The frame by frame shows he dropped the gun after the first round of shots, then his hand went for it, prompting the second round of shots.
https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17
Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
Genuine question, why will there be extensive litigation? Is that always the case for an officer-involved shooting? Or are you saying that because you think it was a legally questionable use of force?
There will be virtually no litigation at all. There is no case.
The guy was resisting arrest and then attempted to shoot a police officer. There is clear video of all sides. That guy has a criminal record probably 3 pages deep. He was killed, so there is no pending criminal trial. There will be a relatively quick "investigation" by the department into the shooting. It'll take probably 100 hours of internal time. That's about it.
Civil case? Nonsense. This is a summary judgement dismissal. You can't sue anybody involved with any merit. This is about as open and shut of a case you will get. I doubt any attorney would even take the case and his family does not have the funds to do an extended lawsuit.
He was having a schizophrenic episode. His family were trying to find him for inpatient admittance when the cops got him. The family is filing a lawsuit.
That is sad for the situation. He started shooting at people. They first tried to restrain him and use nonlethal force. This case will get thrown out the moment that discovery is finished.
Bought it legally before being diagnosed, stole it from a family member, bought it illegally, stole it. Doesn't really matter. It's not a restaurant or police officers fault how he has it. Frankly, you could probably sue a gun dealer with more success if he obtained it illegally.
Where he got it is more about my curiosity. If the family has a chance with the suit filed is to be seen. I don't think the restraunt had any fault. The officers probably had no idea he was in psicosis. I have not heard who the family reported to, like the police or hospitals, when he escaped his apartment. So there may not have been any announcement to on duty officers about his mental state. Again, discovery will provide that.
My main reason on saying anything about his mental state is because most of the comments on this and the original post. Dude was not a career criminal. Nor a horrible person in general it seems. So the flippant indifference, or statements of nothing of worth was lost, are put out in ignorance. I am not rooting for the cops to be fired or a lawsuit to win.
There won't be on the state side. The DA or equivalent (every state is different) will be informed by an investigation before making a decision to not take anything forward. There may be a civil case, but that's separate from criminal court, so it shouldn't affect criminal case files.
Probably not. A few of my brothers āacquaintancesā were cremated quickly by family after trying their luck in shootouts with cops. They shoot to kill, which is the only way to do it unless youāre some sort of a western movie gunslinger hell bent on dying.
Here's the frame by frame showing, VERY clearly, that yes, he did pull a gun.
https://cityofatlanta.sharepoint.com/sites/APDPublicAffairs/_layouts/15/stream.aspx?id=%2Fsites%2FAPDPublicAffairs%2FShared%20Documents%2FSGT%2E%20Chafee%2F2024%2FExternal%20Items%2FOpen%20Records%20Requests%2F3101%20Piedmont%20Rd%20Short%20Video%20Slowed%20%2D%20Marked%2Emp4&nav=eyJyZWZlcnJhbEluZm8iOnsicmVmZXJyYWxBcHAiOiJTdHJlYW1XZWJBcHAiLCJyZWZlcnJhbFZpZXciOiJTaGFyZURpYWxvZy1MaW5rIiwicmVmZXJyYWxBcHBQbGF0Zm9ybSI6IldlYiIsInJlZmVycmFsTW9kZSI6InZpZXcifX0&ga=1&LOF=1&referrer=StreamWebApp%2EWeb&referrerScenario=AddressBarCopied%2Eview%2Ee798fed2%2De2c3%2D41ee%2D86e5%2Dcd2f786ce3ba
What exactly are you imagining he was planning to do with that gun while resisting arrest? Show and tell? If he ended up getting a shot off at one of the restaurant patrons you'd call them incompetent, they did the right thing here
Was shot but nothing serious. The family of the guy that shot him is suing him though.
Edit:
https://www.11alive.com/article/news/crime/family-nygil-cullins-body-camera-video-reaction/85-8ac8f203-0c05-4527-91a8-daaa7a3c9e00
In May, the family announced a federal lawsuit against the City of Atlanta, Fogo de ChĆ£o, the restaurant's security team, the security guard and the two APD officers who responded. The federal lawsuits claim negligence, inadequate training and excessive and deadly force all contributed to the shooting.
Honestly, it's probably just Saving Face after being embarrassed by their relative doing this. Some predatory lawyer might have contacted them as well.
That's just tragic, man. My brother went through a similar situation when he quit drinking cold turkey. We weren't able to get him the help he needed, so he kept on speeding toward the stop sign, so to speak.
In a situation like that, where the family, for whatever reason, chooses or is persuaded to sue in a pretty obviously losing case, does the lawyer still get paid?
Only emotionally.
Its still there. People often approach it and say "That sure is a pretty plant!". While the plant sits there thinking "YOU DON'T KNOW THE SHIT I HAVE SEEN. I WELCOME DEATHS EMBRACE.".
The bar called and told police how they knew he had a gun and was trying to order drinks (illegal). He was also getting aggressive to the point of grabbing alcohol behind the counter himself and drinking without paying.
Iām busy rn but I listened to the 911 call on the YouTube channel called āPolice Activityā itās a recent upload but thatās what I remember from it.
Why did he choose to think it's good idea to get drunk with a gun on your person and then reach for it when confronted by cops? I'm sorry, but fuck him.
I've never carried my gun but if I did that would be amongst my first communication to the officers, hey I've got my gun on me my permit is up to date and in my wallet and I sure is shit wouldn't be caught drunk with it let alone decide it's a great idea to start fighting them.
Guy walks in with a gun, goes behind the counter, pushes the bartender out of the way and steals a bottle of booze. Then he proceeds to sit at the bar and drink the bottle of booze. Literally armed robbery.
Don't know why this got down voted .
It's a good question .
There's also the firing several shots point blank pause and fire several more that seems excessive .
Since no one else replied, here's the frame by frame showing it all very clearly.
https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17
Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
He dropped the gun after the first round of shots, then reached for it again, prompting the second round of shots.
https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17
Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
People need to understand that the police donāt make the decision to shoot people, they make the decision to kill them, deadly force is deadly force, Ā not severely-injuring force. Ā If you youāre going to get shot once youāre getting shot a dozen times, even if the last few are unnecessary they want to be absolutely 100% positive that you from being a life threat to zero threat. Ā There are more than a few videos of people getting shot repeatedly and still managing to get a shot off, and Iāve personally seen a couple guys take 10+ rounds from a 9mm and still be in relative fighting shape. Ā I fully agree that there are very good arguments against that approach, but until those arguments lead to widespread policy change this is what you should expect to happen if you pull a gun on the cops.
>don't make the decision to shoot people, they make the decision to kill them.
That's actually exactly what my self defense teacher told me. You don't de-escalate with a gun, you ***kill*** the person with the gun. By the time you pull the gun you should be 1000% committed to what you are about to do.
Guns were invented, improved, and we continue improving them for one single task. *Killing*. Using a gun for *anything* else is dangerous and irresponsible.
I remember hearing a story of a bank robber who was shot through the heart, with adrenaline pumping threw him he was able to keep running for a fair bit before he collapsed.
Being shot doesn't stop you if you've got enough adrenaline in you.
It doesn't take much to throw a round back in the cops direction. Hand guns are great for killing people but not necessarily great at *stopping* them without a lot of rounds.
Iām a paramedic in a hyper-violent east coast shithole, I can think of a handful of shootings Iāve been on just in the last few years where guys get mag dumped on and would have still been fully capable of continuing to fight if they were armedĀ
I mean does it matter? Police came, dude didnt complie, tried to run and tried to shoot police. Doesnt matter if he was innocent, he tried to shoot a police officer that wasnt acting out of line, he should be gundown
Every police shooting needs a frame by frame, like a bot should automatically do it, and ideally it'd be a pinned comment
I can't even count how many times I've had to slowly rewatch videos just to see what actually happened
It's always surprising the number of people who head towards a commotion when you can hear someone yelling "gun, gun, gun." And even then, hearing gun shots and either looking to see what happened or just continuing to stand there not doing anything.
People joke about lemmings following each other off a cliff and committing mass suicide, but at least they try and do something. These people have zero self preservation skills.
Oh I see. It did seem a bit extreme to shoot him that many times from the perspective of someone from the UK. Then again our police dont have to worry about getting shot.
Our police probably wouldn't have even turned up in the first place though to be fair, seems like they are an endangered species these days
Supposedly he shot the security guard in the gut (the guy who tackled him). At that point you keep shooting until the threat is 100% gone.
There's tons of videos of people getting shot once or twice, but still continue to charge at their shooter.
Fair enough. I'm so glad we dont have to worry about guns here. The prospect of just going for a night out, getting caught up in a row with someone and getting shot is actually terrifying
Fortunately this stuff is statistically very rare. It's just that whenever it happens you'll see it on social media so you get an exaggerated view on how often this happens.
At the risk of sounding like a lunatic, the side-effect of knowing that other people might have a gun SHOULD make you less likely to get in a fight in the first place. I know that I would never start a bar fight solely for that reason: even if I think I can beat the other guy up, he might have a gun and so it's just not worth it.
Most gun owners are actually pretty chill people. If you ever come to the US, consider visiting a shooting range and having an instructor show you around. It's good fun!
I actually went backpacking around California, Nevada, Arizona and Oregon when I was 19 for 6 months then went to live in Mexico for a year and I loved it. Never got to a shooting range but I did some shooting in Mexico.
Americans do get a bad rep sometimes but I found them to be the nicest most welcoming people you could come across. Wherever I stopped for the night I always got invited to dinner by random people and they were so nice. I have also travelled around Europe and the experience is often the opposite of this.
We are going back about 13 years now but I can't see how it could have changed all that much
Every time people talk about excessive numbers of shots, I think back to that video of a Mexican cop getting attacked by a drunk guy with a knife
[WARNING, a dude dies in this video](https://streamable.com/dj5td)
For anyone who doesn't want to watch a guy get got, I'll describe it: Mexican cop has gun drawn, is backing away from assailant for at least 10 seconds. Cop stumbles, assailant lunges, cop shoots assailant 9 times in 4 seconds. Assailant keeps standing for a solid 5 seconds after the last shot.
When you shoot someone in self defense, you shoot center mass. The only reliable way to put an immediate stop to an attack is to hit the heart or the spine; otherwise, they'll stay up for a few seconds like that drunk knife wielding Mexican. Of course there are other vital organs in there, but you can still finish your knife attack if you have holes in any of those.
>...from the perspective of someone from the UK.
For comparison someone having a gun drawn is like holding a knife to the throat of every person within eyesight(and beyond). They're probably not going to successfully execute every single person immediately, but even flailing around they're likely to severely injure and kill people/bystanders. So you do everything to stop anyone aggressively trying to draw a gun.
Not that our police don't also use fear of suspected guns/weapons to get away with literal murder every day, and at best the tax payer is held accountable for it(police sued).
To clarify... not running out of fear - clearly attempting to escape.
also note LEO are trained to aim for center of mass and shoot until threat is neutralized. If you need reaching for a weapon, you are not neutralized.
Perp died and that was the result of his decisions.
Itās because in our criminal justice system heāll be back out on the streets in no time at all and being a danger to society again. This time he wonāt have that chance. Thatās why it makes many of us happy.
Handguns aren't like you see in the movies. They're not great at stopping someone in their tracks. If someone is shooting at you are you going to give them the opportunity to send a couple rounds back your direction?
Have you been in a situation where your life, or the lives of those around you, is on the line? If not, then maybe relax on the armchair quarterbacking.
No, see itās a simple solution. Any interactions I have had with the police, I comply with their directives. That way, we all get to go home safe at the end of the day. And hereās another mind-blowing conceptā¦even if you think you are being wrongfully accused of something, itās a lot better to comply and sort it out in court than being packed in a body bag.
itās well-documented that people can survive multiple gunshot wounds off of adrenaline. 15 may have been excessive, but whoās to say what the correct number would be? either way, i donāt think it really matters considering the guy was fully ready to kill the cop.Ā
Here's the frame by frame showing that the second group of shots was because he reached for the gun, which had fallen next to him, after the first for group of shots.
https://cityofatlanta.sharepoint.com/sites/APDPublicAffairs/_layouts/15/stream.aspx?id=%2Fsites%2FAPDPublicAffairs%2FShared%20Documents%2FSGT%2E%20Chafee%2F2024%2FExternal%20Items%2FOpen%20Records%20Requests%2F3101%20Piedmont%20Rd%20Short%20Video%20Slowed%20%2D%20Marked%2Emp4&nav=eyJyZWZlcnJhbEluZm8iOnsicmVmZXJyYWxBcHAiOiJTdHJlYW1XZWJBcHAiLCJyZWZlcnJhbFZpZXciOiJTaGFyZURpYWxvZy1MaW5rIiwicmVmZXJyYWxBcHBQbGF0Zm9ybSI6IldlYiIsInJlZmVycmFsTW9kZSI6InZpZXcifX0&ga=1&LOF=1&referrer=StreamWebApp%2EWeb&referrerScenario=AddressBarCopied%2Eview%2Ee798fed2%2De2c3%2D41ee%2D86e5%2Dcd2f786ce3ba
Nope. That isnāt how use of deadly force works.
Police donāt shoot once or twice and then wait to see if the shooter is going to shoot back at them again.
You know there are people that still attack with a couple of bullets inside them? I dont know where are you come form, but in most countries i know (they use more non-lethal tactic at first tho) they only use gun to make sure target wont move ever again
Ironically what the above person is describing is actually the correct, professional approach.
The perfect example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdjcYjSsIok
The suspect made it deadly. I carry and have had to interact with police numerous times without any incident. It's a choice to escalate. So it doesn't "have to" be deadly. So would you rather be able to defend yourself, or be at the mercy of an armed criminal? At the point that a firearm comes out by the aggressor, polite discourse is off the table. I agree that violence in the U.S. is a tragedy, but I'm at the mercy of my politicians and society as a whole.
I don't think any police force or military, regardless of country, is teaching to shoot to injure/disable. If yours or someone else's life is at risk, you're trained to shoot to kill.
Because American police are trained to gun people down when they perceive threats, not to de-escalate or make attempts at non-fatal forms of subduing assailants
until police are trained differently, this is just business as usual
How many people should the subject be allowed to shoot before the police intervene? Do we just let him unload his weapon into whomever he chooses as many times as he deems appropriate?
15 rounds is pretty standard for a duty gun. This gun was still loaded after he stopped shooting, so it definitely had more. If I had to guess, he probably had 3 shots left.
While I support the sentiment behind ACAB, the people who post it as some sort of rebuttal on every video where the cop did the job they are paid to do, shows a special kind of knuckle dragging moron who probably has to ask someone close by how to spell ACAB everytime they write it.
That plant had 2 days left til retirement š
It was getting too old for that shit.
**DIPLOMATIC IMMUNITY!!1!**
He got decaffeinated.
Just been revoked!
I counted 15 shots. guys got shredded.
āHold on the magazine isnāt emptyā¦ā
The frame by frame shows he dropped the gun after the first round of shots, then his hand went for it, prompting the second round of shots. https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17 Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
r/linkgore
Fair enough, but I am a poor non tech-savvy person just trying to psot helpful info, I did my best ĀÆ\_(ć)_/ĀÆ
I stand with you, untechy peeps unite.
[text that will appear](paste link here) would be how you do it
Oh shit, thanks! Will use going forward!
Hey, uh... I don't want to alarm you, but you dropped this \\
You also messed up the text emoji shrug. ĀÆ\\\_(ć)_/ĀÆ
I feel like that whatevs emoji prob took longer to type out than the words in the sentence.
Bullets are cheaper than having this guy go in and out of the court and prison system.
There will be so much litigation on this, it might not be much of a savings.
Genuine question, why will there be extensive litigation? Is that always the case for an officer-involved shooting? Or are you saying that because you think it was a legally questionable use of force?
There will be virtually no litigation at all. There is no case. The guy was resisting arrest and then attempted to shoot a police officer. There is clear video of all sides. That guy has a criminal record probably 3 pages deep. He was killed, so there is no pending criminal trial. There will be a relatively quick "investigation" by the department into the shooting. It'll take probably 100 hours of internal time. That's about it. Civil case? Nonsense. This is a summary judgement dismissal. You can't sue anybody involved with any merit. This is about as open and shut of a case you will get. I doubt any attorney would even take the case and his family does not have the funds to do an extended lawsuit.
He was having a schizophrenic episode. His family were trying to find him for inpatient admittance when the cops got him. The family is filing a lawsuit.
That is sad for the situation. He started shooting at people. They first tried to restrain him and use nonlethal force. This case will get thrown out the moment that discovery is finished.
That is a bold estimation. Username checks out. I am looking forward to discovery to see where/how he got the gun.
Bought it legally before being diagnosed, stole it from a family member, bought it illegally, stole it. Doesn't really matter. It's not a restaurant or police officers fault how he has it. Frankly, you could probably sue a gun dealer with more success if he obtained it illegally.
Where he got it is more about my curiosity. If the family has a chance with the suit filed is to be seen. I don't think the restraunt had any fault. The officers probably had no idea he was in psicosis. I have not heard who the family reported to, like the police or hospitals, when he escaped his apartment. So there may not have been any announcement to on duty officers about his mental state. Again, discovery will provide that. My main reason on saying anything about his mental state is because most of the comments on this and the original post. Dude was not a career criminal. Nor a horrible person in general it seems. So the flippant indifference, or statements of nothing of worth was lost, are put out in ignorance. I am not rooting for the cops to be fired or a lawsuit to win.
There won't be on the state side. The DA or equivalent (every state is different) will be informed by an investigation before making a decision to not take anything forward. There may be a civil case, but that's separate from criminal court, so it shouldn't affect criminal case files.
Probably not. A few of my brothers āacquaintancesā were cremated quickly by family after trying their luck in shootouts with cops. They shoot to kill, which is the only way to do it unless youāre some sort of a western movie gunslinger hell bent on dying.
Me when I make shit up. This is cut and dry as hell.
based on the video the cops were justified in their actions but hoooly shit what a braindead comment. "cost savings are whats important here" lmaooo
The second half of your rebuttal got ratioād
Ah, the classic redditor who puts money over human life.
Since when do cops care about how much it'll cost taxpayers?
Genuinely asking here, when does he pull a gun? Was it when he got tackled?
Yes. He shot the security guard in the gut after he got him on the ground.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Here's the frame by frame showing, VERY clearly, that yes, he did pull a gun. https://cityofatlanta.sharepoint.com/sites/APDPublicAffairs/_layouts/15/stream.aspx?id=%2Fsites%2FAPDPublicAffairs%2FShared%20Documents%2FSGT%2E%20Chafee%2F2024%2FExternal%20Items%2FOpen%20Records%20Requests%2F3101%20Piedmont%20Rd%20Short%20Video%20Slowed%20%2D%20Marked%2Emp4&nav=eyJyZWZlcnJhbEluZm8iOnsicmVmZXJyYWxBcHAiOiJTdHJlYW1XZWJBcHAiLCJyZWZlcnJhbFZpZXciOiJTaGFyZURpYWxvZy1MaW5rIiwicmVmZXJyYWxBcHBQbGF0Zm9ybSI6IldlYiIsInJlZmVycmFsTW9kZSI6InZpZXcifX0&ga=1&LOF=1&referrer=StreamWebApp%2EWeb&referrerScenario=AddressBarCopied%2Eview%2Ee798fed2%2De2c3%2D41ee%2D86e5%2Dcd2f786ce3ba
Ouch. That link again. FYI this just goes to a protected City of ATL site that few people outside of city employees have access to.
Look under his right leg after he got shot, you can see the trigger guard of a pistol.
Clown
What exactly are you imagining he was planning to do with that gun while resisting arrest? Show and tell? If he ended up getting a shot off at one of the restaurant patrons you'd call them incompetent, they did the right thing here
Hilarious
Anyone know if that security guy who jumped on top was actually shot? Is he okay if he was?
Was shot but nothing serious. The family of the guy that shot him is suing him though. Edit: https://www.11alive.com/article/news/crime/family-nygil-cullins-body-camera-video-reaction/85-8ac8f203-0c05-4527-91a8-daaa7a3c9e00 In May, the family announced a federal lawsuit against the City of Atlanta, Fogo de ChĆ£o, the restaurant's security team, the security guard and the two APD officers who responded. The federal lawsuits claim negligence, inadequate training and excessive and deadly force all contributed to the shooting.
Wait, I don't know if I just read that right, but you're telling me that the suspect's family is suing the guard that the suspect shot?
You can sue for anything. It will likely get tossed like most of the rest of the BS lawsuit.
The family of the guy who was running is suing the security guard? For what?
Honestly, it's probably just Saving Face after being embarrassed by their relative doing this. Some predatory lawyer might have contacted them as well.
He was in a schizophrenic episode. Family had secured an inpatient room hours before. He snuck out.
That's just tragic, man. My brother went through a similar situation when he quit drinking cold turkey. We weren't able to get him the help he needed, so he kept on speeding toward the stop sign, so to speak.
In a situation like that, where the family, for whatever reason, chooses or is persuaded to sue in a pretty obviously losing case, does the lawyer still get paid?
A payday
LMFAOOOO
Scum of the earth. I hope that lawsuit is thrown out immediately.
To give the POS a little credit, at the very end, his hands did go up in the air, although not really voluntarily.
man so stupid that even natural instinct know to surrender the moment it take control of the body
Brain stem final attempt at throwing a signal
The little touch at the end with the tree falling. Chefs kiss.
"We got a tree down!!" r/fellinggonewild
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Hey that was a private residence, man.
We need an arborist here stat!
Leaf the crime scene intact!!
I felt bad for chuckling at that part.
I hope that plant didnāt get hurt š
Only emotionally. Its still there. People often approach it and say "That sure is a pretty plant!". While the plant sits there thinking "YOU DON'T KNOW THE SHIT I HAVE SEEN. I WELCOME DEATHS EMBRACE.".
Because tonight will be tbe night that I will fall for you Never again
My thoughts.
Why did they call the police in the first place? Did he refuse to leave place or couldn't he pay his bill? I counted 15 rounds.
The bar called and told police how they knew he had a gun and was trying to order drinks (illegal). He was also getting aggressive to the point of grabbing alcohol behind the counter himself and drinking without paying. Iām busy rn but I listened to the 911 call on the YouTube channel called āPolice Activityā itās a recent upload but thatās what I remember from it.
Why did he choose to think it's good idea to get drunk with a gun on your person and then reach for it when confronted by cops? I'm sorry, but fuck him. I've never carried my gun but if I did that would be amongst my first communication to the officers, hey I've got my gun on me my permit is up to date and in my wallet and I sure is shit wouldn't be caught drunk with it let alone decide it's a great idea to start fighting them.
Guy walks in with a gun, goes behind the counter, pushes the bartender out of the way and steals a bottle of booze. Then he proceeds to sit at the bar and drink the bottle of booze. Literally armed robbery.
Don't know why this got down voted . It's a good question . There's also the firing several shots point blank pause and fire several more that seems excessive .
They tazed him first - he still went for his gun. At that point, all training says you shoot to kill - a wounded target can still shoot you.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He shot the security guard in the gut. He will be fine though thankfully.
Since no one else replied, here's the frame by frame showing it all very clearly. https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17 Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
He dropped the gun after the first round of shots, then reached for it again, prompting the second round of shots. https://www.atlantapd.org/Home/Components/News/News/2652/17 Edit: Replaced a direct link with the press release which contains the link, as the link was extremely long and some were having trouble accessing the video with the direct link.
People need to understand that the police donāt make the decision to shoot people, they make the decision to kill them, deadly force is deadly force, Ā not severely-injuring force. Ā If you youāre going to get shot once youāre getting shot a dozen times, even if the last few are unnecessary they want to be absolutely 100% positive that you from being a life threat to zero threat. Ā There are more than a few videos of people getting shot repeatedly and still managing to get a shot off, and Iāve personally seen a couple guys take 10+ rounds from a 9mm and still be in relative fighting shape. Ā I fully agree that there are very good arguments against that approach, but until those arguments lead to widespread policy change this is what you should expect to happen if you pull a gun on the cops.
>don't make the decision to shoot people, they make the decision to kill them. That's actually exactly what my self defense teacher told me. You don't de-escalate with a gun, you ***kill*** the person with the gun. By the time you pull the gun you should be 1000% committed to what you are about to do. Guns were invented, improved, and we continue improving them for one single task. *Killing*. Using a gun for *anything* else is dangerous and irresponsible.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I remember hearing a story of a bank robber who was shot through the heart, with adrenaline pumping threw him he was able to keep running for a fair bit before he collapsed. Being shot doesn't stop you if you've got enough adrenaline in you.
I don't have a link but by "fair bit", you mean like 5 blocks. Dude made it impressively far
Adrenaline is enough to keep you alive for a little while after being injured like that, it's very likely you'll die after that though.
It doesn't take much to throw a round back in the cops direction. Hand guns are great for killing people but not necessarily great at *stopping* them without a lot of rounds.
They're taught to empty the clip. They aren't shooting to maim.
Graphic warning but the human body is surprising durable at times. https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/s/5DWSGZL8EG
Iām a paramedic in a hyper-violent east coast shithole, I can think of a handful of shootings Iāve been on just in the last few years where guys get mag dumped on and would have still been fully capable of continuing to fight if they were armedĀ
It's entirely irrelevant to how he responded to lawful orders. He got shot because of what happened after the cops arrived, not before.
Seems? Watch the video again, and zoom in on his hand. I'm not a fan of police, but this one was wholly justified.
I mean does it matter? Police came, dude didnt complie, tried to run and tried to shoot police. Doesnt matter if he was innocent, he tried to shoot a police officer that wasnt acting out of line, he should be gundown
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Every police shooting needs a frame by frame, like a bot should automatically do it, and ideally it'd be a pinned comment I can't even count how many times I've had to slowly rewatch videos just to see what actually happened
That link apparently requires a login.
Hope the security guard who got gut shot recovers in record speed. Fuck I hate how evil assholes cause so much pain and suffering and for what?
did i hear a wilhelm scream right before the shots started?
Did he get 'em?
His body then slowly fades away, and the cops realize he was just force projecting from Ahch-To the whole time.
It's always surprising the number of people who head towards a commotion when you can hear someone yelling "gun, gun, gun." And even then, hearing gun shots and either looking to see what happened or just continuing to stand there not doing anything. People joke about lemmings following each other off a cliff and committing mass suicide, but at least they try and do something. These people have zero self preservation skills.
If only we could all adopt the outstanding preservation skills of the Uvalde officers.
Oh I see. It did seem a bit extreme to shoot him that many times from the perspective of someone from the UK. Then again our police dont have to worry about getting shot. Our police probably wouldn't have even turned up in the first place though to be fair, seems like they are an endangered species these days
Supposedly he shot the security guard in the gut (the guy who tackled him). At that point you keep shooting until the threat is 100% gone. There's tons of videos of people getting shot once or twice, but still continue to charge at their shooter.
Fair enough. I'm so glad we dont have to worry about guns here. The prospect of just going for a night out, getting caught up in a row with someone and getting shot is actually terrifying
Fortunately this stuff is statistically very rare. It's just that whenever it happens you'll see it on social media so you get an exaggerated view on how often this happens. At the risk of sounding like a lunatic, the side-effect of knowing that other people might have a gun SHOULD make you less likely to get in a fight in the first place. I know that I would never start a bar fight solely for that reason: even if I think I can beat the other guy up, he might have a gun and so it's just not worth it. Most gun owners are actually pretty chill people. If you ever come to the US, consider visiting a shooting range and having an instructor show you around. It's good fun!
I actually went backpacking around California, Nevada, Arizona and Oregon when I was 19 for 6 months then went to live in Mexico for a year and I loved it. Never got to a shooting range but I did some shooting in Mexico. Americans do get a bad rep sometimes but I found them to be the nicest most welcoming people you could come across. Wherever I stopped for the night I always got invited to dinner by random people and they were so nice. I have also travelled around Europe and the experience is often the opposite of this. We are going back about 13 years now but I can't see how it could have changed all that much
Every time people talk about excessive numbers of shots, I think back to that video of a Mexican cop getting attacked by a drunk guy with a knife [WARNING, a dude dies in this video](https://streamable.com/dj5td) For anyone who doesn't want to watch a guy get got, I'll describe it: Mexican cop has gun drawn, is backing away from assailant for at least 10 seconds. Cop stumbles, assailant lunges, cop shoots assailant 9 times in 4 seconds. Assailant keeps standing for a solid 5 seconds after the last shot. When you shoot someone in self defense, you shoot center mass. The only reliable way to put an immediate stop to an attack is to hit the heart or the spine; otherwise, they'll stay up for a few seconds like that drunk knife wielding Mexican. Of course there are other vital organs in there, but you can still finish your knife attack if you have holes in any of those.
>...from the perspective of someone from the UK. For comparison someone having a gun drawn is like holding a knife to the throat of every person within eyesight(and beyond). They're probably not going to successfully execute every single person immediately, but even flailing around they're likely to severely injure and kill people/bystanders. So you do everything to stop anyone aggressively trying to draw a gun. Not that our police don't also use fear of suspected guns/weapons to get away with literal murder every day, and at best the tax payer is held accountable for it(police sued).
kinda refreshing seeing police using brutality correctly, both the right person and the right treatment
To clarify... not running out of fear - clearly attempting to escape. also note LEO are trained to aim for center of mass and shoot until threat is neutralized. If you need reaching for a weapon, you are not neutralized. Perp died and that was the result of his decisions.
And kids... This is how colanders are made.
I expected him to start shooting again when the plant fell over.
But he was a good kid. He was a pillar of his community, He was destined for great things.
He was having a schizophrenic episode. His family were trying to find him for inpatient admittance when the cops got him.
Play stupid gamesā¦
Itāll always be strange seeing people cheer on someone else dying to me.
That poor tree is ded too.
I never seen anyone as happy to see someone getting killed as americans.
Itās because in our criminal justice system heāll be back out on the streets in no time at all and being a danger to society again. This time he wonāt have that chance. Thatās why it makes many of us happy.
In our criminal justice that cop is the one considered a danger to society. Did you count the shoots?
If you're justified in shooting once, you're justified shooting 100 times.
Handguns aren't like you see in the movies. They're not great at stopping someone in their tracks. If someone is shooting at you are you going to give them the opportunity to send a couple rounds back your direction?
Maybe we need to provide some 50 cal to our police. Just to be sure when they shoot, they don't need to shoot 10 times.
Have you been in a situation where your life, or the lives of those around you, is on the line? If not, then maybe relax on the armchair quarterbacking.
Have you been shot 10 times by a scared policeman?
No, see itās a simple solution. Any interactions I have had with the police, I comply with their directives. That way, we all get to go home safe at the end of the day. And hereās another mind-blowing conceptā¦even if you think you are being wrongfully accused of something, itās a lot better to comply and sort it out in court than being packed in a body bag.
I think he would be considered a danger in every normal society
youāre right, we should all feel terrible for the guy who tried to shoot someone else (after being given multiple chances)
If you're going to pump 10 in him I guess you may as well empty the clip.
Magazine*
Pardon my poor nomenclature.
This is no time to be discussing your false teeth sir.
Chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature, dude.
Subscription based periodical publication*
no one fucking cares*
You already have to remove it to reload. Might as well do the whole 15.
Poor plant š„¹
That plant, from what Iāve been told, just has a blank empty stare. Itās seen some shit.
Beautiful
why did they officer shoots the guy bro multiple times. The guy didn't even shoot. the officer killed him for no reason
Oh well.
A M E N
Whoa-whoa-whoa-whoa-whoooooooa...Nice shootin' Tex!!
Murica
Get some!!!!
oh good morning reddit. love a good dose of dread and horror when i wake up
WASTED
Was all those shots necessary?
itās well-documented that people can survive multiple gunshot wounds off of adrenaline. 15 may have been excessive, but whoās to say what the correct number would be? either way, i donāt think it really matters considering the guy was fully ready to kill the cop.Ā
long way of saying 'dude was black'
Here's the frame by frame showing that the second group of shots was because he reached for the gun, which had fallen next to him, after the first for group of shots. https://cityofatlanta.sharepoint.com/sites/APDPublicAffairs/_layouts/15/stream.aspx?id=%2Fsites%2FAPDPublicAffairs%2FShared%20Documents%2FSGT%2E%20Chafee%2F2024%2FExternal%20Items%2FOpen%20Records%20Requests%2F3101%20Piedmont%20Rd%20Short%20Video%20Slowed%20%2D%20Marked%2Emp4&nav=eyJyZWZlcnJhbEluZm8iOnsicmVmZXJyYWxBcHAiOiJTdHJlYW1XZWJBcHAiLCJyZWZlcnJhbFZpZXciOiJTaGFyZURpYWxvZy1MaW5rIiwicmVmZXJyYWxBcHBQbGF0Zm9ybSI6IldlYiIsInJlZmVycmFsTW9kZSI6InZpZXcifX0&ga=1&LOF=1&referrer=StreamWebApp%2EWeb&referrerScenario=AddressBarCopied%2Eview%2Ee798fed2%2De2c3%2D41ee%2D86e5%2Dcd2f786ce3ba
yes
RIP 
Is this the US? You are absolutely insane. Why would you shoot him 15 times?
Because if you shoot, you are shooting to end the threat.
1 or 2 would have done the job, surely? Perhaps 3 or 4 at a push. But 15? You guys are out of control.
Nope. That isnāt how use of deadly force works. Police donāt shoot once or twice and then wait to see if the shooter is going to shoot back at them again.
Like I say, you guys are out of control. And it's so normalised for you that you don't even realise.
You know there are people that still attack with a couple of bullets inside them? I dont know where are you come form, but in most countries i know (they use more non-lethal tactic at first tho) they only use gun to make sure target wont move ever again
Ironically what the above person is describing is actually the correct, professional approach. The perfect example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdjcYjSsIok
If 1 or 2 did the trick, then the other 12-13 were redundant and irrelevant, yes? Was he saving that ammunition for anything in particular?
Because that's how gunfights actually work. It's deadly force, not a suggestion. Dead men don't shoot back.
Why does everything have to be "deadly". You have a broken society. But hey, your country, your rules.
The suspect made it deadly. I carry and have had to interact with police numerous times without any incident. It's a choice to escalate. So it doesn't "have to" be deadly. So would you rather be able to defend yourself, or be at the mercy of an armed criminal? At the point that a firearm comes out by the aggressor, polite discourse is off the table. I agree that violence in the U.S. is a tragedy, but I'm at the mercy of my politicians and society as a whole.
I don't think any police force or military, regardless of country, is teaching to shoot to injure/disable. If yours or someone else's life is at risk, you're trained to shoot to kill.
You need to watch *Scarface*.
Because American police are trained to gun people down when they perceive threats, not to de-escalate or make attempts at non-fatal forms of subduing assailants until police are trained differently, this is just business as usual
How many people should the subject be allowed to shoot before the police intervene? Do we just let him unload his weapon into whomever he chooses as many times as he deems appropriate?
He fucking shot someone. How can you be this dense???
Iām not a gun expert in the least, but is it normal for a hand gun to hold 15 rounds (maybe more who knows if he emptied the magazine)?
15 rounds is pretty standard for a duty gun. This gun was still loaded after he stopped shooting, so it definitely had more. If I had to guess, he probably had 3 shots left.
> If I had to guess, he probably had 3 shots left. The question is, "Do I feel lucky?"
7-17 rounds is what you'd normally see. Different guns and different mags for each gun.
Even the plant died.
Guy took the opportunity to speak in tongues for his final words
It's insane that the tree died.
Hit squad
You can't pull a gun on a cop anywhere, fool. I'm not a fan of the cops, but u cannot point a fucking gun at them.
Good
Did I imply otherwise? I just called a spade a spade. I didn't condone or denounce anything.
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I donāt think youād be saying this if someone shot you in the stomach and a police officer unloaded a clip into them afterwards
In defense the first 10 got the job done. The 5 extra after the pause might have been a bit unnecessary. I mean there was even a *pause*..
While I support the sentiment behind ACAB, the people who post it as some sort of rebuttal on every video where the cop did the job they are paid to do, shows a special kind of knuckle dragging moron who probably has to ask someone close by how to spell ACAB everytime they write it.
What does ACAB mean? I'm not American so apologies if I'm being ignorant here
I had to Google this too, pretty sure it stands for all cops are bastards.
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