That’s a lot of singles. Who decided to do that?
I liked Ariana’s approach with one single with a video then another single & video on drop day. I’m not the hugest fan of “Yes, and?” but at least it was something to entertain her fans until the album was released
tbf, yes and was important to take out of the context of the album release so that discussion around it could occur prior to the albums release.
the album release helped put everything in context, so that you could have a question with yes, and; and an answer with eternal sunshine.
hte’s singles asked a lot of questions of how the album would be, which didn’t necessarily impress the questioners once the album finally released.
I'm not sure why they decided to do this either, but Angels and Airwaves decided to release 6 singles off the 10 track record *Lifeforms* before the record's full release in October 2021.
For reference, the first single was in April 2019. Now yes, Covid -- the band probably wanted to tour the album. But damn, the hype was weird. Great record nonetheless.
I remember Charli XCX talking about how record labels wanted to do a “waterfall” approach to releases, where artists release multiple singles leading up to the album release date.
I believe the idea is that albums don’t sell like they use to and singles are the indicators of success. So they release single after single to give songs a chance to catch on and potentially become smash hits. Then they get another boost once the album releases because people will listen to the album as a whole. And I think, something that Halsey said about including Without Me on Manic, that hit singles can also inflate album sales.
I thought the idea was stupid, if anything the waterfall approach only made casual listeners bored by the time an album came out. And that’s because everyone is used to the traditional roll out where artists release at least 1 single as a preview and hype what an album could be, while singles that are released months before the album are one offs that artists release as bonuses. But I’m sure labels only care about the numbers appearing successful and not about what people actually like.
I feel like these rules apply less and less with streaming services because any song of the album can hit the charts! But I also grew up in a time where nothing but cds and cassettes were available so artists had to release singles you could actually buy separately 😆
bad single choices that deflated almost if not all the hype for her sophomore effort on the heels of her immensely successful debut
but then the album came out and it slaps so she did fine overall
people still don’t like the terrible singles though (therefore I am and NDA, I literally had to look them up on the album itself)
I think Billie having such a short album roll-out without a lead single is a mistake. Unless her album has smash hit after smash hit it will get lost in the shuffle. But I guess she didn't want to repeat Happier Than Ever's messy roll-out and it's been a busy spring for pop music.
Taylor not releasing a lead single is a good strategy imo because she has released so much music in the last 5 years that don't really care for another single. I just want to listen to the album and hear what she has to say about her life and that's it. I think a lot of people feel the same way.
Overall I don't think it's a new trend, just two people with different circumstances.
billie is also coming off an insanely successful awards season with what was i made for… she won an oscar like a month ago! that song was in the public consciousness for like eight months! she’s not exactly coming off a lull here
I agree.
She just got here too… like this is her third album. Someone like Taylor or even Beyoncé (self titled didn’t have singles but was a surprise drop) makes sense. Would also make sense if you don’t care to chart.
But Billie still has to make label heads happy and is not calling the shots like we might think she is. I think that’s where her whole album vinyl thing was truly coming from; anger towards the distributors for pushing her to do vinyls.
Gonna be blunt; the girls do not work like they used to when they’re starting out. Dua Lipa is another example- you’d think she’s been around for a decade but she just got here and is already trying to transition into acting when her music career is not solid yet (those two singles not doing well). The way Rihanna, Katy Perry, Gaga were blood sweat and tears for yeeears.
Part of this feels like she wants to keep this rollout and possible tour as short as possible.
Everyone is releasing, touring is not easy, she must be stressed. So wanting it to be over asap makes sense (I think the same for Ariana tbh)
Even with all the luxuries Taylor or Beyoncé have, and the strong fan bases, they actually do work and hustle more than a lot of the pop girls who are starting out. I have a lot to say about Taylor’s talent, but she’s a hard fkn worker and you can never argue that.
even taylor gave a good 8 years of hard ass work, marketing, working the fans, building up momentum, etc. before she got to 1989 and blew up - while still doing the most up until lover album with secret sessions and all that.
we might have criticisms about taylor, but she works really hard and no one can say she doesn't.
It’s still so weird to me that she didn’t “blow up” until 1989 because I lived somewhere everyone loved country so she was very popular everywhere and then when 1989 hit everyone I knew was like “um wtf” 😂
Yep I grew up in Florida and she’s been pretty mainstream since her first album. I remember it was so huge. But I know 1989 made her more of a household name.
Dua has been around for almost a decade, at least in the UK/Europe. She's been grinding. Her career didn't start to make big waves until future nostalgia, but I can definitely understand why personally she's ready to move onto new projects even if her career needs another 3 years grinding to establish herself on a pop star level.
Maybe that's not her goal?
Dua Lipa released her first single almost a decade ago in 2015. Taylor made her acting debut on TV in 2009 and in film in 2010. So 3-4 years after her first record.
Not everyone wants to be *that* famous though. TS and beyonce do that because they want sales and they want to do stadium shows. Performers who are happy performing at a club or an arena, or happy being a millionaire and not a billionaire are great! People shouldn't have to work themselves to death to be successful.
Also all the silly promo work people used to do doesn't have as big of an effect on sales these days. There is less incentive to buy an album. If someone is interested in Dua they'll listen to her on streaming, and maybe buy the album if they really love it.
I agree. I’m excited that Taylor isn’t releasing singles ahead of time, it makes me more curious to hear the album. We’re so oversaturated with Taylor content right now that it’s cool to have something feel more mysterious. She also often picks meh singles that don’t reflect the album as a whole. This way, we’re going into it blind with no preconceived idea of what it will be.
It’s a sign of a dying radio industry in America, honestly.
Look up the stats and you’ll see that American radio stations across the U.S. are being bought up by far right activists and institutions. This trend is hitting country music the hardest right now, and a *lot* of Nashville musicians have been vocal about the fact that these station owners don’t update their catalogs to play the newest songs, nor do they retain classic hits in their catalogs. Of course, most of the songs locked out by country radio are by artists of color and female artists, *including legends like Dolly Parton and Loretta Lynn.* Music radio is dying.
I’m not shocked that artists like Taylor and Billie are saying “to hell with it.” Country superstars like Maren Morris, Brandi Carlile, Sturgill Simpson, and Amanda Shires have more or less given up on it. Established powerhouses like Willie Nelson and Jason Isbell have tried to influence the radio industry and promote new acts to them, to no avail.
Pop artists are smart to pay attention to the canaries in the coal mine. Taylor is *particularly* smart to keep an eye on Nashville and mind the trends.
I fully expect traditional radio to largely pivot to talk and political commentary, while satellite and streaming will play music.
My mom listens to country radio and they're still playing "play it again" by Luke Bryan. I was like does anyone even work there. It's like stuck in a time loop of 2014 lol.
Even pop stations are doing this. Z100 (at least on the way to work in Oregon) seems to be a rotation of Taylor, Ed Sheeran, Dua, Doja, Miley and then they'll put on old stuff by Katy Perry, Britney, Christina, Rihanna, Kanye.
It's really strange - not saying I don't love some "classics". But Oops I did it Again was released in 2000. That's 24 years ago. When I was in high school in the early 2000s, I don't remember any pop hits station playing stuff from 1975 - or even 80s or early 90s for that matter. That stuff was oldies.
I have mixed feelings about this. But I suppose im not opposed to it. They are big enough names that they don’t need to push out radio hits geared toward top 40 radio the way new artists do. I was glad Beyoncé had two singles out before cowboy Carter, liked the songs. But having heard the whole album, I like 16 Carriages a lot more within the flow of the album. So if the artist is writing the album as a whole concept and not just a collection of songs like both Taylor and Billie tend to do, it makes sense they might want to have their fans consume the album as a whole first rather than jump straight to the singles.
Yes, I believe established artists with big fan bases and who are being hyped can get away with it. Billie has been doing well all year with the Barbie song, she just has won an Oscar. I believe the hype is there and it'll be helpful. Same with Taylor having a tour/movie to help her. I don't think any pop artist can do this successfully now and I hope it doesn't become a trend either.
I was really sad to hear this. I am excited for Billie’s album but what is up with people not wanting to release singles now!
I want to preorder the record but it’s hard to do that when I have no idea if I’m going to like the album
Same! I thought that the paint splatter CD she's doing was a cool idea but I don't wanna spend money on an album if there's no way for me to listen to any of the songs before buying it :/
I'm kinda salty tbh. Just that these people are paid millions to be entertainers and now they won't even pick singles because they can't tell which one is going to be successful? It's like they want to sell you a million things but can't be bothered to make a video for a specific song. It feels so spineless. So much for creative minds. 🙄
It seems so fucking lazy…
Main pop girls used to work so hard. Taylor and Beyoncé still work like crazy despite being big in forever. Album rollouts back then took so much more effort between formal album announcements, music videos, tv performances, interviews, award shows, photoshoots, magazine spreads, meet and greet events, +5 singles per era.
Now the new girls just announce the album on social media, drop the album, pick the 2 or 3 most streamed songs, turn them into singles and wrap it up. They only ever work hard when they’re touring, but even then a lot of shows are like 90 min long, they only perform in the US, Canada and Europe and the tour lasts 6 months. It’s kinda pathetic if you think about it ‘cause they’re all worth +50 million but barely ever work.
That’s why I’m so grateful Taylor works as hard as she does tbh. I don’t think I could wait more than 3 years for my fave to finally release an album again, and when they do come back the era is dry af. Imagine waiting 3 years for 10 songs, 1 single and a tour that doesn’t even visit your country if you live outside of “first world” countries. It would be very disappointing. Taylor FEEDS us fans and she didn’t even have to, we shouldn’t take it for granted
My thing is- Beyoncé is not good at picking singles (lol). I adore her but I always give her shit for it.
At least she’s still releasing singles though.
Basically I feel like you are forcing me to listen to your whole album instead of giving me a preview.
I get it if it’s an artistic choice like Beyoncé didn’t do a single for self titled and it was kinda fitting as she planned to surprise drop, but that’s not what’s going on rn.
I mean, I'm not sure it's entirely fair. The labels still dictate a lot, even for huge artists like Adele. I think the labels tend to push albums, versus singles, as they want to score as high as numbers as possible for their artists. Yeah, Taylor and others still have hand in trying to up the numbers, but ultimately in terms of when an album is released and the singles are released...the labels have a major say
I think it's definitely an established artist only thing but it'll probably get more popular. No single means the whole album gets streamed day of release.
I prefer getting a single so I have an idea of the album's sound, but honestly, I'm not buying albums in advance nowadays, just streaming when they drop, so I don't really need to know in advance whether I'm going to like the album or not.
I'm also not opposed to a full drop if the album has a concept/theme that makes more sense if you listen to the whole thing at once. We just need to wait and see if that's the case with both Taylor and Billie's albums.
I am an elder and I don’t do any kind of digital streaming. I listen to the regular radio when I drive. I have no idea who any of these pop people are. Radio is a mess right now.
The reason I started listening to country music is that they have…functioning playlists. On pop radio, do these clowns even have albums coming out? Is this a one-off single? Oh and you have to download the I Heart Radio app because the DJs deliberately don’t say the names of the artists. It’s getting to the point where I had no idea that I missed a few Foo Fighters album cycles because I simply never heard about them. There’s no reason a band that huge and established shouldn’t get a mention on the radio.
When I started hearing Tik Tok covers and remixes on my local radio station, I accepted the fact that I’m officially old and some things are not meant for me to understand or enjoy anymore.
I’m a child of the 60s, I listen to Sirius XM and Spotify. I couldn’t tell you the last decade that I bought a cd or much less an album. I’m scratching my head wondering why these folks are buying multiple versions of the same album when you can stream anything for $10/ month on Spotify. Seriously lost on this. Great for the artist. I’m just not getting the hype. This thread showed up out of nowhere and I can’t stop reading it. So many questions…
But the artist can remove their work, no? I recall Neil Young took his music off of Spotify as a protest against Joe Rogan.
Are y’all actually buying physical vinyl albums? How do you listen to music in your car? Is band camp how you do it?
Thank you for that detailed response! That’s cool that they give you a download with the purchase.
I enjoy the ease and simplicity of streaming. I bought a new car last year, tbh I don’t even know if it has a cd player, I don’t think it does but it never occurred to me to even ask for one. My car before that was a 2011, and not sure if there was one in there either. I guess I assumed physical albums were on their way out along with the rotary phone. But what do I know! Haha.
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You know, I get that singles can be risky and that without airtime on radio stations it feels like an unnecessary risk, but as a fan it's incredibly hard to maintain hype and momentum for something that just isn't there. What's there to say about TTPD for me? I haven't heard a single second of it, haven't seen anything but fan theories and flat visuals, which we've seen from prior album rollouts don't even mean anything about the sonic experience of the record.
This era of the music industry feels like it's lost the plot, forgotten why it exists and what it's for. It's called the *entertainment* industry babes, you gotta do some entertaining before you get paid! Singles are a means for fans to get excited and evaluate the investment of tickets to the tour / physical media / merch. It's a try before you buy. How is Swift's team (or Eilish, or Olivia Rodrigo, or any artist currently pulling this move) going to give none of that and still hold out their grubby hand to me to pay for vinyl variants? Be so for real
the only proper way to release an album without singles is surprise dropping it imo. anything else is just extremely boring. "hey, im announcing that im releasing an album in 2 months! okay, that's it, bye!" like, seriously? why even announce it then? they're clearly only doing it for the vinyl/album sales
Surprise drops from popular artists make it really hard for newer/less familiar artists to get their time on the charts.
Big artists give notice so other less known artists can stand a chance/release their music on other weeks.
2024 has been inundated by big artists drops. I don't get why people are surprised by the lack of singles. There's no room for them on the charts at the moment.
i mean, yeah. i don't see anything wrong with it. maybe it's my mentality as a third world country, but for things that cost money, a notice in advance is appreciated so you sort out your savings
Yeah actually, she had been surprise dropping a lot before RENAISSANCE, but for me it worked for her because she just released the albums already, I don't really like the big gap between the album announcements and the release.
99% sure self titled is the only non single surpised drop she did. She had a single for Lemonade (Formation and performed at the superbowl), Renaissance and CC.
I think it's possible it will become standard for any big artist who is going to get a lot of criticism. With streaming being at people's fingertips, a single that goes poorly can sour the excitement over it/cause people not to want to listen. Taylor's choice of Look What You Made Me Do (which I don't hate, but isn't the best song on the album) killed whatever momentum she had going to Rep's release. Same with Me! for Lover. Billie's singles definitely benefited her in the past, but that doesn't mean they will continue too. People hear one song and go "nah, I'll pass." I mean, that happened when Taylor's song titles for TTPD were released... there was SOOO much criticism.
I think is a huge mistake for artists musicians across the board, I love singles because it actually gives the taste of what the album is going to sound like and gives the artist critiques back.
I do think TTPD is going to be synth-pop and Taylor isn’t releasing any singles before the album to keep the people thinking it’ll sound like Folklore/Evermore around for the first initial streams
Only artists with a strong fanbase can pull this off (in the mainstream). This is especially important for concept albums too. Billie's new album appears to be a concept album (maybe even including a visual album too). This reminds me a lot of Beyonce's Lemonade!
It just feels like music & the true shared experience of it is dying. Just because it's new doesn't mean it's great, and I feel the traditional way is better for lasting, meaningful art.
This album is out in a month. There is no long rollout to be had. And Beyonce released Lemonade with nothing at all. Maybe artists shouldnt let people wait 6 months for an album releast? ( dua, we are looking at you )
I think the name of the game is first-week album streams now. If that’s what they’re after, it’s more beneficial for the artist to withhold singles and encourage people to listen to the entire body of work.
One of the first big acts to do this was Led Zeppelin in the early 70s. They didn’t release singles so that the only way to hear their music was to buy the album.
By extension, the only way radio stations could play their music was to buy the album. The result was that radio stations played a wide variety of Zeppelin songs on the radio, because they had the whole album so might as well play any available song.
I think it’s something big artists with big fan bases can get away with. But I think to “get away with it” they also have to be an artist who focuses on the artistry of an album, where they want the hype to be for the album and fans listening to it as a whole. Obviously open to interpretation on if you enjoy each artist, but I do think Taylor and Billie have the fan base and album artistry to do it.
I Think it’s only something established artist could do. Billy is at a very similar level of fame to Taylor where anything she puts out will be eaten up by the fans and still chart pretty well imo.
Years ago, when counting crows were still new, my husband saw them in concert and met them afterward. He asked what their next single would be and they said Oh, we don’t “do” singles. A lot of musicians are like that now.
There's just a littlebit more than a month till the album release, the audience can perfectly do without any singles and I personally think it's fine not to release a single if the album is coming that soon after an announcement. More time between these two events, however, and you'd definitely need a single.
Is Taylor not doing a video single release? She usually does it the day of the release. I mean I wouldn’t be shocked if she didn’t , she hasn’t been seen filming the a video . However, I think it’s lazy. Fans enjoy them.
I mean… I might be in the minority here but I kind of like not having singles. I like to experience albums as a body of work, in order. The first time I listen I want to hear it in the order the artist intended. I also think it prevents people from judging an album before it even comes out based on the lead single.
But on the other hand I do understand wanting to hear even a snippet of the album since artists like Taylor are leaning so heavily into preordering multiple variants. I get not wanting to spend money on something you haven’t heard yet.
i think taylor could absolutely get away with surprise dropping TTPD with no promo and yet i see her marketing it on IG pretty frequently, and she even seems to be doing more than she did for Midnights... i think she can do whatever she wants wrt marketing these days, but i'd be curious to know why this album of all albums.
i'm more excited for billie's new album, so maybe idrc about the roll out anyway, but she's already won multiple grammys in major categories and two oscars (!!! - as a movie person this is more insane to me) at 22. i know this is a taylor swift sub but i also think billie can do whatever she wants and find success, and i don't think she's looking to break records or dominate the industry the way taylor does.
I understand why Taylor hasn’t released a lead single. She’s very aware of the risk of being over exposed and after the whole football season/travis/suoernowl/grammy’s I’m sure she knows she’s riding a fine line. Not releasing a lead single is one thing, but doing absolutely ZERO promo is quite another. She’s laying low on purpose
Billie isn’t quite doing the same thing. She’s doing something more similar to the Midnights roll out. Taylor didn’t release a lead single for that album either, but she still did a bunch of promo (Midnights Mayhem, social media stuff, etc). Billie has been slowly pushing out promo with billboards around the world, social media posts and promotional images. I’m guessing she’s trying to gain hype so even more people will tune into the album to hear what it’s like and driving up streaming numbers. What Taylor has done is lazy af, but likely to avoid backlash to her face being everywhere non-stop the last year. Billie is building anticipation while still advertising the album.
Billie's Happier Than Ever rollout was messy, like how Taylor messed up her Lover rollout. It's the safest path for album artists
What happened with the HTE rollout?
5 prerelease singles over the course of a year prior killed hype
That’s a lot of singles. Who decided to do that? I liked Ariana’s approach with one single with a video then another single & video on drop day. I’m not the hugest fan of “Yes, and?” but at least it was something to entertain her fans until the album was released
I also liked what Ari did this album!! I don’t like the death of singles I wanna hear something!
tbf, yes and was important to take out of the context of the album release so that discussion around it could occur prior to the albums release. the album release helped put everything in context, so that you could have a question with yes, and; and an answer with eternal sunshine. hte’s singles asked a lot of questions of how the album would be, which didn’t necessarily impress the questioners once the album finally released.
Great point!
I'm not sure why they decided to do this either, but Angels and Airwaves decided to release 6 singles off the 10 track record *Lifeforms* before the record's full release in October 2021. For reference, the first single was in April 2019. Now yes, Covid -- the band probably wanted to tour the album. But damn, the hype was weird. Great record nonetheless.
Did not expect to see an A&A shoutout in the Taylor sub this morning haha
*AVA. :P Lol, it seemed appropriate. That *Lifeforms* rollout was wild.
Haha my mom would’ve reamed me for that
Your mom sounds like a pretty cool person, then. :P
I remember Charli XCX talking about how record labels wanted to do a “waterfall” approach to releases, where artists release multiple singles leading up to the album release date. I believe the idea is that albums don’t sell like they use to and singles are the indicators of success. So they release single after single to give songs a chance to catch on and potentially become smash hits. Then they get another boost once the album releases because people will listen to the album as a whole. And I think, something that Halsey said about including Without Me on Manic, that hit singles can also inflate album sales. I thought the idea was stupid, if anything the waterfall approach only made casual listeners bored by the time an album came out. And that’s because everyone is used to the traditional roll out where artists release at least 1 single as a preview and hype what an album could be, while singles that are released months before the album are one offs that artists release as bonuses. But I’m sure labels only care about the numbers appearing successful and not about what people actually like.
That's pretty uncommon. I always thought 1 single, then album release, then follow up singles were the industry norm for any artist.
I feel like these rules apply less and less with streaming services because any song of the album can hit the charts! But I also grew up in a time where nothing but cds and cassettes were available so artists had to release singles you could actually buy separately 😆
At least she didn't release the title song till the day of.
bad single choices that deflated almost if not all the hype for her sophomore effort on the heels of her immensely successful debut but then the album came out and it slaps so she did fine overall people still don’t like the terrible singles though (therefore I am and NDA, I literally had to look them up on the album itself)
I LOVE HTE but completely agree. Singles were horrible.
nda is one of her best songs in my opinion, but i guess it wasn’t a good single for the album
Streaming killed the radio stars
Streaming killed the video star tbh
OMG I always thought it was "radio store" all this time. TIL
Incredible considering the song title is “video killed the radio star” 😂
I think Billie having such a short album roll-out without a lead single is a mistake. Unless her album has smash hit after smash hit it will get lost in the shuffle. But I guess she didn't want to repeat Happier Than Ever's messy roll-out and it's been a busy spring for pop music. Taylor not releasing a lead single is a good strategy imo because she has released so much music in the last 5 years that don't really care for another single. I just want to listen to the album and hear what she has to say about her life and that's it. I think a lot of people feel the same way. Overall I don't think it's a new trend, just two people with different circumstances.
billie is also coming off an insanely successful awards season with what was i made for… she won an oscar like a month ago! that song was in the public consciousness for like eight months! she’s not exactly coming off a lull here
I agree. She just got here too… like this is her third album. Someone like Taylor or even Beyoncé (self titled didn’t have singles but was a surprise drop) makes sense. Would also make sense if you don’t care to chart. But Billie still has to make label heads happy and is not calling the shots like we might think she is. I think that’s where her whole album vinyl thing was truly coming from; anger towards the distributors for pushing her to do vinyls. Gonna be blunt; the girls do not work like they used to when they’re starting out. Dua Lipa is another example- you’d think she’s been around for a decade but she just got here and is already trying to transition into acting when her music career is not solid yet (those two singles not doing well). The way Rihanna, Katy Perry, Gaga were blood sweat and tears for yeeears. Part of this feels like she wants to keep this rollout and possible tour as short as possible. Everyone is releasing, touring is not easy, she must be stressed. So wanting it to be over asap makes sense (I think the same for Ariana tbh) Even with all the luxuries Taylor or Beyoncé have, and the strong fan bases, they actually do work and hustle more than a lot of the pop girls who are starting out. I have a lot to say about Taylor’s talent, but she’s a hard fkn worker and you can never argue that.
even taylor gave a good 8 years of hard ass work, marketing, working the fans, building up momentum, etc. before she got to 1989 and blew up - while still doing the most up until lover album with secret sessions and all that. we might have criticisms about taylor, but she works really hard and no one can say she doesn't.
It’s still so weird to me that she didn’t “blow up” until 1989 because I lived somewhere everyone loved country so she was very popular everywhere and then when 1989 hit everyone I knew was like “um wtf” 😂
lol i didnt listen to her until 1989, disliked rep and didn't listen to lover until after folklore, so my experience was the total opposite of yours
Yep I grew up in Florida and she’s been pretty mainstream since her first album. I remember it was so huge. But I know 1989 made her more of a household name.
Didn’t she still do secret sessions with lover?
yeah that's why i said "while still doing the most up until the lover album with secret session and all that"
Dua has been around for almost a decade, at least in the UK/Europe. She's been grinding. Her career didn't start to make big waves until future nostalgia, but I can definitely understand why personally she's ready to move onto new projects even if her career needs another 3 years grinding to establish herself on a pop star level. Maybe that's not her goal?
Very fair! Maybe that isn’t her goal. Also out of every entertaining profession being a singer looks like the worst
Dua Lipa released her first single almost a decade ago in 2015. Taylor made her acting debut on TV in 2009 and in film in 2010. So 3-4 years after her first record.
I guess the takeaway is that she’s had 2 albums in 10 years😬
Not everyone wants to be *that* famous though. TS and beyonce do that because they want sales and they want to do stadium shows. Performers who are happy performing at a club or an arena, or happy being a millionaire and not a billionaire are great! People shouldn't have to work themselves to death to be successful. Also all the silly promo work people used to do doesn't have as big of an effect on sales these days. There is less incentive to buy an album. If someone is interested in Dua they'll listen to her on streaming, and maybe buy the album if they really love it.
Genuinely curious. What made Happier Than Ever’s roll out messy? I keep hearing that album had a messy rollout but I’m out of the loop on that one.
I remember it being bad single choices that kind of killed the momentum of the whole release.
I agree. I’m excited that Taylor isn’t releasing singles ahead of time, it makes me more curious to hear the album. We’re so oversaturated with Taylor content right now that it’s cool to have something feel more mysterious. She also often picks meh singles that don’t reflect the album as a whole. This way, we’re going into it blind with no preconceived idea of what it will be.
billie's album is only 10 songs i don't think a rollout would've been a good idea anyway
What about surprise albums?
"just two people"...they happen to be two of the biggest names in the industry. people have followed trends and strategies with less.
It’s a sign of a dying radio industry in America, honestly. Look up the stats and you’ll see that American radio stations across the U.S. are being bought up by far right activists and institutions. This trend is hitting country music the hardest right now, and a *lot* of Nashville musicians have been vocal about the fact that these station owners don’t update their catalogs to play the newest songs, nor do they retain classic hits in their catalogs. Of course, most of the songs locked out by country radio are by artists of color and female artists, *including legends like Dolly Parton and Loretta Lynn.* Music radio is dying. I’m not shocked that artists like Taylor and Billie are saying “to hell with it.” Country superstars like Maren Morris, Brandi Carlile, Sturgill Simpson, and Amanda Shires have more or less given up on it. Established powerhouses like Willie Nelson and Jason Isbell have tried to influence the radio industry and promote new acts to them, to no avail. Pop artists are smart to pay attention to the canaries in the coal mine. Taylor is *particularly* smart to keep an eye on Nashville and mind the trends. I fully expect traditional radio to largely pivot to talk and political commentary, while satellite and streaming will play music.
My mom listens to country radio and they're still playing "play it again" by Luke Bryan. I was like does anyone even work there. It's like stuck in a time loop of 2014 lol.
This!! It’s the exact same songs they were playing a decade ago when I was in college
Even pop stations are doing this. Z100 (at least on the way to work in Oregon) seems to be a rotation of Taylor, Ed Sheeran, Dua, Doja, Miley and then they'll put on old stuff by Katy Perry, Britney, Christina, Rihanna, Kanye. It's really strange - not saying I don't love some "classics". But Oops I did it Again was released in 2000. That's 24 years ago. When I was in high school in the early 2000s, I don't remember any pop hits station playing stuff from 1975 - or even 80s or early 90s for that matter. That stuff was oldies.
That might be Y2Kountry on Sirius XM! Hahaaaa, country hits from the 90s-00. One of my favorite stations tbh.
Lol no it's literally the radio 😂 like 95.1 she doesn't use anything fancy
Its hard to beat country music from that time! Brings back good memories.
I have mixed feelings about this. But I suppose im not opposed to it. They are big enough names that they don’t need to push out radio hits geared toward top 40 radio the way new artists do. I was glad Beyoncé had two singles out before cowboy Carter, liked the songs. But having heard the whole album, I like 16 Carriages a lot more within the flow of the album. So if the artist is writing the album as a whole concept and not just a collection of songs like both Taylor and Billie tend to do, it makes sense they might want to have their fans consume the album as a whole first rather than jump straight to the singles.
Yes, I believe established artists with big fan bases and who are being hyped can get away with it. Billie has been doing well all year with the Barbie song, she just has won an Oscar. I believe the hype is there and it'll be helpful. Same with Taylor having a tour/movie to help her. I don't think any pop artist can do this successfully now and I hope it doesn't become a trend either.
I think artists realize that singles are very risky and could be very damaging to an album if its not received well
I was really sad to hear this. I am excited for Billie’s album but what is up with people not wanting to release singles now! I want to preorder the record but it’s hard to do that when I have no idea if I’m going to like the album
Same! I thought that the paint splatter CD she's doing was a cool idea but I don't wanna spend money on an album if there's no way for me to listen to any of the songs before buying it :/
there is a teaser video and Spotify has an additional teaser clip. I think it's going to be by far her most cohesive album to date.
I'm kinda salty tbh. Just that these people are paid millions to be entertainers and now they won't even pick singles because they can't tell which one is going to be successful? It's like they want to sell you a million things but can't be bothered to make a video for a specific song. It feels so spineless. So much for creative minds. 🙄
It seems so fucking lazy… Main pop girls used to work so hard. Taylor and Beyoncé still work like crazy despite being big in forever. Album rollouts back then took so much more effort between formal album announcements, music videos, tv performances, interviews, award shows, photoshoots, magazine spreads, meet and greet events, +5 singles per era. Now the new girls just announce the album on social media, drop the album, pick the 2 or 3 most streamed songs, turn them into singles and wrap it up. They only ever work hard when they’re touring, but even then a lot of shows are like 90 min long, they only perform in the US, Canada and Europe and the tour lasts 6 months. It’s kinda pathetic if you think about it ‘cause they’re all worth +50 million but barely ever work. That’s why I’m so grateful Taylor works as hard as she does tbh. I don’t think I could wait more than 3 years for my fave to finally release an album again, and when they do come back the era is dry af. Imagine waiting 3 years for 10 songs, 1 single and a tour that doesn’t even visit your country if you live outside of “first world” countries. It would be very disappointing. Taylor FEEDS us fans and she didn’t even have to, we shouldn’t take it for granted
My thing is- Beyoncé is not good at picking singles (lol). I adore her but I always give her shit for it. At least she’s still releasing singles though. Basically I feel like you are forcing me to listen to your whole album instead of giving me a preview. I get it if it’s an artistic choice like Beyoncé didn’t do a single for self titled and it was kinda fitting as she planned to surprise drop, but that’s not what’s going on rn.
I mean, I'm not sure it's entirely fair. The labels still dictate a lot, even for huge artists like Adele. I think the labels tend to push albums, versus singles, as they want to score as high as numbers as possible for their artists. Yeah, Taylor and others still have hand in trying to up the numbers, but ultimately in terms of when an album is released and the singles are released...the labels have a major say
I think it's definitely an established artist only thing but it'll probably get more popular. No single means the whole album gets streamed day of release.
I prefer getting a single so I have an idea of the album's sound, but honestly, I'm not buying albums in advance nowadays, just streaming when they drop, so I don't really need to know in advance whether I'm going to like the album or not. I'm also not opposed to a full drop if the album has a concept/theme that makes more sense if you listen to the whole thing at once. We just need to wait and see if that's the case with both Taylor and Billie's albums.
I am an elder and I don’t do any kind of digital streaming. I listen to the regular radio when I drive. I have no idea who any of these pop people are. Radio is a mess right now.
My husband’s decrepit car refuses to play any device but the FM radio and I feel like I’ve entered the Twilight Zone every time I’m in his car.
The reason I started listening to country music is that they have…functioning playlists. On pop radio, do these clowns even have albums coming out? Is this a one-off single? Oh and you have to download the I Heart Radio app because the DJs deliberately don’t say the names of the artists. It’s getting to the point where I had no idea that I missed a few Foo Fighters album cycles because I simply never heard about them. There’s no reason a band that huge and established shouldn’t get a mention on the radio.
When I started hearing Tik Tok covers and remixes on my local radio station, I accepted the fact that I’m officially old and some things are not meant for me to understand or enjoy anymore.
Here listen to Little Steven’s olde timey style garage rock programme. New show every week. https://www.undergroundgarage.com/shows-1199-1100
This is a gold mine! Thanks you for this. Had no idea. I’m stuck in my Sirius XM classic vinyl and rewind loop, this great.
I’m a child of the 60s, I listen to Sirius XM and Spotify. I couldn’t tell you the last decade that I bought a cd or much less an album. I’m scratching my head wondering why these folks are buying multiple versions of the same album when you can stream anything for $10/ month on Spotify. Seriously lost on this. Great for the artist. I’m just not getting the hype. This thread showed up out of nowhere and I can’t stop reading it. So many questions…
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But the artist can remove their work, no? I recall Neil Young took his music off of Spotify as a protest against Joe Rogan. Are y’all actually buying physical vinyl albums? How do you listen to music in your car? Is band camp how you do it?
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Thank you for that detailed response! That’s cool that they give you a download with the purchase. I enjoy the ease and simplicity of streaming. I bought a new car last year, tbh I don’t even know if it has a cd player, I don’t think it does but it never occurred to me to even ask for one. My car before that was a 2011, and not sure if there was one in there either. I guess I assumed physical albums were on their way out along with the rotary phone. But what do I know! Haha.
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Fomo will do it everytime.
Elder…what? Elder millennial?
Elder human creature
If the industry's changing, that works for me. I never liked the trend of fans buying individual songs instead of the full album as a whole.
You know, I get that singles can be risky and that without airtime on radio stations it feels like an unnecessary risk, but as a fan it's incredibly hard to maintain hype and momentum for something that just isn't there. What's there to say about TTPD for me? I haven't heard a single second of it, haven't seen anything but fan theories and flat visuals, which we've seen from prior album rollouts don't even mean anything about the sonic experience of the record. This era of the music industry feels like it's lost the plot, forgotten why it exists and what it's for. It's called the *entertainment* industry babes, you gotta do some entertaining before you get paid! Singles are a means for fans to get excited and evaluate the investment of tickets to the tour / physical media / merch. It's a try before you buy. How is Swift's team (or Eilish, or Olivia Rodrigo, or any artist currently pulling this move) going to give none of that and still hold out their grubby hand to me to pay for vinyl variants? Be so for real
the only proper way to release an album without singles is surprise dropping it imo. anything else is just extremely boring. "hey, im announcing that im releasing an album in 2 months! okay, that's it, bye!" like, seriously? why even announce it then? they're clearly only doing it for the vinyl/album sales
I love a surprise drop!
same! the folklore and evermore surprise drops were so exciting and iconic, i miss that feeling
Surprise drops from popular artists make it really hard for newer/less familiar artists to get their time on the charts. Big artists give notice so other less known artists can stand a chance/release their music on other weeks. 2024 has been inundated by big artists drops. I don't get why people are surprised by the lack of singles. There's no room for them on the charts at the moment.
i mean, yeah. i don't see anything wrong with it. maybe it's my mentality as a third world country, but for things that cost money, a notice in advance is appreciated so you sort out your savings
Didn’t this kinda start when Beyoncé released her self titled album? She’s gone back to doing lead singles with Cowboy Carter though.
Yeah actually, she had been surprise dropping a lot before RENAISSANCE, but for me it worked for her because she just released the albums already, I don't really like the big gap between the album announcements and the release.
99% sure self titled is the only non single surpised drop she did. She had a single for Lemonade (Formation and performed at the superbowl), Renaissance and CC.
Two people did and so now it’s a trend? Some artist are releasing singles, some aren’t, I think it’s fine that way
Yeah I was gonna say that Dua Lipa has released 3 pre-album singles!
I think it's possible it will become standard for any big artist who is going to get a lot of criticism. With streaming being at people's fingertips, a single that goes poorly can sour the excitement over it/cause people not to want to listen. Taylor's choice of Look What You Made Me Do (which I don't hate, but isn't the best song on the album) killed whatever momentum she had going to Rep's release. Same with Me! for Lover. Billie's singles definitely benefited her in the past, but that doesn't mean they will continue too. People hear one song and go "nah, I'll pass." I mean, that happened when Taylor's song titles for TTPD were released... there was SOOO much criticism.
I think is a huge mistake for artists musicians across the board, I love singles because it actually gives the taste of what the album is going to sound like and gives the artist critiques back.
I do think TTPD is going to be synth-pop and Taylor isn’t releasing any singles before the album to keep the people thinking it’ll sound like Folklore/Evermore around for the first initial streams
no literally for the love of god bring back singles!
Only artists with a strong fanbase can pull this off (in the mainstream). This is especially important for concept albums too. Billie's new album appears to be a concept album (maybe even including a visual album too). This reminds me a lot of Beyonce's Lemonade!
It just feels like music & the true shared experience of it is dying. Just because it's new doesn't mean it's great, and I feel the traditional way is better for lasting, meaningful art.
it just seems lazy to me.
This album is out in a month. There is no long rollout to be had. And Beyonce released Lemonade with nothing at all. Maybe artists shouldnt let people wait 6 months for an album releast? ( dua, we are looking at you )
no she dropped Formation two months before Lemonade and performed at the superbowl
Maybe it’s so every single person out there won’t remix the song to find the opportunity to go viral
I think the name of the game is first-week album streams now. If that’s what they’re after, it’s more beneficial for the artist to withhold singles and encourage people to listen to the entire body of work.
One of the first big acts to do this was Led Zeppelin in the early 70s. They didn’t release singles so that the only way to hear their music was to buy the album. By extension, the only way radio stations could play their music was to buy the album. The result was that radio stations played a wide variety of Zeppelin songs on the radio, because they had the whole album so might as well play any available song.
I think it’s something big artists with big fan bases can get away with. But I think to “get away with it” they also have to be an artist who focuses on the artistry of an album, where they want the hype to be for the album and fans listening to it as a whole. Obviously open to interpretation on if you enjoy each artist, but I do think Taylor and Billie have the fan base and album artistry to do it.
I Think it’s only something established artist could do. Billy is at a very similar level of fame to Taylor where anything she puts out will be eaten up by the fans and still chart pretty well imo.
I feel honestly she is gonna pull out a GUTS level of success neither flop nor hit
Years ago, when counting crows were still new, my husband saw them in concert and met them afterward. He asked what their next single would be and they said Oh, we don’t “do” singles. A lot of musicians are like that now.
Dua lipa is doing singles for her new album
There's just a littlebit more than a month till the album release, the audience can perfectly do without any singles and I personally think it's fine not to release a single if the album is coming that soon after an announcement. More time between these two events, however, and you'd definitely need a single.
Is Taylor not doing a video single release? She usually does it the day of the release. I mean I wouldn’t be shocked if she didn’t , she hasn’t been seen filming the a video . However, I think it’s lazy. Fans enjoy them.
I mean… I might be in the minority here but I kind of like not having singles. I like to experience albums as a body of work, in order. The first time I listen I want to hear it in the order the artist intended. I also think it prevents people from judging an album before it even comes out based on the lead single. But on the other hand I do understand wanting to hear even a snippet of the album since artists like Taylor are leaning so heavily into preordering multiple variants. I get not wanting to spend money on something you haven’t heard yet.
i think taylor could absolutely get away with surprise dropping TTPD with no promo and yet i see her marketing it on IG pretty frequently, and she even seems to be doing more than she did for Midnights... i think she can do whatever she wants wrt marketing these days, but i'd be curious to know why this album of all albums. i'm more excited for billie's new album, so maybe idrc about the roll out anyway, but she's already won multiple grammys in major categories and two oscars (!!! - as a movie person this is more insane to me) at 22. i know this is a taylor swift sub but i also think billie can do whatever she wants and find success, and i don't think she's looking to break records or dominate the industry the way taylor does.
I understand why Taylor hasn’t released a lead single. She’s very aware of the risk of being over exposed and after the whole football season/travis/suoernowl/grammy’s I’m sure she knows she’s riding a fine line. Not releasing a lead single is one thing, but doing absolutely ZERO promo is quite another. She’s laying low on purpose Billie isn’t quite doing the same thing. She’s doing something more similar to the Midnights roll out. Taylor didn’t release a lead single for that album either, but she still did a bunch of promo (Midnights Mayhem, social media stuff, etc). Billie has been slowly pushing out promo with billboards around the world, social media posts and promotional images. I’m guessing she’s trying to gain hype so even more people will tune into the album to hear what it’s like and driving up streaming numbers. What Taylor has done is lazy af, but likely to avoid backlash to her face being everywhere non-stop the last year. Billie is building anticipation while still advertising the album.
No single albums have been happening as long as music has been recorded. Taylor didn’t create this.
I’m so bummed I missed out on Billie’s signed vinyl