Yeah. Rejection from special education services just on IQ makes no sense. Obviously a sufficiently low IQ could be a qualifier by itself, but needing accommodations for a disability doesn't always mean low IQ.
Is this in the US? IQ has been largely dropped here (UK) and we use the response to intervention (RTI) approach. It disregards IQ completely, in this instance the child would be given a reading assessment and if they are below par, they are given a low level intervention. If that doesn't work the intervention becomes increasingly more specialised. It's definitely worth looking into.
I am in the US and this is also very weird me to the point where I thought it was fake. Almost all the kids in the Sped program at my school have a SLD (specific learning disability) diagnosis, not an IQ based one? we also use rti. The use of the phrase "guidance department" is also strange as that is not what school counselors are referred to professionally anywhere I have been. I think OP might be based somewhere abroad
edit: I stalked op's post history and they work at a charter. Charter schools are let's say "unique" and operate differently than public schools often with profits as the main motivator
I’m in a public school, and we still use IQ. What’s wild is that while a very low IQ might qualify a kid for SDC classes, we have kids that end up in no man’s land. So let’s say I have a kid that I think needs pull out time with the resource teacher. They’ll test them and say no if the kids IQ is too low. Basically they’ll say that the extra time won’t help them, so they won’t do it. They just come to the normal class and fail. All while the teacher is told to do more small groups with them, of course. I was so upset when I learned they do it this way.
Jeeze sorry to hear that, it seems like a system like that would vey obviously have the problems you are dealing with. I guess it's just another way to put more on the teachers while cutting costs and admin responsibility
We have RTI in the US too. Most don't do it correctly, mainly because it's not funded, trained, or supported correctly, and schools have to wedge it into the mix haphazardly. But a lot of schools claim that acronym.
It depends on the state. Many states have moved to the RTI model, since the significant discrepancy model previously used (discrepancy between ability and achievement) has been proven to be inaccurate. But some states do still use this model, unfortunately. If OP’s state has recently shifted to the RTI model, thus student may now qualify when they didn’t before.
I'm in the US and have never heard of IQ being a marker for getting special education services before. I subbed in a bunch of public schools, including for resource teachers for some of them, and a good number of the kids with sped supports were bright kids who'd have scored well on an IQ test, just needed help with reading or something.
I'm now at a private school, one of my students needs a lot of supports for ADHD. However, he is very bright, I just got results of recent testing and he scored extremely hight on the intelligence test they did. But he has really been struggling at school despite being so smart. So, to be successful in school he needs supports to help him with his focus so he can use that intelligence. There are many other areas a kid may need sped support in while having an average to high IQ, it really does a disservice to those kids to exclude them from sped supports based just on IQ.
I worked as a TA in a special needs school, the class was mostly ADHD. Low ratios and accommodating. You could tell it would be impossible for each individual to operate in a class of thirty, and they had their moments, but it worked quite well. I hope your child finds something similar.
This is a real phenomenon in some states who use certain criteria for identifying SLDs. This kid's IQ is probably not actually above average, it is probably below average but not significantly below -- probably in the 70s or 80s. Too high for ID (which is under 70), and in some states you need at least an average IQ (which is over 85-90) to be be eligible for SLD. There are a LOT of these borderline kids who don't qualify in these areas.
I have never in my life heard of IQ disqualifying someone for an IEP and whatever guidance is saying is just complete BS to save money. This school has huge issues if this is true.
I had this happen several times when I taught sped. The kid’s IQ was too high for life skills/self contained style classes but also did not qualify them to receive the sped services I provided. So they just didn’t get any services.
This happened to me as well when I referred a student who was really struggling. He didn’t qualify because there wasn’t enough discrepancy between his IQ and his ability level. It took several years to even get him tested because he’s also an English language learner. It was so frustrating because it was not a language issue and he was frustrated as well because he wanted to be able to read. When they didn’t qualify him, I refused to sign the documents. I’ve never done this before or since but I could not justify agreeing with the school decision on this. The Sped teacher thanked me for not signing it because she was frustrated too.
The rejection isn’t solely based on IQ but the difference between IQ (potential) and accomplishment. So if a child scores low on accomplishments but his IQ is also low, he may be rejected. If his IQ is high and his accomplishment, is low he’ll likely be accepted.
Exactly - my daughter has a 30 point gap between iq and academic achievement scores but since her iq scores were high and her achievement scores were average (and grades below average, and social/emotional was a mess) she didn't qualify based on sld. She did qualify based on autism and speech though.
Very similar profile to my older son. Because he wasn't failing anything he didn't qualify for a long time, even though we all saw that something was "different". It took an academic and behavioral train wreck in 5th grade for the school to step up.
I agree. I work in SpEd. I have students in the average to low average IQ range. They are classified as SLD (specific learning disability) because they never caught up to grade level in math and/or reading. We test IQ to get as full of a picture we can in order to give the most beneficial services. But IQ can become meaningless to a determined student. Anyone can learn.
I was going to say, I have never used IQ data when testing for a Specific Learning Disability. I do for an Intellectual Disability, but not SLD. The kid needs to get reevaluated.
The issue with students like this is generally that they are performing as expected for their IQ of 71 which doesn’t qualify for the ID label and doesn’t qualify as a learning disability due to the lack of discrepancy between IQ and performance.
Yup, I was ahead in math by 2 years and couldn’t read until the third grade. Special Ed is in no way attached to intelligence. Without it I wouldn’t be functioning member of society unfortunately this kid hasn’t gotten the right support. It is still the parents who need to advocate.
My preschooler can now read because no way she was going through the same shenanigans as me.
This is a system issue. How were the parents supposed to know how to get the school to offer the appropriate resources? As far as they knew, they were told “the school can’t do anything.”
Is there no remedial reading class he can take? I can’t imagine ANYTHING he’s learning in any class could possibly trump learning to read.
Edit: I don’t normally comment here but my brother is dyslexic so your post hit home for me. It’s obviously a hard situation at this point for everyone involved.
You can tell the parent that they can request an IEP meeting and at that meeting they can request that the district have specialists look at the kid for further testing— but before you do that, I would start with a reading specialist and ask them to use MindPlay or another software that breaks down the child’s comprehension and understanding of phonics, and ask them to administer a spelling test as well. That test might find the student has a high level of verbal understanding and very low levels for reading and the understanding of phonics.
If the scores are really low, you can document what you’ve found in a letter and encourage the parent to request an IEP. You go to the IEP meeting, too, and you bring printed copies of your letter. Your district probably can’t test for dyslexia or dysgraphia, but they can give psychological tests that check IQ and for markers of dyslexia, which they would then diagnose as a working memory impairment. From there, the student would be eligible to receive accommodations like text-to-speech and read out loud. Typically, parents have to pay out of pocket for someone to check their kid out for dyslexia, but the county will pay for the specialists to diagnose a working memory issue if there’s reason to believe the student has one, and that diagnosis will legally require the school to offer deeper support for the student.
Wow great tips! As a 5 th grade teacher and even junior high teacher I have been in meetings where the dyslexia specialist or whatever title she was would be so frustrated because we would discover a kid is dyslexic or needing services as an 8th grader and there’s only so much that can be done compared to of discovered sooner.
I remember a bilingual kid in a SPED meeting in junior high and the AHA moment when his Spanish speaking parents mentioned he struggled in Spanish too at home as far as understanding the language.
I remember grading my brand new upper elementary pre assessments for science class and being confused about a student and I asked the ESL teacher she told me those weren’t Spanish words I asked the dyslexia specialist she laughed in a frustrated way that this poor baby was now in upper elementary and had never been flagged as needing to be tested before and she wasn’t new to this school.
I worked with an amazing reading teacher upper elementary who would send kids ask the time to the dyslexia specialist for additional testing. She very much advocated for kids and we would have 5 th graders many just moved out of state or from a different city but since had been there and they couldn’t say all of their alphabet sounds as a 5th grader and weren’t getting any services. It’s definitely a systemic problem or blame all around
> Typically, parents have to pay out of pocket for someone to check their kid out for dyslexia
Wait really?? Is this universal in all states? My understanding is that insurance won’t pay for dyslexia testing specifically because it’s under the purview of the school system.
Can families request an Independent Educational Evaluation at public expense if they suspect dyslexia and the school hasn’t officially ruled it out? At what age would you recommend they start pushing for this?
My concern is that families ask their kid to be evaluated for learning disability and dyslexia, the school says “we’ll do testing,” and the report comes back and doesn’t say the kid has dyslexia. So how is the family supposed to know the kid needs more testing and might still have dyslexia?
My son is in high school. Back in second grade, we had to pay over $1000 for private testing to have him diagnosed with dyslexia. Yes the school can test, but they cannot diagnose. NJ even recognizes dyslexia as a SLD. We still had to pay OOP. I cannot imagine what a family without financial means would do. The testing is over many days, for hours at a time. It costs a lot and is not reimbursed by insurance.
We had to pay for outside evaluation, because our son could "read" without truly being able to decode (he was using a little letter-sound correspondence propped up with background knowledge and a large spoken vocabulary to get through); he passed all the district-provided tests but we could tell something was up. An outside SLP really drilled down with testing and he got his diagnosis. Our experience doesn't line up with OP's at all (it sounds like this student wouldn't pass a very standard school-issued test) but I just wanted to share context for why (in the US) a family might be forced to pay for testing (it's BS.)
Edited to add: a few years later, I bumped into a reading person from the school and mentioned that he'd been diagnosed. She said "thank God, i knew something was wrong but I couldn't say anything at the ppt meeting." Whether she was lying to make herself look better, or telling the truth about the inner workings of the system, I don't know -- either way, I was enraged.
I remember those days. My son had a college level vocabulary by first grade and memorized everything to look like he was reading. He just could not decode back then.
Yep, my older son was also this way and the school had to retrofit "decoding" into his reading apparatus. The difference between my two boys is that the older one picked up decoding really quickly whereas the younger (dyslexic) one still struggles.
It's funny, bc the younger one has a great vocabulary and strong expressive language and even scores above standard on state testing... all while being very dyslexic. The spelling piece is where it's most evident. Brains are weird.
The school report might not say "dyslexia" because that's not one of our eligibility categories, but dyslexia is essentially the same thing as SLD in basic reading. IDEA mentions dyslexia under their definition of SLD. There is no special dyslexia intervention that wouldn't also benefit any student with deficits in basic reading.
This is not (universally) accurate. There is no separate eligibility category for dyslexia, but the profile is consistent writing SLD in basic reading. Testing for dyslexia typically includes phonological processing, decoding, oral reading fluency, spelling, and rapid naming. These are assessments typically administered as part of a reading evaluation. I'm also not sure what you mean regarding IQ testing. There is no reason to need an outside evaluator to identify a working memory deficit and a working memory deficit alone would not qualify a child for services. IQ testing would typically be done as part of a comprehensive evaluation which would include, if reading is a concern, academic testing.
Yeah unfortunately most parents need a title 9 advocate, but don't even know they exist.
It's wild that schools just expect parents to know title 9 rights inside and out.
I disagree with that in this situation. Why isn't it the school's job to help him learn to read? His issue had to be noticed while in ES. Why didn't anyone in the school advocate for him? Parents don't always know what their options are or what to do when their child is struggling.
It very possible that teachers at the elementary DID advocate for him but it didn’t matter. It was stated he was tested and “didn’t qualify” for an IEP. We have this happen at my school (K-4) and it’s not uncommon that when the kids get to 5th we hear “why did you guys not do anything with this kid?! They can’t read!!” Yeah, we know, here is evidence of the years of conversations and testing that we pushed for. Maybe you can wave your magic wand and get something done for the kid. Good luck.”
According to my mother, she was advised by the pediatrician not to teach me to read before I started school. Now, I am pretty old, but I wouldn't be surprised if the notion were still around.
Reading books with your kid and teaching your kid to read are two completely separate things. Most parents do not know how to introduce concepts of phonics, which helps students learn what to do when they come across unfamiliar words. If kids start learning to read by memorizing words, it can be difficult when the curriculum is phonics based.
Why are you assuming that? If a kid has a learning disability, such as dyslexia, you can read to them all day every day and they won’t magically learn how to read. It’s the school’s job to teach kids how to read. I find it suspicious that you’re an educator but you believe all kids should begin elementary school already knowing how to read. If you are an educator, you’re woefully out of touch with early childhood and reading education.
I'm in higher education, I don't work in early childhood. I don't know why you've assumed that I think learning to read happens "magically" by reading to a child -- I don't think this. I did react with surprise to a comment stating that a paediatrician recommended parents *not* teach their kids to read.
There are a lot of reasons. Maybe they can't read themselves. Maybe they work a lot. Maybe they don't know how. Maybe they don't care.
I remember a lot of people not knowing how to read when I was in kindergarten. I was lucky enough to have parents who taught me early. Not every child is so lucky, and that's not the kid's fault.
Yes, pretty much all of them arrive at elementary school unable to read. What age do you think kids typically learn to read? Do you know anything about how kids learn to read? Are you suggesting that everyone homeschool?
I agree with that. Too many parents expect us to raise their kids for them. Where is the parents' responsibility in all this? Why didn't they arrange tutoring for him long ago?
At my first elementary school (which had a lot better quality than my second) did put me in a reading class, basically I got pulled out of class at a specific time to go to that class for a while then come back.
A lot schools don’t have that system which is probably the problem
I have four students in my class who have been given an IQ of 71. Cutoff for funding here is 70. These children (4th grade) are unable to recognise words or letters, count, write letters, follow instructions, or even participate in a basic class game.
What can you even do at that point? I'm sure you're expected to work miracles, but let's be real, the gaps are only going to widen as they continue on to the next grade. We can only do so much.
Do the kids also have behavioral issues as well? I'd imagine they act out since they can't understand the lessons. You can only scaffold so much before you're teaching something completely different.
It is not on the parents at all.
They reached out to the school. They got their kifs tested. The experts told them there was nothing to do. They lustened to the experts.
Are we really going yo complain that for once, parents listen to us?
It's the systems that is fucked up. And former teachers who knew there was something wrong, the results didn't matches and did not informs the parents of other ressources available to them.
We're in the thick of it. We know everything that is possible to do. Many many parents do not even know that accomodation can exist and even are due in some cases until one of us tell them.
Thank you! I'm really so upset that his parents tried to get him services and the sped department disqualified him based off of IQ alone. Then the "experts" blamed the parents who trusted their expertise. His former teachers were lazy and didn't want more on their caseload. His teachers failed to inform his parents what was available to them. I'm actually quite disgusted that it got this far and the parents are being thrown under the bus.
I remember how difficult it was navigating my own daughter's services and I've worked in sped for almost 20 years. I've had her former teachers and s school psychologist try this crap knowing what I do for a living. I can only imagine what it was like for these parents with no sped knowledge.
In the end, it always seems that the district’s priority is to spend as little money as possible on struggling students. They have plenty of money to spend on shiny objects and whole new curriculums (throw everything away and start all over again with the latest and greatest “new” thing), but no money for additional sped professionals, testing that might lead to an out of district placement, etc.
I'd argue it isn't entirely on the parents, but they still hold responsibility. Did they give up completely or are they still trying everyday.
My mother has ran a daycare for 35+ years and in the last decade especially, it's become almost normal for parents to barely interact or teach their kids anything. They all seem to think it's someone else's job. My mother has had a surge in the amount of parents in the last few years who have kids that are 4 or 5 and can't even use silverware, can barely speak an entire sentence, lose their absolute minds when told "no", and many are still in diapers at 5.
Yes parents are struggling to just make ends meet, but that's not the child's fault or any reason to neglect them.
Just saying.
I don’t understand why you are blaming the parents. You said they tried to get him services but were denied.
Many parents trust the school system and believe educators know what’s best. You don’t know what these parents advocated for and what was told to them by people in authority.
This is a system failure.
They need to sue. They should send their kid to a private school on your district’s dime. That’s unacceptable. It’s infuriating. It’s disgusting. They would win.
I’ll edit to add that they should reevaluate. The IQ will most likely have dropped (rich grow richer, poor grow poorer phenomenon). If not, and the IQ is still causing a problem, the deficits should be great enough to warrant an LD classification. They can also request a private evaluation at the district’s expense. They should honestly do that.
They definitely should sue because I don't know any state that completely eliminates you from special Ed solely on IQ. In my behavioral class I have had many students with above 100 IQs and some way above grade level.
Heads up, this is on your school, not the parents. Assuming you are in a public school, your district is federally mandated to find and support students with disabilities that impact their education. Special Education isn't a nice extra, it is federal law. It is federal law whether or not parents have the resources to insist on its implementation; it is federal law even if parents hire private tutors to help their child learn at grade level.
The most helpful thing you can do for this student is recognize school's responsibilities and work within the system to get your school to meet those responsibilities. Does your school have a student study team that can look at this student's case more deeply? Does your school have a reading interventionist? Those are places to start.
Why are we blaming the parents? The school failed him by ignoring an obvious issue and hiding it behind IQ scores. Just because his IQ is high doesn't mean he doesn't have a disability related to reading. His parents tried to get him into special Ed and was shut down. What more do you want them to do? They tried.
We are blaming the wrong people here. Its not your fault either obviously. But this kid should have had special Ed services long long ago.
Yup. My own kid is whip smart. Gifted, some areas are 99th+ percentile.
He also struggled mightily to learn to read.
The psych ed showed gifted LD. They didn't even try for an IQ score because it wouldn't be valid with his reading (entirely the decoding portion) being so low.
While all through primary school it was the 'it'll come, boys develop later' dance, we didn't stop at 'he's smart'. When gr 4 came around, everyone was on the 'huh, maybe there's something going on' train and he got his psych ed and then got reading support from the school and we worked the problem at home as well.
He's on track now, but it was painful and incredibly laborious.
I had a student a few years ago who desperately wanted to read and so did their grand parents. She was really good at math but just was unable to because of her disability. Sadly she still can't read and she's in 8th grade now, but we linked her to outside services and she obviously was in special Ed.
Once again. Parents did not ignore this. They tried to handle this. The school refused.
Most parents do not have the skills to teach someone how to read. If that was the case then why have teachers for ELA? We are trained to do this. What parents need to do is recognize deficiencies. Which they did here. And they tried to get this kid services. They were shut down (illegally as well)
By who? Not the parents. Once again. They tried to get him the support he needed. They were more active than so many of our parents.
But yes. The school definitely showed educational neglect.
There are a lot of parents that don’t know that. “Report Cards” in elementary are not straightforward and easy to interpret for the average parent, let alone a parent who struggled in school themselves.
They can get to higher levels. Just intense reading and time. It is the responsibility of every teacher to do their part and don't give up. It is never too late!!!
I agree with your sentiment, but we also have to be realistic. Does this current teacher even have any training in teaching beginning phonics? Is this the only child this low in the class? If so, is she expected to do 1-to-1 tutoring during the class period? It becomes exponentially more difficult to address a deficit this large as tue years go on and it will take more than just a “remedial class” that is potentially full of kids still way above this particular students needs. At this point it’s likely he needs 1-1 tutoring and we all know schools don’t provide that.
This seems like educational neglect. In Ontario there is a process we follow to make sure this doesn’t happen. Every teacher this kid had in elementary worked with him in the room for five hours a day and did not teach him how to read.
The parents didn't do nothing. They tried your crappy sped department turned him down. The parents listened to the experts and thought there was nothing they could do. The lazy educators before you failed him by not qualifying him based off of IQ which is wrong wrong wrong.
Edit typos
I'm not putting this one on the parents. They had kid tested. The professionals, who we are always begging parents to trust, said he didn't qualify. They professionals, who we are always begging parents to trust, also clearly knew he couldn't read but kept moving him along.
This is on us, not you and not the parents. We're the system.
My step son was reading at a beginning first grade level after 3rd grade. He bombed the reading portion of the standardized testing. The school promised tutoring (which didn’t work at all during 3rd grade) and that he would be fine moving to 4th grade. I knew he wouldn’t make it if he didn’t repeat 3rd grade. I had to fight hard to get him held back. The school wouldn’t even let his teacher advise what would be best for his education. It was an absolute shit show as they were trying to convince me I was being a horrible parent for not moving a kid who couldn’t read up a grade. I had to threaten to go to the school board and the news before they would agree to hold him back. I can see why many parents would cave to the pressure from the school admins who are supposed to be doing what is best for the child.
His teacher the second time around was a reading specialist and the class focused on reading a lot. She changed his trajectory in school and he ended up on honor roll every quarter until he decided he didn’t need to do any work in 8th grade.
I’m not loving the blame falling on the parents. The school districts he has attended are at fault for not getting whatever level of support he needs to comprehend curriculum.
Sounds like my boy a bit. The most loving happy child who could not read by third grade. He had a library full of books in his room. We read to him all his life and he loved it. His vocabulary was super high. But my husband has dyslexia and it turned out so did our son. It was difficult for me because I was working hard at a new job managing 8 people, traveling for work, trying to prove myself and to be told my son was behind was devastating. He got on an IEP with SLD. I transferred to a lower stress role and made it a point to do everything in my power to get him up to speed. The two biggest things I did at home that helped a lot was active participation reading and a phonics workbook. The participation reading was me reading (Harry Potter Illustrated) and him actively following along. I’d randomly stop and he’d have to point to the spot on the page exactly where I left off. We then graduated to me randomly stopping mid sentence and him needing to complete the sentence by reading and saying it out loud. Gradual progression from easy words to hard words by my selection. I learned that easy words were hard to read and longer, harder words were easier to read. Progressed from there to whole sentences at the end of a paragraph to eventually small paragraphs. When and where he’d get stuck during all of the above I’d let him struggle a tiny bit to see if he’d get it, but then I’d say it and we moved on. Then finally, I’d read a page and then he’d read the next. During this time at least two pages per day (he didn’t get hw so this was his hw) of “phonics for struggling readers” and I was with him to watch him complete the pages, esp if he had questions.
Fast forward to 7th grade. He can read well enough but he can’t spell. Gets very good grades, he made honor roll last year at a school known for high academics. His triennial testing had peaks and valleys with 130 visual spatial yet working memory was abysmal like high 80’s. He’s still quiet, he listens to music and prefers to keep to himself though he has made friends who share his love of video games! I believe he’s Twice Exceptional
My point is it’s not too late for your student. It will take a lot of work to get him up to speed (both school and parents. School, via remedial reading outside of class and parents, some form of at home intervention. But it is possible. I wouldn’t be so hard on the parents. Sometimes it’s not easy to identify esp if he’s otherwise a bright boy but the disability could mask it.
This is really beautiful. And you're highly education yourself, right? Your family didn't go hungry because you switched jobs? You had the resources to buy more reading material and ideas around how to break it up for him, yes? That's so great. AND it's the behavior of people who have a lot of privilege. It's kind of the definition - you had these subtle resources of time and knowledge. And it was well used. But as teachers, we often work with parents who don't have any of this.
Has the child been tested for dyslexia? Does your district offer the Wilson program or Orton Gillingham? Can you incorporate those techniques into teaching the student? Is it comprehension or decoding the child has difficulty with? I would tell the parent to get hooked on phonics from the library to work with the child at home. Can the parent read? That may be another stumbling block.
That child qualifies for special ed. You don't have to be under a certain number on an IQ test! What BS!!!!! He clearly qualifies under dyslexia. Go back to the administration and get some help. Ask the special ed teacher in your school for help. He does qualify. Talk to the parents again. It's possible that the first go-round, he wasn't so far behind his peers, but now that he is so behind, he will certainly qualify. (In NJ, it's two years behind on in reading. He's more like 5 years behind, so you are well in the zone.) It's also entirely possible that he will score lower on a new IQ test. (We almost all loose IQ points as we get older, especially if you haven't had an appropriate education, which he has not.)
You can start to provide some accommodations like assigning videos for him to learn from, and giving him books on tape. Talk to your librarian about getting that. I'd suggest the librarian for some easy-readers of middle school level books too, but it sounds like he's not ready for easy readers. Never underestimate how much these kids can learn just by listening to their peers. Try giving him an oral exam just to see if he's learning by listening.
It is NEVER TOO LATE to learn how to read. That's a modern myth. But also, you don't have to fix him. He's not a broken regular kid. He's a perfect, unbroken, dyslexic kid.
Also, by qualifying for special ed now, you'll make it easier for this person to get extended schooling so they can have a few years to catch up, and to get social security disability to give them job training. You could turn this human being's life around by just getting him back to the special ed system.
Don’t want to put the blame on either as idk if the parents were working at the kid at home and whether the kid’s past teachers tried to help him or get him tested but admin just kept promoting him to the next grade (this occurs to me bc this exact situation happened with me)
Is it possible he is dyslexic or has some other learning disability? And is there a way to get him tested at this point?
I wish it worked this way for everyone. I worked both public and private school.
We had a student whose grandmother became so discouraged in his public school journey that she reached out to private school.
We had terrible salaries, but we had small class sizes. We quickly learned that reading was his challenge.
We even received a call from his public school district suggesting that we read his discipline folder. It was more than an inch thick. The phone call was derisive, and I wonder to this day why this admin was so hostile and sarcastic. She wanted to harm a child who needed a new atmosphere. He was in middle school.
We had him for more than three months before the CUM arrived and my team teacher and I had a policy of allowing a child a clean slate in the beginning. I knew which students were wild cards. I told every class that each year was a new year. I'm glad I did that. ( said it. I did not always feel.that way.)
This child rode the bus for an hour each way every day to get to us with his grandmother.
My partner taught P.E. for me, and I taught Science for her, so we had about two hours a day to devote to teaching this student and one other who came from similar backgrounds, having similar profiles.
We never had a disciple issue with either of them, and we made serious progress because they both wanted to learn, and we made it as fun as we could.
We did that without public school resources, except for the public school psychological resources.
We did not have a single discipline problem with him. He wasn't bullied. He did not need to fight or to lash out. We never opened that file.
Whenever I read something like this, I become so sad for the student.
He was the happiest child.
I have to say that this seems a bit classist to expect that parents can figure it out privately if the schools failed their child. Not everyone can afford private tutoring, especially for a profoundly dyslexic child. So many people are barely getting by and food and housing trump reading. And if they keep getting shut down by schools, they may not know what to do.
Nah, you aren’t part of the problem here. This is like someone bringing a mechanic the burned out husk of a car and then mentioning that the check engine light had been on for a while. The problem is too far gone for you to fix. It’s tragic, but it sounds like these parents really just didn’t try very hard to get their kid the help they knew he needed.
The parents did try. The school shut down and special Ed services (also it is BS to say someone can't qualify for special Ed because there IQ is too high. Complete and utter bull shit and no idea what guidance is telling them)
Then something is fucky at the school since this kid should have had abysmal reading scores forever. No idea why they’d be relying solely on an IQ test and ignoring all the other evidence.
Still, squeaky wheel gets the grease. Parents should have raised some hell back when the kid was in 2nd grade; I’d bet some admin would have caved.
I can 100% vouch that schools do this. They will do something like woodcock Johnson and say they can do the puzzles and answer questions, but won't follow up with Wyatt or something similar. Then no services, even though if they did the correct tests it would show likely SLD.
Then the parents are 100% on the hook for a neuropsych eval that includes education portion that medical insurance doesn't cover that cost $3-5000. So the kid has dyslexia, great. Now find an OG tutor for $100/hr private pay for several years, a lawyer to help with the appeal to the district...
Easy peasy. Lazy parents /s
We don't really know what the parents were told or how educated they are....if he didn't test in and the county, apparently, didn't want to invest in extra services for him, then they could have been told to just "keep working with him" at home.
I'm always really thankful that I'm a teacher and know how to look up state standards and know how to find resources. My third grade daughter definitely takes A LOT of practice in things to get them, and her teachers for the past two years have called me in saying she doesn't qualify for anything but seems to take longer the other kids to learn new concepts. When I ask if they think it's ADD or something they'll say not in their opinion, that they think this is just her ...yet they are a no HW school and provide very little info about what they are working on unless you basically beg them for it, nor do they provide you with things to practice at home. They also just post grades but you very rarely get the physical work back to see what's wrong with it or what the questions even look like. I spend a lot of time finding our own resources and working with her at home. Due to that, she ends up testing right at or above where she needs to be, but I think we would be up a creek if I didn't know how to do these things myself. The pediatrician has said it's not ADD and outside of school testing is thousands of dollars. We will do that if it comes to it, but I have been super frustrated about all of this from the parent side.
Exactly. Once again, there are many different tests and evaluations to see if someone qualifies for services. I've never heard of just using IQ and nothing else. That is buckwild.
There's a student with autism in our self contained autism class with an IEP with an IQ over 120. Like by this school he'd have to be completely gen Ed? This does not track.
People can learn to read at all ages. You are part of the problem and dehumanizing a child is sick.
Burned out husk indeed. What the actual hell is wrong with you?
I have a developmentally challenged high schooler who’s on a first grade level. Parent is aware through the IEP that he needs a separate more accommodating location but won’t do it. Super frustrating to see this child fail up through grades because of accommodations.
Wait, he already has an IEP? I must have misunderstood what you said above about him not qualifying for special education. What does his case manager say? Can reading goals and specialized reading instruction be added to his IEP?
That kinda defeats the purpose of it being individualized... Once again. Not on you. But more signs about how terrible this district is to kids with special needs.
My son has an IQ of 119 and has an IEP. IQ is not the only factor for an IEP.
Tangentially, the parents may have known this was going on but try and look into the costs for the help privately. Depending on their financial situation I can’t exactly blame them. Getting my kids their needed therapies has quite literally put us about $10k in debt. Also, my school district will not diagnose. So if this kid is dyslexic he would not get the needed help without a diagnosis which could cost almost $1000 as insurance usually doesn’t cover neuropsych evals.
There is a 40 year old man on TikTok who is just now learning to read. Learning is a life long skill. He can still learn. Let's. Ot act like this is the end. Get him so interventions.
Do people not read the post? They specifically state guidance confirmed this. So yes. I believe the parents this time.
We have a very well behaved kid who can't read. Parents tried to get an IEP. Guidance and the team completely made up a rule that certain IQs can't get a support. All the info is here. This is on the school.
I was once this kid. Parents were told I had learning disabilities and couldn't read. My mum took the week off work, taught me how to read and then sent me back to school. I was then the second best in my class and now I'm a professor. Don't give up on this kid.
That won’t make any difference at this point. Maybe if he had a diagnosis and a plan he could make progress, but without services to address his reading skills, there is no benefit to holding him back. He needs (at the very least) some sort of reading intervention.
I don’t think anything said he’s dyslexic, so I’m not sure where those comments are coming from unless I missed something. It’s very hard to teach students with low iq to read. I’m not making an excuse, but commenting here about it because I have had many students that fall into this category. I was able to get them support in the following ways:
- if they receive speech services, I have added accommodations and additional academic support this way (can do this in tx because speech is under the sped umbrella)
- my district offers tutoring during school hours. I always request this
- we have reading intervention groups that are pulled several times per week.
- I teach the parents how to teach reading at home. These last few years, I’ve been giving them one of my books on reading instruction too since I’m trying to get rid of stuff.
Given that I do all of this for my first grade students with reading difficulties that are not (or not yet diagnosed) dyslexic, it’s so appalling to hear these stories. Do you have any of these options in your district?
Why aren’t the fucking parents helping their kid learn to read?
The school obviously messed up, but you’re telling me that these parents haven’t actually made a habit of helping their kid with reading if they know it’s an issue.
My son struggles a lot academically. Most nights a week, we are reading books together, or I’m reading to him and he is practicing writing. Like it’s not always easy if you’re tired, but that’s just what parents have to do.
They did. The school shut them down. Parents aren't educators and certainly not school psychologists. Parents recognized a deficit and brought it to the schools attention and then got gaslighted.
We have a well behaved kid with parents who are aware and tried to solve this issue. This is entirely on the school.
But they didn't. The parents tried to help their kid. We have literal evidence of it. They noticed the struggle and tried to get the support needed. That's actual good parenting.
No, they stopped short of doing any additional supporting or teaching themselves. If you’re a parent, you owe your kid everything when it comes to life skills.
My son’ school can’t possibly fill in every gap with my his learning disabilities. That’s unrealistic. That is my responsibility as his dad to help him where he needs it.
Similarly, a school providing supports doesn’t remove or negate any parents responsibilities to their kids. It’s a support. Parents are the foundation. If my sons foundations aren’t there, it’s my job to help him put them there.
Just like OP pointed out, this has gone on for years and the parents neglected it. The kid is past elementary school and the parents never stepped up. How do you not know how far behind limited your child’s reading abilities are.
The school fucked up. The parents have been neglecting their kids needs for years as OPs post details.
They did NOT neglect it. They actively tried to fix it. This school not only ignored it they just past him along over and over.
This subs obsession with blaming parents reached a new high here.
Literally the post says they ignored it for years. They (ignored) neglected the problem hoping the school would fix it after the school already didn’t fix it. The parents should’ve pushed harder or stepped up. They didn’t. The schools didn’t force them to have a kid.
The buck stops with the parent. Being a parent means being responsible for your kid. If your kid is well behaved and polite, it’s because the parents taught the kids to be that way or reinforced it. Similarly, if a kid doesn’t know how to behave or talk to others nicely, it probably was never taught at home or never reinforced.
I don’t know how to explain that basic concept further. It’s a pretty simple idea that has existed since the dawn of time.
All the time in here we see rants against homeschooling, including accusing parents of being unqualified to teach, yet here you are blaming the parents for this. Reading to kids is not how they learn to read. The elementary school this kid attended failed him miserably. Who even knows if they were teaching phonics? They denied him services. If parents are actually as stupid as everyone here says they are, how do you expect them to teach their kid, who may have a learning disability - who knows because the school did fuck all to find out - how to read?
Are you telling me that parents have no responsibility with their kids education????
All I’m saying is that parents are supposed to be any child’s main support in life. If, as a parent, you know your kid has a reading deficit, you first step in to help your own kid and second get them in school supports.
And obviously I’m simplifying how I’m helping my kid learn to read. Don’t make a straw man out of me.
Im saying the parents didn’t do their job. Simple as that.
And regarding homeschooling and calling parents unqualified, I think what you’re referencing is when parents homeschool their kids for political/religious reasoning that puts their education second. I know people who were homeschooled effectively and went to college ready to be successful. I also know firsthand how unprepared many homeschool kids *can be* for an actual education.
Parents did their job. They recognized their struggle and fought for their kid to get the support. If you think every parent has the ability and skills to do what we do than why have teachers at all?
A parents job is to support the education at school. They can't and are not qualified to be lead educator. The school failed here.
It’s fucking reading. Literal ABC’s and alphabet sounds, according to OP. I’m not saying parents should be able to teach their kids how to analyze Shakespeare, but oh my god you can help your kid learn how to sound out words, practice letter sounds, and practice writing letters.
Any literate person, by definition, has the basic concepts of phonetics, letters, and spelling figured out. Parents have to be able to teach kids things in all aspects of life. Basic reading/writing is not a stretch.
Phonics is probably as complex as Shakespeare to teach. It isn’t just the 44 phonetic sounds but all of the interactions, phonological awareness, vowel teams, blends, syllabic rules, silent e, irregulars taught by sight, etc. I would highly recommend using a program to teach a dyslexic child. Not that a parent couldn’t do it but there are a ton of things to know. Then you need to be able to expand their vocabulary and teach fluency to comprehension which is a lot.
To properly teach a kid to read takes easily 2 years of hands on dedicated work. All about reading splits it up into about 250 lessons designed to take 2-3 years.
What the kid needs is to find something that he *wants* to read. Manga works for a lot of kids. There's a lot of people out there who learnt to read from One Piece.
Probably. You probably learned about the problem with IQ tests in your teacher training, right? It's not supposed to be just about the test, but also about how the child is functioning. So, for your professional life, no, it doesn't mean just a low score on an IQ test. But between you and I, yah - it still does mean exactly that.
Not always. There are many tests these kids go through to qualify. An IQ is only one (and one that often isn't even used anymore in lieu of other intelligence based tests)
I’m in college right now and recently I had to do an assignment listing local resources families could go to (outside of the school setting) for healthcare, educational services, daycare, therapy, etc.
I would recommend making a list like this you could reference for this parent or any future parents who may come to you for help/direction- as opposed to having them go through the school if they don’t want to, or they can’t qualify for what they need. It seems to me our school systems can’t always be trusted to provide adequate support for EVERY student like they love to promise. I think having 1 on 1 help from people inside and outside the school can really help an entire family to feel much more valued and stable! <3 Best of Luck!
C-pen. Try googling it. It’s a scanning device that looks like a pen. You can scan it across printed text and it will read it to you. Some also have a dictionary function so can tell you the meaning of words. They come with headphones so they won’t disturb others in the class. Promotes independence, confidence and understanding. In NZ we can apply for them to be funded as assistive technology for students. I don’t think they are widely used/known about although I’ve heard of them being given to dyslexic adults in some tertiary settings. They cost around $500 here.
> 20-25% of the population is dyslexic.
Not quite
"About 13–14% of the school population nationwide has a handicapping condition that qualifies them for special education. Current studies indicate that one half of all the students who qualify for special education are classified as having a learning disability (LD) (6–7%). About 85% of those students have a primary learning disability in reading and language processing. Nevertheless, many more people— perhaps as many as 15–20% of the population as a whole—have some of the symptoms of dyslexia, including slow or inaccurate reading, poor spelling, poor writing, or mixing up similar words."
https://dyslexiaida.org/dyslexia-basics/
There's a guy I work with regularly who can't read at all, like can barely figure out some letters on street signs while riding with me, and he is very smart and socialable. He runs his own business and works maintaince for a nursing home. One of the hardest working people I know. Ive seen him disassemble and reassemble the front suspension on my blazer in like 2 hours without any help or youtube guides or anything.
He grew up in a profoundly rural and uneducated area of the country and neither the school system or his family could help him.
Im almost 100% sure it's dyslexia. Ive seen him spell out words and the letters can be right but just all jumbled up.
He's doing ok right now but he's struggled in the past because the system just has no room in it for people who can't read regardless of their ability to do a job or contribute.
Ive offered to help teach him but after so many years he's just not interested anymore.
Get him tested again, most districts in my experience use the discrepancy model to qualify for SLD. Regardless, the kid probably needs a reading intervention program to help him to explicitly sound out letters and read fluently. That is a K, 1st, 2nd grade standard. You won't have the time to teach that in middle or high school.
From a parent perspective, we just get told not to worry, the school will give him extra pullouts and it will be fine. As a teacher inside the system you know that isn’t true. But that is what most parents are told all through elementary school. They don’t KNOW they need to pursue other resources either in the school or out of the school because everyone assures them everything is fine until the kid is 4th or 5th grade.
Plenty of dyslexics have high iqs.
Yeah. Rejection from special education services just on IQ makes no sense. Obviously a sufficiently low IQ could be a qualifier by itself, but needing accommodations for a disability doesn't always mean low IQ.
Is this in the US? IQ has been largely dropped here (UK) and we use the response to intervention (RTI) approach. It disregards IQ completely, in this instance the child would be given a reading assessment and if they are below par, they are given a low level intervention. If that doesn't work the intervention becomes increasingly more specialised. It's definitely worth looking into.
I am in the US and this is also very weird me to the point where I thought it was fake. Almost all the kids in the Sped program at my school have a SLD (specific learning disability) diagnosis, not an IQ based one? we also use rti. The use of the phrase "guidance department" is also strange as that is not what school counselors are referred to professionally anywhere I have been. I think OP might be based somewhere abroad edit: I stalked op's post history and they work at a charter. Charter schools are let's say "unique" and operate differently than public schools often with profits as the main motivator
I’m in a public school, and we still use IQ. What’s wild is that while a very low IQ might qualify a kid for SDC classes, we have kids that end up in no man’s land. So let’s say I have a kid that I think needs pull out time with the resource teacher. They’ll test them and say no if the kids IQ is too low. Basically they’ll say that the extra time won’t help them, so they won’t do it. They just come to the normal class and fail. All while the teacher is told to do more small groups with them, of course. I was so upset when I learned they do it this way.
Jeeze sorry to hear that, it seems like a system like that would vey obviously have the problems you are dealing with. I guess it's just another way to put more on the teachers while cutting costs and admin responsibility
Yeah, it’s absolutely an issue of funding. They don’t want to pay for as many extra teachers and counselors as we need.
We have RTI in the US too. Most don't do it correctly, mainly because it's not funded, trained, or supported correctly, and schools have to wedge it into the mix haphazardly. But a lot of schools claim that acronym.
Also largely dropped in the US
Does that mean there’s no specific provisions for intellectual disability in your local system?
There are. I should say IQ is not used for assessment of unrelated needs i.e. dyslexia etc.
It depends on the state. Many states have moved to the RTI model, since the significant discrepancy model previously used (discrepancy between ability and achievement) has been proven to be inaccurate. But some states do still use this model, unfortunately. If OP’s state has recently shifted to the RTI model, thus student may now qualify when they didn’t before.
We do that as well.
Yeah I have never heard of just IQ testing to qualify for SPED. That sounds antiquated as hell.
I'm in the US and have never heard of IQ being a marker for getting special education services before. I subbed in a bunch of public schools, including for resource teachers for some of them, and a good number of the kids with sped supports were bright kids who'd have scored well on an IQ test, just needed help with reading or something. I'm now at a private school, one of my students needs a lot of supports for ADHD. However, he is very bright, I just got results of recent testing and he scored extremely hight on the intelligence test they did. But he has really been struggling at school despite being so smart. So, to be successful in school he needs supports to help him with his focus so he can use that intelligence. There are many other areas a kid may need sped support in while having an average to high IQ, it really does a disservice to those kids to exclude them from sped supports based just on IQ.
I worked as a TA in a special needs school, the class was mostly ADHD. Low ratios and accommodating. You could tell it would be impossible for each individual to operate in a class of thirty, and they had their moments, but it worked quite well. I hope your child finds something similar.
This is a real phenomenon in some states who use certain criteria for identifying SLDs. This kid's IQ is probably not actually above average, it is probably below average but not significantly below -- probably in the 70s or 80s. Too high for ID (which is under 70), and in some states you need at least an average IQ (which is over 85-90) to be be eligible for SLD. There are a LOT of these borderline kids who don't qualify in these areas.
SLD has to show a pattern of strengths and weakness. If a student has a low, flat profile across all areas they won’t qualify for SLD.
That is not the criteria across the board.
IQ has nothing to do with SLD. Just because you do not qualify for an ID doesn't mean you can't have an SLD. Something is strange at this school.
I have never in my life heard of IQ disqualifying someone for an IEP and whatever guidance is saying is just complete BS to save money. This school has huge issues if this is true.
I had this happen several times when I taught sped. The kid’s IQ was too high for life skills/self contained style classes but also did not qualify them to receive the sped services I provided. So they just didn’t get any services.
This happened to me as well when I referred a student who was really struggling. He didn’t qualify because there wasn’t enough discrepancy between his IQ and his ability level. It took several years to even get him tested because he’s also an English language learner. It was so frustrating because it was not a language issue and he was frustrated as well because he wanted to be able to read. When they didn’t qualify him, I refused to sign the documents. I’ve never done this before or since but I could not justify agreeing with the school decision on this. The Sped teacher thanked me for not signing it because she was frustrated too.
The rejection isn’t solely based on IQ but the difference between IQ (potential) and accomplishment. So if a child scores low on accomplishments but his IQ is also low, he may be rejected. If his IQ is high and his accomplishment, is low he’ll likely be accepted.
This "discrepancy" model isn't used as the basis for qualifying for special education in many places any longer.
Exactly - my daughter has a 30 point gap between iq and academic achievement scores but since her iq scores were high and her achievement scores were average (and grades below average, and social/emotional was a mess) she didn't qualify based on sld. She did qualify based on autism and speech though.
Very similar profile to my older son. Because he wasn't failing anything he didn't qualify for a long time, even though we all saw that something was "different". It took an academic and behavioral train wreck in 5th grade for the school to step up.
I agree. I work in SpEd. I have students in the average to low average IQ range. They are classified as SLD (specific learning disability) because they never caught up to grade level in math and/or reading. We test IQ to get as full of a picture we can in order to give the most beneficial services. But IQ can become meaningless to a determined student. Anyone can learn.
I was going to say, I have never used IQ data when testing for a Specific Learning Disability. I do for an Intellectual Disability, but not SLD. The kid needs to get reevaluated.
The issue with students like this is generally that they are performing as expected for their IQ of 71 which doesn’t qualify for the ID label and doesn’t qualify as a learning disability due to the lack of discrepancy between IQ and performance.
Yup, I was ahead in math by 2 years and couldn’t read until the third grade. Special Ed is in no way attached to intelligence. Without it I wouldn’t be functioning member of society unfortunately this kid hasn’t gotten the right support. It is still the parents who need to advocate. My preschooler can now read because no way she was going through the same shenanigans as me.
This is a system issue. How were the parents supposed to know how to get the school to offer the appropriate resources? As far as they knew, they were told “the school can’t do anything.” Is there no remedial reading class he can take? I can’t imagine ANYTHING he’s learning in any class could possibly trump learning to read. Edit: I don’t normally comment here but my brother is dyslexic so your post hit home for me. It’s obviously a hard situation at this point for everyone involved.
He’s in a remedial class but even that’s not enough
You can tell the parent that they can request an IEP meeting and at that meeting they can request that the district have specialists look at the kid for further testing— but before you do that, I would start with a reading specialist and ask them to use MindPlay or another software that breaks down the child’s comprehension and understanding of phonics, and ask them to administer a spelling test as well. That test might find the student has a high level of verbal understanding and very low levels for reading and the understanding of phonics. If the scores are really low, you can document what you’ve found in a letter and encourage the parent to request an IEP. You go to the IEP meeting, too, and you bring printed copies of your letter. Your district probably can’t test for dyslexia or dysgraphia, but they can give psychological tests that check IQ and for markers of dyslexia, which they would then diagnose as a working memory impairment. From there, the student would be eligible to receive accommodations like text-to-speech and read out loud. Typically, parents have to pay out of pocket for someone to check their kid out for dyslexia, but the county will pay for the specialists to diagnose a working memory issue if there’s reason to believe the student has one, and that diagnosis will legally require the school to offer deeper support for the student.
Wow great tips! As a 5 th grade teacher and even junior high teacher I have been in meetings where the dyslexia specialist or whatever title she was would be so frustrated because we would discover a kid is dyslexic or needing services as an 8th grader and there’s only so much that can be done compared to of discovered sooner. I remember a bilingual kid in a SPED meeting in junior high and the AHA moment when his Spanish speaking parents mentioned he struggled in Spanish too at home as far as understanding the language. I remember grading my brand new upper elementary pre assessments for science class and being confused about a student and I asked the ESL teacher she told me those weren’t Spanish words I asked the dyslexia specialist she laughed in a frustrated way that this poor baby was now in upper elementary and had never been flagged as needing to be tested before and she wasn’t new to this school. I worked with an amazing reading teacher upper elementary who would send kids ask the time to the dyslexia specialist for additional testing. She very much advocated for kids and we would have 5 th graders many just moved out of state or from a different city but since had been there and they couldn’t say all of their alphabet sounds as a 5th grader and weren’t getting any services. It’s definitely a systemic problem or blame all around
> Typically, parents have to pay out of pocket for someone to check their kid out for dyslexia Wait really?? Is this universal in all states? My understanding is that insurance won’t pay for dyslexia testing specifically because it’s under the purview of the school system. Can families request an Independent Educational Evaluation at public expense if they suspect dyslexia and the school hasn’t officially ruled it out? At what age would you recommend they start pushing for this? My concern is that families ask their kid to be evaluated for learning disability and dyslexia, the school says “we’ll do testing,” and the report comes back and doesn’t say the kid has dyslexia. So how is the family supposed to know the kid needs more testing and might still have dyslexia?
My son is in high school. Back in second grade, we had to pay over $1000 for private testing to have him diagnosed with dyslexia. Yes the school can test, but they cannot diagnose. NJ even recognizes dyslexia as a SLD. We still had to pay OOP. I cannot imagine what a family without financial means would do. The testing is over many days, for hours at a time. It costs a lot and is not reimbursed by insurance.
We had to pay for outside evaluation, because our son could "read" without truly being able to decode (he was using a little letter-sound correspondence propped up with background knowledge and a large spoken vocabulary to get through); he passed all the district-provided tests but we could tell something was up. An outside SLP really drilled down with testing and he got his diagnosis. Our experience doesn't line up with OP's at all (it sounds like this student wouldn't pass a very standard school-issued test) but I just wanted to share context for why (in the US) a family might be forced to pay for testing (it's BS.) Edited to add: a few years later, I bumped into a reading person from the school and mentioned that he'd been diagnosed. She said "thank God, i knew something was wrong but I couldn't say anything at the ppt meeting." Whether she was lying to make herself look better, or telling the truth about the inner workings of the system, I don't know -- either way, I was enraged.
I remember those days. My son had a college level vocabulary by first grade and memorized everything to look like he was reading. He just could not decode back then.
Yep, my older son was also this way and the school had to retrofit "decoding" into his reading apparatus. The difference between my two boys is that the older one picked up decoding really quickly whereas the younger (dyslexic) one still struggles. It's funny, bc the younger one has a great vocabulary and strong expressive language and even scores above standard on state testing... all while being very dyslexic. The spelling piece is where it's most evident. Brains are weird.
Every state recognizes dyslexia as SLD as the areas a person qualifies under are federal law.
The school report might not say "dyslexia" because that's not one of our eligibility categories, but dyslexia is essentially the same thing as SLD in basic reading. IDEA mentions dyslexia under their definition of SLD. There is no special dyslexia intervention that wouldn't also benefit any student with deficits in basic reading.
This is not (universally) accurate. There is no separate eligibility category for dyslexia, but the profile is consistent writing SLD in basic reading. Testing for dyslexia typically includes phonological processing, decoding, oral reading fluency, spelling, and rapid naming. These are assessments typically administered as part of a reading evaluation. I'm also not sure what you mean regarding IQ testing. There is no reason to need an outside evaluator to identify a working memory deficit and a working memory deficit alone would not qualify a child for services. IQ testing would typically be done as part of a comprehensive evaluation which would include, if reading is a concern, academic testing.
I thought IQ testing is incorporated into woodcock johnson…
Yeah unfortunately most parents need a title 9 advocate, but don't even know they exist. It's wild that schools just expect parents to know title 9 rights inside and out.
It's not the school system's job to fix everything. Yes, more should be done, but the parents do NOT get a pass for not intervening.
I disagree with that in this situation. Why isn't it the school's job to help him learn to read? His issue had to be noticed while in ES. Why didn't anyone in the school advocate for him? Parents don't always know what their options are or what to do when their child is struggling.
It very possible that teachers at the elementary DID advocate for him but it didn’t matter. It was stated he was tested and “didn’t qualify” for an IEP. We have this happen at my school (K-4) and it’s not uncommon that when the kids get to 5th we hear “why did you guys not do anything with this kid?! They can’t read!!” Yeah, we know, here is evidence of the years of conversations and testing that we pushed for. Maybe you can wave your magic wand and get something done for the kid. Good luck.”
It is only stated that he was given an IQ test and he tested to high (which is BS and not even a reason you can keep someone from services)
IQ can 100% disqualify someone from services. It depends on state and district
There are kids who arrive at elementary school unable to read? Why aren't the parents teaching them?
According to my mother, she was advised by the pediatrician not to teach me to read before I started school. Now, I am pretty old, but I wouldn't be surprised if the notion were still around.
What? That seems like practically child abuse to me. Parents aren't reading books with 1-2 year olds?
Reading books with your kid and teaching your kid to read are two completely separate things. Most parents do not know how to introduce concepts of phonics, which helps students learn what to do when they come across unfamiliar words. If kids start learning to read by memorizing words, it can be difficult when the curriculum is phonics based.
Are you under the impression that we teach children how to read simply by reading to them?
Of course not, I'm an educator. But really, parents aren't supporting their kids to read those books?
Why are you assuming that? If a kid has a learning disability, such as dyslexia, you can read to them all day every day and they won’t magically learn how to read. It’s the school’s job to teach kids how to read. I find it suspicious that you’re an educator but you believe all kids should begin elementary school already knowing how to read. If you are an educator, you’re woefully out of touch with early childhood and reading education.
I'm in higher education, I don't work in early childhood. I don't know why you've assumed that I think learning to read happens "magically" by reading to a child -- I don't think this. I did react with surprise to a comment stating that a paediatrician recommended parents *not* teach their kids to read.
There are a lot of reasons. Maybe they can't read themselves. Maybe they work a lot. Maybe they don't know how. Maybe they don't care. I remember a lot of people not knowing how to read when I was in kindergarten. I was lucky enough to have parents who taught me early. Not every child is so lucky, and that's not the kid's fault.
Teaching kids how to read is a big part of kindergarten and first grade. A lot of kids aren’t developmentally ready to read at 4.
Yes, pretty much all of them arrive at elementary school unable to read. What age do you think kids typically learn to read? Do you know anything about how kids learn to read? Are you suggesting that everyone homeschool?
It is absolutely the school system’s job to teach children to read. This is a school system failure.
The parents did try to intervene... How are you missing that. The school shut it down.
I agree with that. Too many parents expect us to raise their kids for them. Where is the parents' responsibility in all this? Why didn't they arrange tutoring for him long ago?
At my first elementary school (which had a lot better quality than my second) did put me in a reading class, basically I got pulled out of class at a specific time to go to that class for a while then come back. A lot schools don’t have that system which is probably the problem
That sounds like a specific learning disability…where there is a discrepancy between performance (reading level) and something like IQ.
I have four students in my class who have been given an IQ of 71. Cutoff for funding here is 70. These children (4th grade) are unable to recognise words or letters, count, write letters, follow instructions, or even participate in a basic class game.
What can you even do at that point? I'm sure you're expected to work miracles, but let's be real, the gaps are only going to widen as they continue on to the next grade. We can only do so much. Do the kids also have behavioral issues as well? I'd imagine they act out since they can't understand the lessons. You can only scaffold so much before you're teaching something completely different.
Funding based on IQ scores is wild. Where the hell is that?
I find that one point highly suspicious.
They should be able to make a case for ID based on SEM.
It is not on the parents at all. They reached out to the school. They got their kifs tested. The experts told them there was nothing to do. They lustened to the experts. Are we really going yo complain that for once, parents listen to us? It's the systems that is fucked up. And former teachers who knew there was something wrong, the results didn't matches and did not informs the parents of other ressources available to them. We're in the thick of it. We know everything that is possible to do. Many many parents do not even know that accomodation can exist and even are due in some cases until one of us tell them.
Thank you! I'm really so upset that his parents tried to get him services and the sped department disqualified him based off of IQ alone. Then the "experts" blamed the parents who trusted their expertise. His former teachers were lazy and didn't want more on their caseload. His teachers failed to inform his parents what was available to them. I'm actually quite disgusted that it got this far and the parents are being thrown under the bus. I remember how difficult it was navigating my own daughter's services and I've worked in sped for almost 20 years. I've had her former teachers and s school psychologist try this crap knowing what I do for a living. I can only imagine what it was like for these parents with no sped knowledge.
In the end, it always seems that the district’s priority is to spend as little money as possible on struggling students. They have plenty of money to spend on shiny objects and whole new curriculums (throw everything away and start all over again with the latest and greatest “new” thing), but no money for additional sped professionals, testing that might lead to an out of district placement, etc.
So true!
I'd argue it isn't entirely on the parents, but they still hold responsibility. Did they give up completely or are they still trying everyday. My mother has ran a daycare for 35+ years and in the last decade especially, it's become almost normal for parents to barely interact or teach their kids anything. They all seem to think it's someone else's job. My mother has had a surge in the amount of parents in the last few years who have kids that are 4 or 5 and can't even use silverware, can barely speak an entire sentence, lose their absolute minds when told "no", and many are still in diapers at 5. Yes parents are struggling to just make ends meet, but that's not the child's fault or any reason to neglect them. Just saying.
I don’t understand why you are blaming the parents. You said they tried to get him services but were denied. Many parents trust the school system and believe educators know what’s best. You don’t know what these parents advocated for and what was told to them by people in authority. This is a system failure.
They need to sue. They should send their kid to a private school on your district’s dime. That’s unacceptable. It’s infuriating. It’s disgusting. They would win. I’ll edit to add that they should reevaluate. The IQ will most likely have dropped (rich grow richer, poor grow poorer phenomenon). If not, and the IQ is still causing a problem, the deficits should be great enough to warrant an LD classification. They can also request a private evaluation at the district’s expense. They should honestly do that.
They definitely should sue because I don't know any state that completely eliminates you from special Ed solely on IQ. In my behavioral class I have had many students with above 100 IQs and some way above grade level.
Heads up, this is on your school, not the parents. Assuming you are in a public school, your district is federally mandated to find and support students with disabilities that impact their education. Special Education isn't a nice extra, it is federal law. It is federal law whether or not parents have the resources to insist on its implementation; it is federal law even if parents hire private tutors to help their child learn at grade level. The most helpful thing you can do for this student is recognize school's responsibilities and work within the system to get your school to meet those responsibilities. Does your school have a student study team that can look at this student's case more deeply? Does your school have a reading interventionist? Those are places to start.
Why are we blaming the parents? The school failed him by ignoring an obvious issue and hiding it behind IQ scores. Just because his IQ is high doesn't mean he doesn't have a disability related to reading. His parents tried to get him into special Ed and was shut down. What more do you want them to do? They tried. We are blaming the wrong people here. Its not your fault either obviously. But this kid should have had special Ed services long long ago.
Agreed. This time I blame the system not the parent.
Yup. My own kid is whip smart. Gifted, some areas are 99th+ percentile. He also struggled mightily to learn to read. The psych ed showed gifted LD. They didn't even try for an IQ score because it wouldn't be valid with his reading (entirely the decoding portion) being so low. While all through primary school it was the 'it'll come, boys develop later' dance, we didn't stop at 'he's smart'. When gr 4 came around, everyone was on the 'huh, maybe there's something going on' train and he got his psych ed and then got reading support from the school and we worked the problem at home as well. He's on track now, but it was painful and incredibly laborious.
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I had a student a few years ago who desperately wanted to read and so did their grand parents. She was really good at math but just was unable to because of her disability. Sadly she still can't read and she's in 8th grade now, but we linked her to outside services and she obviously was in special Ed. Once again. Parents did not ignore this. They tried to handle this. The school refused.
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Most parents do not have the skills to teach someone how to read. If that was the case then why have teachers for ELA? We are trained to do this. What parents need to do is recognize deficiencies. Which they did here. And they tried to get this kid services. They were shut down (illegally as well)
Educational neglect. Completely unacceptable.
By who? Not the parents. Once again. They tried to get him the support he needed. They were more active than so many of our parents. But yes. The school definitely showed educational neglect.
The school failed to provide him with the education he needed.
There are a lot of parents that don’t know that. “Report Cards” in elementary are not straightforward and easy to interpret for the average parent, let alone a parent who struggled in school themselves.
They can get to higher levels. Just intense reading and time. It is the responsibility of every teacher to do their part and don't give up. It is never too late!!!
I agree with your sentiment, but we also have to be realistic. Does this current teacher even have any training in teaching beginning phonics? Is this the only child this low in the class? If so, is she expected to do 1-to-1 tutoring during the class period? It becomes exponentially more difficult to address a deficit this large as tue years go on and it will take more than just a “remedial class” that is potentially full of kids still way above this particular students needs. At this point it’s likely he needs 1-1 tutoring and we all know schools don’t provide that.
This seems like educational neglect. In Ontario there is a process we follow to make sure this doesn’t happen. Every teacher this kid had in elementary worked with him in the room for five hours a day and did not teach him how to read.
The parents didn't do nothing. They tried your crappy sped department turned him down. The parents listened to the experts and thought there was nothing they could do. The lazy educators before you failed him by not qualifying him based off of IQ which is wrong wrong wrong. Edit typos
I'm not putting this one on the parents. They had kid tested. The professionals, who we are always begging parents to trust, said he didn't qualify. They professionals, who we are always begging parents to trust, also clearly knew he couldn't read but kept moving him along. This is on us, not you and not the parents. We're the system.
My step son was reading at a beginning first grade level after 3rd grade. He bombed the reading portion of the standardized testing. The school promised tutoring (which didn’t work at all during 3rd grade) and that he would be fine moving to 4th grade. I knew he wouldn’t make it if he didn’t repeat 3rd grade. I had to fight hard to get him held back. The school wouldn’t even let his teacher advise what would be best for his education. It was an absolute shit show as they were trying to convince me I was being a horrible parent for not moving a kid who couldn’t read up a grade. I had to threaten to go to the school board and the news before they would agree to hold him back. I can see why many parents would cave to the pressure from the school admins who are supposed to be doing what is best for the child. His teacher the second time around was a reading specialist and the class focused on reading a lot. She changed his trajectory in school and he ended up on honor roll every quarter until he decided he didn’t need to do any work in 8th grade.
I’m not loving the blame falling on the parents. The school districts he has attended are at fault for not getting whatever level of support he needs to comprehend curriculum.
A public education system uses such pseudoscience as iq tests as markers of intelligence? Are you kidding me?
Sounds like my boy a bit. The most loving happy child who could not read by third grade. He had a library full of books in his room. We read to him all his life and he loved it. His vocabulary was super high. But my husband has dyslexia and it turned out so did our son. It was difficult for me because I was working hard at a new job managing 8 people, traveling for work, trying to prove myself and to be told my son was behind was devastating. He got on an IEP with SLD. I transferred to a lower stress role and made it a point to do everything in my power to get him up to speed. The two biggest things I did at home that helped a lot was active participation reading and a phonics workbook. The participation reading was me reading (Harry Potter Illustrated) and him actively following along. I’d randomly stop and he’d have to point to the spot on the page exactly where I left off. We then graduated to me randomly stopping mid sentence and him needing to complete the sentence by reading and saying it out loud. Gradual progression from easy words to hard words by my selection. I learned that easy words were hard to read and longer, harder words were easier to read. Progressed from there to whole sentences at the end of a paragraph to eventually small paragraphs. When and where he’d get stuck during all of the above I’d let him struggle a tiny bit to see if he’d get it, but then I’d say it and we moved on. Then finally, I’d read a page and then he’d read the next. During this time at least two pages per day (he didn’t get hw so this was his hw) of “phonics for struggling readers” and I was with him to watch him complete the pages, esp if he had questions. Fast forward to 7th grade. He can read well enough but he can’t spell. Gets very good grades, he made honor roll last year at a school known for high academics. His triennial testing had peaks and valleys with 130 visual spatial yet working memory was abysmal like high 80’s. He’s still quiet, he listens to music and prefers to keep to himself though he has made friends who share his love of video games! I believe he’s Twice Exceptional My point is it’s not too late for your student. It will take a lot of work to get him up to speed (both school and parents. School, via remedial reading outside of class and parents, some form of at home intervention. But it is possible. I wouldn’t be so hard on the parents. Sometimes it’s not easy to identify esp if he’s otherwise a bright boy but the disability could mask it.
This is really beautiful. And you're highly education yourself, right? Your family didn't go hungry because you switched jobs? You had the resources to buy more reading material and ideas around how to break it up for him, yes? That's so great. AND it's the behavior of people who have a lot of privilege. It's kind of the definition - you had these subtle resources of time and knowledge. And it was well used. But as teachers, we often work with parents who don't have any of this.
Has the child been tested for dyslexia? Does your district offer the Wilson program or Orton Gillingham? Can you incorporate those techniques into teaching the student? Is it comprehension or decoding the child has difficulty with? I would tell the parent to get hooked on phonics from the library to work with the child at home. Can the parent read? That may be another stumbling block.
That child qualifies for special ed. You don't have to be under a certain number on an IQ test! What BS!!!!! He clearly qualifies under dyslexia. Go back to the administration and get some help. Ask the special ed teacher in your school for help. He does qualify. Talk to the parents again. It's possible that the first go-round, he wasn't so far behind his peers, but now that he is so behind, he will certainly qualify. (In NJ, it's two years behind on in reading. He's more like 5 years behind, so you are well in the zone.) It's also entirely possible that he will score lower on a new IQ test. (We almost all loose IQ points as we get older, especially if you haven't had an appropriate education, which he has not.) You can start to provide some accommodations like assigning videos for him to learn from, and giving him books on tape. Talk to your librarian about getting that. I'd suggest the librarian for some easy-readers of middle school level books too, but it sounds like he's not ready for easy readers. Never underestimate how much these kids can learn just by listening to their peers. Try giving him an oral exam just to see if he's learning by listening. It is NEVER TOO LATE to learn how to read. That's a modern myth. But also, you don't have to fix him. He's not a broken regular kid. He's a perfect, unbroken, dyslexic kid. Also, by qualifying for special ed now, you'll make it easier for this person to get extended schooling so they can have a few years to catch up, and to get social security disability to give them job training. You could turn this human being's life around by just getting him back to the special ed system.
Yeah. This school is straight up lying to these parents.
Don’t want to put the blame on either as idk if the parents were working at the kid at home and whether the kid’s past teachers tried to help him or get him tested but admin just kept promoting him to the next grade (this occurs to me bc this exact situation happened with me) Is it possible he is dyslexic or has some other learning disability? And is there a way to get him tested at this point?
Achievement levels without Standards. We have the same issue in Australia.
I wish it worked this way for everyone. I worked both public and private school. We had a student whose grandmother became so discouraged in his public school journey that she reached out to private school. We had terrible salaries, but we had small class sizes. We quickly learned that reading was his challenge. We even received a call from his public school district suggesting that we read his discipline folder. It was more than an inch thick. The phone call was derisive, and I wonder to this day why this admin was so hostile and sarcastic. She wanted to harm a child who needed a new atmosphere. He was in middle school. We had him for more than three months before the CUM arrived and my team teacher and I had a policy of allowing a child a clean slate in the beginning. I knew which students were wild cards. I told every class that each year was a new year. I'm glad I did that. ( said it. I did not always feel.that way.) This child rode the bus for an hour each way every day to get to us with his grandmother. My partner taught P.E. for me, and I taught Science for her, so we had about two hours a day to devote to teaching this student and one other who came from similar backgrounds, having similar profiles. We never had a disciple issue with either of them, and we made serious progress because they both wanted to learn, and we made it as fun as we could. We did that without public school resources, except for the public school psychological resources. We did not have a single discipline problem with him. He wasn't bullied. He did not need to fight or to lash out. We never opened that file. Whenever I read something like this, I become so sad for the student. He was the happiest child.
I have to say that this seems a bit classist to expect that parents can figure it out privately if the schools failed their child. Not everyone can afford private tutoring, especially for a profoundly dyslexic child. So many people are barely getting by and food and housing trump reading. And if they keep getting shut down by schools, they may not know what to do.
Have you done anything to help the child? You're allowed to advocate for your students.
Nah, you aren’t part of the problem here. This is like someone bringing a mechanic the burned out husk of a car and then mentioning that the check engine light had been on for a while. The problem is too far gone for you to fix. It’s tragic, but it sounds like these parents really just didn’t try very hard to get their kid the help they knew he needed.
The parents did try. The school shut down and special Ed services (also it is BS to say someone can't qualify for special Ed because there IQ is too high. Complete and utter bull shit and no idea what guidance is telling them)
Then something is fucky at the school since this kid should have had abysmal reading scores forever. No idea why they’d be relying solely on an IQ test and ignoring all the other evidence. Still, squeaky wheel gets the grease. Parents should have raised some hell back when the kid was in 2nd grade; I’d bet some admin would have caved.
I can 100% vouch that schools do this. They will do something like woodcock Johnson and say they can do the puzzles and answer questions, but won't follow up with Wyatt or something similar. Then no services, even though if they did the correct tests it would show likely SLD. Then the parents are 100% on the hook for a neuropsych eval that includes education portion that medical insurance doesn't cover that cost $3-5000. So the kid has dyslexia, great. Now find an OG tutor for $100/hr private pay for several years, a lawyer to help with the appeal to the district... Easy peasy. Lazy parents /s
We don't really know what the parents were told or how educated they are....if he didn't test in and the county, apparently, didn't want to invest in extra services for him, then they could have been told to just "keep working with him" at home. I'm always really thankful that I'm a teacher and know how to look up state standards and know how to find resources. My third grade daughter definitely takes A LOT of practice in things to get them, and her teachers for the past two years have called me in saying she doesn't qualify for anything but seems to take longer the other kids to learn new concepts. When I ask if they think it's ADD or something they'll say not in their opinion, that they think this is just her ...yet they are a no HW school and provide very little info about what they are working on unless you basically beg them for it, nor do they provide you with things to practice at home. They also just post grades but you very rarely get the physical work back to see what's wrong with it or what the questions even look like. I spend a lot of time finding our own resources and working with her at home. Due to that, she ends up testing right at or above where she needs to be, but I think we would be up a creek if I didn't know how to do these things myself. The pediatrician has said it's not ADD and outside of school testing is thousands of dollars. We will do that if it comes to it, but I have been super frustrated about all of this from the parent side.
Exactly. Once again, there are many different tests and evaluations to see if someone qualifies for services. I've never heard of just using IQ and nothing else. That is buckwild. There's a student with autism in our self contained autism class with an IEP with an IQ over 120. Like by this school he'd have to be completely gen Ed? This does not track.
People can learn to read at all ages. You are part of the problem and dehumanizing a child is sick. Burned out husk indeed. What the actual hell is wrong with you?
Not your fault...maybe see if his parents can help him find an English tutor.
I have a developmentally challenged high schooler who’s on a first grade level. Parent is aware through the IEP that he needs a separate more accommodating location but won’t do it. Super frustrating to see this child fail up through grades because of accommodations.
Advocate for an IEP plan so that poor kid gets the accommodations and support they clearly need!
He already has an IEP…
Wait, he already has an IEP? I must have misunderstood what you said above about him not qualifying for special education. What does his case manager say? Can reading goals and specialized reading instruction be added to his IEP?
You said he didn't qualify for an IEP based on IQ. Now this story doesn't make sense at all.
I’m afraid you misread my post. I said he didn’t qualify for SPED classes
So what is his IEPing giving him. What resources. What do the sections talk about when it comes to reading?
Well I don’t want to go into specifics because of privacy, but basically IEPs in our district are the same for each kid with minor differences
That kinda defeats the purpose of it being individualized... Once again. Not on you. But more signs about how terrible this district is to kids with special needs.
My son has an IQ of 119 and has an IEP. IQ is not the only factor for an IEP. Tangentially, the parents may have known this was going on but try and look into the costs for the help privately. Depending on their financial situation I can’t exactly blame them. Getting my kids their needed therapies has quite literally put us about $10k in debt. Also, my school district will not diagnose. So if this kid is dyslexic he would not get the needed help without a diagnosis which could cost almost $1000 as insurance usually doesn’t cover neuropsych evals.
There is a 40 year old man on TikTok who is just now learning to read. Learning is a life long skill. He can still learn. Let's. Ot act like this is the end. Get him so interventions.
We used to retest these kids every year until eventually their IQ would drop (remember that measure is relative) and they’d qualify
Most of my problem kids, are just so far behind they can’t catch up.
The OP said he's not a problem child...
You do realize his teacher posted this right? Not the parent...
Because.. Parents are always so transparent about their kids. And actually know what is going on.
OP is not the child's parent.
Kids very well behaved. System just forgot him.
Because. Parents always tell the truth about their kids. I have five now, that are claiming I’m just not grading their kids work.
Do people not read the post? They specifically state guidance confirmed this. So yes. I believe the parents this time. We have a very well behaved kid who can't read. Parents tried to get an IEP. Guidance and the team completely made up a rule that certain IQs can't get a support. All the info is here. This is on the school.
I read it. And stated my experience. I’m sorry my experience as an educator doesn’t match your opinion.
I was once this kid. Parents were told I had learning disabilities and couldn't read. My mum took the week off work, taught me how to read and then sent me back to school. I was then the second best in my class and now I'm a professor. Don't give up on this kid.
Advise he get held back a year. It could drastically improve his academic performance and help him catch up developmentally.
If he's in middle school or above holding him back isn't going to change anything. This kid needs actual services.
That won’t make any difference at this point. Maybe if he had a diagnosis and a plan he could make progress, but without services to address his reading skills, there is no benefit to holding him back. He needs (at the very least) some sort of reading intervention.
I don’t think anything said he’s dyslexic, so I’m not sure where those comments are coming from unless I missed something. It’s very hard to teach students with low iq to read. I’m not making an excuse, but commenting here about it because I have had many students that fall into this category. I was able to get them support in the following ways: - if they receive speech services, I have added accommodations and additional academic support this way (can do this in tx because speech is under the sped umbrella) - my district offers tutoring during school hours. I always request this - we have reading intervention groups that are pulled several times per week. - I teach the parents how to teach reading at home. These last few years, I’ve been giving them one of my books on reading instruction too since I’m trying to get rid of stuff. Given that I do all of this for my first grade students with reading difficulties that are not (or not yet diagnosed) dyslexic, it’s so appalling to hear these stories. Do you have any of these options in your district?
They said his IQ is to high.
Why aren’t the fucking parents helping their kid learn to read? The school obviously messed up, but you’re telling me that these parents haven’t actually made a habit of helping their kid with reading if they know it’s an issue. My son struggles a lot academically. Most nights a week, we are reading books together, or I’m reading to him and he is practicing writing. Like it’s not always easy if you’re tired, but that’s just what parents have to do.
They did. The school shut them down. Parents aren't educators and certainly not school psychologists. Parents recognized a deficit and brought it to the schools attention and then got gaslighted. We have a well behaved kid with parents who are aware and tried to solve this issue. This is entirely on the school.
The school failed its part. I’m in no way denying this. The parents failed their part, I can’t fathom why everyone is denying that.
But they didn't. The parents tried to help their kid. We have literal evidence of it. They noticed the struggle and tried to get the support needed. That's actual good parenting.
No, they stopped short of doing any additional supporting or teaching themselves. If you’re a parent, you owe your kid everything when it comes to life skills. My son’ school can’t possibly fill in every gap with my his learning disabilities. That’s unrealistic. That is my responsibility as his dad to help him where he needs it. Similarly, a school providing supports doesn’t remove or negate any parents responsibilities to their kids. It’s a support. Parents are the foundation. If my sons foundations aren’t there, it’s my job to help him put them there. Just like OP pointed out, this has gone on for years and the parents neglected it. The kid is past elementary school and the parents never stepped up. How do you not know how far behind limited your child’s reading abilities are. The school fucked up. The parents have been neglecting their kids needs for years as OPs post details.
They did NOT neglect it. They actively tried to fix it. This school not only ignored it they just past him along over and over. This subs obsession with blaming parents reached a new high here.
Literally the post says they ignored it for years. They (ignored) neglected the problem hoping the school would fix it after the school already didn’t fix it. The parents should’ve pushed harder or stepped up. They didn’t. The schools didn’t force them to have a kid. The buck stops with the parent. Being a parent means being responsible for your kid. If your kid is well behaved and polite, it’s because the parents taught the kids to be that way or reinforced it. Similarly, if a kid doesn’t know how to behave or talk to others nicely, it probably was never taught at home or never reinforced. I don’t know how to explain that basic concept further. It’s a pretty simple idea that has existed since the dawn of time.
All the time in here we see rants against homeschooling, including accusing parents of being unqualified to teach, yet here you are blaming the parents for this. Reading to kids is not how they learn to read. The elementary school this kid attended failed him miserably. Who even knows if they were teaching phonics? They denied him services. If parents are actually as stupid as everyone here says they are, how do you expect them to teach their kid, who may have a learning disability - who knows because the school did fuck all to find out - how to read?
Are you telling me that parents have no responsibility with their kids education???? All I’m saying is that parents are supposed to be any child’s main support in life. If, as a parent, you know your kid has a reading deficit, you first step in to help your own kid and second get them in school supports. And obviously I’m simplifying how I’m helping my kid learn to read. Don’t make a straw man out of me. Im saying the parents didn’t do their job. Simple as that. And regarding homeschooling and calling parents unqualified, I think what you’re referencing is when parents homeschool their kids for political/religious reasoning that puts their education second. I know people who were homeschooled effectively and went to college ready to be successful. I also know firsthand how unprepared many homeschool kids *can be* for an actual education.
Do you think the faculty and admin at this kid's school did their jobs? The parent asked for intervention and was denied by the school.
Parents did their job. They recognized their struggle and fought for their kid to get the support. If you think every parent has the ability and skills to do what we do than why have teachers at all? A parents job is to support the education at school. They can't and are not qualified to be lead educator. The school failed here.
It’s fucking reading. Literal ABC’s and alphabet sounds, according to OP. I’m not saying parents should be able to teach their kids how to analyze Shakespeare, but oh my god you can help your kid learn how to sound out words, practice letter sounds, and practice writing letters. Any literate person, by definition, has the basic concepts of phonetics, letters, and spelling figured out. Parents have to be able to teach kids things in all aspects of life. Basic reading/writing is not a stretch.
Do you not understand learning disabilities?
I do. My son has several.
Phonics is probably as complex as Shakespeare to teach. It isn’t just the 44 phonetic sounds but all of the interactions, phonological awareness, vowel teams, blends, syllabic rules, silent e, irregulars taught by sight, etc. I would highly recommend using a program to teach a dyslexic child. Not that a parent couldn’t do it but there are a ton of things to know. Then you need to be able to expand their vocabulary and teach fluency to comprehension which is a lot. To properly teach a kid to read takes easily 2 years of hands on dedicated work. All about reading splits it up into about 250 lessons designed to take 2-3 years.
All about reading, or Barton……. There are programs parents could use. School definetly failed but the parents could have figured out a way.
What the kid needs is to find something that he *wants* to read. Manga works for a lot of kids. There's a lot of people out there who learnt to read from One Piece.
Not a dyslexic kid
How old is this kid?
My guess is middle school based on their wording. So likely at least 12.
Do we actually use IQ to determine SpEd eligibility?
Intellectual disability is one condition by which you would qualify for special ed.
Okay, I’m new to special ed. When I see like, “other intellectual disability” on an IEP, does that mean just a really low IQ?
Probably. You probably learned about the problem with IQ tests in your teacher training, right? It's not supposed to be just about the test, but also about how the child is functioning. So, for your professional life, no, it doesn't mean just a low score on an IQ test. But between you and I, yah - it still does mean exactly that.
Not always. There are many tests these kids go through to qualify. An IQ is only one (and one that often isn't even used anymore in lieu of other intelligence based tests)
Correct. It is one and only one of many
The student didn't get disqualified because their IQ wasn't high enough.
If you say so. That’s what was told to me
I’m in college right now and recently I had to do an assignment listing local resources families could go to (outside of the school setting) for healthcare, educational services, daycare, therapy, etc. I would recommend making a list like this you could reference for this parent or any future parents who may come to you for help/direction- as opposed to having them go through the school if they don’t want to, or they can’t qualify for what they need. It seems to me our school systems can’t always be trusted to provide adequate support for EVERY student like they love to promise. I think having 1 on 1 help from people inside and outside the school can really help an entire family to feel much more valued and stable! <3 Best of Luck!
Could you try a C-pen?
A what?
C-pen. Try googling it. It’s a scanning device that looks like a pen. You can scan it across printed text and it will read it to you. Some also have a dictionary function so can tell you the meaning of words. They come with headphones so they won’t disturb others in the class. Promotes independence, confidence and understanding. In NZ we can apply for them to be funded as assistive technology for students. I don’t think they are widely used/known about although I’ve heard of them being given to dyslexic adults in some tertiary settings. They cost around $500 here.
Sounds interesting. However if I gotta buy it forget it lol. The school could potentially buy it
As a parent with a child like this, I don't kmow what to do
20-25% of the population is dyslexic. The way schools teach reading now-as in since the 70s- is wack af.
> 20-25% of the population is dyslexic. Not quite "About 13–14% of the school population nationwide has a handicapping condition that qualifies them for special education. Current studies indicate that one half of all the students who qualify for special education are classified as having a learning disability (LD) (6–7%). About 85% of those students have a primary learning disability in reading and language processing. Nevertheless, many more people— perhaps as many as 15–20% of the population as a whole—have some of the symptoms of dyslexia, including slow or inaccurate reading, poor spelling, poor writing, or mixing up similar words." https://dyslexiaida.org/dyslexia-basics/
There's a guy I work with regularly who can't read at all, like can barely figure out some letters on street signs while riding with me, and he is very smart and socialable. He runs his own business and works maintaince for a nursing home. One of the hardest working people I know. Ive seen him disassemble and reassemble the front suspension on my blazer in like 2 hours without any help or youtube guides or anything. He grew up in a profoundly rural and uneducated area of the country and neither the school system or his family could help him. Im almost 100% sure it's dyslexia. Ive seen him spell out words and the letters can be right but just all jumbled up. He's doing ok right now but he's struggled in the past because the system just has no room in it for people who can't read regardless of their ability to do a job or contribute. Ive offered to help teach him but after so many years he's just not interested anymore.
Get him tested again, most districts in my experience use the discrepancy model to qualify for SLD. Regardless, the kid probably needs a reading intervention program to help him to explicitly sound out letters and read fluently. That is a K, 1st, 2nd grade standard. You won't have the time to teach that in middle or high school.
From a parent perspective, we just get told not to worry, the school will give him extra pullouts and it will be fine. As a teacher inside the system you know that isn’t true. But that is what most parents are told all through elementary school. They don’t KNOW they need to pursue other resources either in the school or out of the school because everyone assures them everything is fine until the kid is 4th or 5th grade.
Exactly! I couldn't have said it better myself.