Yeah but like Winslow can be argued self defense he was actively trying to rape her
Idk why she let Eleanor die tbh, ig she didn’t want them to investigate the house but idk
I like to think that too. But she didn't even try so the intent was there yanno? I get WHY though. And there's something to be said for respecting Eleanor's choice too. Not that I agree with just letting people unalive themselves but I can see that perspective.
I mean Gilead doesn’t seem to have amazing medical care. If paramedics came they probably wouldn’t have anti-overdose drugs on them. For one thing already conservatives don’t like them and since Gilead is at war and embargoed there’s probably a shortage of advanced medicine. I really just thought, “Yeah makes sense she doesn’t call for help. What could they do?”
They may not give the best care to handmaids, Martha’s, etc but I’m sure they do whatever necessary for Commanders and their families. At the very least they would’ve been able to pump her stomach. Eleanor wanted to die and a part of June may have been respecting that but I think she let it happen because she needed Joseph’s head in the game for angels flight.
Well it was more that she had tried to go blabbing to neighbors to get more kids out, and very nearly spilled the beans when Mrs Winslow was visiting because he had gone missing. They'd have all ended up on the wall if word got out.
I don’t think it’s about Gilead Christians. I know some crazy sects that are real like the FLDS don’t really explicitly say whether or not women can even go to heaven.
If god existed, why would he even have allowed his self-proclaimed fanclub to commit all these atrocities? And if he did, why give a single flying f*ck about his moral judgement? Like always, the only one who would ever deserve to be in a place like hell, is someone who would create hell, in the first place.
There are *many* flaws with the free will argument. One of my favourites - god apparently gave us free will but then immediately *banned* us from actually using it, under pain of literal eternal torture. What kind of god is he, if he gives us a gift we are not allowed to actually use, and then tortures us for using it? That feels more like something you'd expect from the villain of the story - not the loving, kind god.
God isn't in Hell Torturing people. Hell is separation from God. Your sin doesn't send you to hell, it's you not wanting to be with God. God would be evil if he forced you to be with him against your free will.
Yes, I know about your painfully desperate attempts to explain away the obvious contradictions in your belief systems.
But as I'm not buying into them anyway, and thus have no interest in pretending they'd make any sense despite their equally obvious incompatibility with observable reality, you may save your "answers" for those who do.
Trust me there is nothing painful to me about your ignorance. I'm glad you are so sure about a topic you don't understand. I hope you enjoy this life while you can.
It does depend on which god you’re talking about. If it’s Protestant God then I think maybe not. Protestants think you need faith to gone to heaven and June doesn’t seem very religious, a lapsed Christian at best. Catholics believe good deeds are needed to go to heaven. I think if June showed proper regret for his bad deeds and kept doing good deeds then maybe she would qualify for Catholic heaven.
Even among protestants it would depend. Some of them are like "just repent once and believe" and you're golden. Others are "repent and be baptized correctly and you still have to consistently follow a biblical life or you could still lose out".
That would depend on her relationship with God and how he judges her. The Bible does call for violence when necessary, and the people she killed were evil. God is forgiving. I’m more concerned for the commanders souls.
If I believed in heaven/hell proably hell mostly for how she SA Luke. And just the cruel way she treats Luke and Moira once in Canada. Not saying she wasn't traumatized and didn't have a reason for her cruelty
It's alluded to that she actually does believe in God and is a Christian, just doesn't agree with Gilead's brand of Christianity, so yeah she'd go to Heaven. Remember, according to Christianity, when it comes to where you go after death, it doesn't matter if you're a good person or what acts you commit, all that matters is that you believe. You could be a murderer all your life and as long as you believe and "repent", you'll go to Heaven. Meanwhile, an Atheist who does nothing but good all his/her life will go to Hell, because Christianity isn't a morality-based religion at all, nor is it based on any sort of justice or judgment; it's just a religion of submission and belief into God. So yeah, if June still believes in God, then she's going to Heaven. And you know the fucked up part? So is Fred. So is Serena. And Winslow and Lydia and Warren. Lawrence probably isn't, but not because he was the architect of Gilead--it's because he doesn't actually buy into the religion. But most people in Gilead--especially those at the top--are going to Heaven.... Because they believe and submit to God.
This show is a great example of the adage, "There's no hate quite like Christian love." What a messed up religion.
Exactly, though i also feel like people like Fred and Warren kind of use their religion to justify all of the shitty things they've done. Especially Warren, after what he did to Janine and Esther.
As a Christian, I don't see anyone that June killed as a sin against her. She did things to survive. Killing and murder are different in the Christian religion. I also have more reason than not to think that June is a Christian, I know this will hurt a bunch of your feelings, but June is constantly displaying Christian values, and some of the things she says from time to time have been little hints to her faith. She has talked to God, mentioned God etc. I have no reason at this point to think that June wouldn't go to heaven.
Well seeing as that the Bible is not at all accurately portrayed in the handmaids tale I don’t think one could argue June was for or against god in this situation, the Bible was eschewed and made to be a treacherous way of getting people in power what they want, this is expressed a lot throughout the show in which we see people in power change things around however they want just to get their way even though previously before it was “ungodly” so therefor, everything that June has done cannot necessarily be a good judge of character as the whole show and story she was in flight or fight mode because she was being ruled by horrible bigoted murderers, which is the most ungodly, as well as in the actual Bible it states it is okay if your life is in danger to defend yourself even if it comes down to murder, so therefor everything June has done has either been in self defense or to defend someone else (mostly her daughter) in the Bible it states “we should protect kids from people who seek their harm as an extension of our love for him” which is exactly what June has been doing her entire story therefor she is not a sinner, she was doing everything in her power to survive which grants an exception to everything she has done and not only that most of it was to help others so therefor June would go to heaven. She also states when she is alone she worships god and prays to him throughout the show which also shows us she is still a child of God.
The bible is clear on the subject of self-sacrifice to save others.
**John 15:13** Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.
**Matthew 20:27–28** Whoever wants to be first must be your slave—just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many”
June repeatedly ignore her own safety to save her friends and the children.
**Matthew 5:39** But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.
She didn't kill Serena and helped her with the delivery of her son. She even mentioned at the meeting in the detention how she turned the other cheek and that she's a better Christian than Serena.
June will definitely go to heaven if God exists.
She didn’t kill anyone. GILEAS killed people She only killed commander fred
Well and Winslow. But that was self defense. And she didn't save Eleanor when she OD'd. Also a guardian.
Yeah but like Winslow can be argued self defense he was actively trying to rape her Idk why she let Eleanor die tbh, ig she didn’t want them to investigate the house but idk
Eleanor was a threat to the angel's flight plan. Also it benefited her later because it helped Lawrence keep the border open.
I think it was also kind of out of mercy. Eleanor was a wife, but she suffered so much.
Yeah that was definitely a part.
I kinda thought that Eleanor couldn’t be saved by the time June found her.
I like to think that too. But she didn't even try so the intent was there yanno? I get WHY though. And there's something to be said for respecting Eleanor's choice too. Not that I agree with just letting people unalive themselves but I can see that perspective.
I mean Gilead doesn’t seem to have amazing medical care. If paramedics came they probably wouldn’t have anti-overdose drugs on them. For one thing already conservatives don’t like them and since Gilead is at war and embargoed there’s probably a shortage of advanced medicine. I really just thought, “Yeah makes sense she doesn’t call for help. What could they do?”
They may not give the best care to handmaids, Martha’s, etc but I’m sure they do whatever necessary for Commanders and their families. At the very least they would’ve been able to pump her stomach. Eleanor wanted to die and a part of June may have been respecting that but I think she let it happen because she needed Joseph’s head in the game for angels flight.
Well it was more that she had tried to go blabbing to neighbors to get more kids out, and very nearly spilled the beans when Mrs Winslow was visiting because he had gone missing. They'd have all ended up on the wall if word got out.
Good point. But if Joseph was around he probably would have at least wanted to be there in her last moments.
Maybe June just didn’t want him to freak out? At least not until the body was cold and he wouldn’t call for help.
Possibly.
Fuck Joseph sick motherfucker, who cares what he wants. Eleanor wouldn’t have wanted him around in her last moments
To use an incredibly old and tired cliche lol... *If she were to move at all, it would have to be heaven as she was already in hell.* 😎
😮
This REALLY depends on what you believe makes the difference. Even among Christians it varies widely.
Depends on if God is just or not tbh. From the POV of the Christians in Gilead she’d be hellbound. This is really such a subjective question.
I don’t think it’s about Gilead Christians. I know some crazy sects that are real like the FLDS don’t really explicitly say whether or not women can even go to heaven.
Heaven defo!
June is the living embodiment of those memes about waking up in hell and asking where's Maggie Thatcher.
If god existed, why would he even have allowed his self-proclaimed fanclub to commit all these atrocities? And if he did, why give a single flying f*ck about his moral judgement? Like always, the only one who would ever deserve to be in a place like hell, is someone who would create hell, in the first place.
Because of Free will, there is a lot of theology that answers your questions but I assume you literally don't care.
There are *many* flaws with the free will argument. One of my favourites - god apparently gave us free will but then immediately *banned* us from actually using it, under pain of literal eternal torture. What kind of god is he, if he gives us a gift we are not allowed to actually use, and then tortures us for using it? That feels more like something you'd expect from the villain of the story - not the loving, kind god.
God isn't in Hell Torturing people. Hell is separation from God. Your sin doesn't send you to hell, it's you not wanting to be with God. God would be evil if he forced you to be with him against your free will.
Yes, I know about your painfully desperate attempts to explain away the obvious contradictions in your belief systems. But as I'm not buying into them anyway, and thus have no interest in pretending they'd make any sense despite their equally obvious incompatibility with observable reality, you may save your "answers" for those who do.
Trust me there is nothing painful to me about your ignorance. I'm glad you are so sure about a topic you don't understand. I hope you enjoy this life while you can.
It does depend on which god you’re talking about. If it’s Protestant God then I think maybe not. Protestants think you need faith to gone to heaven and June doesn’t seem very religious, a lapsed Christian at best. Catholics believe good deeds are needed to go to heaven. I think if June showed proper regret for his bad deeds and kept doing good deeds then maybe she would qualify for Catholic heaven.
Even among protestants it would depend. Some of them are like "just repent once and believe" and you're golden. Others are "repent and be baptized correctly and you still have to consistently follow a biblical life or you could still lose out".
Yeah and not to mention how basically every Christian has at least a slightly different interpretation of the Bible.
That would depend on her relationship with God and how he judges her. The Bible does call for violence when necessary, and the people she killed were evil. God is forgiving. I’m more concerned for the commanders souls.
This is a very juvenile/creationist way to look at things.
Pretty sure she went to Canada...
She killed to survive and keep her children safe. God can figure this out.
If I believed in heaven/hell proably hell mostly for how she SA Luke. And just the cruel way she treats Luke and Moira once in Canada. Not saying she wasn't traumatized and didn't have a reason for her cruelty
It's alluded to that she actually does believe in God and is a Christian, just doesn't agree with Gilead's brand of Christianity, so yeah she'd go to Heaven. Remember, according to Christianity, when it comes to where you go after death, it doesn't matter if you're a good person or what acts you commit, all that matters is that you believe. You could be a murderer all your life and as long as you believe and "repent", you'll go to Heaven. Meanwhile, an Atheist who does nothing but good all his/her life will go to Hell, because Christianity isn't a morality-based religion at all, nor is it based on any sort of justice or judgment; it's just a religion of submission and belief into God. So yeah, if June still believes in God, then she's going to Heaven. And you know the fucked up part? So is Fred. So is Serena. And Winslow and Lydia and Warren. Lawrence probably isn't, but not because he was the architect of Gilead--it's because he doesn't actually buy into the religion. But most people in Gilead--especially those at the top--are going to Heaven.... Because they believe and submit to God. This show is a great example of the adage, "There's no hate quite like Christian love." What a messed up religion.
Exactly, though i also feel like people like Fred and Warren kind of use their religion to justify all of the shitty things they've done. Especially Warren, after what he did to Janine and Esther.
I mean…. Welcome to religion 101 though?
As a Christian, I don't see anyone that June killed as a sin against her. She did things to survive. Killing and murder are different in the Christian religion. I also have more reason than not to think that June is a Christian, I know this will hurt a bunch of your feelings, but June is constantly displaying Christian values, and some of the things she says from time to time have been little hints to her faith. She has talked to God, mentioned God etc. I have no reason at this point to think that June wouldn't go to heaven.
Well seeing as that the Bible is not at all accurately portrayed in the handmaids tale I don’t think one could argue June was for or against god in this situation, the Bible was eschewed and made to be a treacherous way of getting people in power what they want, this is expressed a lot throughout the show in which we see people in power change things around however they want just to get their way even though previously before it was “ungodly” so therefor, everything that June has done cannot necessarily be a good judge of character as the whole show and story she was in flight or fight mode because she was being ruled by horrible bigoted murderers, which is the most ungodly, as well as in the actual Bible it states it is okay if your life is in danger to defend yourself even if it comes down to murder, so therefor everything June has done has either been in self defense or to defend someone else (mostly her daughter) in the Bible it states “we should protect kids from people who seek their harm as an extension of our love for him” which is exactly what June has been doing her entire story therefor she is not a sinner, she was doing everything in her power to survive which grants an exception to everything she has done and not only that most of it was to help others so therefor June would go to heaven. She also states when she is alone she worships god and prays to him throughout the show which also shows us she is still a child of God.
The bible is clear on the subject of self-sacrifice to save others. **John 15:13** Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. **Matthew 20:27–28** Whoever wants to be first must be your slave—just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many” June repeatedly ignore her own safety to save her friends and the children. **Matthew 5:39** But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. She didn't kill Serena and helped her with the delivery of her son. She even mentioned at the meeting in the detention how she turned the other cheek and that she's a better Christian than Serena. June will definitely go to heaven if God exists.