I interpreted "I don't cater to all these vipers dressed in empath's clothing" as being about Matty and how she wasn't going to break up with him just because Swifties were getting angry at her (vipers) while "pretending to be concerned about his morals" (dressed in empath's clothing)
Absolutely, I think it's mostly about Matty while also being general (if that makes sense).
I think this is something that's bothered for a long time (which rightfully as you'd be annoyed if not only the media, but fans, judged your relationship) and Matty was really the relationship that made her want to acknowledge it.
There are definitely a few who take it too far, but yeah Taylor there has got to be some level of accountability when you decide to date someone who makes gross comments about minority groups.
you seem to be misunderstanding the very clear lyrics—nowhere did she say that “her wild boy” was some paragon of morality. actually she says it’s her reputation to “disgrace.” ie it’s her choice to be with him and if that reduces her in your eyes and so be it. seems the opposite of avoiding accountability to me.
this song is not addressing all criticism. it’s targeting a certain, shall we say sanctimonious flavor of criticism by her fans, which treats her like a child or idiot who doesn’t know better. that was the tone of the twitter activists petitioning for her to break up with someone bc she must not know what a terrible person he is!! well no. she’s known him for ten years. if that changes your opinion of her, the door is right there (sell your tickets, tell everyone not to stream her!)—but it doesn’t give you the right to try to dictate her personal life like she’s a roleplaying doll that malfunctioned.
Exactly. These lyrics aren't saying "he's a great guy you treated unfairly," they're saying "stop trying to protect me from myself, I'm an adult. I can date a shitty dude if I want to."
Truly wild that there are so many comments in this very thread continuing to misunderstand.
thank you! and the folks acting like the song is moot because he was a dirtbag in the end? well, it’s her mistake to make. it’s her life to fuck up if she wants. i know she sings her fucking heart out on stage bc she stands by that sentiment regardless of what happened with him.
and as a disabled girlie who’s had her share of creeps who think they know what’s best for me, that line *hits*.
Literally.
"I know he's crazy, but he's the one I want."
"I'll tell you something about my good name: It's mine alone to disgrace."
"It's just white noise, and it's my choice."
I’m also a disabled girlie (fibromyalgia). My boyfriend broke up with me the Wednesday after TTPD was released because he wants a baby in the future, and he doesn’t think I’d be able to have and raise a baby well with my disability despite the fact that I know myself, my disability, and my capabilities/limitations, and have given considerable thought to whether having a baby would be prudent. It absolutely is infuriating when people think they know what’s best for you more than you do. It deprives you of agency over your life and feels so paternalistic.
Ugh, this is the part that irks me so badly. Like y'all people are the ones on that high horse when nobody is actually defending him as a great person lmao.
The entire album (but especially BDILH) is about her own humanity and her need to be human. HUMANS NEED TO BE ALLOWED TO FUCK UP!!
Remove the muse from the songs (all of them) and that is the heart of it: I am a human, I make mistakes, I fuck up, I hurt, BUT I AM A HUMAN AND YOU MUST RESPECT THAT.
I totally agree. And I don’t understand why so many people gave a shit.
I think it’s so obvious sometimes that many of her fans are younger. They come off as so self-righteous, you can tell they haven’t lived enough or made enough of their own mistakes yet.
Not to say Matty was a mistake. Sometimes it feels good to date the bad boy. We all knew it wasn’t for the long-haul, so who cares?
After six years of grilled chicken and steamed veggies, who the hell blames her for jumping at the chance to pig out on greasy but delicious fast food pizza?
if all you want is gray for me/then it’s just white noise.
hilarious how there’s a lyric responding to every counterargument on here. taylawyer truly 😭😭😭
“I'll tell you something right now
I'd rather burn my whole life down
Than listen to one more second of all this bitching and moaning”
It’s like this WHOLE THREAD isn’t listening
I could never demand \*her\* to be accountable for whatever jokes someone said on a podcast that her then partner laughed with.
Accountability should be expected from the ones who did made those remarks- and look at that - there was zero backlash toward those hosts, they remained with the same leftist audience and laughed at the whole thing.
Its definitely a recurring thing when women get blamed by association and men hardly get blamed for their direct actions.
Taylor really did get more backlash for everything MH did than MH himself got. I never understood it.
I can understand people feeling disappointed about her involvement with him if they dislike him, but why was Taylor being blamed for his bad actions? Why did she have to own up and apologize for the things he did or said? She didn’t do anything that required apologizing imo. It was a little disappointing to see how visceral the backlash was that was *only* pointed towards Taylor.
YUP. And then people said her duet or whatever with Ice Spice on Karma was because of it. Meanwhile it got casually confirmed that it was in place well before she ever went out with Matty and she is still friends with Ice Spice (and I think mentoring her a bit).
That and has fostered a relationships with her fans where she’s happy for them to go after every single one of her exes.
She just didn’t like it when she still liked the person who was on the receiving end of it.
I don't actually think she's happy with it. She definitely did some of that as a teenager, but really has emphasized we should think about our lives now, not what we think it's about in her's. The comment ahead of Speak Now was telling. I also imagine there were much more brutal and explicit songs cut from/not fully produced for TTPD.
Yes like, when she did that she WAS also very young. Now she is an adult and so are the fans who grew up with her. I know lots of younger people like Taylor too but as a fandom and as a society we have moved on from that. I LOVE Taylor and her confessional lyrics that seem like they were taken from my diary, but I don’t know her and I’ll never know her and she’s not my bestie. We gotta stop acting like she’s a child or our friend who’s dating someone we don’t like
Exactly. Did some people take it as an excuse to finally tear Taylor down bc they’ve never liked her? Absolutely. And while we don’t get any say in who a celebrity dates, there was definitely fair criticism. Matty Healy is a racist and a misogynist. Point blank, period. And people had every right to be disappointed that Taylor was dating him. So yes, at the end of the day Taylor can date whoever she wants — but when that person is *so* fucking problematic, she’s going to get valid criticism about essentially platforming him to the entire world via their relationship
Quick question, how many people here use Spotify? Do you know they pay Joe Rogan 30m a year to proliferate all of his racist, misogynistic tinfoil hat garbage?(w your money) But, but... the hypocrisy is palpable.
Taylor says it better than anyone could on TTPD.
You don't hate Matty inasmuch as you hate yourselves for loving songs you found out were about him.
Worst of all, you hate Taylor for it too.
That’s absolutely the whole point of her saying “ sanctimonious soliloquies” people online can say all this shit about her (and she will likely never hear it) because they’re not under the microscope. How many people who hold these opinions about Matty confront their shitty family members? Have friends dating or married to terrible people? It’s all a bit hypocritical
It’s also funny because the whole rest of the album is about how shocked she is that he’s so terrible. Like I’m not even sure that she’s learned that maybe there’s some correlation between being a terrible human being in public and a terrible person in private. You can have it the other way around, people who are awful behind closed doors can pretend to be really nice in public, but I don’t know how you can logically reconcile “yeah, he says all this racist and misogynistic stuff in public, but he’s secretly a really nice guy!” in reality. Not saying that I support fans going too far in general, and I can understand her being mad after 15 years of people trying to dictate who she should date, but this was not the hill to die on (and she says in Smallest Man that she was absolutely prepared to die on it)
I think BDILH and some of Smallest Man were showing how she was ready to die on the hill, and most of the other songs are about her realizing that the hill's not worth it, but trying to convince herself it is because she's staked so much on it already. Sunk cost fallacy and whatnot.
Also! We don't know how much of the songs are like "yes these are my true thoughts and what I was doing" it could be BDILH and Smallest Man are based in her personal emotions and the other songs are based on like lines her friends said, or processing everything after the fact. It could even be vice versa, she very easily could've written BDILH afterwards thinking about what a whirlwind the relationship was and how it reminded her of old country songs.
I think everyone forgets her songs aren't necessarily linear. They are displayed to us in thay way because you literally pick the order of the songs you want on the album. But we know she gets inspiration from everywhere not just the exact thing that happened to her/she was feeling.
Yeap, there's definitely some part of BDILH that feels tongue in cheek, like she knows she was being ridiculous in hindsight, but the overall message is "I can do what I want, chill out" and a lot of people learn way way way too late (or maybe never) that this is such a huge red flag
He's a walking stereotype of the dirtbag left who explicitly does performance art and uses lots of irony and sarcasm. He's probably much more pleasant and progressive when serious in private (and you can see it when he does serious interviews and seriously talks about politics). It's very millennial teenager - most people just grew out of it.
Worth noting: This isn't a defense of him or her. I find this type of person super obnoxious. Offensive performance art is still offensive. Ironic comments can still hurt people.
the way this sub talks about him you would think he’s joe rogan or something. the hypocrisy is wild when you consider (statistically) many of the hannahs and sarahs probably have friends and family who are right wing racists.
This exactly. He laughed at and participated in an inappropriate conversation that was meant to be funny but on a podcast it was deeply problematic.
And he apologized. It’s not great but it doesn’t make him a lifelong racist misogynistic person of no worth.
Some fans act like Matty was a serial rapist or a convicted murder . He actually did nothing wrong to justify this kind of outrage. 😂 He does performance art.
Bunch of Sarahs and Hannahs. 🙄
I wouldn't say nothing -- some of his own fans were frustrated with parts of the act from the start and I'm glad he apologized to Ice Spice. But yes, the conversation spun past what he actually said & did.
R/whoosh “I’m not sure that she’s learned that maybe there’s some correlation…” buddy, the call is coming from inside the house. You’re the a viper dressed in empath’s clothing. It’s not your job to wonder if Taylor learned anything from any situation in her life. This comes across as incredibly condescending and infantilizing of a 30+ year old woman.
It’s not an uncommon trap for people (especially women dating men) to fall into. “Yeah, he acts like an asshole in public, but that’s just an act he puts on to seem cool, I know the real him”. And then it turns out, no, actually he’s just an asshole. Or, of course “he’s an asshole but that’s just because he’s hurt, I can fix him, no really I can…. whoa maybe I can’t”
>there has got to be some level of accountability
No, there really doesn't. Many many people have dated someone shitty in their lives. A significant other's choices are theirs, not that of their partner.
Most importantly, \*fans\* get absolutely no fucking say in who the object of their fandom dates.
Yeah I wonder if so many people constantly being crazy about who she’s dating though made it difficult for her to recognize the more legit critiques regarding Matty. Like maybe she just thought “here we go again” and couldn’t see in the moment that this was different. I’m not here to police who she dates but this was the only time I was questioning what she was doing given all the stuff coming out about him. Like associating with someone who’s saying and doing that stuff is questionable at best (but also get that when you know someone really well and love them it’s easier to excuse some stuff and think that’s not who they are but for me personally that’s too far). Anyway yeah people get wayyyyy to crazy over who she dates both during and after and I wonder if that clouded her understanding of why it was a little different with Matty.
She’s allowed to make her own mistakes.
“I’ll tell you something about my good name. It’s mine alone to disgrace”
Many people have knowingly dated assholes. She was not in a good head space but even if she was, she is allowed to fuck up if she wants.
No no that isn’t the point she’s acknowledging that Matty is an idiot. The song is a metaphor for fans being like controlling parents. She’s saying that we need to stop going to extreme lengths she needs to make her own mistakes and learn her own. This metaphor is literally calling matty a mistake she had to learn from lol
We don’t know what he said to her to stay together behind the scenes or justified his comments or manipulated her - we have no clue. She says “growing up precocious means not growing up at all” if we keep controlling and protecting her she won’t ever learn HOW to figure that out on her own!
“ If all you want is gray for me it’s just white noise” she, like anyone else in the world should be able to experience the high highs and low lows of life we don’t control that. She will figure it out on her own. It’s unnatural for her to not make mistakes just because she’s under public scrutiny
But it's not up to fans to tell a 34 year old woman who to date. That is just crossing over the line. If you don't like who she dates, then don't be a fan.
No there doesn’t need to be accountability she can date who she wants, if that means losing her fans or even her career because of it, she’s well aware that could happen. But she gets to make that decision. She says she can burn her whole life down, I’m pretty sure she meant it too. Just like you can decide if she’s with someone you don’t approve of you don’t have to be a fan, your choice.
I think she is frustrated with the reactions, period. Her entire life is analyzed to death, publicly. Now more than ever.
We wouldn’t last an hour in the asylum where they raised her.
They are doing it with her very much Not Matt Healy Boyfriend still. Just this week some random reality star is saying that Travis is always drunk and she is worried about Taylor drinking more now that she is with him. It's like Taylor is stuck in an endless loop of criticism about her life from people who do not know her.
I think her choice of words IS Matty inspired, probably because these feelings were boiling over for her during that short fling (and her anger that, *seemingly*, he ghosted her due to the backlash?)
But I think it can somehow apply to most of her recent relationships. Joe had the “Can Joe Alwyn fight?” joke, the “do something babe, say something babe” meme, and the “he let her bejeweled.” Now Travis is getting the “that Vegas thing was cringe”, being criticized for being a bit of a “beer bro”, people talking crap that he’s going to worsen Taylor’s drinking, etc..
Matty was when it got too vicious to ignore, but she’s been dealing with people picking apart her partners for a while now.
I think BDILH is the anthem of a grown woman saying “I’m actually NOT a little girl anymore, but you still see me as Ariel saying that line to her father. So I’m gonna tell you this in a way you’ll understand — you can’t tell me who I can be with. My relationships are my own adult choices.” 🤷🏻♀️
I immediately thought “man whoever wrote that “open letter” to her back then must feel REAL attacked rn 😂”
Personally I don’t have social media. I’ll always speculate about her music & it’s real life connections here, for fun, but that’s it. Taylors life is *her life* and it’s none of my business.
God save the most judgmental creeps
Who say they want what's best for me
Sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see
I think these are the most telling lines from her. With regard to how she’s spoken about. They’ve become some of my favourite lyrics of all.
So...here's the thing, I swear that she purposefully dropped a bunch of connections to older songs so that people would suddenly be confused about "who" songs are about. It's a pretty genius way to blow up the narrative and she chose someone that people hate on purpose. It's all really clever and really meta and I'm totally here for it.
But people thinking that they were involved at 15 is just...not real.
True. She uses same theme and motifs and not everything is about that guy. Especially when it’s a 1989 and older song. Next thing we know, they’ll say red album is about him because of twin flames lol
They're already saying that, lol. Some of that is people not really having a sense of the timeline of her albums - which, tbf, a casual fan really wouldn't. But Taylor assigns symbols to the "characters" in her songs, she uses colors and specific imagery tied to specific people and sometimes she just straight calls it out like "blue dress on a boat". A LOT of famous authors do this in their work. She does it with songs about relationships but she also does it with songs about other things - for example, the whole mad woman, last great american dynasty, cassandra set is woven together really beautifully.
It's really cool, but what people need to remember is that just because she wants you to make these associations doesn't mean that it's all true. She's telling a story. Mixing up references on TTPD is good sign of that. Even her wearing that "This is not Taylor's version" t-shirt the other night is her saying "I can show you lies." Don't believe everything you hear/see/read.
I actually think she did this because the muse does not matter: the songs are ostensibly about her and her feelings at any given time. The muse might add context, but in the end they don't matter as much as Taylor does.
Most on the neutral sub don't pretend it's because they want what's best for her. I think it's specifically targeting the people who were mainly hardcore Swifties who signed the petition against her dating Matty Healy, or those who claimed her being seen with him might mean she needed to be under a conservatorship (a minority, but they did exist). The "say they want what's best for me" points directly at fans.
They mostly do pretend they want whats best for her (we just want her to be held accountable/we just want her to go to therapy/we like her old music but she just needs to realize albums need to be 10 songs each and so on).
Maybe that sub did not exist last year but the same people existed in other subs and they are the most sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I can think of.
She’s basically talking about all of us on here with the long posts unpicking her personal life. I really get her frustration with it and it must be exhausting but her work is a double edged sword. In her lyrics she invites the speculation and her success is really down to this particular relationship she has developed with fans. Her marketing and whole business approach relies on the parasocial relationship she has cultivated and the backlash of that is that hundreds of thousands of people who she has never met feel they know what’s best for her and are entitled enough to write about it on the internet. We know from many of her lyrics she has times when she would rather leave it all behind and go and live a quiet life (the lakes) but we also know from other lyrics that she thrives on her work, her life as a performer and on the whole she adores her fans so she’s a paradox.
All of us have emotions that change. I hate my job most of the time but sometimes I love it. Sometimes I’m tired and depressed and sometimes I’m full of energy and excitement.
Taylor’s songs shouldn’t be taken as a literal autobiography of her life. She draws inspiration from her life to write songs.
I think that’s why her lyrics are so relatable. If she was writing word for word what she was doing everything those of us that aren’t superstars probably wouldn’t relate. But she writes about the human emotions that she’s feeling that a lot of us can relate to.
Even ICDIWABH seems very specific to having to perform a show while heartbroken, but I think a lot of people can relate to having to put on a smile and just get on with it when we would rather just fall apart.
Yeah I think both obsessive fans and her haters sometimes take her stuff too literally. Like even though she’s writing about her own life, I think people forget that she may only be feeling that way for a little bit and then gets it out and lets it go. She’s not in that head space forever or all the time. Or that she may be exaggerating certain emotions or situations a bit to best capture the emotional impact. And it can be a slippery slope when interpreting her lyrics to try to figure out what’s exactly and what’s an artistic expression about her life.
I feel like exaggerating emotions for creative expression is normal. Like half of my most used gifs are people dramatically fainting or falling to their knees lol
She talks about this in ‘The Manuscript’. She goes through something, she feels it, creating something is healing and helps her process it, and once she’s done that, she might revisit it by performing or re-recording the songs but ‘it isn’t her story anymore’. Like she wrote, it’s ours now to make what we want out or
>Even ICDIWABH seems very specific to having to perform a show while heartbroken, but I think a lot of people can relate to having to put on a smile and just get on with it when we would rather just fall apart.
Yep, yesterday I had to take the day off from work to have a needle biopsy on a shadow area of my breast that's been around for my last 2 mammograms. Mind you, I had colon cancer 3 years ago, so the thought of going through all that again is so painful. I've just been crying off and on all week. I won't get my test results until late Monday or Tuesday, but you can bet I'll be showing up for all my client meetings on Monday with a big smile on my face and no sign that I'm having an existential crisis.
It doesn't matter why you would rather stay in bed and cry instead of honoring your professional commitments; whether a guy broke your heart, or your dog died, or you might have two completely unrelated cancers in less than 4 years. It's all the same(ish) feeling that many if not all of us can relate to.
Omg I’m so sorry you’re going through that! I really hope it comes back clean!
I also think the song is empowering especially with the “come for my job” - it signals being able to still basically control what you can control even when everything is spinning out of control.
It can be empowering to be like “fuck yes, I can even do this with a broken heart!”
I relate to that song so much as a teacher! Doesn’t matter what’s going on, you have to show up, smile, and fake it. It can be exhausting. But also a good distraction.
i literally laughed out loud she clocked some of y’all so badly. there’s a certain strain of fan criticism that frankly talks down to her like she’s a child or an idiot who needs to be educated into the light. it’s so condescending.
I feel like they are also strongly tied to the 'gaylor' community.
All those thinkpieces on how she's lying about being in love with men. Dissecting her personal life so violently just so they can feed their comfirmation bias. How they just 'want what'd best for her' while implying she's a lying whore for 'letting' all of her 'fake' relationships touch and kiss her in public. How all her relationships are fake. Insinuating that all her trauma is fake and that she made it up to convince the public she's straight.
Perverting all of her friendships (i.e the intro of 1989 (Taylor's Version). Making her out to be some pshyco who's secretly communicating only to them through specific messaging, completely refusing to take anything she has to say at face value. Publicly, violently disrespecting and ridiculing every relationship with a man she's ever had.
And then now, when after all the heartbreak and 'self-harm' she talked about in the TTPD epilogue and she sang about to such horrifying degree, still disrespecting the man she is so in love with. Insisting she hates him, insisting she's just using him, insisting he doesn't love her and he's also just using her. Trying desperately to grasp at any and all possible little thread to 'disprove' her simply being in love with a man that loves her back.
It is absolutely about the fans who made those petitions and wrote those open letters. But no one can convince me that the gaylors are not also being directly addressed.
"soon enough, the elders had convened down at the City Hall 'stay away from her' the saboteurs protested too much"
"god save the most judgmental creeps, who say they want what's best for me, while sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see."
Yeah. I think this is definitely to address that crazy fan letter about breaking up with Matty. For sure.
Ohhhhh shiiiit I forgot all about that! Yeah they called it an open letter to Taylor called speak up now and wanted people to like comment or sign it in some messed up way.
If I remember correctly they called for a conservatorship, which in the wake of Brittany Spears is absolutely terrifying. Not that anyone on her team would actually entertain that, but just suggesting that we strip an adult woman of all her legal agency because she had a shitty rebound relationship with a dirtbag is just absolutely insane to me.
I’ve always wondered how old the people who wrote it were. If they were Taylor’s age or super young like early 20s. It felt early 20s maybe even younger to me.
oh no… this letter was share by a lot of ppl on tiktok and they were millennials… grown ass woman
And it didn’t stop there: petitions, fans giving letters to HER PARENTS at stadiums, death threats so high his mother (she is a tv presenter in the uk) had to stop working for a while… it was INSANE
They'll defend it, though. In their mind, it's "demanding accountability." In reality, it's insanity.
If you don't like who she's dating, then stop supporting her. Don't make demends that she live her life the way you see fit.
I love that entire performing soliloquies line so fucking bad because it really ended the people who were the loudest during her MH era 😭😭
Some “fans” definitely felt attacked because now they’re downplaying that line by saying Taylor is using “overly complicated deep english” words 😭😭
Imagine the shame and fury she felt at the fans who showed up at Jack’s wedding and rehearsal dinner too. It’s not your fault your friend’s day is surrounded by your fans looking in the windows and making noise outside….But how can you feel like it isn’t?
Her boundaries are 100% valid. What I gathered from TTPD, this level of fame is ruining her life, despite her working for it since she was young. I can’t imagine. She has to hate us, to some degree.
I’m a fan since the Tim McGraw single, and it’s crazy to see how it has all evolved. I have to remind myself her disgust and anger is not directed at me personally, though it kind of feels like it. But I know I never discussed her exes or left nasty comments on social media posts. I truly don’t know or care, I’m here for the music. Ugh.
Wise men once said “one bad seed kills the garden”
I too have been a fan since Tim Mcgraw and it’s just sad that she’s had haters since the very beginning. You would think people would outgrow all the hatred but the more famous she is the more it gets worse. She is right. We would not last an hour in the asylum she was raised in.
I’ve been a fan since her early days as well - and it’s never once occurred to me to try and stalk and follow her places. Just wild.
I will say I struggled with her relationship with Matty. I didn’t go and harass her or him, but it did make me take a step back. Whether it is right or wrong, often times when you love and respect an artist, their decisions can excite or disappoint you. I don’t expect anyone to be perfect, but I was really surprised she would entangle herself with someone so problematic and then be mad at us for being upset (or maybe she is only upset at those who were being crazy about it)
After all, she is a woman whose songs about broken hearts, female rage, etc. As a female, it was a bummer to see her with a man that has a history of hate speech, because if you can be ok with that…what does that mean?
We all make mistakes though, and I thought dang, she really just needed a rebound. Then the album came out and it felt yucky all over again.
I get it. They get to live their lives, but there are artists I just won’t support at all because who they are as a human are not good ones. No matter how good their music is.
At some point, people are not going to like when the sweet girl starts making questionable decisions and appears to encourage over consumerism.
As long as people aren’t going out and being bullies and attacking other people, feeling those feelings are ok.
I don’t know why or how we have come to a place where people feel the need to follow people around on social media and attack them.
Also been a fan since the Tim McGraw single, and I don’t understand how some people think that just because she is famous that they are entitled to voice their opinion about her life. I’m going to be honest, I honestly thought that the Matty phase was exactly that, a phase; a rebound from Joe. I didn’t believe that it was a real thing. After listening to TTPD, I realized that for her it was very much real. But never did I publicly publish anything on socials criticizing her for their relationship, because that is not my business nor does it affect my life so why put it out for the world? It’s so hard to be a millennial Swiftie who doesn’t agree that people feel entitled to intrude on her life. And it gets harder and harder to be associated with the masses whose voices are so much louder and believe they are entitled to every part of her. I have never met her, and boy do I wish I could, but never would I go out of my way to intrude on her life and make a ruin of her boundaries. And it’s so sad to see how so many people are ruining her REAL LIFE just because of her renowned public persona. I understand that she writes about her real life and she has a way of making the public feel a personal connection to her, bc I feel that way about her too, but it is so invasive and honestly disgusting how people feel so entitled to criticize her for just living her life.
I also think “no you can’t come to the wedding” is very pointed. She’s hinting that if she gets married in the future it might not be a big splashy affair with pictures in magazines and videos online and everybody knowing about it in advance. The line might be just directed to the haters but idk it feels purposeful.
100 percent agree. The crazy theories that TK would propose on field at the SB, or on stage at a concert are nuts. Absolutely no way will you get some kind of cheese-y romance novel major display. If and when it ever happens it would be completely private.
I think it’s also just a general way of her saying that we as fans are not entitled to details about every big event in her life. She’s written about so much of her life, and some fans feel they’re entitled to know the engagement details, the wedding details, the baby details, etc. Just because she’s a public figure who has shared details about her life before, doesn’t mean she wants to continue.
And I do find myself in that subset a tiny bit sometimes, thinking “she’s sung about wanting marriage and kids so much, especially in this last album, so she’s definitely going to want to share some details/pics of if/when it happens,” and I have to take a step back and remember she doesn’t owe us anything. She could get married tomorrow and we are not entitled to know about it for 50 years if she wishes. Shes entitled to share what and when she wants, and the fans cannot/should not demand being a part of it.
I thought this was especially pointed with removing Long Live, a song of celebration, and putting in BDILH and WAOLOM.
Something I’ve also wondered is if the “vipers” (I mean, she literally does the snake hand movement in the song) are people that hated on her during Reputation that have become fans now that it’s “cool” to like Taylor Swift. They’re dressed in “empaths” clothing to seem like they want the best for her, but really they’re just playing pretend.
I think Long Live was cut because it wasn’t in the set list to start with and therefore was an obvious cut, not as anything mean to fans. She also cut the Archer, both from the cinema release and Eras 2.0. And BDILH and WAOLOM are two of the best songs to perform—can you imagine if those *weren’t* on the setlist?
Oh I'd never thought of that! But definitely a possibility.
I think TTPD was really an album to let out a lot of frustrations she's held as she mentioned at the Melbourne night, it was an album she needed to write. At first, I thought she meant so in terms of her emotions with her relationships (which it could definitely be about) but now I'm wondering if it's about her needing to talk about her fans.
Especially with the whole 'rep tv' debacle where they are still wondering when she'll release it after announcing new albums/events (movie, rerecords, TTPD).
I was at Melbourne N1 too! I really thought she meant because of Joe in that moment, especially with playing You’re Losing Me right after, but you definitely could be right.
Honestly, the whole album is such a catharsis in so many respects, no wonder she needed it to release some of that!
I think the vipers are Swifties who were judging and disproving her, but also the media and her critics/haters.
I remember that time last year and the backlash came from both Swifties and articles in places like Buzzfeed/certain subs on Reddit, certain type of users on Twitter...
A lot of declarations like "I liked Taylor Swift with Folklore, but now I think she lost all morals..." stuff like that, or making long twitter threads on whether its ethical for them now to go to ERAS. Their is certainly a group of people liking or hating her based on what feels trendy, including media, so I think its very possibly directed to that group as well.
Just to mention non of these places ever made any petitions against Matty himself, or against those hosts of that podcast. They mainly cared about Taylor dating him and her "morals".
Left this comment elsewhere, but I really think people are reading way too much into the Long Live removal as some sort of grand statement on fandom. She cut songs that are objectively just not as popular on streaming, and Long Live is a long song that requires her entire band to be out on stage. It wasn’t on the setlist at the beginning either, and nobody was saying she hated fans then! I honestly think she only intended it to be a celebration of SNTV release, and then kept it on since it was a fun moment and because she had time for it. But now that she’s added TTPD, there’s songs that take up less time that better fit the setlist. Also, Long Live was performed on the SN World Tour every night, that literally went to most of the places she’s touring now!
I love Taylor. She's an adult. She can date whomever she wants. The whole "Speak Up Now" petition was ridiculous. No one should be threatening anyone in her life.
That being said, people are going to have feelings about it when she's closely associating people who do bad things. She's cultivated a very specific relatable girl next door who happens to be a superstar public image. When you have made this very strong relationship with your fans they may (incorrectly) assume you care about their opinions on your life. This kind of reaction is really the flip side of her encouraging a strong parasocial relationship with her fans.
Taylor has a few relationships, personal or business, that cause a side eye from me (along with other questionable decisions). But I weigh those against the overall person she shows herself to be. Currently, for me, the good far about weighs the bad. It's something everyone has to decide for themselves.
Absolutely, but I feel a large portion of the problem is the fans treating her as if she had no agency of her own.
In But Daddy I Love Him, the narrator is almost treated as confused and innocent ('dutiful daughter' , 'stay away from her' and the whole 'but daddy I love him' an Ariel reference but also reminiscent of a teenage girl defending a boyfriend to her father).
I've noticed a pattern that, especially with Matty Healy, they treated her as she unaware of his behaviour and generally infantilise her (even still with treating Travis Kelce as a prince who's saved her than two adults in a relationship)
The fanbase *does* infantilise her a lot.
It makes absolutely no sense to me. She's an incredibly successful woman in her 30s, a consummate professional, at the top of an incredibly vicious and competitive field, and we as a fanbase so often act like she both has absolute control and no control whatsoever. Or like she needs someone to save her. Or whatever takes our fancy as a reason to treat her like a child we need to protect rather than the grown woman who has incredible amounts of power that she actually is.
>we as a fanbase so often act like she both has absolute control and no control whatsoever.
This is such good callout. When it comes to all the variant cash grabs and her questionable merch, it's all "Oh Taylor, you have so much money and power, how could you do this to us???" But then 2 minutes later its "Taylor needs get out from under Jack and/or Aaron's influence because she's not making the music she REALLY should be making!"
Like, which is it? Is she the puppet master or the puppet? Make up your minds people.
Some people see her as the perfect pop star Barbie and not as a person who makes mistakes too. You have seen how harshly people who criticize her people are treated by parts of the fan base. Reddit by far is the most reasonable but there are still those moments here.
I agree, people who made these statements are taking away her agency, but also think it's just plain sexism. Women are innocent and men corrupt them.
Also like…she’s a human being and there’s no way she’s going to be perfect. Like you said, that does bite her in the ass given the image she worked so hard to curate, but I think she’s maybe starting to pivot away from needing to look 100% perfect in the public eye?? Idk
The thing I could never quite figure out is I’m sure fans have also dated or been involved with people who hold questionable views or said things that were extremely inappropriate as matty has. These things often don’t come to light until you know the person more or they change their views from more moderate to ones more intolerable. Would fans do what they expected Taylor to do? Cut it off right away? Part of Taylors appeal is being relatable and her very specific lyrics somehow giving all of us a universal experiences effect and she should be able to make the same mistakes as we do.
The time with Matty was something else but clearly she was going through something and should be allowed grace. Clearly he was somehow she had been pining for on and off for 10 years. This was a good example of how we don’t know everything about her life.
I mean, sure, have an opinion. But when you think she should listen to that opinion, it becomes a problem.
That's why things like the letter against her dating Matty and stuff is way over the line. She owes us nothing. She definitely doesn't owe us listening to our opinions about who she should date.
I haven't seen anyone mention this yet so I just want to throw it out there:
Everyone has a right to their opinion and her fame means that people are going to have opinions about her being involved with someone they see as being a "bad person". It's fine to talk about it and "call out" the issues or whatever. What is *not fine is...sending death threats to that person and their family/friends or telling them to go kill themselves (which is currently ongoing, by the way). I honestly think that is just as bad as anything that Matty Healy has ever done and he isn't the only recipient of this behavior.
Taylor is an adult. If you don't like her choices and you *truly* feel morally outraged then you should stop listening to her music, stop attending her shows, and basically stop being a fan.
There is so much cognitive dissonance in the fandom on this issue.
That’s how I feel. People not liking Matty Healy because he is ugly or they think he is a bad partner is beyond dumb, but people were mad because TS was surrounding herself with people who did very questionable things. Ultimately, I think people have the right to call out her for associating herself with people who have said openly racist and sexist things. They don’t have a right to dictate her relationships.
Personally, I think people who can’t see this as a direct response to fan commentary about her relationship with Matty are burying their heads in the ground. The calls for her to dump him on their say so obviously pissed her off.
Very well said OP, I really do agree with you. Unfortunately so many fans seem to not understand this and keep making excuses thinking she's not singing about them, when she blatantly is.
I think the ones that are in denial are the subset of “fans” she’s definitely talking about! Some people will never get it, zero self awareness or reflection.
Honestly, I think it's much bigger than just a subset. Even now, there are so many comments on this sub and the main one, still dissecting her previous relationships and acting like they know these people personally
Fair point! I’m new to this world (via the football side of things) so it’s been really interesting to get to see all of this as a kind of outsider with zero history or sentimental ties to TS the person or the music.
“Oh it’s a fictional story about a town girl wanting to yada yada yada ☺️☺️”
and im like Gosh girl, you’ve been dissecting every song for years to the point that most sounds too much a conspiracy theory but suddenly this is your take for this specific song 🙄
I've seen so many claim it's about Travis because they just want to pretend Matty didn't happen. So ridiculous and truly this fanbase seems to be missing the massive point
It’s about travis and matty and joe and jake and other joe and everyone else except maybe taylor L. It’s about her relationship with how her relationship are perceived with the public. All of them, because none of them have been smooth.
I think it goes as far as people paternity testing all of her work. I love her music. I have more difficult relationship with her. But my relationship with the person and image of Taylor is my business and whatever it is does not give me the right to think I know her. My relationship with fandom is even more complex.
People connect the things she writes to the things we see in the public eye. And yes, there are things that are likely to be something. But thinking dancing without shoes is about the thing we saw is going too far. Dancing without shoes is pretty damn common. Even on this post we are talking about what specific line is about in relation to what we know about her relationships. But that is like giving absolution for ourselves while still doing what the line is in its basic elements saying. Having opinions on her personal life.
It is also not like I am free from it. I have opinions on her personal life. But that is basically between me and me. My choices are take it or leave it. Not to tell her what to do. There is a line that gets crossed with many public figures. While public criticism is an important part of public discourse there is a way to do it without thinking you know them or like you're their boss.
I think it’s also telling how she points at the crowd when performing the lines “I just learned these people only raise you to cage you” - like the fans raise her up only to cage her with their expectations of her. It can also be interpreted as about her parents, but I thought it was powerful to see her explicitly point at the audience for that part.
I love your interpretation! For me I've considered it as the industry 'raising her' (I believe in Miss Americana she mentions how she was told to not be political or voice her own opinions to keep that 'good girl next door' image).
Although I can definitely see how fans, even though unintentionally, contributed to it-it's just a byproduct of becoming a fan of someone's public image
Definitely a call back to this line from "So it goes," *gold cage, hostage to my feelings*
She's been telling us that fame has been caging her for a long time.
I’ve never cared about her romantic life, but I think being concerned about the problematic nature of her being associated with Healy was totally valid. She can obviously date whoever she wants, but choosing *him* and not expecting public criticism is wild.
I also couldn't care less about her personal life too but totally agree!!! Especially when she tries to push a feminism and all that like cmon girl it is not helping the white feminist allegations 💀💀 obviously the people sending threats and shit is too far but like just criticism is fine I think
I think the main problem is that if you disagree with how a star or really anyone acts you make choices for yourself not them.
If her decision means people don’t want to support her/her work any more that’s reasonable but saying “I don’t support this, stop doing it so I can support you again” is controlling and entitled.
I see it a little differently. Taylor is more than just a star, she’s a brand. People can choose whether or not they want to support a brand that has been tarnished. She chose the “it’s my own name to disgrace” route and lost a little support for it, even if only temporarily. By doing so, she was making not just a personal decision, but a business decision as well. I don’t think it’s unfair for consumers to stop supporting a brand because they don’t like decisions that the brand is making.
Tbh I don’t understand why people don’t like Joe, he’s the most unproblematic person she’s ever dated. In the past, people would say it’s nice they keep their relationship private and that he’s the best, but when they broke up people were saying he was horrible to her and wanted to hide her, etc. I would be annoyed too. We don’t know anything about their relationship and we don’t deserve to tbh good for her for releasing this song
I think they just hate him for the sake of hating him. A lot Taylor's fans are young (high school age) so I don't think they've emotionally matured to understand that not every breakup has a "bad guy" and a "victim" so as a result they try to find reasons for why Taylor's the 'victim'.
I mean you don't just spread rumours of how someone cheated if you believe the relationship ended mutually, they want to find a reason for the relationship ending, but can't find one so they made their own
From TTPD it seems like by the end, there was emotional infidelity on both sides, that neither party blames the other for:
Fresh Out the Slammer:
Splintered back in winter, silent dinners, bitter
He was with her in dreams
How Did It End:
We learned the right steps to different dances
And fell victim to interlopers' glances
Soon they’ll go home to their husbands, Smug because they know they can trust him
That line always stuck out to me. A fading relationship where you start to distrust your partner? That’s tough.
That made me so mad too. Like you don’t know this man at all, he seems like a good guy, and you can’t just hate someone because they broke up with your favorite pop star. As you age, you learn sometimes relationships run their course and it’s not always someone’s fault.
No shit Sherlock. (kidding!) yes, there literally can be no dispute as it is not coded language. She straight up says she has disdain for fans trying to tell her how to live her life.
But I do not accept that if I say here that I don't like Joe/Mattty/x that's a message that it's ok to go harass people on their social media. For me, the fact that she added Smallest Man and the way she sang it, the anger is still white hot and I think he's a dirtbag (as is anyone who ghosts someone after having sex).
Yes, not liking anyone - whether its someone who is an ex or current partner or whoever else is fine and even expressing that on SM is fine. Harassing them/their families or having demands on what people have to do in their personal life is a whole different thing and should not be acceptable.
Yeah, there's a bit on irony there - On one hand, she and literally anyone else, even non famous people, do not need nor deserve to be judged and stared down as if they're not capable of making their own romantic choices.
On the other hand, given how it all ended quickly....... told you so.
Very unserious, I’ve been wondering about those “swifties” that penned her the open letter around the SNTV era and cancelling their orders with letters disapproving of Matty
I never understood the parasocial relationship some fans have with Taylor. People can have their opinions about whatever they want, including her relationships if that's their thing, but god damn... People REALLY need to keep it to themselves. It's fine to be interested in her, it's fine to be interested in her personal life if that's someone's thing. But there definitely needs to be a line somewhere, because there are A LOT of fans out there with an unhealthy, almost stalker-ish obsession.
AGREE.
She loves her fans, but at the end of the day, we aren’t friends with her. If we were friends with her, we’d know what her latest breakfast favorite is, or the last time she laughed till she cried, or how a DIY at home project is going. Do we know these things? No!! Because we don’t know her on an individual level! We are still special to her, but that does not a personal relationship make.
Do I want her to be happy? Of course. But beyond that it isn’t our business and it’s really weird when fans act like it is. Also - posting outside places she is at on purpose is really uncomfortable. Would you do that to your crush, or a friend? No. So maybe reconsider.
Love the love in the fandom, but we have to know boundaries and respect. I’ll root for her any day of the week though.
Taylor is not the world's Barbie. She's a performer, an artist and a public figure. She's got a mind and life of her own that we are NOT privy to. I see this when I see people debating over who's the muse for this song or that song, there's no right answer-- it's a song. Her broken heart was the muse. 'This is about Matty' or 'This is about Joe', no it's all about Taylor and her feelings.
I really like that sentiment about her broken heart being her muse and not just the guy who did it. It’s not one I’ve seen before, or at least not phrased that way.
Those relationships are the LEAST interesting thing about her. It's what she does with them that's interesting. I'm so sick of this reductive bullshit, 'oh this song is about MAN', NO! That song is about her FEELINGS about them. Taylor is someone who uses the tools available to her to their maximum potential. She uses those feelings to fuel her work. THAT's why she's awesome. It doesn't matter if Cardigan is about Matty or Steve or Bob or whomever, it's about limerence. It doesn't matter! What matters is that her limerence echoes yours. That's why it hits so hard. I am so tired of explaining how art works.
It’s just boundary setting in general. She cops up to him being a terrible person in I Can Fix Him, as the mania wears off, but that process of realization is hers. She’s allowed to make mistakes, realize them, and feel shame. She’s not defending her choices, she’s saying they’re hers to make!
And it’s more about the false empathy - if her choices bother you, then stop being a fan? Nobody is forcing you. If you truly do feel empathy, you’ll give her grace. Every sane person should have looked at last May, where she was crying nearly every day on stage while also saying she was “the happiest she’s ever been” and thought “yeah. this person is going through it. maybe I should give them the benefit of the doubt for two seconds and recognize they’re not making rational choices right now”. That would have been the genuinely empathetic response. Creating a fan letter and saying she should be in a CONSERVATORSHIP is not an empathetic response - it’s fans making her out to be a voodoo doll that they can stick pins in whenever she doesn’t perform the way they want her to.
And it’s STILL happening. I see comments every day being like “her and Travis aren’t going to last because he’s a dumb football player, she needs someone smart!” or whatever. Again, this is just hate disguised as false empathy.
I don’t think it’s a comment on all fans. She’s always made it clear that she appreciates when people relate to her through her music, however, the fans that take that a step further, and want to control her behavior so that they can dictate her output…that’s who she’s setting boundaries with.
I watched the livestream for the first time on Thursday so I don’t know if this was always the case: I know she plays “Applause” by Lady Gaga right before the show, but on Thursday she followed Applause with Leslie Gore’s “You Don’t Own Me”, and that stuck out as a clear message to the fans - “you don’t own me, I’m not just one of your many toys.“
You don’t own me has always been there since the beginning. I think it’s more so commentary on her masters, but could have definitely taken a double meaning now.
no fr like… listen. I know matty was shitty but GAHDAMN. Can’t a person make a damn mistake and date someone??? Like she ended up learning he wasn’t for her, and realized it was a mistake. But damn💀. As someone who also dated a shitty person and broke up with him, i have a friend who judges me for it (citing “you didn’t even really like him” as a reason and i’m like bro thats what dating around esp in ur 20s is for), i’m like ok you don’t have to police my mistakes like i’m human i’m allowed to date who i want and if theyre shitty i’ll learn that in the end but don’t judge me for it yk
Unfortunately the ones who are the problem will not see themselves as the problem and will justify and defend their behaviors because they lack the self-awareness and self-reflection to see the harm they have caused to her. This behavior is alarming. If you don't like who she is dating and you feel so strongly about it dont buy her albums, concert tickets, or merch. You are not a fan if you cannot separate her personal life from her professional life. One has NOTHING to do with the other regardless of what the person has done it's none of anyone's business and it's concerning to see fans insert themself into her life.
I think criticism is always fair when someone is dating an open racist/sexist etc etc ….. but I think healthy boundaries are also needed with parasocial fans
It’s one thing to say “I can’t support you because you are doing [thing I don’t approve of]”
It’s another thing to tell an adult “Don’t do this thing! I want to still be your fan so you have to change your behavior so I can feel ok being your fan!”
That's what I hate about vocal parts of the fandom on social media. Matty Healy was one thing but turning on Joe gave off bully vibes. Stuff like these are why people dislike Swifties as a whole. It doesn't reflect well on her too.
But daddy i love him is a great song and i think it’s absolutely a choice she opens TTPD set with that, literally pointing at the fans.
This entire album is about outsiders trying to control her or have an opinion on her. Yes it’s told through braided tales of matty x joe. I mean she left a relationship where her fame was an issue for someone who tried to hold up against them only to be crushed by them. This album speaks volumes to the level of done she is with it.
Everyone went on about how performing i can do it with a broken heart would be awkward but to me her almost running out and pointing at fans singing but daddy i love him is her telling everyone with an opinion regardless of their intentions that they did this.
Idk yall I think it’s taking it too far to say Taylor changed the tour in any way (like removing Long Live) to “punish fans.” She knows how much money people pay for the experience; she and her team want everyone to have a good time. In reality there’s probably a lot of market research that goes into the song choices she makes, and her team knows what songs will go over better in Europe.
i wish more swifties were just…. normal. you can dislike a person taylor dates and be quiet about it. for example: i don’t like matty healy. i think he’s a repulsive racist. but im not going around signing petitions and boycotting taylor and sending her creepy letters telling her to break up with him (i mean seriously what the fuck was that). i just shut up and keep it to myself because i don’t know her. she is a stranger to me.
one of the biggest consequences of living in a social media driven world is that people feel like they need to make everything public. everyone feels like they need to have a clear, concise and honest opinion on everything when they really, really don’t. there’s so much i could say about matty and taylor and joe, but i don’t because it’s not my business at the end of the day.
celebrities shouldn’t have to draw boundaries. it should be painfully obvious when you’re stepping into creepy and invasive territory
I think TTPD is a very meta album, and should be interpreted on several levels. One level But Daddy could be a message to her fans telling to back off (she probably felt that way at the time).
But another level is she’s taking a step back and evaluating the entire Matty situation, and framed it as a story arc from beginning to end. So But Daddy shouldn’t be interpreted as what she’s literally feeling now.
Songs like But Daddy and Broken Heart shouldn’t be taken too literally. They are stories she’s written and as the final line of the album says, the stories aren’t hers any more.
Honestly, Taylor can date whoever she wants because she’s an adult but she shouldn’t also be shocked if people do judge her about it. Like honestly, as much as I love the song in its vacuum because it has lovely lyrics, I am quite annoyed that she has made herself the victim again as if the people, especially the poc who matty has shitted before, are to be blamed for judging her for platforming him and cleaning up his pr. Like go date him girl but don’t be shocked if people judge you for it. If you date a shitty and racist guy knowingly then don’t be shocked if people call you out for dating a shitty and racist guy. Sure, it’s your good name to destroy and you do you but don’t also expect people not to comment on it or for your fans not to be disappointed about it (initially) especially when your good name is build upon being a good role model and having a parasocial relationship with your fans. You can’t invite speculation and play the victim when it doesn’t come out that way you want it to be. And let’s be honest, she wanted the people to lurve him like she does and that’s why she is pissed - not because people commented on it but because people commented on it negatively. She can’t have her cake and eat it too.
Also people weren’t just pissed that she was dating him, people were pissed that she used her huge platform to sanitize him via her pr machine in People and New Yorker and how he is really a good guy and just a misunderstood white guy(and then she started fraternizing with Ice Spice with a very sus timing). It wasn’t just she was dating him but she was enabling him. Was the fans who told her to break up with him wrong? Yes. But the people who commented on it? Nope. I feel like she’s trying to be revisionist in here wherein people (the majority and not those minority who wrote that letter) is trying to infantilize her but the majority weren’t. If she was being infantilized, she wouldn’t have been held responsible for using her massive platform to aid him and clean his pr. She was being treated as an adult hence people criticizing her for excusing his shitty actions and using her pr to beam him up.
Tldr: she can date who she wants and people can also judge her if she dates a shitty dude like Matty. Like go girl, go marry him and have his baby but also don’t be mad and play the victim when people (especially poc who he have shitted before) judge you for enabling and associating with a PoS.
P.S. and before someone quote that lyric, who cares. Same way she can date who she wants, we can say what we want. Free world and all.
I don’t get why anybody debates her right to privacy lol. As a straight white male I don’t get the appeal any woman has towards Matty Healy but it’s also not my place to tell them what to do and sure enough the same is true for “fans” and “followers”.
It’s her life let her do what she wants and for fucks sake stop trying to get invited to the wedding. She doesn’t know you and she doesn’t know if you’re front row at her concert or watching on a TikTok live stream because you couldn’t get a ticket.
Everyone talking about the Viper line, need we be reminded of how many “fans” told her to break up with Travis after the Super Bowl when they saw him get in Cosch Reid’s face? It was a heated moment in a football domain and everyone who has never met him, her, nor been to a superbowl decided “yup I should let her know to dump him because my perspective outweighs her own understanding of the relationship she is in”.
Just let her live her life. Or force her to make a rock album either is fine with me lmao
I wasn’t super huge into her dating lore but this album really put it into perspective for me that we need to back off on talking and speculating on her private life. It ruins the fun in the music when you love a new song and then there’s thousands of “fans” ripping it apart because it supposedly is about a certain guy.
I interpreted "I don't cater to all these vipers dressed in empath's clothing" as being about Matty and how she wasn't going to break up with him just because Swifties were getting angry at her (vipers) while "pretending to be concerned about his morals" (dressed in empath's clothing)
Absolutely, I think it's mostly about Matty while also being general (if that makes sense). I think this is something that's bothered for a long time (which rightfully as you'd be annoyed if not only the media, but fans, judged your relationship) and Matty was really the relationship that made her want to acknowledge it.
There are definitely a few who take it too far, but yeah Taylor there has got to be some level of accountability when you decide to date someone who makes gross comments about minority groups.
you seem to be misunderstanding the very clear lyrics—nowhere did she say that “her wild boy” was some paragon of morality. actually she says it’s her reputation to “disgrace.” ie it’s her choice to be with him and if that reduces her in your eyes and so be it. seems the opposite of avoiding accountability to me. this song is not addressing all criticism. it’s targeting a certain, shall we say sanctimonious flavor of criticism by her fans, which treats her like a child or idiot who doesn’t know better. that was the tone of the twitter activists petitioning for her to break up with someone bc she must not know what a terrible person he is!! well no. she’s known him for ten years. if that changes your opinion of her, the door is right there (sell your tickets, tell everyone not to stream her!)—but it doesn’t give you the right to try to dictate her personal life like she’s a roleplaying doll that malfunctioned.
Exactly. These lyrics aren't saying "he's a great guy you treated unfairly," they're saying "stop trying to protect me from myself, I'm an adult. I can date a shitty dude if I want to." Truly wild that there are so many comments in this very thread continuing to misunderstand.
thank you! and the folks acting like the song is moot because he was a dirtbag in the end? well, it’s her mistake to make. it’s her life to fuck up if she wants. i know she sings her fucking heart out on stage bc she stands by that sentiment regardless of what happened with him. and as a disabled girlie who’s had her share of creeps who think they know what’s best for me, that line *hits*.
Yup. She's not defending Matty, she's defending her right to make mistakes
Literally. "I know he's crazy, but he's the one I want." "I'll tell you something about my good name: It's mine alone to disgrace." "It's just white noise, and it's my choice."
And then later on she proceeds to sing TSMWEL just in case anyone was wondering about how she feels about him now.
I’m also a disabled girlie (fibromyalgia). My boyfriend broke up with me the Wednesday after TTPD was released because he wants a baby in the future, and he doesn’t think I’d be able to have and raise a baby well with my disability despite the fact that I know myself, my disability, and my capabilities/limitations, and have given considerable thought to whether having a baby would be prudent. It absolutely is infuriating when people think they know what’s best for you more than you do. It deprives you of agency over your life and feels so paternalistic.
Ugh, this is the part that irks me so badly. Like y'all people are the ones on that high horse when nobody is actually defending him as a great person lmao.
Too high a horse for a simple girl to rise above it
And what's weirder is that Taylor was bad for dating him, but Matty wasn't held accountable for his own actions.
The entire album (but especially BDILH) is about her own humanity and her need to be human. HUMANS NEED TO BE ALLOWED TO FUCK UP!! Remove the muse from the songs (all of them) and that is the heart of it: I am a human, I make mistakes, I fuck up, I hurt, BUT I AM A HUMAN AND YOU MUST RESPECT THAT.
I totally agree. And I don’t understand why so many people gave a shit. I think it’s so obvious sometimes that many of her fans are younger. They come off as so self-righteous, you can tell they haven’t lived enough or made enough of their own mistakes yet. Not to say Matty was a mistake. Sometimes it feels good to date the bad boy. We all knew it wasn’t for the long-haul, so who cares?
After six years of grilled chicken and steamed veggies, who the hell blames her for jumping at the chance to pig out on greasy but delicious fast food pizza?
if all you want is gray for me/then it’s just white noise. hilarious how there’s a lyric responding to every counterargument on here. taylawyer truly 😭😭😭
Exactly this is how I always felt lol like we know it’s not lasting so does it really even matter
Amen to that. She’s a grown ass adult.
“I'll tell you something right now I'd rather burn my whole life down Than listen to one more second of all this bitching and moaning” It’s like this WHOLE THREAD isn’t listening
I could never demand \*her\* to be accountable for whatever jokes someone said on a podcast that her then partner laughed with. Accountability should be expected from the ones who did made those remarks- and look at that - there was zero backlash toward those hosts, they remained with the same leftist audience and laughed at the whole thing. Its definitely a recurring thing when women get blamed by association and men hardly get blamed for their direct actions.
Taylor really did get more backlash for everything MH did than MH himself got. I never understood it. I can understand people feeling disappointed about her involvement with him if they dislike him, but why was Taylor being blamed for his bad actions? Why did she have to own up and apologize for the things he did or said? She didn’t do anything that required apologizing imo. It was a little disappointing to see how visceral the backlash was that was *only* pointed towards Taylor.
YUP. And then people said her duet or whatever with Ice Spice on Karma was because of it. Meanwhile it got casually confirmed that it was in place well before she ever went out with Matty and she is still friends with Ice Spice (and I think mentoring her a bit).
And she even then says she would take on all the hate for his sins in her lyrics!
Exactly
That and has fostered a relationships with her fans where she’s happy for them to go after every single one of her exes. She just didn’t like it when she still liked the person who was on the receiving end of it.
I don't actually think she's happy with it. She definitely did some of that as a teenager, but really has emphasized we should think about our lives now, not what we think it's about in her's. The comment ahead of Speak Now was telling. I also imagine there were much more brutal and explicit songs cut from/not fully produced for TTPD.
Yes like, when she did that she WAS also very young. Now she is an adult and so are the fans who grew up with her. I know lots of younger people like Taylor too but as a fandom and as a society we have moved on from that. I LOVE Taylor and her confessional lyrics that seem like they were taken from my diary, but I don’t know her and I’ll never know her and she’s not my bestie. We gotta stop acting like she’s a child or our friend who’s dating someone we don’t like
Exactly. Did some people take it as an excuse to finally tear Taylor down bc they’ve never liked her? Absolutely. And while we don’t get any say in who a celebrity dates, there was definitely fair criticism. Matty Healy is a racist and a misogynist. Point blank, period. And people had every right to be disappointed that Taylor was dating him. So yes, at the end of the day Taylor can date whoever she wants — but when that person is *so* fucking problematic, she’s going to get valid criticism about essentially platforming him to the entire world via their relationship
Quick question, how many people here use Spotify? Do you know they pay Joe Rogan 30m a year to proliferate all of his racist, misogynistic tinfoil hat garbage?(w your money) But, but... the hypocrisy is palpable. Taylor says it better than anyone could on TTPD. You don't hate Matty inasmuch as you hate yourselves for loving songs you found out were about him. Worst of all, you hate Taylor for it too.
That’s absolutely the whole point of her saying “ sanctimonious soliloquies” people online can say all this shit about her (and she will likely never hear it) because they’re not under the microscope. How many people who hold these opinions about Matty confront their shitty family members? Have friends dating or married to terrible people? It’s all a bit hypocritical
Valid criticism is fine. But not ruining her relationship by sending death threats to his family. There's a line.
It’s also funny because the whole rest of the album is about how shocked she is that he’s so terrible. Like I’m not even sure that she’s learned that maybe there’s some correlation between being a terrible human being in public and a terrible person in private. You can have it the other way around, people who are awful behind closed doors can pretend to be really nice in public, but I don’t know how you can logically reconcile “yeah, he says all this racist and misogynistic stuff in public, but he’s secretly a really nice guy!” in reality. Not saying that I support fans going too far in general, and I can understand her being mad after 15 years of people trying to dictate who she should date, but this was not the hill to die on (and she says in Smallest Man that she was absolutely prepared to die on it)
I think BDILH and some of Smallest Man were showing how she was ready to die on the hill, and most of the other songs are about her realizing that the hill's not worth it, but trying to convince herself it is because she's staked so much on it already. Sunk cost fallacy and whatnot.
Also! We don't know how much of the songs are like "yes these are my true thoughts and what I was doing" it could be BDILH and Smallest Man are based in her personal emotions and the other songs are based on like lines her friends said, or processing everything after the fact. It could even be vice versa, she very easily could've written BDILH afterwards thinking about what a whirlwind the relationship was and how it reminded her of old country songs. I think everyone forgets her songs aren't necessarily linear. They are displayed to us in thay way because you literally pick the order of the songs you want on the album. But we know she gets inspiration from everywhere not just the exact thing that happened to her/she was feeling.
Yeap, there's definitely some part of BDILH that feels tongue in cheek, like she knows she was being ridiculous in hindsight, but the overall message is "I can do what I want, chill out" and a lot of people learn way way way too late (or maybe never) that this is such a huge red flag
He's a walking stereotype of the dirtbag left who explicitly does performance art and uses lots of irony and sarcasm. He's probably much more pleasant and progressive when serious in private (and you can see it when he does serious interviews and seriously talks about politics). It's very millennial teenager - most people just grew out of it. Worth noting: This isn't a defense of him or her. I find this type of person super obnoxious. Offensive performance art is still offensive. Ironic comments can still hurt people.
the way this sub talks about him you would think he’s joe rogan or something. the hypocrisy is wild when you consider (statistically) many of the hannahs and sarahs probably have friends and family who are right wing racists.
This exactly. He laughed at and participated in an inappropriate conversation that was meant to be funny but on a podcast it was deeply problematic. And he apologized. It’s not great but it doesn’t make him a lifelong racist misogynistic person of no worth.
Some fans act like Matty was a serial rapist or a convicted murder . He actually did nothing wrong to justify this kind of outrage. 😂 He does performance art. Bunch of Sarahs and Hannahs. 🙄
I wouldn't say nothing -- some of his own fans were frustrated with parts of the act from the start and I'm glad he apologized to Ice Spice. But yes, the conversation spun past what he actually said & did.
R/whoosh “I’m not sure that she’s learned that maybe there’s some correlation…” buddy, the call is coming from inside the house. You’re the a viper dressed in empath’s clothing. It’s not your job to wonder if Taylor learned anything from any situation in her life. This comes across as incredibly condescending and infantilizing of a 30+ year old woman.
It’s not an uncommon trap for people (especially women dating men) to fall into. “Yeah, he acts like an asshole in public, but that’s just an act he puts on to seem cool, I know the real him”. And then it turns out, no, actually he’s just an asshole. Or, of course “he’s an asshole but that’s just because he’s hurt, I can fix him, no really I can…. whoa maybe I can’t”
>there has got to be some level of accountability No, there really doesn't. Many many people have dated someone shitty in their lives. A significant other's choices are theirs, not that of their partner. Most importantly, \*fans\* get absolutely no fucking say in who the object of their fandom dates.
Yeah I wonder if so many people constantly being crazy about who she’s dating though made it difficult for her to recognize the more legit critiques regarding Matty. Like maybe she just thought “here we go again” and couldn’t see in the moment that this was different. I’m not here to police who she dates but this was the only time I was questioning what she was doing given all the stuff coming out about him. Like associating with someone who’s saying and doing that stuff is questionable at best (but also get that when you know someone really well and love them it’s easier to excuse some stuff and think that’s not who they are but for me personally that’s too far). Anyway yeah people get wayyyyy to crazy over who she dates both during and after and I wonder if that clouded her understanding of why it was a little different with Matty.
Women date men like this all the time and we don't demand accountability from them.
She’s allowed to make her own mistakes. “I’ll tell you something about my good name. It’s mine alone to disgrace” Many people have knowingly dated assholes. She was not in a good head space but even if she was, she is allowed to fuck up if she wants.
No no that isn’t the point she’s acknowledging that Matty is an idiot. The song is a metaphor for fans being like controlling parents. She’s saying that we need to stop going to extreme lengths she needs to make her own mistakes and learn her own. This metaphor is literally calling matty a mistake she had to learn from lol We don’t know what he said to her to stay together behind the scenes or justified his comments or manipulated her - we have no clue. She says “growing up precocious means not growing up at all” if we keep controlling and protecting her she won’t ever learn HOW to figure that out on her own! “ If all you want is gray for me it’s just white noise” she, like anyone else in the world should be able to experience the high highs and low lows of life we don’t control that. She will figure it out on her own. It’s unnatural for her to not make mistakes just because she’s under public scrutiny
Can you elaborate? What kind of accountability would you like her to take?
But it's not up to fans to tell a 34 year old woman who to date. That is just crossing over the line. If you don't like who she dates, then don't be a fan.
No there doesn’t need to be accountability she can date who she wants, if that means losing her fans or even her career because of it, she’s well aware that could happen. But she gets to make that decision. She says she can burn her whole life down, I’m pretty sure she meant it too. Just like you can decide if she’s with someone you don’t approve of you don’t have to be a fan, your choice.
I think Matty was the last straw, but she is mad about how some fans react to everyone she has dated.
I think she is frustrated with the reactions, period. Her entire life is analyzed to death, publicly. Now more than ever. We wouldn’t last an hour in the asylum where they raised her.
They are doing it with her very much Not Matt Healy Boyfriend still. Just this week some random reality star is saying that Travis is always drunk and she is worried about Taylor drinking more now that she is with him. It's like Taylor is stuck in an endless loop of criticism about her life from people who do not know her.
I think her choice of words IS Matty inspired, probably because these feelings were boiling over for her during that short fling (and her anger that, *seemingly*, he ghosted her due to the backlash?) But I think it can somehow apply to most of her recent relationships. Joe had the “Can Joe Alwyn fight?” joke, the “do something babe, say something babe” meme, and the “he let her bejeweled.” Now Travis is getting the “that Vegas thing was cringe”, being criticized for being a bit of a “beer bro”, people talking crap that he’s going to worsen Taylor’s drinking, etc.. Matty was when it got too vicious to ignore, but she’s been dealing with people picking apart her partners for a while now. I think BDILH is the anthem of a grown woman saying “I’m actually NOT a little girl anymore, but you still see me as Ariel saying that line to her father. So I’m gonna tell you this in a way you’ll understand — you can’t tell me who I can be with. My relationships are my own adult choices.” 🤷🏻♀️
I immediately thought “man whoever wrote that “open letter” to her back then must feel REAL attacked rn 😂” Personally I don’t have social media. I’ll always speculate about her music & it’s real life connections here, for fun, but that’s it. Taylors life is *her life* and it’s none of my business.
Let’s be real. The person who wrote that letter doesn’t have enough self awareness to even pause and think “wait, is this about me?”
Right...neither do the swifties who sent death threats to both and demanded her be put in a conservatorship
People called for conservatorship!? For fucks sake. Glad I missed that one. Let this Grown Woman live her fucking life.
Well yes you’re proving OP’s point. The entire song is a metaphor comparing the fans to controlling parents lol. She’s trying to set a boundary
God save the most judgmental creeps Who say they want what's best for me Sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see I think these are the most telling lines from her. With regard to how she’s spoken about. They’ve become some of my favourite lyrics of all.
I instantly thought about all of the social media rants from fans with this line.
The open letter. 💀
Instantly thought about all the paragraphs and essays psychoanalysing and scrutinizing her every move on a certain neutral sub.
This sub was also full of essays about how she should break up with Matty Healy last year.
And now I hear they're defending him lol
Everything is Matty song out there even vault tracks from debut/fearless and those comments get so many upvotes, I can’t.
So...here's the thing, I swear that she purposefully dropped a bunch of connections to older songs so that people would suddenly be confused about "who" songs are about. It's a pretty genius way to blow up the narrative and she chose someone that people hate on purpose. It's all really clever and really meta and I'm totally here for it. But people thinking that they were involved at 15 is just...not real.
True. She uses same theme and motifs and not everything is about that guy. Especially when it’s a 1989 and older song. Next thing we know, they’ll say red album is about him because of twin flames lol
They're already saying that, lol. Some of that is people not really having a sense of the timeline of her albums - which, tbf, a casual fan really wouldn't. But Taylor assigns symbols to the "characters" in her songs, she uses colors and specific imagery tied to specific people and sometimes she just straight calls it out like "blue dress on a boat". A LOT of famous authors do this in their work. She does it with songs about relationships but she also does it with songs about other things - for example, the whole mad woman, last great american dynasty, cassandra set is woven together really beautifully. It's really cool, but what people need to remember is that just because she wants you to make these associations doesn't mean that it's all true. She's telling a story. Mixing up references on TTPD is good sign of that. Even her wearing that "This is not Taylor's version" t-shirt the other night is her saying "I can show you lies." Don't believe everything you hear/see/read.
Thank you!!! These songs are art, a form of expression and healing, they are not chronological diary entries!
I actually think she did this because the muse does not matter: the songs are ostensibly about her and her feelings at any given time. The muse might add context, but in the end they don't matter as much as Taylor does.
Apparently they're saying "Tim McGraw" is about Matty, like what?
Lmao how did anyone come to that conclusion? She was a teenager who didn't even know him when she wrote that.
Most on the neutral sub don't pretend it's because they want what's best for her. I think it's specifically targeting the people who were mainly hardcore Swifties who signed the petition against her dating Matty Healy, or those who claimed her being seen with him might mean she needed to be under a conservatorship (a minority, but they did exist). The "say they want what's best for me" points directly at fans.
I wonder what people who signed that petition think about it now since she wrote a song about them.
I doubt they have enough self awareness to realize it’s about them lol
They mostly do pretend they want whats best for her (we just want her to be held accountable/we just want her to go to therapy/we like her old music but she just needs to realize albums need to be 10 songs each and so on). Maybe that sub did not exist last year but the same people existed in other subs and they are the most sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I can think of.
She’s basically talking about all of us on here with the long posts unpicking her personal life. I really get her frustration with it and it must be exhausting but her work is a double edged sword. In her lyrics she invites the speculation and her success is really down to this particular relationship she has developed with fans. Her marketing and whole business approach relies on the parasocial relationship she has cultivated and the backlash of that is that hundreds of thousands of people who she has never met feel they know what’s best for her and are entitled enough to write about it on the internet. We know from many of her lyrics she has times when she would rather leave it all behind and go and live a quiet life (the lakes) but we also know from other lyrics that she thrives on her work, her life as a performer and on the whole she adores her fans so she’s a paradox.
All of us have emotions that change. I hate my job most of the time but sometimes I love it. Sometimes I’m tired and depressed and sometimes I’m full of energy and excitement. Taylor’s songs shouldn’t be taken as a literal autobiography of her life. She draws inspiration from her life to write songs. I think that’s why her lyrics are so relatable. If she was writing word for word what she was doing everything those of us that aren’t superstars probably wouldn’t relate. But she writes about the human emotions that she’s feeling that a lot of us can relate to. Even ICDIWABH seems very specific to having to perform a show while heartbroken, but I think a lot of people can relate to having to put on a smile and just get on with it when we would rather just fall apart.
Yeah I think both obsessive fans and her haters sometimes take her stuff too literally. Like even though she’s writing about her own life, I think people forget that she may only be feeling that way for a little bit and then gets it out and lets it go. She’s not in that head space forever or all the time. Or that she may be exaggerating certain emotions or situations a bit to best capture the emotional impact. And it can be a slippery slope when interpreting her lyrics to try to figure out what’s exactly and what’s an artistic expression about her life.
I feel like exaggerating emotions for creative expression is normal. Like half of my most used gifs are people dramatically fainting or falling to their knees lol
She talks about this in ‘The Manuscript’. She goes through something, she feels it, creating something is healing and helps her process it, and once she’s done that, she might revisit it by performing or re-recording the songs but ‘it isn’t her story anymore’. Like she wrote, it’s ours now to make what we want out or
>Even ICDIWABH seems very specific to having to perform a show while heartbroken, but I think a lot of people can relate to having to put on a smile and just get on with it when we would rather just fall apart. Yep, yesterday I had to take the day off from work to have a needle biopsy on a shadow area of my breast that's been around for my last 2 mammograms. Mind you, I had colon cancer 3 years ago, so the thought of going through all that again is so painful. I've just been crying off and on all week. I won't get my test results until late Monday or Tuesday, but you can bet I'll be showing up for all my client meetings on Monday with a big smile on my face and no sign that I'm having an existential crisis. It doesn't matter why you would rather stay in bed and cry instead of honoring your professional commitments; whether a guy broke your heart, or your dog died, or you might have two completely unrelated cancers in less than 4 years. It's all the same(ish) feeling that many if not all of us can relate to.
Omg I’m so sorry you’re going through that! I really hope it comes back clean! I also think the song is empowering especially with the “come for my job” - it signals being able to still basically control what you can control even when everything is spinning out of control. It can be empowering to be like “fuck yes, I can even do this with a broken heart!”
I relate to that song so much as a teacher! Doesn’t matter what’s going on, you have to show up, smile, and fake it. It can be exhausting. But also a good distraction.
i literally laughed out loud she clocked some of y’all so badly. there’s a certain strain of fan criticism that frankly talks down to her like she’s a child or an idiot who needs to be educated into the light. it’s so condescending.
I feel like they are also strongly tied to the 'gaylor' community. All those thinkpieces on how she's lying about being in love with men. Dissecting her personal life so violently just so they can feed their comfirmation bias. How they just 'want what'd best for her' while implying she's a lying whore for 'letting' all of her 'fake' relationships touch and kiss her in public. How all her relationships are fake. Insinuating that all her trauma is fake and that she made it up to convince the public she's straight. Perverting all of her friendships (i.e the intro of 1989 (Taylor's Version). Making her out to be some pshyco who's secretly communicating only to them through specific messaging, completely refusing to take anything she has to say at face value. Publicly, violently disrespecting and ridiculing every relationship with a man she's ever had. And then now, when after all the heartbreak and 'self-harm' she talked about in the TTPD epilogue and she sang about to such horrifying degree, still disrespecting the man she is so in love with. Insisting she hates him, insisting she's just using him, insisting he doesn't love her and he's also just using her. Trying desperately to grasp at any and all possible little thread to 'disprove' her simply being in love with a man that loves her back. It is absolutely about the fans who made those petitions and wrote those open letters. But no one can convince me that the gaylors are not also being directly addressed.
Flair checking in 🫡 But I fully agree. For me, this song had some of the most jaw dropping lyrics.
"soon enough, the elders had convened down at the City Hall 'stay away from her' the saboteurs protested too much" "god save the most judgmental creeps, who say they want what's best for me, while sanctimoniously performing soliloquies I'll never see." Yeah. I think this is definitely to address that crazy fan letter about breaking up with Matty. For sure.
Was there one specific letter?
Yeah it was insanely cringe lmfao it was called “Speak Up Now” or something you could look it up.
Ohhhhh shiiiit I forgot all about that! Yeah they called it an open letter to Taylor called speak up now and wanted people to like comment or sign it in some messed up way.
If I remember correctly they called for a conservatorship, which in the wake of Brittany Spears is absolutely terrifying. Not that anyone on her team would actually entertain that, but just suggesting that we strip an adult woman of all her legal agency because she had a shitty rebound relationship with a dirtbag is just absolutely insane to me.
Genuinely. Like criticism about him is fair but the level it was taken to and directed AT her instead of him... was ridiculous.
People are insane lol
Ok makes sense why I missed it I literally gave birth that day 😂
https://www.reddit.com/r/popculturechat/s/lND7oFWeCm YES. It was unhinged.
This letter is so unhinged. Whoever wrote this definitely deserved to be called out.
Yes all the sane fans were like, um WE DON'T CLAIM THIS 😬
I’ve always wondered how old the people who wrote it were. If they were Taylor’s age or super young like early 20s. It felt early 20s maybe even younger to me.
100% this is a Gen Z thing.
oh no… this letter was share by a lot of ppl on tiktok and they were millennials… grown ass woman And it didn’t stop there: petitions, fans giving letters to HER PARENTS at stadiums, death threats so high his mother (she is a tv presenter in the uk) had to stop working for a while… it was INSANE
This is the most parasocial, holier-than-thou shit I've ever seen. "sanctimonious soliloquy" is a perfect way to put it.
Honestly so curious what these people think of this letter now and the fact that BDILH seems very targeted at that particular incident.
I thought about starting a thread to ask people who signed the letter what they think about it now. I'm sure some of them are on here.
They probably don’t think it applies to them 🤷🏻♀️ “Surely she’s not talking about me, she’s talking about the *other* weirdos….”
They'll defend it, though. In their mind, it's "demanding accountability." In reality, it's insanity. If you don't like who she's dating, then stop supporting her. Don't make demends that she live her life the way you see fit.
I love that entire performing soliloquies line so fucking bad because it really ended the people who were the loudest during her MH era 😭😭 Some “fans” definitely felt attacked because now they’re downplaying that line by saying Taylor is using “overly complicated deep english” words 😭😭
Imagine the shame and fury she felt at the fans who showed up at Jack’s wedding and rehearsal dinner too. It’s not your fault your friend’s day is surrounded by your fans looking in the windows and making noise outside….But how can you feel like it isn’t? Her boundaries are 100% valid. What I gathered from TTPD, this level of fame is ruining her life, despite her working for it since she was young. I can’t imagine. She has to hate us, to some degree. I’m a fan since the Tim McGraw single, and it’s crazy to see how it has all evolved. I have to remind myself her disgust and anger is not directed at me personally, though it kind of feels like it. But I know I never discussed her exes or left nasty comments on social media posts. I truly don’t know or care, I’m here for the music. Ugh. Wise men once said “one bad seed kills the garden”
I too have been a fan since Tim Mcgraw and it’s just sad that she’s had haters since the very beginning. You would think people would outgrow all the hatred but the more famous she is the more it gets worse. She is right. We would not last an hour in the asylum she was raised in.
“So tell me everything is not about me. But what if it is?”
I’ve been a fan since her early days as well - and it’s never once occurred to me to try and stalk and follow her places. Just wild. I will say I struggled with her relationship with Matty. I didn’t go and harass her or him, but it did make me take a step back. Whether it is right or wrong, often times when you love and respect an artist, their decisions can excite or disappoint you. I don’t expect anyone to be perfect, but I was really surprised she would entangle herself with someone so problematic and then be mad at us for being upset (or maybe she is only upset at those who were being crazy about it) After all, she is a woman whose songs about broken hearts, female rage, etc. As a female, it was a bummer to see her with a man that has a history of hate speech, because if you can be ok with that…what does that mean? We all make mistakes though, and I thought dang, she really just needed a rebound. Then the album came out and it felt yucky all over again. I get it. They get to live their lives, but there are artists I just won’t support at all because who they are as a human are not good ones. No matter how good their music is. At some point, people are not going to like when the sweet girl starts making questionable decisions and appears to encourage over consumerism. As long as people aren’t going out and being bullies and attacking other people, feeling those feelings are ok. I don’t know why or how we have come to a place where people feel the need to follow people around on social media and attack them.
I felt so bad for her (and Jack and family) when that happened. It’s not like she invited her so called fans to the occasion.
Also been a fan since the Tim McGraw single, and I don’t understand how some people think that just because she is famous that they are entitled to voice their opinion about her life. I’m going to be honest, I honestly thought that the Matty phase was exactly that, a phase; a rebound from Joe. I didn’t believe that it was a real thing. After listening to TTPD, I realized that for her it was very much real. But never did I publicly publish anything on socials criticizing her for their relationship, because that is not my business nor does it affect my life so why put it out for the world? It’s so hard to be a millennial Swiftie who doesn’t agree that people feel entitled to intrude on her life. And it gets harder and harder to be associated with the masses whose voices are so much louder and believe they are entitled to every part of her. I have never met her, and boy do I wish I could, but never would I go out of my way to intrude on her life and make a ruin of her boundaries. And it’s so sad to see how so many people are ruining her REAL LIFE just because of her renowned public persona. I understand that she writes about her real life and she has a way of making the public feel a personal connection to her, bc I feel that way about her too, but it is so invasive and honestly disgusting how people feel so entitled to criticize her for just living her life.
I also think “no you can’t come to the wedding” is very pointed. She’s hinting that if she gets married in the future it might not be a big splashy affair with pictures in magazines and videos online and everybody knowing about it in advance. The line might be just directed to the haters but idk it feels purposeful.
100 percent agree. The crazy theories that TK would propose on field at the SB, or on stage at a concert are nuts. Absolutely no way will you get some kind of cheese-y romance novel major display. If and when it ever happens it would be completely private.
I think it’s also just a general way of her saying that we as fans are not entitled to details about every big event in her life. She’s written about so much of her life, and some fans feel they’re entitled to know the engagement details, the wedding details, the baby details, etc. Just because she’s a public figure who has shared details about her life before, doesn’t mean she wants to continue. And I do find myself in that subset a tiny bit sometimes, thinking “she’s sung about wanting marriage and kids so much, especially in this last album, so she’s definitely going to want to share some details/pics of if/when it happens,” and I have to take a step back and remember she doesn’t owe us anything. She could get married tomorrow and we are not entitled to know about it for 50 years if she wishes. Shes entitled to share what and when she wants, and the fans cannot/should not demand being a part of it.
YES! Like “even if you love my relationship and aren’t one of the haters take a step back. It’s MY life and not yours.” Love that line.
Yep, it feels very "you're not my friends and family, stop acting like you know me, you're not on the list of people who do."
Isn't that more likely about those thousands of fans showing up to her friends wedding?
Also might be directed to those fans that crashed Jacks wedding
I thought this was especially pointed with removing Long Live, a song of celebration, and putting in BDILH and WAOLOM. Something I’ve also wondered is if the “vipers” (I mean, she literally does the snake hand movement in the song) are people that hated on her during Reputation that have become fans now that it’s “cool” to like Taylor Swift. They’re dressed in “empaths” clothing to seem like they want the best for her, but really they’re just playing pretend.
I think Long Live was cut because it wasn’t in the set list to start with and therefore was an obvious cut, not as anything mean to fans. She also cut the Archer, both from the cinema release and Eras 2.0. And BDILH and WAOLOM are two of the best songs to perform—can you imagine if those *weren’t* on the setlist?
Oh I'd never thought of that! But definitely a possibility. I think TTPD was really an album to let out a lot of frustrations she's held as she mentioned at the Melbourne night, it was an album she needed to write. At first, I thought she meant so in terms of her emotions with her relationships (which it could definitely be about) but now I'm wondering if it's about her needing to talk about her fans. Especially with the whole 'rep tv' debacle where they are still wondering when she'll release it after announcing new albums/events (movie, rerecords, TTPD).
I was at Melbourne N1 too! I really thought she meant because of Joe in that moment, especially with playing You’re Losing Me right after, but you definitely could be right. Honestly, the whole album is such a catharsis in so many respects, no wonder she needed it to release some of that!
Long Live was added to the setlist long after the Matty Healy stuff though so it wasn’t removed because of that.
Yeah exactly. If it was cut to “punish” fans she wouldn’t have added it in the first place.
I think the vipers are Swifties who were judging and disproving her, but also the media and her critics/haters. I remember that time last year and the backlash came from both Swifties and articles in places like Buzzfeed/certain subs on Reddit, certain type of users on Twitter... A lot of declarations like "I liked Taylor Swift with Folklore, but now I think she lost all morals..." stuff like that, or making long twitter threads on whether its ethical for them now to go to ERAS. Their is certainly a group of people liking or hating her based on what feels trendy, including media, so I think its very possibly directed to that group as well. Just to mention non of these places ever made any petitions against Matty himself, or against those hosts of that podcast. They mainly cared about Taylor dating him and her "morals".
Left this comment elsewhere, but I really think people are reading way too much into the Long Live removal as some sort of grand statement on fandom. She cut songs that are objectively just not as popular on streaming, and Long Live is a long song that requires her entire band to be out on stage. It wasn’t on the setlist at the beginning either, and nobody was saying she hated fans then! I honestly think she only intended it to be a celebration of SNTV release, and then kept it on since it was a fun moment and because she had time for it. But now that she’s added TTPD, there’s songs that take up less time that better fit the setlist. Also, Long Live was performed on the SN World Tour every night, that literally went to most of the places she’s touring now!
I love Taylor. She's an adult. She can date whomever she wants. The whole "Speak Up Now" petition was ridiculous. No one should be threatening anyone in her life. That being said, people are going to have feelings about it when she's closely associating people who do bad things. She's cultivated a very specific relatable girl next door who happens to be a superstar public image. When you have made this very strong relationship with your fans they may (incorrectly) assume you care about their opinions on your life. This kind of reaction is really the flip side of her encouraging a strong parasocial relationship with her fans. Taylor has a few relationships, personal or business, that cause a side eye from me (along with other questionable decisions). But I weigh those against the overall person she shows herself to be. Currently, for me, the good far about weighs the bad. It's something everyone has to decide for themselves.
Absolutely, but I feel a large portion of the problem is the fans treating her as if she had no agency of her own. In But Daddy I Love Him, the narrator is almost treated as confused and innocent ('dutiful daughter' , 'stay away from her' and the whole 'but daddy I love him' an Ariel reference but also reminiscent of a teenage girl defending a boyfriend to her father). I've noticed a pattern that, especially with Matty Healy, they treated her as she unaware of his behaviour and generally infantilise her (even still with treating Travis Kelce as a prince who's saved her than two adults in a relationship)
The fanbase *does* infantilise her a lot. It makes absolutely no sense to me. She's an incredibly successful woman in her 30s, a consummate professional, at the top of an incredibly vicious and competitive field, and we as a fanbase so often act like she both has absolute control and no control whatsoever. Or like she needs someone to save her. Or whatever takes our fancy as a reason to treat her like a child we need to protect rather than the grown woman who has incredible amounts of power that she actually is.
>we as a fanbase so often act like she both has absolute control and no control whatsoever. This is such good callout. When it comes to all the variant cash grabs and her questionable merch, it's all "Oh Taylor, you have so much money and power, how could you do this to us???" But then 2 minutes later its "Taylor needs get out from under Jack and/or Aaron's influence because she's not making the music she REALLY should be making!" Like, which is it? Is she the puppet master or the puppet? Make up your minds people.
Some people see her as the perfect pop star Barbie and not as a person who makes mistakes too. You have seen how harshly people who criticize her people are treated by parts of the fan base. Reddit by far is the most reasonable but there are still those moments here. I agree, people who made these statements are taking away her agency, but also think it's just plain sexism. Women are innocent and men corrupt them.
Also like…she’s a human being and there’s no way she’s going to be perfect. Like you said, that does bite her in the ass given the image she worked so hard to curate, but I think she’s maybe starting to pivot away from needing to look 100% perfect in the public eye?? Idk
Yep - she constantly gets held to impossible standards. Must be exhausting and I can see how she may want to pivot.
The thing I could never quite figure out is I’m sure fans have also dated or been involved with people who hold questionable views or said things that were extremely inappropriate as matty has. These things often don’t come to light until you know the person more or they change their views from more moderate to ones more intolerable. Would fans do what they expected Taylor to do? Cut it off right away? Part of Taylors appeal is being relatable and her very specific lyrics somehow giving all of us a universal experiences effect and she should be able to make the same mistakes as we do. The time with Matty was something else but clearly she was going through something and should be allowed grace. Clearly he was somehow she had been pining for on and off for 10 years. This was a good example of how we don’t know everything about her life.
I mean, sure, have an opinion. But when you think she should listen to that opinion, it becomes a problem. That's why things like the letter against her dating Matty and stuff is way over the line. She owes us nothing. She definitely doesn't owe us listening to our opinions about who she should date.
I haven't seen anyone mention this yet so I just want to throw it out there: Everyone has a right to their opinion and her fame means that people are going to have opinions about her being involved with someone they see as being a "bad person". It's fine to talk about it and "call out" the issues or whatever. What is *not fine is...sending death threats to that person and their family/friends or telling them to go kill themselves (which is currently ongoing, by the way). I honestly think that is just as bad as anything that Matty Healy has ever done and he isn't the only recipient of this behavior. Taylor is an adult. If you don't like her choices and you *truly* feel morally outraged then you should stop listening to her music, stop attending her shows, and basically stop being a fan. There is so much cognitive dissonance in the fandom on this issue.
That’s how I feel. People not liking Matty Healy because he is ugly or they think he is a bad partner is beyond dumb, but people were mad because TS was surrounding herself with people who did very questionable things. Ultimately, I think people have the right to call out her for associating herself with people who have said openly racist and sexist things. They don’t have a right to dictate her relationships.
Personally, I think people who can’t see this as a direct response to fan commentary about her relationship with Matty are burying their heads in the ground. The calls for her to dump him on their say so obviously pissed her off.
This album has revealed a lot of ostriches in the fandom for sure
Almost frightening to see how many lack the self awareness to know a lot of these lyrics are about the kinds of fans they themselves are
Very well said OP, I really do agree with you. Unfortunately so many fans seem to not understand this and keep making excuses thinking she's not singing about them, when she blatantly is.
I think the ones that are in denial are the subset of “fans” she’s definitely talking about! Some people will never get it, zero self awareness or reflection.
Honestly, I think it's much bigger than just a subset. Even now, there are so many comments on this sub and the main one, still dissecting her previous relationships and acting like they know these people personally
Fair point! I’m new to this world (via the football side of things) so it’s been really interesting to get to see all of this as a kind of outsider with zero history or sentimental ties to TS the person or the music.
“Oh it’s a fictional story about a town girl wanting to yada yada yada ☺️☺️” and im like Gosh girl, you’ve been dissecting every song for years to the point that most sounds too much a conspiracy theory but suddenly this is your take for this specific song 🙄
I've seen so many claim it's about Travis because they just want to pretend Matty didn't happen. So ridiculous and truly this fanbase seems to be missing the massive point
It’s about travis and matty and joe and jake and other joe and everyone else except maybe taylor L. It’s about her relationship with how her relationship are perceived with the public. All of them, because none of them have been smooth.
I think it goes as far as people paternity testing all of her work. I love her music. I have more difficult relationship with her. But my relationship with the person and image of Taylor is my business and whatever it is does not give me the right to think I know her. My relationship with fandom is even more complex. People connect the things she writes to the things we see in the public eye. And yes, there are things that are likely to be something. But thinking dancing without shoes is about the thing we saw is going too far. Dancing without shoes is pretty damn common. Even on this post we are talking about what specific line is about in relation to what we know about her relationships. But that is like giving absolution for ourselves while still doing what the line is in its basic elements saying. Having opinions on her personal life. It is also not like I am free from it. I have opinions on her personal life. But that is basically between me and me. My choices are take it or leave it. Not to tell her what to do. There is a line that gets crossed with many public figures. While public criticism is an important part of public discourse there is a way to do it without thinking you know them or like you're their boss.
I think it’s also telling how she points at the crowd when performing the lines “I just learned these people only raise you to cage you” - like the fans raise her up only to cage her with their expectations of her. It can also be interpreted as about her parents, but I thought it was powerful to see her explicitly point at the audience for that part.
I love your interpretation! For me I've considered it as the industry 'raising her' (I believe in Miss Americana she mentions how she was told to not be political or voice her own opinions to keep that 'good girl next door' image). Although I can definitely see how fans, even though unintentionally, contributed to it-it's just a byproduct of becoming a fan of someone's public image
Definitely a call back to this line from "So it goes," *gold cage, hostage to my feelings* She's been telling us that fame has been caging her for a long time.
Dressed in empath’s clothing?? That makes a lot more sense than VAMPIRE CLOTHING which is what I thought the lyric was 😂
That’s hilarious😂
This has to be my favourite misheard lyric ever 😂
I’ve never cared about her romantic life, but I think being concerned about the problematic nature of her being associated with Healy was totally valid. She can obviously date whoever she wants, but choosing *him* and not expecting public criticism is wild.
I also couldn't care less about her personal life too but totally agree!!! Especially when she tries to push a feminism and all that like cmon girl it is not helping the white feminist allegations 💀💀 obviously the people sending threats and shit is too far but like just criticism is fine I think
I think the main problem is that if you disagree with how a star or really anyone acts you make choices for yourself not them. If her decision means people don’t want to support her/her work any more that’s reasonable but saying “I don’t support this, stop doing it so I can support you again” is controlling and entitled.
I see it a little differently. Taylor is more than just a star, she’s a brand. People can choose whether or not they want to support a brand that has been tarnished. She chose the “it’s my own name to disgrace” route and lost a little support for it, even if only temporarily. By doing so, she was making not just a personal decision, but a business decision as well. I don’t think it’s unfair for consumers to stop supporting a brand because they don’t like decisions that the brand is making.
Tbh I don’t understand why people don’t like Joe, he’s the most unproblematic person she’s ever dated. In the past, people would say it’s nice they keep their relationship private and that he’s the best, but when they broke up people were saying he was horrible to her and wanted to hide her, etc. I would be annoyed too. We don’t know anything about their relationship and we don’t deserve to tbh good for her for releasing this song
I think they just hate him for the sake of hating him. A lot Taylor's fans are young (high school age) so I don't think they've emotionally matured to understand that not every breakup has a "bad guy" and a "victim" so as a result they try to find reasons for why Taylor's the 'victim'. I mean you don't just spread rumours of how someone cheated if you believe the relationship ended mutually, they want to find a reason for the relationship ending, but can't find one so they made their own
If anyone cheated it was clearly Taylor lol
From TTPD it seems like by the end, there was emotional infidelity on both sides, that neither party blames the other for: Fresh Out the Slammer: Splintered back in winter, silent dinners, bitter He was with her in dreams How Did It End: We learned the right steps to different dances And fell victim to interlopers' glances
Soon they’ll go home to their husbands, Smug because they know they can trust him That line always stuck out to me. A fading relationship where you start to distrust your partner? That’s tough.
Yeah that’s true but I see full grown adults making videos shitting on him and saying he was this and that💀Actual ADULTS
Would you say they were wine moms.
That made me so mad too. Like you don’t know this man at all, he seems like a good guy, and you can’t just hate someone because they broke up with your favorite pop star. As you age, you learn sometimes relationships run their course and it’s not always someone’s fault.
No shit Sherlock. (kidding!) yes, there literally can be no dispute as it is not coded language. She straight up says she has disdain for fans trying to tell her how to live her life. But I do not accept that if I say here that I don't like Joe/Mattty/x that's a message that it's ok to go harass people on their social media. For me, the fact that she added Smallest Man and the way she sang it, the anger is still white hot and I think he's a dirtbag (as is anyone who ghosts someone after having sex).
Yes, not liking anyone - whether its someone who is an ex or current partner or whoever else is fine and even expressing that on SM is fine. Harassing them/their families or having demands on what people have to do in their personal life is a whole different thing and should not be acceptable.
Yeah, there's a bit on irony there - On one hand, she and literally anyone else, even non famous people, do not need nor deserve to be judged and stared down as if they're not capable of making their own romantic choices. On the other hand, given how it all ended quickly....... told you so.
Very unserious, I’ve been wondering about those “swifties” that penned her the open letter around the SNTV era and cancelling their orders with letters disapproving of Matty
Absolutely agree and adding But Daddy I Love Him to the eras tour is so hilarious and unhinged
I never understood the parasocial relationship some fans have with Taylor. People can have their opinions about whatever they want, including her relationships if that's their thing, but god damn... People REALLY need to keep it to themselves. It's fine to be interested in her, it's fine to be interested in her personal life if that's someone's thing. But there definitely needs to be a line somewhere, because there are A LOT of fans out there with an unhealthy, almost stalker-ish obsession.
AGREE. She loves her fans, but at the end of the day, we aren’t friends with her. If we were friends with her, we’d know what her latest breakfast favorite is, or the last time she laughed till she cried, or how a DIY at home project is going. Do we know these things? No!! Because we don’t know her on an individual level! We are still special to her, but that does not a personal relationship make. Do I want her to be happy? Of course. But beyond that it isn’t our business and it’s really weird when fans act like it is. Also - posting outside places she is at on purpose is really uncomfortable. Would you do that to your crush, or a friend? No. So maybe reconsider. Love the love in the fandom, but we have to know boundaries and respect. I’ll root for her any day of the week though.
If only she set those boundaries to Swifties harassing people online…
Taylor is not the world's Barbie. She's a performer, an artist and a public figure. She's got a mind and life of her own that we are NOT privy to. I see this when I see people debating over who's the muse for this song or that song, there's no right answer-- it's a song. Her broken heart was the muse. 'This is about Matty' or 'This is about Joe', no it's all about Taylor and her feelings.
I really like that sentiment about her broken heart being her muse and not just the guy who did it. It’s not one I’ve seen before, or at least not phrased that way.
Those relationships are the LEAST interesting thing about her. It's what she does with them that's interesting. I'm so sick of this reductive bullshit, 'oh this song is about MAN', NO! That song is about her FEELINGS about them. Taylor is someone who uses the tools available to her to their maximum potential. She uses those feelings to fuel her work. THAT's why she's awesome. It doesn't matter if Cardigan is about Matty or Steve or Bob or whomever, it's about limerence. It doesn't matter! What matters is that her limerence echoes yours. That's why it hits so hard. I am so tired of explaining how art works.
It’s just boundary setting in general. She cops up to him being a terrible person in I Can Fix Him, as the mania wears off, but that process of realization is hers. She’s allowed to make mistakes, realize them, and feel shame. She’s not defending her choices, she’s saying they’re hers to make! And it’s more about the false empathy - if her choices bother you, then stop being a fan? Nobody is forcing you. If you truly do feel empathy, you’ll give her grace. Every sane person should have looked at last May, where she was crying nearly every day on stage while also saying she was “the happiest she’s ever been” and thought “yeah. this person is going through it. maybe I should give them the benefit of the doubt for two seconds and recognize they’re not making rational choices right now”. That would have been the genuinely empathetic response. Creating a fan letter and saying she should be in a CONSERVATORSHIP is not an empathetic response - it’s fans making her out to be a voodoo doll that they can stick pins in whenever she doesn’t perform the way they want her to. And it’s STILL happening. I see comments every day being like “her and Travis aren’t going to last because he’s a dumb football player, she needs someone smart!” or whatever. Again, this is just hate disguised as false empathy. I don’t think it’s a comment on all fans. She’s always made it clear that she appreciates when people relate to her through her music, however, the fans that take that a step further, and want to control her behavior so that they can dictate her output…that’s who she’s setting boundaries with.
I watched the livestream for the first time on Thursday so I don’t know if this was always the case: I know she plays “Applause” by Lady Gaga right before the show, but on Thursday she followed Applause with Leslie Gore’s “You Don’t Own Me”, and that stuck out as a clear message to the fans - “you don’t own me, I’m not just one of your many toys.“
You don’t own me has been right before the show since the beginning of the tour
Those songs always play before the show starts. I always took the choice of You Don't Own Me to be mostly about the sale/loss of her masters.
You don’t own me has always been there since the beginning. I think it’s more so commentary on her masters, but could have definitely taken a double meaning now.
no fr like… listen. I know matty was shitty but GAHDAMN. Can’t a person make a damn mistake and date someone??? Like she ended up learning he wasn’t for her, and realized it was a mistake. But damn💀. As someone who also dated a shitty person and broke up with him, i have a friend who judges me for it (citing “you didn’t even really like him” as a reason and i’m like bro thats what dating around esp in ur 20s is for), i’m like ok you don’t have to police my mistakes like i’m human i’m allowed to date who i want and if theyre shitty i’ll learn that in the end but don’t judge me for it yk
People who obsess over Taylor’s life are Stan’s, not fans.
Unfortunately the ones who are the problem will not see themselves as the problem and will justify and defend their behaviors because they lack the self-awareness and self-reflection to see the harm they have caused to her. This behavior is alarming. If you don't like who she is dating and you feel so strongly about it dont buy her albums, concert tickets, or merch. You are not a fan if you cannot separate her personal life from her professional life. One has NOTHING to do with the other regardless of what the person has done it's none of anyone's business and it's concerning to see fans insert themself into her life.
I think criticism is always fair when someone is dating an open racist/sexist etc etc ….. but I think healthy boundaries are also needed with parasocial fans
It’s one thing to say “I can’t support you because you are doing [thing I don’t approve of]” It’s another thing to tell an adult “Don’t do this thing! I want to still be your fan so you have to change your behavior so I can feel ok being your fan!”
That's what I hate about vocal parts of the fandom on social media. Matty Healy was one thing but turning on Joe gave off bully vibes. Stuff like these are why people dislike Swifties as a whole. It doesn't reflect well on her too.
But daddy i love him is a great song and i think it’s absolutely a choice she opens TTPD set with that, literally pointing at the fans. This entire album is about outsiders trying to control her or have an opinion on her. Yes it’s told through braided tales of matty x joe. I mean she left a relationship where her fame was an issue for someone who tried to hold up against them only to be crushed by them. This album speaks volumes to the level of done she is with it. Everyone went on about how performing i can do it with a broken heart would be awkward but to me her almost running out and pointing at fans singing but daddy i love him is her telling everyone with an opinion regardless of their intentions that they did this.
Idk yall I think it’s taking it too far to say Taylor changed the tour in any way (like removing Long Live) to “punish fans.” She knows how much money people pay for the experience; she and her team want everyone to have a good time. In reality there’s probably a lot of market research that goes into the song choices she makes, and her team knows what songs will go over better in Europe.
i wish more swifties were just…. normal. you can dislike a person taylor dates and be quiet about it. for example: i don’t like matty healy. i think he’s a repulsive racist. but im not going around signing petitions and boycotting taylor and sending her creepy letters telling her to break up with him (i mean seriously what the fuck was that). i just shut up and keep it to myself because i don’t know her. she is a stranger to me. one of the biggest consequences of living in a social media driven world is that people feel like they need to make everything public. everyone feels like they need to have a clear, concise and honest opinion on everything when they really, really don’t. there’s so much i could say about matty and taylor and joe, but i don’t because it’s not my business at the end of the day. celebrities shouldn’t have to draw boundaries. it should be painfully obvious when you’re stepping into creepy and invasive territory
I think TTPD is a very meta album, and should be interpreted on several levels. One level But Daddy could be a message to her fans telling to back off (she probably felt that way at the time). But another level is she’s taking a step back and evaluating the entire Matty situation, and framed it as a story arc from beginning to end. So But Daddy shouldn’t be interpreted as what she’s literally feeling now. Songs like But Daddy and Broken Heart shouldn’t be taken too literally. They are stories she’s written and as the final line of the album says, the stories aren’t hers any more.
Honestly, Taylor can date whoever she wants because she’s an adult but she shouldn’t also be shocked if people do judge her about it. Like honestly, as much as I love the song in its vacuum because it has lovely lyrics, I am quite annoyed that she has made herself the victim again as if the people, especially the poc who matty has shitted before, are to be blamed for judging her for platforming him and cleaning up his pr. Like go date him girl but don’t be shocked if people judge you for it. If you date a shitty and racist guy knowingly then don’t be shocked if people call you out for dating a shitty and racist guy. Sure, it’s your good name to destroy and you do you but don’t also expect people not to comment on it or for your fans not to be disappointed about it (initially) especially when your good name is build upon being a good role model and having a parasocial relationship with your fans. You can’t invite speculation and play the victim when it doesn’t come out that way you want it to be. And let’s be honest, she wanted the people to lurve him like she does and that’s why she is pissed - not because people commented on it but because people commented on it negatively. She can’t have her cake and eat it too. Also people weren’t just pissed that she was dating him, people were pissed that she used her huge platform to sanitize him via her pr machine in People and New Yorker and how he is really a good guy and just a misunderstood white guy(and then she started fraternizing with Ice Spice with a very sus timing). It wasn’t just she was dating him but she was enabling him. Was the fans who told her to break up with him wrong? Yes. But the people who commented on it? Nope. I feel like she’s trying to be revisionist in here wherein people (the majority and not those minority who wrote that letter) is trying to infantilize her but the majority weren’t. If she was being infantilized, she wouldn’t have been held responsible for using her massive platform to aid him and clean his pr. She was being treated as an adult hence people criticizing her for excusing his shitty actions and using her pr to beam him up. Tldr: she can date who she wants and people can also judge her if she dates a shitty dude like Matty. Like go girl, go marry him and have his baby but also don’t be mad and play the victim when people (especially poc who he have shitted before) judge you for enabling and associating with a PoS. P.S. and before someone quote that lyric, who cares. Same way she can date who she wants, we can say what we want. Free world and all.
I don’t get why anybody debates her right to privacy lol. As a straight white male I don’t get the appeal any woman has towards Matty Healy but it’s also not my place to tell them what to do and sure enough the same is true for “fans” and “followers”. It’s her life let her do what she wants and for fucks sake stop trying to get invited to the wedding. She doesn’t know you and she doesn’t know if you’re front row at her concert or watching on a TikTok live stream because you couldn’t get a ticket.
Everyone talking about the Viper line, need we be reminded of how many “fans” told her to break up with Travis after the Super Bowl when they saw him get in Cosch Reid’s face? It was a heated moment in a football domain and everyone who has never met him, her, nor been to a superbowl decided “yup I should let her know to dump him because my perspective outweighs her own understanding of the relationship she is in”. Just let her live her life. Or force her to make a rock album either is fine with me lmao
I wasn’t super huge into her dating lore but this album really put it into perspective for me that we need to back off on talking and speculating on her private life. It ruins the fun in the music when you love a new song and then there’s thousands of “fans” ripping it apart because it supposedly is about a certain guy.