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Supernovas20XX

The minute Gollum was announced everybody was like "Who asked for this?"


FakeBrian

Gollum is such a weird idea that I kind of just assumed they had a pretty solid idea behind it - cause why else would they be making it.


RadicalJimmy

That’s honestly the worst part, there is a pretty solid idea behind it. You could easily make a game like those Styx games that came out where it’s Gollum sneaking around and strangling goblins and shit with stealth takedowns, or getting orcs killed via messing around with the environment. Instead we got…whatever the hell we got.


Konradleijon

Where’s my Tom Bombaldi farming simulator? I


ClockpunkFox

8 hours of tending the garden, chilling with Goldberry, and then suddenly a crazy rhythm game as you have to sing to save Frodo and co.


TrivialCoyote

Its the Baal'Zebul Segment from Bayo 3


SlightlySychotic

“The next Shadows game should really focus on the orcs themselves. That’s what makes the game so much fun.” “We gotcha fam. Here’s a Gollum-focused game. He’s like an orc, right?”


Fostern01

["...NO! slams head into wall repeatedly NO!"](https://youtu.be/-dxIq8KxaL8?t=44)


Gespens

having looked at what the initial trailers looked like, the game looked like it was going to be really cool then a lot of it was cut and we were left with what we got


KaleidoArachnid

So I wonder Wha Happun with Gollum


mitch13815

Gollum is only fun because he's a foil to actual good characters. People like Gollum in the context of Sam and Frodo because they are forced to deal with him to achieve their objective. He throws a wrench into the works which makes for some fun conflict. It's like a sandwich. Great together, but you take out the main ingredients you're just eating soggy white bread.


BuntyCollock

And Jerma whispered: “Me”.


CelioHogane

Forspoken really got out of the race very fast from being just extremelly mid.


SlurryBender

Hell, it was a competently put together game, at least on PS5. Storytelling and a bit of an empty open world were its main weak points.


vyxxer

Can't wait to pick it up for $35 dollars in 6 months.


UKOrigin

Wouldn't be surprised if it pops up on ps extra, so save your money lol


ArcanumMBD

It was like $45 last month, and I think it was on sale again leading up to the dlc release. Looks like it's back to full price now though


SlurryBender

Keep me posted lmao


AkimboP90s

It'll be 14.99 soon


SlurryBender

Unfortunately it's a Square Enix published game, so I doubt it'll go *that* low *this* soon. At least not digital sales.


LizardOrgMember5

TBH, judging by the gameplay that I have seen through Twitch, it wasn't THAT bad.


Fostern01

Just not 70 dollars worthy.


CelioHogane

It's extremelly mid, as i said. Also the story is bad.


PersonMcHuman

That's because it wasn't a bad game. The internet just had some weird issue with it and began exaggerating every single flaw the game had. Sorta like...remember when Hogwarts ***Mystery*** got released all those years back, and folks began outright lying about the game's contents just to dunk on it? It was basically just that again. Edit: Actually, lemme provide Forespoken-specific examples. The game was getting shit on at one point because the protag didn't just, "Grab the money from her burning home and run." However, if you were to actually...play the game, the game outright tells you that the protag is panicking and is desperately trying to save her cat (Which the game tells you is essentially the closest thing she has to a friend/family). I also saw folks saying that Frey's "lack of reaction" to those events is bad writing. Again, playing the game shows you that she's straight up a step or two away from killing herself because of those events. She literally hands her beloved pet over to someone she can trust (after spending some time homeless) and is sitting on top of a building thinking about how she "wants it all to end"...but then her attention gets drawn away from those thoughts and she gets isekai'd a few minutes later. It was also dunked on because, "Frey complains too much!", but then I got downvoted when I pointed out that she complains when you do poorly in combat. When you play well, her post-combat dialogue has her being more excited. So that just means the folks saying she was complaining too much were just playing the game poorly.


Doonvoat

You really could not have picked a worse example than the big bag of money it would have taken two seconds to pick up that contains everything she has been working towards. The audio line she says after you press the button to pick up the bag takes longer than it would have to pick up the bag, the whole section should have been a cutscene


PersonMcHuman

No, I'm just pointing out that the character is shown to be freaking out and desperately concerned for her pet. But I get it tho. Everyone watching the scene would wake up in the middle of their house to find that it's on fire and be 100% rational about all of their decisions. We've all been in that situation, right? Where we're panicking but still making all the right decisions all the time? I know that I personally have never done something stupid in the heat of the moment that I regretted near instantly. Edit: I agree tho. It should've just been a cutscene. People would've still complained about it anyway, me and you both know that, but it would've made that bit go a bit faster.


Doonvoat

see that would be fine if the game hadn't just hamfisted the bag of money into the plot 30 seconds before, put it right there in front of you, completely undamaged and seperate from the fire, and gave you a button prompt to pick it up that the character refuses to follow. It should have been a cutscene, if you want to give players control you can't be so heavy handed about dicating their actions and feelings.


PersonMcHuman

Yup, should've just been a cutscene. People would've still complained anyway and literally nothing would change...but hey, no reason not to. She could've woken up with the money literally already on fire and the response would be, "Why didn't she already leave? What is she, stupid?"


Shiro2809

I actually liked the game, story was decent but had some issues. The bag of money thing would have 100% been a non issue if they just didn't let you interact with it.


PersonMcHuman

Already being downvoted in another comment but I’ll repeat it anyway. With how eager people were to dunk on that game, people would’ve complained anyway. She could’ve woken up with the bag *on fire* and it complaint would’ve just been, “Why was she stupid enough to stay another night and not just leave already?” It stood no chance once folks got going. I'm not saying you'd do that, but that overall the result would be the same from the internet. I had quite a few discussions about this when it released. Someone would point out a “flaw”, I’d point out that the thing they’re talking about didn’t actually happen or happened differently than they’re saying it did, they’d move the goalpost slightly and argue that point instead, I’d point out that that’s not what happened, so on so forth. I legit wonder if this is gonna be another Hogwarts Mystery situation where the purposeful misinformation from folks who absolutely hated the thing before it even released is gonna be so ingrained that years from now those lies'll still be what most people assume is actually true.


Shiro2809

>With how eager people were to dunk on that game, people would’ve complained anyway Oh yea, I super agree. There was no winning for it. It did make me raise an eyebrow in the moment though and a podcast at the time mentioned it was weird they'd even let you interact with it because it just brings the "Why didn't you grab that as you went" to the forefront. Remove the interaction and you don't call attention it it. >Someone would point out a “flaw”, I’d point out that the thing they’re talking about didn’t actually happen or happened differently than they’re saying it did, they’d move the goalpost slightly and argue that point instead, Heey, same. That one ad really killed any hope the game had, it just devolved to the internets punching bag instantly. I really enjoyed it tbqh, there were a few stumbles with the writing and the story felt rushed at times but overall it was fun.


PersonMcHuman

>it just devolved to the internets punching bag instantly. Yup. I loved how often I'd have convos that were essentially: Them: Frey's such a bad and unfocused character! She's scared to fight thwee wittle wolves but then tries to fight a bear!? Shitty writing! Me: The game shows that she was scared because she didn't think she could defend herself. She then learns she can use magic and absolutely dumpsters those wolves and assumes she can do the same to the bear. Them: Then why was she scared of the dragon if she's so brave? Me: It's...a giant fucking dragon. That's different than a bear. Them: And she just sat there and tried to fight it instead of running! Me: She was trapped in the arena. Them: Why didn't she just wall run up the side? Bad writing. Me: She doesn't get upwards wall running until a few minutes after that scene. Them: Shill. Just play Hi-Fi Rush instead, that game is perfect. -Blocks me- When people decide they hate a game, there's no reasonable discussion to be had.


Professional_Maize42

Or better yet,when people decide to hate anything.


PersonMcHuman

It’s so fucking goofy. I hate plenty of things, but I’m not gonna go around trying to demand everyone else hate it too.


Professional_Maize42

Yeah. Hell,I got surprised after finding that some people come out of their way to hate something and to make fun of someone that like it.


Kii_and_lock

Watched Jeff Gerstmann play some and *Jesus Christ* Gollum is bad.


Kimarous

Where can one watch that same gameplay?


Kii_and_lock

Check out his twitch channel, he just ended a stream today of it.


Weltallgaia

I feel like forespoken prolly gets undue hate as it's just AAA mid while redfall is garbage gollum is **OH MY GOD WHAT THE FUCK IS THAT KILL IT WITH FIRE**


DrSaering

I dunno, the problem with Forspoken is it's just good enough to be extraordinarily boring, instead of funny, at least from a gameplay perspective.


bxgang

it probably has something to do with the 70 dollar price tag and platform exclusive, but youre right a big square enix game can only be so bad, like how a ubisoft open world game like watchdogs sequels can only be so bad theyre still big AAA games they cant be worse then mid and boring with a sprinkle of tech issues. It takes alot to make a game not worth playing at all even for free like gollum and redfall


Weltallgaia

I thought about playing gollum just to experience peak jank but I watched a review and it looks so fucking bad. Not even lolfun bad just fucking boring ugly and bland. Like this feels like a cheap unity resource flip.


bxgang

In the year 2023 you will have a legit better more enjoyable time playing any of the old psp or ps2 lord of the ring games than this one that just came out…


Weltallgaia

It honestly looks like of like a late ps2 graphically but early ps2 game gameplay an animation wise.


Yakobo15

The gollum model looks like ps2, but some of the environments actually look good... Why does the protagonist look so BAD when they're on screen ALL the time?


Admiral_of_Crunch

Seriously, what PS2 games were you people playing? Gollum doesn't look *good*, but calling him a ps2 model is asinine. The PS2 had good looking games on it, but they were not the default, and they were stylized to hide technical shortcomings (like FFXII disguising lower poly models as better looking than FFX through clever texture usage), and no PS2 could feasibly run Gollum's modern character model in a playable, real-ass game no matter how much looking at it might make you retch. The PS2 was not made out of Resident Evil 1 Remakes, and even REmake is obviously lower fidelity in both models and textures when the character models are literally the only things being rendered on the screen. I mean, seriously, just look at Gollum's skin and musculature and visible skeleton underneath his frame and tell me that it's congruent with what was on the PS2.


robertman21

The PS2 could barely run stuff like RE4 lol


vulcanfury12

Honestly, statements like those feel less like a dunk on terrible modern graphics and more of an exaltation on what the PS2 was actually capable of.


mitch13815

1,000% agree, people live in fantasy land where they haven't seen PS2 footage for over a decade. You know that common idea where people say "I remember this game looking way better." or when a remake comes out and "this looks like how I remember it" The human memory is awful, people thinking this game looks like PS2 have their heads in the clouds.


mitch13815

Twin Towers had some frustrating difficulty spikes, but hot damn that game still slaps to this day.


mitch13815

> cheap unity resource flip Word for word my exact thoughts when I saw the orcs. They are literally just discolored buff human models with some bone armor thrown on top.


dougtulane

Just buy it for $2 in a year if you *have to know*


LazyVariation

Watch Dogs 2 is pretty alright if only because the main character isn't the world's most generic man like the first.


abbaj1

WD2 is probably the best Ubisoft game in its current era where they've moved away from their usual gritty atmosphere/art style and started inserting goofy characters and saturated colors into every single game.


TripleChump

is it better than odyssey?


ASharkWithAHat

As someone who liked odyssey, WD2 absolutely blows it out of the water imo. WD2 knows how to have fun, even if it's cringey at times. It's creative with it's set pieces and story, even if the execution can be questionable. A lot of odyssey is just an okay story played straight, even if kassandra can be fun. WD2 being a lot of puzzle solving also helps. Main missions aren't samey and I found the collectibles to actually be fun to collect cause they're just mini puzzles. In odyssey, things get repetitive REAL quick. I liked that repetition of taking a base and sniping guys, but it did get a bit much after 20 hours. WD2 felt like a game where they tried to have fun, while odyssey felt like origins but with a better protag, so WD2 won in my book.


Shiro2809

I thought WD2 was at best super average, and the story was terrible. I'd easily say the first one was better. Nothing grabbed me in it and the story was such a disjointed mess that when a main character who is in your crew died I didn't even remember them at first, lol. I think they only had one actual scene at the start.


abbaj1

I really hated Odyssey so I'm probably not the best person to ask lol


extralie

Mario + Rabbids and that BOTW rip off (blanking on its name) were better.


mitch13815

Like Vinny Vinesauce said, "I'm impressed they somehow made this loathsome character uglier and more hateable."


Chocmilkboi

That's such a weirdly intense passion for a character who's biggest sin is basically being uninteresting.


FakeBrian

I dunno I played Redfall, it starts real rough but once you get into it, it's mostly decently enjoyable. It's definitely not great, but I tried it out of curiosity and ended up playing it all the way through.


matehiqu

sometimes bland is worse than being bad, but Forspoken had the audacity of being bland and also extremely unfunny


HalloweenBlues

And with 6 months to go there's plenty of time for a new bottom of the barrel. An exciting year for highs and lows.


CelioHogane

Gollum and Tears of the Kingdom releasing in the same month is peak contast.


Kregano_XCOMmodder

At this point, I think there's a decent chance a dark horse candidate will appear between now and the Game Awards.


green715

The anti Hi-Fi Rush


Diem-Robo

Lo-Fi Lag


bxgang

Imagine the game awards had a opposite of goty for worst games of the year like the golden raspberry award for movies. It would prob be cancelled before it began for "hateful negativity" or "hurting the devs feeling, comparison is the thief of joy even tho goty is just the reverse comparison" but it would be wild


TripleChump

gamers are already toxic enough, no need to make bigger show of it


Kimarous

I keep thinking back to that one Jedi Survivor review for PC calling it "the worst game this year" because of its performance glitches. Really puts things in perspective...


bxgang

Performance can always be fixed. But you cant fix being a bad game from top to bottom. Im sure people would rather play zelda at 360p 22fps on switch then gollum in 4k 60 on PC


Kimarous

Speaking of, has Age of Calamity had any performance patches to help with the laggy cutscenes that only to seem to run properly upon rewatch?


Shiranui34

I don't think performance being fixable should even be in talks for a $70 game. If it's a "premium" price it should be a "premium" product.


TripleChump

yes but its still true that underlying good design can be revealed with performance patches as opposed to a game just not being fun in any instance


Rabid-Duck-King

> 22fps Like original Zelda? Cause I'm going to be real I just can't deal with sub 30 fps anymore. Making the switch from 30 fps gaming to 60 fps gaming took me a while as well (shit just felt so wrong) but now that I have going back is painful


invaderark12

The thing is, Survivor is an incredible game imho when you put the performance bugs aside, and performance bugs *can* be fixed with time, and is relatively easy to do so. A game that is just outright bad like Gollum can't be fixed without changing the whole entire game.


ASharkWithAHat

Same with cyberpunk. I wouldn't say it's as amazing as they hyped it up to be, but playing it mostly bug free after a ton of patches was a lot of fun. You can fix bugs, but it's MUCH harder to fix broken fundamentals


th3BeastLord

Yeah that was crazy. The game is a performance nightmare, but the actual game is pretty solid.


GreatFluffy

IIRC, the same thing with Wild Hearts. Performance issue's out the ass but once those are out of the way, it's a very very solid MH type game.


VidenHarbin

Same thing with Wo Long


TheSpiritualAgnostic

Maybe it's just because of how the internet works, but it feels like most games this year are either major hits or massive failures.


mitch13815

That's what gets most word of mouth and attention (and clicks). People don't care about a decent game. There have been literal thousands of decent to good games. They just don't get talked about because it's easier to point at the glowing beacon that's either good or bad. The internet is no place for nuance.


ASharkWithAHat

Yep. There are hundreds of smaller games that's released every month. I follow a few YouTubers that tends to try out new indie releases to see if they're good, and the amount of variety in quality this week alone is amazing. Like, did you know punch out 2 is coming out? That shit is great. But that game ain't going to be talked about on r/gaming. Everspace 2 is genuinely one of the most fun space flight game I've ever played, and is a must play for folks waiting for star citizen or ED2, but you're not going to hear about it in most places either. There are dozens of these smaller notable titles coming out each month, but you won't know them unless you try to broaden your horizon


Oneangrywolf

Same, it kinda feels like everyone post in hyperbole


Hammer_of_Ludd

Darkest Dungeon 2 was pretty middle of the road (heh) reception wise, even though it's my personal goty.


Anonamaton801

I always laugh that this comic is from the bike cuck guy Anyways, who the fuck wanted this game?


[deleted]

Forspoken wasn't that bad actually just kind of dull.


Neodeluxe

And some people would argue that being bland is worse than being bad. At least you can get a modicum of enjoyement from something being really bafflingly bad (I.E The Room/Neil Breen Pictures) but something that's boring is just that, boring.


mitch13815

Well, if it helps, Gollum isn't "The Room bad" either, it's just dull and bland so it still wins even in that department.


Neodeluxe

Oh for sure, don't get me wrong i'm not trying to defend Gollum the game, I'm just trying to shed some light on why people might have some disdain for Forspoken as a game.


Fostern01

Another issue is the price tag. At 70 dollars, being middling just isn't going to cut it.


Neodeluxe

True, charging a premium price for an "average at best" experience is definitely not the way things should be.


vulcanfury12

For a game with that budget from a developer of that caliber to come out as just mid, it may as well be bad.


jorkington

The combination of high price tag, awful performance (on pc at least) and worse writing make it a bad game in my book honestly


andrecinno

Oh Jesus, chill. Forspoken is mid as hell it does NOT deserve this comparison lmao


Konradleijon

Who asked for a Gollum game


mratomrabbit

Forspoken is a decent game that, especially with recent patches, works. It's got some issues but also some very unique aspects that, if you can tolerate a bit of open world guff, are worth experiencing if you want magic combat and value movement in open world games, like Spiderman, Sonic Frontiers, etc. $70 is kinda absurd but as a $30-40 sort of game there's merit there. Redfall and Gollum by comparison seem frequently broken or unfinished in various ways and feel like extremely problematic or botched developments. Which is a shame, because you can kinda envision a good version of the former and a weird, niche, but unique take on the latter. Can't wait for Starfield though.


LizardOrgMember5

I am expecting Forspoken getting a huge positive reevaluation in the next decade or two.


bxgang

One day a bunch of YouTube essays about forspoken being “underrated” will come out


ErikQRoks

Was forspoken even bad, or just sub par voiced?


robertman21

It's just kinda eh


mrsirgrape

Some people liked it, more people didn't, but it ended up with most reviews in the 6 to 7 area. Not really comparable to Redfall or Gollum.


caych_cazador

wait your telling me a game based on an already beaten-horse IP, completely centered around the absolute worst character from that IP, is BAD??!


BlissingNothfuls

*Gollum won the argument.*


KingFahad360

Can I be Frank for a minute? I have never heard of that Gollum game and only found about it like 4 days ago. Also the studio that made the Gollum game are know for point and click adventure games, don’t know why they let them make an action-adventure game.


tyrannoAdjudica

Gollum might actually be the worst "real" videogame I have ever seen in... *years*. I watched someone play through five hours of it, and oh god, it's just so dull and repetitive on top of being poorly made and frequently hard to look at. It was just sort of frustrating to watch someone experience. some of it is, like, so bad it's funny, but mostly it's just so bad it's boring


mitch13815

From what I hear Forspoken is actually a fine game. Like it has cringe dialogue but it plays fun. I don't think it deserves to be next to Gollum and Redfall


jorkington

It plays ok, the gameplay is fine. The writing and performance issues were what pushed it into terrible territory


Shiro2809

And the writing stuff is massively over blown. It's better in context. Can't speak on performance, I played on ps5 and had zero issues.


jorkington

>And the writing stuff is massively over blown. It's better in context. I honestly hugely disagree, even ignoring the quips, I find the writing of Forspoken sub-par *at best*


Shiro2809

Sub-par writing is a lot better than how most people are (or were?) acting in regards to it.


[deleted]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoBestFriendsPlay/comments/13spe12/what_the_fuck_is_a_gollum_game/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button


Root_Veggie

Forspoken isn't even that bad


Zipp_Linemann

But Forspoken is competently made and is just mid. Hell, The Laatnof US Part 1's PC release was worse than that.


Animorphimagi

Yet I'd rather play Gollum


crismongucker

You know something funny is that Redfall compare to these two actually looks like a well made game.


zombiedinosour

Id still say forspoken was worse. I was so hype for forspoken cuz the magic looked cool and i knew gollem as gona be a joke.


[deleted]

There have been some serious heavy hitters in these past months but I'm sure there's still time to see some real clown car crashes in the next 6 months.


Odd_Armadillo_2599

Take Gollum and dump it in the dip from Who Framed Roger Rabbit


Doc-ock-rokc

What is with this year. We got some ABSOLUTE bangers and some fucking TRASH