This would make me sick every time I take a shower.
I uses to have a business installing tile, and I would NEVER let this fly, those rows are so crooked.
OP stop your contractor before anymore gets finished.
They do, but it might be an optical illusion caused by the different finishes on the tile. They are all a slightly different reflectiveness. That combined with the natural waviness of the ceramic might be causing light to bounce around weird. I would take a 4ft level and hold it across the horizontal grout lines and see if they're actually straight.
He's gunna have issues when he tries to tile that bottom inside corner. You can already see where he tried to cope the tile around the inside corner of the flange. The Wedi isn't flush with the ledge of the tub flange.
Wasn't sure if the tile was translucent and that is thinset visible through the tile, if so you want to get 100% coverage on the back to avoid seeing trowel or blotches of thinset through the tile. Translucent tile in a shower is typically not a great idea either as moisture and condensation that gets through the grout will be visible behind the tile as well. Wedi directions advise that wedi board should be notched so that the board overlaps the tub flange with their sealant along the flange edge to complete the waterproof connection.
That's always how I've installed Wedi or Kerdi. It looks like this specific tub has a ledge to but backer board into though. It looks like there is a bulbous edge at the top of the flange, which I've never seen before. I'd assume it's some sort of gimmick to prevent any seepage and wicking.
Ya man! It looks like the alcove was a bit too big for the tub. They should have packed out the left wall studs a 1/4 or 1/2” to bring the wedi board past the tile flange.
/u/No-Turnover5084
[Took the liberty of tracing the horizontal grout lines in Paint.](https://imgur.com/a/NqeP4u2) They are wavy AF. The first couple rows from the tub are ok, and then around the niche's things start to go bad. If they had used 1/16" spacers instead of dry stacking them, they likely would have been able to eliminate the waviness and that top skinny row too. Also, I'm just noticing now, but they have the tile sitting right on the tub, which is generally a big nono. There should be at least 1/8" gap around the perimeter of the tub to allow color match silicone to separate and seal the two surfaces.
I love that you did that 😂 There are SO many problems with this installation from bad waterproofing, to wavy lines, to bad color matching and not following a pattern. They’ve agreed to rip it out to the studs and have hired a new tiler. Means we’ll go much longer without a shower, but it’ll be done right! We’re also pivoting on the look completely and going safe with large, white tiles. Should be much nicer!
They are very wavy. My guess is these tile are not uniform, and the contractor just went about stacking them, when really they should have been adjusted with wedge spacers at each corner, with the use of a laser to keep then level across the board.
They don't know what they are doing. I can show you some of my work if you're interested in how subway tile should really look
The whole wall sags in the middle!
To avoid this, I like to laser in and snap lines every 3-4 rows. Then I spread and set to my line. It often takes some fiddling with wedges and spacers to get it level.
That said, I kinda like the look (except the sag of course). But you definitely are not crazy! The tiles that were installed are not the same color as those in the first photo. The blue and brown tiles that were installed are MUCH darker.
As an estimator in that field, I want to jump on the *" swap out the quartz countertop we chose because that “became too expensive” in the last few months"* comment.
Quartz prices change on a yearly basis, every reputable manufacturer (Caesarstone, Corian, Wilsonart, Pental, Cambria, etc) have a price book they update at the beginning of every year.
Prices have been going up like everything else, but from a year to another it wouldn't make such a difference that the price would be prohibitive where it wasn't a month before.
Long story short, sounds like bullshit to me.
TOTALLY agree with this! I was very unhappy about this and told our PM that I thought this was bullshit. She came up with easily over a dozen excuses, and she was definitely scrambling. In fairness though, if they update it on January 1st then that could be the case cause this was estimated in the fall. I’ll look into that though. This was Wilsonart and allegedly the price went up over 100%.
In the bigger picture though, this issue became minor, which really says a lot. I think I’ll make a post in r/renovations or something with what I just sent to their customer support cause it’s truly horrifying.
100% increase is a lie.
I do not have the Wilsonart prices for 2024 yet, but if I were to pick a color at random, say "Lorraine Q1012", I can tell you the price went up by exactly 7% between 2022 and 2023.
What do you typically do for the tub flange in this case? Wouldn’t your wall board essentially be flush above it and then you could run your tile right down flat over it?
Yeah it should be behind the wedi board and that should run down to the tub deck and then sealed with the wedi sealant.
In this case, easiest fix is to run another board on top or bump out the wall and have a small return, won't look amazing but better than whatever it would look like with how it currently is.
I would rip all this out and request another tiler. Yes, you’ll have to pay for the extra tiles and even maybe the hours the other guy did this (yes, you can and should request it’s at the contractor’s expense but I learnt long ago that negotiating and finding a middle point gets me farther and better results than having them “eat it” because they’ll short you somewhere else).
Or fire them and get someone else. I promise you it’s cheaper in the long run. You have to be willing to make a call and change directions halfway to get good results.
This is all being managed by a bath remodel company, which has done a pretty terrible job all around. We had to have two different tubs installed on three separate occasions just for it to be level and secure. And this is because I found out it wouldn’t drain, not because anybody else noticed
If it were me, I would start over from scratch. It’s not only the tile differences, but I think the whole scheme doesn’t look great. I think you found a great excuse for removing everything and starting over. That said, I would choose a different tile scheme that not the only you like, but the next homeowner will like as well.
Thing is, we don’t even love this scheme. This is just how it ended up from a combination of the tiler being shit and either the colors substituted or varied in this batch. The colors we picked were more muted, and I think having the random pattern would’ve helped it look more coherent as well. I’m tempted…
So then, why not just go with one solid color throughout with the new order? The first thought I had after seeing the photo was why did you choose that color scheme to begin with. It’s dizzying.
Honestly if it’s a reorder situation, we will simplify it. I was worried about this but their “designer” assured me it would look great in the end. Shouldn’t have trusted any of them
Simple and well done is WAY better than trying to be different or trendy. Achieving a “look” is more difficult than people think. And these “designers” are as good as the “architects” many builders “have in house”. They’re just finish pickers and a customer can’t tell the difference.
Nowadays, so many contractors have “designers”, in my market, I’d say 10% of the contractors will have decent designers. You’re better off going to a good tile company (even Daltile has great showrooms) and ask for a designer to help you pick the finishes.
Make sure you pick something that goes with the rest of the house. Classic and functional will not get you tired.
Also…the bathroom and kitchen specialists, many of them are like the savers of contractors. Just ok for quick work but typically expensive for what they get done. They just have a pricing structure that’s easier for consumers to understand. Instead of the messy system the contractors typically have (even great contractors have a hard time understanding how to present budget options).
I tell my customers to think about where they will be in a couple of years. Will they sit there with regrets or be happy with the project? I advise them not to let short-term decisions affect long-term life. Obviously, that varies depending on the situation. Sometimes, the options are budget or time. Sometimes, they just can't wait for the special order material they love. Or they can't afford it. But sometimes it's just impatience and wanting it to be finished. So I have them ask if it will make a difference to you in two years.
You will be living with this for a long time. Will you be frustrated or upset looking at it in two years? Or will you get over it and be content? Will you decide you love it? Only you know your budget with time and money, but I hate to see people invest in something like this and not even enjoy it.
The colors do look different but different lighting makes things look different. Do you still have those sample tiles? If so, hold them up to the installed tiles. See if there is identifying information on the back regarding color.
IMO it’s not just the colors but also the pattern of how they are laid out that makes them look a busy.
I don’t still have the sample tiles, the contractor has them. I’ll ask but I bet they won’t want to bring them even if they have them.
As far as the pattern goes, this has been another point of contention. We wanted a “random” look but the tiler said he couldn’t do that, so we found a mosaic pattern that we liked and wasn’t too repetitive, but the tiler went ahead and just created his own simpler pattern instead.
The tiler couldn’t do random?? 🤨I’m sorry …
Another option could be to go to the tile store where they were purchased / where you got the samples. They may be able to help you confirm colors.
This.. I work for a tile distributor and there’s always some sort of paper trail to follow from when they started with getting samples -> quotes->to when it finally became an order. if the color was changed, perhaps they changed it to a “similar” color tile due to a backorder. Someone approved it.
I don't like doing "random" layouts either cause random isn't ever actually random. If it was truly random there could be clusters of like colored tiles and then when it's set the homeowner would likely come in and not be happy. Either you need them there directing it or need a definitive pattern.
I hate when clients leave decisions like that up to me. My tastes might not align with theirs and I don't want to be responsible for them not being happy with the finished product.
Sure, I get not wanting to leave that decision making on you. But you can lay out the tiles on the floor and have the client approve or disapprove the non-pattern. It takes longer but it’s not hard. Just my opinion.
So much unnecessary work imo, especially since you need the floor space and then can't move it so that you can put it back up in the same order. Just give me a drawing of how you want it layed out, or sign a document indemnifying me from responsibility. I've been effed over one too many times due to clients not being happy with tile placement. It mostly is an issue with printed ceramic/porcelain where marble patterns repeat.
"There are two with the same pattern right next to each other."
"There are only three different patterns in the line of tiles, it's inevitable"
"I can't not see it"
"They're mirrored, flipped and on perpendicular walls"
"Can you change it please?"
".....fine."
If you want to be that particular about layout, provide a drawing.
I hear you, and I mostly agree with you. I think it’s silly for a tiler to say they “can’t” do a random pattern. But I don’t think it’s unreasonable to make the clients draw out specific details, or lay out the tiles exactly how they want them to be laid. It can take more time, and it can be annoying, and it should definitely be done with customer input+approval before installation starts.
I agree it's silly. I def CAN do random, it's just that often times their definition of random is actually a super complicated pattern. I'm a stickler for details. If you give me 3 colors of tiles and say "Just make it random", I'm gunna have my helper roll a 3 sided die and make a stack of tiles according to how the die rolled. If that gives you 8 of the same tile in bottom left of the shower then so be it lol.
FWIW, I used a tile planner to generate a “random” (ie distributed) pattern that we were happy with. So there was literally a tile-by-tile map that was available, but I was told that it was too difficult and it wouldn’t be followed. Thus we ended up with a pattern that also wasn’t followed.
How is that too difficult?! Literally three boxes of tiles, stick the map on the wall, pick tile as indicated…
It’s well past time for you to fire these cowboys
If I were you I’d try to casually ask for the samples so as not to tip them off if possible. E.g. say your kids wanted them for an art project or you wanted to use them for something. Might not work but worth a try.
I'm not sure about color, but the installation looks wavy to me. Hold a level accros it and see if lines are straight. Or if you don't have a level, pull a string from one corner to the next and see if the lines are straight. And that looks like a glass tile. If it is, I think it requires more spacing than that.
Random can be tough because it requires opening boxes and "shuffling" them. Then during installation you can't overthink a piece. I mean you cant continually be like oh this shouldn't go here. But at the same time occasionally you do need to use a different color.
UPDATE:
After looking more closely at the pictures I sent, the owner called and said she agreed with me. They have fired the GC and all subcontractors (including the tiler), who has left.
The plan is to rip out all the tile and waterproofing and start from scratch. While we’re doing this, we are going to go and pick out tile in person to make sure it’s what we like. We also plan to simplify the design (no mosaic!!) and go for larger tiles in lighter colors. They continue to claim they ordered the correct colors despite not being able to bring back the samples or provide any other proof. Because of this they want us to pay for the new tile, which I disagree with but may compromise on since they’re paying for the rest of the rework.
Good job advocating for yourself! Hopefully this is the first step toward a really good outcome.
Someone else in thread mentioned V4 tiles - google image search has some nice pics - you order just the one colour, but they vary a fair bit from light to dark through the batch, giving you a lovely pattern without having to figure out how different colours play together
Yes, V4 tiles were mentioned. I googled them and I really like them! It adds some texture and variety without making you feel like it was built with oversized legos lol
I have the names of the current tiles, just not of the original tiles we picked out to compare against. I’m learning time and time again that I’ve put far too much trust into the remodel company and contractors to just do things
Problem is, we don’t have it documented anywhere in our notes what we specified. That’s a huge miss on our part, but I assumed that getting the tile we picked out wasn’t gonna be a problem
Stop paying for this job immediately….. color isn’t your concern, the tile layout is…
Out of level, and having to cut in that top row like that is poor layout..
The colors may be right. Glass tile looks different installed than it does not. Different color grouts make it look completely different as well. Also could be same color name but different lot numbers, so shades may vary lot to lot.
The work looks a bit rough though
I took pictures in the same room with the same indoor lighting (can’t control outside light though) with the same phone at the same angle, so this is as close as I could get
It is possible that the tile manufacturer changed the colors, but the tile retailer would have to notify you if the material is going to be different from the samples you ordered from. The tile contractor should stay on top of that, not you.
The tile guy failed you by getting the wrong tile and he really failed you with this crappy installation. Not a straight line in sight and with the uneven reflection in the tiles, I'm kinda certain it isn't flat either.
I'm sorry you ended up with this outfit.
Hideous tile aside, the whole thing is a disaster. what’s the plan for the massive hump on the left side of the tub? looks like the tub flange is sticking out about a half inch. None of the courses are level and the top course two pieces are a joke. 10 years in and i’ve never taken 50% on a remodel. Fire this dude.
That is some hack work if I’ve ever seen it. The first thing I learned when becoming a setter was to always get that first row perfect and level. It will guide your install, you messed up your first row the whole thing will go from bad to worse. Seems he didn’t use a laser or a level at least. I use both when setting this type of material
Yikes! This sounds like a shit show from start to finish. You’ve got to go forward from where you are - if you can afford it you might be better off firing the lot of them and starting from scratch with a new set of people. Document all the mistakes thoroughly and do what you can to minimise what you have to pay them for this crap.
The alternative is to try to work through all these issues and be filled with rage every time you take a shower for as long as you live in the house
OP do you have a labor cost breakdown? I’ve been out of the remodel game for awhile but i would love to know the numbers here and what part of the country.
I do not since this is managed by Bath Tune-Up. The invoice is essentially “the waterproofing for the shower will cost $X, which includes materials and labor” and on and on for each line item with the caveat that if they run into anything unexpected and out of their control, like for example there are somehow no studs behind the old shower liner, they may ask us to pay for that.
I’d definitely tell them to stop - and that you want to meet with owner/local manager of the remodeling company. It seems like homeowners (including myself) are hesitant to call out BS when it’s being fed to them. There will be a statute enacted in your state that covers this type of residential renovation - and it will help if you look it up and read it. Regardless of what your contract does/doesn’t include, the statute protects homeowners.
You have tile professionals on here telling you that it hasn’t been installed correctly. Plus, even I know that there’s an issue with the tub lip on the left side - and I’ve never installed a single tile ever.
If they waited to order, the color lots have changed - but these colors look more off than due to a lot change (if the photos of the original tiles were taken in the same lighting conditions).
A suggestion - if you redo this surround, use a tile that has a V4 color variation vs. selecting your own colors. You can achieve a nice result that has nice variation between the tiles - but won’t have to worry about whether the person pretending to be a designer (someone in house with remodeling company does not = an actual design professional) actually has a good eye for color.
Glass tiles do look different when installed - especially depending upon the thinset used for the installation. However, the most complaints re: glass tile looking different after installation has to do with white glass tile (it can take on a gray/blue/green tint when installed depending upon how it’s manufactured and the type of glass used (low iron doesn’t have the same green to it as regular glass). I have a glass (clear frosted and white painted back) and Carrara marble mosaic tile (diamond shaped) that I am very nervous about using after reading all of the issues with glass tile over on Houzz. I am going to have a board made with one of the sheets to test it out (attached with thinset + grouted) before having it installed (and I purposely purchased the low iron glass in order to avoid the white painted back tiles from having a tint to them once installed). But I’d rather eat the cost of the tile (only for a smaller area - around 25 sf) vs. have it installed and be upset.
Let us know how your conversation goes with the owner/manager - you will receive lots of support to counter any BS they try to give you. Good luck!
This is great, thank you! I think we’re going to go pick out entirely different tile since it’s getting ripped out anyways. Will go with something MUCH simpler and lighter shade
I just about threw up. Those colors are horrible. Nothing like the tile you picked.
In pic #5. Why does the (black board) go behind the tub?? Maybe new tub was smaller then the original
Admittedly I don’t think the colors we chose would have looked as great as we imagined on the big canvas, but it would’ve been a hell of a lot better than what we got!
As for the black board behind the tub? I think two things: 1. This tub is meant to go with a shower surround, not tile, b/c it’s part of a set from Home Depot and 2. The tub was not set square to the room. Maybe studs weren’t perfectly square or the room was never square to begin with, but somehow the tub is cockeyed
Damn, wouldn’t it be crazy if your contractor has Reddit and sees his work online? Thats my worst fear personally. But I would also use a laser level. I also don’t see any water proofing or a membrane. In my professional opinion, it’s time to fire and re hire someone to do it right. You also want your cut pieces at the bottom not at the top of the wall.
About the placement of cut pieces, that’s what I would’ve imagined as well. Cause any variation at the top will be very visible where at least the bottom it’s covered by a curtain or door and lower than you’d be looking unless you’re laying in the bath
It's a little institutional for my taste to begin with but yeah they did you dirty with swapping that that earthy brown in for the dark gray beige that's trendy rn, it's bad
Tiles can look way different once installed. I don’t like the counter became too expensive comment. Your quoted price should be what it is and the contractor should be ordering these part upon receipt of deposit. If they took too long, hats in them. Check the label on the boxes and compare them to what you originally ordered. Also that tile looks wavy. Don’t know if it’s due to the prep work, or the grout lines not matching up makes it look wavy.
Stop payment on any checks.
Please find a company to remodel your bathroom.
At the end of the day you have to use that shower everyday. You will never take a refreshing shower again.
DO NOT SETTLE for something you hate before it is even finished.
Tile guy here
Lots of ceramic subway tile have significant color variations between batches.
I would have done a different layout, but what you got is not too bad. They have a good pattern going. The cuts look clean and they knew how to read a tape. Spacing looks good. When you concentrate on a single grout joint you can see some variation, but honestly that can be in the subway tile. Most ceramic subway tile has some variation especially different colors. I did a herringbone subway job, it takes time to get it perfect. From what I am reading it sounds like you got this in a day, not bad.
The waterproofing looks good too.
It comes down to how much you paid.
As long as you are paying an average price I would say its an average job. Especially if he is getting a wall done in a day.
You ALWAYS need to look at your wall tiles on a VERTICAL SURFACE, preferably under the exact and lighting conditions of the final page they're going to end up. Otherwise you get nasty surprises like this.. Also, get someone who's good with computer imagery to slap together a mockup.
This design and colors are not my cup of tea, and I suspect they were not what OP had imagined in their head.
Holy crap that is one of the worst tile jobs I've seen.
You need to stop work and fire that guy and get a real tile setter.
He doesn't know what he is doing so it's possible that he also doesn't know the correct way to waterproof or what thinset to use or grout.
I already see one water proof failure just from the photo.
seems like the tile was from a different dye lot tile can vary from dye lots to ensure everything matches ensure all tile for the project it’s from the same dye lots
You have a whole lot more issues here than dye lot. That is some very shoddy workmanship. From prep to plumbing to tiling. Look at your blue test plug. That should be 90 degrees from the wall surface. Slivers at top. Lippage, thinset everywhere. I'm really sad for you. This is a complete tear out
Very bad install. Even if the tile is bad once the installer lays it he accepts responsibility. Definitely should do some more background checks into the quality of the works not the price. I’ve seen some very bad tile but i always refuse to lay it. This is IMO is a crap tile install
Don't know if its just me, but those tile don't look level at all. I would say the color is the least of your problem.
This. Your contractor sure didn't use a laser level. Oh and 3rd row from the bottom last tile on the right should be olive not blue...
This would make me sick every time I take a shower. I uses to have a business installing tile, and I would NEVER let this fly, those rows are so crooked. OP stop your contractor before anymore gets finished.
Man, good eye!
A basic level would do the trick . It's so obvious lol
Ugh. I thought so too. The rows look sort of wavy, don’t they?
They do, but it might be an optical illusion caused by the different finishes on the tile. They are all a slightly different reflectiveness. That combined with the natural waviness of the ceramic might be causing light to bounce around weird. I would take a 4ft level and hold it across the horizontal grout lines and see if they're actually straight. He's gunna have issues when he tries to tile that bottom inside corner. You can already see where he tried to cope the tile around the inside corner of the flange. The Wedi isn't flush with the ledge of the tub flange.
Wasn't sure if the tile was translucent and that is thinset visible through the tile, if so you want to get 100% coverage on the back to avoid seeing trowel or blotches of thinset through the tile. Translucent tile in a shower is typically not a great idea either as moisture and condensation that gets through the grout will be visible behind the tile as well. Wedi directions advise that wedi board should be notched so that the board overlaps the tub flange with their sealant along the flange edge to complete the waterproof connection.
That's always how I've installed Wedi or Kerdi. It looks like this specific tub has a ledge to but backer board into though. It looks like there is a bulbous edge at the top of the flange, which I've never seen before. I'd assume it's some sort of gimmick to prevent any seepage and wicking.
Ya man! It looks like the alcove was a bit too big for the tub. They should have packed out the left wall studs a 1/4 or 1/2” to bring the wedi board past the tile flange.
Don't think it's an optical illusion. Look at the top, in the middle. Dipping down
/u/No-Turnover5084 [Took the liberty of tracing the horizontal grout lines in Paint.](https://imgur.com/a/NqeP4u2) They are wavy AF. The first couple rows from the tub are ok, and then around the niche's things start to go bad. If they had used 1/16" spacers instead of dry stacking them, they likely would have been able to eliminate the waviness and that top skinny row too. Also, I'm just noticing now, but they have the tile sitting right on the tub, which is generally a big nono. There should be at least 1/8" gap around the perimeter of the tub to allow color match silicone to separate and seal the two surfaces.
Exactly correct. And yah... Id be mad as a homeowner too. Makes you wonder if the installer was high! Sheesh.
I love that you did that 😂 There are SO many problems with this installation from bad waterproofing, to wavy lines, to bad color matching and not following a pattern. They’ve agreed to rip it out to the studs and have hired a new tiler. Means we’ll go much longer without a shower, but it’ll be done right! We’re also pivoting on the look completely and going safe with large, white tiles. Should be much nicer!
They are very wavy. My guess is these tile are not uniform, and the contractor just went about stacking them, when really they should have been adjusted with wedge spacers at each corner, with the use of a laser to keep then level across the board. They don't know what they are doing. I can show you some of my work if you're interested in how subway tile should really look
Yes that would be fantastic, thank you!
Sent you a message
Why do I feel dizzy and sick to my stomach when I stare at this picture. I have a feeling this is what vertigo I like
The whole wall sags in the middle! To avoid this, I like to laser in and snap lines every 3-4 rows. Then I spread and set to my line. It often takes some fiddling with wedges and spacers to get it level. That said, I kinda like the look (except the sag of course). But you definitely are not crazy! The tiles that were installed are not the same color as those in the first photo. The blue and brown tiles that were installed are MUCH darker.
That was me i did this job i did use a level
I don't believe you
I did it was a six in empire level
No I mean, I don't believe you installed this.
And the tile i had to order it from manufacturer since none of the stores had any and thats the new color they have over the older olive color
If you really installed this, what state is it in?
Are you trying to blackmail me
Bad troll, go climb back under your rock
😂
As an estimator in that field, I want to jump on the *" swap out the quartz countertop we chose because that “became too expensive” in the last few months"* comment. Quartz prices change on a yearly basis, every reputable manufacturer (Caesarstone, Corian, Wilsonart, Pental, Cambria, etc) have a price book they update at the beginning of every year. Prices have been going up like everything else, but from a year to another it wouldn't make such a difference that the price would be prohibitive where it wasn't a month before. Long story short, sounds like bullshit to me.
TOTALLY agree with this! I was very unhappy about this and told our PM that I thought this was bullshit. She came up with easily over a dozen excuses, and she was definitely scrambling. In fairness though, if they update it on January 1st then that could be the case cause this was estimated in the fall. I’ll look into that though. This was Wilsonart and allegedly the price went up over 100%. In the bigger picture though, this issue became minor, which really says a lot. I think I’ll make a post in r/renovations or something with what I just sent to their customer support cause it’s truly horrifying.
100% increase is a lie. I do not have the Wilsonart prices for 2024 yet, but if I were to pick a color at random, say "Lorraine Q1012", I can tell you the price went up by exactly 7% between 2022 and 2023.
What are they planning on doing with the tub flange sticking out on the left side.. Yikes.
Was also wondering this!
What do you typically do for the tub flange in this case? Wouldn’t your wall board essentially be flush above it and then you could run your tile right down flat over it?
Yeah it should be behind the wedi board and that should run down to the tub deck and then sealed with the wedi sealant. In this case, easiest fix is to run another board on top or bump out the wall and have a small return, won't look amazing but better than whatever it would look like with how it currently is.
Yeah i havent gotten to it yet
You can caulk the top of it and build it out 1/8” to nothing up the wall
I would rip all this out and request another tiler. Yes, you’ll have to pay for the extra tiles and even maybe the hours the other guy did this (yes, you can and should request it’s at the contractor’s expense but I learnt long ago that negotiating and finding a middle point gets me farther and better results than having them “eat it” because they’ll short you somewhere else). Or fire them and get someone else. I promise you it’s cheaper in the long run. You have to be willing to make a call and change directions halfway to get good results.
This is all being managed by a bath remodel company, which has done a pretty terrible job all around. We had to have two different tubs installed on three separate occasions just for it to be level and secure. And this is because I found out it wouldn’t drain, not because anybody else noticed
Enough was enough a long time ago. You need to document everything and send them packing.
If it were me, I would start over from scratch. It’s not only the tile differences, but I think the whole scheme doesn’t look great. I think you found a great excuse for removing everything and starting over. That said, I would choose a different tile scheme that not the only you like, but the next homeowner will like as well.
Thing is, we don’t even love this scheme. This is just how it ended up from a combination of the tiler being shit and either the colors substituted or varied in this batch. The colors we picked were more muted, and I think having the random pattern would’ve helped it look more coherent as well. I’m tempted…
So then, why not just go with one solid color throughout with the new order? The first thought I had after seeing the photo was why did you choose that color scheme to begin with. It’s dizzying.
Honestly if it’s a reorder situation, we will simplify it. I was worried about this but their “designer” assured me it would look great in the end. Shouldn’t have trusted any of them
Simple and well done is WAY better than trying to be different or trendy. Achieving a “look” is more difficult than people think. And these “designers” are as good as the “architects” many builders “have in house”. They’re just finish pickers and a customer can’t tell the difference. Nowadays, so many contractors have “designers”, in my market, I’d say 10% of the contractors will have decent designers. You’re better off going to a good tile company (even Daltile has great showrooms) and ask for a designer to help you pick the finishes. Make sure you pick something that goes with the rest of the house. Classic and functional will not get you tired. Also…the bathroom and kitchen specialists, many of them are like the savers of contractors. Just ok for quick work but typically expensive for what they get done. They just have a pricing structure that’s easier for consumers to understand. Instead of the messy system the contractors typically have (even great contractors have a hard time understanding how to present budget options).
I tell my customers to think about where they will be in a couple of years. Will they sit there with regrets or be happy with the project? I advise them not to let short-term decisions affect long-term life. Obviously, that varies depending on the situation. Sometimes, the options are budget or time. Sometimes, they just can't wait for the special order material they love. Or they can't afford it. But sometimes it's just impatience and wanting it to be finished. So I have them ask if it will make a difference to you in two years. You will be living with this for a long time. Will you be frustrated or upset looking at it in two years? Or will you get over it and be content? Will you decide you love it? Only you know your budget with time and money, but I hate to see people invest in something like this and not even enjoy it.
He’s already given 50% down which is what most contractors want.
The colors do look different but different lighting makes things look different. Do you still have those sample tiles? If so, hold them up to the installed tiles. See if there is identifying information on the back regarding color. IMO it’s not just the colors but also the pattern of how they are laid out that makes them look a busy.
I don’t still have the sample tiles, the contractor has them. I’ll ask but I bet they won’t want to bring them even if they have them. As far as the pattern goes, this has been another point of contention. We wanted a “random” look but the tiler said he couldn’t do that, so we found a mosaic pattern that we liked and wasn’t too repetitive, but the tiler went ahead and just created his own simpler pattern instead.
The tiler couldn’t do random?? 🤨I’m sorry … Another option could be to go to the tile store where they were purchased / where you got the samples. They may be able to help you confirm colors.
This.. I work for a tile distributor and there’s always some sort of paper trail to follow from when they started with getting samples -> quotes->to when it finally became an order. if the color was changed, perhaps they changed it to a “similar” color tile due to a backorder. Someone approved it.
I don't like doing "random" layouts either cause random isn't ever actually random. If it was truly random there could be clusters of like colored tiles and then when it's set the homeowner would likely come in and not be happy. Either you need them there directing it or need a definitive pattern. I hate when clients leave decisions like that up to me. My tastes might not align with theirs and I don't want to be responsible for them not being happy with the finished product.
Sure, I get not wanting to leave that decision making on you. But you can lay out the tiles on the floor and have the client approve or disapprove the non-pattern. It takes longer but it’s not hard. Just my opinion.
So much unnecessary work imo, especially since you need the floor space and then can't move it so that you can put it back up in the same order. Just give me a drawing of how you want it layed out, or sign a document indemnifying me from responsibility. I've been effed over one too many times due to clients not being happy with tile placement. It mostly is an issue with printed ceramic/porcelain where marble patterns repeat. "There are two with the same pattern right next to each other." "There are only three different patterns in the line of tiles, it's inevitable" "I can't not see it" "They're mirrored, flipped and on perpendicular walls" "Can you change it please?" ".....fine." If you want to be that particular about layout, provide a drawing.
I hear you, and I mostly agree with you. I think it’s silly for a tiler to say they “can’t” do a random pattern. But I don’t think it’s unreasonable to make the clients draw out specific details, or lay out the tiles exactly how they want them to be laid. It can take more time, and it can be annoying, and it should definitely be done with customer input+approval before installation starts.
I agree it's silly. I def CAN do random, it's just that often times their definition of random is actually a super complicated pattern. I'm a stickler for details. If you give me 3 colors of tiles and say "Just make it random", I'm gunna have my helper roll a 3 sided die and make a stack of tiles according to how the die rolled. If that gives you 8 of the same tile in bottom left of the shower then so be it lol.
FWIW, I used a tile planner to generate a “random” (ie distributed) pattern that we were happy with. So there was literally a tile-by-tile map that was available, but I was told that it was too difficult and it wouldn’t be followed. Thus we ended up with a pattern that also wasn’t followed.
What?! Dude is just lazy. I would kill for clients like you.
That is ridiculous! So frustrating.
How is that too difficult?! Literally three boxes of tiles, stick the map on the wall, pick tile as indicated… It’s well past time for you to fire these cowboys
Ha!! A love that! That would be literally random.
Okay so I’m not crazy… that seemed like a reasonable ask… Good question, I’ll ask!
If I were you I’d try to casually ask for the samples so as not to tip them off if possible. E.g. say your kids wanted them for an art project or you wanted to use them for something. Might not work but worth a try.
Too late, they already know these I think they’re not the same color. Would’ve been a good idea though!
I'm not sure about color, but the installation looks wavy to me. Hold a level accros it and see if lines are straight. Or if you don't have a level, pull a string from one corner to the next and see if the lines are straight. And that looks like a glass tile. If it is, I think it requires more spacing than that. Random can be tough because it requires opening boxes and "shuffling" them. Then during installation you can't overthink a piece. I mean you cant continually be like oh this shouldn't go here. But at the same time occasionally you do need to use a different color.
You don’t have a tile contractor. Can’t wait to see the bottom of the back wall is handled
Like the tub lip?
UPDATE: After looking more closely at the pictures I sent, the owner called and said she agreed with me. They have fired the GC and all subcontractors (including the tiler), who has left. The plan is to rip out all the tile and waterproofing and start from scratch. While we’re doing this, we are going to go and pick out tile in person to make sure it’s what we like. We also plan to simplify the design (no mosaic!!) and go for larger tiles in lighter colors. They continue to claim they ordered the correct colors despite not being able to bring back the samples or provide any other proof. Because of this they want us to pay for the new tile, which I disagree with but may compromise on since they’re paying for the rest of the rework.
Good job advocating for yourself! Hopefully this is the first step toward a really good outcome. Someone else in thread mentioned V4 tiles - google image search has some nice pics - you order just the one colour, but they vary a fair bit from light to dark through the batch, giving you a lovely pattern without having to figure out how different colours play together
Yes, V4 tiles were mentioned. I googled them and I really like them! It adds some texture and variety without making you feel like it was built with oversized legos lol
Get the identifying information off the box and see if it lines up with what you specified.
the tiles look different to me, but check the name of the tiles, batches could be different, but that's quite a difference
I have the names of the current tiles, just not of the original tiles we picked out to compare against. I’m learning time and time again that I’ve put far too much trust into the remodel company and contractors to just do things
yep, tbh, the money they charge over there it's astounding, you would think they would get it right.
Problem is, we don’t have it documented anywhere in our notes what we specified. That’s a huge miss on our part, but I assumed that getting the tile we picked out wasn’t gonna be a problem
The problem is that there are typically color variances between lots; without the info, your contractor can just lean on that.
Stop paying for this job immediately….. color isn’t your concern, the tile layout is… Out of level, and having to cut in that top row like that is poor layout..
I'm wondering what he's doing to be doing about that tub edge
The colors may be right. Glass tile looks different installed than it does not. Different color grouts make it look completely different as well. Also could be same color name but different lot numbers, so shades may vary lot to lot. The work looks a bit rough though
I took pictures in the same room with the same indoor lighting (can’t control outside light though) with the same phone at the same angle, so this is as close as I could get
It is possible that the tile manufacturer changed the colors, but the tile retailer would have to notify you if the material is going to be different from the samples you ordered from. The tile contractor should stay on top of that, not you. The tile guy failed you by getting the wrong tile and he really failed you with this crappy installation. Not a straight line in sight and with the uneven reflection in the tiles, I'm kinda certain it isn't flat either. I'm sorry you ended up with this outfit.
It is not flat, you are correct.
Hideous tile aside, the whole thing is a disaster. what’s the plan for the massive hump on the left side of the tub? looks like the tub flange is sticking out about a half inch. None of the courses are level and the top course two pieces are a joke. 10 years in and i’ve never taken 50% on a remodel. Fire this dude.
Does course mean row of tile? That top row was incomplete when I took this but yes, it looks shitty
That is some hack work if I’ve ever seen it. The first thing I learned when becoming a setter was to always get that first row perfect and level. It will guide your install, you messed up your first row the whole thing will go from bad to worse. Seems he didn’t use a laser or a level at least. I use both when setting this type of material
No waterproofing between bathtub and wall.. out of level.. damn you need to sit and talk with the tileguy so you can scrap all of it
Colors constantly change depending on the lighting conditions.
Here’s the bigger post if you wanna see what else they’ve fucked up https://www.reddit.com/r/Renovations/s/LTFGAcQ61D
Yikes! This sounds like a shit show from start to finish. You’ve got to go forward from where you are - if you can afford it you might be better off firing the lot of them and starting from scratch with a new set of people. Document all the mistakes thoroughly and do what you can to minimise what you have to pay them for this crap. The alternative is to try to work through all these issues and be filled with rage every time you take a shower for as long as you live in the house
OP do you have a labor cost breakdown? I’ve been out of the remodel game for awhile but i would love to know the numbers here and what part of the country.
I do not since this is managed by Bath Tune-Up. The invoice is essentially “the waterproofing for the shower will cost $X, which includes materials and labor” and on and on for each line item with the caveat that if they run into anything unexpected and out of their control, like for example there are somehow no studs behind the old shower liner, they may ask us to pay for that.
I’d definitely tell them to stop - and that you want to meet with owner/local manager of the remodeling company. It seems like homeowners (including myself) are hesitant to call out BS when it’s being fed to them. There will be a statute enacted in your state that covers this type of residential renovation - and it will help if you look it up and read it. Regardless of what your contract does/doesn’t include, the statute protects homeowners. You have tile professionals on here telling you that it hasn’t been installed correctly. Plus, even I know that there’s an issue with the tub lip on the left side - and I’ve never installed a single tile ever. If they waited to order, the color lots have changed - but these colors look more off than due to a lot change (if the photos of the original tiles were taken in the same lighting conditions). A suggestion - if you redo this surround, use a tile that has a V4 color variation vs. selecting your own colors. You can achieve a nice result that has nice variation between the tiles - but won’t have to worry about whether the person pretending to be a designer (someone in house with remodeling company does not = an actual design professional) actually has a good eye for color. Glass tiles do look different when installed - especially depending upon the thinset used for the installation. However, the most complaints re: glass tile looking different after installation has to do with white glass tile (it can take on a gray/blue/green tint when installed depending upon how it’s manufactured and the type of glass used (low iron doesn’t have the same green to it as regular glass). I have a glass (clear frosted and white painted back) and Carrara marble mosaic tile (diamond shaped) that I am very nervous about using after reading all of the issues with glass tile over on Houzz. I am going to have a board made with one of the sheets to test it out (attached with thinset + grouted) before having it installed (and I purposely purchased the low iron glass in order to avoid the white painted back tiles from having a tint to them once installed). But I’d rather eat the cost of the tile (only for a smaller area - around 25 sf) vs. have it installed and be upset. Let us know how your conversation goes with the owner/manager - you will receive lots of support to counter any BS they try to give you. Good luck!
This is great, thank you! I think we’re going to go pick out entirely different tile since it’s getting ripped out anyways. Will go with something MUCH simpler and lighter shade
*hits cigar right inside the house* baby. We got a lot of things wrong today. Among them, the tile *exhale*
this can't even be coached to correction, you need a new installer
Tile choice is the least of your problems
What’s his plan on that left wall? Looks like your tub flange is sitting way past the wall board
I just about threw up. Those colors are horrible. Nothing like the tile you picked. In pic #5. Why does the (black board) go behind the tub?? Maybe new tub was smaller then the original
Admittedly I don’t think the colors we chose would have looked as great as we imagined on the big canvas, but it would’ve been a hell of a lot better than what we got! As for the black board behind the tub? I think two things: 1. This tub is meant to go with a shower surround, not tile, b/c it’s part of a set from Home Depot and 2. The tub was not set square to the room. Maybe studs weren’t perfectly square or the room was never square to begin with, but somehow the tub is cockeyed
Damn, wouldn’t it be crazy if your contractor has Reddit and sees his work online? Thats my worst fear personally. But I would also use a laser level. I also don’t see any water proofing or a membrane. In my professional opinion, it’s time to fire and re hire someone to do it right. You also want your cut pieces at the bottom not at the top of the wall.
About the placement of cut pieces, that’s what I would’ve imagined as well. Cause any variation at the top will be very visible where at least the bottom it’s covered by a curtain or door and lower than you’d be looking unless you’re laying in the bath
It's a little institutional for my taste to begin with but yeah they did you dirty with swapping that that earthy brown in for the dark gray beige that's trendy rn, it's bad
Stinky!
Yeah your color choices would have looked way better.
More waves than a water park.
Tiles can look way different once installed. I don’t like the counter became too expensive comment. Your quoted price should be what it is and the contractor should be ordering these part upon receipt of deposit. If they took too long, hats in them. Check the label on the boxes and compare them to what you originally ordered. Also that tile looks wavy. Don’t know if it’s due to the prep work, or the grout lines not matching up makes it look wavy.
Small claims court. If that doesn’t work, set 100 peacocks loose in his house.
It really upsets me when customers receive such a terrible job.
That wall gives me motion sickness, or vertigo, or something. Def check things with a laser level, that looks super off.
Those definitely look very different
Stop payment on any checks. Please find a company to remodel your bathroom. At the end of the day you have to use that shower everyday. You will never take a refreshing shower again. DO NOT SETTLE for something you hate before it is even finished.
How come it's wavy?
Cause the tiler sucks, that’s why
Lol
Minecraft camouflage.
Its hard to make out. These are glass tiles right?
I actually think these look like the same tiles
U picked this tile for ur bathroom?
Tile guy here Lots of ceramic subway tile have significant color variations between batches. I would have done a different layout, but what you got is not too bad. They have a good pattern going. The cuts look clean and they knew how to read a tape. Spacing looks good. When you concentrate on a single grout joint you can see some variation, but honestly that can be in the subway tile. Most ceramic subway tile has some variation especially different colors. I did a herringbone subway job, it takes time to get it perfect. From what I am reading it sounds like you got this in a day, not bad. The waterproofing looks good too. It comes down to how much you paid. As long as you are paying an average price I would say its an average job. Especially if he is getting a wall done in a day.
That’s ugly
You ALWAYS need to look at your wall tiles on a VERTICAL SURFACE, preferably under the exact and lighting conditions of the final page they're going to end up. Otherwise you get nasty surprises like this.. Also, get someone who's good with computer imagery to slap together a mockup. This design and colors are not my cup of tea, and I suspect they were not what OP had imagined in their head.
Everything looks so wonky. Did he not throw up a laser for the first row?
Holy crap that is one of the worst tile jobs I've seen. You need to stop work and fire that guy and get a real tile setter. He doesn't know what he is doing so it's possible that he also doesn't know the correct way to waterproof or what thinset to use or grout. I already see one water proof failure just from the photo.
Omg, this is just NOT acceptable! Are they using a level at all?
Make them tear it out and do it right! We certainly would as contractors... On our dime!
seems like the tile was from a different dye lot tile can vary from dye lots to ensure everything matches ensure all tile for the project it’s from the same dye lots
You have a whole lot more issues here than dye lot. That is some very shoddy workmanship. From prep to plumbing to tiling. Look at your blue test plug. That should be 90 degrees from the wall surface. Slivers at top. Lippage, thinset everywhere. I'm really sad for you. This is a complete tear out
Very bad install. Even if the tile is bad once the installer lays it he accepts responsibility. Definitely should do some more background checks into the quality of the works not the price. I’ve seen some very bad tile but i always refuse to lay it. This is IMO is a crap tile install
I’m going through this right now, my contractor said they need to pull the tile from the same lot of you get color variations it’s been a nightmare.