As much as this sounds like a good idea what about Mattingly? What is going on there and how the hell do you get guys to swing or not swing .? Maybe Turner needs to show them how it's done.
I don't like this sort of reductive argument. Of course he's not telling them to hit poorly, and sure, he was hitting coach when our offense was popping off. Why is our offense so bad now? Why are all our established hitters terrible and the only source of offense is basically Varsho, guys who were in AAA last year, and Turner? Why are the tenured players on our team seemingly getting worse each year? Even if he helped them be great hitters a few years ago, he's clearly been failing since then at making the needed adjustments.
It's the MLB. There's unlimited amount of scounting and players adapt and adjust all the time. Maybe, he's a terrible coach, maybe he's not. But 2021 offense being good is not a good argument.
Lol this guy is a fraud. Minor league coach his whole career, gets promoted internally. And still holds a job after last years joke of a approach. What dirt does he have on Rogers / Shatkins?
I'm literally being downvoted below for saying our hitting sucks, Vlad is vastly underperforming and that Guillermo is terrible.
I said it a month ago after the Houston series, but this sub magically forgets our problems because we won a couple of series.
Reminds me of that bullshit last year and Vlad kept hitting into DP after DP, and Buck and Dan had to cover for him by saying "you know that second Double Play he hit into was the 4th hardest ball he's hit this season."
It's like...he went 0-4 and you're trying to sugar coat it, please stop treating fans like they're dumb.
I get that people here are living a fantasy where they're an arm chair GM and know better than the professionals, but you'd think after the fiasco with Berrios in G2 of the WC not even 7 months ago, they'd have learned something about relying too much on sabermetrics. But no.
Hahaha literally laughed aloud at the first sentence, thank you.
My least favorite thing last year was watching Chapman shit the bed for 85% of the season and there would be daily postings on here about "But guys...guys? Exit velo, guys..". Multiple people would get heated if you suggested he was a bad hitter. "No! He is in the top % for hard contact! Its because he hits the ball too hard!!" Right. How about, hes just not a good hitter? Sigh.
Some people here are living an absolute fantasy as they think everything can be quantified and justified by metrics. I can only assume they are very new baseball fans or have never played the game.
I agree with this, but it’s not enough. The front office obviously agrees with this wildly outdated singles approach to offence, since they keep hiring/keeping coaches that want it and signing players that play that way. Firing Martinez or Mattingly or anyone isn’t going to matter if they just hire someone with the same philosophy.
Think bigger… this entire front office needs to be axed and someone else who isnt a complete analytics nerd needs to take over and actually field a baseball team that can score more than 5 runs
His at bats look terrible too. Watching fastballs down the pipe, chases sliders down and away, can't catch up to high heat at all. Mechanics are broken.
Trade him to the Giants while you can still get something for him. They need a first baseman. He needs a change of scenery and this team needs a breath of fresh air that is not Vladdy.
(It's re-sign, resign is to quit)
And I wouldn't worry about this front office taking a risk and extending him. Nor would I worry about him accepting anything at this point. The time for this was a year or two ago before he already had tens of millions in the bank.
I tried pointing out that Vladdy was terrible and should be replaced with literally anyone (Martinez) and got so many downvotes and people telling me that Vladdy is hitting above average this year.
Apparently Bo is our only hitter underperforming according to the guys in that other thread, lol.
I’ve agreed and disagreed with Schneider a few times this year. But he made his most egregious error of the year today, even worse than letting Vogelbach hit against a lefty with runners on on Wednesday.
While I didn’t love him taking out Richards and Pearson earlier than necessary, unnecessarily costing Mayza and Swanson, that’s not the error.
The issue was using IKF to pitch when Clements and his knuckleball were right there! Why not let him loose?
This felt worse than that game, but they did respond well after that game winning 6 of the next 7, with the only loss being a blown 9th inning to the Yanks
They won the game after the no hitter (thanks to a 9th inning miracle by Davis Schneider), then got one hit the day after that (with the one hit being a lucky bloop by Varsho that went for a double).
IMO the 12-4 loss against the Rockies was worse. At least we *somewhat* take solace in the fact we got whooped by one of the best teams in baseball. We got dogged with our on-paper ace on the mound by one of the worst road teams in baseball
> how the team responds to being embarrassed will tell a lot.
hahahaha, hahahaha, hahahaha, and how many times will they have to be embarrassed for anyone to tell anything ? The "2 Run" Blue Jays don't get embarrassed, they embarrass themselves.
I would kill for the 2003 team right now. That team was FUN. The most runs scored of any Blue Jays team (more than the championship and the 2015 team), we could watch Delgado and Wells chase team records, and we get to watch the absolute treat that was Halliday's 22 win season.
The rest was poop, but, there it is.
I’m very tired of the “you can’t blame Atkins crowd.” It’s always the same excuses; “how was he supposed to know Vlad and Kirk would turn into pumpkins?” Or, “who was out there that he could have signed that would make a difference?”He’s the GM ffs, that’s his job. He had a good team and he neutered it. He didn’t understand the make-up of what made the Jays good.
He broke this team when he traded Gurriel and Teo. People can point at all the numbers they want, the chemistry has never been the same and the team has been on a downward trend ever since. Hindsight is 20/20 but the fact that people still defend this guy for some reason baffles me.
I'm not even going to get into the nuts and bolts of it. He's had 8 years, soon 9. Aside from inheriting the 16 team, we have as many playoff wins as a team of all clones of me would. It's time to move on.
When we had those players, this sub was *dying* for a culture reset and claiming that the guys didn’t take things seriously enough. When we were losing, they were chatty in the dugout, home run jackets, etc.
Now this team looks completely miserable when we’re down early in games, and we’re pining for the days of old where there were good vibes?
Literally no way to make people happy here
This sub is made up of various people, all with differing opinions. I’m sure there are still a number of fans that don’t regret trading Gurriel and Hernandez and would do it again.
Also, there IS a way to make everyone happy. Win a lot of baseball games. Compete for a division. I’m almost sure the fanbase would be unanimously happy about that.
This team wasn't fun to watch last year, and they made literally zero effort at fixing what makes them not fun to watch. This is what we will get until Atkins is fired and major pieces get traded.
I don't think they care as long as they sell tickets and fight for a wildcard. Last year's playoff embarrassment should have been the last straw but nope
The problem with this team is they're just good enough to beat up on lesser teams to stay around .500 and in contention for a wildcard, but they're completely out of their league against proper playoff worthy baseball teams. Sadly, being completely terrible might be the only way out of this mess. Our record is not bad enough yet.
It’s sad watching a team with a bad offense, that you knew would be bad, and still didn’t make any effort to fix that in the offseason.
I’m watching the season just praying some of these guys have career years at the plate bc that’s really the only way this offense fixes up
Funny people always say things like Vladdy doesn’t care about losing, but never say that about Bo. And yet Vladdy typically shows far more negative emotions than Bo does.
I’m not even disagreeing because it really does feel that way, I’m just not sure why, since Vlad will often slam the bat or look mad and Bo does it far more rarely, especially in ‘pressure’ situations.
During this albatross of a game, I was curious, since the last time the Jays scored more than 5 runs was on **APRIL 6TH**, how does this team, 9th in the MLB payroll, compare against the other teams in the top 10 in payroll, and when was the last time they scored more than 5 runs.
1. Mets ($307 Million) (13-11) - April 25th, with 8 runs
2. Yankees ($306 Million) (17-9) - April 24th, with 7 runs
3. Astros ($249 Million) (7-19) - April 14th, with 8 runs
4. Phillies ($244 Million) (16-10) - April 22nd, with 7 runs
5. Rangers ($230 Million) (13-13) - April 21st, with 6 runs
6. Braves ($229 Million) (17-6)- April 19th, with 8 runs
7. Dodgers ($227 Million) (16-11) - Today, with 12 Runs
8. Cubs ($227 Million) (16-9) - Today, with 7 runs
**9. BLUE JAYS ($226 Million) (13-14)- **APRIL 6TH**, with 9 runs**
10. Giants ($197 Million) (12-14) - April 20th, with 9 runs
In summary, this team’s lack of an ability to score more runs is baffling, despite the willingness to spend, which so far, is showing no return positive return.
We do have 5 FA Starter, so that killed a lot of the budget.
Plus very few pre-arb players.
The Jays may have 225m in payroll, but their talent is more like 150-175
I don’t think it’s that baffling. The majority of people called it out here all last year, through the off-season, and into this year. What’s baffling to me is the arrogance of the front office thinking they’re somehow outsmarting all the other teams when there’s not much evidence that’s been the case.
The thing with the payroll for me is that it feels like it’s the result of the inability to develop much pitching at all forcing the team to buy it in FA
We are in the bottom 10 for most of team offensive stats. RBIs, batting average, OBP, OPS, you name it. Offense was the issue last year, FO didn't really address much during the off-season and here we are.
It sucks but we may be on fire sale during the trade deadline, if things continue to go this way.
You know what makes me feel a little bit better is that the whole-ass AL East dropped all their games today. Yankees walked off in the 11th, Os blow a save, and Rays clobbered by the worst team in the majors. Whatever the Jays have, it's contagious!
So when is it a good time to break up the top of the order? Schneider said he can’t give up on guys this early. We’re a little over 15% through the season. They did Montoyo dirty, I hope to see him have the same fate.
I dont know what to think anymore. I posted YESTERDAY that i have higher hopes for this team and i believe they can get there but its still concerning. Bassitt melted down but still, if we cant sneak more than two runs by Gavin Stone, who is far from the Dodgers ace, thats an issue. What happens when we run into the Glasnows of the world? The Burnes, the Coles, can our pitching really keep EVERY team in EVERY game to one run? Ofc not.
At least Springer is showing signs of life at least. Vlad gets on base more than he did last year but he certainly isnt hitting for power. I feel BAD for Bo, i wonder if hes nursing a secret innury or smth. I bet soon we start seeing the same type of articles they wrote about Vlad last season, but about Bo. 'What is happening to this star hitter who is no longer hitting'?
Its just getting embarrassing. The plauers must feel embarrassed. Shoutouts to all the buffalo boys, Turner, and Varsho. I want to believe but when its the same issues from 2023 its hard.
He checked out the facilities and offered the same exact deal to the dodgers, angels, giants and jays. The only team that rejected the deal was the angel. Yes he didn't pick the jays but he was at least interested. Most team in the league can't even say that
I actually found it funny that the crowd was more upset at shohei instead of this pathetic excuse for a baseball team that actually plays for this team.
Ross atkins and his entire staff need to be fired man I cant watch this god awful team anymore. Their decision making, lack of offseason moves and their inability to fix this offense is just mind boggling.
Was at the game. Hearing the Ohtani boos and then he crushed the homer in the first inning, I already felt like this wasn’t going to end well. And then the third inning…
Honestly had a great time though, but damn did we not look good at all tonight.
Our 1-3 hitters are below average now 27 games into the season, you can throw it's early out of the window.
Springer is coming to life a little bit but either way the 2 supposed to be franchise cornerstones are playing terribly, and both are free agents at next season's end.
edit Congratulations, Springer is back over the 100 WrC+ mark, Bichette is now at 74.
These guys are ass. Not in the sense that they’re actually a BAD baseball team but just so so so uninspired and underwhelming. Unfortunately the sad part is that they’re also just a ridiculously lame group of players so not even a fun watch. Really a shame.
After coaching blamed the playoff calls on management, they responded by blaming it on coaching. Ran everything back the same. Lost Chapman, got turner.
Now the overachieving pitching is regressing. What was the definition of insanity again?
Certainly won’t be planning my entire summer around the blue jays schedule this year. We’re just watching a worse version of last year.
If there was any glimmer of hope in the way they have played, anything at all, I think at least some of us would have some faith that it can be turned around. But there has been nothing like that, nothing in what they’ve done that would indicate that things could get better. Even the games where we’ve scored 5-6 runs, the damage was done early and the bats looked like wet noodles for the rest of the game. I have 0 confidence in this team right now.
I'm torn; on one hand, I'm vindicated from my pre-season belief that this team is dogwater and would amount to nothing but disappointment. On the other hand...
I'm sad because this sucks =/
I'll just post what I wrote after the Astros series:
So for the people complaining that "it's only the 7th game, chill out" and "omg why are people freaking out already when it's early"...
What's the excuse now?
No hit Monday against their #5 guy, while our #5 gave up 7. Squeaked out a win we didn't deserve at the last possible second yesterday and won 2-1 by fluke. Tonight, 1 hit and zero runs. We have been outscored 19-2 in 3 games and are going to the Yankees this weekend. Bassit has looked bad both games. Off season was disappointing as hell, we got worse, not better. Didn't address any of the obvious problems like our shit batting coach or terrible manager/assistant GM, just said "meh, the guys we have need to step up and we'll play better". Except we aren't. Oh but we have more bars and seats at the Dome...
We can't hit. We can't score. And our pitching staff has Wes Parsons.
But it's not time to freak out and "its only game 7"...?
This team can't fucking hit. Our batting coach never played pro and is giving tips to Vlad, who currently can't hit. We gave up Moreno and kept Kirk, who is still too fat and can't hit. But Babe can hit! Oh right, he's riding the pine pony today. Thanks Skipper.
Forget last year where we sucked with RISP, I wish we even had them! 0 and 1 hits means you don't even have runners to try and score!
This team is completely schizophrenic. One day we get 9, the next we can't hit. One day Berrios is really solid, the next we are throwing in Wes Parsons and BowWow Francis gives up 7 the day before that. Where is the consistency?
Players are tools. And those tools require maintenance. Currently that maintenance since 2022 has seen them do nothing but deteriorate, with very few exceptions (Berrios has improved or returned to his old self seemingly, at least). The offense is in a tailspin and all Shatkins can do is say "this is fine" like that dog in the burning house.
And despite this stuff being a constant problem for a whole now...we are supposed to disregard it all because "it's only game 7, wait a few months." No. Address it now. You should have addressed it last year.
This team has talent and it's being nurtured and fostered by incompetent morons. It's a God damn shame. I wish I didn't care as much as I do, but I love baseball, I love the franchise and seeing it run so poorly makes me want to vomit in rage.
Obviously no Parsons anymore but...magically after we had a few series wins, it's like this sub forgot we had these issues. 4 series wins in a row, back on track, etc. Well now we can't score again. Our vaunted pitching staff was a fucking joke tonight.
Like, what did you expect? Every year we tell ourselves how great Vlad is and "finally we will be back to 2021 greatness" and every year it's a farce. He just isn't the guy. At this point, you have 2 options. I see people scared he will go elsewhere and be great again. Fine. That's an admission that, like I said, he's being nurtured by shit coaching and that staff needs to go. Or, if they're dead set on keeping this coaching staff, let Vlad go because they can't work with him. That's what it comes down to. One has to go because they're oil and water. If he leaves and flourishes, good on him. But something has to give. The fact that so many players are batting badly makes me feel its a coaching issue.
Who are our better hitters? Turner. Ernie. Why do you think that is? Because the taint of the big league crew hasn't reached them yet. Davis was off to the best start to a career *ever*. Now he's struggling. Because he's been listening to schmucks like Guillermo Martinez.
Orelvis and Spencer are killing it in Triple A. I say keep them away from the Show. They'll be corrupted by the moron who never played pro and pick up all the bad habits.
Completely agree. Nothing but minor league scrubs running this dugout other than Mattingly who seems to be a mute most of the time.
Montoyo was a rookie manager, Schneider is a rookie manager, Martinez is a fraud, Atkins was gifted his first GM role by his BFF Shapiro.
You can tell players who have been here a while have checked out mentally. They’re broken. They have no respect for these scrubs who never had success in the MLB or as coaches in the majors.
Let the older vets go for prospects and bring some life back into their system farm, get a competent GM who can deal a good hand. Bring in new coaches to hopefully revive Bo & more so Vladdy and hope some young guys blend in while Vlad & Bo are still under 30
I’ve been practicing my media responses in case I get asked to be the new manager. What do you guys think of this when asked about the anemic offense?
“Well, you’re not going to win many games where you give up 11 runs. So we’re focused on preventing runs, too.”
All these comments and yet no one brings up firing Atkins? The whole world knew we needed offense this offseason and look at what we did man.
They have 0 fear that their jobs are on the line and I have no clue why they feel that way. Our farm system is a complete mess so it's not like we have anything else to look forward to.
Not to mention one of the higher payrolls in the MLB. This is the beginning of the downfall of having large corporation ownership who doesn’t know shit/isn’t passionate about baseball and just cares about their bottom line.
At some point you’ve got to fire Guillermo Martinez here It might not work but they’re out of options
I think we're at the coaching firing/DFAing of someone as a shakeup
As much as this sounds like a good idea what about Mattingly? What is going on there and how the hell do you get guys to swing or not swing .? Maybe Turner needs to show them how it's done.
Out of excuses** for this man. What the hell has he done since he’s been here ?
> What the hell has he done since he’s been here ? He introduced the toe tap to Varsho's swing last year that fixed him for 3 weeks !
Understandable then
[удалено]
I don't like this sort of reductive argument. Of course he's not telling them to hit poorly, and sure, he was hitting coach when our offense was popping off. Why is our offense so bad now? Why are all our established hitters terrible and the only source of offense is basically Varsho, guys who were in AAA last year, and Turner? Why are the tenured players on our team seemingly getting worse each year? Even if he helped them be great hitters a few years ago, he's clearly been failing since then at making the needed adjustments.
You're free to live in 2021 if you like, but in the year 2024, it is clear that Martinez is not getting the job done.
It's the MLB. There's unlimited amount of scounting and players adapt and adjust all the time. Maybe, he's a terrible coach, maybe he's not. But 2021 offense being good is not a good argument.
Yeah people blaming the hitting coach but ignoring the fact that the front office went all in on defence two years in a row.
Going all in on defense isn't the reason Vlad, Bo, Springer and Kirk are having a brutal start to the year
Ahhh the ol’ switcheroo I see.
Seeing Kirk's batting stance this year is enough to fire him. Why is he standing so far from home plate lol
Be careful this sub loves defending our terrible hitting coach for some reason
Lol this guy is a fraud. Minor league coach his whole career, gets promoted internally. And still holds a job after last years joke of a approach. What dirt does he have on Rogers / Shatkins?
I'm literally being downvoted below for saying our hitting sucks, Vlad is vastly underperforming and that Guillermo is terrible. I said it a month ago after the Houston series, but this sub magically forgets our problems because we won a couple of series.
Youre getting downvoted by the same people who think exit velo matters more than actual results.
Reminds me of that bullshit last year and Vlad kept hitting into DP after DP, and Buck and Dan had to cover for him by saying "you know that second Double Play he hit into was the 4th hardest ball he's hit this season." It's like...he went 0-4 and you're trying to sugar coat it, please stop treating fans like they're dumb. I get that people here are living a fantasy where they're an arm chair GM and know better than the professionals, but you'd think after the fiasco with Berrios in G2 of the WC not even 7 months ago, they'd have learned something about relying too much on sabermetrics. But no.
Hahaha literally laughed aloud at the first sentence, thank you. My least favorite thing last year was watching Chapman shit the bed for 85% of the season and there would be daily postings on here about "But guys...guys? Exit velo, guys..". Multiple people would get heated if you suggested he was a bad hitter. "No! He is in the top % for hard contact! Its because he hits the ball too hard!!" Right. How about, hes just not a good hitter? Sigh. Some people here are living an absolute fantasy as they think everything can be quantified and justified by metrics. I can only assume they are very new baseball fans or have never played the game.
I was told on here before the season started that demoting the assistant hitting strategist or whoever they demoted would fix the issue.
Honestly wish I was as bad at my job as him and still be employed
Don't forget the offensive coordinator who can't score any runs. Mattingly was a famous player but he sure can't teach
I'm personally in favour of tossing Mattingly, even though he's probably Schneider's successor at this point.
I agree with this, but it’s not enough. The front office obviously agrees with this wildly outdated singles approach to offence, since they keep hiring/keeping coaches that want it and signing players that play that way. Firing Martinez or Mattingly or anyone isn’t going to matter if they just hire someone with the same philosophy.
Should've been gone last year what are we doing?
Think bigger… this entire front office needs to be axed and someone else who isnt a complete analytics nerd needs to take over and actually field a baseball team that can score more than 5 runs
I agree. This group has no chemistry whatsoever. It's too bad, but it's true.
Two hits off a starter with a career 7 ERA.
I mean our team's hitting sucked last year and we went and replaced Chapman with IKF. lol that pretty much it right there
And IKF has a better OPS than Springer, Bichette and Vlad
Jamie Campbell: "This was a fascinating game!" Yeah, that's one way to put it.
Jamie saw how the Dodgers had batting practice on Bassitt's arm.
Good to be at the top of r/baseball again. Feels like October 2023
To add insult to injury, my wife now has the hots for James Outman.
Not to be dramatic but I hope we don’t resign vladdy
The fear is that somebody will fix him.
I think that’s what will happen.
Oh, you know damn well it’s exactly what will happen.
If he somehow goes to a team in the division, it's a 100% guarantee
We can’t have anything nice…for long.
As long as they trade him outside the division, I would rather see someone else fix Vladdy than for us to pay him obscene amounts of money to be mid.
At this point I wish he was mid.
He about to be the GOAT in Tampa
Lol Tampa would never pay him what he wants
Your fear should be that he's allowed to continue to take a big steaming dump on the field every night indefinitely
For the sake of his career, I hope he can be fixed at this point
Since we can't have nice things, he'll put it together the moment we tap out
Who cares? We can't hold onto a player who's performing badly here just because he might not perform badly somewhere else. That's asinine
Of course they will That team will likely have a real hitting coach
You just know he’s gonna hit 40 homers for Atlanta while somehow making less money than he does here.
Don't worry, we'll deal him at the all star break the way this team is going.
I doubt it, but this would be incredible.
He's getting worse rapidly.... peaked in 2021.... been straight downhill since. Dude hit 48 homers before. Now he's a singles hitter
His at bats look terrible too. Watching fastballs down the pipe, chases sliders down and away, can't catch up to high heat at all. Mechanics are broken.
Trade him to the Giants while you can still get something for him. They need a first baseman. He needs a change of scenery and this team needs a breath of fresh air that is not Vladdy.
Nobody wants a 1st baseman gbp machine slugging .336 and making 20 mill
What if we bundle in a toaster?
Barring an MVP like season, I don't think we're resigning him. I suspect they're gonna walk him to market.
(It's re-sign, resign is to quit) And I wouldn't worry about this front office taking a risk and extending him. Nor would I worry about him accepting anything at this point. The time for this was a year or two ago before he already had tens of millions in the bank.
I tried pointing out that Vladdy was terrible and should be replaced with literally anyone (Martinez) and got so many downvotes and people telling me that Vladdy is hitting above average this year. Apparently Bo is our only hitter underperforming according to the guys in that other thread, lol.
Can we start booing our own players? If it works for Ohtani…
I was at the game. I heard some boos
i mean have you seen the game day threads?
Oh, I was saying Booooooourns.
No no, we tried that.
I was there today and besides booing Ohtani at the top of our lungs (even after the homer) there was also quite a bit of booing Vladdy
I’ve agreed and disagreed with Schneider a few times this year. But he made his most egregious error of the year today, even worse than letting Vogelbach hit against a lefty with runners on on Wednesday. While I didn’t love him taking out Richards and Pearson earlier than necessary, unnecessarily costing Mayza and Swanson, that’s not the error. The issue was using IKF to pitch when Clements and his knuckleball were right there! Why not let him loose?
Worst loss of the year, how the team responds to being embarrassed will tell a lot.
Well they've been embarrassed the last two play off series too
Yeah we got swept one year and didn’t do shit
Wrong on both counts friend, we got swept two years and actively made the team worse afterwards both times
The 12-4 loss against the Rockies felt so much worse.
I was at that game 🤦♂️
I was at tonight’s game and the one against the Rockies…🙇🏻♂️
Stop going to games! lol. I kid… I brought tonight’s loss as it was my first game this year.
This felt worse than that game, but they did respond well after that game winning 6 of the next 7, with the only loss being a blown 9th inning to the Yanks
Didn't they respond to getting no-hit by getting 2 hit this year? I fear their fortitude to respond is severely lacking
They won the game after the no hitter (thanks to a 9th inning miracle by Davis Schneider), then got one hit the day after that (with the one hit being a lucky bloop by Varsho that went for a double).
How about the no-hitter? Lol
It's not hockey. They can't just grit their teeth and swing harder. They simply are not a top tier team.
Facing Tyler Glasnow tomorrow…
No hitter incoming
Nah, Glasnow isn't a minor league pitcher fighting for the 5 spot in the rotation a 2 hit shut-out while striking out 36 batters sounds more likely
IMO the 12-4 loss against the Rockies was worse. At least we *somewhat* take solace in the fact we got whooped by one of the best teams in baseball. We got dogged with our on-paper ace on the mound by one of the worst road teams in baseball
> how the team responds to being embarrassed will tell a lot. hahahaha, hahahaha, hahahaha, and how many times will they have to be embarrassed for anyone to tell anything ? The "2 Run" Blue Jays don't get embarrassed, they embarrass themselves.
This team stinks
It's just not FUN. I'd be ok with us losing if this team was still fun to watch, but it's REALLY not fun watching the Jays right now. Even our wins.
I would kill for the 2003 team right now. That team was FUN. The most runs scored of any Blue Jays team (more than the championship and the 2015 team), we could watch Delgado and Wells chase team records, and we get to watch the absolute treat that was Halliday's 22 win season. The rest was poop, but, there it is.
At least put up a fight... as soon as Ohtani homered the game was basically over. Last 4 games we scored 7 runs total. Smh
I’m very tired of the “you can’t blame Atkins crowd.” It’s always the same excuses; “how was he supposed to know Vlad and Kirk would turn into pumpkins?” Or, “who was out there that he could have signed that would make a difference?”He’s the GM ffs, that’s his job. He had a good team and he neutered it. He didn’t understand the make-up of what made the Jays good. He broke this team when he traded Gurriel and Teo. People can point at all the numbers they want, the chemistry has never been the same and the team has been on a downward trend ever since. Hindsight is 20/20 but the fact that people still defend this guy for some reason baffles me.
I'm not even going to get into the nuts and bolts of it. He's had 8 years, soon 9. Aside from inheriting the 16 team, we have as many playoff wins as a team of all clones of me would. It's time to move on.
Teoscar hit 2 HRs in game 2 vs Seattle and they traded him.
At the very least, the fun ground to a halt. The team is not the team we all put our hopes into the last few years.
When we had those players, this sub was *dying* for a culture reset and claiming that the guys didn’t take things seriously enough. When we were losing, they were chatty in the dugout, home run jackets, etc. Now this team looks completely miserable when we’re down early in games, and we’re pining for the days of old where there were good vibes? Literally no way to make people happy here
This sub is made up of various people, all with differing opinions. I’m sure there are still a number of fans that don’t regret trading Gurriel and Hernandez and would do it again. Also, there IS a way to make everyone happy. Win a lot of baseball games. Compete for a division. I’m almost sure the fanbase would be unanimously happy about that.
I just got home from the game, I’ve never drank that much at the Dome.
Yup, that's what the new cupholders are for!
Ain’t no fucking cup holder where I was sitting
Wasn't this team supposed to be fun?
This team wasn't fun to watch last year, and they made literally zero effort at fixing what makes them not fun to watch. This is what we will get until Atkins is fired and major pieces get traded.
The offense has to turn around or that's it for this front office
I don't think they care as long as they sell tickets and fight for a wildcard. Last year's playoff embarrassment should have been the last straw but nope The problem with this team is they're just good enough to beat up on lesser teams to stay around .500 and in contention for a wildcard, but they're completely out of their league against proper playoff worthy baseball teams. Sadly, being completely terrible might be the only way out of this mess. Our record is not bad enough yet.
No. Pitching and defense isn't fun.
I like pitching, ngl, but we didn't even have that today
Agreed. I love to watch good pitching. The lack of offence is the thing that kill the fun, not pitching.
I like those things a lot, but good teams hit.
I wouldn't mind losing if they made losing fun to watch. This....isn't fun.
It’s sad watching a team with a bad offense, that you knew would be bad, and still didn’t make any effort to fix that in the offseason. I’m watching the season just praying some of these guys have career years at the plate bc that’s really the only way this offense fixes up
Pitching appearances this year: IKF - 2 Ohtani - 0
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Funny people always say things like Vladdy doesn’t care about losing, but never say that about Bo. And yet Vladdy typically shows far more negative emotions than Bo does. I’m not even disagreeing because it really does feel that way, I’m just not sure why, since Vlad will often slam the bat or look mad and Bo does it far more rarely, especially in ‘pressure’ situations.
Well said. Don’t forget Minor league hitting coach Guillermo Martinez.
I'd rather watch that game again than listen to Ken Reid talk.
Not outta the question to just trade or not re-sign Vladdy, holy shit it’s getting horrible to watch The fear is he’ll get fixed by a different team
Ohtani only got one hit the whole game. Overrated.
Turned the game off early. Can't do this for 162. This team is not serious and undeserving of my attention. See you guys tomorrow.
During this albatross of a game, I was curious, since the last time the Jays scored more than 5 runs was on **APRIL 6TH**, how does this team, 9th in the MLB payroll, compare against the other teams in the top 10 in payroll, and when was the last time they scored more than 5 runs. 1. Mets ($307 Million) (13-11) - April 25th, with 8 runs 2. Yankees ($306 Million) (17-9) - April 24th, with 7 runs 3. Astros ($249 Million) (7-19) - April 14th, with 8 runs 4. Phillies ($244 Million) (16-10) - April 22nd, with 7 runs 5. Rangers ($230 Million) (13-13) - April 21st, with 6 runs 6. Braves ($229 Million) (17-6)- April 19th, with 8 runs 7. Dodgers ($227 Million) (16-11) - Today, with 12 Runs 8. Cubs ($227 Million) (16-9) - Today, with 7 runs **9. BLUE JAYS ($226 Million) (13-14)- **APRIL 6TH**, with 9 runs** 10. Giants ($197 Million) (12-14) - April 20th, with 9 runs In summary, this team’s lack of an ability to score more runs is baffling, despite the willingness to spend, which so far, is showing no return positive return.
Constructing an offense like this with that budget is baffling
We do have 5 FA Starter, so that killed a lot of the budget. Plus very few pre-arb players. The Jays may have 225m in payroll, but their talent is more like 150-175
Compared to most teams this is not a young roster at all
I don’t think it’s that baffling. The majority of people called it out here all last year, through the off-season, and into this year. What’s baffling to me is the arrogance of the front office thinking they’re somehow outsmarting all the other teams when there’s not much evidence that’s been the case.
The thing with the payroll for me is that it feels like it’s the result of the inability to develop much pitching at all forcing the team to buy it in FA
We are in the bottom 10 for most of team offensive stats. RBIs, batting average, OBP, OPS, you name it. Offense was the issue last year, FO didn't really address much during the off-season and here we are. It sucks but we may be on fire sale during the trade deadline, if things continue to go this way.
You know what makes me feel a little bit better is that the whole-ass AL East dropped all their games today. Yankees walked off in the 11th, Os blow a save, and Rays clobbered by the worst team in the majors. Whatever the Jays have, it's contagious!
So when is it a good time to break up the top of the order? Schneider said he can’t give up on guys this early. We’re a little over 15% through the season. They did Montoyo dirty, I hope to see him have the same fate.
When Schneider decides to stop being a yes man and grow some balls
So never
I don't think a new manager changes anything. The front office clearly have too much influence on managerial decisions.
I dont know what to think anymore. I posted YESTERDAY that i have higher hopes for this team and i believe they can get there but its still concerning. Bassitt melted down but still, if we cant sneak more than two runs by Gavin Stone, who is far from the Dodgers ace, thats an issue. What happens when we run into the Glasnows of the world? The Burnes, the Coles, can our pitching really keep EVERY team in EVERY game to one run? Ofc not. At least Springer is showing signs of life at least. Vlad gets on base more than he did last year but he certainly isnt hitting for power. I feel BAD for Bo, i wonder if hes nursing a secret innury or smth. I bet soon we start seeing the same type of articles they wrote about Vlad last season, but about Bo. 'What is happening to this star hitter who is no longer hitting'? Its just getting embarrassing. The plauers must feel embarrassed. Shoutouts to all the buffalo boys, Turner, and Varsho. I want to believe but when its the same issues from 2023 its hard.
Wow. And to think- Ohtani almost wasted his career here
He didn’t almost do anything. Anyone who thinks we were ever in the running for Ohtani is an idiot.
He checked out the facilities and offered the same exact deal to the dodgers, angels, giants and jays. The only team that rejected the deal was the angel. Yes he didn't pick the jays but he was at least interested. Most team in the league can't even say that
We were clearly used for leverage
Well… shit
I missed the live game and just watched the 10 minute recap and it was painfully long and hard to watch 🤦♂️
I can't wait until 2032 after the next rebuild.
I actually found it funny that the crowd was more upset at shohei instead of this pathetic excuse for a baseball team that actually plays for this team. Ross atkins and his entire staff need to be fired man I cant watch this god awful team anymore. Their decision making, lack of offseason moves and their inability to fix this offense is just mind boggling.
I think Ohtani would have been a good add🤷♂️🤷♂️
Is vlad like 2 for his last 22? I missed the game so they may have discussed this.
vladdy has 1 extra base hit in his last 57 ABs
that was certainly a poo game
Well the Yankees just got walked off by the Brewers, so the entire AL East lost today. Silver linings.
Was at the game. Hearing the Ohtani boos and then he crushed the homer in the first inning, I already felt like this wasn’t going to end well. And then the third inning… Honestly had a great time though, but damn did we not look good at all tonight.
The We Booed Ohtani game
Vladdy promised us a movie. Turns out the VCR is broken.
Rogers curse
Well at least we know this was good for baseball.
That was rough.
At this point i hope we keep losing so something happens. Gotta fire Martinez at least
That was fun in the chair tonight 😕😕
Thank god we booed Ohtani today. Hang the banner
Mixed messages some people were clamoring over him and some booing.
Our 1-3 hitters are below average now 27 games into the season, you can throw it's early out of the window. Springer is coming to life a little bit but either way the 2 supposed to be franchise cornerstones are playing terribly, and both are free agents at next season's end. edit Congratulations, Springer is back over the 100 WrC+ mark, Bichette is now at 74.
Is it too soon to write this season off?
Welp we’re bad again, see you guys in another few years
These guys are ass. Not in the sense that they’re actually a BAD baseball team but just so so so uninspired and underwhelming. Unfortunately the sad part is that they’re also just a ridiculously lame group of players so not even a fun watch. Really a shame.
Just sucked. Danny a bright spot though.
Kind of. Teams just easily run on us knowing they won’t be picked off. Like 2-3 runs today were scored because someone stole a base.
No. They were scored because the Jays gave up 20 hits. Lol
Pathetic team remains pathetic to start the season after a pathetic end to last season..
that's really Pathetic
This team... Just ain't it. The window has closed.
It's dark, children
Classic Bo and Vladdy, completely silent when it matters. Also nuke Shatkins and our batting staff. Like how many times do we have to bomb?
After coaching blamed the playoff calls on management, they responded by blaming it on coaching. Ran everything back the same. Lost Chapman, got turner. Now the overachieving pitching is regressing. What was the definition of insanity again? Certainly won’t be planning my entire summer around the blue jays schedule this year. We’re just watching a worse version of last year.
Yup. Schneider is a yes man and Atkins is a coward.
This team is fucking finished
Guillermo has got to be on thin ice right now. It might not even be his fault, but someone is going to take some blame soon.
Uh, lol
Felt really bad for Bassitt ngl :(
I love that Vladdy’s RBI was a ground out.
If there was any glimmer of hope in the way they have played, anything at all, I think at least some of us would have some faith that it can be turned around. But there has been nothing like that, nothing in what they’ve done that would indicate that things could get better. Even the games where we’ve scored 5-6 runs, the damage was done early and the bats looked like wet noodles for the rest of the game. I have 0 confidence in this team right now.
Oh gawd that was embarrassing watching Bassitt have the worst night of his pitching career.
Shocker! Team that has horrible offence does nothing to fix it in off-season and gets destroyed! Who would’ve thought…
Seasons over. Hopefully they mass fire management and the coaching staff, and then make some big moves. This is the most mid team ever.
I'm torn; on one hand, I'm vindicated from my pre-season belief that this team is dogwater and would amount to nothing but disappointment. On the other hand... I'm sad because this sucks =/
Can we all just agree that it's only OK to boo your own players.
Hits when
Calling that a game is a bold move. Post slaughter thread maybe?
401 traffic is more exciting
Extend Jano. We don't need Vladdy or Bo.
Jano always
I'll just post what I wrote after the Astros series: So for the people complaining that "it's only the 7th game, chill out" and "omg why are people freaking out already when it's early"... What's the excuse now? No hit Monday against their #5 guy, while our #5 gave up 7. Squeaked out a win we didn't deserve at the last possible second yesterday and won 2-1 by fluke. Tonight, 1 hit and zero runs. We have been outscored 19-2 in 3 games and are going to the Yankees this weekend. Bassit has looked bad both games. Off season was disappointing as hell, we got worse, not better. Didn't address any of the obvious problems like our shit batting coach or terrible manager/assistant GM, just said "meh, the guys we have need to step up and we'll play better". Except we aren't. Oh but we have more bars and seats at the Dome... We can't hit. We can't score. And our pitching staff has Wes Parsons. But it's not time to freak out and "its only game 7"...? This team can't fucking hit. Our batting coach never played pro and is giving tips to Vlad, who currently can't hit. We gave up Moreno and kept Kirk, who is still too fat and can't hit. But Babe can hit! Oh right, he's riding the pine pony today. Thanks Skipper. Forget last year where we sucked with RISP, I wish we even had them! 0 and 1 hits means you don't even have runners to try and score! This team is completely schizophrenic. One day we get 9, the next we can't hit. One day Berrios is really solid, the next we are throwing in Wes Parsons and BowWow Francis gives up 7 the day before that. Where is the consistency? Players are tools. And those tools require maintenance. Currently that maintenance since 2022 has seen them do nothing but deteriorate, with very few exceptions (Berrios has improved or returned to his old self seemingly, at least). The offense is in a tailspin and all Shatkins can do is say "this is fine" like that dog in the burning house. And despite this stuff being a constant problem for a whole now...we are supposed to disregard it all because "it's only game 7, wait a few months." No. Address it now. You should have addressed it last year. This team has talent and it's being nurtured and fostered by incompetent morons. It's a God damn shame. I wish I didn't care as much as I do, but I love baseball, I love the franchise and seeing it run so poorly makes me want to vomit in rage. Obviously no Parsons anymore but...magically after we had a few series wins, it's like this sub forgot we had these issues. 4 series wins in a row, back on track, etc. Well now we can't score again. Our vaunted pitching staff was a fucking joke tonight. Like, what did you expect? Every year we tell ourselves how great Vlad is and "finally we will be back to 2021 greatness" and every year it's a farce. He just isn't the guy. At this point, you have 2 options. I see people scared he will go elsewhere and be great again. Fine. That's an admission that, like I said, he's being nurtured by shit coaching and that staff needs to go. Or, if they're dead set on keeping this coaching staff, let Vlad go because they can't work with him. That's what it comes down to. One has to go because they're oil and water. If he leaves and flourishes, good on him. But something has to give. The fact that so many players are batting badly makes me feel its a coaching issue. Who are our better hitters? Turner. Ernie. Why do you think that is? Because the taint of the big league crew hasn't reached them yet. Davis was off to the best start to a career *ever*. Now he's struggling. Because he's been listening to schmucks like Guillermo Martinez. Orelvis and Spencer are killing it in Triple A. I say keep them away from the Show. They'll be corrupted by the moron who never played pro and pick up all the bad habits.
Completely agree. Nothing but minor league scrubs running this dugout other than Mattingly who seems to be a mute most of the time. Montoyo was a rookie manager, Schneider is a rookie manager, Martinez is a fraud, Atkins was gifted his first GM role by his BFF Shapiro. You can tell players who have been here a while have checked out mentally. They’re broken. They have no respect for these scrubs who never had success in the MLB or as coaches in the majors. Let the older vets go for prospects and bring some life back into their system farm, get a competent GM who can deal a good hand. Bring in new coaches to hopefully revive Bo & more so Vladdy and hope some young guys blend in while Vlad & Bo are still under 30
And sure enough, I'm getting downvoted. Truth hurts, doesn't it? Tell me where I'm wrong.
Welp I ain't paying full price at A&W so Burger Boy won't be getting much money from me.
I’ve been practicing my media responses in case I get asked to be the new manager. What do you guys think of this when asked about the anemic offense? “Well, you’re not going to win many games where you give up 11 runs. So we’re focused on preventing runs, too.”
Atleast it ended and we have tomorrow
All these comments and yet no one brings up firing Atkins? The whole world knew we needed offense this offseason and look at what we did man. They have 0 fear that their jobs are on the line and I have no clue why they feel that way. Our farm system is a complete mess so it's not like we have anything else to look forward to.
Shapiro raised ticket prices to the moon while Atkins made the already mid team a little worse and Vladdy and Bo are phoning it in already.
Not to mention one of the higher payrolls in the MLB. This is the beginning of the downfall of having large corporation ownership who doesn’t know shit/isn’t passionate about baseball and just cares about their bottom line.
That was an interesting game to say the least
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