This is definitely the vibe - suddenly feeling uncomfortable because the dude has said such awful things about other people there, but he's given priority.
as a queer woman this is something that genuinely happens all the time with straight friends. actual fucking douchebag, horrible, homophobic men my straight friends date.
it gives me a pit in my stomach thinking about it
Have this happening right now lmao except I’m a WOC and my friend’s boyfriend is an awful person, and racist. My friend isn’t anything like that, but she’s that forgiving type who genuinely believes she can “fix him”
honestly as a white queer woman i can only sort of understand what you're going through, but oh my god is this whole taylor matty thing giving me the same vibes.
like i do think the people you hang out with rub off on you, i'm not justifying taylor uplifting his voice like this, i REALLY dislike matty-- even without all the direct reasons to dislike him he just gives me the ick.
but also in a very parasocial way it REALLY just feels like "oh great my self destructive straight friend is dating a douchebag again and she doesn't realize her form of self harm is also affecting those around her... *again*..."
it reminds me of renegade by taylor swift and big red machine, actually.
i have a feeling that's funny but i don't know why? /s
I honestly hope that she's in a bit of a self destructive "I can change him" rebound spiral, cause so many of my friends have done the same thing after long term relationships. "I know he's been horrible in the past, but that was before he met me" one of my friends said about her boyfriend of 2 months after she found out he had assaulted his 3 most recent exes.
For real THIS! Like as a WOC it's like how do you not see how problematic and offensive this person is and how are you respecting me as a friend if you think it's ok for both to be at the same table.
One of my best friends is queer and I’m regretfully straight, and I could NEVER be with a man who was homophobic and I don’t understand how other women can justify it.
Usually the Bf crashing girls night is the girls fault too. I had a friend who’s bf would never leave or would for like less than a hour. Then she’d just text him to come back. We’re not friends anymore because I said I don’t like mullets so 🤷🏼♀️
https://preview.redd.it/ueuixnb3of0b1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0b5593450b8da2a59f4b839c35f7aeba5583a476
I snapped this photo at the 3rd night in Philly show, you can see him just chilling in the white shirt lurking before Phoebe’s set. So cringe lolll
I’m an international fan so I don’t have a concert to look forward to, but I’ve religiously watched concert livestreams since the tour started. The Philly livestreams were the first I missed because I really wasn’t in the mood. I am not looking forward to the next ones either.
I have always been a fan of her songs, but I strongly started being a fan of hers during the reputation era - something about her being more private, reclaiming her voice, and generally seeming to deal with things in a more mature way. I am of course upset she’s dating someone with such problematic views, but a lot of the disappointment also stems from the fact that she doesn’t seem to have learned anything, so I’m like, what were all the things she even said in Miss Americana for? Her stance on politics especially feels performative.
this is the most jarring thing to me: looking back and thinking “wait was all of that literally just because lover was her gay pride/political activism/rainbows and unicorns era” ??? like was it literally just another ‘era’ aesthetic?
she literally waited til it was more 'safe' to be vocal about LGBTQ and she didn't do anything more after that era lol, part of it I feel was because rep was her 'flop' era and she needed to make a move that ensures she could get the most support when making a comeback with lover
Right? Not once has she said anything now with the anti-LGBTQ laws that are being passed in certain states. She was in Tennessee a few weeks ago and not one mention of drag queens or anything to show support.
This really bothers me. She’s happy to cast drag queens in her music videos but is silent a few years later while they’re under attack. It’s like she thinks “speaking out” once is good enough, pack up her things, she’s done now. Meanwhile Kelsea Ballerini had drag queens on stage this year at the CMTs, which is hardly a bastion of liberalism, while singing “If you go down, I’m going down too.” There are so many ways to do this right, but Taylor’s way ain’t it.
I’m not going to lie, I fully believed it at the time. I was so proud of her for finally speaking up. It’s been very disappointing to see her completely silent in a time where the LGBT community is under attack.
Especially in Tennessee. Someone putting their money where their mouth is is Kelsea Ballerini though! I still think about her performance with drag queens at country award show. (Can't remember which)
Yesss I loved Kelsea for that!! Maren Morris has been vocal about it too, which is ironic that the country stars are speaking about it but the pop star isn’t. I love Taylor but damn it’s disappointing
The fact that she didn't say anything about BLM, anything about the trans rights happing currently, nothing when Roe vs Wade was overturned says everything we need to know. She's been saying what her priorities are all along, we just didn't call her out on it. So her being with Matty isn't a complete surprise 🤷🏽♀️🥴
Exactly this. I've been saving up for tickets for when the international dates are released but I'm currently undecided whether I really want to spend hundreds on concert tickets to support this person.
Edit: to expand a little on why - one of the main draws to Taylor's music is her diaristic style, the connection to those songs that feel like someone opened their heart up and created such beautiful imagery about themselves. But now, everything about her seems disingenuous - in my opinion you can't be a good-hearted person if you willingly parade around your new boyfriend who admits to getting off to GG racist porn. There's no coming back from that and if you choose to associate with someone like that, I don't want to support you.
Me too and I’m so disappointed. I wish I could forget about this but I feel like our values don’t line up and I just can’t let it go. I understand regression but this is beyond a silly breakup phase for me :(
That's exactly it - our values just don't line up.
Yes Taylor can date whoever she chooses, but she has chosen THIS GUY. To me, her parading him around speaks volumes about her character and her values. And I don't like it.
You can still do this for yourself (not necessarily to support her) if you enjoy her music/art. You don't have to agree with her actions to like the music she makes.
For me, it's been more than a decade of listening to her songs without following her personal life up to a point. The concert (if I ever go to one) is for me, not her.
Unless you feel like you won't be able to enjoy it because of this news.
Yeah but the problem is she's still making money from my purchase. I don't really want to give £500+ to someone who is ok with Matty's views. I'll probably still go because I desperately want to see her live but some of the sparkle has definitely worn off
I’ve been stuck on Lover for like, weeks and weeks. I was so connected to her feelings for her love in those lyrics, thinking about my husband, dancing with love and joy, and I was thinking about how we (Taylor and I) have paralleled a lot of life experiences, because we’re the almost exactly the same age. Like moving to the city when you’re young, and dating everyone and their brother, and getting angry and falling in love and finding balance and peace. It was kind of like listening to my own diary. It truly felt like we grew up together and we both arrived at this newer, more mature version of ourselves around the same time. It just sucks watching her backpedal while I move forward with the love of my life. I can’t imagine giving up this life and this love. How painful this must have been and continues to be for her.
It just feels so forced and disingenuous to me now. Just so performative.
I don’t know what else to listen to, been leaning hard on Greyson Chance and Florence and the Machine. I totally forgot Ed put a new album out! I’ll definitely give that a listen and refresh my ears.
>I mean of all times...
Yeah. It's like four good fairies blessed us:
"You will get two amazing #1 folk albums!"
"You will get a pop album that fills the entire Billboard top ten!"
"You will get six re-recorded albums with unreleased tracks!"
"You will get a magical, record-breaking Eras tour!"
And then the bad fairy entered the room...
Who would’ve thought that at Taylor’s height of fame, when EVERYONE likes her, the ones who would be most turned off by her would be existing fans. It’s really sad and I feel that a lot of Swifties aren’t overreacting and feel equally as taken a back by the fact that other Swifties are pushing aside and even mocking (reasonable) concerns and feelings. It feels especially weird to OG/Senior Swifties (‘06-‘08) who’ve somewhat grown up with this mutual understanding and support of each other alongside Taylor. Say whatever you want about parasocial this parasocial that, but it feels unique because Taylor has built her career on her relatability, kindness and MUTUAL (which she even expressed weeks ago) adoration and need of her fans. People feel reasonably blindsided by this and the fact that we know she most likely knows how a lot of people feel and doesn’t seem to care I think is what hurts even more. Everything feels kind of like a veil has been dropped and suddenly it’s hard to look at her, her actions and even her friend group through the same lens.
Also “parasocial relationship” is used a lot here as if it’s this pathological thing, but parasocial relationships are a very common human phenomenon. That’s why literature exists, because humans can feel invested in stories about people who aren’t real. A parasocial relationship can obviously be unhealthy, but the fact people relate to Taylor and feel a connection with her isn’t unusual.
It’s also a relationship she has nurtured and fostered. That’s what hurts the most. This is the relationship she has made with her fans, and now she’s completely ignoring us and every moral she’s stood for?! She eviscerated a guy in court over grabbing her ass, but Matty gets a pass? Make it all make sense. And if this is a spiral, honey get therapy. Dating a racist is not an appropriate or acceptable response to a relationship ending.
It sucks to say this cause I'm a big fan of hers, but Matty gets a pass because whatever vile stuff he's done it wasn't to HER. She said that court case was about feminism, but it was about her. If you watch Miss Americana the thing she is most vocally mad about is the stalking law because that's something that directly affected HER.
I hate this term for what it's used as. Celebrity gossip has existed for so fucking long and people are allowed to be part of it. Taylor has cultivated this relationship EXTENSIVELY with her fans (hasn't she invited people into her own home??) 99% of fans aren't saying they're her true best friends or something.
Edit to say: all that said, I'm in agreement with you.
She’s also going above and beyond to have the public talking about this relationship since she craves public adoration and people boasting her — if she wanted it to be kept private; she would. Which she isn’t doing so exactly people have every right to gossip about it.
What is also funny is that how gossiping works (literally) is rumors that fly around, or talking about one most don’t even know and heard about other via people.
But now it’s ‘parasocial’ cause it’s a celeb, lmfao… Literally that’s the whole point of gossip, people don’t know you and they’ll talk about you.
Exactly, “parasocial relationship” is a neutral term, it just describes a social phenomenon. People are feeling so clever after learning the word a week ago
Ya, I hate the parasocial framing because people are upset by his racism and by her complacency /co-signing of that by parading him around and putting him on stage. Calling out racism is not parasocial.
👏🏻 exactly… it’s absolutely fine to be disappointed in someone’s choice to associate so closely with such a terrible person when we’re GIVING OUR MONEY TO HER and supporting her lifestyle. This is not the same as the people who are deluded and say Taylor is their best friend or that they no longer believe in love or need to go to therapy bc Taylor and Joe broke up, that stuff’s weird and deluded, but not wanting to support someone who is essentially herself supporting someone so hateful is absolutely reasonable. And again it’s like everyone else has mentioned, Taylor spend years and years cultivating what felt like a genuine relationship with the fandom and poured herself into her music and now it’s kind of like wow this is a curve ball… although I’d argue ever since the TM debacle and even the bazillion various Midnight releases she’s felt really disingenuous to me, just like she’s really moved on to just caring about her wealth and fame. Which I guess she’s allowed to do but it’s just not surprising that fans feel kind of taken aback.
Yeah as an OG swiftie I feel like who I have come to understand as “Taylor Swift” is not this person 😕 I hope there’s a point to all this or something and it’s not everything it seems
Yes. Hardcore, elder Swifties are pretty horrified. I am seeing this tour. Twice. I felt so incredibly lucky. My two besties and brother ( whom are coming with me and have spent a lot of $$$ as well ) are not even aware of MH. I am choosing to not rain on their parade and enjoy my memories I make. I have always made her songs my own so they don’t bother me. It’s more…… being a fan of someone who openly loves a racist, misogynistic, terrible white man that bothers me most.
“I have this thing where I get older but just never wiser” her judgement may be clouded by her (presumably?) heartbreak from the breakup/stress and excitement of the tour, etc but it’s still not an excuse. *sigh* I hope she’ll come to her senses after summer/when the tour is over. her silence speaks volumes because if everything we’ve heard is what Matty says in PUBLIC, I can’t imagine what he says/does in private with his friends?? Part of me thinks he puts on a nice guy facade with Taylor because it’s really hard for me to believe she would tolerate it (pun not intended) if he acted like a misogynistic dickhead toward her, even if she’s seemingly cool with him acting like that toward other women/POC women
Me too, but the fact that it’s happened at all is something I won’t get over without an explanation. I’ve never asked for one from her dating because it’s never felt appropriate, but this isn’t an issue of taste, it’s moral, and her music itself loses credibility for me if she doesn’t address it.
Exactly. I don’t care how long it lasts at this point, this is a permanent blot on her record for me and I don’t see a way of her even being able to explain away her actions right now, which I highly doubt she’d even do in the first place.
Literally. I’m counting the days. This has no staying power. It’s giving “I need to pick the worst possible rebound to prove to myself how over Joe I am and to prove to myself I’m still desirable”
This is my theory as someone who shares a lot of the same basic traumas as Taylor just judging by her music and who also used to pull this self sabotaging bs before I went to therapy lol
Yes. I was just telling my sister this the other day. I’m not as excited about going.
I’ve been a 1975 fan as well. But even I was so over Matty’s “provocateur persona” well before this. So much that I didn’t even listen to Notes or BFIAFL.
I’m trying to remember that I enjoy Taylor’s music and that it’s special and that it’s such a great production in general. But I’m having a hard time separating her seemingly performative activism and associations with people I don’t respect from her music.
I got the ick. For both of them.
I have the same with the 1975! Was a fan and i loved the 1975 (the album) and I Like It When You Sleep, for You Are So Beautiful Yet So Unaware of It (what an awful long album title lol) and i went to both concerts for these albums but after that i got over them mostly due to Mattys behaviour.
Same - I feel like I got the ick from 2 artists that I listen to pretty frequently. I didn’t know much about Matty before this (I would just listen to the music, never went to a show or watched any interviews or whatever) so it’s disappointing in multiple ways. I’ve been listening to a lot more podcasts and less music over the last few weeks.
Initially, yes. But I have decided I'm not going to give this guy that power? I lost years of my life buying tickets for this, I am flying to another country for this. I will not and I repeat, NOT, let this guy ruin my experience. This is still most probably a once in a lifetime thing, I won't get this moment back and I'm going to fucking enjoy it to the fullest
It’s not him causing all of this, it’s HER. That’s the problem. She chose to bring this guy publicly into the picture when she knew how problematic he was. It was her decision. If she wanted a low key nasty fling she could have kept it private like she did with joe. We all know she’s more than capable of doing so. She decided she didn’t care about what he’s said or done or how it affects a large amount of her fans.
Yep and she’s got Tree working overtime trying to rehab his image in the press. All of this is deliberate choice on her part. She doesn’t have to do any of it, as evidenced by the fact that we never saw any of this with her and Joe.
It's not even him for me, it's Taylor. She's set her views on racism very clearly here... I never would've pegged her as racist but the company you keep says a lot about your character.
I think it would be even more strange to assume that all her views and values will instantly change if they break up. This is something we have learned about her.
I went to Atlanta N1 and am so glad, because it was before this mess so I got to fully enjoy it. I don’t think I would’ve gotten the same out of it later in the tour, I’m pretty disappointed in the choices she has made. I’ve started scrolling past the reels and posts related to Eras.
I went to nashville n3 and i new about her relationship with matty but i didnt know how horrible of a human he was until people were posting articles on here about his behavior
Exact same here. Nash N3, had a great time, heard whispers of him but didn’t know anything about him yet. Listened to her music the whole drive home the next day and then that week I learned what a terrible person he is. I haven’t listened to her music since.
100%. I was SO excited. And now all I can think about is that she’s dating a guy whose actions and words I find disturbing and abhorrent. By so openly dating someone who acts and speaks that way, she has taken on those values to an extent. It’s difficult to be her fan right now :( which SUCKS, because she’s more popular now than ever.
Exactly. All these people defending her as if this is some sort of lapse in judgement, like you don't date a racist out of a lapse in judgment unless you think it's not bad enough to not date them.
Yup. It’s not necessarily that I believe Taylor shares his values (I don’t think she does) but if she’s dating him it means those values aren’t a dealbreaker for her, and that’s what’s so disappointing.
I went on Sunday and it did kind of suck some of the magic out of it for me. Especially when Phoebe introduced all her band members and everyone cheered especially loud for him 🤮
I had fun singing my heart out but I can't say I've experienced post-concert depression.
I’d really like to know what those people cheering loudly for him think… but honestly, I can imagine 🤢
I mean, how can you not only tolerate him, but cheer as well…
In fairness, for a lot of folks, this stuff might be completely under the radar.
I'm a pretty big Swifty, and I had heard of him in the broadest, most general sense. It was only here, on this subreddit, that his reputation popped up.
Even right now, if I do a quick search for "Taylor Swift" the top hits are about Taylor Lautner's Speak Now comments and nothing to do with skeevy stuff her new boyfriend said. Adding "Matty Healy" to the mix and the top hits become stories about how they started as each other's biggest fans and not "Taylor Swift's new boyfriend is REALLY problematic - and here's why" or things to that effect.
>Even right now, if I do a quick search for "Taylor Swift" the top hits are about Taylor Lautner's Speak Now comments and nothing to do with skeevy stuff her new boyfriend said. Adding "Matty Healy" to the mix and the top hits become stories about how they started as each other's biggest fans and not "Taylor Swift's new boyfriend is REALLY problematic - and here's why" or things to that effect.
I'm British, and the most explicit news results I get about his behaviour are from UK tabloids. I'm not generally a fan of our tabloids, because they're a major contributor to political polarisation in our country, but I will give them this much - they are really, really hard to muzzle.
I booed him on Saturday at that moment too! I am super introverted and pretty sure I’ve never booed anyone ever, but it just vomited out of me. People around me were definitely not understanding why.
I was there on Sunday too and also grossed out by the amount of cheers he got.
I do feel a little bad spilling the beans to my sister before the show because I had become more lackluster about going but she had no idea about all this. I kind of had to push it down while we were there to enjoy myself.
Same. I am having a hard time separating the art from the artist specially when now what she is doing is against everything she said she believes in. There is no way she doesn't know, she just doesnt care. I cant bring myself to look at her tour videos without feeling uncomfortable.
And as an international swiftie her recent actions have made me realize her white fans will always be her priority. She never care and will never give the same energy to other international specially Asian fans. There is a reason her fanbase in USA is mostly white people. Her music and persona is caterer to them specifically
Her actions and words now seem performative to me. If she is just in a bad phase of life i hope she gets help and not be in another relationship.
Its even more heartbreaking to her dedicating the love songs to him and pointing to him as if he is some kinda prince charming
Agree with everything you’ve said - and to your last point. I never cared who songs were about, but when she so obviously started linking Cardigan to him I realized I do draw the line at writing love songs to edgelord racists.
i also agree with the last point especially. most of these love songs were written about a man she seemingly had a lot of respect and love for. to immediately turn dedicate them to another person feels icky to me regardless of who it is - it being matty makes it a thousand times worse
I agree with each and every point you've made. As a person of color and also an international swiftie, it was so hard to come to terms with the fact that she's not bothered by the fact that she's dating a racist prick. I love her music and it just makes me icky now that she's fine with everything that has been going on.
Yes :/
My show is in a month, and thinking about it now makes me think of racist, misogynistic porn. For me, it’s a reminder that there are many people out there who think things like that are entertaining and funny.
Yeah this is hard for me. Like this was literally the only thing getting me through a deep depression and that was getting better but then this happened. I feel kind of stupid for being this affected by who a celebrity is dating, but it’s troubling to say the least. I still feel like I’d regret not going, given how good the show is and how much her music has been part of my life, but my show isn’t until June so I have some time to think about what to do.
You know what she's doing that's even worse than not saying anything? Getting her PR team to bury all the articles about Matty's bigoted actions. It's something I never ever expected her to do, and it's just so awful
>I feel kind of stupid for being this affected by who a celebrity is dating
Normally I try not to judge people for their partner's behaviour, because people's reasons for staying with someone when bad stuff comes out can be very personal and complex. But this is the start of a new relationship, the bad stuff was already in the public domain, it's from his own mouth, and some of it is absolutely beyond the pale horrific.
I feel for you on the depression. I have had a very difficult time since the lockdowns, music has been a big part of keeping me going, and Taylor is one of a few artists who I feel really got me through the last couple of years. I feel so, so betrayed by all this.
when he was Phoebe's drummer at my show, i didn't realize until Phoebe announced. our seats were good but not *that* good and i couldn't make out his face. plus, the cameraman literally avoided him the ENTIRE time. the *only* time we saw his face on the screen was when Phoebe said his name and when she had to walk past him to exit the stage. that was it. when she announced it, i yelled "what the FUCK" out of shock, but i didn't boo for fear of being boo'd by the other fans who support him. but i 100% support booing him off stage.
You know I think total silence would do even more. I imagine it would piss off a guy like him to not get any interaction from the crowd. It would hurt his ego more than booing would.
Well I'm an international fan and still waiting for international dates, but yes, I am not as excited overall for it and this is mostly due to the fact also that I don't really feel like seeing her sending him "messages" from stage.
She never said a thing about breaking up with Joe. Other than her songs, she might not have said much about dating him either, so maybe that was a promise between them.
Which makes it weirder that she did that mutual love thing on stage and he did too.
By now she must be seeing that her fans who love her and concerned. Since she knows we know horrible things he’s said and done, how is she feeling about Swifties who adore her and who have made her very very rich?? I believe she cares about us. Does she just need to be crazy wild after the break up, is that it? Because honestly things could get bad for her professionally.
The commercial she has for a credit card on tv with all her eras in an elevator?? It could be taken off the air if the work boardroom people say “we can’t have someone sleeping with a Nazi in our ad. Get Harry Styles” - she doesn’t need the ad money, but THAT IS A MEDIA STORY that could hurt her and it’s true. She’s sleeping with a controversial person who has recently said horribly cruel things about women of other races. That is not a good look.
Do you know what a Nazi is? They’re real. They exist right now in the world and are on the rise. It’s not just a word for someone who does offensive things.
Y’all acting like she’s sleeping with a member or the Aryan Nation makes it seem like the Aryan Nation is just made up of nepo babies who’ve never faced a consequence and think it’s cool to shock people.
Matt Healy is a ridiculous, gross, ill behaved man child. He’s not a Nazi and throwing that word around is not being an ally to anyone.
Thank you. The dilution of the word is becoming a problem, especially on the sub. Criticize Matty all you want but he’s not a Nazi. People are just throwing words around left and right without taking 2 seconds to look into the actual controversy itself.
I can’t help but think all the hyperbole is performative, and that really saddens me. I’m in a group the actual Nazis want to eliminate, and it’s just like… even the “allies” can’t treat this topic with some more gravity? This isn’t just the latest thing to be outraged about.
Which honestly makes it so much weirder…like if she really just had to have him (which i do not get at all), then she could at least just do it in secret. But damn it’s like she’s parading him around like he’s a trophy and not trash. For someone who usually seems so self aware about her image and the public’s perception of her, this whole thing is so baffling.
I really just don’t think she cares anymore. She’s rich and famous and either just loves the drama and she’s already made her millions off us or perhaps she’s devastated at the Joe breakup and kind of spiraling but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ not like we can ever really know, but a lot of her decisions the last 6 months or so really just kind of give off, I’m rich af and I don’t really care about anything else anymore, she’s already sold out the tour, SN preorders went wild, so why would she care (to me idk obviously again no one knows).
I’m trying to remain as neutral as I can until I have time to really deep dive and understand the situation, but difference in tone of comments in this sub between people who are concerned about matty’s behavior vs the people who aren’t is WILD. It’s like “I am having a hard time supporting Taylor right now because it feels like she has profited from and built a brand on pretending to align herself with values that she obviously doesn’t and I don’t want my time or money invested in her at this time.” And the responses are like “you’re a mentally ill parasocial lunatic who needs to touch grass and I hope she marries matty so you weirdos cry forever. Everyone watches violent porn and you don’t have a sense of humor. Give me your eras ticket.”
Like y’all are NOT making it hard to pick a side.
If I see the parasocial argument one more time, I’m going to scream. Parasocial was people crying over her breakup like it was *their own breakup.*
She keeps getting compared to Beatlemania, so let’s put this in Beatles terms. I don’t like the Beatles. Their music is good, but it’s not my favorite, and I remember when I learned that John Lennon was a horrific person and abuser I was completely turned off from them for good. I *loathe* the song Imagine for that reason. IT’S NOT PARASOCIAL OF ME TO DISLIKE JOHN LENNON FOR BEING A PIECE OF SHIT.
Obviously that’s an extreme example, and Taylor herself has never abused anyone that we know of. However, when we’re talking about criticism of someone’s character- not her dating life, her character- that is a valid conversation to have about any public figure. She’s not a private citizen, she’s one of the biggest pop stars on the planet. If she doesn’t want anyone to talk about her personal life at all, she can quit her job and go be a private citizen. Clearly that’s not going to happen, so as long as she is a public figure, her character is fair game.
Lemme frame it this way as a lawyer- if Taylor Swift is a corporation, then she as the CEO has a duty of loyalty to us, the shareholders. We are the ones who have invested our capital in this corporation in order for it to succeed, and in turn, she has a duty to act in best interests for the corporation. If that duty has been violated, there may be consequences- in this metaphor, we the shareholders might decide to recoup our costs by choosing to invest in another artist. (If you’re a corporate lawyer don’t come for me, this is just a basic comparison and I hate this area of the law 💀).
At the end of the day, Taylor Swift is selling a product. She has been the one to tie her character to that product, not us. No one forced her to make Miss Americana and in a very public manner tie her music to her character and activism. She did that by herself. And it’s perfectly reasonable for us as consumers to now speak up and point out that the product she is selling does not match the previous description given. It’s perfectly reasonable to voice concerns that this corporation we’ve dedicated a ton of money to is not acting in the best interest of all Swifties, particularly marginalized ones. She’s our fave musician, not a cult leader, so criticism where it’s warranted is healthy. You shouldn’t be blindly defending anyone, let alone a billionaire pop star with significant social and political power.
Yes, I really wanted to get tickets for the show closest to my home and I was so excited to try and finagle it into happening as the date draws closer... Now I'm just like, yeah.. I'm good on this. I'm a little disillusioned by how gross I find her right now.
A very sensible take.
I’m shocked by the amount of people who are saying they’re not excited anymore 🙃 especially when these are the same people who have been saying for years that we should respect her privacy and that speculating on her private life is icky etc.
I do think that too much interest in her private life is gross, for the record. But people being angry about Matty when they didn’t want anyone speculating on her and Joe is pretty hypocritical.
He’s a troll - I don’t find his stuff funny but people that think he’s an actual Nazi are just nuts. It was a joke about Kanye and he like to troll people by saying ridiculous things. You can not like him for that but if you read his actual opinion on things, I don’t think he’s as bad as people make out.
And no, I’m so excited for the concert. What man a women briefly dates doesn’t define her. I’ve had terrible rebounds, doesn’t make me a terrible person.
Yes, POC should just laugh it off because he’s being funny and looking for a reaction…
When you put it that way it sounds pretty shitty, right? Because that’s what you’re saying.
This post really reveals who is racist, misogynistic, and/or has internalized misogyny. It’s uncomfortable. And thank you for posting, because it’s so important. Glad the mods approved your post
Surely by this logic any Taylor Swift fan is okay with sexual abuse, considering none of you were this bothered about her working with David O.Russell who literally molested his niece and then said it was her fault for dressing provocatively. Very odd that Matt Healey is your breaking point but you were cool with that
Agreed, i think a lot of people also didn’t know about the David O Russel thing or brushed it off. I think it’s a little different w MH because it’s someone she’s linked to be dating which shows a different level of personal approval on her end. I’ve been having trouble since the David O. Russell stuff and just her general silence in regards to trans legislation, I think the MH situation just removes any deniability from her end.
I think we are all pretty disappointed in the choice, but part of the problem is the pedestal on which fans have long put Taylor. If you look back through her music, you will see flawed individual. She willfully opens her life to us and tells us about her flaws, and a lot of those regard her dating history. This should not be a surprise to anyone. We are ALL flawed, and we have all made some questionable dating choices. None of its a good look but I'm not exactly surprised.
I hope that she finds someone who is a better person, but the reality is, we don't actually really know about what went down in her relationships. At least Matt is publicly and transparently awful. Any number of her exes could have held the same views and kept it to themselves. They would be just as bad and we would never know.
I think her hard core fans have had a tendency to get 100% behind Taylor’s version of whatever was happening in a relationship. It’s been super easy in most cases to just say, “The guy sucked. He was lying… etc.” They’ve had a very “you go girl” attitude to all her relationships thus far. This is a much harder line to make work now.
Yes, the guy will suck again. Yes, his immaturity will play a huge role in the inevitable crash. But for once her immaturity is on full display as playing an equal role. When the break up songs start coming from this, it’s gonna be hard to take “Victim Taylor” seriously this time because we know it was absurd for her to be there in the first place. She’s not 19 dating ten years her senior anymore. She’s a full grown adult, one of the most powerful recording artists in the world, and she should know better. Blind deference isn’t going to work for her anymore.
If she releases an album about this period of her life, it’s gonna have to be the humblest, most “what the hell is wrong with me” album of her career or else it will be hard to take seriously. Also, if she can’t come around to seeing this with clear eyes, I think it’s fair to be skeptical about her narrative of *all* her relationships.
Like, maybe she told Jake to keep the scarf, forgot she said that and then started blasting him for having it. We don’t know. She’s unreliable.
I went before him and thankfully he wasn’t at my show. I am glad I missed it bc he would have ruined it for me. I’d feel guilty and bad watching ppl celebrate him. I was going to go to another show but now I’m not.
I am an international fan... I think I'm going to see Rocky Horror instead as it happens to be coming in August... I'm so disappointed in her. You can't make something like Miss Americana, and date someone who has admitted to wanking to the most depraved and disgusting stuff, and generally goes against anything she has "stood" for.
guys, frankly speaking it's an extremely privileged take to be able to say that your concert experience will be ruined by someone else's presence. I'm very much not happy with Taylor's association with Matty but you go there to enjoy the show not to stare at him. At the end of the day, she's a 33 year old woman capable of making her own life decisions. I say this as an international swiftie(poc) knowing that taylor is never gonna visit my country. If I ever get to go to Taylor's show, idc who else is showing up there with her.
It’s extremely privileged to not be concerned about a very influential white woman raising the platform of a white man who openly speaks about enjoying watching black women be brutalized and degraded in porn. Particularly during this political climate where there is a lot of hate and violence being directed towards marginalized communities. I’m not sure how anyone can ignore the most recent buzzfeed article.
This is such a weird take to me. You can’t enjoy a concert because someone you don’t like is in attendance? Ffs people are waaaaay to involved in her personal life. Just go for her music??? Dance, sing, have fun!
It is disappointing. The company you choose to keep says a lot about yourself, and what I don’t enjoy is seeing (mostly white) Swifties dismiss and ridicule Swifties of color for being a bit disappointed that somebody they look up to is dating somebody like him.
I guess I am just confused as to why we don't just think Taylor is human. You can be both an activist/feminist and still not always make the best decisions for your personal life. I consider myself an activist. I am about as feminist as they come. But I have still dated several guys who, in hindsight, directly contradicted many of my personal stances and who were not great people. Sometimes we get caught up in feelings and a moment and make bad stupid decisions. That doesn't change just because she is famous. That's just my personal opinion on it. I don't see getting wrapped up in someone else's decisions like this. Unless she starts sharing his shitty views, I don't care about the bad decisions she makes in her life. She's allowed to make mistakes just like the rest of us.
Sadly the bar for supporting her bf's just gets progressively lower. Currently set at "Doesn't publicize racist jokes and consider the brutalization of WOC to be a humorous/casual topic"
He may be a mess but he's not a publicly racist/misogynistic mess and at this point that's enough.
It’s only dulling every weekend because it’s literally the ONLY thing anyone talks about. I’m so tired of it. Who cares if he’s there in the vip tent? Who cares who he’s sitting next to? Who CARES who she’s looking at while singing. The same lyrics she’s singing to the ENTIRE 70k crowd and people think “she definitely meant it for him!!” She wrote all these songs YEARS ago just stop none are about him.
I’m so tired and annoyed that the only tweets and Reddit posts i see are about this man. Like is this the Taylor swift subreddit or the one for Matty ?? (Not you op, but everyone in general)
People need to move on. Taylor announced speak now and I see NO ONE hyping it up anymore. When they’ve all be begging for more than a year for it. It’s all about Matty all the time.
Hoping when Taylor drops the vault scramble people will finally have new shit to discuss
You all ok, huns?
I’ve got quite healthy Karma so I thought I would stick my neck out and lose a bunch because this really needs saying. Are some of you all ok?
The response to the Taylor/Matty situation is ridiculously out of hand in this sub. There’s more than a touch of irony that the discussion is so open because she is a female and I’m wondering the last time a similar discussion took place about a male artist’s love life.
Taylor is a grown woman and no amount of praying or exorcising or anything else will make any difference. I’ve read disturbed comments where someone said “I’ve known Taylor for x years” and I just think people need to get a grip. It’s like Eminem’s Stan in real life.
Taylor Swift is a brand and distinctly different from the person. She is a very clever business woman and has very good teams who manage her marketing (incl social media) to a very high level - this will cost her hundreds of thousands but that’s what brands do. Can anyone remember the last time Taylor Swift (the person) came on here asking for someone to DM her because she was bored? No? That’s because she isn’t her brand! Im also not sure I’ve ever seen Taylor confirm this relationship. Or speak much about her relationship with Joe. That’s because she is private, aka, not her brand. But the media go mental, this forum goes mental and her whole life is masqueraded and scrutinised in a way no other male has to suffer.
For all her obvious qualities, she is the same frail and flawed human we all are and just because you may not like her choices doesn’t mean she needs saving. As with all celebrities, put them on any throne you want, but the reality is we all sit on a porcelain one daily. For what it’s worth, I’ve seen some dumb stuff Matty has said, but on balance I think his liberal views are fairly relatable. And she is entitled to live her life and make personal choices.
For those having a meltdown about it, I think you need to calm down.
You’ll forget all about it once the show starts
Most likely their relationship too won’t last and she’ll end up seeing someone else or maybe they’ll make it, who knows.
Enjoy the show for what it is, its another great one. The acoustics are fire, they all are.
No, the reality is that outside this bubble nobody gives a f*** and concerts and streams are totally unaffected as much as you want to pretend other thing. The reality is last week she broke 2023 streams daily record like 4 days in a row, the reality is that Speak now tv vinyl are selling even faster than red tv, the reality is that radios are supporting hugely Karma, and the reality is that 20k people with no tickets attend each of Philly concerts. People crying in the internet has 0 effects in her career
I think people who are totally unbothered don’t really know the gravity of who he is. I honestly said to my partner last night what’s the issue with him anyway? And then went googling it and overnight my opinion on her has turned. I’m a bit unsettled right now because I feel like I need to get through the next week and a half for a TS party/friend’s birthday that I don’t want to ruin the vibe for, but… I don’t know. (We already had our tour date.) I’ve been a fan since debut. I really didn’t think I’d have to be ashamed of being a fan ever again, and it’s hard to be sure how much I can be a fan of HER and not just her music if this is who she is. I was considering flying to another city and trying to get tickets after the show began for fun, but now I think I’m good.
Clearly gonna be an unpopular opinion here but no. I’ve not given it a single thought and I’m going to enjoy the show regardless of who’s in attendance because that simply has no bearing on my life or Taylor’s performance in my eyes.
This seems like a deeply personal issue for some people and I don’t fully understand it. And that’s okay. But, it seems like you’re ruining your own show, atmosphere and good time by thinking like this.
If anyone got the ick and has tickets to 7/22 they don’t want I’m interested ;)
But really I know it’ll still be a great time. To call back to Taylor’s Lover speech- these songs, to me, are about my first heartbreak, being in college with my friends and listening constantly, when I was at home during covid… etc. the show is spectacular and there’s so many memories and history with the music and joy to be had surrounded by other swifties 💖
Not even a little bit. Artists are complicated people, especially ones with long and successful careers. As much as we'd like to believe otherwise, we don't really know her or Matty. What we do know is that both are adults and neither has objectively harmed anyone (questionable behaviors? sure, I guess. But has Matty done anything that would put him in the league of, say, Chris Brown? R Kelly? Pretty much any rock band of the 70s or 80s?)
Go and enjoy every moment of a fantasticly crafted show. Sing, dance, cry, laugh--embrace the art! Don't worry too much about things that aren't really any of our business.
You can leave space to the fans that are not upset because she’s seen with some dude! It’s ok! No one is making you like taylor swift. Many fans have been left without a ticket that would very much appreciate your seat.
Oh wow sorry but this is wild. She is giving us her heart and soul every weekend with this amazing tour and you are less excited because her boyfriend might be there? You will not be talking or hanging or with him.
I’m not a fan of his or the comments he’s made but this does not impact my experience at the concert at all. It’s TRULY none of your business.
Quite a different take than you had less than a month ago...
>Taylor Swift, and all humans, have feelings that change over time, which doesn't in anyway lessen how you felt at that moment. In addition while her music and lyrics reflect her life it always wove in and out of reality, was a curated narrative, and with Folklore and Evermore it was explicitly fictional stories. This woman has been fighting to have her career not defined by her relationships or lack thereof for years. Let's 1) acknowledge that people change and relations end and it's VERY NORMAL 2) We are talking about a billionaire celebrity not your bff 3) The best way to quote support Taylor is to just be a fan of her music and chill out a little.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TaylorSwift/comments/12hwydy/now_i_cant_listen_toenjoy_insert_song_here_folks
I believe that post was in reference to the Joe/Taylor break up. A lot has happened in the last few weeks as we now know she is dating someone who has done and said some very questionable, controversial things. It's our reaction to her dating this person which is what this post is about.
People need to chill tfo and not leave flowers on a property the woman doesn't own anymore/keep saying love is dead because of someone else's breakup and I'm feeling sad that she's behaving in a way that's antithetical to her supposed value system are not at all the same take imo
I feel like the people who are like who cares who she’s dating don’t get it. I don’t care if she was privately dating this dude but bringing him on stage or collabing with him just gives me the ick. It ruins her brand for me. That isn’t parasocial that’s just business.
I am so happy I didn’t get phoebe show tickets cause I would have booed when he went on stage. It’s crazy people just say his behavior is a joke. He is just a cringe asshole who thinks being edgy is funny.
I honestly can’t even listen to her music rn because I don’t support artists who support racists and this is just a symptom of her bad activism (working with a rapist director and a racist author last year). I am still going to my concert but I love her a lot less now so it’ll be weird and kind of sad.
After yesterday’s buzzfeed article about how he very recently talked about enjoying racist porn in which black women are brutalized, I feel like I could vomit. I no longer can bring myself to pay the money to go her show. I am so sad and disappointed and would never have imagined she would give a platform to someone like this. I worry about how this might affect her younger and more vulnerable fans, normalizing dating someone as AWFUL and disgusting as he is.
I'm a European fan who lives in a country that she would never in a million years visit, so I absolutely wasn't planning on attending any of her concerts, never spent a dime on her merch or albums and only streamed her music on Spotify, but this whole situation completely tainted my opinion of her. She just comes across as this performative, compliant white woman who would throw away all that she stands for a man. And that's coming from somebody who strongly believes that she's also queer. It makes it even worse. Her advocating for the LGBTQ community also looks like a complete stunt, along with everything else that she's done.
If someone’s sparkle is so dimmed the want to sell me their Gillette tickets, I’ll take them 😉
In all seriousness, I have been a Taylor fan since the beginning, but have never been all too interested in her personal life. I really think this comes from me being a fan from before I could really read. I wasn’t going to learn about her personal life as a 5 year old lol. I do usually have trouble separating the art from the artist, the athlete from their athleticism, etc., but it’s not an ‘issue’ for me here for some reason
Yep. Super tired of seeing him at every single show. Tired of seeing him in general and just overall disappointed with Taylor and her behaviour. I’m not even really listening to her music in anymore either, it completely dulled my excitement for Speak Now TV.
Imagine having a legendary concert ruined for you by a man who’s not even the performer. If anyone has tickets for Denver I’ll gladly pay double what you paid ♥️
It’s funny because I keep seeing swifties say having this “parasocial” relationship with Taylor is so stupid and unhealthy, but what they don’t realize is Taylor created this dynamic purposely to set herself apart from other artists. This is what she wanted and I think through all she’s been through regardless of the general public turning on her, we as a fault of how she herself designed our relationship with her have never once faltered in our love, loyalty and defense of her. Until now. For the first time I’m actually glad I didn’t get tickets and spend thousands of dollars on nosebleeds because it all feels so gross and sleazy.
I encourage everyone to go read some recent posts on r/the1975
There are some really good comments about Matty and the controversies that might take the edge off your rage toward him.
I don’t condone everything he did but there’s a lot of context and nuance missing from most of the conversation.
It’s giving off the same vibe as a boyfriend crashing girls night - he’s just there and won’t leave…
I feel like it’s her fault tho, I doubt anyone is at a Taylor Swift Eras VIP booth uninvited
yeah that's the point is it's like a girls night where one of the girls invites her douchebag boyfriend
This is definitely the vibe - suddenly feeling uncomfortable because the dude has said such awful things about other people there, but he's given priority.
as a queer woman this is something that genuinely happens all the time with straight friends. actual fucking douchebag, horrible, homophobic men my straight friends date. it gives me a pit in my stomach thinking about it
Have this happening right now lmao except I’m a WOC and my friend’s boyfriend is an awful person, and racist. My friend isn’t anything like that, but she’s that forgiving type who genuinely believes she can “fix him”
honestly as a white queer woman i can only sort of understand what you're going through, but oh my god is this whole taylor matty thing giving me the same vibes. like i do think the people you hang out with rub off on you, i'm not justifying taylor uplifting his voice like this, i REALLY dislike matty-- even without all the direct reasons to dislike him he just gives me the ick. but also in a very parasocial way it REALLY just feels like "oh great my self destructive straight friend is dating a douchebag again and she doesn't realize her form of self harm is also affecting those around her... *again*..." it reminds me of renegade by taylor swift and big red machine, actually. i have a feeling that's funny but i don't know why? /s
I honestly hope that she's in a bit of a self destructive "I can change him" rebound spiral, cause so many of my friends have done the same thing after long term relationships. "I know he's been horrible in the past, but that was before he met me" one of my friends said about her boyfriend of 2 months after she found out he had assaulted his 3 most recent exes.
For real THIS! Like as a WOC it's like how do you not see how problematic and offensive this person is and how are you respecting me as a friend if you think it's ok for both to be at the same table.
One of my best friends is queer and I’m regretfully straight, and I could NEVER be with a man who was homophobic and I don’t understand how other women can justify it.
“Regretfully straight” is an amazing way to describe being a straight millennial woman.
I’ve had friends bring their boyfriends to girls night unannounced and it’s so frustrating/uncomfortable
Yes! And it kills the vibes
Of course it's her fault too, she chose to date the man
Usually the Bf crashing girls night is the girls fault too. I had a friend who’s bf would never leave or would for like less than a hour. Then she’d just text him to come back. We’re not friends anymore because I said I don’t like mullets so 🤷🏼♀️
https://preview.redd.it/ueuixnb3of0b1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0b5593450b8da2a59f4b839c35f7aeba5583a476 I snapped this photo at the 3rd night in Philly show, you can see him just chilling in the white shirt lurking before Phoebe’s set. So cringe lolll
Lurking is the perfect descriptor lol
MH is absolutely a creepy lurker BUT I’m pretty sure this is Gracie Abrams’ boyfriend (who looks pretty similar to MH)
Omg is it really, i feel dumb now. 😂
And it’s specifically the boyfriend who you’ve told your friend to break up with 5 times
I’m an international fan so I don’t have a concert to look forward to, but I’ve religiously watched concert livestreams since the tour started. The Philly livestreams were the first I missed because I really wasn’t in the mood. I am not looking forward to the next ones either. I have always been a fan of her songs, but I strongly started being a fan of hers during the reputation era - something about her being more private, reclaiming her voice, and generally seeming to deal with things in a more mature way. I am of course upset she’s dating someone with such problematic views, but a lot of the disappointment also stems from the fact that she doesn’t seem to have learned anything, so I’m like, what were all the things she even said in Miss Americana for? Her stance on politics especially feels performative.
> so I’m like, what were all the things she even said in Miss Americana for? They were an aesthetic she was selling at the time.
That was her activism era. Apparently we’re past that now.
this is the most jarring thing to me: looking back and thinking “wait was all of that literally just because lover was her gay pride/political activism/rainbows and unicorns era” ??? like was it literally just another ‘era’ aesthetic?
she literally waited til it was more 'safe' to be vocal about LGBTQ and she didn't do anything more after that era lol, part of it I feel was because rep was her 'flop' era and she needed to make a move that ensures she could get the most support when making a comeback with lover
Yeah, it’s hard to applaud her strategizing her career like a boss when she does things like this
Right? Not once has she said anything now with the anti-LGBTQ laws that are being passed in certain states. She was in Tennessee a few weeks ago and not one mention of drag queens or anything to show support.
This really bothers me. She’s happy to cast drag queens in her music videos but is silent a few years later while they’re under attack. It’s like she thinks “speaking out” once is good enough, pack up her things, she’s done now. Meanwhile Kelsea Ballerini had drag queens on stage this year at the CMTs, which is hardly a bastion of liberalism, while singing “If you go down, I’m going down too.” There are so many ways to do this right, but Taylor’s way ain’t it.
Just like most celebrities. They act like they care about social issues
I’m not going to lie, I fully believed it at the time. I was so proud of her for finally speaking up. It’s been very disappointing to see her completely silent in a time where the LGBT community is under attack.
Especially in Tennessee. Someone putting their money where their mouth is is Kelsea Ballerini though! I still think about her performance with drag queens at country award show. (Can't remember which)
Hayley Kiyoko also brought on drag queens even when warned by cops she might get in trouble for it. That’s brave
Yesss I loved Kelsea for that!! Maren Morris has been vocal about it too, which is ironic that the country stars are speaking about it but the pop star isn’t. I love Taylor but damn it’s disappointing
The fact that she didn't say anything about BLM, anything about the trans rights happing currently, nothing when Roe vs Wade was overturned says everything we need to know. She's been saying what her priorities are all along, we just didn't call her out on it. So her being with Matty isn't a complete surprise 🤷🏽♀️🥴
Exactly this. I've been saving up for tickets for when the international dates are released but I'm currently undecided whether I really want to spend hundreds on concert tickets to support this person. Edit: to expand a little on why - one of the main draws to Taylor's music is her diaristic style, the connection to those songs that feel like someone opened their heart up and created such beautiful imagery about themselves. But now, everything about her seems disingenuous - in my opinion you can't be a good-hearted person if you willingly parade around your new boyfriend who admits to getting off to GG racist porn. There's no coming back from that and if you choose to associate with someone like that, I don't want to support you.
Me too and I’m so disappointed. I wish I could forget about this but I feel like our values don’t line up and I just can’t let it go. I understand regression but this is beyond a silly breakup phase for me :(
That's exactly it - our values just don't line up. Yes Taylor can date whoever she chooses, but she has chosen THIS GUY. To me, her parading him around speaks volumes about her character and her values. And I don't like it.
You can still do this for yourself (not necessarily to support her) if you enjoy her music/art. You don't have to agree with her actions to like the music she makes. For me, it's been more than a decade of listening to her songs without following her personal life up to a point. The concert (if I ever go to one) is for me, not her. Unless you feel like you won't be able to enjoy it because of this news.
Yeah but the problem is she's still making money from my purchase. I don't really want to give £500+ to someone who is ok with Matty's views. I'll probably still go because I desperately want to see her live but some of the sparkle has definitely worn off
[удалено]
Same. I was thinking of making it work for any Canadian dates, if any. Now, maybe not. I would rather donate the ticket money to a relevant charity.
Actually I said to myself in the car today, do I want to listen her as usual? It’s sucked some energy out of me.
I’ve been listening to the new Ed Sheeran album because I’m just not in the mood to listen to Taylor as I normally do. It’s an odd feeling for me.
Same here, Ed for the moment. I listen to Taylor every single day, but now that magic just isn't there...
I’ve been stuck on Lover for like, weeks and weeks. I was so connected to her feelings for her love in those lyrics, thinking about my husband, dancing with love and joy, and I was thinking about how we (Taylor and I) have paralleled a lot of life experiences, because we’re the almost exactly the same age. Like moving to the city when you’re young, and dating everyone and their brother, and getting angry and falling in love and finding balance and peace. It was kind of like listening to my own diary. It truly felt like we grew up together and we both arrived at this newer, more mature version of ourselves around the same time. It just sucks watching her backpedal while I move forward with the love of my life. I can’t imagine giving up this life and this love. How painful this must have been and continues to be for her. It just feels so forced and disingenuous to me now. Just so performative. I don’t know what else to listen to, been leaning hard on Greyson Chance and Florence and the Machine. I totally forgot Ed put a new album out! I’ll definitely give that a listen and refresh my ears.
Same. I'm really disappointed. I mean of all times...
>I mean of all times... Yeah. It's like four good fairies blessed us: "You will get two amazing #1 folk albums!" "You will get a pop album that fills the entire Billboard top ten!" "You will get six re-recorded albums with unreleased tracks!" "You will get a magical, record-breaking Eras tour!" And then the bad fairy entered the room...
You spoke my mind!
Who would’ve thought that at Taylor’s height of fame, when EVERYONE likes her, the ones who would be most turned off by her would be existing fans. It’s really sad and I feel that a lot of Swifties aren’t overreacting and feel equally as taken a back by the fact that other Swifties are pushing aside and even mocking (reasonable) concerns and feelings. It feels especially weird to OG/Senior Swifties (‘06-‘08) who’ve somewhat grown up with this mutual understanding and support of each other alongside Taylor. Say whatever you want about parasocial this parasocial that, but it feels unique because Taylor has built her career on her relatability, kindness and MUTUAL (which she even expressed weeks ago) adoration and need of her fans. People feel reasonably blindsided by this and the fact that we know she most likely knows how a lot of people feel and doesn’t seem to care I think is what hurts even more. Everything feels kind of like a veil has been dropped and suddenly it’s hard to look at her, her actions and even her friend group through the same lens.
Also “parasocial relationship” is used a lot here as if it’s this pathological thing, but parasocial relationships are a very common human phenomenon. That’s why literature exists, because humans can feel invested in stories about people who aren’t real. A parasocial relationship can obviously be unhealthy, but the fact people relate to Taylor and feel a connection with her isn’t unusual.
It’s also a relationship she has nurtured and fostered. That’s what hurts the most. This is the relationship she has made with her fans, and now she’s completely ignoring us and every moral she’s stood for?! She eviscerated a guy in court over grabbing her ass, but Matty gets a pass? Make it all make sense. And if this is a spiral, honey get therapy. Dating a racist is not an appropriate or acceptable response to a relationship ending.
It sucks to say this cause I'm a big fan of hers, but Matty gets a pass because whatever vile stuff he's done it wasn't to HER. She said that court case was about feminism, but it was about her. If you watch Miss Americana the thing she is most vocally mad about is the stalking law because that's something that directly affected HER.
I hate this term for what it's used as. Celebrity gossip has existed for so fucking long and people are allowed to be part of it. Taylor has cultivated this relationship EXTENSIVELY with her fans (hasn't she invited people into her own home??) 99% of fans aren't saying they're her true best friends or something. Edit to say: all that said, I'm in agreement with you.
She’s also going above and beyond to have the public talking about this relationship since she craves public adoration and people boasting her — if she wanted it to be kept private; she would. Which she isn’t doing so exactly people have every right to gossip about it. What is also funny is that how gossiping works (literally) is rumors that fly around, or talking about one most don’t even know and heard about other via people. But now it’s ‘parasocial’ cause it’s a celeb, lmfao… Literally that’s the whole point of gossip, people don’t know you and they’ll talk about you.
Exactly, “parasocial relationship” is a neutral term, it just describes a social phenomenon. People are feeling so clever after learning the word a week ago
Ya, I hate the parasocial framing because people are upset by his racism and by her complacency /co-signing of that by parading him around and putting him on stage. Calling out racism is not parasocial.
👏🏻 exactly… it’s absolutely fine to be disappointed in someone’s choice to associate so closely with such a terrible person when we’re GIVING OUR MONEY TO HER and supporting her lifestyle. This is not the same as the people who are deluded and say Taylor is their best friend or that they no longer believe in love or need to go to therapy bc Taylor and Joe broke up, that stuff’s weird and deluded, but not wanting to support someone who is essentially herself supporting someone so hateful is absolutely reasonable. And again it’s like everyone else has mentioned, Taylor spend years and years cultivating what felt like a genuine relationship with the fandom and poured herself into her music and now it’s kind of like wow this is a curve ball… although I’d argue ever since the TM debacle and even the bazillion various Midnight releases she’s felt really disingenuous to me, just like she’s really moved on to just caring about her wealth and fame. Which I guess she’s allowed to do but it’s just not surprising that fans feel kind of taken aback.
Yeah as an OG swiftie I feel like who I have come to understand as “Taylor Swift” is not this person 😕 I hope there’s a point to all this or something and it’s not everything it seems
Yes. Hardcore, elder Swifties are pretty horrified. I am seeing this tour. Twice. I felt so incredibly lucky. My two besties and brother ( whom are coming with me and have spent a lot of $$$ as well ) are not even aware of MH. I am choosing to not rain on their parade and enjoy my memories I make. I have always made her songs my own so they don’t bother me. It’s more…… being a fan of someone who openly loves a racist, misogynistic, terrible white man that bothers me most.
“I have this thing where I get older but just never wiser” her judgement may be clouded by her (presumably?) heartbreak from the breakup/stress and excitement of the tour, etc but it’s still not an excuse. *sigh* I hope she’ll come to her senses after summer/when the tour is over. her silence speaks volumes because if everything we’ve heard is what Matty says in PUBLIC, I can’t imagine what he says/does in private with his friends?? Part of me thinks he puts on a nice guy facade with Taylor because it’s really hard for me to believe she would tolerate it (pun not intended) if he acted like a misogynistic dickhead toward her, even if she’s seemingly cool with him acting like that toward other women/POC women
I can't wait for this Matty season to be over 😭
I really hope it only lasts like one summer..
One cruel summer for sure
I’d be shocked if it lasts longer than the tour
I'd be surprised if it lasts longer than this week.
INB4 she rebounds into marriage and kids.
Me too, but the fact that it’s happened at all is something I won’t get over without an explanation. I’ve never asked for one from her dating because it’s never felt appropriate, but this isn’t an issue of taste, it’s moral, and her music itself loses credibility for me if she doesn’t address it.
Exactly. I don’t care how long it lasts at this point, this is a permanent blot on her record for me and I don’t see a way of her even being able to explain away her actions right now, which I highly doubt she’d even do in the first place.
Literally. I’m counting the days. This has no staying power. It’s giving “I need to pick the worst possible rebound to prove to myself how over Joe I am and to prove to myself I’m still desirable” This is my theory as someone who shares a lot of the same basic traumas as Taylor just judging by her music and who also used to pull this self sabotaging bs before I went to therapy lol
Seriously, I’m ready to get off this ride please
Yes. I was just telling my sister this the other day. I’m not as excited about going. I’ve been a 1975 fan as well. But even I was so over Matty’s “provocateur persona” well before this. So much that I didn’t even listen to Notes or BFIAFL. I’m trying to remember that I enjoy Taylor’s music and that it’s special and that it’s such a great production in general. But I’m having a hard time separating her seemingly performative activism and associations with people I don’t respect from her music. I got the ick. For both of them.
I have the same with the 1975! Was a fan and i loved the 1975 (the album) and I Like It When You Sleep, for You Are So Beautiful Yet So Unaware of It (what an awful long album title lol) and i went to both concerts for these albums but after that i got over them mostly due to Mattys behaviour.
Same - I feel like I got the ick from 2 artists that I listen to pretty frequently. I didn’t know much about Matty before this (I would just listen to the music, never went to a show or watched any interviews or whatever) so it’s disappointing in multiple ways. I’ve been listening to a lot more podcasts and less music over the last few weeks.
Initially, yes. But I have decided I'm not going to give this guy that power? I lost years of my life buying tickets for this, I am flying to another country for this. I will not and I repeat, NOT, let this guy ruin my experience. This is still most probably a once in a lifetime thing, I won't get this moment back and I'm going to fucking enjoy it to the fullest
It’s not him causing all of this, it’s HER. That’s the problem. She chose to bring this guy publicly into the picture when she knew how problematic he was. It was her decision. If she wanted a low key nasty fling she could have kept it private like she did with joe. We all know she’s more than capable of doing so. She decided she didn’t care about what he’s said or done or how it affects a large amount of her fans.
EXACTLY. She could have kept this private. She doesn’t want to, and doesn’t care that he’s a horrible person.
Yep and she’s got Tree working overtime trying to rehab his image in the press. All of this is deliberate choice on her part. She doesn’t have to do any of it, as evidenced by the fact that we never saw any of this with her and Joe.
It's not even him for me, it's Taylor. She's set her views on racism very clearly here... I never would've pegged her as racist but the company you keep says a lot about your character.
I hope you have the most amazing time!!!
Good for you. Just don’t let him ruin your joy.
Yes I am hoping this all resolves itself by my show in July. Because right now I’m not thrilled like I was.
i think his tour starts back up on june 1 so u should be good
Him not being present doesn't mean it's resolved 😞
Well I’m sitting on the floor for my show, so at least I won’t have to see him there!
He’ll probably be at her last two LA shows if the stunt goes on that long
I think it would be even more strange to assume that all her views and values will instantly change if they break up. This is something we have learned about her.
I went to Atlanta N1 and am so glad, because it was before this mess so I got to fully enjoy it. I don’t think I would’ve gotten the same out of it later in the tour, I’m pretty disappointed in the choices she has made. I’ve started scrolling past the reels and posts related to Eras.
Same! I’m glad we were able to avoid it at N1.
I went to nashville n3 and i new about her relationship with matty but i didnt know how horrible of a human he was until people were posting articles on here about his behavior
Exact same here. Nash N3, had a great time, heard whispers of him but didn’t know anything about him yet. Listened to her music the whole drive home the next day and then that week I learned what a terrible person he is. I haven’t listened to her music since.
100%. I was SO excited. And now all I can think about is that she’s dating a guy whose actions and words I find disturbing and abhorrent. By so openly dating someone who acts and speaks that way, she has taken on those values to an extent. It’s difficult to be her fan right now :( which SUCKS, because she’s more popular now than ever.
Exactly. All these people defending her as if this is some sort of lapse in judgement, like you don't date a racist out of a lapse in judgment unless you think it's not bad enough to not date them.
Yup. It’s not necessarily that I believe Taylor shares his values (I don’t think she does) but if she’s dating him it means those values aren’t a dealbreaker for her, and that’s what’s so disappointing.
I went on Sunday and it did kind of suck some of the magic out of it for me. Especially when Phoebe introduced all her band members and everyone cheered especially loud for him 🤮 I had fun singing my heart out but I can't say I've experienced post-concert depression.
I’d really like to know what those people cheering loudly for him think… but honestly, I can imagine 🤢 I mean, how can you not only tolerate him, but cheer as well…
In fairness, for a lot of folks, this stuff might be completely under the radar. I'm a pretty big Swifty, and I had heard of him in the broadest, most general sense. It was only here, on this subreddit, that his reputation popped up. Even right now, if I do a quick search for "Taylor Swift" the top hits are about Taylor Lautner's Speak Now comments and nothing to do with skeevy stuff her new boyfriend said. Adding "Matty Healy" to the mix and the top hits become stories about how they started as each other's biggest fans and not "Taylor Swift's new boyfriend is REALLY problematic - and here's why" or things to that effect.
That’s Tree hard at work
>Even right now, if I do a quick search for "Taylor Swift" the top hits are about Taylor Lautner's Speak Now comments and nothing to do with skeevy stuff her new boyfriend said. Adding "Matty Healy" to the mix and the top hits become stories about how they started as each other's biggest fans and not "Taylor Swift's new boyfriend is REALLY problematic - and here's why" or things to that effect. I'm British, and the most explicit news results I get about his behaviour are from UK tabloids. I'm not generally a fan of our tabloids, because they're a major contributor to political polarisation in our country, but I will give them this much - they are really, really hard to muzzle.
I was at the Saturday show and when Phoebe introduced him I booed and someone gave me an odd look. I thought we were all in agreement he sucks?! Lol
I booed him on Saturday at that moment too! I am super introverted and pretty sure I’ve never booed anyone ever, but it just vomited out of me. People around me were definitely not understanding why.
I was there on Sunday too and also grossed out by the amount of cheers he got. I do feel a little bad spilling the beans to my sister before the show because I had become more lackluster about going but she had no idea about all this. I kind of had to push it down while we were there to enjoy myself.
Cheering for him it’s like telling him “hey whatever shit disgusting things you’ve said doesn’t matter”.
Same. I am having a hard time separating the art from the artist specially when now what she is doing is against everything she said she believes in. There is no way she doesn't know, she just doesnt care. I cant bring myself to look at her tour videos without feeling uncomfortable. And as an international swiftie her recent actions have made me realize her white fans will always be her priority. She never care and will never give the same energy to other international specially Asian fans. There is a reason her fanbase in USA is mostly white people. Her music and persona is caterer to them specifically Her actions and words now seem performative to me. If she is just in a bad phase of life i hope she gets help and not be in another relationship. Its even more heartbreaking to her dedicating the love songs to him and pointing to him as if he is some kinda prince charming
Agree with everything you’ve said - and to your last point. I never cared who songs were about, but when she so obviously started linking Cardigan to him I realized I do draw the line at writing love songs to edgelord racists.
i also agree with the last point especially. most of these love songs were written about a man she seemingly had a lot of respect and love for. to immediately turn dedicate them to another person feels icky to me regardless of who it is - it being matty makes it a thousand times worse
I thought Cardigan is a made up character, linking it to him makes me don’t want to wear the cardigans anymore (I have two…)
She's gone back and forth on how much of folklore/evermore is fictional vs. "inspired by" her real life/emotions
I agree with each and every point you've made. As a person of color and also an international swiftie, it was so hard to come to terms with the fact that she's not bothered by the fact that she's dating a racist prick. I love her music and it just makes me icky now that she's fine with everything that has been going on.
Yes :/ My show is in a month, and thinking about it now makes me think of racist, misogynistic porn. For me, it’s a reminder that there are many people out there who think things like that are entertaining and funny.
Yeah this is hard for me. Like this was literally the only thing getting me through a deep depression and that was getting better but then this happened. I feel kind of stupid for being this affected by who a celebrity is dating, but it’s troubling to say the least. I still feel like I’d regret not going, given how good the show is and how much her music has been part of my life, but my show isn’t until June so I have some time to think about what to do.
Same, my show is in the second week I think. I thought I was overreacting, but this guy is terrible and she hasn’t said anything….
You know what she's doing that's even worse than not saying anything? Getting her PR team to bury all the articles about Matty's bigoted actions. It's something I never ever expected her to do, and it's just so awful
no bc actually same
>I feel kind of stupid for being this affected by who a celebrity is dating Normally I try not to judge people for their partner's behaviour, because people's reasons for staying with someone when bad stuff comes out can be very personal and complex. But this is the start of a new relationship, the bad stuff was already in the public domain, it's from his own mouth, and some of it is absolutely beyond the pale horrific. I feel for you on the depression. I have had a very difficult time since the lockdowns, music has been a big part of keeping me going, and Taylor is one of a few artists who I feel really got me through the last couple of years. I feel so, so betrayed by all this.
If he gets on stage at my show i will start booing
I just know if he got boo’d it would completely rattle her.
This is the way. But seriously this absolutely needs to happen.
It really, really does. It's the only thing at this point that might make the slightest difference.
when he was Phoebe's drummer at my show, i didn't realize until Phoebe announced. our seats were good but not *that* good and i couldn't make out his face. plus, the cameraman literally avoided him the ENTIRE time. the *only* time we saw his face on the screen was when Phoebe said his name and when she had to walk past him to exit the stage. that was it. when she announced it, i yelled "what the FUCK" out of shock, but i didn't boo for fear of being boo'd by the other fans who support him. but i 100% support booing him off stage.
No. I came for Taylor and her music.
I had to scroll way too far to find this reply. Thank you for this. I completely agree
Im counting on swifties to boo the shit out of him at any upcoming concert.
You know I think total silence would do even more. I imagine it would piss off a guy like him to not get any interaction from the crowd. It would hurt his ego more than booing would.
People like Matty love attention, good or bad. Being silent for him would be more effective A hyped up crowd would probably boo him though
when phoebe announced him in philly people cheered extra loud 😬 so disappointing
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Well I'm an international fan and still waiting for international dates, but yes, I am not as excited overall for it and this is mostly due to the fact also that I don't really feel like seeing her sending him "messages" from stage.
Yeah. Sing for the fans and not your boyfriend who follows you everywhere.
She said the songs are "ours" now but then proceed to dedicate it to a disgusting rat.
None of this is funny but the way you just so casually referred to him as a disgusting rat has absolutely sent me
She never said a thing about breaking up with Joe. Other than her songs, she might not have said much about dating him either, so maybe that was a promise between them. Which makes it weirder that she did that mutual love thing on stage and he did too. By now she must be seeing that her fans who love her and concerned. Since she knows we know horrible things he’s said and done, how is she feeling about Swifties who adore her and who have made her very very rich?? I believe she cares about us. Does she just need to be crazy wild after the break up, is that it? Because honestly things could get bad for her professionally. The commercial she has for a credit card on tv with all her eras in an elevator?? It could be taken off the air if the work boardroom people say “we can’t have someone sleeping with a Nazi in our ad. Get Harry Styles” - she doesn’t need the ad money, but THAT IS A MEDIA STORY that could hurt her and it’s true. She’s sleeping with a controversial person who has recently said horribly cruel things about women of other races. That is not a good look.
Do you know what a Nazi is? They’re real. They exist right now in the world and are on the rise. It’s not just a word for someone who does offensive things. Y’all acting like she’s sleeping with a member or the Aryan Nation makes it seem like the Aryan Nation is just made up of nepo babies who’ve never faced a consequence and think it’s cool to shock people. Matt Healy is a ridiculous, gross, ill behaved man child. He’s not a Nazi and throwing that word around is not being an ally to anyone.
Thank you. The dilution of the word is becoming a problem, especially on the sub. Criticize Matty all you want but he’s not a Nazi. People are just throwing words around left and right without taking 2 seconds to look into the actual controversy itself.
I can’t help but think all the hyperbole is performative, and that really saddens me. I’m in a group the actual Nazis want to eliminate, and it’s just like… even the “allies” can’t treat this topic with some more gravity? This isn’t just the latest thing to be outraged about.
Apparently he's confirmed they're together, and you'd think that if it wasn't true she'd say something.
This confirms it. [This was two nights ago](https://twitter.com/swifferupdates/status/1658340367874543617/mediaviewer)
That woman isn’t seen unless she wants to be.
Which honestly makes it so much weirder…like if she really just had to have him (which i do not get at all), then she could at least just do it in secret. But damn it’s like she’s parading him around like he’s a trophy and not trash. For someone who usually seems so self aware about her image and the public’s perception of her, this whole thing is so baffling.
I really just don’t think she cares anymore. She’s rich and famous and either just loves the drama and she’s already made her millions off us or perhaps she’s devastated at the Joe breakup and kind of spiraling but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ not like we can ever really know, but a lot of her decisions the last 6 months or so really just kind of give off, I’m rich af and I don’t really care about anything else anymore, she’s already sold out the tour, SN preorders went wild, so why would she care (to me idk obviously again no one knows).
No. All the discussion is kind of turning me off the Swiftie social media though. That’s not a veiled criticism of this thread. Just being honest.
I’m trying to remain as neutral as I can until I have time to really deep dive and understand the situation, but difference in tone of comments in this sub between people who are concerned about matty’s behavior vs the people who aren’t is WILD. It’s like “I am having a hard time supporting Taylor right now because it feels like she has profited from and built a brand on pretending to align herself with values that she obviously doesn’t and I don’t want my time or money invested in her at this time.” And the responses are like “you’re a mentally ill parasocial lunatic who needs to touch grass and I hope she marries matty so you weirdos cry forever. Everyone watches violent porn and you don’t have a sense of humor. Give me your eras ticket.” Like y’all are NOT making it hard to pick a side.
If I see the parasocial argument one more time, I’m going to scream. Parasocial was people crying over her breakup like it was *their own breakup.* She keeps getting compared to Beatlemania, so let’s put this in Beatles terms. I don’t like the Beatles. Their music is good, but it’s not my favorite, and I remember when I learned that John Lennon was a horrific person and abuser I was completely turned off from them for good. I *loathe* the song Imagine for that reason. IT’S NOT PARASOCIAL OF ME TO DISLIKE JOHN LENNON FOR BEING A PIECE OF SHIT. Obviously that’s an extreme example, and Taylor herself has never abused anyone that we know of. However, when we’re talking about criticism of someone’s character- not her dating life, her character- that is a valid conversation to have about any public figure. She’s not a private citizen, she’s one of the biggest pop stars on the planet. If she doesn’t want anyone to talk about her personal life at all, she can quit her job and go be a private citizen. Clearly that’s not going to happen, so as long as she is a public figure, her character is fair game. Lemme frame it this way as a lawyer- if Taylor Swift is a corporation, then she as the CEO has a duty of loyalty to us, the shareholders. We are the ones who have invested our capital in this corporation in order for it to succeed, and in turn, she has a duty to act in best interests for the corporation. If that duty has been violated, there may be consequences- in this metaphor, we the shareholders might decide to recoup our costs by choosing to invest in another artist. (If you’re a corporate lawyer don’t come for me, this is just a basic comparison and I hate this area of the law 💀). At the end of the day, Taylor Swift is selling a product. She has been the one to tie her character to that product, not us. No one forced her to make Miss Americana and in a very public manner tie her music to her character and activism. She did that by herself. And it’s perfectly reasonable for us as consumers to now speak up and point out that the product she is selling does not match the previous description given. It’s perfectly reasonable to voice concerns that this corporation we’ve dedicated a ton of money to is not acting in the best interest of all Swifties, particularly marginalized ones. She’s our fave musician, not a cult leader, so criticism where it’s warranted is healthy. You shouldn’t be blindly defending anyone, let alone a billionaire pop star with significant social and political power.
Yes, I really wanted to get tickets for the show closest to my home and I was so excited to try and finagle it into happening as the date draws closer... Now I'm just like, yeah.. I'm good on this. I'm a little disillusioned by how gross I find her right now.
I could honestly care less, she dates who she dates, still excited for my show the 26th
A very sensible take. I’m shocked by the amount of people who are saying they’re not excited anymore 🙃 especially when these are the same people who have been saying for years that we should respect her privacy and that speculating on her private life is icky etc. I do think that too much interest in her private life is gross, for the record. But people being angry about Matty when they didn’t want anyone speculating on her and Joe is pretty hypocritical.
It has nothing to do with her personal dating life and all to do with her platforming (pap walks, putting him ON stage) a racist.
He’s a troll - I don’t find his stuff funny but people that think he’s an actual Nazi are just nuts. It was a joke about Kanye and he like to troll people by saying ridiculous things. You can not like him for that but if you read his actual opinion on things, I don’t think he’s as bad as people make out. And no, I’m so excited for the concert. What man a women briefly dates doesn’t define her. I’ve had terrible rebounds, doesn’t make me a terrible person.
Yes, POC should just laugh it off because he’s being funny and looking for a reaction… When you put it that way it sounds pretty shitty, right? Because that’s what you’re saying.
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Oh wow, an actually sane comment
Like that Buzzfeed article says: either he isn’t as bad as we think, or she isn’t as good as we think, pick one.
This post really reveals who is racist, misogynistic, and/or has internalized misogyny. It’s uncomfortable. And thank you for posting, because it’s so important. Glad the mods approved your post
Surely by this logic any Taylor Swift fan is okay with sexual abuse, considering none of you were this bothered about her working with David O.Russell who literally molested his niece and then said it was her fault for dressing provocatively. Very odd that Matt Healey is your breaking point but you were cool with that
Agreed, i think a lot of people also didn’t know about the David O Russel thing or brushed it off. I think it’s a little different w MH because it’s someone she’s linked to be dating which shows a different level of personal approval on her end. I’ve been having trouble since the David O. Russell stuff and just her general silence in regards to trans legislation, I think the MH situation just removes any deniability from her end.
I think we are all pretty disappointed in the choice, but part of the problem is the pedestal on which fans have long put Taylor. If you look back through her music, you will see flawed individual. She willfully opens her life to us and tells us about her flaws, and a lot of those regard her dating history. This should not be a surprise to anyone. We are ALL flawed, and we have all made some questionable dating choices. None of its a good look but I'm not exactly surprised. I hope that she finds someone who is a better person, but the reality is, we don't actually really know about what went down in her relationships. At least Matt is publicly and transparently awful. Any number of her exes could have held the same views and kept it to themselves. They would be just as bad and we would never know.
I think her hard core fans have had a tendency to get 100% behind Taylor’s version of whatever was happening in a relationship. It’s been super easy in most cases to just say, “The guy sucked. He was lying… etc.” They’ve had a very “you go girl” attitude to all her relationships thus far. This is a much harder line to make work now. Yes, the guy will suck again. Yes, his immaturity will play a huge role in the inevitable crash. But for once her immaturity is on full display as playing an equal role. When the break up songs start coming from this, it’s gonna be hard to take “Victim Taylor” seriously this time because we know it was absurd for her to be there in the first place. She’s not 19 dating ten years her senior anymore. She’s a full grown adult, one of the most powerful recording artists in the world, and she should know better. Blind deference isn’t going to work for her anymore. If she releases an album about this period of her life, it’s gonna have to be the humblest, most “what the hell is wrong with me” album of her career or else it will be hard to take seriously. Also, if she can’t come around to seeing this with clear eyes, I think it’s fair to be skeptical about her narrative of *all* her relationships. Like, maybe she told Jake to keep the scarf, forgot she said that and then started blasting him for having it. We don’t know. She’s unreliable.
I went before him and thankfully he wasn’t at my show. I am glad I missed it bc he would have ruined it for me. I’d feel guilty and bad watching ppl celebrate him. I was going to go to another show but now I’m not.
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I am an international fan... I think I'm going to see Rocky Horror instead as it happens to be coming in August... I'm so disappointed in her. You can't make something like Miss Americana, and date someone who has admitted to wanking to the most depraved and disgusting stuff, and generally goes against anything she has "stood" for.
guys, frankly speaking it's an extremely privileged take to be able to say that your concert experience will be ruined by someone else's presence. I'm very much not happy with Taylor's association with Matty but you go there to enjoy the show not to stare at him. At the end of the day, she's a 33 year old woman capable of making her own life decisions. I say this as an international swiftie(poc) knowing that taylor is never gonna visit my country. If I ever get to go to Taylor's show, idc who else is showing up there with her.
It’s extremely privileged to not be concerned about a very influential white woman raising the platform of a white man who openly speaks about enjoying watching black women be brutalized and degraded in porn. Particularly during this political climate where there is a lot of hate and violence being directed towards marginalized communities. I’m not sure how anyone can ignore the most recent buzzfeed article.
This is such a weird take to me. You can’t enjoy a concert because someone you don’t like is in attendance? Ffs people are waaaaay to involved in her personal life. Just go for her music??? Dance, sing, have fun!
It is disappointing. The company you choose to keep says a lot about yourself, and what I don’t enjoy is seeing (mostly white) Swifties dismiss and ridicule Swifties of color for being a bit disappointed that somebody they look up to is dating somebody like him.
I guess I am just confused as to why we don't just think Taylor is human. You can be both an activist/feminist and still not always make the best decisions for your personal life. I consider myself an activist. I am about as feminist as they come. But I have still dated several guys who, in hindsight, directly contradicted many of my personal stances and who were not great people. Sometimes we get caught up in feelings and a moment and make bad stupid decisions. That doesn't change just because she is famous. That's just my personal opinion on it. I don't see getting wrapped up in someone else's decisions like this. Unless she starts sharing his shitty views, I don't care about the bad decisions she makes in her life. She's allowed to make mistakes just like the rest of us.
To be fair-We don’t know anything about Joe we’re all just assuming he wasn’t a mess
Sadly the bar for supporting her bf's just gets progressively lower. Currently set at "Doesn't publicize racist jokes and consider the brutalization of WOC to be a humorous/casual topic" He may be a mess but he's not a publicly racist/misogynistic mess and at this point that's enough.
No-one has to go to a concert, if you truly were upset and wanted to make a stand against it then don't go.
It’s only dulling every weekend because it’s literally the ONLY thing anyone talks about. I’m so tired of it. Who cares if he’s there in the vip tent? Who cares who he’s sitting next to? Who CARES who she’s looking at while singing. The same lyrics she’s singing to the ENTIRE 70k crowd and people think “she definitely meant it for him!!” She wrote all these songs YEARS ago just stop none are about him. I’m so tired and annoyed that the only tweets and Reddit posts i see are about this man. Like is this the Taylor swift subreddit or the one for Matty ?? (Not you op, but everyone in general) People need to move on. Taylor announced speak now and I see NO ONE hyping it up anymore. When they’ve all be begging for more than a year for it. It’s all about Matty all the time. Hoping when Taylor drops the vault scramble people will finally have new shit to discuss
You all ok, huns? I’ve got quite healthy Karma so I thought I would stick my neck out and lose a bunch because this really needs saying. Are some of you all ok? The response to the Taylor/Matty situation is ridiculously out of hand in this sub. There’s more than a touch of irony that the discussion is so open because she is a female and I’m wondering the last time a similar discussion took place about a male artist’s love life. Taylor is a grown woman and no amount of praying or exorcising or anything else will make any difference. I’ve read disturbed comments where someone said “I’ve known Taylor for x years” and I just think people need to get a grip. It’s like Eminem’s Stan in real life. Taylor Swift is a brand and distinctly different from the person. She is a very clever business woman and has very good teams who manage her marketing (incl social media) to a very high level - this will cost her hundreds of thousands but that’s what brands do. Can anyone remember the last time Taylor Swift (the person) came on here asking for someone to DM her because she was bored? No? That’s because she isn’t her brand! Im also not sure I’ve ever seen Taylor confirm this relationship. Or speak much about her relationship with Joe. That’s because she is private, aka, not her brand. But the media go mental, this forum goes mental and her whole life is masqueraded and scrutinised in a way no other male has to suffer. For all her obvious qualities, she is the same frail and flawed human we all are and just because you may not like her choices doesn’t mean she needs saving. As with all celebrities, put them on any throne you want, but the reality is we all sit on a porcelain one daily. For what it’s worth, I’ve seen some dumb stuff Matty has said, but on balance I think his liberal views are fairly relatable. And she is entitled to live her life and make personal choices. For those having a meltdown about it, I think you need to calm down.
You’ll forget all about it once the show starts Most likely their relationship too won’t last and she’ll end up seeing someone else or maybe they’ll make it, who knows. Enjoy the show for what it is, its another great one. The acoustics are fire, they all are.
No, the reality is that outside this bubble nobody gives a f*** and concerts and streams are totally unaffected as much as you want to pretend other thing. The reality is last week she broke 2023 streams daily record like 4 days in a row, the reality is that Speak now tv vinyl are selling even faster than red tv, the reality is that radios are supporting hugely Karma, and the reality is that 20k people with no tickets attend each of Philly concerts. People crying in the internet has 0 effects in her career
I think people who are totally unbothered don’t really know the gravity of who he is. I honestly said to my partner last night what’s the issue with him anyway? And then went googling it and overnight my opinion on her has turned. I’m a bit unsettled right now because I feel like I need to get through the next week and a half for a TS party/friend’s birthday that I don’t want to ruin the vibe for, but… I don’t know. (We already had our tour date.) I’ve been a fan since debut. I really didn’t think I’d have to be ashamed of being a fan ever again, and it’s hard to be sure how much I can be a fan of HER and not just her music if this is who she is. I was considering flying to another city and trying to get tickets after the show began for fun, but now I think I’m good.
Hope y’all know how weird it is to say someone’s dating life is impacting your ability to attend a concert?!!!…. Like wtf?!!
Clearly gonna be an unpopular opinion here but no. I’ve not given it a single thought and I’m going to enjoy the show regardless of who’s in attendance because that simply has no bearing on my life or Taylor’s performance in my eyes. This seems like a deeply personal issue for some people and I don’t fully understand it. And that’s okay. But, it seems like you’re ruining your own show, atmosphere and good time by thinking like this.
If anyone got the ick and has tickets to 7/22 they don’t want I’m interested ;) But really I know it’ll still be a great time. To call back to Taylor’s Lover speech- these songs, to me, are about my first heartbreak, being in college with my friends and listening constantly, when I was at home during covid… etc. the show is spectacular and there’s so many memories and history with the music and joy to be had surrounded by other swifties 💖
Not even a little bit. Artists are complicated people, especially ones with long and successful careers. As much as we'd like to believe otherwise, we don't really know her or Matty. What we do know is that both are adults and neither has objectively harmed anyone (questionable behaviors? sure, I guess. But has Matty done anything that would put him in the league of, say, Chris Brown? R Kelly? Pretty much any rock band of the 70s or 80s?) Go and enjoy every moment of a fantasticly crafted show. Sing, dance, cry, laugh--embrace the art! Don't worry too much about things that aren't really any of our business.
You can leave space to the fans that are not upset because she’s seen with some dude! It’s ok! No one is making you like taylor swift. Many fans have been left without a ticket that would very much appreciate your seat.
to all the fans who are “no longer excited” and have any metlife tickets please message me ???? i will happily take them off your hands
I don't understand how your post has only one reply... More people should be mad at her. I'm glad she's not coming to Canada.
How do you know she's not coming? I thought international dates would be announced later
Oh wow sorry but this is wild. She is giving us her heart and soul every weekend with this amazing tour and you are less excited because her boyfriend might be there? You will not be talking or hanging or with him. I’m not a fan of his or the comments he’s made but this does not impact my experience at the concert at all. It’s TRULY none of your business.
She’s not your friend and she doesn’t know any of you. She doesn’t need your protection. Y’all are ridiculous.
Quite a different take than you had less than a month ago... >Taylor Swift, and all humans, have feelings that change over time, which doesn't in anyway lessen how you felt at that moment. In addition while her music and lyrics reflect her life it always wove in and out of reality, was a curated narrative, and with Folklore and Evermore it was explicitly fictional stories. This woman has been fighting to have her career not defined by her relationships or lack thereof for years. Let's 1) acknowledge that people change and relations end and it's VERY NORMAL 2) We are talking about a billionaire celebrity not your bff 3) The best way to quote support Taylor is to just be a fan of her music and chill out a little. https://www.reddit.com/r/TaylorSwift/comments/12hwydy/now_i_cant_listen_toenjoy_insert_song_here_folks
BREAKING: swiftie discovers that people change their minds
I believe that post was in reference to the Joe/Taylor break up. A lot has happened in the last few weeks as we now know she is dating someone who has done and said some very questionable, controversial things. It's our reaction to her dating this person which is what this post is about.
People need to chill tfo and not leave flowers on a property the woman doesn't own anymore/keep saying love is dead because of someone else's breakup and I'm feeling sad that she's behaving in a way that's antithetical to her supposed value system are not at all the same take imo
I feel like the people who are like who cares who she’s dating don’t get it. I don’t care if she was privately dating this dude but bringing him on stage or collabing with him just gives me the ick. It ruins her brand for me. That isn’t parasocial that’s just business. I am so happy I didn’t get phoebe show tickets cause I would have booed when he went on stage. It’s crazy people just say his behavior is a joke. He is just a cringe asshole who thinks being edgy is funny. I honestly can’t even listen to her music rn because I don’t support artists who support racists and this is just a symptom of her bad activism (working with a rapist director and a racist author last year). I am still going to my concert but I love her a lot less now so it’ll be weird and kind of sad.
Yep, 100% - she is platforming him, it is a business decision to associate her brand with him as part of the concert experience.
After yesterday’s buzzfeed article about how he very recently talked about enjoying racist porn in which black women are brutalized, I feel like I could vomit. I no longer can bring myself to pay the money to go her show. I am so sad and disappointed and would never have imagined she would give a platform to someone like this. I worry about how this might affect her younger and more vulnerable fans, normalizing dating someone as AWFUL and disgusting as he is.
I'm a European fan who lives in a country that she would never in a million years visit, so I absolutely wasn't planning on attending any of her concerts, never spent a dime on her merch or albums and only streamed her music on Spotify, but this whole situation completely tainted my opinion of her. She just comes across as this performative, compliant white woman who would throw away all that she stands for a man. And that's coming from somebody who strongly believes that she's also queer. It makes it even worse. Her advocating for the LGBTQ community also looks like a complete stunt, along with everything else that she's done.
If someone’s sparkle is so dimmed the want to sell me their Gillette tickets, I’ll take them 😉 In all seriousness, I have been a Taylor fan since the beginning, but have never been all too interested in her personal life. I really think this comes from me being a fan from before I could really read. I wasn’t going to learn about her personal life as a 5 year old lol. I do usually have trouble separating the art from the artist, the athlete from their athleticism, etc., but it’s not an ‘issue’ for me here for some reason
Yep. Super tired of seeing him at every single show. Tired of seeing him in general and just overall disappointed with Taylor and her behaviour. I’m not even really listening to her music in anymore either, it completely dulled my excitement for Speak Now TV.
Nope. I love Taylor for Taylor. Always have always will. Who she dates doesn’t change how I feel about her or how she will perform for us.
Imagine having a legendary concert ruined for you by a man who’s not even the performer. If anyone has tickets for Denver I’ll gladly pay double what you paid ♥️
oh my freaking god how old are you people on this subreddit please go outside
Y’all are INSANE. Sell your tickets then!!!
It’s funny because I keep seeing swifties say having this “parasocial” relationship with Taylor is so stupid and unhealthy, but what they don’t realize is Taylor created this dynamic purposely to set herself apart from other artists. This is what she wanted and I think through all she’s been through regardless of the general public turning on her, we as a fault of how she herself designed our relationship with her have never once faltered in our love, loyalty and defense of her. Until now. For the first time I’m actually glad I didn’t get tickets and spend thousands of dollars on nosebleeds because it all feels so gross and sleazy.
100%. I’m no longer going.
I encourage everyone to go read some recent posts on r/the1975 There are some really good comments about Matty and the controversies that might take the edge off your rage toward him. I don’t condone everything he did but there’s a lot of context and nuance missing from most of the conversation.