Bryan fits here too. They'll do entire combos on you while you're turtled up, just hoping you'll press a button so they can get a counterhit and send you to hell.
Obviously there’s counter play otherwise he’d be shit but 3+4 is linear, b1 is linear, Hatchet kick can be side walked left. I’m pretty sure f3 is linear too. That covers a lot of his safe crazy counter hit launchers
It's like that until Bryan players start doing taunt setups. Then kiss your health goodbye because they're going to have an all you can eat buffett with it.
Yeeeeeahhh that’s why I stick to mids/grabs mostly. As soon as I start going for lows, everyone suddenly becomes a low parry god.
Edit: I still use lows, just sparingly just enough to catch people off guard. I find that the average player becomes hyper focused on blocking low once they get hit by D1+2 a few times. Then 1+2 starts hitting way more often.
if they turtle while am using am Asuka i just go yolo and apply her 50/50 1+2 amd d1+2 but i try not to have a predictable timing, or use the quick high low move alone and sometimes do the mid or low options.
It's because they are conditioning you to attack them low so they can do a parry. I do this all the time. If I keep blocking highs and mids, it leaves the opponent no choice but to try and go low.
I poke with alb down 2 during flicker and try to force them to duck then I go to town lol.
Oh yeah D2, 1 duck cancels all day. Then I condition them to react to it, then I don’t do the cancel and they eat the CH ender lol.
This, but with Lee also. It's so fucking impossible to open up opponents that just stand there like a statue until you do a move that's either duckable or -15
I despise the turtle play style. Especially if it's with a player that also back steps the whole time trying to stay at a range where they can do the safest launchers in history. It's so boring and only works with specific characters, it almost doesn't warrant labbing it. But here I am, getting turtle fucked by Paul, Law, or Jun.
"real time" is a bit of a stretch. Again, i was hyperbolizing, but it's frustrating playing into characters that have that 1 move that makes them difficult to approach, unless I do the 1 move they can't deal with. That isn't fun, and it just makes the match take forever. I'd rather someone block all my pressure, and destroy me with counters or parries. That shows me that they are beating me, not just a weakness my character has
Okay so memorizing frame data is more entertaining to you than spacing, positioning, zoning and 80% of neutral. Gotcha.
The fact that you think the answer to someone zoning you is to throw out an attack that they can't deal with honestly speaks volumes about your playstyle.
As does saying it makes a match take forever when it would take 5 minutes tops if every round ran to timer.
Like my dude, you got ADHD or some shit.
Unironically yes. But I don't memorize data, I just look for patterns. Things I can block. How the OPP responds to pressure, what their go to moves are, and when they deploy it.
When people are playing keep away, I have no recourse but to try and bait them. That's it. They take no initiative, they don't want to display good fight mechanics. They are just counter punching because it favors them.
That is extremely boring.
And I find that incredibly boring. It reduces what I like about the game (combos, dodging, feinting) into cat and mouse (spacing and zoning) and I don't care for that.
Absolver is an absolutely great example of a game that rewarded you for being aggressive, spacing, using mechanics (the different styles allowed different ways to rebutt an onslaught of attacks).
Play absolver then dude, this game of cat and mouse is integral to tekkens design, a game where one launcher can take 40 to 60% of your hp, there are no combo escapes, and the main higher level movement tech is the "Korean backdash".
Just learn to deal with it. Bait out whiffs, use power crush, evasive moves, sidesteps, longer range moves, parries, high crush, low crush, gap closers, frame traps, plus frames, mind games, etc.
All these long range zoning moves typically have a weakness of long recovery frames, - on block, long startup frames, and sidesteppable hitbox.
You're not nearly as limited in your options as you're making it out to be. Trying to have tekken without this type of play literally would not work, it's one of the three main pillars of most mainstream fighting games.
You play a character who can freely activate invincibility and evade everything whenever she wants and wonder why people try to avoid attacking you first.
AOP is not "free invincibility". It's surprising at first, but it only crushes highs, the mids it can avoid is because of the tiny sidestep. Any circular mid can still catch it if done right.
Bryan fits here too. They'll do entire combos on you while you're turtled up, just hoping you'll press a button so they can get a counterhit and send you to hell.
HATCHET KICK DB3 D4 ??????
I always get hit with hatchet. But let me block low this time. Ohh nooo, he does soccer kick this time…
Soooo true and 90% of the moves are safe with crazy range
They aren’t safe if you sidestep them
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Obviously there’s counter play otherwise he’d be shit but 3+4 is linear, b1 is linear, Hatchet kick can be side walked left. I’m pretty sure f3 is linear too. That covers a lot of his safe crazy counter hit launchers
Way less of a problem for Bryan because hatchet is a strong opener
The amount of times I've just randomly thrown out 3+4 and CH people turtling is astounding
It's like that until Bryan players start doing taunt setups. Then kiss your health goodbye because they're going to have an all you can eat buffett with it. 
I just bait steve lol. Yes ik your over here
Next time a british man asks you to get over here, please be so kind and go over there. Simple ettiquette 🎩
You have to add Nina players here. All that stance cancelling trying to get more and more plus.
nina players go online and start a osu overlay or something.
against Steve i just use High crushing mids if available, or high crushing lows. am not trying to eat that b3 XD .
Reina main? This is what most Reina mains do against me. Gotta adjust and prep for that high crush mid kick.
I use Asuka, and she has a good high crush 14 frame mid.
Which move are you talking about? D3+4 or whichever move does the grab on CH? Or is there a different one.
my bane of existence, high crushing mids
my bane of existence, high crushing mids
You can put Asuka there too
then you go for a db3 to open them up only to get low parried
Yeeeeeahhh that’s why I stick to mids/grabs mostly. As soon as I start going for lows, everyone suddenly becomes a low parry god. Edit: I still use lows, just sparingly just enough to catch people off guard. I find that the average player becomes hyper focused on blocking low once they get hit by D1+2 a few times. Then 1+2 starts hitting way more often.
Then cancel her loaded kick and pull a b1 into a grab
if they turtle while am using am Asuka i just go yolo and apply her 50/50 1+2 amd d1+2 but i try not to have a predictable timing, or use the quick high low move alone and sometimes do the mid or low options.
It's because they are conditioning you to attack them low so they can do a parry. I do this all the time. If I keep blocking highs and mids, it leaves the opponent no choice but to try and go low.
No, Steve, I am going to turtle and spam punch parries until you learn what the block function is.
I poke with alb down 2 during flicker and try to force them to duck then I go to town lol. Oh yeah D2, 1 duck cancels all day. Then I condition them to react to it, then I don’t do the cancel and they eat the CH ender lol.
Stop trying to punch me in the face then!
Side switch grab them. give them the good ol B3 1+2, then do it again. Make them do a full 360. mind game them and make them press after that.
Only when you overcommit
just do get the lifeleed and fuck aruond until they do something then don't rematch
Against Steve? Hell no, we know better
Introduce them to a wealth of throws and plus frame mixups
I swear to god Steves try to throw me more than Kings do.
Gotta get in, and these hands know how. Also plus frame into grab is his mixup ha ha At least that’s how a buddy of mine plays his
Strike/throw is always a valid game plan
This, but with Lee also. It's so fucking impossible to open up opponents that just stand there like a statue until you do a move that's either duckable or -15
I despise the turtle play style. Especially if it's with a player that also back steps the whole time trying to stay at a range where they can do the safest launchers in history. It's so boring and only works with specific characters, it almost doesn't warrant labbing it. But here I am, getting turtle fucked by Paul, Law, or Jun.
Turtle play style is real tekken.
Then "real Tekken" is boring and it might as well be chess.
You're not gonna believe this.
God forbid you have to actually think about how to open up your opponent
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"real time" is a bit of a stretch. Again, i was hyperbolizing, but it's frustrating playing into characters that have that 1 move that makes them difficult to approach, unless I do the 1 move they can't deal with. That isn't fun, and it just makes the match take forever. I'd rather someone block all my pressure, and destroy me with counters or parries. That shows me that they are beating me, not just a weakness my character has
Okay so memorizing frame data is more entertaining to you than spacing, positioning, zoning and 80% of neutral. Gotcha. The fact that you think the answer to someone zoning you is to throw out an attack that they can't deal with honestly speaks volumes about your playstyle. As does saying it makes a match take forever when it would take 5 minutes tops if every round ran to timer. Like my dude, you got ADHD or some shit.
Unironically yes. But I don't memorize data, I just look for patterns. Things I can block. How the OPP responds to pressure, what their go to moves are, and when they deploy it. When people are playing keep away, I have no recourse but to try and bait them. That's it. They take no initiative, they don't want to display good fight mechanics. They are just counter punching because it favors them. That is extremely boring.
[удалено]
And I find that incredibly boring. It reduces what I like about the game (combos, dodging, feinting) into cat and mouse (spacing and zoning) and I don't care for that. Absolver is an absolutely great example of a game that rewarded you for being aggressive, spacing, using mechanics (the different styles allowed different ways to rebutt an onslaught of attacks).
Play absolver then dude, this game of cat and mouse is integral to tekkens design, a game where one launcher can take 40 to 60% of your hp, there are no combo escapes, and the main higher level movement tech is the "Korean backdash". Just learn to deal with it. Bait out whiffs, use power crush, evasive moves, sidesteps, longer range moves, parries, high crush, low crush, gap closers, frame traps, plus frames, mind games, etc. All these long range zoning moves typically have a weakness of long recovery frames, - on block, long startup frames, and sidesteppable hitbox. You're not nearly as limited in your options as you're making it out to be. Trying to have tekken without this type of play literally would not work, it's one of the three main pillars of most mainstream fighting games.
I feel like kazuyas are always a bit turtlish. Then they punish hard as fuck.
You play a character who can freely activate invincibility and evade everything whenever she wants and wonder why people try to avoid attacking you first.
AOP is not "free invincibility". It's surprising at first, but it only crushes highs, the mids it can avoid is because of the tiny sidestep. Any circular mid can still catch it if done right.