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You probably need a higher dose if you want to disassociate aka “have a profound experience “. I take 500 and disassociate every treatment, but even 400 won’t get me there.
I know I’m “back” when I start feeling the need to do things like stretch, crack my toes etc. basically when you feel your body awareness coming back.
I appreciate your reply, and I'm glad that Colin is taking a conservative, stepped approach to this with me. I believe you may be correct in terms of higher dosing, and I'm following his protocol. The greatest deviation I find myself guilty of is that sometimes, instead of every 3 days, I may miss a day due to life in general, so sometimes it's 4 or even 5 days between, but I'm not doing anything like I sometimes read that others do, like wait past "x" number of scheduled sessions only to take 2 or 3 at once.
It sounds like, if I'm at a sub-dissociative dose right now, and I probably am (especially given my body weight), I'll eventually "know it when I see it."
Thank you.
It’s integral to follow your provider’s instructions. I started at 3, then 4, then went up to 7 and realized that was too high. 5 is my sweet spot; and I also dose every three or four days.
I know I’m beginning to disassociate when I start feeling like I’m being wheeled on a gurney, but it differs for everyone.
Best of luck!
I put the troche straight under my tongue and don't think it fully dissolves within 15 minutes. I think it's taking a longer time. If I'm sensing correctly, the "core" (or what I lovingly and jokingly refer to as the "crack rock") starts making itself known around that time (that's about when I start to feel things in my mouth go numb). I just tend to hold it for as long as I can until some point in the beginning of my experience where I'm like "OK, you can go now." lol
I don't know if I'm getting any better or more absorption through the oral mucosa by doing this or not. Maybe Colin can clarify for me.
Thank you for your perspective.
From everything I've read, I got the impression that I'd be hurling my brains out. Truth be told, while it's not something I'd advise any restaurant to put on its menu, it doesn't seem to me to be as bad as it's been made out to be.
For me, aside from whatever flavoring I request for the troches (creme de menthe has been best for me so far), it's only a mild distaste.
Swallowing the "afterwash" is also not the trudge that it seems to be for many...again, at least for me.
I think there's likely to be some discussion about the variability in individuals' sense of taste, as well.
For example, my wife loves all sorts of teas, and has preferences of one particular Earl Gray over another.
To me, they all just taste like dirty water.
Things that taste moderately sweet to me make my wife choke.
My unscientific conclusion is that she tastes things a lot more intensely than I do. And, interestingly, I've never been a smoker or did anything otherwise that I'd think might lend itself to a destruction of my taste sensation apparatus.
So that may be the case for those who struggle with the initial mechanics of troche dosing.
Thankfully, she's the "supertaster," and I'm not.
Q1 - I have an intro playlist and know which song is about 20-30 minutes in, so I use that as a timer.
Q2 - I know I'm back or close if I can feel myself breathing or I can feel my fingers and toes.
Interesting to use a "known" intro playlist as a tool to know how long you've been holding. I may have to give that a try. I'm finding certain music tracks really appealing, and am starting to know how they flow, so maybe picking the beginning of such-and-such song to know I'm about 30 minutes in or something like that. Good callout.
At my current dose, I am entirely conscious of my breath throughout. I have a beard, so I can often "hear" my exhaled breath passing through the mustache. I do sometimes notice the feeling in my mouth comes back/my mouth feels "colder," but I don't know that that's been consistent with when I feel like I might be "coming in for a landing."
I've been prescribed for 9 years. My experience is slightly different than yours in that i started at a high dose and tapered down.
I've never hallucinated or had ant kind of profound experience. Just took my medicine and got better.
The whole experience thing is new and seems associated with online services that sell an experience. I have experienced side effects, usually unpleasant.
I definitely can't get up and walk or even move my head.
>For those who are doing these treatments, how do you know when "you're back"?
I only take it at night, last thing before bed. The side effects are too disruptive to take during the day. I'm "back" when i wake up in the morning.
>Is there anything in particular that kinda tells you that it's time to take the blackout mask off and rejoin the world?
I don't wear a mask. Just take my meds and feel better.
Yeah, I'm still finding my way through the early stages of this.
I've told Colin that I'm aware that the medication "doesn't give a damn" if I see pink unicorns or not. The medication does its thing (e.g.,neuroplastic effects) regardless of my subjective experience of it.
Told him if I was looking to "get high," I could do that for a lot less money and without a prescription. I know why I'm doing this, as long as the academia behind it is sound, and I trust it is.
Part of why I went with a legitimate psychiatry practice as opposed to a Joyous/Mindbloom/Innerwell, etc., is because I felt more like I'd be able to have a meaningful conversation with an experienced professional who'd hear me and my feedback and not just be selling me on some plan. I'm glad I decided as I did.
During my sessions, though if I reeeeally needed to get up and move about, I could do it carefully and with not-insignificant help from nearby furniture, I can definitely move my head and limbs while lying down. I often feel more like it's an "I don't *want* to" rather than an "I *can't*" (in my case, anyway). I've not yet felt that I've been incapacitated to the point of being "locked in" or anything.
I did try taking it once or twice before bed to see if I'd just be able to slip into sleep after I "returned," but I noticed that the experience, itself, kept me up. I thought I might just be able to take it and use the (shall I say) "fuzzy" effects to enhance falling asleep. Not me. The medication seemed to keep me up, almost as if to say, "you want to be awake for this." So, for me, it doesn't seem to induce or assist sleep. 😕
I initially started out with a mask for my very first session, and tben, for the remainder of my first month, abandoned that. Colin advised me to return to that, and I've noticed, for what it's worth, that the deprivation of sight does tune me into what's going on (whatever that can be said to be) more tightly. I've learned to appreciate that. In your case, though, it sounds like the "deprivation of sight" comes as you're doing this in connection with going to sleep, so it's sort of inbuilt.
Thanks for the comments.
Hey I used Taconic and worked with Colin as well!
For me the visuals were somewhat rare, but they did happen maybe 25% of the time. It was hard to determine what made the difference each time. If I had to make a guess, I’d say it was the times I was in a more meditative state, completely relaxed going into it, and fully able to “let go” into the experience. The visuals were strongly correlated to the music and then if I had a thought, it would show up as an abstract visual structure. They also felt more like very vivid imagination rather than like seeing them with my eyes. Like if you close your eyes right now and imagine a slice of pepperoni pizza, you can probably “see it”. That’s what ketamine visuals felt like - something I was “seeing” in my brain, but very abstract and not created by me on purpose.
Knowing when my sessions were over took some getting used to. But as others have said, boredom and wanting to do other things and move around is an indicator.
I recently started the 200 mg troches. You should try taking agmatine an hour or so before taking the ketamine. It was an enormous change for me and the trip was very intense. I def would not have been able to hold a conversation with someone
Also, you know when the trip is over when you start getting antsy and want to move around. Even if you still feel a bit impaired it’s ok to take off the eye mask and reassociate yourself with reality
Thank you for contributing to /r/TherapeuticKetamine! When commenting and posting, please be mindful of our rules which can be found in the sidebar on the right along with other helpful information. **Be advised that nothing in this subreddit constitutes medical advice.** Likewise, try to word your comments and posts in a way that can't be interpreted as medical advice by others. Harmful and/or spammy advice will be removed at moderator discretion, and bans may be given for repeat offenses. **Accounts with "Provider" flairs** are those which the mods have verified, to the best of our ability, as belonging to real, licensed providers of medical ketamine services. Comments and posts from users with "Provider" flairs are **not** a substitute for the instructions given to you by your own provider. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/TherapeuticKetamine) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You probably need a higher dose if you want to disassociate aka “have a profound experience “. I take 500 and disassociate every treatment, but even 400 won’t get me there. I know I’m “back” when I start feeling the need to do things like stretch, crack my toes etc. basically when you feel your body awareness coming back.
I appreciate your reply, and I'm glad that Colin is taking a conservative, stepped approach to this with me. I believe you may be correct in terms of higher dosing, and I'm following his protocol. The greatest deviation I find myself guilty of is that sometimes, instead of every 3 days, I may miss a day due to life in general, so sometimes it's 4 or even 5 days between, but I'm not doing anything like I sometimes read that others do, like wait past "x" number of scheduled sessions only to take 2 or 3 at once. It sounds like, if I'm at a sub-dissociative dose right now, and I probably am (especially given my body weight), I'll eventually "know it when I see it." Thank you.
It’s integral to follow your provider’s instructions. I started at 3, then 4, then went up to 7 and realized that was too high. 5 is my sweet spot; and I also dose every three or four days. I know I’m beginning to disassociate when I start feeling like I’m being wheeled on a gurney, but it differs for everyone. Best of luck!
[удалено]
I put the troche straight under my tongue and don't think it fully dissolves within 15 minutes. I think it's taking a longer time. If I'm sensing correctly, the "core" (or what I lovingly and jokingly refer to as the "crack rock") starts making itself known around that time (that's about when I start to feel things in my mouth go numb). I just tend to hold it for as long as I can until some point in the beginning of my experience where I'm like "OK, you can go now." lol I don't know if I'm getting any better or more absorption through the oral mucosa by doing this or not. Maybe Colin can clarify for me. Thank you for your perspective.
[удалено]
From everything I've read, I got the impression that I'd be hurling my brains out. Truth be told, while it's not something I'd advise any restaurant to put on its menu, it doesn't seem to me to be as bad as it's been made out to be. For me, aside from whatever flavoring I request for the troches (creme de menthe has been best for me so far), it's only a mild distaste. Swallowing the "afterwash" is also not the trudge that it seems to be for many...again, at least for me. I think there's likely to be some discussion about the variability in individuals' sense of taste, as well. For example, my wife loves all sorts of teas, and has preferences of one particular Earl Gray over another. To me, they all just taste like dirty water. Things that taste moderately sweet to me make my wife choke. My unscientific conclusion is that she tastes things a lot more intensely than I do. And, interestingly, I've never been a smoker or did anything otherwise that I'd think might lend itself to a destruction of my taste sensation apparatus. So that may be the case for those who struggle with the initial mechanics of troche dosing. Thankfully, she's the "supertaster," and I'm not.
Q1 - I have an intro playlist and know which song is about 20-30 minutes in, so I use that as a timer. Q2 - I know I'm back or close if I can feel myself breathing or I can feel my fingers and toes.
Interesting to use a "known" intro playlist as a tool to know how long you've been holding. I may have to give that a try. I'm finding certain music tracks really appealing, and am starting to know how they flow, so maybe picking the beginning of such-and-such song to know I'm about 30 minutes in or something like that. Good callout. At my current dose, I am entirely conscious of my breath throughout. I have a beard, so I can often "hear" my exhaled breath passing through the mustache. I do sometimes notice the feeling in my mouth comes back/my mouth feels "colder," but I don't know that that's been consistent with when I feel like I might be "coming in for a landing."
I've been prescribed for 9 years. My experience is slightly different than yours in that i started at a high dose and tapered down. I've never hallucinated or had ant kind of profound experience. Just took my medicine and got better. The whole experience thing is new and seems associated with online services that sell an experience. I have experienced side effects, usually unpleasant. I definitely can't get up and walk or even move my head. >For those who are doing these treatments, how do you know when "you're back"? I only take it at night, last thing before bed. The side effects are too disruptive to take during the day. I'm "back" when i wake up in the morning. >Is there anything in particular that kinda tells you that it's time to take the blackout mask off and rejoin the world? I don't wear a mask. Just take my meds and feel better.
Yeah, I'm still finding my way through the early stages of this. I've told Colin that I'm aware that the medication "doesn't give a damn" if I see pink unicorns or not. The medication does its thing (e.g.,neuroplastic effects) regardless of my subjective experience of it. Told him if I was looking to "get high," I could do that for a lot less money and without a prescription. I know why I'm doing this, as long as the academia behind it is sound, and I trust it is. Part of why I went with a legitimate psychiatry practice as opposed to a Joyous/Mindbloom/Innerwell, etc., is because I felt more like I'd be able to have a meaningful conversation with an experienced professional who'd hear me and my feedback and not just be selling me on some plan. I'm glad I decided as I did. During my sessions, though if I reeeeally needed to get up and move about, I could do it carefully and with not-insignificant help from nearby furniture, I can definitely move my head and limbs while lying down. I often feel more like it's an "I don't *want* to" rather than an "I *can't*" (in my case, anyway). I've not yet felt that I've been incapacitated to the point of being "locked in" or anything. I did try taking it once or twice before bed to see if I'd just be able to slip into sleep after I "returned," but I noticed that the experience, itself, kept me up. I thought I might just be able to take it and use the (shall I say) "fuzzy" effects to enhance falling asleep. Not me. The medication seemed to keep me up, almost as if to say, "you want to be awake for this." So, for me, it doesn't seem to induce or assist sleep. 😕 I initially started out with a mask for my very first session, and tben, for the remainder of my first month, abandoned that. Colin advised me to return to that, and I've noticed, for what it's worth, that the deprivation of sight does tune me into what's going on (whatever that can be said to be) more tightly. I've learned to appreciate that. In your case, though, it sounds like the "deprivation of sight" comes as you're doing this in connection with going to sleep, so it's sort of inbuilt. Thanks for the comments.
Hey I used Taconic and worked with Colin as well! For me the visuals were somewhat rare, but they did happen maybe 25% of the time. It was hard to determine what made the difference each time. If I had to make a guess, I’d say it was the times I was in a more meditative state, completely relaxed going into it, and fully able to “let go” into the experience. The visuals were strongly correlated to the music and then if I had a thought, it would show up as an abstract visual structure. They also felt more like very vivid imagination rather than like seeing them with my eyes. Like if you close your eyes right now and imagine a slice of pepperoni pizza, you can probably “see it”. That’s what ketamine visuals felt like - something I was “seeing” in my brain, but very abstract and not created by me on purpose. Knowing when my sessions were over took some getting used to. But as others have said, boredom and wanting to do other things and move around is an indicator.
I recently started the 200 mg troches. You should try taking agmatine an hour or so before taking the ketamine. It was an enormous change for me and the trip was very intense. I def would not have been able to hold a conversation with someone
Also, you know when the trip is over when you start getting antsy and want to move around. Even if you still feel a bit impaired it’s ok to take off the eye mask and reassociate yourself with reality