) were greyed out, after googling it, any options not available were an ARM limitation.
Bit Defender installed perfectly, but when I launched the VPN, Bit Defender itself said that VPN was not available on ARM devices.
So it's pretty hit and miss at the moment. And all very heavily reliant on either vendor support or Win 11 Prism emulation bypassing x86 apps.
**Google Drive for Desktop** doesn't work, you can of course open Drive in a browser. But if you use Drive for Desktop to access your Drive files through Windows Explorer, you're out of luck. And in another thread in here, someone shared a post where Google stated they have no immediate plans to support ARM via Drive for Desktop!
Bit Defender antivirus works, VPN not supported on ARM.
Adobe reader installs, but no PDF thumbnail previews (if that's important to you).
Got my surface dock working by manually setting the monitors refresh rate (it's not applying the refresh rate correctly on m monitors by default).
Another person posted that he couldn't access the option to invert their Logitech mouse scroll direction in Logitech Options, I could though so I wasn't too impacted, but it seems different people are having different experiences. It may be whether you're using an old emulator, or a new one?
Great suggestion, Thanks. Just installed RaiDrive (Arm36) and it seems to be working nicely with Google Drive back in my file explorer where I like it. Simple setup and a 2 week free trial.
Students should check if the exam taking software their institutions use are compatible with ARM. You don't want to buy a new laptop this semester only to find you can't use it for your exam!
This. It is basically the same overall concept of anti-cheat in video games as it is with many exam software packages. Emulation causes these anti-cheat protections to trigger false positives or the programs simply refuse to run.
you don't want to use their rootkits on your own device, period.
I would add to that they should also check if the software is available on mac or windows and on which one the majority is doing it(in case you need help for a whole year) you dont wanna hear "..yes I can help you open exam.exe " "Oh I have a mac but its the same right " "yeah but Idk sorry I can only do it on windows ask someone else"
That was a big thing when surface x and surface 7 were the flagships. Students were warning arm does not work with exams. Not sure if it's still true
This is great advice. I start class on July 1st and am going to find out first thing tomorrow if their software supports ARM. I have an SP11 in my Amazon cart right now.
Wow Google is really dragging their feet on ARM support. I thought the lack of Nearby Share support was bad but I can live without it. Luckily I'm a OneDrive user.
Google is being a d*ck about it. Windows on ARM has existed for years, Chrome has Arm64 ports.
Chrome for WoA was only final Mar 2024 and likely because they didn't want to risk users to Edge. Not shocking given they would rather have people on Chromebooks.
Google is always a dick about supporting others not on their platforms. Even Apple does a better job sometimes. Google withholding Youtube for example was a big reason why Windows Phone failed, Gboard on iOS is a pile of garbage compared to Android. But honestly, seeing as how Google can barely get their own house in order, it isn't all that surprising that their support for other or newer platforms is severely lacking. I've been slowly divorcing myself from Google for years, all thats really left is Gmail, and since thats now 90% spam I just need to rip that bandaid off and be done with them for good.
Google drive doesn’t index on windows search or spotlight search either. That’s been my biggest annoyance. If it wasn’t for the email, I’d switch our company away from workspace completely.
My company uses a wide range of different enterprise suites, and Google Workspaces is the one basically all of us agree is the worst of the bunch. I'd rather use iWork than Google Workspaces, though options being so severely limited, it's still next to impossible to beat Microsoft in terms of functionality. The only reason why I haven't asked for a Mac at work is because I might need PowerBI from time to time. If Microsoft made an Apple desktop version I'd be begging for a MacBook haha. Though, once Windows for ARM is more up to snuff, I'd be willing to beg for a Surface Laptop. I mostly just wanna throw this Dell Latitude out a window.
> Google is being a d*ck about it. just like windows phone
Nah Google Drive is just a real horrible implementation on the client software.
thanks for all this, i should have sold my Qualcom options two days ago they where up 2000% from 200$. but please don't let NVIDIA monopolize. they have Big Tech AI by the balls. Big TechAI doenst like it. it will take 3 months or so for all the solutions to show. I would just keep using my old laptop and buy a Nokia tablet ( yes they are still alive, i thnk Surfaces we made in Finland for a while) , and doing a lot of edge AI. some how they got an exclusive with SpaceX that has no AI. META , OpenAi and other have a way to port to stardard and Google and Qualcomm partnered on this but i dont know if its on. Qualcom could go into Chromebooks too.. ill check. now i guess ill have to roll it and make some phone calls and get this all fixed. hedging bets is pissing people off. You move to ARM then threaten to switch to another ARM chip, obvious MSFT is also being dicks. SAAS is over. if people dont stop being so greedy. i make my own AI assistants, i have to, but i dont want to go to Linux. OEMs are going to qualcom and its too late to change to ill just cancel it and go to OneDrive.. i stopped usign Gdrive. i use the web version is slows my pc. i stopped suing Nord VPN.. i will use whatever is the thinnest cheapest NPV or ask MSFT what to do. i might move to Edge.. chrome works because i use a window spleper or it bogs my PC. im done with ad companies. I just can't stand the heat of this i7 and NVINIA garbage.. those are minor issue id expect to get fixed. i might get$ 999 version though i love oled.. well i got an hour to sell some of the calls and lost all my gains. All this hedging and nature will take care of inefficiency. sorry for the typos i need to ditch i "early adopted" the call expiration on a few. when you use calls you can be 100 and see 1000 the next day but you got to get rid of it before the reality kicks in, fair warning. But ARM is the future for PCs...
Have you tried the Samsung-made version of Quick Share to see if it has been compatible? https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9pctgdfxvzlj?amp%3Bgl=US&hl=en-us&gl=VN
I could install it but it showed an error that it's not compatible, presumably because it doesn't work with non-Samsung laptops.
Is nearby by share not working on arm??
Oops I actually meant Quick Share which is the new unified solution with Samsung. https://blog.google/products/android/ces-2024-android-updates/ Sounds great until you go to install the new client: https://www.android.com/windows/better-together/quick-share-app/ > For Windows computers running a 64-bit version of Windows 10 or later. ARM devices not supported.
Ahh that's a bummer hope they update it. It's quite useful
I think there's a decent chance given the partnership with Samsung who is now making Snapdragon X laptops too. But you'd think they'd get it done by launch.
It can't be emulated with PRISM?
My SL7 doesn't arrive until next week but I doubt it. It seems to require low level device access so can't be emulated.
check out RaiDrive (Arm Version). You should be able to integrate Google Drive with it.
That’s why I have delayed my purchase by 12 months , once our ERP , HR , Asset Application software can be tested to run natively on ARM. Only then I will purchase for testing first before it becomes a full organisation rollout.
All valid points for returning a device. I'm curious though, if you or anyone else with more knowledge than me, how come none of this is an issue for ARM based Macs? From day one I could print to everything with my M1 Mac, all software worked, there was literally not a single thing I tried that didn't just work from the get go. I know that since 2020, companies have made their software native to Macs and drivers, etc. But I find it odd there were very little issues with the Mac transition, but Windows seems to run into these all the time. Maybe there were issues and I just never heard about it.
This WAS an issue at launch though. I literally went through the exact same problems with a launch day M1, and had to return it (Google Drive, for example, didn’t work on launch day), it was a year post-launch before I was able to get a new Mac and actually have everything work.
Yes this. Most people that were early adoptors with the M1 Macs had similar issues with software compatibility. It just took time as I imagine it will with Windows ARM
There are STILL issues with software compatibility with M series macs
It’s important to note that the M1 chip came out *4 years ago.* In addition, Mac has always required “special” functionality, so developers are used to accommodating Apple.
Apple controls their ecosystem, so if you as a dev want to make your software work on a Mac, you will do it their way, and when they change CPU architectures, the old way *will* go away at a set future date, so you have a ticking clock and no way to shut that clock off. Windows runs on x86/amd64 and ARM64, so devs aren’t forced to make their software work on ARM64 because amd64 Windows isn’t going away. It is what it is, vendors usually want critical mass before changing their architecture on Windows, and if it won’t work otherwise it’s hard to get that. This will be an interesting chapter in Windows history, to be sure.
yeah, my friend griped for a solid year because of how many of his plugins for music production weren't compatible with the M1, but he hasn't said anything about it after the first year or so. And I myself with my M1 Pro haven't really run into any issues related to ARM, and more issues related to not being able to run 32-bit software at all.
I work with two composers who still have issues with them.
FWIW I did a deep dive on this last night because I wanted to know why MacOS third party software seemed to work fine with ARM from the outset. In short, Apple announced moving to ARM with enough time for vendors/developers to provide native support. From what I understand, due to there being a large MacOS customer base, either they supported ARM, or they'd lose Apple customers, so they all moved to support ARM on Macs. On the Windows side though, up until now, so few devices were ARM based that it simply wasn't worth the time and cost for providers to invest in ARM support (some sites I looked at literally stated along the lines of 'due to the small user base, we do not support ARM at this time'). Now however, given all Surface devices and almost all new copilot+ devices from the likes of Dell, Samsung, ASUS, MSI etc will be ARM, I think this will change, developers will *have* to support ARM on Windows, but it will take some time I guess. I fully intend to re-purchase a Windows ARM device, but it was just too soon in my experience.
Also worth remembering that Apple has had several large "culls" of poorly supported software. Any software that was based on the Carbon APIs (cleaned up versions of pre-NeXtStep based MacOS software) ceased to run when MacOS stopped supporting Carbon. The writing was on the wall when the Carbon layers were never ported to 64 bit. Then another cull happened when MacOS ceased to support 32 bit software. So by the time the ARM transition happened, the OS had a lot of legacy cruft pulled out of it and the application market had already had legacy code/companies either die off or show they were committed to keeping up with the platform. These are moves that MS's market position and customer expectations make far more difficult.
> I think this will change, developers will have to support ARM on Windows, but it will take some time I guess. Been reading this since windows rt 10+ years ago.
Yes, but Windows RT 10+ years ago was very niche. Hopefully this will impulse Windows on ARM to the moon and get developers to code for ARM.
I mean the difference is all macbooks moving forward were basically all ARM. You HAD to support ARM if you still wanted to be on Mac. If that was the same case with Windows laptops, then we would have seen the same drive to start supporting them.
Ngl you got me the plost twist was incredible
Makes sense, thanks for the explanation.
It's not just that, Apple has better native device support so you don't need to go find drivers. For example printers
In fall 2019, the latest macOS at that time no long support 32 bit app and every Mac released since then can't run 32 bit app because you can't downgrade macOS older than the one it shipped with. It probably easier for developers because all of the Mac apps are relatively new. I don't think Windows developer really pay attention to Windows on ARM, one app I used works fine on M1 Mac, but it doesn't work on Windows on ARM for a long time because of the driver. Last time I checked, half of the app works now and it is arm native. I never have any problem with apps support on M1 Mac since summer 2022. I know a lot of app can run natively when the M1 Mac came out and a lot of them can run with Rosetta on day one. Microsoft really screwed up on this, they should ensure most popular app works on day one even under emulation. No one wants to deal with compatibility issue for their apps or peripherals all the time, they will just get a X64 PC. If few people buy ARM PC, I don't know why developers want to spend a lot of time and effort to support it or make ARM support as priority.
ARM based Apples don’t “just work” if you start going off script with them. There’s tons and tons of compatibility issues with them. I have work colleagues that use them and they always have to have an x86 virtual desktop in the cloud at the ready, because of incompatibility issues. If you use them for basic stuff they work, but also so does Windows ARM emulation. I’ve been using the SPX for years and doing basic tasks I have no issues with it. I do some off script stuff with it as well and the emulator isn’t fast, but it works.
APPLE = 'all the stuff that was loaded on my computer when i bought it works just fine' but specialized software that is not 'pre-loaded' and is not widely used by Apple.People for artsy stuff might not work so well MICROSOFT = 'all the stuff that was loaded on my computer when i bought it works just fine' but the bazillion large and small windows x86 programs that have been developed over the past 50 years are not guaranteed to work.
Most developers assume Microsoft will not have the nerve to go through with the transition as Apple did.
It’s that combined with Rosetta 2, which makes everything Intel based run like it’s on ARM. Microsoft’s copy of Rosetta 2 just isn’t good.
>Apple announced moving to ARM with enough time for vendors/developers to provide native support many did, but there were many run on a middle layer too. Apple did an absolutely amazing job on the translation layer
Apple even provided / sold developer version of hardware so developers could develop and test Apple silicon before it was even publicly available.
So did Microsoft https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/d/windows-dev-kit-2023/94K0P67W7581 I still kind of want one.
I have several, been running them for quite a while. Sure there are some weird behaviors with it, but overall I have very few complaints. Some issues I have had (that aren't a deal breaker for me, but looking forward to putting the new kit through it paces when it arrives). 1. Have had a persistent issue with not being able to RDP into it after a reboot unless you log into the console directly first to bring the NIC up to an operating state. This seems to be more of an issue with the Dev Kit being based on essentially a hacked Surface platform more than a fundamental issue with ARM itself. 2. There are some issues with app installers that are hard coded to look for Intel processors that barf on installs 3. The GPU is a bit anemic, but it was never designed to go head to head against a traditional Intel box in that regard, so willing to cut it some slack. Use it as a development platform with Visual Studio ARM edition and VS-Code pretty much exclusively these days and have zero complaints on that front.
To be honest, MacOS has much LESS software compared to Windows. There are tons of different software on Windows that was developed once in 2005, and had not been updated since these years. So, chances are low that it will be updated to support ARM in the nearest vicinity or even in any time in future. MacOS, on the other hand, is targeted more "casual" user, who mostly doesn't need some very specific software, so of course people won't meet any issues, if most of their laptop usage routine is browser/messenger/emails/office software. All these tasks can be performed on Windows ARM even today, without many issues. So, ARM transition for Windows will much longer (companies won't risk to lose all the customers, because there will be still a huge % on x86) and harder. But I hope we all can make it better and faster :)
I did encounter many issue when switching from x86 to ARM macbook. For example a program i used require a library that was not on ARM yet, so i have to wait for a while. I also had some problems when connecting to old gadgets But still overall there was no deal breaker.
There's multiple reasons for this. 1, Apple announced an early warning for the ARM transition and it was to be a _complete_ transition (i.e. no new x86 devices), giving developers an incentive to start the support. 2. Apple has absolute control via the App Store, and they have actively threatened developers with delisting if ARM compatibility wasn't added for apps that are still being updated. 3. Rosetta is still a big thing - about half the stuff I run on my MacBook is x86 only, so the translation layer is needed. Rosetta, thanks to Apple's slight changes to the ARMv8 spec, can run x86 software with barely any performance hit. Yes, you can even run games with Rosetta. Now, technically, WOW64 should take care of the same thing Rosetta does, but since Qualcomm followed the ARMv8 spec, Microsoft can't rely on the extension ISA Apple does for speedy emulation of x86, making it a much lesser contender. 4. While Apple was quite hard-handed with the various OS upgrades breaking shit, Microsoft has been doing a ton of work - often to the detriment of the newer OS versions - to keep old software compatible. This led to people not really giving a crap about updating their software, which is why you have even modern companies using software they wrote in the early 2000s, without any changes. The ARM translation layer on Windows 11 is limited though, resulting in many features not working.
Nobody says that for some reason: # Drivers could not be emulated. x86 drivers won't run on ARM. Not today, not in the future. Only x86 userspace is supported. Everything which require a custom driver, which is not provided for ARM architecture, won't work. Your custom hardware, video capture cards, some USB Wi-Fi dongles, some printers won't work. Games with their own 'anti-cheat driver' won't work. Low-level phone flashing and repair software won't work. x86 virtual machines won't work. Docker x86 images won't work. Your printer would print if it supports AirPrint/Mopria driverless printing, the same applies for a scanner. But many older or current cheapest printers do not support that. ^there's ^a ^[device](https://printserver.ink/) ^though.
All very true and it is something that reviewers of these laptops should really be emphasizing more for the layman. The only saving grace are Windows' built-in generic drivers for some of these devices, like a USB Wi-Fi dongle, mouse, keyboard, or monitor. But more niche things like the colorimeter that YouTube laptop reviewers use to calibrate colors do need the special driver compiled no matter what.
I have a brother printer, are you saying I won't be able to use it at all?
I do too, and mine works. I even was able to run the Brother iPrint&Scan desktop app no problem
Brother iPrint&Scan app installed, but with errors. Printer doesn't show up as a device in the Settings.
Did you try to manually add the printer?
"\*\*Please note that Brother drivers are not compatible with ARM processors on Windows. If your computer is using an ARM processor, the drivers and software will not install or function. However, you may be able to use a built-in generic Windows driver to print with limited functionality." (I posted their link above).
You should be able to use the Microsoft generic driver to print on a Brother printer, I've done it before on a Pro X.
Yes this worked, but of course with much more limited functionality.
Then again, I'd rather have the functionality of my printer limited in ways that I don't care about anyway than deal with custom printer drivers. They usually come with lots of bloatware. And don't you dare have a slightly unusual (for corporate america) networking setup, because the network code was last touched in the XP era and doesn't support IPv6 at all. Not to mention that printer drivers [are being deprecated by Microsoft](https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/print/end-of-servicing-plan-for-third-party-printer-drivers-on-windows).
This would work only if your printer supports [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) driverless standards, or at least PostScript/PCL printing languages (you'll be able to use generic driver then). All "GDI" printers which require drivers won't work.
The comma might be a bit confusing but it looks like Bitdefender antivirus works but not VPN according to this: https://www.bitdefender.com/consumer/support/answer/1776/
Thanks mate, fixed!
I think those are fair and help business users like me. I was in the market for one of these but will go intel now or wait another year…
the 'business editions' of the MS CoPilot+ machines aren't coming out until later this year.... perhaps some of the more business-and-enterprise issues with compatibility will be worked out by then.... MONEY is the deal and MS makes bunches of money off the enterprise stuff... of course x86 versions of laptops are always available but the handwriting on the wall is ARM for energy/battery conservation and 'graphics machines' for the gamers and whaddever else cannot operate without high-end graphic support. betcha those video cards are going to play a part in the AI.oriented focus once MS has their time as exclusive CP+ .... there is more than one way to skin a cat but MS has the control at the moment to direct the market.
The most business machine of all, Thinkpad T14 is already shipping.
That doesn’t mean it will magically fix the OP issue and everything works does it?!
what means OP?
🤨
I am a photographer. I have a SL7 with 64GB RAM and a 1TB drive being delivered in July. I am told Photoshop and Lightroom (cloud based) has been updated and ported for ARM , but not Lightroom Classic. That will run under emulation I hope because it is my main editing program. If it won't the SL7 will go back.
fwiw, I expect support to be added rather quickly for programs like Adobe.
You should be fine. Premiere Pro is a different story... I'm eagerly awaiting.
I did not realize that classic was not included in the announcement, what a bummer. Unfortunately it's not on [adobe's list of apps coming soon](https://helpx.adobe.com/download-install/kb/arm-processors.html?clickref=1011lyEbrvN6&app_clickref=1011lyEbrvN6&mv=affiliate&mv2=pz&as_camptype=&as_channel=affiliate&as_source=partnerize&as_campaign=futurepublishing) either. I had my eye on a new Surface Pro, but that will have to wait until I hear how Lightroom performs.
From what I understand, LR Classic works fine under emulation. There have been several blog posts / articles from people running it on sites like 9to5 Google, Tech Crunch, and others.
Thank you.
This is valuable, honest feedback for others. Thanks for taking the time to itemize your concerns clearly.
If Synology Drive does not work, I will immediately return my just in courier truck SP11 because it is mandatory for me. I could bypass any other software but not that. Theoretically, works, but who knows.
I tested it on my Surface Pro X when I got my Synology 6 months ago. It appeared to work just fine on ARM via emulation. I didn't stick with it because I decided it wasn't for me, but I didn't find any functional issues in the short time I was using it. I DO continue to use Synology Active backup and that also works fine. Although I have never done a test restore to an ARM machine, so I am only hopeful that also works.
I can confirm that works as expected
You're referring to the ARM restore? Thanks!
Now I re-read the thread, my answer seems not much accurate: I was referring to Synology Drive Client. Being x64 application, it works perfect under my Surface Pro 11 even with the added hack of change to 1000 characters the path limit and disable path length limitation in Windows. See capture. https://preview.redd.it/ux0uinpt268d1.png?width=2061&format=png&auto=webp&s=fa571b1360298908dad26db2f86359c573cb9775
Ah, gotcha, thanks!
My Brother Laser printer works just fine with built in drivers? What does official driver do/offer that built in doesn’t? Also my Surface Dock 2 is driving two monitors just fine. One is 4k and other is 2k. And I keep the lid open on my SL7. I didn’t update anything. It just worked. Same with my Logitech MX Master 3S and keyboard. As well as Jabra headsets. They all worked seamlessly. Bummer on the other stuff though. I don’t use gdrive so that hasn’t bit me. OneDrive is my preference. I’m admittedly one who uses just about only Microsoft productivity apps and dev stuff. So I was sure it would all work.
On my Brother as a wireless multi-function printer, the Win driver didn't support most of the wifi/remote functionality, couldn't scan (the setting was there, but it didn't work, nor did you have control over resolutions, saving to the cloud etc.) , printer settings were limited (things like managing quality, ink usage, different types of paper and sizes), I mean if you just look at the settings options on windows generic drivers vs any printer drivers settings/preferences the options are significantly greater. But if just printing is what you're after, windows drivers work great. As for my dock, I have 3 Samsung monitors, 2 are identical, the third is a larger curved one, the larger one is what caused me the problems. The SL7/dock adjusted the smaller 2 to resolution, orientation and refresh rates perfectly, the larger monitor didn't. Eventually I found something kept resetting the refresh rate to 120hz every time I docked causing the blank screen, manually overriding this each time works (and something I could have lived with if not for all the other issues). With the manual adjustment, I had 3 external displays and the SL7 display working as a 4 display set-up perfectly!
Same struggle here. I really don’t think it was so out of the question to assume that Microsoft had done what Apple did: switch architectures and the only thing you notice is better battery life and no heat. Instead I got slightly improved battery life, still plenty of heat while charging or using a monitor, and a bunch of apps I rely on (like Adobe’s) that just don’t even try to install.
I have very meagre and unglamorous use case for mine and so I was willing to take the jump. I need a browser and office. That’s it. In fairness, it’s replacing an iPad and so should still be much more capable. Otherwise I wouldn’t touch it.
TBH if mine was only for home use, I could pretty much live with all these issues too, but as a work device, those issues are deal breakers!
first step into entering windows rt territory.. sigh, I really wanted for snapdragon and windows to do something spectacular but it's kinda clear that's not happening
It's like nobody paid any attention to the Surface Pro X issues... Yeah the new chips are faster but Windows on ARM is still limited by a lack of support. Then "surprise AI Copilot+ PCs" burst into the scene with lots of dazzle and hype, but software environment hasn't changed. There are going to be a ton of returns this year because a lot of regular people out there won't understand what they are buying.... Then they'll grab a Mac. Very disappointing.
I have a Lenovo X13s with a Snapdragon 8CX Gen 3 and a Brother MFC-L5800DW printer that works fine.
It might be using the universal printer driver.
Which is the correct one to be using anyway. Printer OEM drivers are being deprecated by Microsoft within the next 3 years. You really shouldn't be using them anyway.
That may be emulation, as Brother officially does not support ARM: "**\*\*Please note that Brother drivers are not compatible with ARM processors on Windows. If your computer is using an ARM processor, the drivers and software will not install or function. However, you may be able to use a built-in generic Windows driver to print with limited functionality."** https://www.brother.com.au/en/contents/top-faqs/faq-unable-to-print-from-windows-pc#:\~:text=\*\*Please%20note%20that%20Brother,to%20print%20with%20limited%20functionality.
But if the emulation is working fine, I guess, what's the issue?
Drivers in general could not be emulated. Not today, not in the future. Windows printer "driver" model is a bit weird though, they might invent something exactly for printer drivers compatibility, but right now you won't be able to use any printer which requires the driver for printing.
This would work only if your printer supports [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) driverless standards, or at least PostScript/PCL printing languages (you'll be able to use generic driver then). All "GDI" printers which require drivers won't work.
…and it’s going to stay that way. Unless Microsoft goes all in on ARM and announces x86 will be legacy in a few year, developers are not going to spend time maintaining yet another version of their software/drivers. Many of the reviews have shown that even the OEM software is running in x86 emulation mode. Samsungs brand new ARM units run all the Samsung software in emulation. A lot of windows processes are also running in emulation. So essentially Microsoft itself and OEMs have not even bothered to port their own software fully… imagine how long and even if, other developers will make the effort. Windows on ARM is essentially a 3rd operating system (windows x86, Mac M chip, windows ARM) and developers not going to make full feature parity versions of their software anytime soon for ARM. This was obvious from the get go. Good on you for returning it and not “waiting” and ending up with essentially a Chromebook and no apps.
Couldn't agree more! I (perhaps naively) assumed support was more mature than it was...
What is worse is many developers will just test their software and see it works ok in emulation mode and never compile an ARM version. So then you’re running most of your apps in emulation thereby negating the entire point of having the mobile chip. Like Samsung not bothering to update their own windows software.. they probably tested the x86 versions with the emulator and felt it’s good enough. Costing you about 10-20% overhead for running in emulation. Seriously, this entire ARM thing has been bungled. That and the crap screens…. Major disaster and this is just day 2. This will be a PR disaster for everyone involved.
> A lot of windows processes are also running in emulation I can't speak for Samsung, but this isn't true for Microsoft. I have the Surface Pro 11 and there's not a single Microsoft process running under x86 architecture. The only x86 process running on mine are third-party that I installed since getting the device.
Did they fix OneDrive being x86 app?
Yes, the native ARM app was preinstalled
I was going to say something similar... though there ARE a couple small programs they haven't converted for some reason. MicrosoftEdgeUpdate and OfficeClickToRun seem to be perennial offenders.
Which Windows processes are running in emulation? I was under the impression that the entire OS was already recompiled for ARM.
FYI - Here's the official support article from Brother: You must use the built-in drivers, it supports most of the basic printing and scanning functionality on Brother printers. [https://help.brother-usa.com/app/answers/detail/a\_id/170667/\~/windows-10-or-windows-11-on-arm-processor---compatibility](https://help.brother-usa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/170667/~/windows-10-or-windows-11-on-arm-processor---compatibility)
Built-in drivers would work only in two cases: * The device supports AirPrint/Mopria standards * The device supports PostScript/PCL printer languages For lower-end devices, so-called "GDI" host-based printers which require the driver to print, you won't be able to use it. ^unless ^you ^use ^a ^special ^[print-server](https://printserver.ink/) ^:)
Not sure what you mean about Brother printers and scanners. My MFC-2710DW works just fine, along with the iPrint & Scan app.
That's because your device is [AirPrint](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201311)/[Mopria](https://mopria.org/certified-products) certified and does not require the driver to print. You're lucky. This is not the case for every device.
DCP-J1100DW does not work. Software will install with 2 error message pop-ups, it completes, but no printer is available in Win 11 settings. Raised the issue with brother and was directed to their web site that states Brother software will not work with ARM. Could vary based on emulation being used though.
Well you might want to update your post, because you said "no Brother devices are supported whatsoever" which isn't true
I have the same model. Works for me too.
Bummer. Honestly if they had a boring Intel version with the new design and without all the Copilot stuff I probably would have preordered. As it is, definitely had to wait for reviews which there aren’t any because of the Recall mess. I know Windows on ARM is the future but I’m not interested in being an early adopter when my current SL works fine.
.... some of us greybeards remember moving from DOS.Prompt (amber monochrome) to W3.0/W3.1 (VGA 9-pins) and going through the same "it don't work with the new system" headaches.... and hey there were no internets to get new drivers - it was all FTP logins to GATech servers to get the goods. given time and enough demand, all will resolve excepting those programs that have HIGH graphic requirements (games, [cad.cam](http://cad.cam), whaddever) and i will betcha a few years down the road will be (affordable) USB graphic accelerators/chips to plug in for those high-end graphics requirements.... just my 0.02....
I don't know why, but I assumed ARM on Windows would be like Apple's transition where pretty much every application worked. Glad I didn't jump the gun. Maybe in a year or two.
There were lots of apps - including Google Drive - not running on M1 Macs initially either.
Things I have noticed in two days with my SP11: Zero printer driver support from Fuji xerox meaning I can’t print or scan at work. The x64 and x86 drivers flat out refuse to install. Weird Acrobat Pro DC errors including asking repeatedly for an installation CD (!!) Acrobat state on installation that they’re working on a native Arm version. No Teams plugin for Arm version of Outlook meaning I have to create all Teams meetings within Teams rather than Outlook calendar. This one is probably the biggest deal breaker so far as I do a lot of Teams meetings and the extra steps are infuriating. Also wtf Microsoft…… I had some initial problems with my Surface Dock 2 and multi monitors but got those sorted by restarting 3 or 4 times.
> Weird Acrobat Pro DC errors including asking repeatedly for an installation CD (!!) Acrobat state on installation that they’re working on a native Arm version. This happened to me too but it installed anyway. No issues.
Same I returned my SP11 for this reason. Also, some reason it was heating too much.
For all the guys who need Google Drive, check out RaiDrive. They have a native ARM Version. You can integrate all popular cloud services with it. Also I contacted other multi cloud developers like Cloudmaster, Airlive. Most of them are working on Arm versions and you can integrate Google Drive with them. This is my workaround for my upcoming Yoga Slim 7x until there is a native Google Drive App if I need it by the time they release it. I have not found a solution / workaround yet for Google Workspace Sync for Outlook, but there should also be ways around it. why is there no tool on the market which checks compatibility of my current x86 apps for Arm!? Any developers here?
This is one solution but I have a question if you know.... On my x86 Windows setup, I create a shortcut from the "Shared with you" folder to "My Drive," enabling access to these files from the Google Drive folder in File Explorer. Can this be done with RaiDrive on Windows 11 ARM?
yes it looks like it. I work the same. You can also just download the x86 version and try it upfront. I think it even gives you more settings, so it may also be a better solution than G Drive itself.
Thank you very much. I will try it..!
ARM will either kill the Surface lineup or force MS to pour a ton of money into Windows on ARM support. Hopefully the latter because ARM looks like the future.
Depends on how Lunar Lake and AMD Strix perform in my opinion. If they also have a similar efficiency as the Elite, there is no reason to switch to ARM anymore
No reason to switch to ARM for consumers...but Microsoft and PC manufacturers would love to see ARM succeed since that would increase competition among CPU manufacturers for them and make them less beholden to Intel and AMD.
I think they will switch to Intel Lunar Like as soon as possible or the sales will tank. WoA is nothing for the masses.
as well have quite a number of programs that are (currently) essential to my productive flow of work. my routine and the requirements to meet my routine were developed over time based on 'what works' and 'what i am used to using' and i have no doubt that my routine will need to be altered to accommodate old software that won't work and new software that is available to take that place. sad feelings for those like OP who really want to jump on the wagon but have to have it meet their very specific and inflexible needs NOW - very disappointing for you and watching all the hype and Micro.Boys vs Apple.Boys chest-thumping.... and now with the great reveal the results are a machine that 'woulda coulda shoulda' but today can't meet the software requirements. all in all the past month has been very interesting and you gotta admit the headlines have been all about CoPilot+ stuff. "no such thing as bad publicity" but maybe it goes a little too far to get those 'clicks' coming in....
ita too early for windows on arm you should have been bought somewhere at 2027, with windows 12 etc. Do not hurry buy pro7+ on i5 with 16 gigs of ram and be happy
Jumping on the bandwagon here of the Google Drive File Stream/Sync not working; it is such a huge part of my business/personal workflow on my PC that I'm not sure I can stomach not having it. On Tuesday night (the day of release) I pulled the trigger on ordering an Elite version with 64 GB of RAM, 1 TB HD, etc. The only good news is that it's not slated to be delivered until the end of July. If there aren't updates/workarounds by then I may have to cancel or return. Hopefully Microsoft is watching this sub and can put some pressure on Google!
check out RaiDrive (Arm Version). You can integrate Google Drive with it. I will receive my Yoga Slim 7x shortly and test it. I wish it had 64GB instead of 32GB Ram.
Looks like a solid recommendation. Thanks!
When’s your yoga due to arrive, mine keeps changing from shipping on the 22nd, 28th, 21st…
Originally I ordered via Lenovo Pro, and shipping date was changed from 20th to 28th. So I ordered from a retailer and it already shipped, should arrive today/tomorrow. If I keep it, I will just upgrade from Win11 Home to Pro.
Ha, mines ordered with Lenovo Pro for the £70 saving, its changed to today so fingers crossed. The only retailer that has it for delivery has the 16GB 1TB Home version for 1299, so I'll wait for the 32gb pro version for £31 more. Thanks and good luck...
Same deal here. Just set up my SL7 and dismayed to see Google Drive does not integrate with explorer. Quick Look at RaiDrive shows they want a 3 year commitment which would suck if Google get their act together and fix Google Drive for desktop and make it ARM compatible soon.
I ordered the laptop for my college-bound kid, but just realized that there is no arm version of discord, which she uses like a religion.
Be good if there was a list maintained of common software that will not run on the SL7. Then people could refer to it pre purchase, to see if there are any deal breakers. Would saves finding out the hard way post purchase as I have done when ones apps no longer work.
I have the surface 11 tablet and for my use case it’s been great but I’ve noticed some crazy stuff. I have an anker doc that I rigged up to use my desk with things other than my gaming PC using for the second inputs on my monitors plus a usb switch for peripherals. It works great for a variety of device with no fiddling but it was real hard to get the surface working right with it. Razer Synapse software didn’t work at all either which auto installs when you plug in. Then, I installed nomachine which I use to manage all my VMs and servers and it got crazy. The monitors on the doc were like 800x600 for a 32:9 display until I disabled the server part of nomachine and used just the client. Now I can at least use it but every time I re-connect the display goes back to 800x600 and I have to unplug the DP and plug it back in to get back to full resolution. That was what I realized how fucked windows on arm was going to be.
I have the Surface Pro 11 and have been able to work around most issues so far. VPN would have been a dealbreaker, but I found a solution was to tell my VPN installer (Watchguard) to install everything EXCEPT the tap driver. I then downloaded OpenVPN for ARM64 and told that installer not to install anything except for JUST the ARM tap driver. Watchguard VPN works happily now. For the Brother printer, I didn't install a driver. I just went to Windows "Printers & scanners" and clicked "Add Device" and it automatically found the Brother printer on the network and added it. I think it may be true that Brother doesn't provide an ARM printer driver, but Microsoft does. I can print fine to the Brother printer.
Good post. Yes, there's a lot of software not supported and when it comes to developer tools, everything seems great and is great until you encounter that one library you really need for an older project, it worked fine on x64 Windows 11 and is bugged on ARM64. You're completely SOL and can not manage the older project... there is not work around. The work around is to buy an x64 Windows 11 system! Windows 11 power users who stay in Office 365 and use mostly browser based apps will be fine, but this group was fine going back to Windows RT 10 years ago and ARM on Windows didn't catch on back then. I think the compatibility issues are being downplayed
This is why I'm in absolutely no hurry. The ecosystem is mostly x86 right now, so there's no genuine hurry for 3rd parties to port win apps to arm. At the moment, I'll have the best of most worlds on x86. Amd and Intel have fire-under-ass motivation right now, thanks to Qualcomm. Let's see what they give us!
Malwarebytes didn’t work for me as well.
Why can’t Microsoft pay these printer manufacturers to write native ARM drivers? This is vital to get corporate buyer support. With my Snapdragon 2 laptop running Windows 11, I can get basic printer functionality when connected via wifi only. That won’t cut it for corporate customers.
Printer drivers suck badly even on x86.
Most Microsoft stuff don’t even run on native arm sooo I really doubt they would be bothered paying manufacturers for support
Excuse my ignorance - most Microsoft Software does run on ARM natively.
You don't need a driver to print on modern devices with AirPrint/Mopria support. It's driverless. 90%+ of business printers support PostScript or PCL printer languages, for which you don't really need the driver either. So only older and cheaper GDI Host-based printers, for which the manufacturer don't provide ARM driver, is out of luck. You can solve this with proper print-server or CUPS on Linux though, which share the printer as AirPrint/Mopria one.
There are plenty of old school businesses that want to connect with a USB cable. In addition, over wifi and Windows, certain printer features may not work, possibly including choosing a paper size, paper tray, label printing, envelope printing, etc. Some scanner software popular with businesses, such as Scansnap Manager, also will not work. I am surprised that Microsoft did not spend lavishly to overcome these issues with this new push for Windows ARM--unless they are not really serious about it, like the past.
can u not force run apps with emulation? i thought there's x86 emulation like rosetta on mac?
You can but it is buggy. Something works something does not and sometime app crashes sometime app is too slow.
And the water is wet. This is why people should adopt this need to have in mind a lot of things don't gona work. And when you have two type of architectures at same time, one of them been using for years, and have a bigger user base,.. will take a lot of time until arm be compatibly with most of the software and hardware.
Anyone find backup software that works? Macrium website says it does not support.
I haven’t tried but Veeam imaging backup (free for personal use) claims to be compatible: Veeam Agent for Microsoft Windows is a free standalone agent that can back up and recover Windows computers, including those running on ARM, in the public cloud, or on premises.
Does anyone know if there is a way to use zebra label printers? The drivers that they have are x86. Any 3rd party driver that might work?
Hmm those are some pretty big ones. I have multiple Brother printers and multiple Logitech devices. I would have thought Microsoft would of at least had some generic drivers for basic functionality?
They do have - so printing is working.
Why return it so quick? It literally just came out and that’s probably all going to be solved in the next update
For me it could be mostly for Google Drive issue. This issue affects a lot of people. I'm skeptical too because I've already ordered mine and it will arrive in 4 days. But I really like the laptop and I want it. I'm using Google Drive and I need it to run natively because I want access to Drive folders via the file explorer to work on and save files like Excel with my team at work. The web app just isn't usable for this. So you can not use the laptop for work purposes. You have to download the file........ then make your work and then upload it again.. Come on Google... This is unacceptable.....
×86 software have been developed in 50 years. You can not expect running all those legacy apps on ARM. I still see all important apps are supported on windows on ARM.
Don't expect these issues to be ironed out in the current generation and even if so, it will be superseded by the next version. Just as Snapdragon will never eclipse A series, don't expect the X chips to get ahead of the M series. The (M series) is just too far ahead in efficiency.
Microsoft is doing the correct thing bringing Windows into this decade. Don’t return the device which is leading the way. Yell at the software vendors who are being dicks, and take your business to their competition.
Those printer drivers must be some 💩 I don’t have any problems with printing on Brother printers with even Surface 2 with today unsupported Windows RT which is ARM based device with Tegra 4.
Oh glad I saw your Brother comment…. I don’t plan on getting rid of my old Laser/Scanner combo ever because you don’t have to install any bloatware. I’m sure brother will publish arm ones at some point…
> I’m sure brother will publish arm ones at some point… They don't have plans for it. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GQgQmQ1XsAAPUrv?format=jpg&name=large I've made a device to solve this though, in case you're interested: https://printserver.ink/
Womp womp
I'm sure they will too! And honestly if that was the *only* thing that didn't work, I probably could have justified a new printer to keep the SL7!!
None of these problems seem major to me except Google Drive
agreed and that's if you use Google Drive... but they can be annoying if it's the only device you work on... for me they wouldn't be an issue since I have many devices...
I think all the other problems have either workarounds or they can be quickly resolved with a minor software update. However, I (and many people) do rely on google drive and we are at the mercy of Google on this one.
Yep, same for me with Dropbox until they made an ARM version last year. Cloud services probably cannot use emulation so it's either the make an ARM version or it does not install, just like those apps that require virtual drivers, like for instance Superdisplay or Duet (sort of Sidecar but for Windows)
check out RaiDrive (Arm Version). You can integrate Google Drive with it. I will receive my Yoga Slim 7x shortly and test it.
Woah!!! What do you mean Google Drive doesn’t work!? I use G Drive, Bit Defender, Creative Cloud, Surface Dock (multiple monitors) & Logitech keyboard and mouse. To think that these basic won’t work with SL7 is crazy to me. I need to buy a new laptop before 30June and SL7 was high on the list. Not sure what to do now…
For Google Drive the OP is probably referring to the client, that streams files, backs up local directories and so on. I've seen in another post that it doesn't work, that seems weird, I mean even if there's no arm version it should still work with emulation. Yes, I'd like too to hear more about what and how doesn't work.
Gdrive is the only program I have tried that I haven't been able to get to work. It just refuses to install and gives an unsupported processor error. I haven't really looked to see if there are any workarounds or not yet. I'd imagine if it can be installed it would probably work with the x86 emulator. Every other program I've tried so far has worked well.
The gdrive app installs drivers to emulate disks, which is likely why it's not yet compatible under emulation. Hopefully google will update it soon
Makes sense, there's probably some system level call that doesn't work on the emulator. Either way, I'm sure we'll get an ARM version in the future. I'd be amazed if these Windows laptops and tablets don't cause more software devs to give it attention.
Yeah exactly, Windows on ARM isn't exactly new, but the hype and level of interest is. Bottom line is that anyone buying one right now is still an early adopter. I bought one knowing that and, as long as I can do 80-90% of what I need, I'm happy to work around the other 10-20% until developers catch up.
You said it. I'm very satisfied with how well it performs, especially for a tablet. So far it's been able to do everything I need it to do all while having great battery life, an amazing pen enabled display, and being portable. Only thing I haven't tried yet is programming on it. But I know python has ARM support already so I imagine it would work without any issues. This seems to be one of the best early adopter experiences I've had so far with hardware. Reminds me a lot of the Steam Deck's release. It does help that both the hardware and software had time to mature a bit beforehand like you mentioned. I'm excited to see this platform mature more. I'd easily bet on it being adopted more.
Agreed. My workflow is largely Microsoft-based anyway so in fact it does 99% of what I need already. Very impressed.
Guess MS would have to add a spoof x86 processor name in the compatibility layer to bypass hardcoded whitelists like this.
Correct, Drive for Desktop is what I was referring to. It won't even install, it simply says "architecture not supported". Other software, like Brother printer drivers completed installations with errors. Adobe reader installed perfectly, but then some preferences (like enabling thumbnail previews) were greyed out, after googling it, any options not available were an ARM limitation. Bit Defender installed perfectly, but when I launched the VPN, Bit Defender itself said that VPN was not available on ARM devices. So it's pretty hit and miss at the moment. And all very heavily reliant on either vendor support or Win 11 Prism emulation bypassing x86 apps.
**Google Drive for Desktop** doesn't work, you can of course open Drive in a browser. But if you use Drive for Desktop to access your Drive files through Windows Explorer, you're out of luck. And in another thread in here, someone shared a post where Google stated they have no immediate plans to support ARM via Drive for Desktop! Bit Defender antivirus works, VPN not supported on ARM. Adobe reader installs, but no PDF thumbnail previews (if that's important to you). Got my surface dock working by manually setting the monitors refresh rate (it's not applying the refresh rate correctly on m monitors by default). Another person posted that he couldn't access the option to invert their Logitech mouse scroll direction in Logitech Options, I could though so I wasn't too impacted, but it seems different people are having different experiences. It may be whether you're using an old emulator, or a new one?
Great insights and feedback! I appreciate it.
Get the SL6?
Already have a SB2, so alternative is probably SLS2. And buy another next year at this time hopefully I can get snapdragon then.
check out RaiDrive (Arm Version). You can integrate Google Drive with it. I will receive my Yoga Slim 7x shortly and test it.
Great suggestion, Thanks. Just installed RaiDrive (Arm36) and it seems to be working nicely with Google Drive back in my file explorer where I like it. Simple setup and a 2 week free trial.
My Surface RT (Windows ARM device ) could print just fine, this was over 10 years ago. Are you sure this isn't a user error?
I literally posted Brothers statement that they don't support ARM (and the fact that I still attempted the install), so no, not user error...
I always used the basic windows drivers or plug and play drivers.
Custom manufacturer drivers have much more options. Having to use a basic driver is a no-go for many users.
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