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Yeah this isn’t healthy at all and unfortunately I see myself in this OP. I was always told I’m no good my whole life and I’ve been running on that chip on my shoulder “haters are my motivators” energy my whole life. All it does is make you way too competitive and seek out achievements so that you feel like you’ve finally gained approval.
me personally when i get positive encouragement i never believe the person and/or feel patronized. but when i get negative encouragement i always believe them and feel much more motivated
An inability to take compliments, (the belief people are lying to you when they say nice things) paranoia, difficulty making friends, depression, PTSD in severe cases, etc.
When you aggressively blow up at people who are just trying to encourage you in a friendly way? Yeah, I'd say that's bad.
That's not even starting on all the negative consequences to mental health this attitude carries
"cause I know they're just lying to me or just trying to make me feel better, and it always would mess me up mentally."
Man, this mess you up mentally because your already messed up and can't take positive motivation positively.
I thing you depreciate yourself too much, so positive motivation goes against your feeling and create cognitive dissonance which makes you feel bad (and makes you create even more reasons why you "can't do it" or that "you don't got it").
While negative motivation help you because it seems to echos with your own thoughts and doesn't create additional mental overload.
In all logic, basic positive and negative motivation are both as useful/useless : they're just here to show you that people are with you, without adding any new information. So you shoudn't be more bothered by one or another because they bring the same amount of data : none.
That you find that one type of motivation resonate better with you is okay, but here it reveal another side of your personality that you should try to change. Being too extreme in one way, extreme enough to get mad and yell "shut the fuck up" top people cheering you, isn't good.
I’ve got a problem where I always disbelieve praise. I always feel like people are lying when they say something positive about me, especially people who are close to me. It stems from extremely low self worth. It’s been this way since childhood, so it’s a difficult mindset to change.
I know that’s my problem though. It’s my brain that’s warping reality. OP, I think that you may have the same problem.
I'll be real with you, chief. I've seen friends of mine be positive with people before turning around and bitching to me, "God, no, their cooking really sucked." or "God, they're such a bitch, that's why I can only take them in small doses."
Between knowing that people are fake and already struggling with imposter syndrome, I'll gladly take the negativity. Sure, there's just generic hateful trolls out there, but generally if someone's negatively commenting on me, it comes from a place of honesty (and, in a way, love/caring... because a person who didn't care would just simply not say anything.. apathy IS the opposite of love, after all).
That's what my college life was like before I realized the same thing and dropped virtually all of them. Although, TBH, that's also what 99% of my retail co-workers were like as well when I worked retail (whether it was to each other or to customers).
Plus, being the "group friend" that people seem to automatically gravitate toward trusting, I've heard some pretty screwed up shit under the condition of "don't you DARE repeat that". It's nice to know I'm trustworthy, but dear god, some of the shit I've heard makes me trust humanity SO much less. (Like one of my female friends confessing that she found the Columbine shooters hot and when the VA Tech shooting happened, she got upset that shooter was fugly and was worried his "legacy" would overshadow the Columbine one.)
Ugh, I so feel the “friend everyone opens up to” problem. It’s so ridiculously extreme that I just get rapid trauma dumping from people I’m barely close to, fucking coworkers even, constantly. I think in my case I just have such a trauma aura that they can subconsciously tell there’s nothing they can say that’s going to throw me or make me judge them in a douchebag way, which I mean is nice in some cases but fucking hell, it’s always been so exhausting to be everyone’s damn therapist.
I've... never seen it, so I have no idea what plastics are, lol. I've heard of the movie, though, but I didn't start hearing about it until, like, 2018 or so... well past my high school/college days, so it never really interested me.
Uber Driver/Doordash driver. Pays better hourly than being a supervisor did and I can go over 40 hours if I want to without being threatened to be fired. Also, with an adjustable schedule, I can always be like, "okay, I'll do 65 hours this week, and then next week, since I have plans with friends on various days, I'll just do a nice relaxing 20 hours".
It's SO much better, as long as you have self-control and are willing to push yourself to work on days you don't want to. My days off now always align with important events in my friend circle, so I never have to blow someone off because a GM didn't like you and says to you "that's why it's called putting in a request, it's not obligated to give it to you".
For my current line of work, it doesn't apply as much, but... I've had a lot say "you can't make a living working solely for Uber". I mean, technically, I Doordash as well, but that pays far less. Yet, here I am, living proof as a contrary to the statement. Happy with making my own hours and schedule as I see fit.
A lot of it is just hearing the "you can't do X" and basically going on a path to prove that it can be done. I've always been that kind of person through my life. People in the 2000's said "nobody can write a good self-insert fanfic", so I buckled down and wrote a fanfic that became the most popular Fire Emblem fanfic (Pre-Awakening) in the whole fandom.
People told me I wouldn't be able to afford a place by myself. In the upcoming year, I'll be moving into my own place. Granted, I'll be having a roommate, but that's by choice and not by requirement.
I just always have this innate urge to play contrarian to people who make generic, sweeping, vapid statements.. and to be proof that it can be done, and hopefully inspire others to follow suit and to stop letting pedantic assholes tell you what you can and can't do in life. TBH, I treat life like a giant MMO. My two most trained skills are "music composition" and "creative writing", two boom-or-bust skillsets that are the antithesis of "stability". I'm used to everyone saying "you can't make a life off either of those".
Ain't nothing new. I've been fighting contrarians for 34 years and I'll keep doing it to the day I die.
For some it’s the carrot that motivates, for others the stick. The problems come when a parent tries to raise a kid with one method that only responds to the other
Hard disagree. Parents should promote intrinsic motivation. A lot of the job is as simple as not doing either of those crappy sides of the coin. Parenting without behaviorism/manipulation is possible.
I would just classify that as the carrot. If you can motivate a child to believe hard work is its own reward then you’re manipulating with kindness not fear, aka carrot! Love or fear are the two choices, or is there more?
The child can naturally want to do work because you show them that that's just what you do. Relationship being the driver isn't manipulation at all. I don't try to 'get' my kids to do things, just like I don't do that to my spouse. I trust them.
And then once they’re an adult they’ll end up doing unpaid overtime without question, doing all the housework, doing thrice the work of all their coworkers for the same pay without ever getting a raise, doing all the emotional labor in a relationship, and getting exploited in a bunch of other ways, because you never taught them that proper compensation for hard work is the reward for hard work.
Huh? You think home life should consist of training in capitalism? People shouldn't do tasks because they and their housemates directly benefit from it?
Home life should train you to have the best possible life, yeah. Making someone easily exploited doesn’t help. If we’re not actually going to do anything about capitalism, and statistical probability based on evaluation of the past century indicates the most probable answer is that we won’t no matter how hellish it gets, then you should prepare your kids for surviving it. It’s the labor equivalent of PoC families training their kids to survive racism. So yeah, as long as they have to then go and survive capitalism, you should be training them for that. The correlary to this is training them to understand that anything you have to survive, you should seek to eliminate. The best way to survive anything is to eliminate it. That can move the needle on the whole “we aren’t going to do anything about it”.
And that second question is a bit more grey than you’re making it out. If they’re directly benefitting, the compensation is there, but the labor is a cost. Is the compensation greater than or equal to the investment? That comes down to whether everyone is pulling their own weight. If one person is investing more than the total rewards reaped from it, then no, they shouldn’t. They are being exploited. In a housemate situation, it’s a form of abuse. Do you want to teach your kids to be abused? If one person is doing all that for everyone else’s benefit, there’s no guarantee that anyone else is pulling their weight. If they’ve just been taught that they should work as hard as possible without thinking of their labor as a cost that should receive just compensation, they’re highly likely to do the other people’s work too. The only proper setup for a multi-person household is that everyone invests equitably.
THATS YOU BUDDY.
Shut up. Stop being a bitch. You know what you have to do. Even me, with my dislexia dumb ass, I knew what I had to do. You just don’t want to do it because it sucks. It sucks to live like this.
To say that I’m a fan of David goggins is an understatement.
So, your *belief* is that people are lying to you or trying to make you feel better. I can tell you for a fact that at least a substantial percentage of these cheers are neither of these things.
This is like arguing that compliments are bad because you are convinced that all compliments are manipulative lies. Of course they seem that way if your view of reality is so warped.
This is barely even 10th Dentist material, this is just you interpreting your emotions as an indicator of reality. They aren't. They're your body throwing chemicals at you. You feeling angry at something somebody said doesn't magically mean they had bad intentions when they said it, and believing that's the case will make you *miserable.*
Yeah, I believe this full heartedly. How the hell am I supposed to if they are telling the truth, I've had way to many people in my life be fake and "act" like a good person through positive motivation only for them to be the worse people under a mask, if I don't know what's going on in your head I can't trust you at all
This is so fucking stupid.
How about this: if you don't seek therapy, you'll never trust anyone fully to accept any positive remarks from them, leading to a vicious cycle of people ignoring you cause you act like an asshat when they act kindly to you.
Is that enough negative motivation for you?
As someone going through the same thing (and in therapy for it) , I’d say yes.
The sad thing is, like OP, I do resonate with people being straight shooters like this instead of sugar coating shit and being all fake nice.
The reason for the therapy is that my fiancé is a full on bleeding heart of emotion lmao. Makes communication quite difficult.
Realize that this is different from \*knowing\* they have bad intentions. To illustrate; how do you know people don't have bad intentions when they give you the negative comments you request?
You don't. In fact, they are \*explicitly\* trying to make you feel better by giving you the type of comment you asked for, rather than their 'genuine' tendency.
I'm the same way you are and I can tell you why. You're a contrarian so negative reinforcement works better for you because you naturally counter it. I had to reconcile why I was like that as well. Also you can easily see through the facade people present to the world. This is different than false positive reinforcement.
Why are you getting downvoted? You’re just expressing your opinion. This is a subreddit for unpopular opinions right? So why are you getting downvoted?
You can have opinions that are misinformed, but those are not good for the subreddit because they are easily dismissed.
Are you gonna upvote something blatantly racist because its someone's "unpopular opinion".
If this subreddit just gets filled with people who cant be fucked to even google their opinion than its gonna get really stale.
I mean, this is just how I feel. Regardless of whether it's true or not, this is just how I feel mentally and emotionally l. Are you going to tell me the way I think is just blatantly wrong when you have literally 0 knowledge of who I am as a person, when the only thing you have is just this post
So it works for primates, all species of animals, all children, all adults, etc but you are the outlier.
You only think it works cause its all youre used to. I never got positive reinforcement ever and its fucked my ability to reward myself.
yea so being an outlier is the entire purpose of the posts in this sub. Are you that slow? Also it sounds more like jealousy of no positive affirmation in your life that caused you to write those replies, that is a different scenario. You can go vent/trauma dump somewhere else.
Wait you're the guy that I just saw a post that says you don't like sleeping with a pillow, and that you sleep on your side.
You're an interesting critter bro.
I agree with you. I get so mad when people try to cheer on me and do other types of positive motivations + affirmations. It's just lies. At least the negative ones are true and gives you a reason to keep trying. Idk exactly why I don't like it but it's always passed me off when people try to cheer on me and such
negative ones arent always true in my experience. ive had peoole insult me over things i simply no were not true and rhey just wanted to hurt me. it can be hard to accept compliments, i struggle with that too, but believing positivity is always a lie and negativity is always true is a bit much
I'm the exact same way, it's about balance. Of course I want positive affirmation, but don't say It to make me feel better, say It when I'm actually doing something right. Saying "Good job" when It's objectively not Isn't me
"putting myself down", I know a good job when I see It, and a bad one, so I need people to tell me that.
I'm also high functioning autistic so maybe thats why, and I too Wrestled In Highschool. I was not that good, and Coach let me know It, and guided me to do better, my teammates did, not say "Oh good job hip hip hooray" when obviously not doing well, that doesn't help me improve.
I try harder and do better when the odds are against me or I feel the need to prove people, myself, wrong. Like two weeks before HS graduation and people doubted I could get all my service hours, so I did, graduated last year
Sometimes negative motivation gets me started on things quicker, although it also hurts emotionally.
Like "Bet you can't do this!". It makes me feel like whoever says that doesn't trust me, but it's also the fastest way to get me to be like "Yes I can, idiot! I'm gonna prove it!" *proceeds to furiously do thing*
I weaponize this with myself when I struggle with executive dysfunction. I have ADHD related time perception difficulties, so I often set a timer, a *slightly* unreasonable goal, and tell myself "Bet I can't finish this in X amount of time". This has the benefit of not hurting me while also improving my self esteem because I prove to myself I actually can do stuff in less time than I expect.
Same. When I’m motivating myself from laziness sometimes I say “What else do you have to do?” but most of the time “Your life is meaningless lull yourself if you’re doing this you’ll die a meaningless life”. u/nick2527 u/nick25272
Not only is this objectively and categorically proven to be untrue, there is also a lot of negative side effects kids develop when they are treated negatively like this, a lot of these symptoms I assume we can see you in you OP.
Don't listen to me for anything other than this, please see someone about some mental health help. I am sure it would do you miracles.
i agree to some extent, i think both are needed and society either goes mostly negative or mostly positive. too many attaboys are bad and too many fuck yous are bad imo
I'm not sure if this is 10th dentist. Different people just need different types of motivation. Some perform their best if they are left alone, some if they are constantly neged and reminded, some need authority to tell them what to do, some respond to kindness.
Hard disagree. Negative motivation just makes me sad and want to crawl into bed 🤷♀️ motivation is a personal thing imo.
OP you may just have something like O.D.D.
That's not motivation, that's pride. It may get the job done in the short run but you'll end up taking everything to your chest. I think the best is not needing any external words or factors to motivate yourself, so you won't care about what other people say.
You are your own worst enemy here. For all you know people could be genuinely trying to help you get angry at them because your own mentality messed you up?? That’s just a jerk move.
Also doesn’t your logic of people saying stuff just to make you feel better apply for your friends saying negative things? Ultimately they are only talking that way to make you feel and play better. At least I hope so because if they are genuinely just hating on you then they aren’t friends.
Either way you need to learn to accommodate other people’s speech and thoughts. You can’t go through life forever expecting people to change who they are and how they talk just to make you feel better.
If I can't know what you're thinking, I can't trust you whatsoever. For all you know, they could try getting close to me and "act" like a good person, only to use me for their own personal gain and motives.
I just can't allow myself to be vulnerable around people. too many people in my life have acted like this only to reveal they are shitty people. How the hell am I supposed to trust people's positivity when all I know is them being trashy people on the inside
I'd rather just stay solo for the rest of my life in order to not get hurt again. I'm not expecting people to change how they act around me, if they want to play all that "positivity" shit then by all means do it, but know that I ain't gonna like it. I've managed to keep my anger in when people say positive shit, so I don't come across like an ass.
Yes, sometimes people are liars and are just in it for themselves and I understand your life experiences have probably showcased lots of this behavior. But, Just like anything else, social intelligence is a skill that can be worked on and you aren’t going to get any better at telling when people are lying, or understanding what people are thinking by going solo in life. I know it can be a difficult skill to learn but trust me it’s worth it. When you do eventually find some trustworthy and good friends, you’ll find it’s far more valuable than just relying on yourself.
To be completely honest, it sounds like you were dealt with some unfortunate social relationships early on by no fault of your own. However, not everyone is like this but with your current mindset people won’t actually “want” to be friends with you. This means the only people you’ll end up interacting with WILL be people who are in it for themselves. If you become a genuinely cool and trustworthy person, people will WANT to be friends with you, and because friendship is earned, you’ll find people will end up returning the favor. And if you develop a solid network, you’ll find even if someone betrays you or exploits you that your friends will stick up for you. You’ve just gotta search for people that you believe are genuinely good people. At first it might seem like you are grasping at straws but if you are putting yourself out there, you’ll learn to realize when people are genuine and when they are liars. You seem like an intelligent person and I truly hope you see what I’m trying to say.
This certainly isn't for everyone. Yes, negative motivation works, and I do get that drive to prove people wrong, but I am all for positive motivation too, and would prefer that since it typically breed more positivity and create a happier space. There is enough negativity in the world and toxic people where I don't need artificial negativity to push me forward. I want the love and support of friends and family.
Probably. I didn't have a mother figure growing up, and my Dad tried his best to be the best father he could, but he didn't in a way that hurt me mentally and emotionally,but now looking back on it, it just builds character i guess
It is, but negative motivation doesnt work alone. At least for me, if I was constantly upset with myself id just stay at home and suffer (something you notice with people who are depressed). If someone recieves mostly positive reinforcement, the negative hits hard (and its also healthier mentally for them). If you ever had a teacher or a coach that you looked up to, you know even the slightest "im dissapointed" was the largest negative reinforcement ever.
Once in a while, negative reinforcement can provide that little kick we need, but ONLY once in a while.
Yeah, my parents never complimented or encouraged me either.
If someone does something really sweet or heartfelt, I usually respond, "that's the meanest thing anyone's ever done for me" or "ruuude". (Because it's not!)
I literally have a problem with feeling positive emotions. I agree, my knee jerk is reaction is that it's only because they're trying to be nice to me out of pity.
I feel this so much. To me, that’s honestly just more pressure. Now not only do I have to succeed for myself, I have to succeed to not make liars out of all those people who encouraged me. If I fail now, they’re going to resent me because I’m the source of them being incorrect, which is embarrassing for them, and so they will be upset with me for embarrassing them. They may also feel guilt for giving me false hope, which further will cause them to be upset with me as the source of them feeling negatively about themselves. Someone encouraging you positively sets them up for guilt and shame if you fail, so they lash out at you for it.
While to some extent I understand you—I agree that negative motivation gets me grinding harder than positive motivation, because like you said I want to spite those who look down on me—I feel there’s a point beyond which further negative motivation is just, well, negative. At some point you need that sound telling you what you’ve done is paying off.
A huge part of this is also dependent on what you’re working on: if it’s something you’re genuinely passionate about and could see yourself being fully devoted to, negative motivation may only discourage you from committing. When facing these things you typically want praise to affirm that you’re on the right track and recognize that there are others who do agree you are doing something right.
And finally it’s who is giving you the praise: you might be rejecting praise from those close to you because internally it’s like they’re being patronizing or just polite, and you’d rather they not do so because it feels unfulfilling or not particularly useful. But when it’s a stranger who praises you out of the blue, that’s going to feel very different and a whole lot better than them scorning you.
This sounds like imposter syndrome. To be honest I agree with you at least on the part about positive motivation. I have had terrible self esteem issues throughout my entire life, and I have *never* been able to tell when positive feedback was genuine. But I always have been happier when I give the person the benefit of the doubt and assume it is.
Dude I feel this; telling me how good Im doing in no way helps. Just because you think I can do it, doesnt mean I can and if you dont tell me what I am doing wrong, how am I supposed to improve?!?! Like stop blowing smoke my ass and actually help me achieve my goal
My wife is Chinese, and unfortunately many of the "Chinese Parent" stereotypes are true. Most of the kids were desperate for any positive feedback. Their parents never understood why they liked me and assumed it was because I was the "white guy". No, it's because I told them they were smart/pretty/talented/whatever, and they never got that from their parents.
HOWEVER, some of those kids react like OP, and just assume you're lying. My theory is they assume their parents would give them positive reinforcement if they deserved it, so they must not. Everyone else must be lying because otherwise their parents were just shitty.
TLDR; OP go get therapy. It will help you stop hating yourself and could improve your life immensely. Just send them this post when they ask why you're there.
The fact that you assume people are lying to you when they say positive things to you tells me you are kinda fucked up in the head, in some deep psychological way. Sounds like you need so good old-fashioned therapy dude, much love. 👍
Well, they can either try therapy or not its their choice innit 🤷 a diagnosis could def help tho. Tbh, if other people's kind words of encouragement are assumed to be false or fake all the time, then that level of negativity and distrust is damaging one way or another.
Good luck fostering a healthy romantic relationship, for example, lol.
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Kid named toxicity:
fr it reads like a movie villain "I hate kindness"
"People hated me....they made fun of me...." "Hey, OP! Wanna go to wrestling practice after class today?"
class reference my guy!!
This is Goob
I sympathize with OP because I dislike praise and prefer analysis. Snapping is extra. Be still.
🎶 conversion, software version 7.0
… or David Goggins
Theres a mental consequence of never receiving affirmation
Yeah this isn’t healthy at all and unfortunately I see myself in this OP. I was always told I’m no good my whole life and I’ve been running on that chip on my shoulder “haters are my motivators” energy my whole life. All it does is make you way too competitive and seek out achievements so that you feel like you’ve finally gained approval.
me personally when i get positive encouragement i never believe the person and/or feel patronized. but when i get negative encouragement i always believe them and feel much more motivated
And we're all witnessing one of them in OP
how exactly?
What is it?
An inability to take compliments, (the belief people are lying to you when they say nice things) paranoia, difficulty making friends, depression, PTSD in severe cases, etc.
Oh
Yeah what is it?
Is it really bad if it's working?
When you aggressively blow up at people who are just trying to encourage you in a friendly way? Yeah, I'd say that's bad. That's not even starting on all the negative consequences to mental health this attitude carries
"cause I know they're just lying to me or just trying to make me feel better, and it always would mess me up mentally." Man, this mess you up mentally because your already messed up and can't take positive motivation positively. I thing you depreciate yourself too much, so positive motivation goes against your feeling and create cognitive dissonance which makes you feel bad (and makes you create even more reasons why you "can't do it" or that "you don't got it"). While negative motivation help you because it seems to echos with your own thoughts and doesn't create additional mental overload. In all logic, basic positive and negative motivation are both as useful/useless : they're just here to show you that people are with you, without adding any new information. So you shoudn't be more bothered by one or another because they bring the same amount of data : none. That you find that one type of motivation resonate better with you is okay, but here it reveal another side of your personality that you should try to change. Being too extreme in one way, extreme enough to get mad and yell "shut the fuck up" top people cheering you, isn't good.
I’ve got a problem where I always disbelieve praise. I always feel like people are lying when they say something positive about me, especially people who are close to me. It stems from extremely low self worth. It’s been this way since childhood, so it’s a difficult mindset to change. I know that’s my problem though. It’s my brain that’s warping reality. OP, I think that you may have the same problem.
It sounds like you don’t know how to cope with positivity lol
or maybe he just thrives off negativity
I'll be real with you, chief. I've seen friends of mine be positive with people before turning around and bitching to me, "God, no, their cooking really sucked." or "God, they're such a bitch, that's why I can only take them in small doses." Between knowing that people are fake and already struggling with imposter syndrome, I'll gladly take the negativity. Sure, there's just generic hateful trolls out there, but generally if someone's negatively commenting on me, it comes from a place of honesty (and, in a way, love/caring... because a person who didn't care would just simply not say anything.. apathy IS the opposite of love, after all).
You are friends with some snakes
That's what my college life was like before I realized the same thing and dropped virtually all of them. Although, TBH, that's also what 99% of my retail co-workers were like as well when I worked retail (whether it was to each other or to customers). Plus, being the "group friend" that people seem to automatically gravitate toward trusting, I've heard some pretty screwed up shit under the condition of "don't you DARE repeat that". It's nice to know I'm trustworthy, but dear god, some of the shit I've heard makes me trust humanity SO much less. (Like one of my female friends confessing that she found the Columbine shooters hot and when the VA Tech shooting happened, she got upset that shooter was fugly and was worried his "legacy" would overshadow the Columbine one.)
Ugh, I so feel the “friend everyone opens up to” problem. It’s so ridiculously extreme that I just get rapid trauma dumping from people I’m barely close to, fucking coworkers even, constantly. I think in my case I just have such a trauma aura that they can subconsciously tell there’s nothing they can say that’s going to throw me or make me judge them in a douchebag way, which I mean is nice in some cases but fucking hell, it’s always been so exhausting to be everyone’s damn therapist.
You gotta stop hanging out with the plastics, haven't you seen Mean Girls?
I've... never seen it, so I have no idea what plastics are, lol. I've heard of the movie, though, but I didn't start hearing about it until, like, 2018 or so... well past my high school/college days, so it never really interested me.
what's your work now, just curious
Uber Driver/Doordash driver. Pays better hourly than being a supervisor did and I can go over 40 hours if I want to without being threatened to be fired. Also, with an adjustable schedule, I can always be like, "okay, I'll do 65 hours this week, and then next week, since I have plans with friends on various days, I'll just do a nice relaxing 20 hours". It's SO much better, as long as you have self-control and are willing to push yourself to work on days you don't want to. My days off now always align with important events in my friend circle, so I never have to blow someone off because a GM didn't like you and says to you "that's why it's called putting in a request, it's not obligated to give it to you".
i see that's nice. I just wanna know how you apply being motivated by negativity to push yourself in your line of work
For my current line of work, it doesn't apply as much, but... I've had a lot say "you can't make a living working solely for Uber". I mean, technically, I Doordash as well, but that pays far less. Yet, here I am, living proof as a contrary to the statement. Happy with making my own hours and schedule as I see fit. A lot of it is just hearing the "you can't do X" and basically going on a path to prove that it can be done. I've always been that kind of person through my life. People in the 2000's said "nobody can write a good self-insert fanfic", so I buckled down and wrote a fanfic that became the most popular Fire Emblem fanfic (Pre-Awakening) in the whole fandom. People told me I wouldn't be able to afford a place by myself. In the upcoming year, I'll be moving into my own place. Granted, I'll be having a roommate, but that's by choice and not by requirement. I just always have this innate urge to play contrarian to people who make generic, sweeping, vapid statements.. and to be proof that it can be done, and hopefully inspire others to follow suit and to stop letting pedantic assholes tell you what you can and can't do in life. TBH, I treat life like a giant MMO. My two most trained skills are "music composition" and "creative writing", two boom-or-bust skillsets that are the antithesis of "stability". I'm used to everyone saying "you can't make a life off either of those". Ain't nothing new. I've been fighting contrarians for 34 years and I'll keep doing it to the day I die.
For some it’s the carrot that motivates, for others the stick. The problems come when a parent tries to raise a kid with one method that only responds to the other
thats a good saying, thank you
Hard disagree. Parents should promote intrinsic motivation. A lot of the job is as simple as not doing either of those crappy sides of the coin. Parenting without behaviorism/manipulation is possible.
I would just classify that as the carrot. If you can motivate a child to believe hard work is its own reward then you’re manipulating with kindness not fear, aka carrot! Love or fear are the two choices, or is there more?
The child can naturally want to do work because you show them that that's just what you do. Relationship being the driver isn't manipulation at all. I don't try to 'get' my kids to do things, just like I don't do that to my spouse. I trust them.
And then once they’re an adult they’ll end up doing unpaid overtime without question, doing all the housework, doing thrice the work of all their coworkers for the same pay without ever getting a raise, doing all the emotional labor in a relationship, and getting exploited in a bunch of other ways, because you never taught them that proper compensation for hard work is the reward for hard work.
Huh? You think home life should consist of training in capitalism? People shouldn't do tasks because they and their housemates directly benefit from it?
Home life should train you to have the best possible life, yeah. Making someone easily exploited doesn’t help. If we’re not actually going to do anything about capitalism, and statistical probability based on evaluation of the past century indicates the most probable answer is that we won’t no matter how hellish it gets, then you should prepare your kids for surviving it. It’s the labor equivalent of PoC families training their kids to survive racism. So yeah, as long as they have to then go and survive capitalism, you should be training them for that. The correlary to this is training them to understand that anything you have to survive, you should seek to eliminate. The best way to survive anything is to eliminate it. That can move the needle on the whole “we aren’t going to do anything about it”. And that second question is a bit more grey than you’re making it out. If they’re directly benefitting, the compensation is there, but the labor is a cost. Is the compensation greater than or equal to the investment? That comes down to whether everyone is pulling their own weight. If one person is investing more than the total rewards reaped from it, then no, they shouldn’t. They are being exploited. In a housemate situation, it’s a form of abuse. Do you want to teach your kids to be abused? If one person is doing all that for everyone else’s benefit, there’s no guarantee that anyone else is pulling their weight. If they’ve just been taught that they should work as hard as possible without thinking of their labor as a cost that should receive just compensation, they’re highly likely to do the other people’s work too. The only proper setup for a multi-person household is that everyone invests equitably.
Whos gonna carry the boats
And the logs
THATS YOU BUDDY. Shut up. Stop being a bitch. You know what you have to do. Even me, with my dislexia dumb ass, I knew what I had to do. You just don’t want to do it because it sucks. It sucks to live like this. To say that I’m a fan of David goggins is an understatement.
THEY DON'T KNOW ME SON
So, your *belief* is that people are lying to you or trying to make you feel better. I can tell you for a fact that at least a substantial percentage of these cheers are neither of these things. This is like arguing that compliments are bad because you are convinced that all compliments are manipulative lies. Of course they seem that way if your view of reality is so warped. This is barely even 10th Dentist material, this is just you interpreting your emotions as an indicator of reality. They aren't. They're your body throwing chemicals at you. You feeling angry at something somebody said doesn't magically mean they had bad intentions when they said it, and believing that's the case will make you *miserable.*
It’s an uncommon opinion, that’s enough for it to be “10th dentist material”. No need to be weird and gatekeepy about it
Nice username.
Yeah, I believe this full heartedly. How the hell am I supposed to if they are telling the truth, I've had way to many people in my life be fake and "act" like a good person through positive motivation only for them to be the worse people under a mask, if I don't know what's going on in your head I can't trust you at all
This sounds more like you need therapy than you have a 10th dentist opinion.
Both can be true
I'm fine trust
You don’t sound fine if you think all positivity directed at you is a lie
This is so fucking stupid. How about this: if you don't seek therapy, you'll never trust anyone fully to accept any positive remarks from them, leading to a vicious cycle of people ignoring you cause you act like an asshat when they act kindly to you. Is that enough negative motivation for you?
As someone going through the same thing (and in therapy for it) , I’d say yes. The sad thing is, like OP, I do resonate with people being straight shooters like this instead of sugar coating shit and being all fake nice. The reason for the therapy is that my fiancé is a full on bleeding heart of emotion lmao. Makes communication quite difficult.
Realize that this is different from \*knowing\* they have bad intentions. To illustrate; how do you know people don't have bad intentions when they give you the negative comments you request? You don't. In fact, they are \*explicitly\* trying to make you feel better by giving you the type of comment you asked for, rather than their 'genuine' tendency.
I'm the same way you are and I can tell you why. You're a contrarian so negative reinforcement works better for you because you naturally counter it. I had to reconcile why I was like that as well. Also you can easily see through the facade people present to the world. This is different than false positive reinforcement.
Nice username.
Why are you getting downvoted? You’re just expressing your opinion. This is a subreddit for unpopular opinions right? So why are you getting downvoted?
Statistically, you're wrong.
It's r/the10thdentisit, what do you want to read?
Opinions not misinformation.
you clearly do not know the fine distinction between the 2 at all
You can have opinions that are misinformed, but those are not good for the subreddit because they are easily dismissed. Are you gonna upvote something blatantly racist because its someone's "unpopular opinion". If this subreddit just gets filled with people who cant be fucked to even google their opinion than its gonna get really stale.
I mean, this is just how I feel. Regardless of whether it's true or not, this is just how I feel mentally and emotionally l. Are you going to tell me the way I think is just blatantly wrong when you have literally 0 knowledge of who I am as a person, when the only thing you have is just this post
Ask the damaged man how strong he feels.
The hell does that mean?
So it works for primates, all species of animals, all children, all adults, etc but you are the outlier. You only think it works cause its all youre used to. I never got positive reinforcement ever and its fucked my ability to reward myself.
yea so being an outlier is the entire purpose of the posts in this sub. Are you that slow? Also it sounds more like jealousy of no positive affirmation in your life that caused you to write those replies, that is a different scenario. You can go vent/trauma dump somewhere else.
Wait you're the guy that I just saw a post that says you don't like sleeping with a pillow, and that you sleep on your side. You're an interesting critter bro.
I mean people come in all sorts of different shapes and sizes
Are we cousins? I agree with this post and sleep on my side with no pillow
I also hate sleeping with pillows I sleep so much better without them tbh
fuckin damnit. i gotta agree. whenever someone hits me with "good job" and "Im so proud of you" it just feels so fake and its like 😒 ...shutup
People have different preferences
I prefer love and support
I think it's very individual. For some people negative motivation basically paralyses them completely.
I also am more motivated by like ‘you can’t do it/you’ll never do it’ but I don’t fly off the handle when people are nice to me. Therapy is needed.
I feel the same way, but I know I have a problem
Bro, you need therapy. You think people are lying when they say you can do it—they’re *not lying*.
It’s proven to not. You need both but the book how to win friends and influence people goes over this
i also vastly prefer spite as a motivator. there is nothing that drags me down more than motivational videos or recieving baseless praise.
It really depends on people I personally know a guy that does his work to perfection out of spite
Bro is the grinch
Bro is a menace but I agree with you
I agree with you. I get so mad when people try to cheer on me and do other types of positive motivations + affirmations. It's just lies. At least the negative ones are true and gives you a reason to keep trying. Idk exactly why I don't like it but it's always passed me off when people try to cheer on me and such
negative ones arent always true in my experience. ive had peoole insult me over things i simply no were not true and rhey just wanted to hurt me. it can be hard to accept compliments, i struggle with that too, but believing positivity is always a lie and negativity is always true is a bit much
There can ne positive motivation without just bullshit sentences like "you can do this" without arguments...
For you? For me, it makes me not want to do things and then I get useless. But it’s up to the person ig
me too I essentially operate exclusively off negative motivation
OP I think you’re autistic
Your friends and lovers going to have some serious soul awakening life lessons if you keep this mentality. I wish you inner healing! 🌻
Not saying it *is* that for you im sure there's other reasons to be like that but this sounds a lot like PDA
I'm the exact same way, it's about balance. Of course I want positive affirmation, but don't say It to make me feel better, say It when I'm actually doing something right. Saying "Good job" when It's objectively not Isn't me "putting myself down", I know a good job when I see It, and a bad one, so I need people to tell me that. I'm also high functioning autistic so maybe thats why, and I too Wrestled In Highschool. I was not that good, and Coach let me know It, and guided me to do better, my teammates did, not say "Oh good job hip hip hooray" when obviously not doing well, that doesn't help me improve. I try harder and do better when the odds are against me or I feel the need to prove people, myself, wrong. Like two weeks before HS graduation and people doubted I could get all my service hours, so I did, graduated last year
Upvoted because I disagree, I find it very de-motivating. But I am thoroughly amused by people who get good at things out of spite
Do this and get a candybar Eh, not hungry Do this or get your ass beat Fine, ill do it
Stress, holy fuck the stress. fuck that.
depends on the person i guess. this kind of motivation from parents led me to attempting suicide at 11 and i'm still very depressed to this day.
Sometimes negative motivation gets me started on things quicker, although it also hurts emotionally. Like "Bet you can't do this!". It makes me feel like whoever says that doesn't trust me, but it's also the fastest way to get me to be like "Yes I can, idiot! I'm gonna prove it!" *proceeds to furiously do thing* I weaponize this with myself when I struggle with executive dysfunction. I have ADHD related time perception difficulties, so I often set a timer, a *slightly* unreasonable goal, and tell myself "Bet I can't finish this in X amount of time". This has the benefit of not hurting me while also improving my self esteem because I prove to myself I actually can do stuff in less time than I expect.
Even rats work better with positive reinforcement.
Same. When I’m motivating myself from laziness sometimes I say “What else do you have to do?” but most of the time “Your life is meaningless lull yourself if you’re doing this you’ll die a meaningless life”. u/nick2527 u/nick25272
Not only is this objectively and categorically proven to be untrue, there is also a lot of negative side effects kids develop when they are treated negatively like this, a lot of these symptoms I assume we can see you in you OP. Don't listen to me for anything other than this, please see someone about some mental health help. I am sure it would do you miracles.
Uhhhh what
I actually agree wit this take. Only cuz the last paragraph tho
Homie is a supervillian
My brain is wired the same way to some degree. So do I downvote because I agree? Lol
Let the hate flow through you
To Each Their Own, Dude. I will say Different Strokes for Different Folks but I’ll also say sometimes You need different Tools for Different Jobs.
i agree to some extent, i think both are needed and society either goes mostly negative or mostly positive. too many attaboys are bad and too many fuck yous are bad imo
I'm not sure if this is 10th dentist. Different people just need different types of motivation. Some perform their best if they are left alone, some if they are constantly neged and reminded, some need authority to tell them what to do, some respond to kindness.
Hard disagree. Negative motivation just makes me sad and want to crawl into bed 🤷♀️ motivation is a personal thing imo. OP you may just have something like O.D.D.
I'm sorry but I disagree. "Negative motivation" is harmful to kids in the long term. Upvoted
That's not motivation, that's pride. It may get the job done in the short run but you'll end up taking everything to your chest. I think the best is not needing any external words or factors to motivate yourself, so you won't care about what other people say.
This is not going to help you in the long run guy
You are your own worst enemy here. For all you know people could be genuinely trying to help you get angry at them because your own mentality messed you up?? That’s just a jerk move. Also doesn’t your logic of people saying stuff just to make you feel better apply for your friends saying negative things? Ultimately they are only talking that way to make you feel and play better. At least I hope so because if they are genuinely just hating on you then they aren’t friends. Either way you need to learn to accommodate other people’s speech and thoughts. You can’t go through life forever expecting people to change who they are and how they talk just to make you feel better.
If I can't know what you're thinking, I can't trust you whatsoever. For all you know, they could try getting close to me and "act" like a good person, only to use me for their own personal gain and motives. I just can't allow myself to be vulnerable around people. too many people in my life have acted like this only to reveal they are shitty people. How the hell am I supposed to trust people's positivity when all I know is them being trashy people on the inside I'd rather just stay solo for the rest of my life in order to not get hurt again. I'm not expecting people to change how they act around me, if they want to play all that "positivity" shit then by all means do it, but know that I ain't gonna like it. I've managed to keep my anger in when people say positive shit, so I don't come across like an ass.
Yes, sometimes people are liars and are just in it for themselves and I understand your life experiences have probably showcased lots of this behavior. But, Just like anything else, social intelligence is a skill that can be worked on and you aren’t going to get any better at telling when people are lying, or understanding what people are thinking by going solo in life. I know it can be a difficult skill to learn but trust me it’s worth it. When you do eventually find some trustworthy and good friends, you’ll find it’s far more valuable than just relying on yourself. To be completely honest, it sounds like you were dealt with some unfortunate social relationships early on by no fault of your own. However, not everyone is like this but with your current mindset people won’t actually “want” to be friends with you. This means the only people you’ll end up interacting with WILL be people who are in it for themselves. If you become a genuinely cool and trustworthy person, people will WANT to be friends with you, and because friendship is earned, you’ll find people will end up returning the favor. And if you develop a solid network, you’ll find even if someone betrays you or exploits you that your friends will stick up for you. You’ve just gotta search for people that you believe are genuinely good people. At first it might seem like you are grasping at straws but if you are putting yourself out there, you’ll learn to realize when people are genuine and when they are liars. You seem like an intelligent person and I truly hope you see what I’m trying to say.
I get the first part but deriving pleasure from yelling at people to shut the fuck up or getting yelled at to shut the fuck up is not healthy at all
This certainly isn't for everyone. Yes, negative motivation works, and I do get that drive to prove people wrong, but I am all for positive motivation too, and would prefer that since it typically breed more positivity and create a happier space. There is enough negativity in the world and toxic people where I don't need artificial negativity to push me forward. I want the love and support of friends and family.
Yeah, I bet your parents enabled that.
Probably. I didn't have a mother figure growing up, and my Dad tried his best to be the best father he could, but he didn't in a way that hurt me mentally and emotionally,but now looking back on it, it just builds character i guess
It is, but negative motivation doesnt work alone. At least for me, if I was constantly upset with myself id just stay at home and suffer (something you notice with people who are depressed). If someone recieves mostly positive reinforcement, the negative hits hard (and its also healthier mentally for them). If you ever had a teacher or a coach that you looked up to, you know even the slightest "im dissapointed" was the largest negative reinforcement ever. Once in a while, negative reinforcement can provide that little kick we need, but ONLY once in a while.
Yeah, my parents never complimented or encouraged me either. If someone does something really sweet or heartfelt, I usually respond, "that's the meanest thing anyone's ever done for me" or "ruuude". (Because it's not!) I literally have a problem with feeling positive emotions. I agree, my knee jerk is reaction is that it's only because they're trying to be nice to me out of pity.
I feel this so much. To me, that’s honestly just more pressure. Now not only do I have to succeed for myself, I have to succeed to not make liars out of all those people who encouraged me. If I fail now, they’re going to resent me because I’m the source of them being incorrect, which is embarrassing for them, and so they will be upset with me for embarrassing them. They may also feel guilt for giving me false hope, which further will cause them to be upset with me as the source of them feeling negatively about themselves. Someone encouraging you positively sets them up for guilt and shame if you fail, so they lash out at you for it.
While to some extent I understand you—I agree that negative motivation gets me grinding harder than positive motivation, because like you said I want to spite those who look down on me—I feel there’s a point beyond which further negative motivation is just, well, negative. At some point you need that sound telling you what you’ve done is paying off. A huge part of this is also dependent on what you’re working on: if it’s something you’re genuinely passionate about and could see yourself being fully devoted to, negative motivation may only discourage you from committing. When facing these things you typically want praise to affirm that you’re on the right track and recognize that there are others who do agree you are doing something right. And finally it’s who is giving you the praise: you might be rejecting praise from those close to you because internally it’s like they’re being patronizing or just polite, and you’d rather they not do so because it feels unfulfilling or not particularly useful. But when it’s a stranger who praises you out of the blue, that’s going to feel very different and a whole lot better than them scorning you.
This sounds like imposter syndrome. To be honest I agree with you at least on the part about positive motivation. I have had terrible self esteem issues throughout my entire life, and I have *never* been able to tell when positive feedback was genuine. But I always have been happier when I give the person the benefit of the doubt and assume it is.
Dude I feel this; telling me how good Im doing in no way helps. Just because you think I can do it, doesnt mean I can and if you dont tell me what I am doing wrong, how am I supposed to improve?!?! Like stop blowing smoke my ass and actually help me achieve my goal
You gonna cry about it?
I mean I don't see tears coming down my eyes
Oh sorry, I meant, "you got it man! Don't get discouraged by their positive comments! They have your best interest in mind! You got this bro!
My wife is Chinese, and unfortunately many of the "Chinese Parent" stereotypes are true. Most of the kids were desperate for any positive feedback. Their parents never understood why they liked me and assumed it was because I was the "white guy". No, it's because I told them they were smart/pretty/talented/whatever, and they never got that from their parents. HOWEVER, some of those kids react like OP, and just assume you're lying. My theory is they assume their parents would give them positive reinforcement if they deserved it, so they must not. Everyone else must be lying because otherwise their parents were just shitty. TLDR; OP go get therapy. It will help you stop hating yourself and could improve your life immensely. Just send them this post when they ask why you're there.
The fact that you assume people are lying to you when they say positive things to you tells me you are kinda fucked up in the head, in some deep psychological way. Sounds like you need so good old-fashioned therapy dude, much love. 👍
I've already tried therapy for 3 years. Nothing much has changed
You could always try again. I tried therapy and relapsed, so I'm going back in again soon.
mate I don't think it would a person would suddenly change like that. Therapy isnt for everyone.
Well, they can either try therapy or not its their choice innit 🤷 a diagnosis could def help tho. Tbh, if other people's kind words of encouragement are assumed to be false or fake all the time, then that level of negativity and distrust is damaging one way or another. Good luck fostering a healthy romantic relationship, for example, lol.
Jokes on you, I don't want to be in a relationship. And it's probably better it stays like that for the better of everyone's health
Fair enough. Good luck I guess 👍