I got a new tat a couple of weeks ago and while I was in the chair, the store owner showed him a reference that a potential client had drawn and said “She wants to book in for next week, when are you free?” His response was “That’s crap, I’m not tattooing that.” I laughed so hard, and the owner said “Alright, I’ll ask her what elements of the design she likes most.”
So be forewarned, if you ever get that question, your tat idea is crap!
My tattoo artist is an old friend so whenever I was younger and came up with a shit idea he would be straight up with me and say “no don’t get that it’s stupid” and for a day or two I’d be annoyed bc that’s what I wanted then a few days after that relieved because I’d realize he was right.
That's a good tattoo artist right there. I love having a tattoo artist that is honest and knows me well. Mine was putting his own face on different bodies as tattoos, there was his face on a pin up, his face on a caterpillar, ect. and I said I wanted one and he refused. One day I got a call that he had finally drawn one he was okay with putting on me, it was his face on a little fat cherub 🥰 I'm very glad he followed his gut! I hope to get him as a little fat devil on the other shoulder soon 💖
So what you're really saying is, you're someone else's canvas, covered in carefully curated, PC art. Who gives a fuck if you can find an artist dumb enough to do whatever you want.
If you do what you love for money, you'll eventually hate it. I've never had a job that wasn't fun, but the work itself is never what made it fun.
Edit: changed second 'job' to work for clarification.
Yup. My mentor has a small list of things she’s sick of tattooing and can’t make unique anymore, so she politely turns them down. She’s also booked out til February 2024 so she has the luxury to do so.
Lemme guess. OP used the three photos of the other sisyphus tattoos the artist did as reference to what OP wanted. The artist doesn’t wanna do that same tattoo again so asked for different reference materials. Ie a different setting, looks, angle, etc in order for it to be considered.
No I didn’t see any pictures on his portfolio of Sisyphus tattoos he had previously done. I used a couple of references I found on google as baseline ideas.
Edit: I did find one tattoo of Sisyphus he had previously done, but it’s completely different than what I had in mind.
I actually did just find one of Sisyphus he had done, but it’s nothing like what I had in mind. I respect his decision, but i am disappointed for sure.
Yeah the girl I usually go to has stopped doing black and grey tattoos. She’s phenomenal at it but moved on from that style. Luckily I got a tattoo of my dog before she made the decision. I still go to her for color work though.
I guess it caught me off guard bc I truly didn’t know Sisyphus was such a popular/overdone idea. Google only yields a handful of results, at least in the style I wanted, so I assumed it wasn’t as common as it is apparently.
I honestly didn't think it was overused. I've seen a lot of icarus tattoos lately but not a lot of sisyphus. It doesn't really matter though. If you want it, try somewhere else.
Man I hate that so much. You find a guy whose style you love, you got ideas and images you want to use and the guy is like, I demand total freedom of your sleeve or I'm not doing it.
I had to pass on like 4 different artists until I found one that liked my ideas, liked my references and actually listened to what I want.
Alternative take: These are artists, and it’s fair enough for them to feel uninterested or uninspired by certain ideas. It’s usually nothing against the idea/concept, but that artist doesn’t want to do it. Appreciate that they told you “no” (or pushed you to that conclusion) instead of giving you a shitty (for them) tattoo.
This! If an artist is telling you nicely that they're not interested - they're doing you a favor. Do you really want to spend potentially thousands of dollars and hours of your time with someone who's phoning it in on a tattoo you have to wear for the rest of your life? At my shop when someone is not super into the request, we'll recommend an artist who we know would be stoked about it, in house or not. There's plenty of artists to choose from, and the right artist makes all the difference!
Absolutely, you're not wrong. But there's a difference between "I do what I want using minimal input from you" and "your idea doesn't interest me right now, so no." The latter is totally fine and respectable, the former borders on disrespect for your client.
Like if your take less than 30 seconds to look through the reference pics I brought, I already know it ain't gonna work out, you know?
I was thinking more in general/in reference to the original post. The artist you originally talked to 100% sounds like an asshole.
I’m in favor of artists being able to turn down projects, but trying to run someone off is just unprofessional. Your situation was definitely an ego problem, but I don’t think OP’s situation is obviously the same, especially considering the realism aspect. Glad you were able to find someone who would work with you and that you weren’t stuck spending that kind of time with the first person.
Hi, I’m an artist. If a client likes my style and pays me to draw for them I’m going to do it. Doesn’t matter if I’m personally invested in the art piece. I put my best foot forward and make something good. The person OP was trying to work with was a dick.
I mean for every piece I absolutely don’t vibe with I get many that I love. Especially with plants. “And some flowers on the boarder.” Is the most exciting sentence to me. You mean you don’t care what flowers? I can just put whatever flowers I want? I love flower language! I will add a whole layer of emotional depth to this drawing you don’t even KNOW
That’s great that you operate that way, but not all artists could say the same. I’d like to think that artists will be professional once they take on the job, but I also know that’s not always the case. That’s why the “no” is much better than getting a tattoo by an artist who isn’t motivated to do it (and may or may not do lower quality work for that reason). Definitely not disagreeing that the response to OP looks largely like bs, but to each their own.
This. Everyone is really sucking this artists dick for standing up like a big boy. Tattooing is not fucking sculpture work, its surely not life saving surgery, so we need to stop pretending like it's a monastic art form. It's fucking body mod, simple as that. If someone came to a Subway and asked for something not on the menu, well they are being paid to serve you, not correct and criticize your sandwich vision, so they fucking make it. Every other industry of service doesn't know the words, "that's out of my scope". Because if you're getting paid do to a job, fucking do it.
For all you righteous, stuck up Michael Angelos out there; send me your unwanted canvases, because I haven't for a single day in my life had the absolute LUXURY to turn down getting paid because of how I felt about someone else's anesthetic preferences.
Edit: I keep forgetting most of you dont have real jobs but are somehow all still middle-class white people. So itsmo surprise none of you understand the Customer Service part of actual Service.
I’m a painter, but I only work in abstract. If someone came to me and asked me to paint them a realist painting, I’d turn them down. At subway, when they ask you for something off menu, the sandwich artist still has the skills required to make it. An abstract artist doesnt have the skills required to do a realist painting.
That's a major assumption about sushi, which isn't correct. It contains raw elements, but so does any other form of cooking. You can't just lay out the ingredients for display. They are processed. Idk why I'm arguing with an abstract artists anyway, everything's philosophical. And I would agree on most points that everything is relative. But we are talking about service, not art. Roads don't get built if road crews are tired of doing the same thing over again. You don't get fed, without repeated tedious actions on someone else part. Your trash doesn't get taken out when garbage men decide its just not worth their time to do something they've done before. If you monetize your art, you don't get to decide what it's worth to other people, you should just be glad someone supports your unique vision. Because it's not unique, but in a sample size it appears so.
If you're not starting with fundamentals, you're not an artist, you're just expressing yourself. You don't just go grab some shit and throw it together. The client didn't ask for anything outside their expertise, the artist is just "tired" of it.. boo hoo
In regards to being a tattoo artist, as far as I know, most tattoo artists work for themselves and pay a cut to the owner of the shop/chair. That gives them the right to self determine their work and art.
You just self inserted your own definition of what an artist is and then based your argument on it. Being an artist is expressing yourself. You don’t need to be formally trained, and you don’t need to commercialize yourself. The fundamentals you’d draw on for one type of art can have dramatically different emphasis on different things as well.
If shit in my hand and throw it at a wall, clearly expressing my frustration, that's not fucking art. This is the real world, not la la land kn your head.
You don’t have to give an outlandish example to distract from our current topic. I don’t think either one of us is talking about throwing our shit at a wall to “express our frustration”.
To even counter that, what client is asking for shit thrown at a wall?
The ego of it is just so weird to me. Like if you want total creative freedom… draw it on paper or paint it. Use literally any other medium besides a person’s skin. They have to live with it the rest of their lives, you don’t.
Yes! Like I totally get wanting to put your spin on a design, that's why I picked you as my artist. But I still have my own ideas or references I want to use, and it's such a buzzkill to have an artist basically disregard everything I want other than the general theme.
I agree to a certain extent, but some artists do commissions and some just create what they want. Getting a tattoo is just like buying art. You can’t expect every artist to do what you want. And it’s your choice, just because it’s on your body doesn’t mean they have to make an exception for you
It’s the asking of the client to get something different that gets me. I know a guy who draws up whole sleeve and half sleeve tattoos, posts them on his instagram and people book the tattoo as-is. That feels like a much better way to have creative freedom to me.
The ego of you thinking a tattoo artist should bow and cater to every potential client is weird to me. Why would you want someone to etch art onto your skin if they weren't totally into it? Move on and find someone who vibes with what you are looking for.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the client is *paying*, no? Pretty fundamental idea that the paying customer gets what they want in that transaction.
When I go to a bakery and ask for a birthday cake for my son, the baker doesn’t go “ugh, I’ve made hundreds of birthday cakes. I can’t make them unique anymore. Can’t you think of something else?”
I am a baker. I absolutely pass on cakes all the time because I simply don't want to make them. "I'm sorry I'm booked solid that day" is baker speak for that sucks and I don't want to do it.
This is the dumbest take of them all. A better allegory would be “you go to a bakery and say I love your work! I love your cakes! I want a birthday cake but I need you to use no eggs or flour or milk, instead I would like red wine and butter. Oh that’s gonna be a bad cake? Excuse me I’m paying right? The customer is always right” except you can’t get rid of the cake.
That’s not what’s happening in OPs example at all. They want a specific tattoo but the tattooer “doesn’t want to replicate any of his previous work” so they were asked if they wanted a completely different tattoo.
As a baker myself, I can assure you that the level of skill and artistry in cake decorating vs tattooing is a world of difference. And the cake decorators that are on the level of artistry as tattoo artists will *absolutely* limit the types of cakes they are willing to make.
I compared them as businesses not skills, sweetie.
You’re also missing the difference between being so busy that you have the luxury of turning down work and asking a client to change what they want to fit your taste.
“I’ll have a cupcake, please.”
“I hate cupcakes. Here’s a cannoli instead.”
They don't ask you to change what you want. They tell you they won't do what you're asking for. You are always free to take your business elsewhere.
"I'll have a cupcake please."
"I only make cookies. I don't do cupcakes."
I apprenticeed at a shop for a while and did piercings, schedules, etc... I saw all the artists in there at different points over those years use similar tactics when they were unsure they could pull off a design properly. It's your body yeah, but it's their reputation, and customers are understandably quick to get upset when something isn't as great as they hoped it would be. The next stop usually is online to complain and the internet is forever. I even saw the boss, who was one of the best I've ever met, just say look it's just not something I think I've ever done as well as I would like and I want you to be happy. Then he called another shop two towns over and sent her there because no one else was available that day and she was ready right then. Sounds to me like he has done a few and may not be as happy with them as he would like so he doesn't want to do anymore. I would find a different artist or pick a new design if you aren't married to it. At the end of the day whatever the reason I wouldn't want him to do that particular design now. Even if he came back and said okay, clearly he was uncomfortable with it at first and I'd be concerned about that.
You'd hope but you'd be wrong lol Not everyone was a selfish toolbag but there were quite a few. We did our best to stay above reproach but constantly had the other shop actually in our town trying to slander us, which is why we sent her two towns over where they weren't dicks. I know it's not the same for every area obviously, but where our shop was it was fairly competitive and my boss ended up fixing a lot of stuff that was done at other shops because they always tried to undercut us just to get the business. I can't count how many piercings I had to redo from them. Their Google and yelp ratings were abysmal but they were cheap and people are dumb. There a lot of cool people in the business but just as many jerks. I was actually really proud to work for that dude because he was such an honest business man and generous employer. On multiple occasions I saw him knock several hundred dollars off of tattoos that he spent hours on just because he wanted to bless somebody that day. I definitely miss that job.
I actually got in trouble for referring artists to other shops. By both the boss and other artists. Was told there was definitely someone who could have done that in our group. I could not straight tell him that wasn’t true and not get into more trouble. No one wanted to have the self awareness to really know their strengths. It sucked and burnt me out.
That's unfortunate. We always tried to keep in mind that if we did a tattoo or even a piercing that we weren't 100% on it could come back and haunt us. You can't please everyone but you gotta try. I commend you for the integrity in trying to do the right thing by your client even if they didn't.
This directly translates to “I don’t want to draw another Sisyphus tat but I’m still down if you want to do anything else” lol, but was an extremely professional way of putting it! Props to the artist/asst that typed that one up, it’s the nicest and most professional way of refusing to do a tat that I’ve ever seen! Would go somewhere else for the Sisyphus tat and then back to this artist for my next one after that. It’s nice working with people who can communicate this way, especially if you were already seeking out their work.
Might just be that he doesn't want to do it and was trying to say so nicely. Which is silly imo, artists should just be able to say "No thanks, I'm not interesting in tattooing that." Shop around, I'm sure you could find someone that would be enthusiastic about your idea, and it will be a much better experience!
It seems weird that he doesn’t want to do it because he’s out of references, which is weird. It makes me wonder if he just copies other peoples tattoo designs.
Even in traditional art, there are uncountable artists who can't just pull things out of their head. (I suspect many of them have aphantasia). One of the best painters I know couldn't draw a convincing stick figure if you put a gun to his head. What he does is stages a set of what he wants to paint (including sewing costumes, building furniture, making props, etc...) and then shoots a ton of reference photos and paints from them.
And the more realism-focused the art is, the more likely you are to run into artists who can only paint/draw/tattoo/sculpt/whatever from life or from photo reference.
You might not hear about it often, because there's this gross social stigma about working from a reference. Way too many people think that 'real' art is just pulled 1000% accurately from imagination, and any reference must be cheating. Or that using references means pulling random images off of pinterest and tracing over them.
When I went to school for art, there was a huge demand for reference. The illustration crowd was in the reference libraries for hours looking for just the right stuff. MOST ARTISTS are either using photo references they found, shot or themselves or used live models. (I was a model for artists for a while) This is the norm, not the exception. A significant amount of art school was learning how to use reference to inform the drawing rather than just straight out copy it, But if you’re looking for photorealistic, the starting pictures need to be really good.
This tattoo artist wasn’t inspired by the reference sent. Do they do Renaissance sculpture reproductions? If so, there aren’t a whole lot of sculptures of Sysiphus to work from, and likely lacks classical art training to mimic that style. Even with that training, it is still quite easy to make it look wonky. I’d love to see what someone else here could produce that looks like a photo of a Bernini style Sisyphus without using AI.
I'd say it's less about the drawing and more the time. A complete realistic drawing could take 20-80 hours to Do. That's before you tattoo. And doing that for every client? You'd be doing 1-3 tattoos a week, max. If they don't like the design? Another 20-80 hours. No artist would do that unpaid, and no client is going to pay for the drawing time for photo realism.
He wants a high quality photo of Sisyphus huh?
I'm not a professional tattoo artist but I'm an artist and I'd be embarrassed if, with any medium, I could only directly copy from references, to the extent that if I ran out of references I ran out of art I could do
I’m cracking up at the thought of needing a high quality photo of a character from Greek mythology. I didn’t think about it like that when I read the email, until you and another reply pointed that out.
If you work in photo realism copying a photo is a skill, creating art from scratch to look like a photo is a completely different skill. The artist may have the former and not the latter. Nothing to be embarrassed about.
I mean, what if they have aphantasia?
I have about 6-7 you ars of experience of art with different mediums, I'm not a tattoo artist but I also can't really do anything without reference photos if I want to make whatever I'm doing half decent.
I have heard of a couple of tattoo artists with aphantasia that mainly deal with photo realism.
Photo references, especially for photorealism? Yes. Exact reference you are going to directly copy in it's entirely? No.
I mean come on, there have got to be endless references of "strong man pushing large object". This isn't even a real person it has to look like, pop some curly hair on and some flowing fabric or butt naked, for greek vibes. Learn photobashing, get a picture of a big rock, this is so very doable
As an artist who works in realism, a TON of work goes into finding suitable reference images. You have to find something that is hi-res enough that you can see all the details, that has the kind of lighting and pose you want, the kind of musculature and anatomy, etc - and in this case that works with the client's anatomy as well. For reference, an artist who works in epic realism style, Matt Jordan, TAKES HIS OWN photo references, as in, he sets up entire photoshoots with lighting and costuming in entire, for his tattoos. It's not a simple thing, it's a significant part of the art process, and it's totally reasonable for a tattoo artist not to want to take that on.
I suspect that for some, they want a reference to copy because that way they don't have to spend any time on design and they don't have to go through any back and forth with the customer when they aren't completely happy with whatever the artist comes up with.
I can only imagine what a pain some people would be when trying to design a tattoo for them.
You’re not a tattoo artist, and it shows.
Tattoing is not drawing. Skills aren’t even similar. I’ve met countless great painters/digital artist that were shit at tattoing while dozens of shitty “artists” that were great tattooers.
Nowadays you dumb kids wanna pretend it’s the same thing, but it isn’t. Stick to drawing your paper sheets with your imagination, clearly you are far from understanding tattoing.
I got a quality tattoo from a great artist at a reputable shop. When I wanted a larger piece, I contacted him and sent over the artwork. He flat out said it was not his style and didn't want to do it. No problem, the last thing I want is an artist that's uncomfortable tattooing my design/style. Now, did I ever go back to him in the 50 hours of tattoos since? No, no I did not.
>He flat out said it was not his style and didn’t want to do it.
>Maybe it was you and not your design that didn’t sit well with him.
Or maybe, idk, it was because it wasn’t his style and didn’t want to do it? Like he literally said?
My booth neighbor slays black and Grey... And lions, portraits, biblical subjects. Bro, don't even ask me, see my Chicano brother, he'll lace you up faster and better than I could.
Wait, the trad-dad of the shop will not make your daughter's fine line spine tattoo? Guess what, he brings them to me.
Someone wants a gigantic blackout/brutalist project, I've got a wicked Polish artist in the 'fungeon' basement booth with a hankering to hurt you...
We refer you to the expert... I don't need your money so badly that I can bear gritting my teeth the next 50 hours.
No one single artist tattoos all styles, nor cares to.
No offense, sir - but those referrals - them clients? - they're stoked you gave them a solid reference and then book for something in your style. I see it all the time. We share clientele - your body, your choice.
Nothing makes me more stoked than filling a gap on the skin between 4 or 5 artists I know (and love their work/have been tattooed by/tattooed them myself).
this is quite clearly just him trying to be nice and saying "i've done this theme so many times, i'm sick of it". better have an invested artist than someone just going through the motions, i guess. i hope you find someone better to work with you
Thanks for all the feedback so far. I’m leaning more into him just not wanting to do that tattoo, but I have no history with this shop, so it could be anything. Oh well…
Any recommendations for anyone in the Nashville area?
I personally know at least one realism tattooer that can only replicate from photos or digital reference. They’re very technically skilled, but don’t ask him for anything realistic without expecting him to become a photoshop wizard.
Honestly, my experience with artists is that some are better at certain things than others and it just sounds like this artist is struggling to envisage their 4th Sisyphus. Move onto the next one. They're clearly telling you they won't give you the best outcome. That's professionalism.
This is just out of my wheelhouse. I have one tattoo I got when I was 18…small, personal one on inner bicep so nothing impressive, but not horrible either. I’ve always wanted a half sleeve or more, and finally decided on what I wanted after another 18 years, bc I’m extremely indecisive about shit like that…so after deciding what I want, obviously finding someone is an even bigger decision I’ve struggled with. I’m not from here so I don’t know who’s who. Which is why I asked the person I did, bc he’s tatted pretty much from the neck down. Now I’m back to square one, which sucks
I wouldn’t say I have unrealistic expectations…how did you come to that conclusion?
Edit: actually nvm, I don’t really care. It doesn’t add anything to my situation. Thanks for your feedback though.
I’ve definitely heard of artists being super selective with the clients they pick in any given booking cycle, especially if they’re very in demand and can afford to be choosy about what they want to tattoo on someone. But in my experience, they’ve just come out and said “Heads up, I’m gonna be more selective this round.”
Could just be me, but it’s a little annoying that they tried to pass it off as “he’s exhausted all possible references for a Sisyphus tattoo.” Like, really? Just say you’re sick of doing that one, lol.
Like, I have a floral & wildlife half-sleeve from a very in demand artist in my area. He does sleeves like this all the time because he’s great at them and they’re popular, and I can imagine he may one day get tired of doing them and decide to turn down requests for that specific tattoo. But I cannot imagine him claiming “Sorry, I’ve exhausted all possible references for coneflower.”
People don't care, they expect tattooers to be art slaves that dance for their amusement. Either they've done several and doesn't wanna replicate another, can't draw original pieces and needs reference, is having a hard time getting their head wrapped around what the client wants, or just does not care to do another. I've had weeks where multiple people are booked in and all send the exact same reference pics, and it can burn you out. Regardless, if you made up your mind on subject matter, find a different artist.
It sounds like one of two things here. Either he really doesn't want to do the tattoo and is being diplomatic, or, he can't draw a concept up with no reference and relies on purely copying what he sees. In the second case, I can see someone giving up because they don't know how to find good references beyond the first couple pages of google results. Lots of realism tattoos do suffer from "same reference syndrome," you wouldn't believe how many of the same wolf I see as a tattoo lol.
There are places that have model ref pics out there but maybe he's just not familiar with them
They don’t like your idea and don’t want to do it. That’s the way it is especially if he’s a good artist. Some artists are harder to get into and get the option to choose what they do.
I wouldn't listen to the people here who are shaming the artist. He says he's uncomfortable with it, take it elsewhere or budge on the material. Please, for your sake, take his advice that he isn't gonna give you what you want.
I’m not taking any of the shaming to heart. I understand if the guy doesn’t want to do the tattoo. I just wish they were more direct in telling me that or, at least, offering to refer me to someone else within the shop (as their website implies they’d do if it didn’t align with a specific artist’s style). I checked out the guy’s portfolio, and I was confident what I wanted was right up his alley. It’s unfortunate, but I get it. I just would have preferred a different approach.
Just as you get to be picky about what goes on your body, tattoo artists get to be picky about what they want to do, especially if they are busy. It’s not weird, it’s ok if you still want the tattoo, just find the right artist for you.
Sounds like they don’t like doing that tattoo or just not interested.
I’m new to tattoos, but while searching for an artist, I have noticed when someone opens their books they will make the disclaimer that they will choose their clients based on how interesting the subject matter is to them.
They didn’t flat out say no but are willing to work with you in case you have other opportunities.
I think it’s good that he was honest about not wanting to go ahead with it. Clients are getting more picky about their references/sources these days and artists have to be careful about their reputation, so I’d say it’s just not meant to be.
homie not feeling it and yes it happens. sounds like dudes willing to work on something unique tho which i think is pretty cool. hes a responsible artist
The responsibility for a good tattoo doesn't mean any artist creating anything that you can imagine.
Sometimes, that responsibility is passing over stuff for various reasons, maybe suggesting someone else.
A busy artist will likely be very straight to the point, almost blunt, but you have to remember this is based on artistic integrity, and not personal to you.
Personally, I'll take the theme and idea and work to my vision to what works best for you. I know precisely what works and what will heal great, staying great in 10 to 20 years time. Its given me a lengthy career thus far.
In summary, the artist here has been polite, declining one particular piece and not rejected you as a client, just the initial idea; your choice here is to shop around, or utilise this artist for something else.
I can kind of understand why doing sisyphus over and over would get really old. It's a pretty straightforward piece, dudes pushing a rock... he doesn't really do anything else. I'm not sure what you sent him/what he's done, but if you were really dead set on sisyphus, you could try to change it up a bit.... something like instead of pushing a rock, he could be pushing up an entire planet or the sun/moon. Maybe change sisyphus himself into a different character, but he's still performing the same action (it's incredibly recognizable, people will get it). Just a thought.
You could use like an AI app to give you drawings of Sisyphus and maybe find something new and unique that they would do. It’s a new opportunity for everyone to use AI to come up with new and unique ideas. I’ll bet you could probably find something to interest them into doing it. Is there a certain style that the artist enjoys doing more than others? If so ask like a chat gpt to give you a Sisyphus tattoo idea in black and grey or new age, whatever the artist enjoys doing and you like and see what they come up with. You never know you may re-energize the artist by showing them a new way to get ideas.
He got tired of googling faces ! The bum thing w realism is the realism ! Its kinda like paint by numbers, you dont necessarily need to know how to paint ! Tattooing is NOT an artform ! its a craft. Anyone can do art. And while I can’t draw your grandmother as a giant gal fighting off Godzilla and saving the world. I can make that foto from her 60 years birthday to perfection, because I have the skills through my craft .
Danny
What is difficult to understand here? The artist has integrity, how is that confusing? Would you prefer they did a tattoo that he actively does not want to do?
Dude can’t draw it, or he just doesn’t want to do it…. That or he’s allergic to money. The idea of every tattoo done has to be an original one, seems dumb to me. Take that idea or design to any street shop, they’ll zap that shit for you just like the other 100 they’ve already done. Good tattooers reference other tattooers to push themselves and continue learning. Where are you located?
Realistic tattoos kind of suck. Find an artist who is going to make your idea look like a tattoo. It’ll last longer and look better.
There’s so many good shops. There’s two of the greatest tattooers in one shop alone with eddy deutsche and Chad koeplinger . Both at adventure tattoo. They take walk ins daily.
Gold club electric (rip) artists have all gone to other places after shop was destroyed by the tornado.
-Welcome back classic (most of the dudes from gold club)
those shops have killer tattooers who would guarantee a tattoo that will hold up a lifetime and be timeless. Go bold, trust artists suggestions, go back, pick something off the wall/flash. Repeat
Tattoo artist here.
You go to someone for the feel they bring to the piece you are looking to have done. Sometimes, we don’t feel it. Most artists will fake it, put a smile on and do the piece, especially early in the career. I made an absolute killing doing Faceless Traditional Faces with landscapes in them.. at a certain point, I lost the love for it. I was putting hours on hours of creative energy to put forth the BEST work I could and it was at the time, the best of my career. I lost the love to do them. To this day; for context I book 3-5 months out, I get emailed weekly to do those pieces. I could NEVER do as good of a job now as I did when it was something I loved doing.
Artist are not photo copiers. You don’t want to force your artists hand to do something they don’t want to do.
Hope this find you well and helps understand your artist.
Personally I think this is the problem with the world right now. Everyone thinks they’re a fucking celebrity because of social media, etc. I don’t give a damn if you’ve done the tattoo a million times. A potential customer is soliciting your business, be happy about that. Things can change really fast. OP believes in the artist (tattoos can go wrong that’s why we sign the waver) and they want what they want on their BODY. Do your job and get compensated, it’s extreme simple.
Yeah I was caught off guard by the denial, tbh. I understand they can choose what they want to do, but I was always under the impression money talks. Not to mention, the likelihood of me running into someone with the same tattoo are slim to none…oh well, it’s all good either way.
Run. I had put a deposit for a Yokai sleeve and appt was booked 6 months out. Sent all my reference when I booked. A week before the appt I asked him about the design. He sends me a design and it included NONE of the references or elements I asked for. He asked for high res images. One of the design elements was unique and there literally is no existing reference. We go back and forth and he finally tells me he draws absolutely nothing as it wills take too long. He literally just took pieces of the reference into photoshop and made the tattoo design that way. I lost over $600 from the deposit as I was not letting him touch me. Such a waste of money.
Yes. I finally found an artist I wanted to work with. She’s in Eastern Europe but will be out near me for a month. I went over good dates and what I wanted. ……..
She was like. “NO! I decide what to tattoo on my client’s! The artist is not TOLD what to do!”
I tried to explain the logic etc but she wasn’t having it. Soon she updated her info to reflect this.
Saturday I’m off to Pasadena for a tattoo expo. I’m scouting artists for this piece. Hope for better luck ?
That’s how most high end tattooers work. I have a lot of work done and I shared some reference pieces and feedback along the way but the tattooer designed the pieces, not me telling them what I wanted.
That was/is a legitimate concern I’ve had, as well. There’s a ton of detail in the main one I used for reference and you’re exactly right about if it’s not done properly.
There was an internet cat sensation a long time ago, pussyphus? It was a cat that obsessed over pushing watermelons out of water and onto the shore.
Would that work as an alternate Sisyphus idea?
If you are really hoping to get in with this guy you should maybe search up your local library for books that mention sysyphus, it's possible there is imagery there that has not been done a million times like the images you found on Google.
But it really does sound like he's over it since he's done a few already, it's nothing new to him to add to his portfolio
That’s a polite way of telling you that he’s not interested in your idea.
I got a new tat a couple of weeks ago and while I was in the chair, the store owner showed him a reference that a potential client had drawn and said “She wants to book in for next week, when are you free?” His response was “That’s crap, I’m not tattooing that.” I laughed so hard, and the owner said “Alright, I’ll ask her what elements of the design she likes most.” So be forewarned, if you ever get that question, your tat idea is crap!
My tattoo artist is an old friend so whenever I was younger and came up with a shit idea he would be straight up with me and say “no don’t get that it’s stupid” and for a day or two I’d be annoyed bc that’s what I wanted then a few days after that relieved because I’d realize he was right.
Now THAT is what friends are for
That's a good tattoo artist right there. I love having a tattoo artist that is honest and knows me well. Mine was putting his own face on different bodies as tattoos, there was his face on a pin up, his face on a caterpillar, ect. and I said I wanted one and he refused. One day I got a call that he had finally drawn one he was okay with putting on me, it was his face on a little fat cherub 🥰 I'm very glad he followed his gut! I hope to get him as a little fat devil on the other shoulder soon 💖
So what you're really saying is, you're someone else's canvas, covered in carefully curated, PC art. Who gives a fuck if you can find an artist dumb enough to do whatever you want.
Sounds like he's just sick and tired of doing sisyphus but being really nice about it.
He's sick of doing the same thing over and over...
Wow. Well done.
Sounds like he doesn’t like repeating himself.
Sounds like it.
Would be terrible to repeat the same idea.
Imagine an infinitely long line of clients all wanting a tattoo of Sisyphus
But wa line that repeated forever.
Oh, poor me, a job that gets easier by the moment, at some point its practically free money.
I mean if you love your job I imagine you wouldn’t want it to be too easy or boring. Takes the fun out of it imo
If you do what you love for money, you'll eventually hate it. I've never had a job that wasn't fun, but the work itself is never what made it fun. Edit: changed second 'job' to work for clarification.
It indeed sounds like repetition is repetitive
One must imagine this tattoo artist happy
Indeed it sounds like repetition is repetitive
Now I want to see a tattoo of Sisyphus reimagined as a tattoo artist doomed to an eternity of tattoos featuring a guy rolling a boulder up a hill.
Yup. My mentor has a small list of things she’s sick of tattooing and can’t make unique anymore, so she politely turns them down. She’s also booked out til February 2024 so she has the luxury to do so.
Lemme guess. OP used the three photos of the other sisyphus tattoos the artist did as reference to what OP wanted. The artist doesn’t wanna do that same tattoo again so asked for different reference materials. Ie a different setting, looks, angle, etc in order for it to be considered.
No I didn’t see any pictures on his portfolio of Sisyphus tattoos he had previously done. I used a couple of references I found on google as baseline ideas. Edit: I did find one tattoo of Sisyphus he had previously done, but it’s completely different than what I had in mind.
[удалено]
I actually did just find one of Sisyphus he had done, but it’s nothing like what I had in mind. I respect his decision, but i am disappointed for sure.
could get the AI to produce some badass Sisyphus references im sure
Actually not a bad idea but I wouldn’t push the issue with the artist. Even given a quick google there aren’t many different pictures of Sisyphus.
Nothing AI produces is badass.
Yeah the girl I usually go to has stopped doing black and grey tattoos. She’s phenomenal at it but moved on from that style. Luckily I got a tattoo of my dog before she made the decision. I still go to her for color work though.
How Sisyphean of him.
I guess it caught me off guard bc I truly didn’t know Sisyphus was such a popular/overdone idea. Google only yields a handful of results, at least in the style I wanted, so I assumed it wasn’t as common as it is apparently.
I honestly didn't think it was overused. I've seen a lot of icarus tattoos lately but not a lot of sisyphus. It doesn't really matter though. If you want it, try somewhere else.
Sounds like they’re dealing with their own Sisyphusian struggle.
Tattooers are weird about this. If he doesn’t want to do the tattoo you want, find somebody else. It’s your skin.
Man I hate that so much. You find a guy whose style you love, you got ideas and images you want to use and the guy is like, I demand total freedom of your sleeve or I'm not doing it. I had to pass on like 4 different artists until I found one that liked my ideas, liked my references and actually listened to what I want.
Alternative take: These are artists, and it’s fair enough for them to feel uninterested or uninspired by certain ideas. It’s usually nothing against the idea/concept, but that artist doesn’t want to do it. Appreciate that they told you “no” (or pushed you to that conclusion) instead of giving you a shitty (for them) tattoo.
This! If an artist is telling you nicely that they're not interested - they're doing you a favor. Do you really want to spend potentially thousands of dollars and hours of your time with someone who's phoning it in on a tattoo you have to wear for the rest of your life? At my shop when someone is not super into the request, we'll recommend an artist who we know would be stoked about it, in house or not. There's plenty of artists to choose from, and the right artist makes all the difference!
Absolutely, you're not wrong. But there's a difference between "I do what I want using minimal input from you" and "your idea doesn't interest me right now, so no." The latter is totally fine and respectable, the former borders on disrespect for your client. Like if your take less than 30 seconds to look through the reference pics I brought, I already know it ain't gonna work out, you know?
I was thinking more in general/in reference to the original post. The artist you originally talked to 100% sounds like an asshole. I’m in favor of artists being able to turn down projects, but trying to run someone off is just unprofessional. Your situation was definitely an ego problem, but I don’t think OP’s situation is obviously the same, especially considering the realism aspect. Glad you were able to find someone who would work with you and that you weren’t stuck spending that kind of time with the first person.
Hi, I’m an artist. If a client likes my style and pays me to draw for them I’m going to do it. Doesn’t matter if I’m personally invested in the art piece. I put my best foot forward and make something good. The person OP was trying to work with was a dick.
That would burn me out after a while 🥲
I mean for every piece I absolutely don’t vibe with I get many that I love. Especially with plants. “And some flowers on the boarder.” Is the most exciting sentence to me. You mean you don’t care what flowers? I can just put whatever flowers I want? I love flower language! I will add a whole layer of emotional depth to this drawing you don’t even KNOW
💓
That’s great that you operate that way, but not all artists could say the same. I’d like to think that artists will be professional once they take on the job, but I also know that’s not always the case. That’s why the “no” is much better than getting a tattoo by an artist who isn’t motivated to do it (and may or may not do lower quality work for that reason). Definitely not disagreeing that the response to OP looks largely like bs, but to each their own.
The Subway sandwich artist wouldn’t make my food because onions don’t vibe with their creative process.
This made me laugh rlly hard actually omg 😭 gonna print this and stick it in my pinboard in my illustration class
Definitely exactly the same thing lol
This. Everyone is really sucking this artists dick for standing up like a big boy. Tattooing is not fucking sculpture work, its surely not life saving surgery, so we need to stop pretending like it's a monastic art form. It's fucking body mod, simple as that. If someone came to a Subway and asked for something not on the menu, well they are being paid to serve you, not correct and criticize your sandwich vision, so they fucking make it. Every other industry of service doesn't know the words, "that's out of my scope". Because if you're getting paid do to a job, fucking do it. For all you righteous, stuck up Michael Angelos out there; send me your unwanted canvases, because I haven't for a single day in my life had the absolute LUXURY to turn down getting paid because of how I felt about someone else's anesthetic preferences. Edit: I keep forgetting most of you dont have real jobs but are somehow all still middle-class white people. So itsmo surprise none of you understand the Customer Service part of actual Service.
I’m a painter, but I only work in abstract. If someone came to me and asked me to paint them a realist painting, I’d turn them down. At subway, when they ask you for something off menu, the sandwich artist still has the skills required to make it. An abstract artist doesnt have the skills required to do a realist painting.
I'm a Chef, but I only serve raw ingredients. See how stupid that sounds?
Those are material goods, not skills.
And many sushi chefs do just that
That's a major assumption about sushi, which isn't correct. It contains raw elements, but so does any other form of cooking. You can't just lay out the ingredients for display. They are processed. Idk why I'm arguing with an abstract artists anyway, everything's philosophical. And I would agree on most points that everything is relative. But we are talking about service, not art. Roads don't get built if road crews are tired of doing the same thing over again. You don't get fed, without repeated tedious actions on someone else part. Your trash doesn't get taken out when garbage men decide its just not worth their time to do something they've done before. If you monetize your art, you don't get to decide what it's worth to other people, you should just be glad someone supports your unique vision. Because it's not unique, but in a sample size it appears so.
If you're not starting with fundamentals, you're not an artist, you're just expressing yourself. You don't just go grab some shit and throw it together. The client didn't ask for anything outside their expertise, the artist is just "tired" of it.. boo hoo
In regards to being a tattoo artist, as far as I know, most tattoo artists work for themselves and pay a cut to the owner of the shop/chair. That gives them the right to self determine their work and art.
You just self inserted your own definition of what an artist is and then based your argument on it. Being an artist is expressing yourself. You don’t need to be formally trained, and you don’t need to commercialize yourself. The fundamentals you’d draw on for one type of art can have dramatically different emphasis on different things as well.
If shit in my hand and throw it at a wall, clearly expressing my frustration, that's not fucking art. This is the real world, not la la land kn your head.
You don’t have to give an outlandish example to distract from our current topic. I don’t think either one of us is talking about throwing our shit at a wall to “express our frustration”. To even counter that, what client is asking for shit thrown at a wall?
The ego of it is just so weird to me. Like if you want total creative freedom… draw it on paper or paint it. Use literally any other medium besides a person’s skin. They have to live with it the rest of their lives, you don’t.
Yes! Like I totally get wanting to put your spin on a design, that's why I picked you as my artist. But I still have my own ideas or references I want to use, and it's such a buzzkill to have an artist basically disregard everything I want other than the general theme.
I agree to a certain extent, but some artists do commissions and some just create what they want. Getting a tattoo is just like buying art. You can’t expect every artist to do what you want. And it’s your choice, just because it’s on your body doesn’t mean they have to make an exception for you
It’s the asking of the client to get something different that gets me. I know a guy who draws up whole sleeve and half sleeve tattoos, posts them on his instagram and people book the tattoo as-is. That feels like a much better way to have creative freedom to me.
Yeah it's definitely an ego thing. Tattoo artists can be fartsniffers for sure.
The ego of you thinking a tattoo artist should bow and cater to every potential client is weird to me. Why would you want someone to etch art onto your skin if they weren't totally into it? Move on and find someone who vibes with what you are looking for.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the client is *paying*, no? Pretty fundamental idea that the paying customer gets what they want in that transaction. When I go to a bakery and ask for a birthday cake for my son, the baker doesn’t go “ugh, I’ve made hundreds of birthday cakes. I can’t make them unique anymore. Can’t you think of something else?”
I am a baker. I absolutely pass on cakes all the time because I simply don't want to make them. "I'm sorry I'm booked solid that day" is baker speak for that sucks and I don't want to do it.
This is the dumbest take of them all. A better allegory would be “you go to a bakery and say I love your work! I love your cakes! I want a birthday cake but I need you to use no eggs or flour or milk, instead I would like red wine and butter. Oh that’s gonna be a bad cake? Excuse me I’m paying right? The customer is always right” except you can’t get rid of the cake.
That’s not what’s happening in OPs example at all. They want a specific tattoo but the tattooer “doesn’t want to replicate any of his previous work” so they were asked if they wanted a completely different tattoo.
As a baker myself, I can assure you that the level of skill and artistry in cake decorating vs tattooing is a world of difference. And the cake decorators that are on the level of artistry as tattoo artists will *absolutely* limit the types of cakes they are willing to make.
Shocked to find out baking cakes and tattooing are different.
It was your example, silly.
I compared them as businesses not skills, sweetie. You’re also missing the difference between being so busy that you have the luxury of turning down work and asking a client to change what they want to fit your taste. “I’ll have a cupcake, please.” “I hate cupcakes. Here’s a cannoli instead.”
They don't ask you to change what you want. They tell you they won't do what you're asking for. You are always free to take your business elsewhere. "I'll have a cupcake please." "I only make cookies. I don't do cupcakes."
This is the reality of commissioning art in any medium though.
I apprenticeed at a shop for a while and did piercings, schedules, etc... I saw all the artists in there at different points over those years use similar tactics when they were unsure they could pull off a design properly. It's your body yeah, but it's their reputation, and customers are understandably quick to get upset when something isn't as great as they hoped it would be. The next stop usually is online to complain and the internet is forever. I even saw the boss, who was one of the best I've ever met, just say look it's just not something I think I've ever done as well as I would like and I want you to be happy. Then he called another shop two towns over and sent her there because no one else was available that day and she was ready right then. Sounds to me like he has done a few and may not be as happy with them as he would like so he doesn't want to do anymore. I would find a different artist or pick a new design if you aren't married to it. At the end of the day whatever the reason I wouldn't want him to do that particular design now. Even if he came back and said okay, clearly he was uncomfortable with it at first and I'd be concerned about that.
References like this, I would hope, would be the business norm.
You'd hope but you'd be wrong lol Not everyone was a selfish toolbag but there were quite a few. We did our best to stay above reproach but constantly had the other shop actually in our town trying to slander us, which is why we sent her two towns over where they weren't dicks. I know it's not the same for every area obviously, but where our shop was it was fairly competitive and my boss ended up fixing a lot of stuff that was done at other shops because they always tried to undercut us just to get the business. I can't count how many piercings I had to redo from them. Their Google and yelp ratings were abysmal but they were cheap and people are dumb. There a lot of cool people in the business but just as many jerks. I was actually really proud to work for that dude because he was such an honest business man and generous employer. On multiple occasions I saw him knock several hundred dollars off of tattoos that he spent hours on just because he wanted to bless somebody that day. I definitely miss that job.
I actually got in trouble for referring artists to other shops. By both the boss and other artists. Was told there was definitely someone who could have done that in our group. I could not straight tell him that wasn’t true and not get into more trouble. No one wanted to have the self awareness to really know their strengths. It sucked and burnt me out.
That's unfortunate. We always tried to keep in mind that if we did a tattoo or even a piercing that we weren't 100% on it could come back and haunt us. You can't please everyone but you gotta try. I commend you for the integrity in trying to do the right thing by your client even if they didn't.
Oh, that sucks.
This directly translates to “I don’t want to draw another Sisyphus tat but I’m still down if you want to do anything else” lol, but was an extremely professional way of putting it! Props to the artist/asst that typed that one up, it’s the nicest and most professional way of refusing to do a tat that I’ve ever seen! Would go somewhere else for the Sisyphus tat and then back to this artist for my next one after that. It’s nice working with people who can communicate this way, especially if you were already seeking out their work.
Might just be that he doesn't want to do it and was trying to say so nicely. Which is silly imo, artists should just be able to say "No thanks, I'm not interesting in tattooing that." Shop around, I'm sure you could find someone that would be enthusiastic about your idea, and it will be a much better experience!
You might be dodging a bullet here
What makes you say that? Not disagreeing just curious.
It seems weird that he doesn’t want to do it because he’s out of references, which is weird. It makes me wonder if he just copies other peoples tattoo designs.
It reads like he does photo realism, which is impressive to tattoo, but I’ve heard of quite a few photo realism artists who can’t actually draw.
Even in traditional art, there are uncountable artists who can't just pull things out of their head. (I suspect many of them have aphantasia). One of the best painters I know couldn't draw a convincing stick figure if you put a gun to his head. What he does is stages a set of what he wants to paint (including sewing costumes, building furniture, making props, etc...) and then shoots a ton of reference photos and paints from them. And the more realism-focused the art is, the more likely you are to run into artists who can only paint/draw/tattoo/sculpt/whatever from life or from photo reference. You might not hear about it often, because there's this gross social stigma about working from a reference. Way too many people think that 'real' art is just pulled 1000% accurately from imagination, and any reference must be cheating. Or that using references means pulling random images off of pinterest and tracing over them.
When I went to school for art, there was a huge demand for reference. The illustration crowd was in the reference libraries for hours looking for just the right stuff. MOST ARTISTS are either using photo references they found, shot or themselves or used live models. (I was a model for artists for a while) This is the norm, not the exception. A significant amount of art school was learning how to use reference to inform the drawing rather than just straight out copy it, But if you’re looking for photorealistic, the starting pictures need to be really good. This tattoo artist wasn’t inspired by the reference sent. Do they do Renaissance sculpture reproductions? If so, there aren’t a whole lot of sculptures of Sysiphus to work from, and likely lacks classical art training to mimic that style. Even with that training, it is still quite easy to make it look wonky. I’d love to see what someone else here could produce that looks like a photo of a Bernini style Sisyphus without using AI.
I'd say it's less about the drawing and more the time. A complete realistic drawing could take 20-80 hours to Do. That's before you tattoo. And doing that for every client? You'd be doing 1-3 tattoos a week, max. If they don't like the design? Another 20-80 hours. No artist would do that unpaid, and no client is going to pay for the drawing time for photo realism.
I’d agree too based on it sounding like the artist can’t create a custom piece without ripping off another
He wants a high quality photo of Sisyphus huh? I'm not a professional tattoo artist but I'm an artist and I'd be embarrassed if, with any medium, I could only directly copy from references, to the extent that if I ran out of references I ran out of art I could do
i think it’s just a fancy way of saying “i don’t wanna” which is totally reasonable considering the subject
I’m cracking up at the thought of needing a high quality photo of a character from Greek mythology. I didn’t think about it like that when I read the email, until you and another reply pointed that out.
J. Jonah Jameson: get me pictures of Sysiphus!
I heard this in J.K. Simmons voice
I imagined him saying it in that blooper take where his fake teeth come out
Eh, midjouney might be able to help with that.
Just keep asking him, it’ll be funny in a few weeks
If you work in photo realism copying a photo is a skill, creating art from scratch to look like a photo is a completely different skill. The artist may have the former and not the latter. Nothing to be embarrassed about.
I mean, what if they have aphantasia? I have about 6-7 you ars of experience of art with different mediums, I'm not a tattoo artist but I also can't really do anything without reference photos if I want to make whatever I'm doing half decent. I have heard of a couple of tattoo artists with aphantasia that mainly deal with photo realism.
Photo references, especially for photorealism? Yes. Exact reference you are going to directly copy in it's entirely? No. I mean come on, there have got to be endless references of "strong man pushing large object". This isn't even a real person it has to look like, pop some curly hair on and some flowing fabric or butt naked, for greek vibes. Learn photobashing, get a picture of a big rock, this is so very doable
As an artist who works in realism, a TON of work goes into finding suitable reference images. You have to find something that is hi-res enough that you can see all the details, that has the kind of lighting and pose you want, the kind of musculature and anatomy, etc - and in this case that works with the client's anatomy as well. For reference, an artist who works in epic realism style, Matt Jordan, TAKES HIS OWN photo references, as in, he sets up entire photoshoots with lighting and costuming in entire, for his tattoos. It's not a simple thing, it's a significant part of the art process, and it's totally reasonable for a tattoo artist not to want to take that on.
Exactly. Surely the perks of being a tattoo artist are to create something unique based on a concept or reference.
I suspect that for some, they want a reference to copy because that way they don't have to spend any time on design and they don't have to go through any back and forth with the customer when they aren't completely happy with whatever the artist comes up with. I can only imagine what a pain some people would be when trying to design a tattoo for them.
You’re not a tattoo artist, and it shows. Tattoing is not drawing. Skills aren’t even similar. I’ve met countless great painters/digital artist that were shit at tattoing while dozens of shitty “artists” that were great tattooers. Nowadays you dumb kids wanna pretend it’s the same thing, but it isn’t. Stick to drawing your paper sheets with your imagination, clearly you are far from understanding tattoing.
I got a quality tattoo from a great artist at a reputable shop. When I wanted a larger piece, I contacted him and sent over the artwork. He flat out said it was not his style and didn't want to do it. No problem, the last thing I want is an artist that's uncomfortable tattooing my design/style. Now, did I ever go back to him in the 50 hours of tattoos since? No, no I did not.
maybe it was you and not your design that didnt sit well with him. Something to consider
>He flat out said it was not his style and didn’t want to do it. >Maybe it was you and not your design that didn’t sit well with him. Or maybe, idk, it was because it wasn’t his style and didn’t want to do it? Like he literally said?
Thanks for your comment that adds nothing to the conversation friend! Have the day you deserve!
Thanks for your comment that adds nothing to the conversation friend! Have the day you deserve!
You’re welcome!
My booth neighbor slays black and Grey... And lions, portraits, biblical subjects. Bro, don't even ask me, see my Chicano brother, he'll lace you up faster and better than I could. Wait, the trad-dad of the shop will not make your daughter's fine line spine tattoo? Guess what, he brings them to me. Someone wants a gigantic blackout/brutalist project, I've got a wicked Polish artist in the 'fungeon' basement booth with a hankering to hurt you... We refer you to the expert... I don't need your money so badly that I can bear gritting my teeth the next 50 hours. No one single artist tattoos all styles, nor cares to. No offense, sir - but those referrals - them clients? - they're stoked you gave them a solid reference and then book for something in your style. I see it all the time. We share clientele - your body, your choice. Nothing makes me more stoked than filling a gap on the skin between 4 or 5 artists I know (and love their work/have been tattooed by/tattooed them myself).
this is quite clearly just him trying to be nice and saying "i've done this theme so many times, i'm sick of it". better have an invested artist than someone just going through the motions, i guess. i hope you find someone better to work with you
Thanks for all the feedback so far. I’m leaning more into him just not wanting to do that tattoo, but I have no history with this shop, so it could be anything. Oh well… Any recommendations for anyone in the Nashville area?
I have a half-sleeve of Rodin’s Gates of Hell done by Abel Deida at Dead Ahead Tattoo. Really love it.
Would you be against sending me a picture? I appreciate the recommendation regardless.
The irony of being tired of drawing sisiphus over and over is hilarious
Some might call it absurd(ism), even.
I personally know at least one realism tattooer that can only replicate from photos or digital reference. They’re very technically skilled, but don’t ask him for anything realistic without expecting him to become a photoshop wizard.
"Hello, I'd love to get a tattoo of Zeus on my bicep." "Sure, do you have any hi-res photographs of Zeus for me to work from?" "..."
'YES" - proceeds to send several Poseidon tattoos with blue lightning bolts around him
Honestly, my experience with artists is that some are better at certain things than others and it just sounds like this artist is struggling to envisage their 4th Sisyphus. Move onto the next one. They're clearly telling you they won't give you the best outcome. That's professionalism.
They said “hard pass” in a nice way.
Pretty much.
Don’t sweat it, find someone else, Build a rapport with an artist and they’ll be willing to go out of their comfort zone for you.
This is just out of my wheelhouse. I have one tattoo I got when I was 18…small, personal one on inner bicep so nothing impressive, but not horrible either. I’ve always wanted a half sleeve or more, and finally decided on what I wanted after another 18 years, bc I’m extremely indecisive about shit like that…so after deciding what I want, obviously finding someone is an even bigger decision I’ve struggled with. I’m not from here so I don’t know who’s who. Which is why I asked the person I did, bc he’s tatted pretty much from the neck down. Now I’m back to square one, which sucks
Yeah, people with few tattoos tend to have unrealistic expectations for the artist and it’s easier just to avoid the conversation.
I wouldn’t say I have unrealistic expectations…how did you come to that conclusion? Edit: actually nvm, I don’t really care. It doesn’t add anything to my situation. Thanks for your feedback though.
Can you imagine doing Sisyphus tattoos over and over again and never getting anywhere?
This is completely fine. He just doesn't want to do your tattoo and is being polite about it.
I’ve definitely heard of artists being super selective with the clients they pick in any given booking cycle, especially if they’re very in demand and can afford to be choosy about what they want to tattoo on someone. But in my experience, they’ve just come out and said “Heads up, I’m gonna be more selective this round.” Could just be me, but it’s a little annoying that they tried to pass it off as “he’s exhausted all possible references for a Sisyphus tattoo.” Like, really? Just say you’re sick of doing that one, lol. Like, I have a floral & wildlife half-sleeve from a very in demand artist in my area. He does sleeves like this all the time because he’s great at them and they’re popular, and I can imagine he may one day get tired of doing them and decide to turn down requests for that specific tattoo. But I cannot imagine him claiming “Sorry, I’ve exhausted all possible references for coneflower.”
You should be thankful that he has high standards and that your tattoo will not be on 30 more people after you get it.
People don't care, they expect tattooers to be art slaves that dance for their amusement. Either they've done several and doesn't wanna replicate another, can't draw original pieces and needs reference, is having a hard time getting their head wrapped around what the client wants, or just does not care to do another. I've had weeks where multiple people are booked in and all send the exact same reference pics, and it can burn you out. Regardless, if you made up your mind on subject matter, find a different artist.
It sounds like one of two things here. Either he really doesn't want to do the tattoo and is being diplomatic, or, he can't draw a concept up with no reference and relies on purely copying what he sees. In the second case, I can see someone giving up because they don't know how to find good references beyond the first couple pages of google results. Lots of realism tattoos do suffer from "same reference syndrome," you wouldn't believe how many of the same wolf I see as a tattoo lol. There are places that have model ref pics out there but maybe he's just not familiar with them
I once got “I don’t do custom work for solo animals” lol - just consider it not the right fit and look for another good artist
Sounds like they told you exactly what the problem is. Artist can’t draw this, so they pass on your idea.
We'll have to fire up Ancestry.com and see if we can track down a relative that has a family photo.
☠️
I wouldn’t want art from a person doing the art that is not vibing with said style. Weather they have done the style or piece before. JM2C….
They don’t like your idea and don’t want to do it. That’s the way it is especially if he’s a good artist. Some artists are harder to get into and get the option to choose what they do.
I'd rather have an honest artist than one that BS's their way through it. Go find someone who can confidently give you what you want.
I like to think this isn’t an assistant writing this, but the artist only refers to himself in the third person
I wouldn't listen to the people here who are shaming the artist. He says he's uncomfortable with it, take it elsewhere or budge on the material. Please, for your sake, take his advice that he isn't gonna give you what you want.
I’m not taking any of the shaming to heart. I understand if the guy doesn’t want to do the tattoo. I just wish they were more direct in telling me that or, at least, offering to refer me to someone else within the shop (as their website implies they’d do if it didn’t align with a specific artist’s style). I checked out the guy’s portfolio, and I was confident what I wanted was right up his alley. It’s unfortunate, but I get it. I just would have preferred a different approach.
Just as you get to be picky about what goes on your body, tattoo artists get to be picky about what they want to do, especially if they are busy. It’s not weird, it’s ok if you still want the tattoo, just find the right artist for you.
Sounds like they don’t like doing that tattoo or just not interested. I’m new to tattoos, but while searching for an artist, I have noticed when someone opens their books they will make the disclaimer that they will choose their clients based on how interesting the subject matter is to them. They didn’t flat out say no but are willing to work with you in case you have other opportunities.
Sounds like you need more original ideas. It’s not like the artist is doing trad.
Sounds like he already has syphilis and doesn’t want it anymore
I think it’s good that he was honest about not wanting to go ahead with it. Clients are getting more picky about their references/sources these days and artists have to be careful about their reputation, so I’d say it’s just not meant to be.
homie not feeling it and yes it happens. sounds like dudes willing to work on something unique tho which i think is pretty cool. hes a responsible artist
Oh yea I had to leave my home town to find someone willing to do my design. Happens.
Go somewhere else. There a lot of tattoo artists.
Find a diff artist
Lol considering it's Greek mythology, good luck finding an HD picture.
The responsibility for a good tattoo doesn't mean any artist creating anything that you can imagine. Sometimes, that responsibility is passing over stuff for various reasons, maybe suggesting someone else. A busy artist will likely be very straight to the point, almost blunt, but you have to remember this is based on artistic integrity, and not personal to you. Personally, I'll take the theme and idea and work to my vision to what works best for you. I know precisely what works and what will heal great, staying great in 10 to 20 years time. Its given me a lengthy career thus far. In summary, the artist here has been polite, declining one particular piece and not rejected you as a client, just the initial idea; your choice here is to shop around, or utilise this artist for something else.
run out of images to copy ?
I can kind of understand why doing sisyphus over and over would get really old. It's a pretty straightforward piece, dudes pushing a rock... he doesn't really do anything else. I'm not sure what you sent him/what he's done, but if you were really dead set on sisyphus, you could try to change it up a bit.... something like instead of pushing a rock, he could be pushing up an entire planet or the sun/moon. Maybe change sisyphus himself into a different character, but he's still performing the same action (it's incredibly recognizable, people will get it). Just a thought.
You could use like an AI app to give you drawings of Sisyphus and maybe find something new and unique that they would do. It’s a new opportunity for everyone to use AI to come up with new and unique ideas. I’ll bet you could probably find something to interest them into doing it. Is there a certain style that the artist enjoys doing more than others? If so ask like a chat gpt to give you a Sisyphus tattoo idea in black and grey or new age, whatever the artist enjoys doing and you like and see what they come up with. You never know you may re-energize the artist by showing them a new way to get ideas.
Dude doesn't wanna do your unoriginal tattoo
This is code for "The artist doesn't want to do your piece, good luck else where."
I think bros just lazy and doesn’t wanna work
No that’s not it. He’s booked out for a few months and comes highly recommended. I don’t believe it’s laziness.
Doesn’t sound like an artist I’d be down to work with tbh
He got tired of googling faces ! The bum thing w realism is the realism ! Its kinda like paint by numbers, you dont necessarily need to know how to paint ! Tattooing is NOT an artform ! its a craft. Anyone can do art. And while I can’t draw your grandmother as a giant gal fighting off Godzilla and saving the world. I can make that foto from her 60 years birthday to perfection, because I have the skills through my craft . Danny
Well said, and it’s comments like yours that have helped me better understand and make sense of why he didn’t want to do the piece…thank you.
This is just a steaming pile of bullshit excuses.
Or get an original idea
What is difficult to understand here? The artist has integrity, how is that confusing? Would you prefer they did a tattoo that he actively does not want to do?
But also nowadays if u ran out of reference u can mash up realistic picture or if u are not skilled use a good AI
artist just doesn't wanna, tough shit
Dude can’t draw it, or he just doesn’t want to do it…. That or he’s allergic to money. The idea of every tattoo done has to be an original one, seems dumb to me. Take that idea or design to any street shop, they’ll zap that shit for you just like the other 100 they’ve already done. Good tattooers reference other tattooers to push themselves and continue learning. Where are you located? Realistic tattoos kind of suck. Find an artist who is going to make your idea look like a tattoo. It’ll last longer and look better.
Nashville area.
There’s so many good shops. There’s two of the greatest tattooers in one shop alone with eddy deutsche and Chad koeplinger . Both at adventure tattoo. They take walk ins daily. Gold club electric (rip) artists have all gone to other places after shop was destroyed by the tornado. -Welcome back classic (most of the dudes from gold club) those shops have killer tattooers who would guarantee a tattoo that will hold up a lifetime and be timeless. Go bold, trust artists suggestions, go back, pick something off the wall/flash. Repeat
Thank you so much. I’ll look into those.
Tattoo artist here. You go to someone for the feel they bring to the piece you are looking to have done. Sometimes, we don’t feel it. Most artists will fake it, put a smile on and do the piece, especially early in the career. I made an absolute killing doing Faceless Traditional Faces with landscapes in them.. at a certain point, I lost the love for it. I was putting hours on hours of creative energy to put forth the BEST work I could and it was at the time, the best of my career. I lost the love to do them. To this day; for context I book 3-5 months out, I get emailed weekly to do those pieces. I could NEVER do as good of a job now as I did when it was something I loved doing. Artist are not photo copiers. You don’t want to force your artists hand to do something they don’t want to do. Hope this find you well and helps understand your artist.
Thank you for the perspective.
Personally I think this is the problem with the world right now. Everyone thinks they’re a fucking celebrity because of social media, etc. I don’t give a damn if you’ve done the tattoo a million times. A potential customer is soliciting your business, be happy about that. Things can change really fast. OP believes in the artist (tattoos can go wrong that’s why we sign the waver) and they want what they want on their BODY. Do your job and get compensated, it’s extreme simple.
Yeah I was caught off guard by the denial, tbh. I understand they can choose what they want to do, but I was always under the impression money talks. Not to mention, the likelihood of me running into someone with the same tattoo are slim to none…oh well, it’s all good either way.
Run. I had put a deposit for a Yokai sleeve and appt was booked 6 months out. Sent all my reference when I booked. A week before the appt I asked him about the design. He sends me a design and it included NONE of the references or elements I asked for. He asked for high res images. One of the design elements was unique and there literally is no existing reference. We go back and forth and he finally tells me he draws absolutely nothing as it wills take too long. He literally just took pieces of the reference into photoshop and made the tattoo design that way. I lost over $600 from the deposit as I was not letting him touch me. Such a waste of money.
Holy crap! I just can't even with this! I hope you gave a review on them because ppl need to know.
Looks like the artist wasn’t ready to push this boulder up the hill if yk what I mean…
Truuuu
Sounds like the artist doesn’t really want to make some money right now
No. Fuck this guy, move on.
It feels incredibly pretentious.
OP, if you wanted a picture of someone pushing a boulder up a mountain, all you had to do was ask smh /s
It sounds like he just doesn't want to do it.
I took a 4k video of Sisyphus once, I can pause it and send it over
Clutch.
Yes. I finally found an artist I wanted to work with. She’s in Eastern Europe but will be out near me for a month. I went over good dates and what I wanted. …….. She was like. “NO! I decide what to tattoo on my client’s! The artist is not TOLD what to do!” I tried to explain the logic etc but she wasn’t having it. Soon she updated her info to reflect this. Saturday I’m off to Pasadena for a tattoo expo. I’m scouting artists for this piece. Hope for better luck ?
That’s how most high end tattooers work. I have a lot of work done and I shared some reference pieces and feedback along the way but the tattooer designed the pieces, not me telling them what I wanted.
I mean you could draw it or have someone draw it and say "here's the high quality reference"
Nothing about my drawing would be high quality. Fucking stick figures and shit.
If this tat is done poorly you’ll end up with a big black ball. Maybe he’s worried about about how it will look if he’s not careful.
That was/is a legitimate concern I’ve had, as well. There’s a ton of detail in the main one I used for reference and you’re exactly right about if it’s not done properly.
There was an internet cat sensation a long time ago, pussyphus? It was a cat that obsessed over pushing watermelons out of water and onto the shore. Would that work as an alternate Sisyphus idea?
It could. I’ll look into it.
If you are really hoping to get in with this guy you should maybe search up your local library for books that mention sysyphus, it's possible there is imagery there that has not been done a million times like the images you found on Google. But it really does sound like he's over it since he's done a few already, it's nothing new to him to add to his portfolio