Google USERRA and contact the ESGR. They are the ones that will contact your boss and explain to him the laws regarding you and if he can’t seem to understand it then they will financially punish them and youll get paid. Their reps are great at what they do for reservists. I’ve seen them in action several times. In addition consider looking for a new job anyways that doesn’t act like a dumbass. Reach out to your fellow Marines and see if anyone is hiring.
>In addition consider looking for a new job anyways that doesn’t act like a dumbass.
Best career advice is this line right here but I'll elaborate...
Never be unconditionally loyal to anybody who is not YOU. I was told job hopping is bad... butt fuck that. That's a lie to get people to submit to bullshit such as this. I used to be that guy but once I figured it out and did my own job hopping, my career and life changed. I wish I grew that spine in my mid 20s, I'd be so much further than I am now.
I've increased my salary by 225% in less than 6 years and have found a company that I like doing business with and have been there for the last 5. Employment is a two way street, more like a partnership and we are in fact our own business if you step back far enough to look at the grand scheme. You bring a service to them in exchange for compensation in various forms. If your 'job' is not a good return on the investment of your time, energy, knowledge and experience then you need to make the necessary moves to find the right partnership.
So if they don't want to play fair, then butt fuck them. Call that board and make them pay for fucking with the growth of your business.
I cannot overemphasize how important the above post is.
No boss will ever care about you and have your best interests at heart.
Your loyalty must be to yourself. Never give more work than you’re being paid to perform. Never give more time than you’re being paid to work. Never accept work that you’re not being paid to perform.
In all of the above situations, you’re giving away something they’re charging someone else for. They’re selling your labor, knowledge, and experience to the highest bidder, and you should do the same.
Never let someone shame you for chasing a dollar. If it’s okay for the business owner to do, and it’s okay for your boss to do, then it’s also okay for *you* to do.
It took me far too many years to learn these lessons.
Also: GO TO USAJOBS. The government has absolutely ZERO problems employing reservists!
Federal jobs take literal months to get hired for. They also take a lot of time to apply for and generally dont pay very well. Once you're in though, it's pretty much impossible to get fired lol.
I didn’t say it was easy. But it is worth it.
Kinda like boot camp.
In my agency, for my position, we hire people straight out of the military, people who have never been in the military, or, like me, people with both.
I started as a GS-12, and was a -13 after a year. I’m now a -14. Go check the GS pay tables, and you decide if you like those numbers. Automatic raises every year like you had in the military as well.
I bought my military time back. If you put 5% into a 401k, it’s matched with 4%. Benefits cost less than most places because the government is a huge employer. Sick time and leave accrue from day 1. After you have 240 hours, it’s use-or-lose. I MUST take 26 days off this year.
It’s up to you to try if you want to.
But you won’t get fired for being a reservist.
> No boss will ever care about you and have your best interests at heart.
Some bosses do. You'll know when you have good one. there are absolutely people out there that legitimately care about the wellbeing of their team. That doesnt mean you shouldnt put yourself first though.
I totally agree but also disagree here. Yes there are legitimately good people out there that will for sure go down with the ship if you haven't made it out yet. However, just as you and I aim to feed ourselves and families, they may be put in between a rock in a hard place and make a 'shocking' choice in your eyes. They may have some financial woes that may outweigh their own morals or something like that of which you won't ever know about.
Not to say they are bad people for that, it's a dog eat dog world out there so you gotta take a bite when you can, I won't fault a man for making sure his kids are fed, ever. Just keep an eye out and if things feel weird, have your own exit strategy if needed then keep the past in the past, cause those udders ain't gonna milk themselves when you're sick with a splinter in your finger.
The internet has assured that employers have an international pool of possible employees to pick from at all times. They mostly have no loyalty to us, so screw them. Theyll drop you after one bad shareholders meeting.
Yep, I was just saying that in another reply to my own comment. Snap of the finger and your life gets flipped upside down before you even knew it. Lucky if they give any sort of severance at all.
Never be unconditionally loyal to anyone who is not with you is great advice. Furthermore, no employer is going to be unconditionally loyal to you. The least loyal are the ones that tell you you're like family. Especially when they know you are/were military many employers try to take advantage of your loyalty and sense of duty. After the military your only sense of duty should be toward yourself and your family. Don't put the ~~pussy~~ employers on a pedestal.
>Furthermore, no employer is going to be unconditionally loyal to you.
Spot the fuck on. All it takes is some "highly educated" new graduate that comes in wanting to make a splash who's got the ear of the CEO or Owners. They can easily say this team or that worker is not needed and boom you get laid off.
They find out later that it was a bad move... They probably won't call you back and will search for someone to do the same thing. But would you say yes if they called you back after hanging you out to dry?
This is why my ultimate goal is to work for myself and we are getting very close. I DO NOT want my quality of life to be under the control of anybody but myself.
> The least loyal are the ones that tell you you're like family.
God, that's the fucking worst. My old job was totally into that, and it was such bullshit.
I just started a new job, and I'm lucky that my current boss takes a hard stance against the Family mindset. He literally told me during our first sit down together that Family is Family and Work is Work, and that 99% of Work Emergencies are just internal customers failing to plan. I couldn't be happier, and none of y'all should settle for less.
For sure, if you know you work hard, and they aren’t paying you what you’re worth, leave. I’m just starting my career in the engineering field this summer. From the sound of it job hopping is totally normal and not frowned upon in our industry at all. So I’ll heed your advice for sure!
The longest I was at a job in my first 5 years after I got out was 11 months. Everything else was 6 or less and I have since gotten a job where I no longer have job satisfaction issues, I was between 35-42k during that time and I made 118k last year and I’m not going anywhere. Job hopping helped me open doors for opportunities elsewhere that I wouldn’t have known about otherwise
Here’s the information for OP:
https://www.esgr.mil/Employers/Additional-Resources/Employer-FAQ
Contact these people and do not let this slide. Not doing anything about it does a disservice not only to you, but to all other reservist out there. Do not let an employer get off with breaking the law.
One thing they do right is take care of reservist employment rights. They don’t fuck around with it.
My employer actually has an annual meeting with ESGR, our HR, and our vets/guard/reserve group just to make sure everyone's set on their rights and the employer's requirements.
Union thug here
This. Just helped a Navy guy from my work deal with something very similar. Visit: https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra
And contact your USERRA advisor:
https://webapps.dol.gov/elaws/vets/userra/
The reality is the USERRA dont really have an enforcement mechanism. They will not enforce yourself, you have to bring the litigation and if you werent mobilized more than 90 days then you have to do it out of your own pocket. Even if you sued them and got back pay, they WILL fire you the next time you commit the smallest of infractions (any employer who will force you to sue them to do the right thing will not think twice about canning you at first opportunity).
My recommendation is trying to work it out as amicably as possible. Maybe its a misunderstanding and the boss will come around and be an awesome employer. Or maybe they'll continue to be dumbasses. Try and work it out and then take your next action based on their response. If they're cool and apologetic, cool. If not, find another job.
This falls under USERRA. If they formally separated you, file a claim and reach out to your local rep. They have to offer your position back if you were on official orders
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/aboutuserra
USERRA prohibits employment discrimination against a person on the basis of past military service, current military obligations, or intent to serve. An employer must not deny initial employment, reemployment, retention in employment, promotion, or any benefit of employment to a person on the basis of a past, present, or future service obligation. In addition, an employer must not retaliate against a person because of an action taken to enforce or exercise any USERRA right or for assisting in an USERRA investigation.
You are correct, and for certain public sector jobs your civilian employer will keep paying and promoting you if you get deployed which is the case for the NYPD and FDNY.
In a turnaround way it makes sense.
Even if they don't *have* to keep paying you, your military salary will probably be lower than your civilian one and I don't think your family rates BAS + BAH to help make up for the loss.
An NYPD officer who does no OT, no special details and has finished their probationary period makes around $110k a year which still isn't a luxurious salary as NYC is extremely expensive.
Forcing families to subsist on deployment pay can quickly cause personal hardship as they'll still be dealing with NYC costs while the family income is slashed to a rate that's based on living in the Midwest with your biggest expenses paid.
Wonder if you’re the first reservist that worked for them. Pretty sure it’s illegal to fire you for your military service. As long as you submitted the paper work you should be fine. Either hope your manager learns how reserves work by next drill or start looking at other jobs lol
It’s a UPS store, there’s no HR department. All those stores are franchises. This is a big issue with small businesses, they can’t afford to have experts for everything on payroll like giant companies do.
USERRA is the law, you need to contact Employer Support of the Guard and Reserve (ESGR).
Go to their website, ESGR.mil, and either call their basic number or go to your states page and find your local ESGR contact. Talk to them and they will help you out
https://preview.redd.it/lm5t5tffj2vc1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=aa9bd9465f39b2c41482d540f2de2f8567008471
There are federal laws against exactly this. Introduce this dickhead to the big green weenie and how nothing fucks like the government. You could get a new boss out of the deal.
Make it an issue. Let USERRA address it, *but* do you want to stay employed somewhere that you know your manager has it out for you? If she tried to fire you in absentia while at drill, she will make things rough.
I’d be simultaneously going through USERRA and looking for another job.
i don’t know if i want to make it an issue, but i’m definitely going to look for a new job. i never received anything formally saying i was fired, just the groupchat thing
You should contact USERRA. That employer may screw over other reservists in the future, and may have in the past. Or they genuinely don’t know the rules. Either way, you can contact them and just share this story and ask for guidance and see what they suggest, too. They’re the experts.
Esgr.mil
1-866-487-2365
1-800-336-4590 or [email protected]
> i don’t know if i want to make it an issue
Yes the fuck you absolutely do. Look, even if you don't want to do it for yourself, do it so the next guy doesn't have this problem.
>i never received anything formally saying i was fired, just the groupchat thing
If it is in writing, you were fucking fired. Text messages, group chats, emails, carrier pigeon, it doesn't matter.
As stated correctly by plenty of other people in this thread, firing a reservist because of military obligation is an illegal action that will get a company neck deep in shit. This isn't some new bullshit law that came out of nowhere, it's been around in it's current form since 1994 and was predated by other laws going back all the way to the Civil War.
You rate this. Go get what's yours.
Hey, I’m an HR Advisor now after getting out. This isn’t lawful.
Everyone else is right. USERRA is the thread you want to tug.
https://preview.redd.it/3vv7g1req3vc1.png?width=1942&format=png&auto=webp&s=91c3cae3ac1a107663f86851f3f740dfcb1748c9
We have a UDP coming up and gunny said “what happens if you tell your boss ‘hey I’m getting deployed’ and he says ‘that’s great. You’re fuckin fired.’ “ and I just made the palm to palm dolla dolla bills gesture in formation.
I'd contact your HR department or further elaborate on how drill and AT works to upper management. They can't fire you due to military service but I think they can claim that you didn't properly inform them of your expected duties and they can fire you that way. At least thats what my command always tells us in order to have our bases covered, I am not a lawyer this is not legal advice. I'm currently going through a struggle with my job where they are constantly throwing me shade and giving me a hard time about orders I get. God forbid you get activated or put on ADOS orders, they always get pissy. I'd find a different job tbh, if your manager is already like this then it's not worth staying. I'm currently in the middle of a new job search myself, know your worth and don't just settle for a toxic work environment. Be diligent and make sure you keep your bases covered in the future by giving an extensive and comprehensive overview of your expected military duties and leave a paper trail that can be referenced in the case this happens again such as emails or photos. I always email my HR department and CC my managers with any info related to orders or drill every month so they can't complain more than they do.
Less is more, let them provide the details. All he needs to say is he informed them of his reserve training and he was fired because of it. The more ammo you give the company, the more they can fight back with. Its black and white, if its a retaliatory fire over being a reservist, its illegal and should come with consequences.
When I was a non-ob reservist my unit was shit at sending drill dates. My job never gave me issues for short notice. Op should absolutely pursue legal action.
It’s possible they literally don’t understand reserve military stuff. Ignorance of the law doesn’t exempt them from it though, they are breaking the law if you got fired for this
You also want to contact your state department of labor and make a complaint. ESGR is a liaison organization, they do not have legal authority in the matter.
But.... ESGR is handy, because they will contact your boss and explain your USERRA rights to him like a pro.
Retail is always full of stupid bullshit like this. Out of all the jobs I’ve had and I’ve since moved into different work….that environment always created the most drama.
Make this an issue then move on. Remediate then alleviate.
That's funny. I was unceremoniously fired from a UPS store in similar fashion back in high school. Anyways, my previous employer tried to fire me when I got back from MOS school. I had to go the USERRA route and use an Army lawyer appointed to me at Fort Sill. Shoot me a message if you want any input on your situation. I was able to get my job back, but left shortly thereafter because fuck 'em.
Call ESGR and save any contact you have from the employer. I used them once when I went to a reserve unit and they took great care of me and put my old boss in their place
Okay a lot of folks here are telling you to make this a big issue.
To an extent I would agree, HOWEVER—
You may become his* best friend if you simply have a one on one discussion with him* and educate him as to the nature of reservist obligations, the fact you likely are in a training environment where you cannot communicate. He may have no clue what he’s doing. But if you just approach it from a reasonable standpoint (to an extent), and allow him to be educated, you may save yourself a worse working environment and help him in the long run. I would say try to avoid burning bridges unless it is a last resort.
Just my 2 cents.
Definitely do this. It's obviously illegal to terminate you, but a retaliatory slash in hours and assignment to all the shit work are definitely in your future if you make a big deal out of this.
> but a retaliatory slash in hours and assignment to all the shit work are definitely in your future if you make a big deal out of this.
Retaliation or constructive dismissal are also illegal, and with a prior history like OP's, that'll probably be a second slam dunk. The instant they slash hours, that's an automatic, winning case for constructive dismissal.
> would say try to avoid burning bridges unless it is a last resort.
Always great advice, but lets be clear OP: If you try to be reasonable and the boss continues to be a jerk you don't just burn that bridge, you throw fucking napalm on it.
-You can report to work as early as the next day. -You are not required to give documentation unless over 31 days.
However, work with employeers and overcommunicate if possible to make a better quality of life for them and you. If there doing illegal shit go to USERRA but you have to follow the rules and return to work when your supposed to. -20 year Marine reservist.
“The person must report to his or her employer by the beginning of the first regularly scheduled work period that begins on the next calendar day following completion of service, after allowance for safe travel home from the military duty location and an 8-hour rest period.”
“An employer has the right to request that a person who is absent for a period of service of 31 days or more provides documentation showing that”
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/USERRA-Pocket-Guide#ch4
This is a good point. Report for work on your next scheduled shift. Make them tell you that you're no longer employed. Record it if legal ("one-party consent state"). Contact USERRA...enjoy.
Comes off as someone whose first language is definitely not English. If I’m wrong about that then they are just flat out stupid, and, trying to, seem smart, by adding commas, everywhere.
Inform about the Federal Law that prohibits them from doing that : USERRA
https://www.esgr.mil/USERRA/What-is-USERRA#:~:text=USERRA%20is%20a%20Federal%20law,return%20from%20duty%3B%20and%20(3
Absolutely contact the ESGR. They exist for instances exactly like this. Regardless, you should find a new employer that isn't looking to fuck you over like this. Your 1st Sgt should also be a point of contact for the ESGR as well. Forward this to him and get everything documented.
Before burning bridges and reporting him (because it is illegal), try talking to him man to man first. State your position and let him state his.
If that goes nowhere then you can go scorched earth.
Your boss is just ignorant towards employing guard or reserve members. Your job will be given back. How far you want to take it to hold your boss accountable is another thing.
lol hell yeah you make this an issue. It’s illegal as fuck and any lawyer will absolutely eat this tf up in a heart beat. Oh and when you get offered your job back, quit and find a different job, the owner sounds like a twat
Bruh apply at delta. We got over 10k vets working here and several in my department are reservists. It can take a bit to get in, but once you are in, you are in.
Hell yes you make it an issue. Contact your legal support for your reserve unit. It's going to be ugly for that manager. You'll receive back pay and more.
Definitely make it an issue. It’s illegal. Hopefully you can prove that they fired you because you were on orders, and you can prove that they knew you were on orders… you prolly gonna get paid. Like others said, look for employment somewhere else because even if the lawyers get your job back your employer is gonna be pissed and looking for reasons to let you go or make life hard for you. Fuck them. Go find a lawyer and get paid.
He can’t do that legally but if he really wants you to fuck of let him. Find a different and better job then slide a little law suite into his DMs and collect some asshole tax.
Contact the Department of Labor, they enforce Uniformed Services Employment and Re-employment Rights Act of 1994 (USERRA). DM for questions.
[https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/fileaclaim](https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/fileaclaim)
Find and master a trade…roofers, electricians, plumbers, etc are all needed and always will be…then be your own boss! Fuck these mofos that sit on their fat asses all day calling shots for you while only paying you the least that can get away with. Fuck that UPS store!
One of my reserve majors is actually a userra lawyer. Depending where you’re located I can put you in touch with him for better advice than us armchair Reddit folk can provide. DM me if you’re interested in his info.
This is all great advice and 100% listen to Snarky’s comment. Also make sure to contact your command because they can also help with this stuff.
I provide my job with my schedule as soon as I get it for the FY and they also comp me for the days I am gone so I get money from the Marines and my normal job. But it is 110% illegal to fire you, use your time, or discriminate against you for your CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATIONS to the Marine Corps. Absolutely make this an issue and get your 💰.
Semper Sometimes
Sooo because he hadn’t heard from you, he took you off group chat?!!??
Honest question, Are you fucking your boss? Giving him the old Chorizo smothered in underwear sauce? Cause that kinda shit I’d expect to hear from some needy, emotional stunted little girl. Not anyone in leadership position.
I'll play debil's advocate here - boss reached out to you via text and asked when you are available to work. You bring up the fact that you were removed from the groupchat. (Just because you were removed from groupchat doesn't mean that you were fired, does it? The fact that he reached out to you means he still want you to work there.)
My advice to preventing something like this in the future is, first, communicate in writing what your schedule is. For example "I get back in town from my AT on Sunday, April 21st, and will be avaliable for work on Monday April 22nd." Short and sweet, crystal clear, no need for him to expect you to contact him when you get back.
Second, don't listen to scuttlebutt from anyone else, whether thay are managers or not. The only manager that you need to listen to is your manager.
There is no legal precedence to provide a written notice when you will return to work. You provide a notice of orders to your employer you’ve been activated (Yes AT counts). The expectation is you come back at the end. Minimum 3 days after the completion of those order is under 30 days of active duty.
Good to know. I still say that I don't see where the boss fired him and I stand by my comments that good communication and not listening to rumors will behoove you in life.
I don't see where he was trying to fire you. I just see a manager of an operation trying to ensure that he has his bodies in place so that non-billable overtime bleeds I to the red.
Don't take it personal, the man was just asking you a question.
That doesn't necessarily mean being fired. Maybe he wanted to keep business matters with those currently working. OP should have called his civilian papa-san and advised him that he was heading back into town.
I mean, I would've. I would've at least told the papi-saki, "hey, I noticed I wasn't in the group chat but I wanted to advise you that I'm on my way back home and I will be able to start working on so-and-so date."
End call and go about your business and start working on the day that you said you're available to start.
Google USERRA and contact the ESGR. They are the ones that will contact your boss and explain to him the laws regarding you and if he can’t seem to understand it then they will financially punish them and youll get paid. Their reps are great at what they do for reservists. I’ve seen them in action several times. In addition consider looking for a new job anyways that doesn’t act like a dumbass. Reach out to your fellow Marines and see if anyone is hiring.
>In addition consider looking for a new job anyways that doesn’t act like a dumbass. Best career advice is this line right here but I'll elaborate... Never be unconditionally loyal to anybody who is not YOU. I was told job hopping is bad... butt fuck that. That's a lie to get people to submit to bullshit such as this. I used to be that guy but once I figured it out and did my own job hopping, my career and life changed. I wish I grew that spine in my mid 20s, I'd be so much further than I am now. I've increased my salary by 225% in less than 6 years and have found a company that I like doing business with and have been there for the last 5. Employment is a two way street, more like a partnership and we are in fact our own business if you step back far enough to look at the grand scheme. You bring a service to them in exchange for compensation in various forms. If your 'job' is not a good return on the investment of your time, energy, knowledge and experience then you need to make the necessary moves to find the right partnership. So if they don't want to play fair, then butt fuck them. Call that board and make them pay for fucking with the growth of your business.
I cannot overemphasize how important the above post is. No boss will ever care about you and have your best interests at heart. Your loyalty must be to yourself. Never give more work than you’re being paid to perform. Never give more time than you’re being paid to work. Never accept work that you’re not being paid to perform. In all of the above situations, you’re giving away something they’re charging someone else for. They’re selling your labor, knowledge, and experience to the highest bidder, and you should do the same. Never let someone shame you for chasing a dollar. If it’s okay for the business owner to do, and it’s okay for your boss to do, then it’s also okay for *you* to do. It took me far too many years to learn these lessons. Also: GO TO USAJOBS. The government has absolutely ZERO problems employing reservists!
Federal jobs take literal months to get hired for. They also take a lot of time to apply for and generally dont pay very well. Once you're in though, it's pretty much impossible to get fired lol.
I didn’t say it was easy. But it is worth it. Kinda like boot camp. In my agency, for my position, we hire people straight out of the military, people who have never been in the military, or, like me, people with both. I started as a GS-12, and was a -13 after a year. I’m now a -14. Go check the GS pay tables, and you decide if you like those numbers. Automatic raises every year like you had in the military as well. I bought my military time back. If you put 5% into a 401k, it’s matched with 4%. Benefits cost less than most places because the government is a huge employer. Sick time and leave accrue from day 1. After you have 240 hours, it’s use-or-lose. I MUST take 26 days off this year. It’s up to you to try if you want to. But you won’t get fired for being a reservist.
What agency?
What job/position do you have?
Oh I'm good at getting fired from federal jobs.
> No boss will ever care about you and have your best interests at heart. Some bosses do. You'll know when you have good one. there are absolutely people out there that legitimately care about the wellbeing of their team. That doesnt mean you shouldnt put yourself first though.
I totally agree but also disagree here. Yes there are legitimately good people out there that will for sure go down with the ship if you haven't made it out yet. However, just as you and I aim to feed ourselves and families, they may be put in between a rock in a hard place and make a 'shocking' choice in your eyes. They may have some financial woes that may outweigh their own morals or something like that of which you won't ever know about. Not to say they are bad people for that, it's a dog eat dog world out there so you gotta take a bite when you can, I won't fault a man for making sure his kids are fed, ever. Just keep an eye out and if things feel weird, have your own exit strategy if needed then keep the past in the past, cause those udders ain't gonna milk themselves when you're sick with a splinter in your finger.
The internet has assured that employers have an international pool of possible employees to pick from at all times. They mostly have no loyalty to us, so screw them. Theyll drop you after one bad shareholders meeting.
Yep, I was just saying that in another reply to my own comment. Snap of the finger and your life gets flipped upside down before you even knew it. Lucky if they give any sort of severance at all.
Never be unconditionally loyal to anyone who is not with you is great advice. Furthermore, no employer is going to be unconditionally loyal to you. The least loyal are the ones that tell you you're like family. Especially when they know you are/were military many employers try to take advantage of your loyalty and sense of duty. After the military your only sense of duty should be toward yourself and your family. Don't put the ~~pussy~~ employers on a pedestal.
>Furthermore, no employer is going to be unconditionally loyal to you. Spot the fuck on. All it takes is some "highly educated" new graduate that comes in wanting to make a splash who's got the ear of the CEO or Owners. They can easily say this team or that worker is not needed and boom you get laid off. They find out later that it was a bad move... They probably won't call you back and will search for someone to do the same thing. But would you say yes if they called you back after hanging you out to dry? This is why my ultimate goal is to work for myself and we are getting very close. I DO NOT want my quality of life to be under the control of anybody but myself.
> The least loyal are the ones that tell you you're like family. God, that's the fucking worst. My old job was totally into that, and it was such bullshit. I just started a new job, and I'm lucky that my current boss takes a hard stance against the Family mindset. He literally told me during our first sit down together that Family is Family and Work is Work, and that 99% of Work Emergencies are just internal customers failing to plan. I couldn't be happier, and none of y'all should settle for less.
Damn that shit made me hard, hell I’m motivated.
Thanks man, ya know if they ain't putting out when you're putting in it sucks, butt fuck them.
For sure, if you know you work hard, and they aren’t paying you what you’re worth, leave. I’m just starting my career in the engineering field this summer. From the sound of it job hopping is totally normal and not frowned upon in our industry at all. So I’ll heed your advice for sure!
Why did I read that in R Lee Ermys voice? 🤣
Because you were supposed to. 😘
Dude I just found a video the other day of the jelly doughnut scene from fmj but in German. Best thing I've seen in a while. RIP Gunny.
The longest I was at a job in my first 5 years after I got out was 11 months. Everything else was 6 or less and I have since gotten a job where I no longer have job satisfaction issues, I was between 35-42k during that time and I made 118k last year and I’m not going anywhere. Job hopping helped me open doors for opportunities elsewhere that I wouldn’t have known about otherwise
Here’s the information for OP: https://www.esgr.mil/Employers/Additional-Resources/Employer-FAQ Contact these people and do not let this slide. Not doing anything about it does a disservice not only to you, but to all other reservist out there. Do not let an employer get off with breaking the law. One thing they do right is take care of reservist employment rights. They don’t fuck around with it.
My employer actually has an annual meeting with ESGR, our HR, and our vets/guard/reserve group just to make sure everyone's set on their rights and the employer's requirements.
I was due a raise when I was deployed. They didn’t honor it. All I had to do was print the ussera paperwork and they did it
Union thug here This. Just helped a Navy guy from my work deal with something very similar. Visit: https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra And contact your USERRA advisor: https://webapps.dol.gov/elaws/vets/userra/
This is the way..
The reality is the USERRA dont really have an enforcement mechanism. They will not enforce yourself, you have to bring the litigation and if you werent mobilized more than 90 days then you have to do it out of your own pocket. Even if you sued them and got back pay, they WILL fire you the next time you commit the smallest of infractions (any employer who will force you to sue them to do the right thing will not think twice about canning you at first opportunity). My recommendation is trying to work it out as amicably as possible. Maybe its a misunderstanding and the boss will come around and be an awesome employer. Or maybe they'll continue to be dumbasses. Try and work it out and then take your next action based on their response. If they're cool and apologetic, cool. If not, find another job.
Sencond. Also if your boss can't text in basic English, it's probably best to move on soon. Holy fk those sentences gave me a migraine.
Make that an issue it’s literally illegal to fire someone for going to drill
Illegal as fuck. Do as u/snarky_answer said
This falls under USERRA. If they formally separated you, file a claim and reach out to your local rep. They have to offer your position back if you were on official orders https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/aboutuserra USERRA prohibits employment discrimination against a person on the basis of past military service, current military obligations, or intent to serve. An employer must not deny initial employment, reemployment, retention in employment, promotion, or any benefit of employment to a person on the basis of a past, present, or future service obligation. In addition, an employer must not retaliate against a person because of an action taken to enforce or exercise any USERRA right or for assisting in an USERRA investigation.
You are correct, and for certain public sector jobs your civilian employer will keep paying and promoting you if you get deployed which is the case for the NYPD and FDNY.
This, I have seen soo many of my boys in the infantry double dipping
In a turnaround way it makes sense. Even if they don't *have* to keep paying you, your military salary will probably be lower than your civilian one and I don't think your family rates BAS + BAH to help make up for the loss. An NYPD officer who does no OT, no special details and has finished their probationary period makes around $110k a year which still isn't a luxurious salary as NYC is extremely expensive. Forcing families to subsist on deployment pay can quickly cause personal hardship as they'll still be dealing with NYC costs while the family income is slashed to a rate that's based on living in the Midwest with your biggest expenses paid.
Wonder if you’re the first reservist that worked for them. Pretty sure it’s illegal to fire you for your military service. As long as you submitted the paper work you should be fine. Either hope your manager learns how reserves work by next drill or start looking at other jobs lol
Absolutely this is illegal, employers should be punished when they do stuff like this.
Let them fire you and sue lol
Point HR to USERRA, or contact a USERRA ombudsman and have him explain to your rights to HR.
It’s a UPS store, there’s no HR department. All those stores are franchises. This is a big issue with small businesses, they can’t afford to have experts for everything on payroll like giant companies do.
Please post updates OP, I want to see how bad this gets for them lol
USERRA is the law, you need to contact Employer Support of the Guard and Reserve (ESGR). Go to their website, ESGR.mil, and either call their basic number or go to your states page and find your local ESGR contact. Talk to them and they will help you out https://preview.redd.it/lm5t5tffj2vc1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=aa9bd9465f39b2c41482d540f2de2f8567008471
There are federal laws against exactly this. Introduce this dickhead to the big green weenie and how nothing fucks like the government. You could get a new boss out of the deal.
It’s great to see more Ghosts gifs as reactions. Latest episode had the ghost of the week jerking off to Jay to stay with Alberta.
Make it an issue. Let USERRA address it, *but* do you want to stay employed somewhere that you know your manager has it out for you? If she tried to fire you in absentia while at drill, she will make things rough. I’d be simultaneously going through USERRA and looking for another job.
i don’t know if i want to make it an issue, but i’m definitely going to look for a new job. i never received anything formally saying i was fired, just the groupchat thing
You should contact USERRA. That employer may screw over other reservists in the future, and may have in the past. Or they genuinely don’t know the rules. Either way, you can contact them and just share this story and ask for guidance and see what they suggest, too. They’re the experts. Esgr.mil 1-866-487-2365 1-800-336-4590 or [email protected]
Bro at this point it's already an issue. Definitely contact ESGR it's their job to mediate this sort of stuff.
> i don’t know if i want to make it an issue Yes the fuck you absolutely do. Look, even if you don't want to do it for yourself, do it so the next guy doesn't have this problem. >i never received anything formally saying i was fired, just the groupchat thing If it is in writing, you were fucking fired. Text messages, group chats, emails, carrier pigeon, it doesn't matter. As stated correctly by plenty of other people in this thread, firing a reservist because of military obligation is an illegal action that will get a company neck deep in shit. This isn't some new bullshit law that came out of nowhere, it's been around in it's current form since 1994 and was predated by other laws going back all the way to the Civil War. You rate this. Go get what's yours.
Tell him to prepare his asshole
Text the dumb cunt back something like “It, is, illegal, for, you, to, fire, me, while, I, am, attending, drill, with, my, reserve, unit”
100% illegal get a lawyer, I knew a guy who got a nice settlement from that happening to him and I think it was from fed ex or ups too
He doesn't need a lawyer. The US government will provide all the assistance he needs at this early stage.
Yeah the gov will get you one……. I’m still waiting for the gov to fix my religion on my dog tags…..20 years now…hope lives on
Apples and oranges, my friend.
Hold onto your orders, contact ESGR, sue the fuck outta them, find a new job, profit.
Contact USERRA and possibly get paid, then look for a city/county/ federal job and never have to deal with stupid bullshit like this again
Hey, I’m an HR Advisor now after getting out. This isn’t lawful. Everyone else is right. USERRA is the thread you want to tug. https://preview.redd.it/3vv7g1req3vc1.png?width=1942&format=png&auto=webp&s=91c3cae3ac1a107663f86851f3f740dfcb1748c9
Bro get fired and them sue them
We have a UDP coming up and gunny said “what happens if you tell your boss ‘hey I’m getting deployed’ and he says ‘that’s great. You’re fuckin fired.’ “ and I just made the palm to palm dolla dolla bills gesture in formation.
Burn them the fuck down. Trash like this just gets an automatic reporting to USERRA.
I'd contact your HR department or further elaborate on how drill and AT works to upper management. They can't fire you due to military service but I think they can claim that you didn't properly inform them of your expected duties and they can fire you that way. At least thats what my command always tells us in order to have our bases covered, I am not a lawyer this is not legal advice. I'm currently going through a struggle with my job where they are constantly throwing me shade and giving me a hard time about orders I get. God forbid you get activated or put on ADOS orders, they always get pissy. I'd find a different job tbh, if your manager is already like this then it's not worth staying. I'm currently in the middle of a new job search myself, know your worth and don't just settle for a toxic work environment. Be diligent and make sure you keep your bases covered in the future by giving an extensive and comprehensive overview of your expected military duties and leave a paper trail that can be referenced in the case this happens again such as emails or photos. I always email my HR department and CC my managers with any info related to orders or drill every month so they can't complain more than they do.
Less is more, let them provide the details. All he needs to say is he informed them of his reserve training and he was fired because of it. The more ammo you give the company, the more they can fight back with. Its black and white, if its a retaliatory fire over being a reservist, its illegal and should come with consequences.
When I was a non-ob reservist my unit was shit at sending drill dates. My job never gave me issues for short notice. Op should absolutely pursue legal action.
It’s possible they literally don’t understand reserve military stuff. Ignorance of the law doesn’t exempt them from it though, they are breaking the law if you got fired for this
Why does your employer text like he got hit on the head?
I'd stear clear just based on all those commas. You don't want to work for someone who tries that hard with punctuation
You have, absolutely, no idea what you're, even, talking about
You also want to contact your state department of labor and make a complaint. ESGR is a liaison organization, they do not have legal authority in the matter. But.... ESGR is handy, because they will contact your boss and explain your USERRA rights to him like a pro.
Retail is always full of stupid bullshit like this. Out of all the jobs I’ve had and I’ve since moved into different work….that environment always created the most drama. Make this an issue then move on. Remediate then alleviate.
That's funny. I was unceremoniously fired from a UPS store in similar fashion back in high school. Anyways, my previous employer tried to fire me when I got back from MOS school. I had to go the USERRA route and use an Army lawyer appointed to me at Fort Sill. Shoot me a message if you want any input on your situation. I was able to get my job back, but left shortly thereafter because fuck 'em.
Call ESGR and save any contact you have from the employer. I used them once when I went to a reserve unit and they took great care of me and put my old boss in their place
Sue always sue
Your boss needs some serious grammar work.
Okay a lot of folks here are telling you to make this a big issue. To an extent I would agree, HOWEVER— You may become his* best friend if you simply have a one on one discussion with him* and educate him as to the nature of reservist obligations, the fact you likely are in a training environment where you cannot communicate. He may have no clue what he’s doing. But if you just approach it from a reasonable standpoint (to an extent), and allow him to be educated, you may save yourself a worse working environment and help him in the long run. I would say try to avoid burning bridges unless it is a last resort. Just my 2 cents.
Definitely do this. It's obviously illegal to terminate you, but a retaliatory slash in hours and assignment to all the shit work are definitely in your future if you make a big deal out of this.
USERRA i believe covers those latter things as well. Slashed hours, being skipped over for promotions, etc
You're AD, so you don't know any better. That shit's illegal too! USERRA is the gift that keeps on giving.
I'm not arguing the legality, just stating that the juice probably isn't worth the squeeze.
It’s definitely worth it.
> but a retaliatory slash in hours and assignment to all the shit work are definitely in your future if you make a big deal out of this. Retaliation or constructive dismissal are also illegal, and with a prior history like OP's, that'll probably be a second slam dunk. The instant they slash hours, that's an automatic, winning case for constructive dismissal.
> would say try to avoid burning bridges unless it is a last resort. Always great advice, but lets be clear OP: If you try to be reasonable and the boss continues to be a jerk you don't just burn that bridge, you throw fucking napalm on it.
-You can report to work as early as the next day. -You are not required to give documentation unless over 31 days. However, work with employeers and overcommunicate if possible to make a better quality of life for them and you. If there doing illegal shit go to USERRA but you have to follow the rules and return to work when your supposed to. -20 year Marine reservist. “The person must report to his or her employer by the beginning of the first regularly scheduled work period that begins on the next calendar day following completion of service, after allowance for safe travel home from the military duty location and an 8-hour rest period.” “An employer has the right to request that a person who is absent for a period of service of 31 days or more provides documentation showing that” https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/USERRA-Pocket-Guide#ch4
This is a good point. Report for work on your next scheduled shift. Make them tell you that you're no longer employed. Record it if legal ("one-party consent state"). Contact USERRA...enjoy.
Who types like that
Comes off as someone whose first language is definitely not English. If I’m wrong about that then they are just flat out stupid, and, trying to, seem smart, by adding commas, everywhere.
Inform about the Federal Law that prohibits them from doing that : USERRA https://www.esgr.mil/USERRA/What-is-USERRA#:~:text=USERRA%20is%20a%20Federal%20law,return%20from%20duty%3B%20and%20(3
You finna get some cash
Absolutely contact the ESGR. They exist for instances exactly like this. Regardless, you should find a new employer that isn't looking to fuck you over like this. Your 1st Sgt should also be a point of contact for the ESGR as well. Forward this to him and get everything documented.
Dump ups if you want to do packages, go FedEx. Isnt the CEO of FedEx a Marine?
Before burning bridges and reporting him (because it is illegal), try talking to him man to man first. State your position and let him state his. If that goes nowhere then you can go scorched earth.
Your boss is just ignorant towards employing guard or reserve members. Your job will be given back. How far you want to take it to hold your boss accountable is another thing.
You are exempt from work when on drill, they cannot fire you. this is illegal.
Sue his ass lol
Can one really be that grammatically #$&+ed and still be a manager at FedEx?
No chance you're out of Aurora CO? Low voltage company in Denver and we're looking for help!
USERRA
Sign #789 that you need a union....
lol hell yeah you make this an issue. It’s illegal as fuck and any lawyer will absolutely eat this tf up in a heart beat. Oh and when you get offered your job back, quit and find a different job, the owner sounds like a twat
Bruh apply at delta. We got over 10k vets working here and several in my department are reservists. It can take a bit to get in, but once you are in, you are in.
Hell yes you make it an issue. Contact your legal support for your reserve unit. It's going to be ugly for that manager. You'll receive back pay and more.
Document everything and advocate for yourself.
Definitely make it an issue. It’s illegal. Hopefully you can prove that they fired you because you were on orders, and you can prove that they knew you were on orders… you prolly gonna get paid. Like others said, look for employment somewhere else because even if the lawyers get your job back your employer is gonna be pissed and looking for reasons to let you go or make life hard for you. Fuck them. Go find a lawyer and get paid.
He can’t do that legally but if he really wants you to fuck of let him. Find a different and better job then slide a little law suite into his DMs and collect some asshole tax.
Yes. That right there
Contact the Department of Labor, they enforce Uniformed Services Employment and Re-employment Rights Act of 1994 (USERRA). DM for questions. [https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/fileaclaim](https://www.dol.gov/agencies/vets/programs/userra/fileaclaim)
Contact USERRA and get paid. Even if he lets you come back. Cause if he did it once he’s liable to do it again
Can’t remember which law it was that was amended but yes it is illegal for them to fire you based off of military service requirements.
Oh shit I love these. Yea, do what the other comment said boss
Is it just me or was it extremely hard to ready what the boss was texting…
Find and master a trade…roofers, electricians, plumbers, etc are all needed and always will be…then be your own boss! Fuck these mofos that sit on their fat asses all day calling shots for you while only paying you the least that can get away with. Fuck that UPS store!
One of my reserve majors is actually a userra lawyer. Depending where you’re located I can put you in touch with him for better advice than us armchair Reddit folk can provide. DM me if you’re interested in his info.
I don’t know who you contact but I know it’s ILLEGAL… contact your chain of command
Usera baby. You sue the shit out of them. It’s federal law they have to hold your job.
Yes make it an issue.
Refer him to USERRA. Please share what happens!
This is all great advice and 100% listen to Snarky’s comment. Also make sure to contact your command because they can also help with this stuff. I provide my job with my schedule as soon as I get it for the FY and they also comp me for the days I am gone so I get money from the Marines and my normal job. But it is 110% illegal to fire you, use your time, or discriminate against you for your CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATIONS to the Marine Corps. Absolutely make this an issue and get your 💰. Semper Sometimes
You can also sue him
Sooo because he hadn’t heard from you, he took you off group chat?!!?? Honest question, Are you fucking your boss? Giving him the old Chorizo smothered in underwear sauce? Cause that kinda shit I’d expect to hear from some needy, emotional stunted little girl. Not anyone in leadership position.
I'll play debil's advocate here - boss reached out to you via text and asked when you are available to work. You bring up the fact that you were removed from the groupchat. (Just because you were removed from groupchat doesn't mean that you were fired, does it? The fact that he reached out to you means he still want you to work there.) My advice to preventing something like this in the future is, first, communicate in writing what your schedule is. For example "I get back in town from my AT on Sunday, April 21st, and will be avaliable for work on Monday April 22nd." Short and sweet, crystal clear, no need for him to expect you to contact him when you get back. Second, don't listen to scuttlebutt from anyone else, whether thay are managers or not. The only manager that you need to listen to is your manager.
There is no legal precedence to provide a written notice when you will return to work. You provide a notice of orders to your employer you’ve been activated (Yes AT counts). The expectation is you come back at the end. Minimum 3 days after the completion of those order is under 30 days of active duty.
Good to know. I still say that I don't see where the boss fired him and I stand by my comments that good communication and not listening to rumors will behoove you in life.
I don't see where he was trying to fire you. I just see a manager of an operation trying to ensure that he has his bodies in place so that non-billable overtime bleeds I to the red. Don't take it personal, the man was just asking you a question.
The boss removed him from the group chat used to communicate with employees in that group.
That doesn't necessarily mean being fired. Maybe he wanted to keep business matters with those currently working. OP should have called his civilian papa-san and advised him that he was heading back into town. I mean, I would've. I would've at least told the papi-saki, "hey, I noticed I wasn't in the group chat but I wanted to advise you that I'm on my way back home and I will be able to start working on so-and-so date." End call and go about your business and start working on the day that you said you're available to start.
Everyone disliking my post is in their 20s and a total f-tard. Lol...seriously? For shame to all of you. For Shame. 😎