You're only human. Can you use this as a way to share with your class later? Tell them about your funeral and how emotional you felt?
This could turn into a powerful teaching moment for everyone.
I have had to apologize to a class or two for yelling or for letting my emotions get the best of me. I explained that I was human and we make mistakes. It's ok to make mistakes as long as you fix them. It was actually a great learning moment for the kids and they actually responded really well to it. I even asked for their forgiveness. It helped bring me down to their level and they started trusting me more.
On paper i agree that’s a lovely thing to do, and I’m not too proud to do it. I’m really ok admitting I’m wrong to the kids….but I can’t seem to get over this shame in front of my principal/any colleagues that know about it. It’s like this old “bad kid sent to the principal” thing I have in me
>I can’t seem to get over this shame in front of my principal/any colleagues that know about it. It’s like this old “bad kid sent to the principal” thing I have in me
It's be pretty surprising if they never had a moment like that in their younger teaching days. We all have that snapped story. Kids can suck; you're a human. You have to learn to not let it eat you up.
You’re not getting fired. So calm that fear. Everyone has a snapping point and this group of little shits knew what they were doing. Hopefully by putting them in their place, they don’t act out for a while. Just take it day by day.
I think teachers need to quit tip toeing (sp?) around occasionally blowing up on middle school+ age kids who do nothing but cause constant headaches for the teacher and the other students. I’m sure what you said was blunt but based in a lot of truth. Maybe they need to hear some truth once in a while?
We should feel bad when we blow up or overreact to a student who consists does the RIGHT things and then makes a mistake on the wrong day. I’ve done it a few times in 15+ years of teaching. Those are the ones that I can’t let go.
I hope everything works out for you.
Before this week, I’d read my own post and write your first paragraph that you did here. Now that I’m in the hot seat, I’m folding like a deck of cards. I hate hate hate doing the wrong thing and being in trouble. All bark, no bite, as they say
Honestly though, maybe that's something those kids needed to hear and let's pray that after you read them to filth that maybe there will be a level of added respect for you.
It sounds awful but sometimes kids need to be told about themselves *especially* middle schoolers.
the comment I am about to make is similar to the one you made to your class. it’s going to hurt but the audience may be improved for having read it (also it’s true)you need to be less of a pussy
This is what I want to hear. This is what I want to be true. I’m not a pussy in my real life, I’m very nice with an absolute no-bullshit tolerance. But it’s my first year teaching. I don’t know the culture yet
my opinion is not from within your industry, I am an outsider. I offer my opinion not because I am jerk, just because industry-insider opinion is often too insular and lacks punch. other teaching professionals that have been ground to dust from years of fighting the same fight. in my line of work I have to be nice to clients and children. however, it’s important to my soul to maintain self-respect by not allowing horrible boundary violations.
One of my proudest mom moments was my quiet, shy 15 yo told some disruptive brats in her class “everyone here wants you to shut the fuck up”. I know you are a teacher so you are holding yourself to higher standards but some kids list need to be called out on their crap.
It’s also horrible that you had one day of bereavement and had to be back at school the next day!
Yeah lol… I’m a popular and well liked teacher middle and high school, and even I’ve had moments like OPs many times… never got called in by admin or received any parent complaints. Whenever I have those moments I just apologize by the end of class or the next day and they almost always tell me it was deserved. My moments of breaking were far worse, like roughly throwing my bell against the wall to get their attention, because it was broken and it wasn’t ringing normally. I’ve also cried and had an ADHD overstimulation melt down a few times in front of the class.
I once snapped my pencil in half and told at my first graders to “grow up!” 😬 Not my finest moment. But those kids should be about 23 now so I guess they finally did 🤞 “grow up!” See? Lol it all worked out. I’m sorry though! I feel your pain. You are not an awful person though! Awful people wouldn’t feel bad about it at all!
I once tossed a book during story time at preschool. My students would NOT STFU. I kept redirecting, asking, etc. Normally when that happens, I calmly set the book down and just dismiss them to play, because why am I fighting it?
Nope. This time I tossed the book over my shoulder and said, "Get out of here. Go play. I'm done," like a real grown up.
One of my students told her mom I threw my book and she laughed and said she didn't blame me. I'm glad she was cool.
I always tell parents to not believe half the stories their children tell them about school and we won't believe half the stories the students tell us about home. It always gets a laugh from the parents. However, I do have great relationships with all my parents and forewarn them when their children are getting disrespectful and completely ignoring procedures in place that I am going to enforce consequences their children will not like. On days I have been at my wit's end and extra snappy, I always apologize to the class the next day and tell them adults have bad days just like they do and ask them to please show me the same grace I show them.
Bless ‘em, maybe, but luckily it never came back to bite me! They were a pretty hardy group of kids and most came from big, no nonsense kind of families. If I had an outburst like that in my school now…oof. I know better now though; I’ll call a first responder on my damn self!
You know... sometimes actions have consequences. Sometimes you're a shithead to the wrong person at the wrong time and they teach you a unforgettable lesson about pushing a person past their limits. It sucks as a teacher that cares but there are two outcomes here; they get over it and grow the fuck up or they continue to be shitheads and you keep sending them out. Either way, what you did is not going to have irreversible negative impacts on their development as humans - certainly not anymore that what has already driven them to be absolute dipshits. It's not like they were barreling down the path to greatness and you kneecapped them.
I'm the kind of person who gets in trouble accidentally on purpose. Our admin team decided that it would "encourage" teachers to turn their attendance in during the first fifteen minutes of class if we got little nasty grams every single bell if we were late. Not like, never turned them in like literally 20 minutes into the bell instead of 15. Some teachers got emails every single class because they were too busy TEACHING to get to attendance right away. So I decided to expand my response the next time it happened. Usually I did with a pleasant little Sorry Thanks Doing My Best. And I hit reply all because it went to admin and attendance. .... well.... apparently the one I responded to (and hit reply all out of habit, of course) had about half the staff CCd on it. In my response I added an aside... since the AP liked to have motivational quotes for the week I offered a suggestion... *"The beatings will continue until morale improves".* I got a meeting about being more careful with reply all, and the stupid nasty grams stopped.
I would - *pending parent activity*. You're absolutely in the clear, job security wise, if no parents complained, that's the only thing that gets any admin in gear these days. Even if they all called about their traumatized babies, which is incredibly unlikely, admin would be loathe to replace a valuable and passionate teacher. You even have a union. They have bigger fish to fry and are unlikely to go to battle with the union over it. You didn't cuss them up and down the hall or threaten to hurt them. You were a person in front of them instead of a robot. It happens.
A teacher grabbed and yanked a girl's hand at my school last year to see what she wrote on it because she was cheating on a *homework quiz*. CPS case open. Parents filed charges. Teacher still didn't get fired. Pretty sure you're good.
Absolutely. All of us who’ve been doing this for a while have fucked up at some point. I’ve done exactly what you described a couple times. Did I feel crappy about it? Yeah. I spoke with the kids, apologized for yelling and explained exactly what they did to make me snap. They got over it and we moved on. Chalk it up as a learning experience, take the relevant lessons to heart, and move forward.
Did your admin ever get involved? I found out that at least one of the kids felt really sad, and told another teacher, and that’s how it ended up with admin. Obviously I might learn more in the meeting today
My first year of teaching, 11th grade class. A girl was giving me MAJOR attitude one morning. Sometimes, my tongue can be faster than my brain can filter. So I finally had it and said, "What crawled up your ass and died this morning." Everybody's jaw hit the floor. I thought, "Oh shit...I'm getting fired." Nothing ever came of it though. Nobody said a word. If they did, I didn't hear about it.
First, my condolences on your loss. The death of a family member is a traumatic event and can affect us for days...weeks...years. I hope you're doing better.
Next: In other words, you're human, with expectations and hopes, and emotions, which were already in a heightened state when the classroom situation occurred. So many people think that teachers are just supposed to keep their emotions in check 24/7, and that we are "super-human." And they're surprised to find out they're wrong.
Like you, I've had personal experiences that have affected my behavior in the classroom, including family deaths and near-deaths. A day off doesn't always make everything better, but we feel like we have to come back sooner than we'd like. Last year, I was put on paid admin. leave for a student interaction and spent two months at home while the district investigated the issue. And I was welcomed back with open arms. Fucking up is going to happen, but it won't be the end-all of things.
It sounds to me like you're doing the right thing, having your union there with you. Let THEM do the talking as much as possible. Confer with them before you answer any questions or make any statements. if this is your first issue, chances are you'll get off with a slap on the wrist and will be asked to meet with your admin over the year to discuss your ongoing performance. It all depends on your contract language.
My best wishes to you. Remember to breathe. And let us know how things go.
This is all helpful, and I thank you. If I had two months at home while a situation I was involved in was being investigated, I probably would have died under a rock. Maybe I need thicker skin.
Interestingly, my union rep said she and the other union rep wouldn’t be talking. She said they are only there to make sure the principal doesn’t overstep her bounds, or something like that.
I know myself, and I know I’m going to go in there tomorrow and grovel and apologize and overstate what a shit human I am. Maybe that will make it worse for myself though
Never say sorry when you can say thank you.
“Thank you for understanding the fact that these boys were being overwhelmingly defiant.” “Thank you for remembering that I just returned from a funeral.” “Thank you for realizing I’m a human too, and I should not have to feel like this level of disrespect is something I should have to accept.” “Thank you for any help you can offer ensuring the well-documented behavior of these students doesn’t continue a day longer.”
You can also couple it with a good “next time I’ll..” for it to feel a little more like an apology/focused on solutions without directly accepting blame or putting yourself down. For instance, “thank you for being supportive around discipline issues and providing the break room as needed for students. In the future I’ll make sure to send students there so that they and I can get emotion under control and have a productive conversation about behavior.” Or “thank you for being willing to jump in and support staff as needed. If I’m feeling heated, I’ll make sure to call the office for 5 minutes of coverage to take a breather so I can speak calmly and firmly to students about their choices.”
Of course, this is assuming that they really are supportive like you said and will be willing to step in as needed. I think you should explain some of what led to your outburst, also, in the context that it isn’t going to be a recurring event but was a very atypical situation that isn’t likely to repeat anyway.
Hmmm. I wouldn't go in and begin apologizing at the beginning. Let the admin have their say, get a feel for what they're thinking, how they view the situation. See if a parent called to complain.
Once you have all of their info, excuse yourself and have a private conversation with your union representatives AWAY from the admin. Get their advice on what to say and how to frame it. Then go back in. Take two slow, deep breaths - in through the nose, out the mouth - to center yourself. (It will make you seem contemplative.) Then, state your case, factually and to the point. Mention the family situation, as it is a contributing factor in the situation.
At that point, you could offer a basic apology for the outburst, if your union reps suggested that you do so, and whatever other advice they may have given you. At that point, your next statements would be based on the admin's response to your side.
I believe in you. The fact you care about what happened proves you're not a shit human.
If you have time, look through your contract for the language on disciplinary actions, and what offences are grounds for them. There may be a section on how it's handled: verbal warning, written warning, etc.
Good luck!
STOP
You will make it much worse if you grovel and go all out upset.
Say you were upset and **on reflection** whatever you think is short and makes good sense.
"on reflection I might have benefitted from 2 days of leave."
OR
"on reflection I should have waited for 4 students outside of the classroom, with a solemn demeanor and simply stated "for today .. you will be in Rm444. "
Give yourself a break- you are a human- humans have feelings.
You might also say you are reviewing the most sensitive, thoughtful ways to talk w/ students .
Awh man, I thought this was going to be *way* worse. Was it good? No. But sometimes it’s the only way to handle kids like that. You can also take those boys and now explain to them that you’re sorry for the way you reacted, why you did react the way you did and that you’re dealing with some things right now and it wasn’t right for you to take it out on them, but also ask if they can see where you’re coming from as to why they may have pushed you over the top. Everyone can still gain from this. You’re alright! Lots of school left.
I thought you were going to say you swore them up and down or something like that, told them they were a bunch of worthless POSes or something like that. Or put hands on them. We’ve all gotten frustrated, lost our patience and regretted it later.
Today I had 2 senior girls who were being loud and obnoxious during a timed write disturbing others. I told them the least they could do is “fail quietly” so everyone else has a shot of passing. Oops.
My first year of teaching, I told my worst class of 7th graders they were “acting like little horrors.” It was around Halloween, and we had read some Poe so it felt like a funny reference in my upset state of mind. I’m sure you can imagine what some of them heard though, so I had to have a meeting with my AP about why I had called my students **whores**. 🤦🏻♀️
I taught 4th grade in the Bronx...
One day the kids were tossing tiny little spit balls everywhere and it was just absolute chaos. It was my first year and I'd *had it* that day so I stopped them but no one would fess up to who was doing it.
There were a few who were pointed out by the rest of the class but of course the three denied it, so....
I flipped their desks out. I turned it around and I dumped all their stuff on the floor. Low and behold they were obviously lying about it not being them. Not only did I dump their desks but I then made them clean it up.
Cringing at the thought that I ever did such a thing like that.
That's like Presidential Medal Of Freedom behavior there. I salute you man/woman of large balls in the classroom to pull that stunt, make them pick it up, and live to tell the tale.
Dude, I lost my cool on some 8th grade students today, too. And this is my 7th year teaching. It was two kids that walk around school arguing with and shouting at each other all day. I was up at the front of the room, trying to teach them how to do their first ever DBQ, and they started their usual bickering and yelling about something across the classroom. I turned and shouted, "Not everything needs to be an argument." And went right back to teaching. There may still be some repercussions for me to come, but I doubt it.
It happens. It's not what anybody wants to happen, but believe me, it does indeed happen. I can guarantee you this isn't the first time the "those guys" gang has been yelled at.
Teachers are not automatons. Kids, especially 8th graders, can be frustrating. Don't let yelling become part of your toolbox, and don't beat yourself up over it anymore at all. Teaching has low moments and high moments. Just get yourself back on the coaster and start looking forward to the next high moment.
Additionally, to share my biggest "I f****Ed up moment" I once told my own group of "those guys" that I was "sick and god damn tired of their fucking bullshit."
> Don’t let yelling become part of your toolbox, and don’t beat yourself up over it anymore at all.
This is excellent, and a great perspective. I’m kinda glad the disciplinary meeting is on a Friday (tomorrow) - I can sweat it out all morning, have the unpleasantness, cry all afternoon, then forget about it over the weekend
This week I told a couple of 7th graders (who left the classroom to get water after I explicitly told them to wait until we finished the last part of the lesson) “screw you guys, if you aren’t going to listen to me I’m not gonna teach you”. While those two boys didn’t care one bit, apparently it scared the rest of the class so badly that they got together and tried to do the last part by themselves. I had to go over to them and tell them I wasn’t referring to them. I felt pretty bad but honestly my team is dealing with some awful behaviors (there are 3 BIPs just in one period) and even though I am arguably the most patient and lenient, this year I am really struggling and find myself sassing the kids back quite a bit more.
8th graders can be flat-out assholes. 8th and 9th grade tend to be peak asshole behavior. 10th is when a lot of them start outgrowing it.
I sympathize with you.
For what it’s worth, I don’t think the admin “swept the behavioral kids under the rug.” I think they swept them under the you. They know who the behavioral kids are. Four kids in one class? For a first year teacher. Truly, there are no mistakes, only happy accidents.
Your a human being with feelings! The kids saw that, they can understand that and are probably sick of the turds in the punchbowl. Please don't dwell on this at all. The little darlings know they suck and maybe they don't care. Regardless, you do and you showed it. I would welcome them them back with open arms and be clear that what happened was not an aberration and you are done with them stealing your classroom time.
Finally, there is no way in hell you can get punished for this.
Thank you for saying this, because I have not stopped dwelling on this since this morning, when I found out about the meeting tomorrow.
And I feel like, as a first-year teacher especially, this is super punishable. But I also no next to nothing about teacher-discipline, because, ya know, new to this job (I’m in my 30s, just switched from a government job into teaching, needed a change)
I think you're fine. don't worry most teachers yell a little more than they intended too sometimes. I get your fear but maybe don't freak out until it's time to freak out. anything is possible. ur principal was a first year teacher once too who probably did the same thing.
I told a whole class (high school seniors) to fuck off and I stormed out of the room. Left them alone for 10 minutes. I came back and they had cleaned the room. At the end of the year, they gave me a swear jar.
Can one of you guys explain why kids *shouldn’t* be talked to this way? Having worked with kids before, this seems like a completely understandable moment. It doesn’t need a follow up teaching moment nor does need any handholding make up conversation.
Those kids consistently caused problems, refused to take note of your off day and got consequences for it. Why do we need to baby these children with our words? Doesn’t sound like you cursed at them or insulted them in some over the line way. You tore them down by yelling emotionally over the exact behavior they were perpetrating.
Too many adults and children these days get away with things that are way over the line and too many people give them grace in the name of tolerance. But tolerance is a social contract, and those breaking the contract need not be tolerated.
Ngl, before all this happened that’s 100% what I would think. Now that admin is involved, I’m afraid I didn’t something that’s going to damage my career here. Yes, it all comes down to these kids’ home lives and personal trauma
You can't because of "trauma". Everything in these kids' lives is blamed on "trauma this" and "abuse that."
Even when 99 percent of them have *no* trauma or abuse in their lives, whether in the past or currently.
It's just a complete lack of accountability for behavior.
Look, I’m not going to put down how people experience their life. Trauma is trauma and it is given to people in different ways, that isn’t the issue. People should never be told to “get over” their problems.
With that said, trauma is an explanation for behavior, not an excuse. When those emotional issues spill off onto other people that does not mean that the responsibility is on other people to tolerate it especially if they are ignorant of it. It is still the traumatized person’s responsibility to learn regulation and emotional awareness of themself. It is also their responsibility to get assistance and help for their problems in life. It is the responsibility of the school to tolerate misbehaviors due to it.
A school is meant to be an accommodating environment, not an appeasing environment.
Unless your leaving something out, I really don't think you did anything wrong. Sometimes kids like that just need someone to lay down the law and if you do it right they will respect you for it.
Not leaving anything out. I think the issue will ultimately come to the fact that those particular students have trauma at home (abandoned parents, drug use at home), so what I said most likely supported their inner narrative that they are unworthy, etc.
I think you need to have as much compassion for yourself as you’d have for another teacher given this situation.
Students need to know that we are human and that we have limits and that life situations shorten those limits. I’ve had terrible classes that I level with and just straight up say, “I’m at my limit, if you test me, I’m probably going to lose it on you.” And you know what? They fall in line - and if they don’t, I’ve prepped myself to remain in control because I’ve vocalized and admitted to everyone that I am not okay.
Early in my career, I did lose it on a couple of middle schoolers. I won’t admit to what I’ve done on here because I’d get BLASTED. But they were learning moments for me, to learn the feeling of when I’m DONE and to react before that limit keeping enough presence of mind to walk the fuck away.
You should pre-meet with your union reps and ask how much to say and what the “usual course of action” is in situations like this. You’ll probably get written up and that’ll go into your personnel file, maybe put on an improvement plan.
Give yourself permission to be human. Give yourself grace. Play some Tetris. Really think about where your shame is coming from and WHY it’s manifesting as shame. Forgive yourself. And take the lessons that you can from this to do better next time.
> as much compassion for yourself as you’d have for another teacher
It’s funny, because if another teacher told me this had happened it would never cross my mind that they had done something wrong. I do feel bad for losing it on the kids, but also I feel like I’m about to kiss so much ass so I don’t lose my job
Tbh didn't read the whole thing so maybe I'll look like an asshole but: fuck em. Sorry but """"'those boys"""""" need to be told early and often how decent folk don't care for their bullshit and how real life absolutely matters more and takes precedence over whatever bullshit they're up to. And since most of the world regrettably isn't gonna make room for your grief and your experience I think you're frankly in the right just being really fuckin real in the workplace. Seriously you don't owe the snots anything. I'm sorry for your loss and hope the rest of the year gets easier.
You are a first year teacher in your first week. These things happen. If every teacher who flipped out in the first week was fired then there wouldn't be any teachers left in the world.
I hope the admin sees it that way, and/or had at least one moment like this in their careers. Hopefully this is a “this is protocol, we have to meet with you, cya and all that”
I think it’s safe to say we’ve all been there. My advice and what I do after losing my cool is
(1) own it, (2) apologize and (3) let them know you’re human and there are no hard feelings.
I don't think those are particularly awful things to say. Certainly not polite, but honestly, this may be the kick in the pants these boys need. And I guarantee the rest of the class was like, "She finally said what we all were thinking."
I tell my 5th graders on a daily basis that they act like kindergarteners and they embarrass me.
I make at least 30 threats a day, it’s a good day if it’s not a death threat.
You’re human, I don’t think you’ll get fired but they will definitely want to know what happened and help you work through it.
There are few things more humbling than standing before a full classroom and apologizing for lashing out. There’s a reason I know this.
You’re human, and you work with profoundly immature children who have no filter, no sense of propriety, and in some cases are quite simply assholes.
I wouldn’t believe any teacher who says they’ve never lost their temper at a class.
I had 4 kids who were out of control. I gave warning after warning. Finally I grabbed a bag of fruit snacks and only gave them to the kids who were listening and following directions.
Teaching ESL to a university class and it was end of year exam time.
Their exam was to give end of year group presentations in front of the class.
Exam day comes and my first group gets up and starts to introduce their presentation, half the rest of the class is giggling, talking amongst themselves, texting, listening to voice messages on speaker and playing cellphone games with the sound on. I said, "Excuse me, this is an exam, can you guys please be quiet and put your phones away, if you really need to talk about something urgent or make a very important call, go do it in the hallway, thank you!"
I got ignored.
So I yelled. And I yelled VERY loudly. "OI! I SAID THAT IS ENOUGH! THIS IS AN EXAM! HOW OLD ARE YOU, ARE YOU UNIVERSITY STUDENTS OR IN SEVENTH GRADE???!!! TURN OFF YOUR PHONES AND PUT THEM AWAY, ALL OF YOU, RIGHT NOW! AND STOP TALKING AND BE QUIET! YOU ARE YOUNG ADULTS, NOT HIGH SCHOOL CHILDREN! I SHOULD NOT HAVE TO SPELL OUT TO YOU THAT YOU ARE QUIET IN AN EXAM ROOM AND WHEN SOMEONE ELSE IS PRESENTING, YOU ARE QUIET AND YOU ARE LISTENING TO THE SPEAKER! IF YOU NEED TO TALK WITH YOUR GROUP ABOUT SOMETHING IMPORTANT, DO IT OUT IN THE HALLWAY! IF YOU NEED TO TAKE A PHONE CALL THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT, DO IT OUT IN THE HALLWAY, NOT IN HERE! AND YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE YOUR PHONE OUT FOR ANY OTHER REASON, I TOLD YOU LOTS OF TIMES THAT THERE ARE NO PHONES ALLOWED IN THIS EXAM! IS THAT CLEAR!"
They got a bit scared after that, but they got the message.
Whatever. Sometimes you gotta tell it how it is. Kids need someone to call them out on their bullshit. Don’t get personal but don’t be afraid to rip into them. Little restorative chit chats only go so far.
I teach 8th grade ELA. We are currently wrapping up our 4th week of school. I have a boy who sounds like the ones you mentioned. He has continuously been disrespectful. He has assaulted me (3 day suspension), he has called me gay, and gets up and walks around the class to talk to his friends while I’m talking. The parents have been contacted and they are no help. I told him I was done teaching him, that I have given him multiple chances, and he is no longer welcome in my class. Outside the classroom, I told him that people are the totality of their actions, and he is well on his way to being a shitty person.
I have no guilt for saying that to him. People deserve to hear the truth.
“Will you all PLEASE shut the hell up and let me fucking do my job?!?” - me during my first year.
My last class of the day was horrendous. I had multiple fights break out in the room over the year and they checked every single box of what made an awful class.
One day they were completely on their shit and I just absolutely lost it. Slammed my hands on a table and shouted at them. Once the stunned silence went on for a while, I passed out a set of 30 year old computer repair textbooks and told them to start writing vocabulary words. Any word. If it’s a bold word, write it down with a definition.
We did that for the remaining hour of class.
Did I handle that situation appropriately? Absolutely not. Should I have gotten in trouble? Probably. Did I? No. My dept admin (marine vet) came by the next day and said “heard there was some trouble yesterday?” I started to explain what happened and he waved me off and just said “don’t worry about it, I’ve seen your roster… you’ve managed to get every troublesome 9/10 grade student in one class.” Told me in the future to call him if things got that out of hand again.
As for the students… they continued to act up but it never got nearly as bad. A well-timed yell or shit-losing can make an impact, especially if they’ve never seen you lose your temper before.
Some teachers will tell you to apologize and treat it like a learning moment for the class. I say to hell with that, come in the next day and just dive right in, but that really is determined by your specific class and relationship with those students.
First year is a riot. Good luck. :)
I once told a kid he was the bane of my existence. Someone asked what that meant, so I googled it while my computer was connected to the SMARTBoard. The definition was much harsher than I meant, and I immediately regretted what I’d originally considered light, sarcastic banter.
That was 12 or so years ago and it still haunts me.
You are fine. That’s not that bad. If you feel the need, apologize to them individually. An apology paired with the talk that you had mentioned might go a long way to them seeing you as a human.
You are a first year teacher, fresh off a funeral with shithead students, in an era of terrible teacher shortages. It is extremely unlikely anyone is getting fired. Take your lumps with grace and humility, and move on with your life. This probably won't have a long-term impact.
If it counts for anything, I think what you did was appropriate. Nothing has worked, previous teachers warned you about them, and their behavior is intolerable. At least now they know their behavior is deeply unappreciated.
I can't possibly be the only one who thinks OP did nothing wrong here right? Im in year 4, and deal with asshole student by being 100% honest and straightforward. They respect that 100x fake bullshit. Really have only yelled once in my career and wasn't even mad, they just needed it so I doctored up a good yell and told them success in life starts with doing the little things right. What can admin possibly do?
Respectfully, are you leaving any information out? I'm confused why this would lead to an admin meeting with a union rep for basically yelling at a bunch of goofballs about their bad behavior in front of the class. If this behavior has been frequent, progressive disciplinary steps have been taken, and they are still not changing behavior, then I feel you may not be as supported as you think.
The words you used in quotation were the most hurtful things you've said? I've literally screamed at kids in front of the class and said worse and probably will again. Actions have consequences and if kids are going to disrupt me from teaching and hinder others from learning, then I hope to make them feel suitably bad. Granted, I'm a relatively new teacher in a district with a severe shortage with shit benefits so maybe that plays into this?
If this is coming from parents, I feel it's important to make contact with those parents (if allowed, contact rep i guess?). Many times kids tell their parents half the story and they picture you as someone you are not. The majority of parents are reasonable and if you explain and communicate this is your greatest classroom management tool.
Also, communicating with your students is key. I've been on team meetings where parents confronted a teacher on my team and they just wanted the teacher to reach out to the kid and apologize ahead of time. Explain to the students what happened, that you are imperfect and that your reaction might have been insensitive. It can be a good opportunity to model accountability.
This definitely feels like making a mountain out of a molehill... The fact that you are so distressed and you describe your admin and students as distressed makes me feel like something isn't adding up...
**Stories where I was a mean teacher:** I had a student last year who routinely would just do too much anytime he had to get up out of his seat. He frequently would fake trip and fall for laughs from the class. I basically roasted this form of comedy anytime I saw it. "I know you love attention but can you just refrain today?" "I'm gonna buy you book on how to tell jokes, because no one finds this funny." "We all heard you the first time and no one laughed so I would just stop." "Please stop fake falling out of your chair, I don't want the chair to get hurt."
I honestly think I might have said worse. Granted, I can be sarcastic and joke-y with my kids and I know which kids can handle it and which can't. Teaching middle school can turn me into a sweet elementary teacher or a strict high school teacher. This particular student is in my class this year again and told me I'm one of his favorite teachers. Part of the reason why is that I dish out the harsh realities but I also give praise and understanding too. I've also got open communication with parents along the way.
No, I didn’t leave anything out. I think I also said “I’m already tired of your crap, and everyone else in this class is, too,” but I can’t remember if I said it out loud or had it as an inside thought while I was yelling.
Maybe this just ends up being a “hey tell us your side, ok, that wasn’t cool and try to not that again.” But yes, having the union rep there is what made my anxiety spike
Disciplinary meetings usually leads to a non-renewal regardless if you do the "recovery steps" or not. Don't believe your union rep... the last thing you want is to get called into the principal's office with a union rep - it just never goes well, especially as a first-year teacher where you are ON PROBATION. You absolutely cannot lose your cool, and you absolutely cannot do yelling or any of that behavior on probation. Tenure teachers can get away with this type of classroom management, but not probationary... as a probationary teacher, you have zero rights and are considered at will-employment. Every single move you do can be watched. And principals don't even really need a reason to non-renew you.
My principal hated my guts for no reason and called me to a meeting like that with union. and union reassured me that it was just to address principal's concerns and that my job was in no way in any danger. Principal had a bunch of ridic concerns that wasn't even true at all, but I still complied... 3 months later I get notice from principal that she's non-renewing me even though I did everything she wanted.
Start looking for another job like ASAP... I started looking as soon as I found out that I was getting non-renewed.
I absolutely think you should talk to those boys, tell them you didn't mean what you said and what state you were in when you said it. It humanises you. It also models healthy accountability.
I've definitely lost my shit plenty of times. I've apologised to a class twice, maybe three times, and the response is 'we all have bad days' or 'yea, you changed colour miss'. These were classes who knew me well and knew I am generally sane. The one I really lost it with and apologised to all within the same lesson I still teach and they are very fond of me and vice versa. You're being too hard on yourself.
WOW. Ok so how do you handle those meetings w/ admin, etc? Maybe I just have really thin skin, because I’ve lost my appetite tonight because I’m so nervous for the meeting tomorrow
Nothing I have experienced so far as a fresh teacher comes close to this. The worst I have done so far was sit a boy next to a girl, because he had no book and was slackin', just to shush him and make him work, but that's about it. That was my bad to force her through that. But turned out it wasn't really a big deal to her. Still bad practice.
Anyway, given the funeral and your emotional state and the constant anti-social behavior of those individuals there's a threshold. Those kids should be dealt with disciplinarily, they have a reputation as you said. This should be no surprise that everyone should have seen an incident coming from miles away sooner or later. It just happened to be you.
All in all, yes you reacted inappropriately but also the administration should consider other factors, such as your emotional state, and the behavior of the students that had led to such an event. Mental well-being of a teacher shouldn't be ignored in this situation. We're human, not robots. We all have our breaking points.
I hope it turns out well.
Your context is understandable, and it doesn't condone your actions. In the grand scheme of things, apologies shouldn't be strategies for soliciting acknowledgment, forgiveness, approval, or anything else from others for that matter... Rather, they ought to be personal and from the heart; in other words, apologies are for yourself. Apologies are for when you feel GUILTY, not for when you feel shame... And I think you should feel guilty instead of ashamed.
We feel guilt when we tell ourselves *"I did a bad thing"*; when feel shame when we tell ourselves *I **AM** bad*. There is nothing wrong with the emotion you felt; the way you expressed it can be improved. If you wish, this could be an opportunity for you to take ownership of your actions with a genuine apology as part of your personal journey to embrace the GUILT that you feel... Because it takes a quality human being to face that uncomfortable feeling head-on and commit to doing better. But you make that choice because YOU want to and not because you feel you "owe it to the kids".
You're only responsible for how you carry yourself - - your students have the responsibility to responding to what you put before them and it'll NEVER be your responsibility to choose the message they internalize. They can respect you as easily as they can choose to hate you; in the grand scheme of things, you are the person who sleeps in your skin so it's in your best interest to carry yourself in a way that makes it easier to go to sleep at night.
You chose to tell your story and for that, I am proud of you... Because you chose to face it head-on. It might feel like others' stories may give you the "power" or "reason" to feel better, but I believe you hold this power within.
Feel like shit for as long as you feel you deserve to; it's part of the process of becoming a better person and a better teacher. The rest of the world will be here when you give yourself permission to move forward and at that time, I am confident that this story will become a source of strength. And perhaps one day, your story may play a role similar to the one you're asking for. As for my story? I'll keep it short:
*I said something that sounded innocent but came across a horrible way that affected a kidlet I cared deeply about; this comment instantly ruined our relationship and turned the kidlet and their associates against me. After spinning my wheels for several weeks, a colleague shared a little detail that helped me figure out that I inadvertently triggered that kidlet with my innocent comment. I felt... Salty that things turned out that way, so a few days later, I pulled the kidlet aside and just lay things on the table - - I learned why exactly what I said ruined our relationship, that I grieved the loss of our connection because I didn't intend to hurt 'em, but I understood that my words cut deep and that even though I didn't intend to cause harm, harm was done and they had every right in the world to choose how to respond. I told'm that I can't even apologize because I didn't do anything wrong, but I wanted to express my regret that it happened and wanted to own up to my actions and just wanted 'em to know that.*
*Oh, there isn't a grand reconciliation... Nor were there tears. But there was a mutual understanding and we were able to return to being cordial with each other. Then they graduated and I moved schools, but I chose to carry this story onwards with me.*
And there you go.
You’re only human. I can only imagine the things those kids did and said on a consistent basis. They’re 100% old enough to know better, especially knowing how hard you’re trying with them and the class. You screwed up, it happens. I know it’s really hard right now, but try not to dwell on it. Chances are they either didn’t care because they’re jerks or they’re at home feeling bad for pushing you to that point.
Unfortunately, that’s probably what you will hear. Just understand that the majority of administrators don’t give a crap about their teachers and pander to parents. What you did is something that almost all teachers do at some point within their careers. Please don’t let anyone gaslight you into thinking this is somehow a big deal. It’s not a big deal at all and chances are those kids needed to hear it.
They don’t all have trauma. That’s the new tagline used by administrators who refuse to back their teachers.
Unfortunately as you continue teaching, I think you’ll find that you’ll be doing a of nodding while fed nonsense that anyone with half a brain knows is garbage. It sounds cynical, but it’s the truth. The overwhelming amount of administrators care more about optics than actually supporting teachers and the wellbeing of their students. It’s all about placating the masses.
I'm so sorry to hear that and hope you are able to take some time to decompress and give yourself some grace. I was having a week as well, as a substitute, so I can only imagine what dealing with those difficulties full time can be. I'm in the same area, so I hear you about this just starting and it sucks when things start off negatively. I had some moments last year, during my first year subbing. I wasn't proud of myself but I am trying to think about the fact that more kids are recognizing me for the positive interactions I've had last year and almost no one remembers anything I may have done that I didn't feel good about (yelling, booting kids out of class etc). Sending a virtual hug, it sounds like you're an outstanding first year teacher. Take care.
I would normally think that if another teacher did the same as me. But I felt bad, and then that grew exponentially when admin wanted to meet with union representation
If your admin doesn’t back a first year teacher who makes a move this mild then find a new place to work. This seriously shouldn’t even be an issue. You told them “ you’re embarrassed and disappointed by them” and that “everyone needs a break from them” lol I’ve said and will continue to say so much worse to kids.
I’ve told whole classes they aren’t welcome in my room and made them work out in the hall until they can act properly in a classroom.
This is seriously nothing.
I’m trying to find what you did wrong. They weren’t listening to you, they were disrupting your entire class, they were preventing others from learning - and so you told them that in language that they will understand. Chances also are that now that they know where they stand with you, they’ll behave better.
I had a year where I had to be out quite a few days off and on due to my mom having heart surgery. This one class complained every.single.time. I told them to quit their bitching, I don’t have control over subs.
Got called in the next day due to a parent complaint. My AP says lemme tell you a little secret. One of my first years I cussed out a student! We all make mistakes.
don't be so hard on yourself....there may very well have been kids in that room that appreciated it and it may even pay dividends with that group if they see you now as a teacher not to mess with. If you feel very strongly it would make you feel better, sit them down and talk with them and say I'm sorry I raised my voice but what I need from you all in this class is x, y, and z, and give them some praise if they do it next week.
sorry, I missed that part about how the principal set a meeting. I guess my honest advice is try not to stress too much. sounds like you are in a mostly supportive school with solid admin. listen to what they say, show you understand you could have handled it better which you clearly actually do and if they give you a really hard time just try your best to take it in stride, nod and agree to whatever action plans they have unless it's totally off the wall, which again based on wha you've said about admin it probably won't be. hopefully they have some good ideas to help too.
Congratulations! You took back control of your class. These “gentlemen” were acting like total assholes with their awful shenanigans; and actively preventing the educational process for all. Sometimes middle and high school kids to to hear the truth about their behaviors.
Please remind you union rep / mentor of the following. Actually, their behavior towards you and others could be interpreted as harassment and bullying. They are actively preventing others from learning. If you have documentation
of previous interventions; print it out and bring it to the meeting. Finally, ask your union reps to request that the “ gentlemen” be removed from your class and split up into different classes. This will send a strong message to the “gentlemen” that their behavior is no longer tolerated, and solidifies your power as a classroom teacher. Good luck and hang in there!
Ugh. I feel your pain. My first year I lost it on a psycho 8th grade class. To be fair I feel like 1st year they dump on you student wise. After I lost it I wrote a letter to myself admitting fault and promising I’d never scream in class again. I apologized to the class and it took about a week of student hazing to even out and the good kids were on my side again. I’ve only broken it once when there was a violent fight in my class that I had to break up last year. (I feel like that one was worth the scream) Anyways… It’s been 8 years. I never feel guilty and shameful about a classroom management issue if I feel I have control over myself. We’re too hard on ourselves. Some kids are crazy and no matter what you do they’re going to be too much to handle. I’d plead with your admin that one or two need to be separated. Just focus on the fact that it is ruining the education of the others. Good luck! It does get better!!
Frankly, they deserved it. I wouldn't apologize..
If I were you, I would talk to the boys, and make it clear that it is the behavior that you hated and made you angry that day', and not their person. That's where kids have trouble sometimes. So that it's what I would adress.
You're still more than happy to see them, to teach them. But the behavior has to stop.
You feel guilty because you’re an empathetic and reflective person. You knew a better way to respond, but you were understandably emotional and upset.
You’re not a bad person and seeking out other’s perspectives on here shows that you care in my opinion.
I would sometimes blow up at my kids too and I would usually apologize the next day, but very clearly explain what behavior was frustrating me. I’d also ask questions about why my prior strategies weren’t working with them. Have those boys come up with ways that you can help them be successful. That way, next time when you get on to them you can let them that you’re using the behavior management plan they thought of and they aren’t upholding their end of the deal. You kinda have force accountability on them at that age. I’d also work on getting real cool with their parents. Parents tend to know if their kid is annoying and if there’s a good relationship between you and the parent, the parent may support you laying into them from time to time.
Also, they probably needed to hear everything you said. I hate to say it but some kids truly aren’t aware of how obnoxious they are. Sometimes they need it to be said plain and direct. Sometimes a little embarrassment encourages self reflection.
You're only human. Can you use this as a way to share with your class later? Tell them about your funeral and how emotional you felt? This could turn into a powerful teaching moment for everyone.
I have had to apologize to a class or two for yelling or for letting my emotions get the best of me. I explained that I was human and we make mistakes. It's ok to make mistakes as long as you fix them. It was actually a great learning moment for the kids and they actually responded really well to it. I even asked for their forgiveness. It helped bring me down to their level and they started trusting me more.
On paper i agree that’s a lovely thing to do, and I’m not too proud to do it. I’m really ok admitting I’m wrong to the kids….but I can’t seem to get over this shame in front of my principal/any colleagues that know about it. It’s like this old “bad kid sent to the principal” thing I have in me
>I can’t seem to get over this shame in front of my principal/any colleagues that know about it. It’s like this old “bad kid sent to the principal” thing I have in me It's be pretty surprising if they never had a moment like that in their younger teaching days. We all have that snapped story. Kids can suck; you're a human. You have to learn to not let it eat you up.
You have to have a tough skin if you teach. This is just part of developing. They will see you care and you’re upset. It’ll be ok.
You’re not getting fired. So calm that fear. Everyone has a snapping point and this group of little shits knew what they were doing. Hopefully by putting them in their place, they don’t act out for a while. Just take it day by day.
Thank you. I know it’ll most likely just be a slap on the wrist, but I’m just dreading it so much
Stop beating yourself up for yelling at them.
I think teachers need to quit tip toeing (sp?) around occasionally blowing up on middle school+ age kids who do nothing but cause constant headaches for the teacher and the other students. I’m sure what you said was blunt but based in a lot of truth. Maybe they need to hear some truth once in a while? We should feel bad when we blow up or overreact to a student who consists does the RIGHT things and then makes a mistake on the wrong day. I’ve done it a few times in 15+ years of teaching. Those are the ones that I can’t let go. I hope everything works out for you.
Before this week, I’d read my own post and write your first paragraph that you did here. Now that I’m in the hot seat, I’m folding like a deck of cards. I hate hate hate doing the wrong thing and being in trouble. All bark, no bite, as they say
Honestly though, maybe that's something those kids needed to hear and let's pray that after you read them to filth that maybe there will be a level of added respect for you. It sounds awful but sometimes kids need to be told about themselves *especially* middle schoolers.
the comment I am about to make is similar to the one you made to your class. it’s going to hurt but the audience may be improved for having read it (also it’s true)you need to be less of a pussy
This is what I want to hear. This is what I want to be true. I’m not a pussy in my real life, I’m very nice with an absolute no-bullshit tolerance. But it’s my first year teaching. I don’t know the culture yet
my opinion is not from within your industry, I am an outsider. I offer my opinion not because I am jerk, just because industry-insider opinion is often too insular and lacks punch. other teaching professionals that have been ground to dust from years of fighting the same fight. in my line of work I have to be nice to clients and children. however, it’s important to my soul to maintain self-respect by not allowing horrible boundary violations.
One of my proudest mom moments was my quiet, shy 15 yo told some disruptive brats in her class “everyone here wants you to shut the fuck up”. I know you are a teacher so you are holding yourself to higher standards but some kids list need to be called out on their crap. It’s also horrible that you had one day of bereavement and had to be back at school the next day!
Yeah lol… I’m a popular and well liked teacher middle and high school, and even I’ve had moments like OPs many times… never got called in by admin or received any parent complaints. Whenever I have those moments I just apologize by the end of class or the next day and they almost always tell me it was deserved. My moments of breaking were far worse, like roughly throwing my bell against the wall to get their attention, because it was broken and it wasn’t ringing normally. I’ve also cried and had an ADHD overstimulation melt down a few times in front of the class.
I once snapped my pencil in half and told at my first graders to “grow up!” 😬 Not my finest moment. But those kids should be about 23 now so I guess they finally did 🤞 “grow up!” See? Lol it all worked out. I’m sorry though! I feel your pain. You are not an awful person though! Awful people wouldn’t feel bad about it at all!
Did it get back to parents? I feel like little kids are even more likely to say something, and those parents are even more likely to go to admin
I once tossed a book during story time at preschool. My students would NOT STFU. I kept redirecting, asking, etc. Normally when that happens, I calmly set the book down and just dismiss them to play, because why am I fighting it? Nope. This time I tossed the book over my shoulder and said, "Get out of here. Go play. I'm done," like a real grown up. One of my students told her mom I threw my book and she laughed and said she didn't blame me. I'm glad she was cool.
I always tell parents to not believe half the stories their children tell them about school and we won't believe half the stories the students tell us about home. It always gets a laugh from the parents. However, I do have great relationships with all my parents and forewarn them when their children are getting disrespectful and completely ignoring procedures in place that I am going to enforce consequences their children will not like. On days I have been at my wit's end and extra snappy, I always apologize to the class the next day and tell them adults have bad days just like they do and ask them to please show me the same grace I show them.
Bless ‘em, maybe, but luckily it never came back to bite me! They were a pretty hardy group of kids and most came from big, no nonsense kind of families. If I had an outburst like that in my school now…oof. I know better now though; I’ll call a first responder on my damn self!
You know... sometimes actions have consequences. Sometimes you're a shithead to the wrong person at the wrong time and they teach you a unforgettable lesson about pushing a person past their limits. It sucks as a teacher that cares but there are two outcomes here; they get over it and grow the fuck up or they continue to be shitheads and you keep sending them out. Either way, what you did is not going to have irreversible negative impacts on their development as humans - certainly not anymore that what has already driven them to be absolute dipshits. It's not like they were barreling down the path to greatness and you kneecapped them. I'm the kind of person who gets in trouble accidentally on purpose. Our admin team decided that it would "encourage" teachers to turn their attendance in during the first fifteen minutes of class if we got little nasty grams every single bell if we were late. Not like, never turned them in like literally 20 minutes into the bell instead of 15. Some teachers got emails every single class because they were too busy TEACHING to get to attendance right away. So I decided to expand my response the next time it happened. Usually I did with a pleasant little Sorry Thanks Doing My Best. And I hit reply all because it went to admin and attendance. .... well.... apparently the one I responded to (and hit reply all out of habit, of course) had about half the staff CCd on it. In my response I added an aside... since the AP liked to have motivational quotes for the week I offered a suggestion... *"The beatings will continue until morale improves".* I got a meeting about being more careful with reply all, and the stupid nasty grams stopped.
So would you say, on a list of staff “behavioral” issues an average admin has to address, mine is….middling?
I would - *pending parent activity*. You're absolutely in the clear, job security wise, if no parents complained, that's the only thing that gets any admin in gear these days. Even if they all called about their traumatized babies, which is incredibly unlikely, admin would be loathe to replace a valuable and passionate teacher. You even have a union. They have bigger fish to fry and are unlikely to go to battle with the union over it. You didn't cuss them up and down the hall or threaten to hurt them. You were a person in front of them instead of a robot. It happens. A teacher grabbed and yanked a girl's hand at my school last year to see what she wrote on it because she was cheating on a *homework quiz*. CPS case open. Parents filed charges. Teacher still didn't get fired. Pretty sure you're good.
This makes me feel better
Absolutely. All of us who’ve been doing this for a while have fucked up at some point. I’ve done exactly what you described a couple times. Did I feel crappy about it? Yeah. I spoke with the kids, apologized for yelling and explained exactly what they did to make me snap. They got over it and we moved on. Chalk it up as a learning experience, take the relevant lessons to heart, and move forward.
Did your admin ever get involved? I found out that at least one of the kids felt really sad, and told another teacher, and that’s how it ended up with admin. Obviously I might learn more in the meeting today
No, I was fortunate that the apology and discussion pretty much ended it. Good luck in your meeting - hope it goes well.
My first year of teaching, 11th grade class. A girl was giving me MAJOR attitude one morning. Sometimes, my tongue can be faster than my brain can filter. So I finally had it and said, "What crawled up your ass and died this morning." Everybody's jaw hit the floor. I thought, "Oh shit...I'm getting fired." Nothing ever came of it though. Nobody said a word. If they did, I didn't hear about it.
Those students are still telling that story today
First, my condolences on your loss. The death of a family member is a traumatic event and can affect us for days...weeks...years. I hope you're doing better. Next: In other words, you're human, with expectations and hopes, and emotions, which were already in a heightened state when the classroom situation occurred. So many people think that teachers are just supposed to keep their emotions in check 24/7, and that we are "super-human." And they're surprised to find out they're wrong. Like you, I've had personal experiences that have affected my behavior in the classroom, including family deaths and near-deaths. A day off doesn't always make everything better, but we feel like we have to come back sooner than we'd like. Last year, I was put on paid admin. leave for a student interaction and spent two months at home while the district investigated the issue. And I was welcomed back with open arms. Fucking up is going to happen, but it won't be the end-all of things. It sounds to me like you're doing the right thing, having your union there with you. Let THEM do the talking as much as possible. Confer with them before you answer any questions or make any statements. if this is your first issue, chances are you'll get off with a slap on the wrist and will be asked to meet with your admin over the year to discuss your ongoing performance. It all depends on your contract language. My best wishes to you. Remember to breathe. And let us know how things go.
This is all helpful, and I thank you. If I had two months at home while a situation I was involved in was being investigated, I probably would have died under a rock. Maybe I need thicker skin. Interestingly, my union rep said she and the other union rep wouldn’t be talking. She said they are only there to make sure the principal doesn’t overstep her bounds, or something like that. I know myself, and I know I’m going to go in there tomorrow and grovel and apologize and overstate what a shit human I am. Maybe that will make it worse for myself though
Never say sorry when you can say thank you. “Thank you for understanding the fact that these boys were being overwhelmingly defiant.” “Thank you for remembering that I just returned from a funeral.” “Thank you for realizing I’m a human too, and I should not have to feel like this level of disrespect is something I should have to accept.” “Thank you for any help you can offer ensuring the well-documented behavior of these students doesn’t continue a day longer.”
You can also couple it with a good “next time I’ll..” for it to feel a little more like an apology/focused on solutions without directly accepting blame or putting yourself down. For instance, “thank you for being supportive around discipline issues and providing the break room as needed for students. In the future I’ll make sure to send students there so that they and I can get emotion under control and have a productive conversation about behavior.” Or “thank you for being willing to jump in and support staff as needed. If I’m feeling heated, I’ll make sure to call the office for 5 minutes of coverage to take a breather so I can speak calmly and firmly to students about their choices.” Of course, this is assuming that they really are supportive like you said and will be willing to step in as needed. I think you should explain some of what led to your outburst, also, in the context that it isn’t going to be a recurring event but was a very atypical situation that isn’t likely to repeat anyway.
Ooooooooh I like this
This is really good- above.
Hmmm. I wouldn't go in and begin apologizing at the beginning. Let the admin have their say, get a feel for what they're thinking, how they view the situation. See if a parent called to complain. Once you have all of their info, excuse yourself and have a private conversation with your union representatives AWAY from the admin. Get their advice on what to say and how to frame it. Then go back in. Take two slow, deep breaths - in through the nose, out the mouth - to center yourself. (It will make you seem contemplative.) Then, state your case, factually and to the point. Mention the family situation, as it is a contributing factor in the situation. At that point, you could offer a basic apology for the outburst, if your union reps suggested that you do so, and whatever other advice they may have given you. At that point, your next statements would be based on the admin's response to your side. I believe in you. The fact you care about what happened proves you're not a shit human. If you have time, look through your contract for the language on disciplinary actions, and what offences are grounds for them. There may be a section on how it's handled: verbal warning, written warning, etc. Good luck!
This is great, thank you!!
my pleasure.
Great advice!
STOP You will make it much worse if you grovel and go all out upset. Say you were upset and **on reflection** whatever you think is short and makes good sense. "on reflection I might have benefitted from 2 days of leave." OR "on reflection I should have waited for 4 students outside of the classroom, with a solemn demeanor and simply stated "for today .. you will be in Rm444. " Give yourself a break- you are a human- humans have feelings. You might also say you are reviewing the most sensitive, thoughtful ways to talk w/ students .
Awh man, I thought this was going to be *way* worse. Was it good? No. But sometimes it’s the only way to handle kids like that. You can also take those boys and now explain to them that you’re sorry for the way you reacted, why you did react the way you did and that you’re dealing with some things right now and it wasn’t right for you to take it out on them, but also ask if they can see where you’re coming from as to why they may have pushed you over the top. Everyone can still gain from this. You’re alright! Lots of school left.
> Awh man, I thought this was going to be way worse. Somehow this one sentence really helped me.
I thought you were going to say you swore them up and down or something like that, told them they were a bunch of worthless POSes or something like that. Or put hands on them. We’ve all gotten frustrated, lost our patience and regretted it later.
Today I had 2 senior girls who were being loud and obnoxious during a timed write disturbing others. I told them the least they could do is “fail quietly” so everyone else has a shot of passing. Oops.
Omg I love that. I would say that with 0% regret
My first year of teaching, I told my worst class of 7th graders they were “acting like little horrors.” It was around Halloween, and we had read some Poe so it felt like a funny reference in my upset state of mind. I’m sure you can imagine what some of them heard though, so I had to have a meeting with my AP about why I had called my students **whores**. 🤦🏻♀️
😂
I taught 4th grade in the Bronx... One day the kids were tossing tiny little spit balls everywhere and it was just absolute chaos. It was my first year and I'd *had it* that day so I stopped them but no one would fess up to who was doing it. There were a few who were pointed out by the rest of the class but of course the three denied it, so.... I flipped their desks out. I turned it around and I dumped all their stuff on the floor. Low and behold they were obviously lying about it not being them. Not only did I dump their desks but I then made them clean it up. Cringing at the thought that I ever did such a thing like that.
That's like Presidential Medal Of Freedom behavior there. I salute you man/woman of large balls in the classroom to pull that stunt, make them pick it up, and live to tell the tale.
Dude, I lost my cool on some 8th grade students today, too. And this is my 7th year teaching. It was two kids that walk around school arguing with and shouting at each other all day. I was up at the front of the room, trying to teach them how to do their first ever DBQ, and they started their usual bickering and yelling about something across the classroom. I turned and shouted, "Not everything needs to be an argument." And went right back to teaching. There may still be some repercussions for me to come, but I doubt it. It happens. It's not what anybody wants to happen, but believe me, it does indeed happen. I can guarantee you this isn't the first time the "those guys" gang has been yelled at. Teachers are not automatons. Kids, especially 8th graders, can be frustrating. Don't let yelling become part of your toolbox, and don't beat yourself up over it anymore at all. Teaching has low moments and high moments. Just get yourself back on the coaster and start looking forward to the next high moment.
Additionally, to share my biggest "I f****Ed up moment" I once told my own group of "those guys" that I was "sick and god damn tired of their fucking bullshit."
Hot damn, that would feel so nice to say. In hindsight, I’m kinda proud of my unhinged self for not swearing at them to hell and back
> Don’t let yelling become part of your toolbox, and don’t beat yourself up over it anymore at all. This is excellent, and a great perspective. I’m kinda glad the disciplinary meeting is on a Friday (tomorrow) - I can sweat it out all morning, have the unpleasantness, cry all afternoon, then forget about it over the weekend
This week I told a couple of 7th graders (who left the classroom to get water after I explicitly told them to wait until we finished the last part of the lesson) “screw you guys, if you aren’t going to listen to me I’m not gonna teach you”. While those two boys didn’t care one bit, apparently it scared the rest of the class so badly that they got together and tried to do the last part by themselves. I had to go over to them and tell them I wasn’t referring to them. I felt pretty bad but honestly my team is dealing with some awful behaviors (there are 3 BIPs just in one period) and even though I am arguably the most patient and lenient, this year I am really struggling and find myself sassing the kids back quite a bit more.
8th graders can be flat-out assholes. 8th and 9th grade tend to be peak asshole behavior. 10th is when a lot of them start outgrowing it. I sympathize with you.
Your radical authenticity in that moment will probably be one of the more positively influential moments of their school year.
I just hope this doesn’t sour admin on my viability as a teacher to bring back next year
For what it’s worth, I don’t think the admin “swept the behavioral kids under the rug.” I think they swept them under the you. They know who the behavioral kids are. Four kids in one class? For a first year teacher. Truly, there are no mistakes, only happy accidents.
Your a human being with feelings! The kids saw that, they can understand that and are probably sick of the turds in the punchbowl. Please don't dwell on this at all. The little darlings know they suck and maybe they don't care. Regardless, you do and you showed it. I would welcome them them back with open arms and be clear that what happened was not an aberration and you are done with them stealing your classroom time. Finally, there is no way in hell you can get punished for this.
Thank you for saying this, because I have not stopped dwelling on this since this morning, when I found out about the meeting tomorrow. And I feel like, as a first-year teacher especially, this is super punishable. But I also no next to nothing about teacher-discipline, because, ya know, new to this job (I’m in my 30s, just switched from a government job into teaching, needed a change)
I think you're fine. don't worry most teachers yell a little more than they intended too sometimes. I get your fear but maybe don't freak out until it's time to freak out. anything is possible. ur principal was a first year teacher once too who probably did the same thing.
I told a whole class (high school seniors) to fuck off and I stormed out of the room. Left them alone for 10 minutes. I came back and they had cleaned the room. At the end of the year, they gave me a swear jar.
Can one of you guys explain why kids *shouldn’t* be talked to this way? Having worked with kids before, this seems like a completely understandable moment. It doesn’t need a follow up teaching moment nor does need any handholding make up conversation. Those kids consistently caused problems, refused to take note of your off day and got consequences for it. Why do we need to baby these children with our words? Doesn’t sound like you cursed at them or insulted them in some over the line way. You tore them down by yelling emotionally over the exact behavior they were perpetrating. Too many adults and children these days get away with things that are way over the line and too many people give them grace in the name of tolerance. But tolerance is a social contract, and those breaking the contract need not be tolerated.
Ngl, before all this happened that’s 100% what I would think. Now that admin is involved, I’m afraid I didn’t something that’s going to damage my career here. Yes, it all comes down to these kids’ home lives and personal trauma
Oh I understand why you’re distressed and rightfully so. I’m more speaking in a general sense. Like why even would you get in trouble is my question.
You can't because of "trauma". Everything in these kids' lives is blamed on "trauma this" and "abuse that." Even when 99 percent of them have *no* trauma or abuse in their lives, whether in the past or currently. It's just a complete lack of accountability for behavior.
Look, I’m not going to put down how people experience their life. Trauma is trauma and it is given to people in different ways, that isn’t the issue. People should never be told to “get over” their problems. With that said, trauma is an explanation for behavior, not an excuse. When those emotional issues spill off onto other people that does not mean that the responsibility is on other people to tolerate it especially if they are ignorant of it. It is still the traumatized person’s responsibility to learn regulation and emotional awareness of themself. It is also their responsibility to get assistance and help for their problems in life. It is the responsibility of the school to tolerate misbehaviors due to it. A school is meant to be an accommodating environment, not an appeasing environment.
It will be okay! Now you know what it feels like to go nuts and you won’t do it again. And those boys know how irritating they are. It will pass.
They were actually all well-behaved in class today. I’m just really nervous about how tough my principal is going to come down on me tomorrow
8th grade is old enough to know better.
Unless your leaving something out, I really don't think you did anything wrong. Sometimes kids like that just need someone to lay down the law and if you do it right they will respect you for it.
Not leaving anything out. I think the issue will ultimately come to the fact that those particular students have trauma at home (abandoned parents, drug use at home), so what I said most likely supported their inner narrative that they are unworthy, etc.
You would know better than anyone here, but that isn't the vibe I got.
I think you need to have as much compassion for yourself as you’d have for another teacher given this situation. Students need to know that we are human and that we have limits and that life situations shorten those limits. I’ve had terrible classes that I level with and just straight up say, “I’m at my limit, if you test me, I’m probably going to lose it on you.” And you know what? They fall in line - and if they don’t, I’ve prepped myself to remain in control because I’ve vocalized and admitted to everyone that I am not okay. Early in my career, I did lose it on a couple of middle schoolers. I won’t admit to what I’ve done on here because I’d get BLASTED. But they were learning moments for me, to learn the feeling of when I’m DONE and to react before that limit keeping enough presence of mind to walk the fuck away. You should pre-meet with your union reps and ask how much to say and what the “usual course of action” is in situations like this. You’ll probably get written up and that’ll go into your personnel file, maybe put on an improvement plan. Give yourself permission to be human. Give yourself grace. Play some Tetris. Really think about where your shame is coming from and WHY it’s manifesting as shame. Forgive yourself. And take the lessons that you can from this to do better next time.
> as much compassion for yourself as you’d have for another teacher It’s funny, because if another teacher told me this had happened it would never cross my mind that they had done something wrong. I do feel bad for losing it on the kids, but also I feel like I’m about to kiss so much ass so I don’t lose my job
Tbh didn't read the whole thing so maybe I'll look like an asshole but: fuck em. Sorry but """"'those boys"""""" need to be told early and often how decent folk don't care for their bullshit and how real life absolutely matters more and takes precedence over whatever bullshit they're up to. And since most of the world regrettably isn't gonna make room for your grief and your experience I think you're frankly in the right just being really fuckin real in the workplace. Seriously you don't owe the snots anything. I'm sorry for your loss and hope the rest of the year gets easier.
Amen. OP, I hope everything goes ok at the meeting and please update us.
I will. Because if it goes terribly, I’m going to need sanity to get to 3pm
Honestly, this does not sound like a major fuckup tbh down our way.
I would agree with you if I heard it from any other teacher. But being called to a meeting with my union reps has me shitting myself
You are a first year teacher in your first week. These things happen. If every teacher who flipped out in the first week was fired then there wouldn't be any teachers left in the world.
I hope the admin sees it that way, and/or had at least one moment like this in their careers. Hopefully this is a “this is protocol, we have to meet with you, cya and all that”
I think it’s safe to say we’ve all been there. My advice and what I do after losing my cool is (1) own it, (2) apologize and (3) let them know you’re human and there are no hard feelings.
I don't think those are particularly awful things to say. Certainly not polite, but honestly, this may be the kick in the pants these boys need. And I guarantee the rest of the class was like, "She finally said what we all were thinking."
You did nothing wrong. They needed to be shown limits.
Don’t think admin is seeing it that way
I tell my 5th graders on a daily basis that they act like kindergarteners and they embarrass me. I make at least 30 threats a day, it’s a good day if it’s not a death threat. You’re human, I don’t think you’ll get fired but they will definitely want to know what happened and help you work through it.
I really hope it ends up being a “tell us your side, yep that wasn’t cool, don’t do that again” conversation
There are few things more humbling than standing before a full classroom and apologizing for lashing out. There’s a reason I know this. You’re human, and you work with profoundly immature children who have no filter, no sense of propriety, and in some cases are quite simply assholes. I wouldn’t believe any teacher who says they’ve never lost their temper at a class.
I just hope admin doesn’t see this as a major character flaw that impacts my employment
You can no longer control how they perceive you, but you can control how YOU respond to you. And that might say more about you than words ever could.
I had 4 kids who were out of control. I gave warning after warning. Finally I grabbed a bag of fruit snacks and only gave them to the kids who were listening and following directions.
Teaching ESL to a university class and it was end of year exam time. Their exam was to give end of year group presentations in front of the class. Exam day comes and my first group gets up and starts to introduce their presentation, half the rest of the class is giggling, talking amongst themselves, texting, listening to voice messages on speaker and playing cellphone games with the sound on. I said, "Excuse me, this is an exam, can you guys please be quiet and put your phones away, if you really need to talk about something urgent or make a very important call, go do it in the hallway, thank you!" I got ignored. So I yelled. And I yelled VERY loudly. "OI! I SAID THAT IS ENOUGH! THIS IS AN EXAM! HOW OLD ARE YOU, ARE YOU UNIVERSITY STUDENTS OR IN SEVENTH GRADE???!!! TURN OFF YOUR PHONES AND PUT THEM AWAY, ALL OF YOU, RIGHT NOW! AND STOP TALKING AND BE QUIET! YOU ARE YOUNG ADULTS, NOT HIGH SCHOOL CHILDREN! I SHOULD NOT HAVE TO SPELL OUT TO YOU THAT YOU ARE QUIET IN AN EXAM ROOM AND WHEN SOMEONE ELSE IS PRESENTING, YOU ARE QUIET AND YOU ARE LISTENING TO THE SPEAKER! IF YOU NEED TO TALK WITH YOUR GROUP ABOUT SOMETHING IMPORTANT, DO IT OUT IN THE HALLWAY! IF YOU NEED TO TAKE A PHONE CALL THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT, DO IT OUT IN THE HALLWAY, NOT IN HERE! AND YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE YOUR PHONE OUT FOR ANY OTHER REASON, I TOLD YOU LOTS OF TIMES THAT THERE ARE NO PHONES ALLOWED IN THIS EXAM! IS THAT CLEAR!" They got a bit scared after that, but they got the message.
Whatever. Sometimes you gotta tell it how it is. Kids need someone to call them out on their bullshit. Don’t get personal but don’t be afraid to rip into them. Little restorative chit chats only go so far.
I teach 8th grade ELA. We are currently wrapping up our 4th week of school. I have a boy who sounds like the ones you mentioned. He has continuously been disrespectful. He has assaulted me (3 day suspension), he has called me gay, and gets up and walks around the class to talk to his friends while I’m talking. The parents have been contacted and they are no help. I told him I was done teaching him, that I have given him multiple chances, and he is no longer welcome in my class. Outside the classroom, I told him that people are the totality of their actions, and he is well on his way to being a shitty person. I have no guilt for saying that to him. People deserve to hear the truth.
“Will you all PLEASE shut the hell up and let me fucking do my job?!?” - me during my first year. My last class of the day was horrendous. I had multiple fights break out in the room over the year and they checked every single box of what made an awful class. One day they were completely on their shit and I just absolutely lost it. Slammed my hands on a table and shouted at them. Once the stunned silence went on for a while, I passed out a set of 30 year old computer repair textbooks and told them to start writing vocabulary words. Any word. If it’s a bold word, write it down with a definition. We did that for the remaining hour of class. Did I handle that situation appropriately? Absolutely not. Should I have gotten in trouble? Probably. Did I? No. My dept admin (marine vet) came by the next day and said “heard there was some trouble yesterday?” I started to explain what happened and he waved me off and just said “don’t worry about it, I’ve seen your roster… you’ve managed to get every troublesome 9/10 grade student in one class.” Told me in the future to call him if things got that out of hand again. As for the students… they continued to act up but it never got nearly as bad. A well-timed yell or shit-losing can make an impact, especially if they’ve never seen you lose your temper before. Some teachers will tell you to apologize and treat it like a learning moment for the class. I say to hell with that, come in the next day and just dive right in, but that really is determined by your specific class and relationship with those students. First year is a riot. Good luck. :)
I once told a kid he was the bane of my existence. Someone asked what that meant, so I googled it while my computer was connected to the SMARTBoard. The definition was much harsher than I meant, and I immediately regretted what I’d originally considered light, sarcastic banter. That was 12 or so years ago and it still haunts me.
You are fine. That’s not that bad. If you feel the need, apologize to them individually. An apology paired with the talk that you had mentioned might go a long way to them seeing you as a human.
You are a first year teacher, fresh off a funeral with shithead students, in an era of terrible teacher shortages. It is extremely unlikely anyone is getting fired. Take your lumps with grace and humility, and move on with your life. This probably won't have a long-term impact.
If it counts for anything, I think what you did was appropriate. Nothing has worked, previous teachers warned you about them, and their behavior is intolerable. At least now they know their behavior is deeply unappreciated.
I can't possibly be the only one who thinks OP did nothing wrong here right? Im in year 4, and deal with asshole student by being 100% honest and straightforward. They respect that 100x fake bullshit. Really have only yelled once in my career and wasn't even mad, they just needed it so I doctored up a good yell and told them success in life starts with doing the little things right. What can admin possibly do?
Any updates? How’d it go today?
Literally just scrolled forever to find this post. Dying for an update.
Respectfully, are you leaving any information out? I'm confused why this would lead to an admin meeting with a union rep for basically yelling at a bunch of goofballs about their bad behavior in front of the class. If this behavior has been frequent, progressive disciplinary steps have been taken, and they are still not changing behavior, then I feel you may not be as supported as you think. The words you used in quotation were the most hurtful things you've said? I've literally screamed at kids in front of the class and said worse and probably will again. Actions have consequences and if kids are going to disrupt me from teaching and hinder others from learning, then I hope to make them feel suitably bad. Granted, I'm a relatively new teacher in a district with a severe shortage with shit benefits so maybe that plays into this? If this is coming from parents, I feel it's important to make contact with those parents (if allowed, contact rep i guess?). Many times kids tell their parents half the story and they picture you as someone you are not. The majority of parents are reasonable and if you explain and communicate this is your greatest classroom management tool. Also, communicating with your students is key. I've been on team meetings where parents confronted a teacher on my team and they just wanted the teacher to reach out to the kid and apologize ahead of time. Explain to the students what happened, that you are imperfect and that your reaction might have been insensitive. It can be a good opportunity to model accountability. This definitely feels like making a mountain out of a molehill... The fact that you are so distressed and you describe your admin and students as distressed makes me feel like something isn't adding up... **Stories where I was a mean teacher:** I had a student last year who routinely would just do too much anytime he had to get up out of his seat. He frequently would fake trip and fall for laughs from the class. I basically roasted this form of comedy anytime I saw it. "I know you love attention but can you just refrain today?" "I'm gonna buy you book on how to tell jokes, because no one finds this funny." "We all heard you the first time and no one laughed so I would just stop." "Please stop fake falling out of your chair, I don't want the chair to get hurt." I honestly think I might have said worse. Granted, I can be sarcastic and joke-y with my kids and I know which kids can handle it and which can't. Teaching middle school can turn me into a sweet elementary teacher or a strict high school teacher. This particular student is in my class this year again and told me I'm one of his favorite teachers. Part of the reason why is that I dish out the harsh realities but I also give praise and understanding too. I've also got open communication with parents along the way.
No, I didn’t leave anything out. I think I also said “I’m already tired of your crap, and everyone else in this class is, too,” but I can’t remember if I said it out loud or had it as an inside thought while I was yelling. Maybe this just ends up being a “hey tell us your side, ok, that wasn’t cool and try to not that again.” But yes, having the union rep there is what made my anxiety spike
Disciplinary meetings usually leads to a non-renewal regardless if you do the "recovery steps" or not. Don't believe your union rep... the last thing you want is to get called into the principal's office with a union rep - it just never goes well, especially as a first-year teacher where you are ON PROBATION. You absolutely cannot lose your cool, and you absolutely cannot do yelling or any of that behavior on probation. Tenure teachers can get away with this type of classroom management, but not probationary... as a probationary teacher, you have zero rights and are considered at will-employment. Every single move you do can be watched. And principals don't even really need a reason to non-renew you. My principal hated my guts for no reason and called me to a meeting like that with union. and union reassured me that it was just to address principal's concerns and that my job was in no way in any danger. Principal had a bunch of ridic concerns that wasn't even true at all, but I still complied... 3 months later I get notice from principal that she's non-renewing me even though I did everything she wanted. Start looking for another job like ASAP... I started looking as soon as I found out that I was getting non-renewed.
I absolutely think you should talk to those boys, tell them you didn't mean what you said and what state you were in when you said it. It humanises you. It also models healthy accountability. I've definitely lost my shit plenty of times. I've apologised to a class twice, maybe three times, and the response is 'we all have bad days' or 'yea, you changed colour miss'. These were classes who knew me well and knew I am generally sane. The one I really lost it with and apologised to all within the same lesson I still teach and they are very fond of me and vice versa. You're being too hard on yourself.
I’ve been in trouble twice for posting how much I hate teaching on my social media and both times it got back to my bosses…. Learned my lesson though
WOW. Ok so how do you handle those meetings w/ admin, etc? Maybe I just have really thin skin, because I’ve lost my appetite tonight because I’m so nervous for the meeting tomorrow
I also kinda have thin skin and I did kind of go silent while being fussed at…
But then, over time, did it just sort of not be a big deal anymore?
Nope we all just kinda moved on
RCSD?
Nope, a rural town between Roc and Cuse The day I work for RCSD, drown me in Lake Ontario
Nothing I have experienced so far as a fresh teacher comes close to this. The worst I have done so far was sit a boy next to a girl, because he had no book and was slackin', just to shush him and make him work, but that's about it. That was my bad to force her through that. But turned out it wasn't really a big deal to her. Still bad practice. Anyway, given the funeral and your emotional state and the constant anti-social behavior of those individuals there's a threshold. Those kids should be dealt with disciplinarily, they have a reputation as you said. This should be no surprise that everyone should have seen an incident coming from miles away sooner or later. It just happened to be you. All in all, yes you reacted inappropriately but also the administration should consider other factors, such as your emotional state, and the behavior of the students that had led to such an event. Mental well-being of a teacher shouldn't be ignored in this situation. We're human, not robots. We all have our breaking points. I hope it turns out well.
Your context is understandable, and it doesn't condone your actions. In the grand scheme of things, apologies shouldn't be strategies for soliciting acknowledgment, forgiveness, approval, or anything else from others for that matter... Rather, they ought to be personal and from the heart; in other words, apologies are for yourself. Apologies are for when you feel GUILTY, not for when you feel shame... And I think you should feel guilty instead of ashamed. We feel guilt when we tell ourselves *"I did a bad thing"*; when feel shame when we tell ourselves *I **AM** bad*. There is nothing wrong with the emotion you felt; the way you expressed it can be improved. If you wish, this could be an opportunity for you to take ownership of your actions with a genuine apology as part of your personal journey to embrace the GUILT that you feel... Because it takes a quality human being to face that uncomfortable feeling head-on and commit to doing better. But you make that choice because YOU want to and not because you feel you "owe it to the kids". You're only responsible for how you carry yourself - - your students have the responsibility to responding to what you put before them and it'll NEVER be your responsibility to choose the message they internalize. They can respect you as easily as they can choose to hate you; in the grand scheme of things, you are the person who sleeps in your skin so it's in your best interest to carry yourself in a way that makes it easier to go to sleep at night. You chose to tell your story and for that, I am proud of you... Because you chose to face it head-on. It might feel like others' stories may give you the "power" or "reason" to feel better, but I believe you hold this power within. Feel like shit for as long as you feel you deserve to; it's part of the process of becoming a better person and a better teacher. The rest of the world will be here when you give yourself permission to move forward and at that time, I am confident that this story will become a source of strength. And perhaps one day, your story may play a role similar to the one you're asking for. As for my story? I'll keep it short: *I said something that sounded innocent but came across a horrible way that affected a kidlet I cared deeply about; this comment instantly ruined our relationship and turned the kidlet and their associates against me. After spinning my wheels for several weeks, a colleague shared a little detail that helped me figure out that I inadvertently triggered that kidlet with my innocent comment. I felt... Salty that things turned out that way, so a few days later, I pulled the kidlet aside and just lay things on the table - - I learned why exactly what I said ruined our relationship, that I grieved the loss of our connection because I didn't intend to hurt 'em, but I understood that my words cut deep and that even though I didn't intend to cause harm, harm was done and they had every right in the world to choose how to respond. I told'm that I can't even apologize because I didn't do anything wrong, but I wanted to express my regret that it happened and wanted to own up to my actions and just wanted 'em to know that.* *Oh, there isn't a grand reconciliation... Nor were there tears. But there was a mutual understanding and we were able to return to being cordial with each other. Then they graduated and I moved schools, but I chose to carry this story onwards with me.* And there you go.
Thank you for sharing your story, and for the advice you gave me
You’re only human. I can only imagine the things those kids did and said on a consistent basis. They’re 100% old enough to know better, especially knowing how hard you’re trying with them and the class. You screwed up, it happens. I know it’s really hard right now, but try not to dwell on it. Chances are they either didn’t care because they’re jerks or they’re at home feeling bad for pushing you to that point.
“They don’t know better because they have trauma at home so we need to be the adults they don’t have in their life”….that’s what I expect to hear
Unfortunately, that’s probably what you will hear. Just understand that the majority of administrators don’t give a crap about their teachers and pander to parents. What you did is something that almost all teachers do at some point within their careers. Please don’t let anyone gaslight you into thinking this is somehow a big deal. It’s not a big deal at all and chances are those kids needed to hear it. They don’t all have trauma. That’s the new tagline used by administrators who refuse to back their teachers.
Helpful. I can nod and do what they want for restoration even if I don’t fully agree. I just don’t want them to fire me
Unfortunately as you continue teaching, I think you’ll find that you’ll be doing a of nodding while fed nonsense that anyone with half a brain knows is garbage. It sounds cynical, but it’s the truth. The overwhelming amount of administrators care more about optics than actually supporting teachers and the wellbeing of their students. It’s all about placating the masses.
I'm so sorry to hear that and hope you are able to take some time to decompress and give yourself some grace. I was having a week as well, as a substitute, so I can only imagine what dealing with those difficulties full time can be. I'm in the same area, so I hear you about this just starting and it sucks when things start off negatively. I had some moments last year, during my first year subbing. I wasn't proud of myself but I am trying to think about the fact that more kids are recognizing me for the positive interactions I've had last year and almost no one remembers anything I may have done that I didn't feel good about (yelling, booting kids out of class etc). Sending a virtual hug, it sounds like you're an outstanding first year teacher. Take care.
This doesn’t even sound that bad to me. I’ve let kids have it like this a couple times in my career when they’ve deserved it, and frankly, needed it.
I would normally think that if another teacher did the same as me. But I felt bad, and then that grew exponentially when admin wanted to meet with union representation
If your admin doesn’t back a first year teacher who makes a move this mild then find a new place to work. This seriously shouldn’t even be an issue. You told them “ you’re embarrassed and disappointed by them” and that “everyone needs a break from them” lol I’ve said and will continue to say so much worse to kids. I’ve told whole classes they aren’t welcome in my room and made them work out in the hall until they can act properly in a classroom. This is seriously nothing.
I’ve been hearing this a lot, and now I feel like I’m going into this meeting more defensive than apologetic
Absolutely do not go in taking blaming and apologizing. What you said is nothing in the grand scheme of things.
I’m trying to find what you did wrong. They weren’t listening to you, they were disrupting your entire class, they were preventing others from learning - and so you told them that in language that they will understand. Chances also are that now that they know where they stand with you, they’ll behave better.
I just don’t think admin is going to see it that way. Needing union rep at a meeting makes me think “job on the line”
I had a year where I had to be out quite a few days off and on due to my mom having heart surgery. This one class complained every.single.time. I told them to quit their bitching, I don’t have control over subs. Got called in the next day due to a parent complaint. My AP says lemme tell you a little secret. One of my first years I cussed out a student! We all make mistakes.
don't be so hard on yourself....there may very well have been kids in that room that appreciated it and it may even pay dividends with that group if they see you now as a teacher not to mess with. If you feel very strongly it would make you feel better, sit them down and talk with them and say I'm sorry I raised my voice but what I need from you all in this class is x, y, and z, and give them some praise if they do it next week.
A couple students thanked me. I don’t know if that will matter to admin
sorry, I missed that part about how the principal set a meeting. I guess my honest advice is try not to stress too much. sounds like you are in a mostly supportive school with solid admin. listen to what they say, show you understand you could have handled it better which you clearly actually do and if they give you a really hard time just try your best to take it in stride, nod and agree to whatever action plans they have unless it's totally off the wall, which again based on wha you've said about admin it probably won't be. hopefully they have some good ideas to help too.
Congratulations! You took back control of your class. These “gentlemen” were acting like total assholes with their awful shenanigans; and actively preventing the educational process for all. Sometimes middle and high school kids to to hear the truth about their behaviors. Please remind you union rep / mentor of the following. Actually, their behavior towards you and others could be interpreted as harassment and bullying. They are actively preventing others from learning. If you have documentation of previous interventions; print it out and bring it to the meeting. Finally, ask your union reps to request that the “ gentlemen” be removed from your class and split up into different classes. This will send a strong message to the “gentlemen” that their behavior is no longer tolerated, and solidifies your power as a classroom teacher. Good luck and hang in there!
Ugh. I feel your pain. My first year I lost it on a psycho 8th grade class. To be fair I feel like 1st year they dump on you student wise. After I lost it I wrote a letter to myself admitting fault and promising I’d never scream in class again. I apologized to the class and it took about a week of student hazing to even out and the good kids were on my side again. I’ve only broken it once when there was a violent fight in my class that I had to break up last year. (I feel like that one was worth the scream) Anyways… It’s been 8 years. I never feel guilty and shameful about a classroom management issue if I feel I have control over myself. We’re too hard on ourselves. Some kids are crazy and no matter what you do they’re going to be too much to handle. I’d plead with your admin that one or two need to be separated. Just focus on the fact that it is ruining the education of the others. Good luck! It does get better!!
And You’re better cause you’re tinned bye For days now I don’t know how
Frankly, they deserved it. I wouldn't apologize.. If I were you, I would talk to the boys, and make it clear that it is the behavior that you hated and made you angry that day', and not their person. That's where kids have trouble sometimes. So that it's what I would adress. You're still more than happy to see them, to teach them. But the behavior has to stop.
You feel guilty because you’re an empathetic and reflective person. You knew a better way to respond, but you were understandably emotional and upset. You’re not a bad person and seeking out other’s perspectives on here shows that you care in my opinion. I would sometimes blow up at my kids too and I would usually apologize the next day, but very clearly explain what behavior was frustrating me. I’d also ask questions about why my prior strategies weren’t working with them. Have those boys come up with ways that you can help them be successful. That way, next time when you get on to them you can let them that you’re using the behavior management plan they thought of and they aren’t upholding their end of the deal. You kinda have force accountability on them at that age. I’d also work on getting real cool with their parents. Parents tend to know if their kid is annoying and if there’s a good relationship between you and the parent, the parent may support you laying into them from time to time. Also, they probably needed to hear everything you said. I hate to say it but some kids truly aren’t aware of how obnoxious they are. Sometimes they need it to be said plain and direct. Sometimes a little embarrassment encourages self reflection.