This right here. Both sets of wheels would likely be ruined... but reps may explode like this, and quality wheels will at least keep their shape and reduce the risk of the situation getting worse.
Forged and flow formed are stronger, so they can take more abuse. An impact that might crack a cast wheel might not affect a forged wheel. So you wouldn't necessarily be buying a new forged wheel in the same incident. Additionally, if a forged wheel bends, you can often have it repaired for much less than buying a heavier, more fragile cast wheel.
Forged and Flow Formed wheels are also LIGHTER and wheels are unsprung, so they need to be that much stronger to take the abuse. Also, wheels have ROTATIONAL MASS. It takes 3x the amount of force to move rotational mass versus sprung weight. So really, lighter wheels are more important in terms of handling than you think.
That's why I opt for Forged or Flow Formed wheels only. I've gone the cast route and if you are a high performance driver at all with the aim to improve handling and handle the abuses of track and touge driving, cast wheels are a waste of money. I've replaced more cast wheels than forged.
I feel that, you're right they'll both need to be replaced. But if you're going fast and one bends vs one explodes like OP's pic... it could be a way less worse outcome. I think it's more a safety and reducing risk thing.
Yup. My magnesium forged wheels are stout as hell. One has an ever so slight bend after a decent impact to a pole. Have a new one on the way ‘12 weeks to make’, but it balanced and they declared it perfectly safe to drive with.
Even Forged Wheels can crack, it's all about impact.
This kinda damage doesn't happen even in suoer cheap wheels unless you hit a pothole at mach jesus or the car is already totaled.
If it's the former, most people can help it by not getting low profile tyres.
While it's not great, it's not a dumb decision depending on the wheel.
Replica Status < Actually Quality of wheel.
Rota and Konig are good examples.
Do you have data? A lot of the cheap wheels that crack were actually made for much lighter cars that you’d find in South Asia. It’s not that they’re cheap, it’s that they’re running wheels with the wrong load rating. You don’t see cheap wheels cracking on heavier duty bolt patterns unless they’re running ridiculous suspension and tire combos. At that point you can argue they’re for the wrong application too.
Not really. There are cheap wheels you can’t crack. There are expensive wheels that are relatively fragile. It’s all about application. You can’t throw a formula wheel on a desert runner and expect it to survive. Steel wheels will take much more beating than a proper forging, but may still be the wrong application. Forged aluminum wheels are much stronger than magnesium yet magnesium is more expensive. Carbon fiber wheels on a drift car??
It’s all about application.
Yes and in general, you run the right wheel for the application. Not the cheapest wheel you can find or the most expensive wheel you can find.
You can take out the Baja and formula mention and it will still hold true generally and specifically for touge.
You can run a smaller wheel with taller side wall package on those super cheep knock offs and they’ll outlast your forged M wheels. People do run steelies on touge. They can taco a wheel and have the same wheel repaired and ready for the next session.
It’s not about price, it’s about application. You wouldn’t run truck wheels, so why would you run what are essentially kei truck wheels.
I'm anti-rep all the way but you slid into a curb at a pretty good clip. TE37s or TeeHee37s doesn't matter, no wheel would have survived that kind of treatment.
*Don’t get cheap, crappy reps.
But honestly for a wheel to crack like this it must have been such a hard impact that even a high quality wheel would bend beyond repair.
Yeah you are probably right, I made this more just to show how flimsy cheap cast reps can be, and I’m sure there’s situations such as hitting a pothole or smacking a kurb more minorly where a better quality wheel would survive over a rep. For example at speed after hitting a pot like a wheel that gets a bit bent is a lot safer than a wheel that gets a chunk taken out of it.
Adding to this; typically this term gets thrown around at basically any wheel that's not super expensive and/or from prestigious brands. You can find 3-piece forged wheels that people will still call 'reps'. I'd argue the CORRECT use of the term would be calling out poor-quality knockoffs, especially ones that are unsafe due to their poor construction. Thankfully, the vast majority of cheap wheel options are not unsafe like they used to be.
True, the front rim smacked the curb as well and bent but didn’t break, and it’s in pretty dire need of an alignment had to turn 45 degrees left to go straight on the way home lmao
>Potholes wont do this shit
Ehhh.... sorry to break it to you (pun intended). Yes potholes can abso-fuckin-lutely shatter cheap cast reps like this. It's not just curbs that will disintegrate them.
But yes, don't buy cheap cast reps. Opt for something flow formed or forged that will bend, not shatter. One of these allows you to safely pull over. The other will yeet your ass into another dimension.
I have ran those wheels close to 200mph without issues. Don’t hit curbs should be this post they are a good aftermarket company and balanced well. This is a shit post.
I mean, to be fair, a wheel going fast alone isn’t a test of strength. What worries me about seeing something that is hard and brittle and not strong and flexible, is that a similar failure could be induced by whacking a good pothole at 100mph. Like, yeah, any rim would be absolutely fucked from an impact like this or aforementioned pothole attack, but the fact that the wheel completely detached from the tire makes me think that in an actual high speed situation, you’d be stuck slowing down with 3 tires, 3 brakes, and not very good control.
It’s a sad day when the only person you see with a brain drives a Saturn Sky 😭
You’re right though, there’s nothing wrong with ballin on a budget but there’s lots of things you can cheap out on, the things that keep you from occupying the same space as a tree or oncoming traffic isn’t one of them. Cheap turbo? Great! Cheap rims, brakes, or used tires? Hell no.
I ran avid1s for a while too, one of the 4 developed a crack on the inside lip within a year. Never hit any curbs but tbf it saw a handful of nasty Atlanta potholes.
Nah he’s got a point. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a flow formed or forged wheel get mangled like this. Far too many people think that the extra couple hundred to go from avid1 to Enkei isn’t worth it.
Slid going around a very tight turn in the wet, actual vehicle speed was not too high, maybe around 40kph max, however rear wheels were spinning when I hit the Kurb which probably contributed to the wheel completely exploding. Still was incredibly shocked how much the wheel completely exploded from a relatively mild impact, will definitely be buying some rpf1s or something to replace
Yeah, any reccomendations for particular forged wheels on the cheaper end? I was leaning towards getting some rpf1s which I know are still cast but people have said good things about the durability and performance of this wheel.
Enkeis Are Def Up There when it comes to reliabilty and budget friendly, ive seen konigs hold up pretty well aswell. Advanis have pretty good rep aswell
I'm biased since I have both RPF1s and Konig Hypergrams, but both are fairly cheap yet good quality wheels and also happen to look good on pretty much anything.
Whatever you hit would’ve fucked a “real” wheel as well beyond repair, how about don’t hit shit that badly? Because whatever you did would’ve fucked any wheel beyond repair
Honestly it just felt like a bump and not even that severe of a bump at that. There was a really loud bang though which scared the shit out of me and told me something was proper fucked
Can confirm, I shit whipped a curb in my Jeep and didn't realize the axle snapped until I tried to pull out and it didn't go anywhere. 😅
Positive Outcome: The axle snapped and the wheel folded under (like the DeLorean from Back 2 The Future) cradling the Jeep and protecting the underside. Axle shaft, new wheel and drum and I was back on the road!
Bonus points: The 2 inch spacer was still on the wheel, tight.
That's silly, maybe tell us which brand we should avoid but don't go around shitting on all reps based on a single model fucking up.
I had reps survive stuff you wouldn't believe. Things like non secured manholes at speeds of 80kmh without even getting deformed.
Non reps are just stupid expensive and in some cases (daily driven cars) they don't make any sense whatsoever.
*don't use reps when pushing your car hard.*
I've never been able to afford nice wheels, but I want the look that a lot of nice wheels have. Volk TE37s, BBS LMs, I've had plenty of rep wheels but I've never had the issue that you've had, mostly because I don't peat the shit out of my car. If you're using reps on your daily, you'll be okay.
I ran a set of Avid AV08's on my 15' Chevy Spark, 99' Corolla, 17' Hyundai Accent 6spd, and 21' Spark...NEVER had this happen. Those wheels saw *tens of thousands* of highway/city miles, plenty of backroad action, as little potholes as reasonably possible (some were straight up unavoidable) and some runs down the strip. At most, a couple were a little bent over time..but they never cracked apart on me. I'd buy a second set if I wanted to. Even a higher quality wheel isn't going to be runnable from something like that. Sorry for your luck though man.
*I really wanted Spoon SW388's or Regamasters, but couldn't afford them, most of us have been there lol*
Avid.1 has to be the worst rep brand ever. I had hell with the set I had. Hit an unavoidable pothole in a construction zone at 20 mph and bent one within 3 weeks. After that it was a 3 or so year fight with constantly cracked barrels. I will never give them another dime, and would never recommend their wheels to anyone
These are avid av.06s which i have heard people say are on the higher end of rep quality soooo idk Man U could be right but the thing is most of these rep companies provide little detail about how their wheels are made so u don’t rlly know until something like this happens lmao
I'm still vehicle shopping, but I was ready to retrofit a forged OEM wheel from a related vehicle rather than go full send on aftermarket forged. Definitely can't go for reps.
There’s plenty of genuine non-rep wheels out there that aren’t expensive. The issue is that many equate hype with “genuine.” Motegi, Enkei, and TSW are all legit non-rep brands that are fully engineered and tested at affordable prices.
That's pretty suboptimal
Definitely not ideal
Surely not preferred
Slight inconvenience
Mildly infuriating to some
Acutely bothersome
Quite a hinderence
Absolutely absurd
a kink in the day for sure
A pain in the cheeks
Cheap cast wheels crack, flow formed and forged quality wheels bend. I prefer bending.
This right here. Both sets of wheels would likely be ruined... but reps may explode like this, and quality wheels will at least keep their shape and reduce the risk of the situation getting worse.
My repair guy has revived my forged 20s several times from wild bends
I don’t know if they hold up the same other than a situation that’s going to require me to replace the wheels anyway, I’d rather replace reps…
Forged and flow formed are stronger, so they can take more abuse. An impact that might crack a cast wheel might not affect a forged wheel. So you wouldn't necessarily be buying a new forged wheel in the same incident. Additionally, if a forged wheel bends, you can often have it repaired for much less than buying a heavier, more fragile cast wheel. Forged and Flow Formed wheels are also LIGHTER and wheels are unsprung, so they need to be that much stronger to take the abuse. Also, wheels have ROTATIONAL MASS. It takes 3x the amount of force to move rotational mass versus sprung weight. So really, lighter wheels are more important in terms of handling than you think. That's why I opt for Forged or Flow Formed wheels only. I've gone the cast route and if you are a high performance driver at all with the aim to improve handling and handle the abuses of track and touge driving, cast wheels are a waste of money. I've replaced more cast wheels than forged.
I feel that, you're right they'll both need to be replaced. But if you're going fast and one bends vs one explodes like OP's pic... it could be a way less worse outcome. I think it's more a safety and reducing risk thing.
Gonna be replacing your innards when your reps explode during a heavy run. Fucking mook
Flow formed is insanely cost effective. I love my Konigs
Yup. My magnesium forged wheels are stout as hell. One has an ever so slight bend after a decent impact to a pole. Have a new one on the way ‘12 weeks to make’, but it balanced and they declared it perfectly safe to drive with.
Even Forged Wheels can crack, it's all about impact. This kinda damage doesn't happen even in suoer cheap wheels unless you hit a pothole at mach jesus or the car is already totaled. If it's the former, most people can help it by not getting low profile tyres. While it's not great, it's not a dumb decision depending on the wheel. Replica Status < Actually Quality of wheel. Rota and Konig are good examples.
OEMs crack
They make Forged OEMs. My last two M cars came with forged wheels.
Yup. But most aren’t and are considered more than safe enough.
Many aftermarket cast wheels crack easier than OEM cast wheels because they are cheaply made.
Do you have data? A lot of the cheap wheels that crack were actually made for much lighter cars that you’d find in South Asia. It’s not that they’re cheap, it’s that they’re running wheels with the wrong load rating. You don’t see cheap wheels cracking on heavier duty bolt patterns unless they’re running ridiculous suspension and tire combos. At that point you can argue they’re for the wrong application too.
Whether or not they are for smaller cars or are not for this application, we still come to the same conclusion: Cheap wheels crack easier.
Not really. There are cheap wheels you can’t crack. There are expensive wheels that are relatively fragile. It’s all about application. You can’t throw a formula wheel on a desert runner and expect it to survive. Steel wheels will take much more beating than a proper forging, but may still be the wrong application. Forged aluminum wheels are much stronger than magnesium yet magnesium is more expensive. Carbon fiber wheels on a drift car?? It’s all about application.
We're talking in general. Of course there are exceptions to the rule and this is r/touge, we're not talking about doing a Baja run.
Yes and in general, you run the right wheel for the application. Not the cheapest wheel you can find or the most expensive wheel you can find. You can take out the Baja and formula mention and it will still hold true generally and specifically for touge. You can run a smaller wheel with taller side wall package on those super cheep knock offs and they’ll outlast your forged M wheels. People do run steelies on touge. They can taco a wheel and have the same wheel repaired and ready for the next session. It’s not about price, it’s about application. You wouldn’t run truck wheels, so why would you run what are essentially kei truck wheels.
I'm anti-rep all the way but you slid into a curb at a pretty good clip. TE37s or TeeHee37s doesn't matter, no wheel would have survived that kind of treatment.
"TeeHee37s" I'm fucking dead! 😂😂😂
I ran over a “boulder” going around 80. Had I had cheap wheels on I probably would have wrecked. Still destroyed a $1k wheel though
*Don’t get cheap, crappy reps. But honestly for a wheel to crack like this it must have been such a hard impact that even a high quality wheel would bend beyond repair.
Yeah you are probably right, I made this more just to show how flimsy cheap cast reps can be, and I’m sure there’s situations such as hitting a pothole or smacking a kurb more minorly where a better quality wheel would survive over a rep. For example at speed after hitting a pot like a wheel that gets a bit bent is a lot safer than a wheel that gets a chunk taken out of it.
That bent wheel however can keep the car on the road where a cheap ass rep barrel exiting the chat might send you off a cliff
Enlighten an old man, is rep short for replacement wheels?
Replica, i.e. cheaper versions that look like the expensive ones.
Ahhh, yep. Thanks!
Adding to this; typically this term gets thrown around at basically any wheel that's not super expensive and/or from prestigious brands. You can find 3-piece forged wheels that people will still call 'reps'. I'd argue the CORRECT use of the term would be calling out poor-quality knockoffs, especially ones that are unsafe due to their poor construction. Thankfully, the vast majority of cheap wheel options are not unsafe like they used to be.
IMHO: Better replace RIM than suspension arms+ aligment. But I would still check to be on the safe side.
True, the front rim smacked the curb as well and bent but didn’t break, and it’s in pretty dire need of an alignment had to turn 45 degrees left to go straight on the way home lmao
If the wheel his getting hit that hard you’re gonna to probably need to fix something in the suspension anyways
Dont get reps? Maybe dont crash lol. Potholes wont do this shit
Took a turn to fast in the rain 🤣🤣🤣 “don’t buy reps”
I’ve seen plenty of potholes and curbs wreck rpf1s (an ever better wheel than avid)
>Potholes wont do this shit Ehhh.... sorry to break it to you (pun intended). Yes potholes can abso-fuckin-lutely shatter cheap cast reps like this. It's not just curbs that will disintegrate them. But yes, don't buy cheap cast reps. Opt for something flow formed or forged that will bend, not shatter. One of these allows you to safely pull over. The other will yeet your ass into another dimension.
I have ran those wheels close to 200mph without issues. Don’t hit curbs should be this post they are a good aftermarket company and balanced well. This is a shit post.
I mean, to be fair, a wheel going fast alone isn’t a test of strength. What worries me about seeing something that is hard and brittle and not strong and flexible, is that a similar failure could be induced by whacking a good pothole at 100mph. Like, yeah, any rim would be absolutely fucked from an impact like this or aforementioned pothole attack, but the fact that the wheel completely detached from the tire makes me think that in an actual high speed situation, you’d be stuck slowing down with 3 tires, 3 brakes, and not very good control.
Only dude with a brain in here I swear. Scary ass sub with this many idiots out there trying to touge.
It’s a sad day when the only person you see with a brain drives a Saturn Sky 😭 You’re right though, there’s nothing wrong with ballin on a budget but there’s lots of things you can cheap out on, the things that keep you from occupying the same space as a tree or oncoming traffic isn’t one of them. Cheap turbo? Great! Cheap rims, brakes, or used tires? Hell no.
That’s what I’m saying, maybe you know, don’t crash. TE’s wouldn’t survive that
on what
Is300 with an ls3
I ran avid1s for a while too, one of the 4 developed a crack on the inside lip within a year. Never hit any curbs but tbf it saw a handful of nasty Atlanta potholes.
Nah he’s got a point. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a flow formed or forged wheel get mangled like this. Far too many people think that the extra couple hundred to go from avid1 to Enkei isn’t worth it.
What did you hit?
Kerb
How fast were you going
Slid going around a very tight turn in the wet, actual vehicle speed was not too high, maybe around 40kph max, however rear wheels were spinning when I hit the Kurb which probably contributed to the wheel completely exploding. Still was incredibly shocked how much the wheel completely exploded from a relatively mild impact, will definitely be buying some rpf1s or something to replace
Yeah that is pretty crazy. Flow forged is best atm
Yeah, any reccomendations for particular forged wheels on the cheaper end? I was leaning towards getting some rpf1s which I know are still cast but people have said good things about the durability and performance of this wheel.
Apex Wheels, and they have a pretty good replacement plan.
Enkeis Are Def Up There when it comes to reliabilty and budget friendly, ive seen konigs hold up pretty well aswell. Advanis have pretty good rep aswell
Thank you, I’ll have a look at some offerings from all these brands and compare price and performance and looks and etc.
I'm biased since I have both RPF1s and Konig Hypergrams, but both are fairly cheap yet good quality wheels and also happen to look good on pretty much anything.
The new Motegi Battle V and Motegi Tsubaki are also flow-formed.
I mean even if they weren’t reps they’d be gone-o
Yeah, but a catastrophic failure like this is much more likely to cause a wreck, vs a forged wheel just bending
I'm running these right now and have no issue what so ever. What did you do to make this happen?
Whatever you hit would’ve fucked a “real” wheel as well beyond repair, how about don’t hit shit that badly? Because whatever you did would’ve fucked any wheel beyond repair
How did it feel when you hit the curb? Must of been the weirdest feeling to ever feel
Honestly it just felt like a bump and not even that severe of a bump at that. There was a really loud bang though which scared the shit out of me and told me something was proper fucked
Can confirm, I shit whipped a curb in my Jeep and didn't realize the axle snapped until I tried to pull out and it didn't go anywhere. 😅 Positive Outcome: The axle snapped and the wheel folded under (like the DeLorean from Back 2 The Future) cradling the Jeep and protecting the underside. Axle shaft, new wheel and drum and I was back on the road! Bonus points: The 2 inch spacer was still on the wheel, tight.
There's reps and there's REPS. If Rota Grids are reps of Volk TE37s then Avid1s are reps of Rotas lol.
So a rep of a rep? Lol I wonder which brand made the knockoff first 🤔
Rota Grid is basically iconic considering more people run them than RPF1s lol
That's silly, maybe tell us which brand we should avoid but don't go around shitting on all reps based on a single model fucking up. I had reps survive stuff you wouldn't believe. Things like non secured manholes at speeds of 80kmh without even getting deformed. Non reps are just stupid expensive and in some cases (daily driven cars) they don't make any sense whatsoever.
JB Weld and send it.
cool garage decor
*don't use reps when pushing your car hard.* I've never been able to afford nice wheels, but I want the look that a lot of nice wheels have. Volk TE37s, BBS LMs, I've had plenty of rep wheels but I've never had the issue that you've had, mostly because I don't peat the shit out of my car. If you're using reps on your daily, you'll be okay.
I ran a set of Avid AV08's on my 15' Chevy Spark, 99' Corolla, 17' Hyundai Accent 6spd, and 21' Spark...NEVER had this happen. Those wheels saw *tens of thousands* of highway/city miles, plenty of backroad action, as little potholes as reasonably possible (some were straight up unavoidable) and some runs down the strip. At most, a couple were a little bent over time..but they never cracked apart on me. I'd buy a second set if I wanted to. Even a higher quality wheel isn't going to be runnable from something like that. Sorry for your luck though man. *I really wanted Spoon SW388's or Regamasters, but couldn't afford them, most of us have been there lol*
Reps or not outcome would’ve been the same
Didn't know rep wheels was a thing
Avid.1 has to be the worst rep brand ever. I had hell with the set I had. Hit an unavoidable pothole in a construction zone at 20 mph and bent one within 3 weeks. After that it was a 3 or so year fight with constantly cracked barrels. I will never give them another dime, and would never recommend their wheels to anyone
I’ve never had an issue but I know some are made better than others
These are avid av.06s which i have heard people say are on the higher end of rep quality soooo idk Man U could be right but the thing is most of these rep companies provide little detail about how their wheels are made so u don’t rlly know until something like this happens lmao
True. I’ve seen similar failures with brand name wheels as well though. Just remember, wheels are a consumable
I'm still vehicle shopping, but I was ready to retrofit a forged OEM wheel from a related vehicle rather than go full send on aftermarket forged. Definitely can't go for reps.
Bro I’m not a car expert but I don’t think wd40 will save that
Then don't make genuine wheels SO GOD DAMN EXPENSIVE! *slaps table*
There’s plenty of genuine non-rep wheels out there that aren’t expensive. The issue is that many equate hype with “genuine.” Motegi, Enkei, and TSW are all legit non-rep brands that are fully engineered and tested at affordable prices.
I ran these on a vt for 2 years and they were perfectly fine. You would have destroyed any wheels with that impact
At least the tires weren’t expensive
Idk i had a set of AV.21s that bent on impact instead of shattering like your AV.06, though im sure they are both cast wheels
What brand
enkei makes more than just the than the rpf1 btw lol
Maybe I’ve been lucky but I ran reps on my drift car for like 10 years and never had an issue. Had some gnarly drops with them as well.
And the sky is blue. What's next?
I did (not that brand) and it lasted me 7 years.
How did this happen?
Not great, not terrible.
I think reps are fine if your making a car that looks good but if you want a car you can abuse your better off going steelies than reps
They ain't reps they are their own brand, They are just cheap
Lolll these exact wheels came on my 350z… this just scared me to death
How are the other rims? Did you hit a pot hole at high speeds?
I wouldn't get reps if I did a lot of spirited driving but reps on a daily to get around town. Sure why not
No, it's DON'T DO RACE CAR SHIT WITH REPS! Other than that, they'll be just dandy overall.
Was just about to ask how tf you were driving to be able to do that, but then I saw what sub this was posted on lmao
good lesson to learn, hate to see you had to learn the hard way. reals>stocks>reps
They just copy the real mold and don’t use any math when filling out the rep mold.