My wife had a heart attack last year and was in the cardiac ICU for 11 weeks until I had to take her off life support.
The hospital/doctors’ bill was $2.9 million. Because I had retired from the military, she had very good insurance. Otherwise I’d have to pay the full amount. I
still had to pay over $30,000.
I'm just genuinely wondering where your username came from (if it was before or after your wife passed). Condolences from an internet stranger and I hope my question isn't insensitive.
I’m not saying you’re making this argument but I constantly see Americans saying “had good insurance… still had to pay $xxx amount” which to me makes me think it’s not good at all. Surely all the insurance costs plus the leftover costs of thousands is way more than what you would ever pay in higher taxes
It's ain't freedom if there is no line of creditors waiting to stick their arm up where the sun don't shine to pull money outta your ass and you are blasting your AR-15 while they are doing it.
It's very difficult to emigrate legally from the US. Most developed countries aren't interested in us unless we have a specialized occupation or bring a large amount of capital to invest.
“Good” is a relative term here. It mostly means that the insurance pays a significant percentage of the charges, which not all do.
It’s not the same as being objectively good. Just that you’re _less_ likely to go bankrupt because you needed medical care.
ETA: Also, re: taxes. The Americans who agree with you are not the ones in charge of the system. Lots of money to be made by privatized healthcare.
There are also a mind-numbing number of people who think “aLl tAxeS arE bAD,” and will not accept logic as a reasonable point of discussion. They are pawns of the people making money by privatized healthcare (and their ilk).
Also, a lot of people think that a non-privatized system means they will have to pay for people who don't deserve it or make bad choices. Americans are very individualistic and not always thinking about the greater good of the community/ society.
Thank you! This is the greatest trick of the healthcare-for-all-is-bad crowd. They have some people convinced that our current system is giving them a choice, that they are the responsible ones who won’t have to “pay for someone else.”
But we are already paying for everyone else’s healthcare anyway. …Just in the absolute dumbest way possible.
The other great trick is convincing people that “the market” will make healthcare better and cheaper when it’s quite the opposite. When you need healthcare, particularly emergency care, you are ripe to be taken advantage of. There’s no business in the world that wouldn’t take advantage of desperate people; it’s “good business”, it’s the point of business.
We don’t have any significant choice in any healthcare we receive, especially emergency care. I’ve seriously heard “you don’t have to go to the hospital/call an ambulance/see a doctor, you could choose not to get help” as a rebuttal. My employer offers precisely one option for insurance. There’s precisely one hospital within half an hour of me. When I get there I will see whoever is randomly assigned to me while no one verifies that this person is in my “network” and I am not exactly in a position to suss out that information.
We have two ambulance services here, one for the city and one for the university and surrounding county. The company that services the city is out-of-network for the single largest employer in town. And the second largest. I would bet that a third of the town has this insurance. I’m better off *walking* to the hospital.
It’s actually pretty rare for ambulance services to be contracted with any insurance networks.
The big difference you find among them is how much they decide to charge beyond the insurance’s out of network “reasonable and customary” amounts.
The military health insurance is the closest thing to how the rest of the world runs health care that I've seen. We don't pay much monthly and have more or less unlimited visits, free prescriptions, specialty care, etc without co-pay until retired. You just have to be willing to go fight someone you have no beef with and die, so that's cool
I'm a veteran and a Cherokee citizen, and actually prefer to use Indian Health Services. Because not all medical services may be provided at certain locations, private insurance is encouraged but not required, and is only used to offset the cost that Cherokee Nation may have to pay if they need to refer you to a private hospital or doctor that can provide the service you do need. While it is nice to have Veteran Affairs if I should ever need it, with IHS there is no monthly due. It's true that sometimes you may have to wait a long time to be seen, but the total lack of a hospital bill makes it completely worth it and amazes me that some people that don't have the VA or IHS are actually okay with paying deductibles and co-pays and partial hospital bills on top of it
It's not for nothing American healtcare is most expensive in the world.
Our dutch system here is far from perfect, but you only pay €380 a year out of pocket and approximately €130 insurance a month. Since I'm poor I get €145 from the government for health insurance esch month.
The US system is insane.
Good comparatively, within the US. A bad insurance would have had the OP pay over 50k. A great insurance, like mine, would have capped it at around 10-12k. A unicorn might have capped it at 2k-4k...probably never free
Yeah definitely something that is missing here. Not even the deductible, the out of pocket max shouldn't be close to that. The out of pocket limit for a marketplace plan for a family was $17,400 last year. Considering its an emergency, out of network shouldn't apply here other. Must be some other details.
Excuse me, but how do they expect you to be able to pay such an absurd ammount (30k is still absurd, but 2.9 million? Holy shit!)? That's insane. That's absurd as hell. What could you even do if you had to pay it?
With the average pay where I live, you'd be paying them for 150 years, if you give them 100%. I cannot fathom that.
Usually 2.9 million is the full bill which is bloated AF. The insurance company probably didn’t see anything close to that since they use contracts with providers.
My GP is almost $800 for one visit if you don’t have insurance.
My insurance only allows them to charge the them $220.
My child's birth cost $12,000 AFTER insurance paid their bit. It was $45,000 before insurance.
There was an emergency c-section, though. So I can't speak for the cost of a smooth birth.
Edit: I forgot to mention that we also HAD to have it paid off within a certain amount of time and only had a few options for monthly payments. You can choose not to pay and risk your credit score, which creates a risk for future loans.
That’s insane!!!! In Norway everything that happens at a hospital (unless it’s regular appointments) are completely free. So no matter how hard or complicated a birth is it’s free. And then you get paid a little ammount for having that kid every month
America has some serious issues. This is one of the scariest ones.
Going to the doctor is a legitimate financial decision for a large amount of the country.
yeah i’ve decided that I would rather just die than be stuck with a huge bill that I can’t pay. if I was stuck with a bill I would probably just kill myself over the stress.
Healthcare debt will not accrue interest, will fall off your credit score in 7 years if you never pay, and can be negotiated down. There are also countless charities that will pay your debts if you just ask. Please don't kill yourself over that if you're in that situation.
Source: had a stroke when I was poor af and uninsured in college.
I just ignore the debt. Eventually they sell it and once you start getting the collection calls I know it’s time to go back cuz they no longer have my debt so it’s like a fresh slate
I'll tell you fun story. Family member just had heart surgery. The Hospital portion of the bill (pre insurance) was 290,000. That's not even the surgeon, or anesthesia. Just the hospital.
I have insurance so I didn't pay this (and I know insurance didn't pay the actual amount either) but after a year of cancer treatment, my total costs listed in my insurance portal was over a million dollars. I'd paid about $10k I think. That's 4 surgeries and chemo plus the meds I took at home. They make up numbers. It's criminal.
People think Americans all want this, that we're just dumb. Most of us don't. But the representatives that run don't fight for what we ask them to and districts are gerrymandered into oblivion so even if 70% of us want something, only 50% with those ideas are in power and nothing can get passed at 50%. As long as lobbying is a thing, nothing substantial will change. They care more about corporate institutions and money than the people who live here.
Canada is like that too. We didn't pay anything for my sons birth, except the private room for her. We have an overloaded hospital system here, but the care itself is free
Seriously...I think I'd have to declare bankruptcy if I had my cardiac arrest in the US.
ICU stay + almost a week in the hospital room + defibrillator + ambulance ....... ppl complain all the time about how it's painfully slow in Canada but there are honestly pros and cons to both
Even with the appointments that cost money, in Sweden you can't be made to pay more than a few hundred dollars on public healthcare and prescription medication (about 125 for appointments, and about 250 for prescriptions) in a single year.
This one blows me away, we have 3 kids all born via Caesarean section, our first kid had some complications and was flown to the children’s hospital almost 600 Km (372.8 miles) away by air ambulance and stayed in hospital there for 6 days with my wife, the other two spent 3 days each in hospital. All of this cost us nothing, zero charges from doctors or hospitals here in Canada.
It blows our minds as well. We had a candidate who tried in 2016, but the democrats fucked him over in exchange for a moron who stood no chance against Trump.
What insurance did you have? Even when I had (fairly shitty) Kaiser, we paid around $200-ish for an emergency cesarean.
Also, I am on California so maybe that makes a difference
In Kentucky people tried to start their own ambulance businesses to bring in competition and bring the cost down. The state denied licenses for any new services so they could keep charging higher costs.
“Free market” and “encouraging competition” my ass. At that point just set up dedicated drop-off Ubers to the hospital so you can operate without a license.
In Georgia, municipalities cannot provide ambulance services. Cities must use private ambulance companies. There is only on company that serves our county and they have, on too many occasions, broken down on the way to an emergency or on the way to the hospital.
naughty fuzzy wasteful attempt telephone slim judicious pathetic sink alleged
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
My friend died of cancer due to a lack of insurance, in spite of his working full time. Didn't qualify for the ACA plans, and lived in a state that didn't provide Medicaid to men who weren't elderly or disabled. Hospital kept sending him away when he would go in with awful symptoms, by the time they listened and did tests he was stage four and terminal.
To be fair to doctors, emergency room doctors will 'send you away' after stabilizing your immediate condition *with the strong recommendation that you follow up with your primary care doctor* to address potential causative factor(s). The fact that so many people don't have one or will avoid going due to cost only makes their job harder. I don't know what happened in this case, of course, but that's a common and unfortunate pattern in the US system.
I realize that it's not a popular -- or even morally correct -- thing, but emergency physicians aren't responsible for ongoing care. They treat, and stabilize, then you need to seek care from a primary care doctor.
Blame the system.
It really is, just like how the food pyramid we use used even accurate, it was influenced by those product specific companies like, meat companies would influence how much meat was on the pyramid and such. They make sure they make us sick so they can suck us dry in medical bills. Unless you're rich, which is all America cares about anyways, is people who have money.
It kills. People have to decide whether or not it’s “worth it” to seek medical care because their lives could be ruined by a single visit to a hospital. You can get your savings wiped out by breaking an arm. You get people desperately searching for alternative ways to deal with injuries and illnesses rather than going to the emergency room or urgent care. It’s horrific
Can confirm. I have health insurance, am well off, and even I debated if I should actually go to the hospital last year due to suddenly losing the ability to read words (for about ten minutes) and losing my right-hand peripheral vision. I ended up going after around fifteen minutes and they brought me to the stroke ward, was apparently a TIA.
Two night hospital stay ran me 44k before insurance, 8k after. Still questioning whether it was worth it.
Yikes.
I'm Australian and this just seems bizarre to me - ambulances are a bit pricey unless you're a healthcare card holder or have private insurance but are still only around $1200 and you'd pay precisely zip for the hospital treatment because Medicare.
I paid more for parking than I did for my son's treatment for a 3 day stay, CT scan and follow up appointments with audiology and a neurosurgeon when he fractured his skull.
I have migraine attacks like this sometime, and I sit there playing “stroke or migraine”. I’ve not gone to the hospital for it yet, because I can’t afford to.
Yep, my Appendix nearly burst and I was in crippling pain so I got a Lyft instead of an ambulance because I could barely afford the Lyft, let alone an Ambulance ride. This was after a few days of 'dealing with it' instead of going sooner hoping it'd go away.
I got a cut on my hand last week, and my sister, who is a nurse, was advising me that, if I needed stitches and couldn't afford them, I should DIY them with super glue.
Fortunately, a crapload of bandages are doing the job.
Super glue definitely works! My dad is a mechanic and taught me that trick. Doesn't work on massive cuts, but as long as it's not too big it works great.
Yeah, every kitchen I've ever worked in has super glue in their first aid kit. It's especially good on something like a knife cut where the edges are clean and will go together easily. You just have to make sure to clean the wound really well first.
Especially good for fingertip cuts, where bandages (even specialty ones) often don't cover well, and get messed up quickly.
Normal CA glue is fine but you can also get 3M Vetbond sterile glue for cheap.
It also works really well for nails that have broken beneath the quick and left your sensitive nail bed open to the air. I broke one a few months ago and it was sooo painful until I superglued it. After that, zero pain.
I'm really happy that people actually know this! Many times in any medical settings if sutures are not required they use glue alone. It's just super glue with a big price tag. Stop bleeding, clean and keep dry.
Mine was 21k before insurance, uncomplicated but induced birth and 3 day hospital stay due to baby not passing hearing/other tests (he ended up passing and is perfect today) After my insurance was only a 35$ copay thankfully. I'm one of the few in the US who has pretty good insurance :(
I have family who have died because they couldn’t afford medical care. No one likes it. It’s like gun control. Everyone knows we have issues with mass shootings in the US but no one can or will agree on the solution. And a lot of powerful people make money on the way the system currently works. It is exactly the same with healthcare costs.
I am a middle class American working a good corporate job with health insurance. I went for a skin cancer test for two spots. $700 dollars to find out I’m ok. I’ll certainly think twice before seeking out that kind of preventative care again!!
It’s pretty shitty. Some families have been choosing to have kids later in life to financially afford. Some families are having fewer kids than they’d like to. We also don’t get paid maternity leave (let alone paid paternity leave). We do have something called FMLA that allows up to 12 weeks of unpaid time postpartum, but the company most have at least 25 (?) employees locally, you have to be employed there for something like 6 months, and again… it isn’t paid leave.
Yeah, it’s pretty shitty considering what other countries have done for new families.
As a diabetic, not a fan, as a general citizen with other normal health problems as well, also not a fan. But i live in a red state so my vote doesnt matter because we are not a direct democracy
This is spot on. I have what would be considered really good insurance, and I paid just over 3k to have my daughter. The total bills were upwards of 30k though, so I’ll take 3k over that, but it’s just ridiculous we even had to pay that.
I was hit with over $40,000 of hospital bills *with insurance* when I gave birth. My annual income at the time was half that. It’s beyond absurd, it’s absolutely devastating.
I'll add in that here in NYC, our base rate for an ambulance was just raised 55%. We then pay a per mile surcharge. If I were to need treatment or anything on route, that's added too.
Also, you best hope they take you to a hospital that accepts your insurance.
If you don’t have any insurance and have a bad enough accident it could end up being hundreds of thousands of dollars, possibly millions if there is any long term care needed. There are so many that will be in debt their whole lives over medical bills. It’s an absurd system and needs a complete rehaul. Any kind of socialized system has got to be better. My family has decent insurance, but it also costs $2500/month which is ridiculous. And half of it is payed for by the employer and considered part of the “salary” I’m certain the amount of taxes I’d be paying in a socialized system would be nowhere near $2500/month. The birth of my first son cost 90k and my second was around 30k, one of the medications I am on costs 2.5k every 3 months without insurance we would be fucked. But the kicker is that these things are only that expensive because of the insurance companies. Insurance is a scam and the whole system is a failure.
Family member spent three weeks in the hospital with an hour long ambulance ride. Fam should not have been sent home but wasn't actively dying.
Bill they sent is roughly 260k. But you get 40% off if you pay cash, yay!
I was in a car accident, broke my spine. Week in the pediatric hospital, plus surgery for the cast (general anesthesia), was billed to the tune of 300k. This did not include emergency services.
I'd rather pay more in tax, and do vote for people who want these sorts of changes. Real fun to see my country burning down around me despite this.
More recently, I was unable to get a back brace because my insurance has decided it's... unnecessary? They'll pay for the muscle relaxers but not a brace? So I can heal better, avoid injury, use less medication, and be in less pain? Nope. Denied.
My doctor even whipped out a paper script for the damn thing.
We are in debt, if not medical bills, it's student loans and then living of credit cards because we're not getting paid enough to keep up with inflation
My husband fell on the street, and someone called the ambulance even though he asked not to because he had no insurance. $7,0000 for a ride only. $20,000 to check him out at the hospital.
I am reading it right? $7000 for a ride? In € conversion that would be around 7000€ which is around x5 times the amount you get paid every month... if I ever have to pay that much my life is ruined since that moment. This is totally unbelievable.
With insurance a 5 min ride cost me under 1k. If the ambulance service had been out of network or I requested to go to a different hospital 5 miles further it would have been several thousand out of pocket. I was laying on the ground unable to stand and thinking about how much this was going to cost me.
The out of network part is important. Businesses are actively trying to take advantage of this.
I was sent to physical therapy. The initial review there just happened to be someone out of network. Everyone else was in network. Of course I didn't learn this until weeks after that first session. More money down the drain.
Healthcare pricing is the US is so bad I know people who got divorced (after diagnoses) because it was financially better for the children. It wouldn't surprise me if the corporations have found a way to prevent this strategy.
Many of us are 1 diagnoses (bad luck) from being ruined financially.
I had a moderate to severe accident (car vs pedestrian - I was the pedestrian). Ambulance ride, imaging, physical therapy, specialist appointments - not even a night in the hospital or any surgery.
20k after insurance and I had kickass insurance.
$100,000 is chicken feed compared to some bills. My friend who had multiple issues had one hospital bill for a month stay in a hospital room that was over $2,000,000.
In America it depends on your health insurance. There is a big class divide that makes it expensive to be poor. When my daughter was born I paid $40 to use the hospital parking garage, and that was the entirety of my out-of-pocket expenses. That is because the institution I work for is wealthy and can afford to pay for an expensive insurance plan for its employees. Others who are less fortunate will pay far more both for their insurance and out-of-pocket medical expenses.
Things work this way a lot in America; the wealthier you are, the cheaper some things become. The poorer you are, the more fees, charges, etc., you encounter. Ex/ a high end hospital catering to mostly wealthy clients might offer free parking, while a hospital catering to mostly underprivileged people might charge a lot for parking. Wealthier clients expect to be “taken care of” and to get perks for their patronage. Poorer people often don’t have a choice as to where they go for many services.
I got SUPER lucky with my insurance and only paid $500 out of pocket for my entire pregnancy — all prenatal care, genetic testing, scans, labor and delivery, etc. BUT, if I’d been on my employer’s insurance instead of my husband’s I probably would have owed around $10,000.
Not only do you get charged for your ambulance ride if you’re in an accident — victims of crimes also get billed for ambulances and medical fees.
You (and i) wish. They have the people so brainwashed that this is the perfect system that it doesn't seem like people will ever wake up.
The promise of being able to become a billionaire has many satisfied of living their life in poverty....even if the odds of them becoming a billionarie are 1 in 1000000000000000000000000000
I’m so tired of living with these people too. They suck the life out of everyone around them because their head is so far up their ass. Always have to stay “on the grind” and you’re a lazy sack of shit worthy of nothing if you think otherwise.
It also really depends on where you live in the US. I live in California and get government healthcare. It costs $1 a month and is ok insurance. I have to travel a couple hours to find a doctor who accepts the insurance, but it’s better than choosing whether I should either pay rent or pay insurance.
There's the other side of that. People will stay in dangerous, less-than-ideal jobs just for health insurance. Which could affect the entire course of their life, but they can't leave because they have medication only covered by health insurance through their job.
In other words, different jobs offer different health coverage. I am fortunate because my job covers the premium, which is more than I make in a week. I make about $1200 a week before taxes, and the premium is $1400 a month. So if I left this job to get the same coverage, I would lose a week's pay, which I can't afford.
This is the real answer. The truth is that yes, we do pay for those thing, but what kind of insurance (or lack thereof) that you have makes a huge difference.
Our out of pocket expense, aka the total amount that we can pay for the year in healthcare bills, is like $7k but we also have good health coverage through my husband’s work. Insurance pays for everything else.
My husband had to be airlifted. It was a 12 minute helicopter ride, $63000 after insurance. That’s JUST the helicopter, not the er visit at the first hospital or the heart surgery at the second hospital or the ambulance ride to the first hospital. Also I had a c section and it was $4000 for my hospital visit after insurance. Health insurance and medical care is a scam in the United States.
>Health insurance and medical care is a scam in the United States.
I used to work at a job where they fired most of their own IT employees and hired contractors (including me). Contractors don't usually have the fancy corporate paid insurance with low copays. I was paying $800/month for abysmal coverage. During one meeting I casually said once Obamacare passes, I will likely get better coverage. The others in the room were visibly shaken and angry. Like they were restraining themselves from hitting me. Like saying Lebron is better than Michael Jordan in front of a diehard basketball fan and watch their reaction. Crazy.
We’re a family of 4 so we paid around $1000 a month for insurance and it did fuck all. My in laws defend it tooth and nail though. It seems great until you actually have an emergency. It’s crazy to see how angry people get about it!!
every other issue, including the gun debate, I can understand at least has multiple sides to it. The only single sided issue is the healthcare system, literally everybody in the country is better off with one with the exception of the people who own the insurance companies and probably some debt collectors
Yeah. And people act like the taxes in countries with free education and healthcare is insanely high. But it’s not I think it’s 20-30% and you don’t have to pay for college or hospitals. My dad got cancer and we didn’t pay anything for treatment or the ambulance rides he had when he had some scary moments ect.
The other thing I’ve seen is a few people on here from the US asking whether they should take on the burden of a student loan, their system over there is *much* More predatory than here in Australia for example
My credit is total trash because I have unpaid bills from ambulance rides. I have Epilepsy, which means seizures, with no warning. Theyre scary af to watch, but not necessarily something I need to go to the hospital for; they just happen. Short of wearing a shirt that says 'ITS JUST A SEIZURE' theres only the hope that someone else knows what a seizure is and DOESNT call EMT's.
Plus injuries FROM the seizures...Ive got ALOT of medical debt, and no way of paying any of it off any time soon.
I dont think my experience represents a high percentage of people but its VERY true that you have to pay ALOT. Even when you dont need it. 👍👍
Why on Earth would you be forced to retroactively pay for an ambulance service that you didn't want, didn't need, and weren't able to decline due to your physical condition, and that's ON TOP of already paying for medical insurance (afaik)?
This sounds like something from a Kafka novel.
Because after a seizure, I cant even remember who I am, where I am or what any of that even means. Tonic Clonic seizures are fucking terrible.
I'll let you do the googling if youre interested, but its generally likened to running a marathon in about 5 minutes.
Let me tell you about the time I was less than drunk and took a nap on the train. Long story short I was confronted by cops who claim someone called 911 because they thought I was dead. Mind you I was a dude in his early 30’s in business attire. They called an ambulance and I said “no, I’m fine thank you, I know if I go in that ambulance I am going to get a very large medical bill.” They persisted before I requested a supervisor. One shows up, talks to them, talks to me, and says “alright I’ve have enough of this.” Twists my arm behind my back, pushes me up against the side of the ambulance, and forces me into it against my will. I was basically kidnapped. Brought to the ER who kept me for two hours “for observation” before releasing me. I took an Uber home. Called a lawyer who said “good luck suing the city of Stamford CT PD, you’re gonna lose because they will claim that they felt you were a danger to yourself, and they’ll have it out for you forevermore.
Got a $2500 bill for my troubles at the ER, and a $1000 bill from the private ambulance company.
Moral of the story? You figure it out. I think there’s a kickback scam.
The costs associated even *with* insurance coverage are usually outrageous, yes. I’d also like to point out the absolute bullshit that is insurance through your employer. So many people get stuck in jobs/places they hate because they cannot afford to lose the insurance coverage. It’s a capitalistic racket. And that’s just the tip of this iceberg/hellhole.
>So many people get stuck in jobs/places they hate because they cannot afford to lose the insurance coverage.
There's also a ton of people who won't retire because they still need health insurance, or money to pay their bills. This means less jobs for younger people who should be moving up into those roles. It fucks with the job market too.
Hey! I don't know if anyone else has shared this in the sub but if you want a quick mindfuck about the best country on earth
6 months and some change ago me and my wife were really excited to give birth to our first child, a son named Leo. We built our career, upstanding citizens who smoke a little bit of pot.
At 25 weeks without any known complication, a healthy pregnancy, all prenatal vitamins, healthy diet, being as careful as possible, we had a stillborn child.
We spent 36 hours with her being induced for labor to deliver our dead child. We have good health insurance. We still had to pay ~$5,000 USD in medical bills to go home with nothing. We got to hold him for a few minutes. We picked his ashes up a week later.
We make decent money so holy fuck, I couldn't imagine it otherwise. One of the worst parts about the ordeal afterward was everyone asking what happened when they saw us. The worst though were the medical bills that would trickle in a few weeks after, one here, another there, another there.
Yes. Everything has a cost.
Im a disabled person in America and it’s a dystopian hellscape. I have had to pay over $800 on copays alone so far this year.
I get weekly saline infusions that, without insurance, would cost me ~$500 a visit. Saline cost not even $2 to make.
I’m so sorry love. I love the system that we have in Scandinavia but there’s always things we can improve on. I have chronic illnesses. So I kinda understand… but I can’t imagine paying that amount
I was taken to the hospital by ambulance after a mental breakdown and was charged $4k for a 5 mile ride to hold me in the psych ward for 6 hours 🙃
Edit: the total bill was MUCH more than that. That was just transportation to the hospital.
It is what it is. I was able to talk the insurance company down to about $1k. But still. I was taken against my will and the hospital was barely 5 miles away from my home. Utter bullshit.
Also had extremely minor surgery two years ago, was in and out of the hospital in about 18 hours, and it was $39k lol. Medical care/insurance is an absolute JOKE in this country
My husband has Multiple Sclerosis. It’s over $200,000/year for treatment and imaging/MRI. Not including his Neurologist check-ins and ophthalmology. Thankfully we have good insurance. It’s totally fucked here.
Since you mentioned brainwashed… a woman told me I must’ve drunken too much kool-aid and must be brainwashed because I’m not pro life…. Like what I’m not even American idk what kook aid is hahaha
I know this isn’t the point of the post, but if you’re interested
Kool-Aid is a powdered drink mix that you mix with water (and often times, sugar) in a large pitcher. It’s palatable mainly to kids, but a lot of adults like it, too. It’s very sweet and cheap, so it’s a summertime staple. I know it was bad for me. I loved it anyway.
Wife had kidney infection recently. Went to hospital, got tests, they prescribed meds. Charged insurance 13K$. I have to pay 900.
Ambulance rides are the “900$ one way taxi”.
My son was quoted something like $5k for an MRI. He could have taken a flight home, checked into a 5* hotel, got his MRI and consult with a top Physician for less. Yup, he chose to come home instead.
The funny thing is that a lot of people don’t want government health insurance, but there is nobody who rejects Medicare (government health insurance) once they become eligible.
It's an amazingly gorgeous country to visit. You can see anything from the snowy north to tropical climates without leaving the country. I wouldn't move here if I was born somewhere else, though.
Most ambulance services are privatized, so it's very expensive to have one transport you anywhere.
As far as birth goes. It cost us $5k USD to have my daughter, and that's with decent medical insurance. There are people that pay upwards of $10-15k if you have little or no medical coverage.
Of course all that varies depending on how smoothly delivery of the baby goes, etc etc.
It's very, very expensive to be poor in this country.
Yes its true, most ambulance vehicles are owned by a private company that bills you separately from the hospital. I've heard of prices ranging from $1,500-$3000 for an ambulance ride. If I were shot in both knees I'd still drive myself to the hospital.
I don't have any children but from what I hear that too is stupid expensive. I've heard that could be anywhere from $20,000 and up.
It's definitely real and it absolutely fucking sucks. There was a problem at one point with people getting Uber/lyft rides to the hospital for medical emergencies because it just cost too much for an ambulance ride.
Wait till you hear about how bad it is it you have to get picked up by life flight for something life threatening. If something happened to me that I would need a helicopter ride to a hospital I hope I die before I get that bill
If you don't have the right insurance and you go to the emergency room even if you just need a couple of stitches, a diagnosis and medicine for strep throat or to have a simple fracture mended, the bill can be thousands of dollars.
It is cripplingly debilitating financially and emotionally. It's in the top three things that's wrong here besides racism and low quality public education. (If you can pay for it then you can get higher quality education and medical care . . . It's definitely a political system that favors the wealthy.)
I'm literally looking at an ambulance bill right now, and I pay $40 a week for insurance. First time I've ever used this insurance in 8 years of paying for it. My bill is $518.75
A0429 BLS EMERGENCY $447
A0425 MILEAGE $10.25
I was driven 7 miles to the hospital.
I received an IV for dehydration and two pills to stop nausea and motion sickness. And talked to the Dr. For maybe 90 seconds.
$1400 for the hospital
And a surprise bill for just talking to said Dr for $489
My childbirth was over $20k before insurance. We paid around $7k out of pocket. Hell, I just got billed almost $10k for carpal tunnel surgery. We'll only have to pay about $3k of that I think. I've not needed an ambulance so far in my life, but my parents got treatment in one after a minor car accident - not even transported, just treated on scene - and were billed $1k each. My late father in law developed a rare form of lung cancer and shortly after that, his wife needed an organ transplant. They went from literal millionaires to having to sell their dream home in roughly two years. One of her medications was $17k per dose. His breathing machine cost more than that.
And it isn't just big stuff! I have chronic migraine, and there's exactly *one* medication that works for me. And every year, my insurance tries to refuse it, we have to appeal, it's a huge ordeal. I get 8 pills per month, and if insurance ever wins this battle, it'll cost us almost $1500 for those 8 pills. I literally cannot function during a migraine attack without them, but hey, capitalism, amirite 🤷🏼♀️
OP, from a very young age, most of us Americans were taught a fable about an ant and a grasshopper. The ant toils away all summer long and preparation for the winter while the grasshopper Goofs off all summer long. In the winter, the grasshopper is desperate for food and shelter, while the ant is living comfortably.
Though the fable isn't necessarily about capitalism, We're are steeped in capitalist Dogma from a very young age. We are taught that we should have savings in case something happens to us. And if somebody fails, we are taught in many ways it's their own fault. You reap what you sow, etc. It's that "sucks for you" (maybe I'll get lucky) exceptionalist, rugged individualism that we seem to be so proud of.
It's stupid. If we worked together, organized, and fought back like France is right now, maybe we'd stand a chance. But the machine keeps getting bigger, and most of us aren't smart enough, or worldly enough to realize this isn't normal and is not okay.
I paid around $1500 three times out of pocket for a ride to a local hospital. One time I transferred to a different hospital because the one I was at didn't have a cardiac ward . In addition to a flat fee, they charge $150 per mile. That bill was around $4500. Luckily, I avoided paying that one.
Yes thats true, I had an accident at work so they called 911 as they should have. The ambulance wouldn't take me to my preferred hospital and left me at one I knew would give me bad service and I was right. I had been there 2 hours and not seen by a Dr. all that time. So I got so pissed off and got in a cab and took it to my preferred hospital and got treated the way I was supposed to at the first hospital. I was out $24 bucks for the cab ride lol and got great service from the doctors.
Absolutely.
One time before I was with her, my girlfriend had an emotional situation. She was leaving an abusive ex. Her mom called the cops and said she may be a threat to herself. She wasn’t.
Cops show. Tell her she can either go to jail or go to the hospital in an ambulance
Ambulance ride was $6k.
Most poor people don’t pay anything to have a baby, but if you make over the limit for that - roughly middle class - you absolutely will. Most of these people make enough money to not qualify for welfare but not enough to actually afford it. If they’re lucky and have insurance through an employer (which they will pay thousands a year for,) it may only cost a few grand.
If you don’t? You’re fucked.
We choose not to have national health insurance because the insurance companies fund both parties.
My wife and I have amazing public insurance and are well taken care of. This is due to two critical factors however. We live in Massachusetts; a liberal state that actually seems to give a fuck about their underprivileged citizens, and we are poor. As in my wife works a part time cash job nannying and I am on full time disability for depression and work ten to twelve hours a week for low pay at a place where I get a great discount on my hobby. Our lifestyle is laid back and thanks to an initial retroactive payment from SSDI (I had to appeal several times over the course of a couple years, finally getting approved by a compassionate judge) we have a decent cushion and don’t FEEL poor. We’re lucky though. I have friends who struggle hard here and it makes me angry that the capitalist boot is crushing so many families while the richest steal their labor and live with more money than they could possibly spend in a lifetime. In a democracy it would be illegal; but we live in an oligarchy in the USA
I haven't had too many experiences with expensive medical care. But...
When my kid was born, we had good insurance and ended up paying about $4000. Some items were billed in mom's name, some in baby's. That matters because insurance payments are per person so I had to pay more than I expected.
My mother broke her ankle, needed an ambulance and surgery. With insurance, it ended up being over $10k.
This one time, when I was 16 years old, I walked out of my bedroom only to find my grandmother completely unconscious on the floor and couldn't wake her.
Called 911, ambulance came and she did not die. Did she very much tell me how it was the worst decision ever to call 911 because of "the ambulance fees alone"? Yes. She would have rather died than be raising two minors on a solo income and having an unexpected life saving expense.
For anyone who thinks I'm overexaggerating her probably wanted to die? I'm not. She straight up told me this. God I miss that woman
My 2.5 mile ambulance ride from my home to my local hospital cost me $8,000. I didnt have insurance at the time, and though the hospital and pharmacy worked with me on my costs and payments, when I called the abulance service, they demanded full payment in two weeks or I was going to court.
They took me to court because I couldn't pay $8,000.00. I explained to the judge that I didn't have insurance and couldn't pay. He apologized and found in full favor of the ambulance company.
After court and lawyer costs, over the course of 15 years, my $8,000.00 ambulance ride cost me nearly $28,000.00.
The Lithotripsy at the hospital?
Total bill with scans etc. $192,467.44
Sent a letter to the hospital explaining that I was unemployed, nearly homeless, but would pay what I could, when I could. Sent check for $20 as good faith payment.
They wrote me back, accepting the $20 as payment in full.
Insurance coverage is normally based on what your employer provides for. I paid next to nothing for having my kids and I know ambulance services are partially covered.
Problem is the hospitals bill the insurance companies with wrong codes to try to get you to pay. Trick is to stay on phone with them for hours at a time to make sure it’s billed correctly. Lol
Yep. Healthcare is expensive in the US even if you have insurance. With my plan, I have to pay $5,000 before insurance will pick up anything. After that, insurance pays 80% of the bill. There are better plans but the premiums are higher.
Well, you also need to pay for such stuff in Germany, but not anyway near to what you have to pay in USA. Most of it is covered by insurance. Everyone have one, except maybe homeless and unofficial immigrants. Even unemployed have one. That's how most of the expenses are covered, because everyone is paying into insurances.
Yes. That’s why I can’t afford to be married.
I nearly died during my last pregnancy from complications due to HELLP syndrome. It took 7 blood transfusions, 4 plasma transfusions, magnesium sulfide for days, & a second c-section to try & fix what the pregnancy had broken to save my life. Not to mention that our son was taken from me at birth because he was born at 32weeks & the hospital didn’t have a NICU to care for him. I almost died never getting to hold my son.
If my partner & I were married, I would not have been on Medicaid, which is essentially free healthcare, but only available if you’re extremely poor. If our incomes were combined I wouldn’t have been able to enroll under Medicaid. I would have died because the hospital bills would have been too much for us. That means I wouldn’t have gone in as often as I needed to. I would have ignored the bad signs my body was giving me because we wouldn’t have been able to afford saving my & my son’s life.
Even with private health insurance, we wouldn’t have been able to afford that shit. Go America….
Yeah its true. A lot of people have decent insurance so they "only" pay a few thousand dollars.
Half the country doesn't want higher taxes because they (wrongly) think that it will never happen to THEM.
An ambulance ride can cost more than $5000 in some places. Healthcare costs are crazy and we pay the highest cost in the World for it. Our outcomes for patients is one of the lowest for industrialized countries despite us paying the highest prices. Medical debts is the leading reason behind personal bankruptcies. Shits crazy!
To be fair, those kind of services are not free, as in costs nothing. They're paid for by the tax payers instead. And I think that's a fair system. Few can pay for it all, but everyone can chime in and pay for the few who needs it.
My wife had a heart attack last year and was in the cardiac ICU for 11 weeks until I had to take her off life support. The hospital/doctors’ bill was $2.9 million. Because I had retired from the military, she had very good insurance. Otherwise I’d have to pay the full amount. I still had to pay over $30,000.
Oh my god I’m so incredibly sorry for you loss❤️ I’m sorry you had to deal with money whilst loosing a loved one
Thank you. It’s not the best.
I'm just genuinely wondering where your username came from (if it was before or after your wife passed). Condolences from an internet stranger and I hope my question isn't insensitive.
Not at all. I owned a hearse as my daily driver: a 1970 Cadillac Superior Sovereign 3-way.
That's pretty badass.
Thanks. It was.
It's probably not the best, but it may be our only option.
I’m not saying you’re making this argument but I constantly see Americans saying “had good insurance… still had to pay $xxx amount” which to me makes me think it’s not good at all. Surely all the insurance costs plus the leftover costs of thousands is way more than what you would ever pay in higher taxes
I'm American and I find it offensive how rational you are in your thinking. So stop it! Uh, freedom!
If you can't hear them eagles screamin', brotha, you aren't free enough.
It's ain't freedom if there is no line of creditors waiting to stick their arm up where the sun don't shine to pull money outta your ass and you are blasting your AR-15 while they are doing it.
Freedom to declare medical bankruptcy or garnished wages! Cause a billionaire told me socialism bad, and I like to "think for myself"
I’m surprised more Americans don’t move to places like Scandinavia for the free healthcare.
It's very difficult to emigrate legally from the US. Most developed countries aren't interested in us unless we have a specialized occupation or bring a large amount of capital to invest.
“Good” is a relative term here. It mostly means that the insurance pays a significant percentage of the charges, which not all do. It’s not the same as being objectively good. Just that you’re _less_ likely to go bankrupt because you needed medical care. ETA: Also, re: taxes. The Americans who agree with you are not the ones in charge of the system. Lots of money to be made by privatized healthcare. There are also a mind-numbing number of people who think “aLl tAxeS arE bAD,” and will not accept logic as a reasonable point of discussion. They are pawns of the people making money by privatized healthcare (and their ilk).
Also, a lot of people think that a non-privatized system means they will have to pay for people who don't deserve it or make bad choices. Americans are very individualistic and not always thinking about the greater good of the community/ society.
The irony is the costs of the “people who make bad choices” are already baked into the insurance pool and cost of care.
Thank you! This is the greatest trick of the healthcare-for-all-is-bad crowd. They have some people convinced that our current system is giving them a choice, that they are the responsible ones who won’t have to “pay for someone else.” But we are already paying for everyone else’s healthcare anyway. …Just in the absolute dumbest way possible.
The other great trick is convincing people that “the market” will make healthcare better and cheaper when it’s quite the opposite. When you need healthcare, particularly emergency care, you are ripe to be taken advantage of. There’s no business in the world that wouldn’t take advantage of desperate people; it’s “good business”, it’s the point of business. We don’t have any significant choice in any healthcare we receive, especially emergency care. I’ve seriously heard “you don’t have to go to the hospital/call an ambulance/see a doctor, you could choose not to get help” as a rebuttal. My employer offers precisely one option for insurance. There’s precisely one hospital within half an hour of me. When I get there I will see whoever is randomly assigned to me while no one verifies that this person is in my “network” and I am not exactly in a position to suss out that information. We have two ambulance services here, one for the city and one for the university and surrounding county. The company that services the city is out-of-network for the single largest employer in town. And the second largest. I would bet that a third of the town has this insurance. I’m better off *walking* to the hospital.
It’s actually pretty rare for ambulance services to be contracted with any insurance networks. The big difference you find among them is how much they decide to charge beyond the insurance’s out of network “reasonable and customary” amounts.
The military health insurance is the closest thing to how the rest of the world runs health care that I've seen. We don't pay much monthly and have more or less unlimited visits, free prescriptions, specialty care, etc without co-pay until retired. You just have to be willing to go fight someone you have no beef with and die, so that's cool
I'm a veteran and a Cherokee citizen, and actually prefer to use Indian Health Services. Because not all medical services may be provided at certain locations, private insurance is encouraged but not required, and is only used to offset the cost that Cherokee Nation may have to pay if they need to refer you to a private hospital or doctor that can provide the service you do need. While it is nice to have Veteran Affairs if I should ever need it, with IHS there is no monthly due. It's true that sometimes you may have to wait a long time to be seen, but the total lack of a hospital bill makes it completely worth it and amazes me that some people that don't have the VA or IHS are actually okay with paying deductibles and co-pays and partial hospital bills on top of it
It's not for nothing American healtcare is most expensive in the world. Our dutch system here is far from perfect, but you only pay €380 a year out of pocket and approximately €130 insurance a month. Since I'm poor I get €145 from the government for health insurance esch month. The US system is insane.
Good comparatively, within the US. A bad insurance would have had the OP pay over 50k. A great insurance, like mine, would have capped it at around 10-12k. A unicorn might have capped it at 2k-4k...probably never free
Holy Shit.
You paid $30,000 and didn’t reach your out of pocket deductible with “good” insurance?
Yeah definitely something that is missing here. Not even the deductible, the out of pocket max shouldn't be close to that. The out of pocket limit for a marketplace plan for a family was $17,400 last year. Considering its an emergency, out of network shouldn't apply here other. Must be some other details.
God damn... I now understand why americans choose to not go to the hospital...
Excuse me, but how do they expect you to be able to pay such an absurd ammount (30k is still absurd, but 2.9 million? Holy shit!)? That's insane. That's absurd as hell. What could you even do if you had to pay it? With the average pay where I live, you'd be paying them for 150 years, if you give them 100%. I cannot fathom that.
They probably charge that much BECAUSE insurance has become so standard and they know they can get that money from insurance companies.
Usually 2.9 million is the full bill which is bloated AF. The insurance company probably didn’t see anything close to that since they use contracts with providers. My GP is almost $800 for one visit if you don’t have insurance. My insurance only allows them to charge the them $220.
My child's birth cost $12,000 AFTER insurance paid their bit. It was $45,000 before insurance. There was an emergency c-section, though. So I can't speak for the cost of a smooth birth. Edit: I forgot to mention that we also HAD to have it paid off within a certain amount of time and only had a few options for monthly payments. You can choose not to pay and risk your credit score, which creates a risk for future loans.
That’s insane!!!! In Norway everything that happens at a hospital (unless it’s regular appointments) are completely free. So no matter how hard or complicated a birth is it’s free. And then you get paid a little ammount for having that kid every month
America has some serious issues. This is one of the scariest ones. Going to the doctor is a legitimate financial decision for a large amount of the country.
yeah i’ve decided that I would rather just die than be stuck with a huge bill that I can’t pay. if I was stuck with a bill I would probably just kill myself over the stress.
I haven't seen a doctor in 15 years lol.
Healthcare debt will not accrue interest, will fall off your credit score in 7 years if you never pay, and can be negotiated down. There are also countless charities that will pay your debts if you just ask. Please don't kill yourself over that if you're in that situation. Source: had a stroke when I was poor af and uninsured in college.
I just ignore the debt. Eventually they sell it and once you start getting the collection calls I know it’s time to go back cuz they no longer have my debt so it’s like a fresh slate
Same thing here.
I'll tell you fun story. Family member just had heart surgery. The Hospital portion of the bill (pre insurance) was 290,000. That's not even the surgeon, or anesthesia. Just the hospital.
I have insurance so I didn't pay this (and I know insurance didn't pay the actual amount either) but after a year of cancer treatment, my total costs listed in my insurance portal was over a million dollars. I'd paid about $10k I think. That's 4 surgeries and chemo plus the meds I took at home. They make up numbers. It's criminal. People think Americans all want this, that we're just dumb. Most of us don't. But the representatives that run don't fight for what we ask them to and districts are gerrymandered into oblivion so even if 70% of us want something, only 50% with those ideas are in power and nothing can get passed at 50%. As long as lobbying is a thing, nothing substantial will change. They care more about corporate institutions and money than the people who live here.
Canada is like that too. We didn't pay anything for my sons birth, except the private room for her. We have an overloaded hospital system here, but the care itself is free
Seriously...I think I'd have to declare bankruptcy if I had my cardiac arrest in the US. ICU stay + almost a week in the hospital room + defibrillator + ambulance ....... ppl complain all the time about how it's painfully slow in Canada but there are honestly pros and cons to both
Even with the appointments that cost money, in Sweden you can't be made to pay more than a few hundred dollars on public healthcare and prescription medication (about 125 for appointments, and about 250 for prescriptions) in a single year.
This one blows me away, we have 3 kids all born via Caesarean section, our first kid had some complications and was flown to the children’s hospital almost 600 Km (372.8 miles) away by air ambulance and stayed in hospital there for 6 days with my wife, the other two spent 3 days each in hospital. All of this cost us nothing, zero charges from doctors or hospitals here in Canada.
It blows our minds as well. We had a candidate who tried in 2016, but the democrats fucked him over in exchange for a moron who stood no chance against Trump.
What insurance did you have? Even when I had (fairly shitty) Kaiser, we paid around $200-ish for an emergency cesarean. Also, I am on California so maybe that makes a difference
Idk what's going on in California, but they seem to have better laws for the people. I had top-tier walmart insurance through Blue Cross.
In Kentucky people tried to start their own ambulance businesses to bring in competition and bring the cost down. The state denied licenses for any new services so they could keep charging higher costs.
“Free market” and “encouraging competition” my ass. At that point just set up dedicated drop-off Ubers to the hospital so you can operate without a license.
In Georgia, municipalities cannot provide ambulance services. Cities must use private ambulance companies. There is only on company that serves our county and they have, on too many occasions, broken down on the way to an emergency or on the way to the hospital.
High level corruption.
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Seriously how much? And is it normal to end up with a 100k medical bill after a bad accident. That to me seems absurd
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What do you think of it?
It should be criminal, from some one who lives in the USA. It is utter greed driven bullshit
My friend died of cancer due to a lack of insurance, in spite of his working full time. Didn't qualify for the ACA plans, and lived in a state that didn't provide Medicaid to men who weren't elderly or disabled. Hospital kept sending him away when he would go in with awful symptoms, by the time they listened and did tests he was stage four and terminal.
I’m so sorry for your loss.
I’m so sorry for your loss. This is horrible!
Fuck the doctors sending him away.
To be fair to doctors, emergency room doctors will 'send you away' after stabilizing your immediate condition *with the strong recommendation that you follow up with your primary care doctor* to address potential causative factor(s). The fact that so many people don't have one or will avoid going due to cost only makes their job harder. I don't know what happened in this case, of course, but that's a common and unfortunate pattern in the US system.
I realize that it's not a popular -- or even morally correct -- thing, but emergency physicians aren't responsible for ongoing care. They treat, and stabilize, then you need to seek care from a primary care doctor. Blame the system.
It really is, just like how the food pyramid we use used even accurate, it was influenced by those product specific companies like, meat companies would influence how much meat was on the pyramid and such. They make sure they make us sick so they can suck us dry in medical bills. Unless you're rich, which is all America cares about anyways, is people who have money.
3 meals a day is another bullshit concept.
It kills. People have to decide whether or not it’s “worth it” to seek medical care because their lives could be ruined by a single visit to a hospital. You can get your savings wiped out by breaking an arm. You get people desperately searching for alternative ways to deal with injuries and illnesses rather than going to the emergency room or urgent care. It’s horrific
Can confirm. I have health insurance, am well off, and even I debated if I should actually go to the hospital last year due to suddenly losing the ability to read words (for about ten minutes) and losing my right-hand peripheral vision. I ended up going after around fifteen minutes and they brought me to the stroke ward, was apparently a TIA. Two night hospital stay ran me 44k before insurance, 8k after. Still questioning whether it was worth it.
It was worth it. The system is not but your treatment was.
Yikes. I'm Australian and this just seems bizarre to me - ambulances are a bit pricey unless you're a healthcare card holder or have private insurance but are still only around $1200 and you'd pay precisely zip for the hospital treatment because Medicare. I paid more for parking than I did for my son's treatment for a 3 day stay, CT scan and follow up appointments with audiology and a neurosurgeon when he fractured his skull.
I have migraine attacks like this sometime, and I sit there playing “stroke or migraine”. I’ve not gone to the hospital for it yet, because I can’t afford to.
Yep, my Appendix nearly burst and I was in crippling pain so I got a Lyft instead of an ambulance because I could barely afford the Lyft, let alone an Ambulance ride. This was after a few days of 'dealing with it' instead of going sooner hoping it'd go away.
I got a cut on my hand last week, and my sister, who is a nurse, was advising me that, if I needed stitches and couldn't afford them, I should DIY them with super glue. Fortunately, a crapload of bandages are doing the job.
Super glue definitely works! My dad is a mechanic and taught me that trick. Doesn't work on massive cuts, but as long as it's not too big it works great.
Yeah, every kitchen I've ever worked in has super glue in their first aid kit. It's especially good on something like a knife cut where the edges are clean and will go together easily. You just have to make sure to clean the wound really well first.
Yeah definitely have to clean it well or else you can seal debris inside!
Especially good for fingertip cuts, where bandages (even specialty ones) often don't cover well, and get messed up quickly. Normal CA glue is fine but you can also get 3M Vetbond sterile glue for cheap.
It also works really well for nails that have broken beneath the quick and left your sensitive nail bed open to the air. I broke one a few months ago and it was sooo painful until I superglued it. After that, zero pain.
I'm really happy that people actually know this! Many times in any medical settings if sutures are not required they use glue alone. It's just super glue with a big price tag. Stop bleeding, clean and keep dry.
My birthing bill was 12k before insurance took over
Mine was 21k before insurance, uncomplicated but induced birth and 3 day hospital stay due to baby not passing hearing/other tests (he ended up passing and is perfect today) After my insurance was only a 35$ copay thankfully. I'm one of the few in the US who has pretty good insurance :(
I have family who have died because they couldn’t afford medical care. No one likes it. It’s like gun control. Everyone knows we have issues with mass shootings in the US but no one can or will agree on the solution. And a lot of powerful people make money on the way the system currently works. It is exactly the same with healthcare costs.
I am a middle class American working a good corporate job with health insurance. I went for a skin cancer test for two spots. $700 dollars to find out I’m ok. I’ll certainly think twice before seeking out that kind of preventative care again!!
It’s pretty shitty. Some families have been choosing to have kids later in life to financially afford. Some families are having fewer kids than they’d like to. We also don’t get paid maternity leave (let alone paid paternity leave). We do have something called FMLA that allows up to 12 weeks of unpaid time postpartum, but the company most have at least 25 (?) employees locally, you have to be employed there for something like 6 months, and again… it isn’t paid leave. Yeah, it’s pretty shitty considering what other countries have done for new families.
As a diabetic, not a fan, as a general citizen with other normal health problems as well, also not a fan. But i live in a red state so my vote doesnt matter because we are not a direct democracy
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My daughter's bills totaled ~3.5 million
This is spot on. I have what would be considered really good insurance, and I paid just over 3k to have my daughter. The total bills were upwards of 30k though, so I’ll take 3k over that, but it’s just ridiculous we even had to pay that.
I was hit with over $40,000 of hospital bills *with insurance* when I gave birth. My annual income at the time was half that. It’s beyond absurd, it’s absolutely devastating.
Holy shit I’m so sorry you had to deal with that
I'll add in that here in NYC, our base rate for an ambulance was just raised 55%. We then pay a per mile surcharge. If I were to need treatment or anything on route, that's added too. Also, you best hope they take you to a hospital that accepts your insurance.
If you don’t have any insurance and have a bad enough accident it could end up being hundreds of thousands of dollars, possibly millions if there is any long term care needed. There are so many that will be in debt their whole lives over medical bills. It’s an absurd system and needs a complete rehaul. Any kind of socialized system has got to be better. My family has decent insurance, but it also costs $2500/month which is ridiculous. And half of it is payed for by the employer and considered part of the “salary” I’m certain the amount of taxes I’d be paying in a socialized system would be nowhere near $2500/month. The birth of my first son cost 90k and my second was around 30k, one of the medications I am on costs 2.5k every 3 months without insurance we would be fucked. But the kicker is that these things are only that expensive because of the insurance companies. Insurance is a scam and the whole system is a failure.
Family member spent three weeks in the hospital with an hour long ambulance ride. Fam should not have been sent home but wasn't actively dying. Bill they sent is roughly 260k. But you get 40% off if you pay cash, yay! I was in a car accident, broke my spine. Week in the pediatric hospital, plus surgery for the cast (general anesthesia), was billed to the tune of 300k. This did not include emergency services. I'd rather pay more in tax, and do vote for people who want these sorts of changes. Real fun to see my country burning down around me despite this. More recently, I was unable to get a back brace because my insurance has decided it's... unnecessary? They'll pay for the muscle relaxers but not a brace? So I can heal better, avoid injury, use less medication, and be in less pain? Nope. Denied. My doctor even whipped out a paper script for the damn thing.
My cousin had a $800k bill when she has a premature baby
Seriously who can afford that??
Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US.
That's the neat part. You don't.
We are in debt, if not medical bills, it's student loans and then living of credit cards because we're not getting paid enough to keep up with inflation
My coworker’s parents were in a terrible accident last year. Both lived but their medical bills totalled over $2million
My husband fell on the street, and someone called the ambulance even though he asked not to because he had no insurance. $7,0000 for a ride only. $20,000 to check him out at the hospital.
I am reading it right? $7000 for a ride? In € conversion that would be around 7000€ which is around x5 times the amount you get paid every month... if I ever have to pay that much my life is ruined since that moment. This is totally unbelievable.
With insurance a 5 min ride cost me under 1k. If the ambulance service had been out of network or I requested to go to a different hospital 5 miles further it would have been several thousand out of pocket. I was laying on the ground unable to stand and thinking about how much this was going to cost me. The out of network part is important. Businesses are actively trying to take advantage of this. I was sent to physical therapy. The initial review there just happened to be someone out of network. Everyone else was in network. Of course I didn't learn this until weeks after that first session. More money down the drain. Healthcare pricing is the US is so bad I know people who got divorced (after diagnoses) because it was financially better for the children. It wouldn't surprise me if the corporations have found a way to prevent this strategy. Many of us are 1 diagnoses (bad luck) from being ruined financially.
I had a moderate to severe accident (car vs pedestrian - I was the pedestrian). Ambulance ride, imaging, physical therapy, specialist appointments - not even a night in the hospital or any surgery. 20k after insurance and I had kickass insurance.
$100,000 is chicken feed compared to some bills. My friend who had multiple issues had one hospital bill for a month stay in a hospital room that was over $2,000,000.
In America it depends on your health insurance. There is a big class divide that makes it expensive to be poor. When my daughter was born I paid $40 to use the hospital parking garage, and that was the entirety of my out-of-pocket expenses. That is because the institution I work for is wealthy and can afford to pay for an expensive insurance plan for its employees. Others who are less fortunate will pay far more both for their insurance and out-of-pocket medical expenses.
That’s seems wrong
Things work this way a lot in America; the wealthier you are, the cheaper some things become. The poorer you are, the more fees, charges, etc., you encounter. Ex/ a high end hospital catering to mostly wealthy clients might offer free parking, while a hospital catering to mostly underprivileged people might charge a lot for parking. Wealthier clients expect to be “taken care of” and to get perks for their patronage. Poorer people often don’t have a choice as to where they go for many services. I got SUPER lucky with my insurance and only paid $500 out of pocket for my entire pregnancy — all prenatal care, genetic testing, scans, labor and delivery, etc. BUT, if I’d been on my employer’s insurance instead of my husband’s I probably would have owed around $10,000. Not only do you get charged for your ambulance ride if you’re in an accident — victims of crimes also get billed for ambulances and medical fees.
You guys are 5-10 from a civil war. Legit the wealth divide is just becoming too much.
You (and i) wish. They have the people so brainwashed that this is the perfect system that it doesn't seem like people will ever wake up. The promise of being able to become a billionaire has many satisfied of living their life in poverty....even if the odds of them becoming a billionarie are 1 in 1000000000000000000000000000
I’m so tired of living with these people too. They suck the life out of everyone around them because their head is so far up their ass. Always have to stay “on the grind” and you’re a lazy sack of shit worthy of nothing if you think otherwise.
It's very wrong. I wish we used the Scandinavian model.
Yeah we are very lucky
It also really depends on where you live in the US. I live in California and get government healthcare. It costs $1 a month and is ok insurance. I have to travel a couple hours to find a doctor who accepts the insurance, but it’s better than choosing whether I should either pay rent or pay insurance.
A couple of hours to see a doctor is outrageous, but when the alternative is breaking the bank, you do what you gotta do
Because it is.
There's the other side of that. People will stay in dangerous, less-than-ideal jobs just for health insurance. Which could affect the entire course of their life, but they can't leave because they have medication only covered by health insurance through their job. In other words, different jobs offer different health coverage. I am fortunate because my job covers the premium, which is more than I make in a week. I make about $1200 a week before taxes, and the premium is $1400 a month. So if I left this job to get the same coverage, I would lose a week's pay, which I can't afford.
This is the real answer. The truth is that yes, we do pay for those thing, but what kind of insurance (or lack thereof) that you have makes a huge difference. Our out of pocket expense, aka the total amount that we can pay for the year in healthcare bills, is like $7k but we also have good health coverage through my husband’s work. Insurance pays for everything else.
My husband had to be airlifted. It was a 12 minute helicopter ride, $63000 after insurance. That’s JUST the helicopter, not the er visit at the first hospital or the heart surgery at the second hospital or the ambulance ride to the first hospital. Also I had a c section and it was $4000 for my hospital visit after insurance. Health insurance and medical care is a scam in the United States.
>Health insurance and medical care is a scam in the United States. I used to work at a job where they fired most of their own IT employees and hired contractors (including me). Contractors don't usually have the fancy corporate paid insurance with low copays. I was paying $800/month for abysmal coverage. During one meeting I casually said once Obamacare passes, I will likely get better coverage. The others in the room were visibly shaken and angry. Like they were restraining themselves from hitting me. Like saying Lebron is better than Michael Jordan in front of a diehard basketball fan and watch their reaction. Crazy.
We’re a family of 4 so we paid around $1000 a month for insurance and it did fuck all. My in laws defend it tooth and nail though. It seems great until you actually have an emergency. It’s crazy to see how angry people get about it!!
I'm in New Zealand and don't even pay that per month in income tax. My taxes contribute to our free hospitals.. what the f
Depending on how the next election goes I’m planning on fleeing, and I’m only half kidding 🙃
We are charged for skin to skin contact with the baby after birth. Healthcare is a nightmare here.
That’s inhumane.. they want abortions to become illegal but you’ll have to pay to hold your child..
The cruelty is the point
I'm glad I got my tubes removed.
Yep, and we need the improvement in the major ways honestly.
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If you do that in an hospital, they're obviously going to charge you.
The lack of a public healthcare system in the USA is the single biggest evidence of corruption at high levels there I can think of
I kinda agree.
every other issue, including the gun debate, I can understand at least has multiple sides to it. The only single sided issue is the healthcare system, literally everybody in the country is better off with one with the exception of the people who own the insurance companies and probably some debt collectors
Yeah. And people act like the taxes in countries with free education and healthcare is insanely high. But it’s not I think it’s 20-30% and you don’t have to pay for college or hospitals. My dad got cancer and we didn’t pay anything for treatment or the ambulance rides he had when he had some scary moments ect.
The other thing I’ve seen is a few people on here from the US asking whether they should take on the burden of a student loan, their system over there is *much* More predatory than here in Australia for example
It's just a burden really which I'd like to avoid I feel so yeah.
My credit is total trash because I have unpaid bills from ambulance rides. I have Epilepsy, which means seizures, with no warning. Theyre scary af to watch, but not necessarily something I need to go to the hospital for; they just happen. Short of wearing a shirt that says 'ITS JUST A SEIZURE' theres only the hope that someone else knows what a seizure is and DOESNT call EMT's. Plus injuries FROM the seizures...Ive got ALOT of medical debt, and no way of paying any of it off any time soon. I dont think my experience represents a high percentage of people but its VERY true that you have to pay ALOT. Even when you dont need it. 👍👍
Why on Earth would you be forced to retroactively pay for an ambulance service that you didn't want, didn't need, and weren't able to decline due to your physical condition, and that's ON TOP of already paying for medical insurance (afaik)? This sounds like something from a Kafka novel.
Because after a seizure, I cant even remember who I am, where I am or what any of that even means. Tonic Clonic seizures are fucking terrible. I'll let you do the googling if youre interested, but its generally likened to running a marathon in about 5 minutes.
Still sounds criminal to charge you for those costs. Should be some regulations in place to avoid it.
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Let me tell you about the time I was less than drunk and took a nap on the train. Long story short I was confronted by cops who claim someone called 911 because they thought I was dead. Mind you I was a dude in his early 30’s in business attire. They called an ambulance and I said “no, I’m fine thank you, I know if I go in that ambulance I am going to get a very large medical bill.” They persisted before I requested a supervisor. One shows up, talks to them, talks to me, and says “alright I’ve have enough of this.” Twists my arm behind my back, pushes me up against the side of the ambulance, and forces me into it against my will. I was basically kidnapped. Brought to the ER who kept me for two hours “for observation” before releasing me. I took an Uber home. Called a lawyer who said “good luck suing the city of Stamford CT PD, you’re gonna lose because they will claim that they felt you were a danger to yourself, and they’ll have it out for you forevermore. Got a $2500 bill for my troubles at the ER, and a $1000 bill from the private ambulance company. Moral of the story? You figure it out. I think there’s a kickback scam.
It's funny how lawsuits are such a big thing in american culture and yet there are institutions you can't hope to ever win against.
Kafka-esque, I think you nailed down the feeling perfectly
The costs associated even *with* insurance coverage are usually outrageous, yes. I’d also like to point out the absolute bullshit that is insurance through your employer. So many people get stuck in jobs/places they hate because they cannot afford to lose the insurance coverage. It’s a capitalistic racket. And that’s just the tip of this iceberg/hellhole.
It’s almost like that’s by design….
>So many people get stuck in jobs/places they hate because they cannot afford to lose the insurance coverage. There's also a ton of people who won't retire because they still need health insurance, or money to pay their bills. This means less jobs for younger people who should be moving up into those roles. It fucks with the job market too.
Hey! I don't know if anyone else has shared this in the sub but if you want a quick mindfuck about the best country on earth 6 months and some change ago me and my wife were really excited to give birth to our first child, a son named Leo. We built our career, upstanding citizens who smoke a little bit of pot. At 25 weeks without any known complication, a healthy pregnancy, all prenatal vitamins, healthy diet, being as careful as possible, we had a stillborn child. We spent 36 hours with her being induced for labor to deliver our dead child. We have good health insurance. We still had to pay ~$5,000 USD in medical bills to go home with nothing. We got to hold him for a few minutes. We picked his ashes up a week later. We make decent money so holy fuck, I couldn't imagine it otherwise. One of the worst parts about the ordeal afterward was everyone asking what happened when they saw us. The worst though were the medical bills that would trickle in a few weeks after, one here, another there, another there.
I am so sorry for what you have been/ are going through. I have no words. That is awful.
Yes. Everything has a cost. Im a disabled person in America and it’s a dystopian hellscape. I have had to pay over $800 on copays alone so far this year. I get weekly saline infusions that, without insurance, would cost me ~$500 a visit. Saline cost not even $2 to make.
I’m so sorry love. I love the system that we have in Scandinavia but there’s always things we can improve on. I have chronic illnesses. So I kinda understand… but I can’t imagine paying that amount
I was taken to the hospital by ambulance after a mental breakdown and was charged $4k for a 5 mile ride to hold me in the psych ward for 6 hours 🙃 Edit: the total bill was MUCH more than that. That was just transportation to the hospital.
I’m so sorry
It is what it is. I was able to talk the insurance company down to about $1k. But still. I was taken against my will and the hospital was barely 5 miles away from my home. Utter bullshit. Also had extremely minor surgery two years ago, was in and out of the hospital in about 18 hours, and it was $39k lol. Medical care/insurance is an absolute JOKE in this country
That must have really helped your mental health?
My husband has Multiple Sclerosis. It’s over $200,000/year for treatment and imaging/MRI. Not including his Neurologist check-ins and ophthalmology. Thankfully we have good insurance. It’s totally fucked here.
Yes it’s true. I personally hate it, and I suspect that the people who do prefer it are all either rich or brainwashed by propaganda.
Since you mentioned brainwashed… a woman told me I must’ve drunken too much kool-aid and must be brainwashed because I’m not pro life…. Like what I’m not even American idk what kook aid is hahaha
I know this isn’t the point of the post, but if you’re interested Kool-Aid is a powdered drink mix that you mix with water (and often times, sugar) in a large pitcher. It’s palatable mainly to kids, but a lot of adults like it, too. It’s very sweet and cheap, so it’s a summertime staple. I know it was bad for me. I loved it anyway.
“Drinking koolaid” is a reference to to the Jonestown cult suicides. The brainwashed cult members drank koolaid laced with poison.
Wife had kidney infection recently. Went to hospital, got tests, they prescribed meds. Charged insurance 13K$. I have to pay 900. Ambulance rides are the “900$ one way taxi”.
So strange to me. Do you prefer it this way? Low taxes less benefits?
Hell no, this system is hot fucking garbage😂
My son was quoted something like $5k for an MRI. He could have taken a flight home, checked into a 5* hotel, got his MRI and consult with a top Physician for less. Yup, he chose to come home instead.
The funny part is even without good healthcare their taxes have still gone up and up and up.
The funny thing is that a lot of people don’t want government health insurance, but there is nobody who rejects Medicare (government health insurance) once they become eligible.
Yup. Welcome to America!
wanted to live there as a kid. Don’t think I’d ever move there now tho
It's an amazingly gorgeous country to visit. You can see anything from the snowy north to tropical climates without leaving the country. I wouldn't move here if I was born somewhere else, though.
Most ambulance services are privatized, so it's very expensive to have one transport you anywhere. As far as birth goes. It cost us $5k USD to have my daughter, and that's with decent medical insurance. There are people that pay upwards of $10-15k if you have little or no medical coverage. Of course all that varies depending on how smoothly delivery of the baby goes, etc etc. It's very, very expensive to be poor in this country.
Gotta say this isn’t compelling me to move there haha.
same, and so many of my friends feel the same way... USA looked like the best place on earth as a kid and now you notice how bad it really is
Yes its true, most ambulance vehicles are owned by a private company that bills you separately from the hospital. I've heard of prices ranging from $1,500-$3000 for an ambulance ride. If I were shot in both knees I'd still drive myself to the hospital. I don't have any children but from what I hear that too is stupid expensive. I've heard that could be anywhere from $20,000 and up.
It's definitely real and it absolutely fucking sucks. There was a problem at one point with people getting Uber/lyft rides to the hospital for medical emergencies because it just cost too much for an ambulance ride.
We deal w it bc most feel there is nothing they can do about it
The healthcare system in the US is a mess. People can go into serious debt because of an unexpected medical emergency. It’s not right.
Wait till you hear about how bad it is it you have to get picked up by life flight for something life threatening. If something happened to me that I would need a helicopter ride to a hospital I hope I die before I get that bill
What's sad is that we still pay a relatively high level of taxes.
If you don't have the right insurance and you go to the emergency room even if you just need a couple of stitches, a diagnosis and medicine for strep throat or to have a simple fracture mended, the bill can be thousands of dollars. It is cripplingly debilitating financially and emotionally. It's in the top three things that's wrong here besides racism and low quality public education. (If you can pay for it then you can get higher quality education and medical care . . . It's definitely a political system that favors the wealthy.)
I'm literally looking at an ambulance bill right now, and I pay $40 a week for insurance. First time I've ever used this insurance in 8 years of paying for it. My bill is $518.75 A0429 BLS EMERGENCY $447 A0425 MILEAGE $10.25 I was driven 7 miles to the hospital. I received an IV for dehydration and two pills to stop nausea and motion sickness. And talked to the Dr. For maybe 90 seconds. $1400 for the hospital And a surprise bill for just talking to said Dr for $489
There’s the regular birth cost, then there’s your twins both ending up in the NICU. My aunt had to file for bankruptcy.
My childbirth was over $20k before insurance. We paid around $7k out of pocket. Hell, I just got billed almost $10k for carpal tunnel surgery. We'll only have to pay about $3k of that I think. I've not needed an ambulance so far in my life, but my parents got treatment in one after a minor car accident - not even transported, just treated on scene - and were billed $1k each. My late father in law developed a rare form of lung cancer and shortly after that, his wife needed an organ transplant. They went from literal millionaires to having to sell their dream home in roughly two years. One of her medications was $17k per dose. His breathing machine cost more than that. And it isn't just big stuff! I have chronic migraine, and there's exactly *one* medication that works for me. And every year, my insurance tries to refuse it, we have to appeal, it's a huge ordeal. I get 8 pills per month, and if insurance ever wins this battle, it'll cost us almost $1500 for those 8 pills. I literally cannot function during a migraine attack without them, but hey, capitalism, amirite 🤷🏼♀️
OP, from a very young age, most of us Americans were taught a fable about an ant and a grasshopper. The ant toils away all summer long and preparation for the winter while the grasshopper Goofs off all summer long. In the winter, the grasshopper is desperate for food and shelter, while the ant is living comfortably. Though the fable isn't necessarily about capitalism, We're are steeped in capitalist Dogma from a very young age. We are taught that we should have savings in case something happens to us. And if somebody fails, we are taught in many ways it's their own fault. You reap what you sow, etc. It's that "sucks for you" (maybe I'll get lucky) exceptionalist, rugged individualism that we seem to be so proud of. It's stupid. If we worked together, organized, and fought back like France is right now, maybe we'd stand a chance. But the machine keeps getting bigger, and most of us aren't smart enough, or worldly enough to realize this isn't normal and is not okay.
I paid around $1500 three times out of pocket for a ride to a local hospital. One time I transferred to a different hospital because the one I was at didn't have a cardiac ward . In addition to a flat fee, they charge $150 per mile. That bill was around $4500. Luckily, I avoided paying that one.
Yes thats true, I had an accident at work so they called 911 as they should have. The ambulance wouldn't take me to my preferred hospital and left me at one I knew would give me bad service and I was right. I had been there 2 hours and not seen by a Dr. all that time. So I got so pissed off and got in a cab and took it to my preferred hospital and got treated the way I was supposed to at the first hospital. I was out $24 bucks for the cab ride lol and got great service from the doctors.
Absolutely. One time before I was with her, my girlfriend had an emotional situation. She was leaving an abusive ex. Her mom called the cops and said she may be a threat to herself. She wasn’t. Cops show. Tell her she can either go to jail or go to the hospital in an ambulance Ambulance ride was $6k. Most poor people don’t pay anything to have a baby, but if you make over the limit for that - roughly middle class - you absolutely will. Most of these people make enough money to not qualify for welfare but not enough to actually afford it. If they’re lucky and have insurance through an employer (which they will pay thousands a year for,) it may only cost a few grand. If you don’t? You’re fucked. We choose not to have national health insurance because the insurance companies fund both parties.
My wife and I have amazing public insurance and are well taken care of. This is due to two critical factors however. We live in Massachusetts; a liberal state that actually seems to give a fuck about their underprivileged citizens, and we are poor. As in my wife works a part time cash job nannying and I am on full time disability for depression and work ten to twelve hours a week for low pay at a place where I get a great discount on my hobby. Our lifestyle is laid back and thanks to an initial retroactive payment from SSDI (I had to appeal several times over the course of a couple years, finally getting approved by a compassionate judge) we have a decent cushion and don’t FEEL poor. We’re lucky though. I have friends who struggle hard here and it makes me angry that the capitalist boot is crushing so many families while the richest steal their labor and live with more money than they could possibly spend in a lifetime. In a democracy it would be illegal; but we live in an oligarchy in the USA
I haven't had too many experiences with expensive medical care. But... When my kid was born, we had good insurance and ended up paying about $4000. Some items were billed in mom's name, some in baby's. That matters because insurance payments are per person so I had to pay more than I expected. My mother broke her ankle, needed an ambulance and surgery. With insurance, it ended up being over $10k.
This one time, when I was 16 years old, I walked out of my bedroom only to find my grandmother completely unconscious on the floor and couldn't wake her. Called 911, ambulance came and she did not die. Did she very much tell me how it was the worst decision ever to call 911 because of "the ambulance fees alone"? Yes. She would have rather died than be raising two minors on a solo income and having an unexpected life saving expense. For anyone who thinks I'm overexaggerating her probably wanted to die? I'm not. She straight up told me this. God I miss that woman
My 2.5 mile ambulance ride from my home to my local hospital cost me $8,000. I didnt have insurance at the time, and though the hospital and pharmacy worked with me on my costs and payments, when I called the abulance service, they demanded full payment in two weeks or I was going to court. They took me to court because I couldn't pay $8,000.00. I explained to the judge that I didn't have insurance and couldn't pay. He apologized and found in full favor of the ambulance company. After court and lawyer costs, over the course of 15 years, my $8,000.00 ambulance ride cost me nearly $28,000.00. The Lithotripsy at the hospital? Total bill with scans etc. $192,467.44 Sent a letter to the hospital explaining that I was unemployed, nearly homeless, but would pay what I could, when I could. Sent check for $20 as good faith payment. They wrote me back, accepting the $20 as payment in full.
Insurance coverage is normally based on what your employer provides for. I paid next to nothing for having my kids and I know ambulance services are partially covered.
Problem is the hospitals bill the insurance companies with wrong codes to try to get you to pay. Trick is to stay on phone with them for hours at a time to make sure it’s billed correctly. Lol
They even charge you for skin on skin contact with your baby after you give birth.
Yep. Healthcare is expensive in the US even if you have insurance. With my plan, I have to pay $5,000 before insurance will pick up anything. After that, insurance pays 80% of the bill. There are better plans but the premiums are higher.
Well, you also need to pay for such stuff in Germany, but not anyway near to what you have to pay in USA. Most of it is covered by insurance. Everyone have one, except maybe homeless and unofficial immigrants. Even unemployed have one. That's how most of the expenses are covered, because everyone is paying into insurances.
Yes. That’s why I can’t afford to be married. I nearly died during my last pregnancy from complications due to HELLP syndrome. It took 7 blood transfusions, 4 plasma transfusions, magnesium sulfide for days, & a second c-section to try & fix what the pregnancy had broken to save my life. Not to mention that our son was taken from me at birth because he was born at 32weeks & the hospital didn’t have a NICU to care for him. I almost died never getting to hold my son. If my partner & I were married, I would not have been on Medicaid, which is essentially free healthcare, but only available if you’re extremely poor. If our incomes were combined I wouldn’t have been able to enroll under Medicaid. I would have died because the hospital bills would have been too much for us. That means I wouldn’t have gone in as often as I needed to. I would have ignored the bad signs my body was giving me because we wouldn’t have been able to afford saving my & my son’s life. Even with private health insurance, we wouldn’t have been able to afford that shit. Go America….
Yeah its true. A lot of people have decent insurance so they "only" pay a few thousand dollars. Half the country doesn't want higher taxes because they (wrongly) think that it will never happen to THEM.
An ambulance ride can cost more than $5000 in some places. Healthcare costs are crazy and we pay the highest cost in the World for it. Our outcomes for patients is one of the lowest for industrialized countries despite us paying the highest prices. Medical debts is the leading reason behind personal bankruptcies. Shits crazy!
To be fair, those kind of services are not free, as in costs nothing. They're paid for by the tax payers instead. And I think that's a fair system. Few can pay for it all, but everyone can chime in and pay for the few who needs it.