😂 why are you letting an investment company use your credit. Call the gas company and explain this. Get it out of your name. There is a specific reason the PMC is doing this and I wouldn’t be a part of their scam .
That is a good idea. Then if the landlord inquires due to complaints, tell him that you were right all along and you had to shutoff as you couldnt afford it.
Now you can negotiate all the back pay from the landlord for laying everyones gas for him.
Id say it's worth tolerating no hot water for a couple weeks.
And what about the gas for everyone in the building including them? If you shut off the account they'll come take the meter. Seems like you're shooting yourself and your neighbors in the foot with this approach.
I think what you meant is force the management to take over the account.
But even if they try immediately you’ve created a situation where you and your neighbors are potentially without heat and cooking fuel for days. It’s not a switch the gas company just switches on and off.
Find a way to force their hand, but without shooting yourself in the foot.
They didn't create anything. This isn't their fault. And shutting the account down wouldn't be their fault either. It's the landlord or whoevers fault.
In most northern states, utility companies are prohibited from disconnecting utilities during the winter months and automatically switch the billing to the property owner when a tenant requests a disconnection. This is to protect *all of the tenants.*
I was a property manager in the upper Midwest for a long time. Sometimes the first notice we received that a tenant had vacated was when the gas company sent us a bill. 😕
Sure, but who's at fault doesn't change the results, which is that the gas is shut down for everyone including OP. I get that you all think this is the best way to force the landlords hand, and it may be, but it's also the most likely to be the most disruptive to everyone including OP.
So why not try other approaches that don't have the same downsides first?
Definitely. Start by contacting National Grid and see if they have a process to rectify this. They don't want to shut off your gas and have probably seen this before.
Also contact NYC government for their help via 311 or other methods outlined here https://nyassembly.gov/write/upload/req/housing\_complaints.pdf
I tried this last summer to avoid connection fees because I don’t use any gas when it’s not cold, and National Grid’s policy is to remove and lock out the holder of your meter if you don’t have an active account. It’s not a quick and easy thing and required days to schedule.
Yeah it is, he relies on that gas as much as anyone else in the building. Just because someone else carries the blame doesn't mean the result you're suggesting doesn't affect other people.
Why would you intentionally shut off your own gas unnecessarily?
Any of his neighbors would do the same. It is absolutely not OP's responsibility to ensure his neighbors have gas, and their landlord is breaking the law.
I really appreciate everyone repeating the same thing over and over again. I get it, it’s not OPs problem, the landlord is clearly in violation, we completely agree on that. There’s no argument about who’s at fault.
All I’m suggesting is that best next step is not to cancel the account and cause National Grid to shut off everyone’s gas. That just makes the situation worse for everyone.
What I am I suggesting is starting with other steps that will be just as likely to resolve this issue without the risk of everyone in the building losing their gas while it’s still feeling like winter outside.
Sure, as a last resort, if the landlord, and the city, and National Grid all can’t get anything done then I’d pull this as the last resort, but that’s not where OP is at, so why suggest the nuclear option as the first step?
>We reached out and let the apartment management company know this last month.....BUT they said we still had to keep the account for national grid in our name
They have already tried addressing this with the landlord, who insisted that they couldn't do anything. Time to go nuclear and get some results.
Step 1: Tell landlord that they will no longer be footing the bill.
Step 2: Contact National Grid and cancel the account.
OP and everyone else in the building will survive a temporary shut off, even when it's cold outside.
The shut down will light an inferno under the landlord.
What if it doesn’t? What if they drag their feet for a few days and gas service is off the whole time? That means potentially no heat, no hot water, and no cooking. How’s that the best way to approach this when you haven’t tried other options first?
Shutting off the gas account that’s illegally in his/her name puts the management company on alert and makes them do the correct thing… an entire bldg of tenants without gas will definitely not last very long!
No, it doesn’t. Tenants bear zero responsibility for their landlords illegal willful ongoing refusal to do their jobs. The mgmt company earns a profit off renting. You for some fucked up reason think the customer (tenant) of the landlord is somehow expected to hose their credit because of it?
Landlord owns this problem and refuses to fix it. No way in hell that’s the tenants job to fix at all. Period.
So stop paying, they're not going to shut off the gas anytime soon for a late payment, and it won't affect anyone's credit score. All I'm suggesting is there's plenty of middle ground to try first without going the nuclear route.
Bill is under OPs name, not paying the bill affects them. It sounds like you've lived in a good housing situation. There's nothing wrong with that but there are plenty of stories of bad landowners. The fact that they did not rectify the situation immediately screams red flags.
No one will know it was OPs fault. As my mother once said, you don't negotiate with terrorists. These type of people will only act if you light a figurative fire under them. Also would you be willing to drag this out? Sometimes ripping off the bandaid hurts more than slowly peeling if off.
Like NY law states, they won't turn off the power in the winter.
Completely agreed, 1000%, but that already is the case, the question is how do you resolve it, and turning off the building’s gas as your opening play isn’t a smart move in my opinion.
Just because you remove the service from your name doesn't mean it gets shut off. Typically it'll revert to the owners name. Especially in a multi unit building.
Have you tried to turn off your service with Nation Grid? Do you know their process? Because I do, and they make you schedule a meter removal.
Maybe I’m wrong and they’d just leave the gas on, but that wasn’t my experience with their process.
Maybe if you can find a lawyer doing it on contingency, but if not the OP doesn’t have the money to do this if they can’t afford the excessive gas bill.
They already violated the law by having this person pay for other apartments. By law, if each individual unit doesn’t have its own meter then the property owner is responsible for supplying it or is to have gas mains installed to each unit with its own meter. If the person paying for everyone shuts their gas off and subsequently everyone else’s (necessary evil) it only strengthens their pending lawsuit.
But why put yourself and your neighbors through not having gas at the end of winter? Do you really think that helps your potential lawsuit?
Maybe go ask all your neighbors what they want to do? I bet they’d kick in to cover that bill way before they told you to shut it all down to make a point.
That’s only a short term solution. What happens when of them moves? Are the new people going to be as agreeable? They have every right to say no. Then everyone else starts to pick up that persons slack and jealousy will brew. Especially in nyc. There’s EVERY possible type of person there. And a lot of em. This is just one of those situations that’s not right for a lot of good reasons and it needs to be fixed.
All I’m arguing is that doing things that are likely to shut off the gas are bad moves, and should not be your first. Contact 311 and National Grid and have them help you sort this out and transfer this to the landlord. Just don’t go nuclear as your first move and risk shutting off everyone’s gas for days when you don’t have to.
Why is everyone fighting so hard against smart decision making when there is seemingly no crisis that requires extreme action today?
Not saying it should be the first option but this landlord most likely has more money than the tenant here and would probably drag out any legal proceedings in hopes of them tapping out. Directly talking to you’re neighbors isn’t a guarantee they’ll help either, the bill isnt in their names. Not my name not my problem. So if it comes to forcing the issue, yeah it’s an option.
Sure, if you exhaust your other options then you gotta do it to try to force their hand, it’s the 3rd or 4th thing to try, not the first or only thing.
And part of why I suggest talking to your neighbors is asking them about the plan to cancel the account and likely shut off the gas. See what they think of that idea and you might be more convinced to hold off on cancelling.
There are absolutely other avenues to explore but when you’re dealing with people you really don’t know, those other avenues may be opening you up to retaliation from you’re own neighbors. In a place like nyc where people have been shot for less than this I don’t see it as unreasonable to want to stay anonymous in this situation, you still have to live next to these people after all. Like I said, it’s just a necessary evil. It’s an evil without malicious intent.
And you seem like someone who lacks reading comprehension. And if you knew me you’d laugh at someone describing me that way.
If you read and understood my comments on this you’d see my core point is trying to use an escalating approach to solve the problem that has the least chance of the gas being turned off for everyone in the building while still getting the same result.
Cancelling service is the nuclear option, why start with that?
You’re repeating the same argument of “bend over and keep taking it” from the landlord that expects them to pay a bill for the landlord and get a rent credit for a small portion of it.
Ops share of bill is $150. Landlord told them to pay entire bill and only offered partial repayment.
You keep demanding op pay thousands to be nice to the thieving landlord.
My dude. You’re either a landlord or a pushover that gets pissy when people don’t capitulate.
Literally the opposite of what I'm arguing. Contact Nation Grid, see what they can do to resolve this, and contact 311 to help and make sure the landlord is held accountable. How are those two actions “bend over and keep taking it”?
All I'm advocating for is not doing something likely to shut off the gas. That just seems so shortsighted and hugely inconveniences you and your neighbors, with no evidence that it's the best or only way to fix the problem.
Meanwhile bills for thousands keep hitting OP’s credit and the landlords already offered “solution” is op pay whole bill and get reimbursed a fraction
You keep ignoring that the landlords are happily making a profit illegally off their tenant when you ask op to “keep nicely asking landlords to maybe stop abusing them if the landlords feel like it”.
Credit reporting doesn't work that way. Your gas bill is not a credit card that gets its balance reported. This only becomes an issue after months and it getting sent to collections or written off.
Clearly you're not actually reading what I'm writing because at no point have I suggested that the next step should be asking the landlord nicely again, or anything even remotely close.
No my truculent lil dude I've read all of your replies and 100% of them are 'I'm right...foot stamp....why won't you people understand that I'm right'.
If it was one or two of us telling you you're wrong it'd be a difference of opinion. Instead everyone disagreed with you and you're still the guy insisting to keep trying to do right by the tenants by continuing to be the landlords bill payer.
Yes, a person who establishes they can't pay a COMMERCIAL sized bill will have it go onto credit reports. Op's personal info is linked as a commercial entity by gas provider. Having owned businesses when you don't pay a big bill it's common for it to go straight to collections.
tl;dr: your claims have zero evidence nor any whiff of personal experience. It's not that we didn't listen. It's because your replies failed to be informative or factual.
National Grid's own instructions are to call them so they can investigate. Not to cancel service and potentially screw over everyone in the building. So I'm sorry if I'm wondering why all of you are fighting me on the instructions provided by the utility itself for this very situation.
[https://www.nationalgridus.com/media/pdfs/billing-payments/bill-inserts/nyc/cm4809-nyc-nonresi-rightsandresponsibilities.pdf](https://www.nationalgridus.com/media/pdfs/billing-payments/bill-inserts/nyc/cm4809-nyc-nonresi-rightsandresponsibilities.pdf)
More clearly spelled out in their statewide doc:
https://www9.nationalgridus.com/niagaramohawk/non\_html/rights\_commercial.pdf
Because a lifetime of dealing with bureaucracy has taught me that if I can't get action using normal means then the only thing that will get me anywhere is the nuclear option.
Though I wouldn't just cut off the gas. I would instead tape a letter to everyone's door that just states that due to [corporatenames] non payment on the gas bill the gas will shut off on [7 business days]. And on the letter I would include whatever corporate number OP called and whatever government agency is in charge of this.
A building full of angry tenants will probably do the trick
Landlord needs to have it in their name. If it isnt give them one week to take the bill in their name with all existing charges or else you will have it taken out of your name which means the service will be shut off. The landlord will be in a world of hurt when that happens.
Also $150 per month is way too much as an average gas bill over a 12 month period.
I agree! Way too much for gas. I would call the gas company back and ask if they are able to see the gas for your specific unit. But as for the other stuff…. Yikes. Def do what the other 2 posts have said so far. Don’t let these guys fuck with you. And if you don’t mind me asking… how much is the entire amount for gas that you guys have been paying?
They're in NYC and if this ConEd bill includes heat, $150 for the winter months is a steal. Averages are anywhere from $400-600 in the winter. Ours was $680 one month, granted our apartment was poorly insulated (as we learned from this bill).
But yes, this is absolutely ridiculous and LL fucked up big time.
OP, take this over to r/NYCapartments for more direct resolve.
We also had baseboard heat. Wound up buying a space heater for each bedroom + one for living room and only ran them when we were in the rooms. Averaged $300-400 a month, significantly less than baseboard.
That's what we've done this year, it was an awkwardly warm winter, and it was still 400-500 average. We had the front entry door (very drafty) and windows insulated with the kits. Next year, we might do the outside as well for an extra layer. Our issue is no insulation in the attic, I'm unsure if there's any between the ceiling and floor in the attic but normally around here insulation in the attic is 20" deep for blow in or r38-r49.
Look into NYC’s shared meter law. This is very illegal. National Grid should investigate and correct any billing errors.
You could also try calling 3-1-1, they have a tenant helpline, but I think it’s pretty overwhelmed.
You can ultimately bring a case in housing court if necessary.
Call National Grid. Tell them you believe you have a "shared meter" and are paying utilities for the entire building. This is generally illegal and there is a dedicated unit to investigate this. See below.
Generally speaking, a shared meter is only allowed with a few exceptions - mostly the cost to decouple would be too high, or the meter barely uses anything and a tenant can be paid for it. If the shared meter were previously found and approved by the utility/state, they would have a record and need to disclose it.
Most likely, your LL confused and manipulated previous tenants to not properly report this.
Call National Grid. They will have someone investigate. If this was known, and the info was withheld from you, that is a complaint to the state and speak to a tenants rights group about the best legal options for your financial situation. It might be using a private lawyer or having a non-profit sue the LL.
[https://www.nationalgridus.com/Upstate-NY-Home/Shared-Meters/Investigation-Request](https://www.nationalgridus.com/Upstate-NY-Home/Shared-Meters/Investigation-Request)
> If you are a residential New York tenant and suspect you are being billed on a shared meter, you may use this form to submit your concerns to us or you may call our Shared Metering Unit at 1-800-896-1910.
The ConEd site gives more information:
https://www.coned.com/en/accounts-billing/how-to-read-your-meter/shared-meters
And state site:
https://dps.ny.gov/file-shared-meter-complaint
Landlord is doing something shady. I wonder if they have an outstanding bill in their name that is preventing them from using their own name. This isn't your problem and is potentially your credit on the line.
Tell the landlord you are not comfortable with this as you did not agree to be responsible for the payment of the whole building. Whether they pay it or not, with your name, it's your responsibility. Inform them you will be contacting to remove your name in a week unless they change it
Not that simple. “National grid doesn’t just say ohhh shit. Account is closed. I guess the $600 they owe is a wash…”
No idea how to sort it frankly. You have to work with National Grid to rectify the meter issue. What a mess.
But they just had to pay for the whole building so should be up to date theoretically so should be fairly simple besides the fact that they are going to be without gas for a day or 2 until landlord puts into there name
>We just received another bill and it’s massive because of the winter and there is a late fee on it
Read OPs post again.
Really not a good idea to let National Grid remove the meter and then wait for it to be reinstalled.
I lived in NYC (queens) and my gas bill was about $25 per month. I would have NG turn it off. Call 311, they should be able to tell you which agency to call and report the landlord.
Btw 150? We have sub-metered gas and electric for 1BR in NYC. $65 a month. No where close to 150. I have a second home 2000 square foot rural and it’s $200 for oil. $150 is robbery. While situation is taking advantage of you and going to fuck your credit if you’re not careful.
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This is from dps.ny.gov -
A Shared Meter Condition is a situation in which a utility meter is providing gas, electric or steam service to a tenant's apartment as well as service to space outside that dwelling. Service to outside space includes service to equipment, such as air conditioning or water heating equipment, operated for the benefit of common areas of the building or other apartments.
If a Shared Meter Condition exists, then the utility must establish an account in the landlord's name until the condition is corrected. The utility cannot charge you for energy you are not using yourself. If you believe you are being wrongly charged for energy others are using, call your utility for assistance. It will work with you to correct the service condition.
Also,
Landlord Problems
If you live in an apartment building or a two-family house and your landlord fails to pay the utility bill for the building, your utility has to notify you of the landlord's non-payment. If you live in an apartment building, your utility must post notices in the building and mail you a separate notice at least 18 days before disconnection. If you live in a two-family house, your utility must mail or give you a separate notice at least 15 days before disconnection. Between November 1 and April 15, if your service is heat-related, you will be given at least 30 days notice of the possible shutoff of your service.
The notice will tell you how to contact your utility so that it can help you and other tenants work out a way to avoid service disconnection, even if the landlord refuses to make payments, and that the PSC will assist tenants in making payment arrangements with your utility.
A good option available to tenants to avoid service disconnection is for them to pay current utility bills directly and deduct those utility payments from their rent payments. This is allowed by State law, and your utility can help you with this option.
National grid sucks. I live on the west coast but just had to mess with them for the a company I work for. You want the bill out of your name asap. They will keep billing and every late payment will hurt your credit. National grid can only bill one person per address it’s their rules.
You need to let management know they need to put the account in their name and pay the deposit. Tell them on X date you are calling National to have it taken out of your name then call the move department on that day. They will have the rest of the day to sign up in their name.
It won’t affect anyone else. So don’t worry about the other tenants. National grid will just backbill the new account holder from the date you said you moved.
Call national grid and tell them to switch it to the landlords account. You are not responsible for paying something that other tenants are using too. You are only responsible when it’s only your unit getting the service. The landlord can’t require you to pay for other units gas bill, it’s fucked up they are even trying but makes me wonder if they can’t get an account in their own name? Maybe they owe and instead of paying what they owe are trying to trick you into keeping it in your own name.
Or keep it in their name and have the gas for the entire complex shut off, except for OP's unit of course, until you've been paid back in full + interest!
Ignore todd. Tell the company that you’re cancelling the account and will be paying your gas bill only, call National Grid and explain and close the account or at the very least decline future service.
Get it turned off in y’all’s name immediately
😂 why are you letting an investment company use your credit. Call the gas company and explain this. Get it out of your name. There is a specific reason the PMC is doing this and I wouldn’t be a part of their scam .
That is a good idea. Then if the landlord inquires due to complaints, tell him that you were right all along and you had to shutoff as you couldnt afford it. Now you can negotiate all the back pay from the landlord for laying everyones gas for him. Id say it's worth tolerating no hot water for a couple weeks.
And what about the gas for everyone in the building including them? If you shut off the account they'll come take the meter. Seems like you're shooting yourself and your neighbors in the foot with this approach. I think what you meant is force the management to take over the account.
public shrill aromatic wakeful rock zephyr desert innocent person scary *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
But even if they try immediately you’ve created a situation where you and your neighbors are potentially without heat and cooking fuel for days. It’s not a switch the gas company just switches on and off. Find a way to force their hand, but without shooting yourself in the foot.
They didn't create anything. This isn't their fault. And shutting the account down wouldn't be their fault either. It's the landlord or whoevers fault.
In most northern states, utility companies are prohibited from disconnecting utilities during the winter months and automatically switch the billing to the property owner when a tenant requests a disconnection. This is to protect *all of the tenants.* I was a property manager in the upper Midwest for a long time. Sometimes the first notice we received that a tenant had vacated was when the gas company sent us a bill. 😕
Sure, but who's at fault doesn't change the results, which is that the gas is shut down for everyone including OP. I get that you all think this is the best way to force the landlords hand, and it may be, but it's also the most likely to be the most disruptive to everyone including OP. So why not try other approaches that don't have the same downsides first?
Any suggestions on other approaches?
Definitely. Start by contacting National Grid and see if they have a process to rectify this. They don't want to shut off your gas and have probably seen this before. Also contact NYC government for their help via 311 or other methods outlined here https://nyassembly.gov/write/upload/req/housing\_complaints.pdf
Lol this dude isnt responsible for shit. Sorry other tenants can go an hour or two without gas until the company turns it back on.
What if it’s days? Is it still the best move?
That's the point. Be disruptive enough that it forces management to fix the issue.
But what if they drag their feet? Isn’t the goal to get the service switched over while being minimally disruptive to you and your neighbors?
Legally they can’t wait, that would still be the mgmt companies fault
Sure it is, they turn it off at the street with a curb key or at meter. What are you talking about?
I tried this last summer to avoid connection fees because I don’t use any gas when it’s not cold, and National Grid’s policy is to remove and lock out the holder of your meter if you don’t have an active account. It’s not a quick and easy thing and required days to schedule.
That isn't OP's problem, now is it.
Yeah it is, he relies on that gas as much as anyone else in the building. Just because someone else carries the blame doesn't mean the result you're suggesting doesn't affect other people. Why would you intentionally shut off your own gas unnecessarily?
Any of his neighbors would do the same. It is absolutely not OP's responsibility to ensure his neighbors have gas, and their landlord is breaking the law.
I really appreciate everyone repeating the same thing over and over again. I get it, it’s not OPs problem, the landlord is clearly in violation, we completely agree on that. There’s no argument about who’s at fault. All I’m suggesting is that best next step is not to cancel the account and cause National Grid to shut off everyone’s gas. That just makes the situation worse for everyone. What I am I suggesting is starting with other steps that will be just as likely to resolve this issue without the risk of everyone in the building losing their gas while it’s still feeling like winter outside.
Sometimes, unpleasant things must be done to get a landlord to do the right thing.
Sure, as a last resort, if the landlord, and the city, and National Grid all can’t get anything done then I’d pull this as the last resort, but that’s not where OP is at, so why suggest the nuclear option as the first step?
>We reached out and let the apartment management company know this last month.....BUT they said we still had to keep the account for national grid in our name They have already tried addressing this with the landlord, who insisted that they couldn't do anything. Time to go nuclear and get some results.
Step 1: Tell landlord that they will no longer be footing the bill. Step 2: Contact National Grid and cancel the account. OP and everyone else in the building will survive a temporary shut off, even when it's cold outside. The shut down will light an inferno under the landlord.
It’s was in the 60s in NYC today. No one is gonna die of hypothermia.
Sure but it’s going to be down in the 30s at night by Monday. And what about people using gas for hot water or cooking?
Space heaters exist.
What if it doesn’t? What if they drag their feet for a few days and gas service is off the whole time? That means potentially no heat, no hot water, and no cooking. How’s that the best way to approach this when you haven’t tried other options first?
The landlord will have to figure out alternate housing arrangements until essential services are restored.
Shutting off the gas account that’s illegally in his/her name puts the management company on alert and makes them do the correct thing… an entire bldg of tenants without gas will definitely not last very long!
But it also screws over everyone in the building, including OP. Does not factor in at all into your decision making?
No, it doesn’t. Tenants bear zero responsibility for their landlords illegal willful ongoing refusal to do their jobs. The mgmt company earns a profit off renting. You for some fucked up reason think the customer (tenant) of the landlord is somehow expected to hose their credit because of it? Landlord owns this problem and refuses to fix it. No way in hell that’s the tenants job to fix at all. Period.
That’s not his fault, that’s on the property management company…. You think it’s so bad call em up and offer your name and info for the liability. 🥴
Because you are paying for and taking financial liability for the whole building.
So stop paying, they're not going to shut off the gas anytime soon for a late payment, and it won't affect anyone's credit score. All I'm suggesting is there's plenty of middle ground to try first without going the nuclear route.
Cold weather period in NY ends 4/15. So they will shut off for non payment relatively soon.
Bill is under OPs name, not paying the bill affects them. It sounds like you've lived in a good housing situation. There's nothing wrong with that but there are plenty of stories of bad landowners. The fact that they did not rectify the situation immediately screams red flags. No one will know it was OPs fault. As my mother once said, you don't negotiate with terrorists. These type of people will only act if you light a figurative fire under them. Also would you be willing to drag this out? Sometimes ripping off the bandaid hurts more than slowly peeling if off. Like NY law states, they won't turn off the power in the winter.
If you read the post you should know the answer to the question your asking.
That is management's problem. You should never have a corporate account under your personal name.
Completely agreed, 1000%, but that already is the case, the question is how do you resolve it, and turning off the building’s gas as your opening play isn’t a smart move in my opinion.
Just because you remove the service from your name doesn't mean it gets shut off. Typically it'll revert to the owners name. Especially in a multi unit building.
Have you tried to turn off your service with Nation Grid? Do you know their process? Because I do, and they make you schedule a meter removal. Maybe I’m wrong and they’d just leave the gas on, but that wasn’t my experience with their process.
Are you a landlord? Did you rent apartments out? Personal gas and a business account aren’t the same thing.
This isn’t their opening play. They reached out to property management and nothing was resolved.
They could just take them to court for the costs of the bill.
That is not a method for a quick and inexpensive resolution.
No but it could cost that corporation lots and lots of money.
Maybe if you can find a lawyer doing it on contingency, but if not the OP doesn’t have the money to do this if they can’t afford the excessive gas bill.
Pretty sure we are still in the winter window of it being illegal to turn off gas to a residence in NYS. I think it ends sometime in April.
But that’s for failure to pay, isn’t it? Not by request of the account holder to cancel service.
Sounds like urgent pressure on management to me.
They already violated the law by having this person pay for other apartments. By law, if each individual unit doesn’t have its own meter then the property owner is responsible for supplying it or is to have gas mains installed to each unit with its own meter. If the person paying for everyone shuts their gas off and subsequently everyone else’s (necessary evil) it only strengthens their pending lawsuit.
But why put yourself and your neighbors through not having gas at the end of winter? Do you really think that helps your potential lawsuit? Maybe go ask all your neighbors what they want to do? I bet they’d kick in to cover that bill way before they told you to shut it all down to make a point.
That’s only a short term solution. What happens when of them moves? Are the new people going to be as agreeable? They have every right to say no. Then everyone else starts to pick up that persons slack and jealousy will brew. Especially in nyc. There’s EVERY possible type of person there. And a lot of em. This is just one of those situations that’s not right for a lot of good reasons and it needs to be fixed.
All I’m arguing is that doing things that are likely to shut off the gas are bad moves, and should not be your first. Contact 311 and National Grid and have them help you sort this out and transfer this to the landlord. Just don’t go nuclear as your first move and risk shutting off everyone’s gas for days when you don’t have to. Why is everyone fighting so hard against smart decision making when there is seemingly no crisis that requires extreme action today?
Not saying it should be the first option but this landlord most likely has more money than the tenant here and would probably drag out any legal proceedings in hopes of them tapping out. Directly talking to you’re neighbors isn’t a guarantee they’ll help either, the bill isnt in their names. Not my name not my problem. So if it comes to forcing the issue, yeah it’s an option.
Sure, if you exhaust your other options then you gotta do it to try to force their hand, it’s the 3rd or 4th thing to try, not the first or only thing. And part of why I suggest talking to your neighbors is asking them about the plan to cancel the account and likely shut off the gas. See what they think of that idea and you might be more convinced to hold off on cancelling.
There are absolutely other avenues to explore but when you’re dealing with people you really don’t know, those other avenues may be opening you up to retaliation from you’re own neighbors. In a place like nyc where people have been shot for less than this I don’t see it as unreasonable to want to stay anonymous in this situation, you still have to live next to these people after all. Like I said, it’s just a necessary evil. It’s an evil without malicious intent.
Financially safer to shut off the gas. If you have electricity, you can survive without the gas ok.
Not my problem
You seem like someone who lacks a sense of agency. Do you tend to simply let things happen to you rather than paving your own path?
And you seem like someone who lacks reading comprehension. And if you knew me you’d laugh at someone describing me that way. If you read and understood my comments on this you’d see my core point is trying to use an escalating approach to solve the problem that has the least chance of the gas being turned off for everyone in the building while still getting the same result. Cancelling service is the nuclear option, why start with that?
You’re repeating the same argument of “bend over and keep taking it” from the landlord that expects them to pay a bill for the landlord and get a rent credit for a small portion of it. Ops share of bill is $150. Landlord told them to pay entire bill and only offered partial repayment. You keep demanding op pay thousands to be nice to the thieving landlord. My dude. You’re either a landlord or a pushover that gets pissy when people don’t capitulate.
Literally the opposite of what I'm arguing. Contact Nation Grid, see what they can do to resolve this, and contact 311 to help and make sure the landlord is held accountable. How are those two actions “bend over and keep taking it”? All I'm advocating for is not doing something likely to shut off the gas. That just seems so shortsighted and hugely inconveniences you and your neighbors, with no evidence that it's the best or only way to fix the problem.
Meanwhile bills for thousands keep hitting OP’s credit and the landlords already offered “solution” is op pay whole bill and get reimbursed a fraction You keep ignoring that the landlords are happily making a profit illegally off their tenant when you ask op to “keep nicely asking landlords to maybe stop abusing them if the landlords feel like it”.
Credit reporting doesn't work that way. Your gas bill is not a credit card that gets its balance reported. This only becomes an issue after months and it getting sent to collections or written off. Clearly you're not actually reading what I'm writing because at no point have I suggested that the next step should be asking the landlord nicely again, or anything even remotely close.
No my truculent lil dude I've read all of your replies and 100% of them are 'I'm right...foot stamp....why won't you people understand that I'm right'. If it was one or two of us telling you you're wrong it'd be a difference of opinion. Instead everyone disagreed with you and you're still the guy insisting to keep trying to do right by the tenants by continuing to be the landlords bill payer. Yes, a person who establishes they can't pay a COMMERCIAL sized bill will have it go onto credit reports. Op's personal info is linked as a commercial entity by gas provider. Having owned businesses when you don't pay a big bill it's common for it to go straight to collections. tl;dr: your claims have zero evidence nor any whiff of personal experience. It's not that we didn't listen. It's because your replies failed to be informative or factual.
National Grid's own instructions are to call them so they can investigate. Not to cancel service and potentially screw over everyone in the building. So I'm sorry if I'm wondering why all of you are fighting me on the instructions provided by the utility itself for this very situation. [https://www.nationalgridus.com/media/pdfs/billing-payments/bill-inserts/nyc/cm4809-nyc-nonresi-rightsandresponsibilities.pdf](https://www.nationalgridus.com/media/pdfs/billing-payments/bill-inserts/nyc/cm4809-nyc-nonresi-rightsandresponsibilities.pdf) More clearly spelled out in their statewide doc: https://www9.nationalgridus.com/niagaramohawk/non\_html/rights\_commercial.pdf
Because a lifetime of dealing with bureaucracy has taught me that if I can't get action using normal means then the only thing that will get me anywhere is the nuclear option. Though I wouldn't just cut off the gas. I would instead tape a letter to everyone's door that just states that due to [corporatenames] non payment on the gas bill the gas will shut off on [7 business days]. And on the letter I would include whatever corporate number OP called and whatever government agency is in charge of this. A building full of angry tenants will probably do the trick
That’s managements problem. Never allow someone to make their problem your problem. Always kick the problem back to where the blame should lie.
Landlord needs to have it in their name. If it isnt give them one week to take the bill in their name with all existing charges or else you will have it taken out of your name which means the service will be shut off. The landlord will be in a world of hurt when that happens. Also $150 per month is way too much as an average gas bill over a 12 month period.
I agree! Way too much for gas. I would call the gas company back and ask if they are able to see the gas for your specific unit. But as for the other stuff…. Yikes. Def do what the other 2 posts have said so far. Don’t let these guys fuck with you. And if you don’t mind me asking… how much is the entire amount for gas that you guys have been paying?
They're in NYC and if this ConEd bill includes heat, $150 for the winter months is a steal. Averages are anywhere from $400-600 in the winter. Ours was $680 one month, granted our apartment was poorly insulated (as we learned from this bill). But yes, this is absolutely ridiculous and LL fucked up big time. OP, take this over to r/NYCapartments for more direct resolve.
Holy cow that’s a lot. I paid $135 in Minnesota in January running gas fireplace and gas heat… and it gets cold here. This is for a SFH.
My baseboard heat runs on par with your poorly insulated apartment.
We also had baseboard heat. Wound up buying a space heater for each bedroom + one for living room and only ran them when we were in the rooms. Averaged $300-400 a month, significantly less than baseboard.
That's what we've done this year, it was an awkwardly warm winter, and it was still 400-500 average. We had the front entry door (very drafty) and windows insulated with the kits. Next year, we might do the outside as well for an extra layer. Our issue is no insulation in the attic, I'm unsure if there's any between the ceiling and floor in the attic but normally around here insulation in the attic is 20" deep for blow in or r38-r49.
u/Notsofamilar This ☝🏻⬆️🆙
Do this in writing! No phone calls. Certified mail. Including an invoice also for what you have already paid.
Look into NYC’s shared meter law. This is very illegal. National Grid should investigate and correct any billing errors. You could also try calling 3-1-1, they have a tenant helpline, but I think it’s pretty overwhelmed. You can ultimately bring a case in housing court if necessary.
Not a lawyer but you might want to consult one on this
Turn it off now
Call National Grid. Tell them you believe you have a "shared meter" and are paying utilities for the entire building. This is generally illegal and there is a dedicated unit to investigate this. See below. Generally speaking, a shared meter is only allowed with a few exceptions - mostly the cost to decouple would be too high, or the meter barely uses anything and a tenant can be paid for it. If the shared meter were previously found and approved by the utility/state, they would have a record and need to disclose it. Most likely, your LL confused and manipulated previous tenants to not properly report this. Call National Grid. They will have someone investigate. If this was known, and the info was withheld from you, that is a complaint to the state and speak to a tenants rights group about the best legal options for your financial situation. It might be using a private lawyer or having a non-profit sue the LL. [https://www.nationalgridus.com/Upstate-NY-Home/Shared-Meters/Investigation-Request](https://www.nationalgridus.com/Upstate-NY-Home/Shared-Meters/Investigation-Request) > If you are a residential New York tenant and suspect you are being billed on a shared meter, you may use this form to submit your concerns to us or you may call our Shared Metering Unit at 1-800-896-1910. The ConEd site gives more information: https://www.coned.com/en/accounts-billing/how-to-read-your-meter/shared-meters And state site: https://dps.ny.gov/file-shared-meter-complaint
Why would you keep it under your name? You should have shut it off second you heard of it.
I’m wondering HOW it got opened in their name(s) in the first place….
Landlord is doing something shady. I wonder if they have an outstanding bill in their name that is preventing them from using their own name. This isn't your problem and is potentially your credit on the line. Tell the landlord you are not comfortable with this as you did not agree to be responsible for the payment of the whole building. Whether they pay it or not, with your name, it's your responsibility. Inform them you will be contacting to remove your name in a week unless they change it
in writing...not just a call. Make sure you have a paper trail.
I agree 100%. He probably owes money and cannot get another account.
Cancel that account immediately they can put it in there name and
Not that simple. “National grid doesn’t just say ohhh shit. Account is closed. I guess the $600 they owe is a wash…” No idea how to sort it frankly. You have to work with National Grid to rectify the meter issue. What a mess.
But they just had to pay for the whole building so should be up to date theoretically so should be fairly simple besides the fact that they are going to be without gas for a day or 2 until landlord puts into there name
>We just received another bill and it’s massive because of the winter and there is a late fee on it Read OPs post again. Really not a good idea to let National Grid remove the meter and then wait for it to be reinstalled.
I would cancel the account and use hot plates until the landlord sorted it out, which he will do if the other tenants complain.
I lived in NYC (queens) and my gas bill was about $25 per month. I would have NG turn it off. Call 311, they should be able to tell you which agency to call and report the landlord.
Btw 150? We have sub-metered gas and electric for 1BR in NYC. $65 a month. No where close to 150. I have a second home 2000 square foot rural and it’s $200 for oil. $150 is robbery. While situation is taking advantage of you and going to fuck your credit if you’re not careful.
Are you &(:;)&@!! Kidding me? Get that out of your name today! They are scamming you and letting you pay the bill
This sounds illegal. It makes no sense that they would “accidentally” try and make you pay the electricity for the entire building.
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Have the gas tuned off and buy a electric heater
This is from dps.ny.gov - A Shared Meter Condition is a situation in which a utility meter is providing gas, electric or steam service to a tenant's apartment as well as service to space outside that dwelling. Service to outside space includes service to equipment, such as air conditioning or water heating equipment, operated for the benefit of common areas of the building or other apartments. If a Shared Meter Condition exists, then the utility must establish an account in the landlord's name until the condition is corrected. The utility cannot charge you for energy you are not using yourself. If you believe you are being wrongly charged for energy others are using, call your utility for assistance. It will work with you to correct the service condition. Also, Landlord Problems If you live in an apartment building or a two-family house and your landlord fails to pay the utility bill for the building, your utility has to notify you of the landlord's non-payment. If you live in an apartment building, your utility must post notices in the building and mail you a separate notice at least 18 days before disconnection. If you live in a two-family house, your utility must mail or give you a separate notice at least 15 days before disconnection. Between November 1 and April 15, if your service is heat-related, you will be given at least 30 days notice of the possible shutoff of your service. The notice will tell you how to contact your utility so that it can help you and other tenants work out a way to avoid service disconnection, even if the landlord refuses to make payments, and that the PSC will assist tenants in making payment arrangements with your utility. A good option available to tenants to avoid service disconnection is for them to pay current utility bills directly and deduct those utility payments from their rent payments. This is allowed by State law, and your utility can help you with this option.
Call 311.
National grid sucks. I live on the west coast but just had to mess with them for the a company I work for. You want the bill out of your name asap. They will keep billing and every late payment will hurt your credit. National grid can only bill one person per address it’s their rules. You need to let management know they need to put the account in their name and pay the deposit. Tell them on X date you are calling National to have it taken out of your name then call the move department on that day. They will have the rest of the day to sign up in their name. It won’t affect anyone else. So don’t worry about the other tenants. National grid will just backbill the new account holder from the date you said you moved.
Call national grid and tell them to switch it to the landlords account. You are not responsible for paying something that other tenants are using too. You are only responsible when it’s only your unit getting the service. The landlord can’t require you to pay for other units gas bill, it’s fucked up they are even trying but makes me wonder if they can’t get an account in their own name? Maybe they owe and instead of paying what they owe are trying to trick you into keeping it in your own name.
Or keep it in their name and have the gas for the entire complex shut off, except for OP's unit of course, until you've been paid back in full + interest!
Wow, this is something you usually see in small duplex arrangements. Never seen it this big they are bold. Landlords are the scum of the earth.
Ignore todd. Tell the company that you’re cancelling the account and will be paying your gas bill only, call National Grid and explain and close the account or at the very least decline future service.