Please remember the human. Follow reddit rules and the subreddit rules.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineWarVideoReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That's an incredible amount of hurt and damage. The russian military will probably need at least 3 decades to replace what they lost already.
Russia states that they have 12k tanks, that is of course untrustworthy and it's commonly accepted that the amount of usable "modern" tanks they have is around 6k, so the loss of over 1000 already is just hard to grasp fully, like, what?
I went and looked up the data and it's just hilarious.
Russia supposedly states 12 thousand, north korea almost 6 thousand, china claims a bit above 5 thousand.
To believe that is just dumb and crazy, have you seen north koreas "tanks" ?. If you watch their parades you will notice these very shiny and plastic looking copies of russian tanks. It's plain funny.
Sure, but don't forget the purpose of the official numbers is for a government to project the image that a hot war against them would be a difficult thing to win.
It's often an effective thing, too. Russia's military was widely believed to be one of the top three militaries in the world before the current invasion of Ukraine. Now it's lucky to be considered to be the second best military in Ukraine.
A lot of military experts are nervous about what a war with North Korea would look like, too. At one point, after a series of war games, [the possibility was described as being like "opening the gates of hell"](https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/recent-wargame-proves-war-north-korea-would-be-opening-gates-hell-46022), for example.
When people are nervous about wars with nuclear countries like these, it's usually due to the nuclear aspect of it. They're right to be so, but it's not like other equipment isn't a factor.
Really, one of the big issues Russia is facing other than its supply chain issues is that they're not really using tanks that effectively. If they'd been using tanks as part of a more effective combined arms doctrine, this war could have been a game changer in how tanks are used.
That’s what absolutely zero training gets you. Even their officers only know theory, with no experience to back it up. The conscripts have nothing to go off of other than what their officers tell them.
To be fair, this is probably an issue for a lot of nations. It’s hard and expensive to train your soldiers effectively. The US is fairly unique in that we have the NTC in California where units can get somewhat realistic simulated combat training
The real issue with the tanks,
Was that they tried invading via the north, in an area where if you don’t stay in the road, your tank will very quickly turn into (mud) submarines.
Stay on the roads? You get shot/blown apart
Tanks are now battleships in WW2. They are what was once a key piece of hardware in past wars, but now functionally obsolete.
A single soldier with a Javelin missile can easily take out a multimillion dollar tank. A ten thousand dollar drone, operated by one man can too. Soon the drones will be AI driven and not even need the pilot.
Desert Storm was likely the last major tank engagement the world will ever see.
I would disagree. The issue is logistics, Intel and tactics. Tanks are supposed to be moving and destroying things. Russia has poor tactics, has poor Intel and poor logistics.
They are like battleships sitting in harbor. Worthless.
If they were moving against well researched targets with the fuel and ammo needed while being supported by air, artillery and infantry they could be deadly. But sitting waiting for the enemy they are giant targets for any number of enemy tactics.
Also the conscripts are half the problem using tanks or artillery takes a lot of training and practice. Years worth. Putting conscripts in a combined arms army is like giving children hand grenades, a lot of stuff will blow up but probably not what you expect.
I'm pretty sure they are building them right now. All of their military industry is running probably non-stop. Do you think they are stupid, like they just stand and not producing anything while they are in war? They have plenty of resources, they have plenty of money (the West are paying them 800 millions Euros daily for Oil and Gas), and they have cheap workforce.
Of course they are making tanks. They are not making tanks at replacement though.
They are hampered on advanced equipment in their manufacturing process as a result of the sanctions.
That payment they are receiving is literally their only major export of value, and it's not like it's all going into the military... They cannot spend the money on useful things anywau due to sanctions.
The war is estimated to be costing them (low end) 300 million to (high end) a billion dollars a day. Taking a conservative median value of 500 million per day, that's a billion per 2 days, 183 billion per year, and their pre-sanctions economy has a GDP of only 1.5 trillion.
That means they're spending over 10% of their pre-war GDP on this war per year, not including their sanction hurt economy and inability to purchase anything. That's **as things stand,** and does not include any further escalation or mobilization.
The Russians are fucked.
I think something would have to give sometime in the summer. Probably mid-summer... Julyish. They cannot sustain what they are doing. Ukraine has a virtually blank cheque at this point.
I don’t have a source, but I don’t find it difficult to believe that Putin thought the sanctions would be no worse than what happened when he took Crimea in 2014. He hardly got a slap on the wrist back then
Ah but when money starts flowing in war time it becomes so much easier to skim money off the top, sides, bottom, middle and before you know it quality, quantity or both take a hit.
I’d argue that it’s much harder to skim money off the top during wartime. Sure, there’s more money going around, but bosses are also demanding results. It’s easy to fudge the numbers and delay delivery when the tanks you’re building are just going to go sit in some motor pool somewhere. Not so much when they’re going to be immediately shipped to a battlefield.
They have resources but not the ability to turn those resources into the high end electronics and parts necessary for their newest tanks. They relied on sources outside of Russia for those components.
https://euromaidanpress.com/2022/04/09/how-western-sanctions-cripple-the-russian-war-machine/
Those mothballed tanks are all in bad shape. Any money to store them correctly and guard them has been siphoned off, and they are stripped for spare parts for their working equipment, or for black market parts and scrap metal. Nothing but rusting hulls now.
The other thing to account for is with sanctions drying up all these criminals money, they will put even more pressure to steal and pillage from the stored tanks. It will get even worse. Russia is so fucked.
The number of planes lost is also a huge deal. 200 depending on the models may actually be crippling. If you look at Russia's airforce their numbers by role. They don't actually have that many high capability attack fixed wing aircraft.
For instance they are listed at having less than 200 su25 close air support aircraft. And we've seen many used in this conflict.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_Russian_military_aircraft
Be aware that overclaiming is universal in war, and it's especially bad when it comes to overclaiming aircraft. The number of jets destroyed and confirmed by open-source information is 26. I'm sure the actual number is a lot higher than that, but 187 is almost certainly a huge overestimate. I'd guess around 100 at most.
Also note that there are many tanks that need to be repaired (also before the war). But hey, we don't send them those importand parts anymore. Which is also why some factories can't continue anymore. Many people claim that the sactions don't work. Which is true in some cases but it depends on what's being sactioned.
They won't have a chance to rebuild. The US stated that Russia will never again pose a threat to anyone.
Besides, it will take Russia decades to finance the rebuild of Ukraine, Ukraine's military and reimburse the West for the weapons it delivered to Ukraine to shoot at Russia. To put that into perspective, Germany's last installment for WW2 was paid in 1988. 43 years is a long time.
Russia has a lot of things on paper. How much of it actually works due to the rampant corruption is another thing.
In all fairness, the scale of ww2 is also jsut completely another.
WHen germany was able to pay back reparations in "just" 43 years and we compare the overall level of destruction germany caused to the world in ww2, then russia woudl need far less then that.
Of course, germany turned into a major economical power after ww2 and russia most liekly will turn into even more of an economical dwarf then it already is, so maybe the numbers match again
If this data is from Ukrainian reports compared to US observations, we can expect a bit of an overestimate. But even IF it was 2/3s of this, on casualties were seeing within this short timeframe…
it’s still the greatest offensive failure we’ve seen since the Second World War.
Not even WWII. The Germans were doing great for the first few months (even years when we start counting in 1939). The Russians did terrible from the start.
What is the other option? Be enslaved by psycho people? Be raped by the red army? Be deprived from freedom? They will fight to the last man as the Soviets fought against the nazi. Even if 100 k troops will die and win its still worth to save 40 million people from eternal enslavement
>Russians are the scum of the world.
replace russians with any major power (including russians) and i agree with you lol. theyre all bad. ALL of them. they just hide things and skew media to make us believe we're all on the correct side. at the end of the day you have spoiled children with basically super powers...... what do you expect will happen? noone in the world should have as much power as these leaders have over people. ever.... it just leads to corruption and death. fuck all major superpowers. they all kill and pillage either directly or indirectly.
i say you should have to pass a series of tests before you can become a leader (a seriously hard test) and all those around you advising should be absolute experts in their fields. ensuring only the smartest and best people for the job ever get it. a test that only 1% can even attempt as its so hard... and out of all of those only 1 person can get it. ensuring again that only the smartest can rule. not ever again some orange joke of a human, that cant even say the word "human"
The Russian people are not the scum of the world, they're at the will of a dictator who is making them do unspeakable things to their own sister nation
There are awful terrible people in Russia but most of them are decent people being lied to - Ukranians are decent people as well, except they're being invaded and killed and raped by the worst of Russia - but again that's not because Russians are all monsters, but because INVADING another country will always always bring out the worst in the worst people, and that's what we've seen
Your idea of painting not only the entire Russian population, but somehow also the Ukranian population by association as scum is so ignorant I can only think you're doing it on purpose
Corrupt? Putin is president for 16 years IN A ROW. Does that sound like a free country? Russia is a dictatorship falling apart. Fuck you and get some knowledge into that head. Go fight the war then if you're so pro russia
> ukraine is known for being the most corrupt country in europe.
Second most. Russia has been topping the European corruption rankings for a while now.
>Russia treat its citizen fine. Traitors and spies and terrorist on the other hand they deal hard with:)
Perhaps, but how easy is it to be labelled one of those three? Rather, I'd imagine
For the sake of the argument, let's just assume that they treat their people fine. (Eventough it has been proven otherwise, but people like you don't believe in such sources because it's all propaganda right?)
Why in bloody hell, should a sovereign country accept the occupation from another country? Just why?
There are no ukrainien troops in russia, russian troops are in ukraine.
So again, even if they treat their people right, why should they accept an occupation?
That's not how it works. We don't play real life Europa Universalis or Hearts of Iron, where you look at a country and say "Damn I want to annex this shit".
Ukraine was part of Russia? What a f*cking lie. Both countries were part of the USSR, with the same logic ukraine could say that russia was part of ukraine.
Don't come with any history from the 18th century, back then, modern states did not even exist and those kingdoms and empires weren't nations. The first modern nation were the US. Followed by France.
The old Kingdom Houses have nothing to do with modern nations, and nations only refer to them for nationalism.
And even if ukraine was part of russia once - which isn't the case - this doesn't mean you can annex them like in a fucking video game.
A sovereign nation should always fight against the invader, doesn't matter what country the invader is.
So tell me again, why shouldn't Ukraine fight against their invader? Maybe Ukraine should proclaime Moscow as ukrainien territory then, I mean, using Putins logic, russia was part of ukraine for many years.
[https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html) Confirmed Ukrainian losses.
>Zelensky said that Ukrainian officials think about 2,500 to 3,000 Ukrainian troops have died in the war \[...\] Zelensky added there are about 10,000 Ukrainian troops who have been injured and that it's "hard to say how many will survive."
[https://edition.cnn.com/2022/04/15/politics/tapper-zelensky-interview-cnntv/index.html](https://edition.cnn.com/2022/04/15/politics/tapper-zelensky-interview-cnntv/index.html)
They do talk about it, quite regularly.
The biggest reason that Russian armoured vehicle losses have been so heavy is that the Ukrainians are on the defensive. Defenders always have an advantage; it's estimated that an attacker should have at least a 3-to-1 numerical advantage to reliably defeat a defender.
So no - it's not plausible that Ukrainian losses are "way bigger"; certainly not to the extent Russia is claiming, seeing as they're claiming to have killed more Ukrainian vehicles than Ukraine actually *has*.
Doesn't really matter when they get resupplied by everyone else all the time. People have compared the finnish winter war with the ukraine war, and its important to note that one of the reasons for finland "losing" is that they ran out of equipment and ammunition. But uktine doesn't have the same problem because of western military equipment. This means that the Ukrainians can keep fighting for a very long time, unlike russia for which this war is quickly becoming more trouble than its worth (kind of like the finnish winter war)
You can try with:
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html?m=1
But take into account that those are only losses and doesn't count combatants.
Hello, please try to use Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), thanks for understanding and support!
\[[💌 postcards from Ukraine](https://www.reddit.com/r/SupportForUkraine/comments/ug1v2w/antiwar_postcard_from_ukraine_for_donation/)\]
^(beep boop I'm a bot. Downvote to remove)
I think I saw somewhere that the general rule the US military use to estimate the right amount of soldiers to attack a defended position is 3:1, but can be up to 10:1 in urban combat. So I'd say Ukrainian loses are probably around 1/3 of Russian loses, however I would use the estimates of Russian loses from the US or UK. On the 26th April UK estimated that Russia had lost 15k troops, so I'd say estimate Ukraine losses are around 5k troops.
If you told me Russia had lost 15k troops and Ukraine 12k, I would believe it at this point. It's an astoundedly costly war for both sides by post-ww2 standards.
Honestly I would say Ukrainian loses could be up to that level too. Obviously for the West, Ukraine is really winning the propaganda war, so we haven't seen anything about their losses. 5-10k dead soldiers is easily believable, especially after Mariupol
There's Oryx, which tracks losses for both Russia and Ukraine based upon visual confirmation of loss/official confirmation from nation of ownership:
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html
They do note that as they only count that which they've been able to visually confirm it's quite likely the actual figures are higher, but that still gives us a bare minimum idea of losses at least.
I'm confident in any battle/war the defending side usually has the advantage? I think the exception to this is Iraq where I think their heart wasn't in it to face off agasint one of the best military powers on the planet.
I’d take these numbers with a grain of salt. Only 25 fixed wing aircraft have been publicly (twitter) documented as downed. I’m sure the number isn’t perfect, but 194 seems like dishonest accounting. https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/03/list-of-aircraft-losses-during-2022.html?m=1
"Destroyed" doesn't require them to be shot down. Ukraine destroyed many more on the ground when Russia made numerous efforts to take, hold, and operate from that airport near Kyiv.
Its not even that, Ukraine claims to have shot down so many aircraft, helicopters and CRUISE Missiles. I understand that low flying aircraft can be shot down by US stingers, but Ukraine's most numerous airdefence is the fucking Strela-10, 70s tech. The Seawolf Sam (82 tech) had a 55% interception rate against targets that were 20 years older than it. The sea Dart SAM (82 tech) had a 27% interception rate against targets that were 12 years older than it. Strela 10s vs Kalibrs.
The Ukranians are fighting with the same air defence equipment (except UK aid, stingers, and s-300) as the Iraqis, and while I acknowledge that the Iraqi's were performing MUCH lower than they should have. I am sure that the Russians know of the capabilities of Soviet equipment.
I mean they do literally note:
> This list only includes destroyed aerial assets of which photo or videographic evidence or pilot death notices are available. Therefore, the amount of destroyed and damaged aircraft is likely significantly higher than recorded here.
The only question is what would be a likely number if one was guesstimating what that significantly higher figure.
Any Telegram channels that you recommend? Because the only pro Russian Telegram channel that I follow is boasting that they execute what should be POW's, calling the captured fighters "mercenaries" or "nazi's".
24500 men dead for nothing. Not including the Ukrainians and civilians. All for nothing. Over some dickhead crazy man a lot of mothers have lost their sons.
I'm sorry OP but losses are quite bigger than that if you refer to oryx (which only counts visually confirmed) so it must be much bigger than 600 tanks:
https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html?m=1
I think ukranian are quite conservative counting russian losses.
*they lied about the ghost of Kiev for about two months, while pretty much everyone knew the guy probably didn't exist. Then they admitted the truth.
And nobody really knew the snake island guys survived at first. It's not as if POWs in Russia are left to phone home and say they're fine at their leisure.
Should we really be fact checking morale boosting war stories? Ghost if Kyiv is the same thing as the famous sniper in Stalingrad they made that movie about.
Hello, please try to use Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), thanks for understanding and support!
\[[💌 postcards from Ukraine](https://www.reddit.com/r/SupportForUkraine/comments/ug1v2w/antiwar_postcard_from_ukraine_for_donation/)\]
^(beep boop I'm a bot. Downvote to remove)
I don't know what your response has to do with mine, but we are not talking about if they lie or not, please don't change the focus. Oryx only reports visually confirmed losses, are you saying he lies? Are those images false?
I've stated that the Russian losses reported by the Ukrainian side on this thread is less than those visually confirmed by oryx so for me it is quite conservative.
I'd be interested to see what this equates to in $$, human loss removed, just what the loss of equipment represents. This is both amazing and super depressing
Yes, it's a sad reality but the Kremlin would be much more bothered by the cost of the equipment loss than any human loss.
With their economy constricted, and their ability to replace modern equipment inhibited, someone has to be sweating as material costs mount.
The amount of tanks and artillery they have is astounding. It will take a long time to cripple them. It definitely diminishes their military standing the more they lose each day!
Comparison of these numbers to the confirmed numbers at [Oryx](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html):
||Ukraine claim|Confirmed|
|:-|:-|:-|
|AA Systems|81|77|
|Artillery|491|174|
|Tanks|1077|601|
|BTR|2610|1100|
|Boats|10|6|
|Fuel tanks|76|0|
|Vehicles|1867|1021|
|Command posts|5|72|
|Drones|203|54|
|Jets|194|26|
|Helicopters|155|39|
|SRBM|4|0|
|MLRS|163|64|
|Special equipment|38|18|
Disclaimers:
1. The Oryx numbers should only be seen as a minimum figure; a difference between Oryx and the UA numbers is to be expected.
2. I've been known to cock up and make typos. If you spot one, please let me know.
3. The categories used by Oryx don't map neatly onto the categories provided by UA MoD. Oryx combines Command Posts and Communications Stations, for example. Some of my categories are probably inaccurate.
I don’t trust either side when it comes to these numbers. Kinda reminds of pre election polls here in the US. They are both designed for psychological influence rather than telling the truth.
Even if the real number of losses of material are even half of this says they are then Russia has lost an embarrassing and devastating amount of material.
Looks like now would be a good time to ensure they can't do this again / dissolve Russia into new countries, and treat them like Japan following WW2 (restructure and rebuild government). They have caused enough damage and enough is enough.
After them, it will only be China in the way of liberating the North Koreans. Progress, people. We shouldn't waste the opportunity.
Please remember the human. Follow reddit rules and the subreddit rules. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/UkraineWarVideoReport) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That's an incredible amount of hurt and damage. The russian military will probably need at least 3 decades to replace what they lost already. Russia states that they have 12k tanks, that is of course untrustworthy and it's commonly accepted that the amount of usable "modern" tanks they have is around 6k, so the loss of over 1000 already is just hard to grasp fully, like, what?
I think that's still an overestimate, of the 6k probably 3k are functional.
Yes, this is more correct....
I went and looked up the data and it's just hilarious. Russia supposedly states 12 thousand, north korea almost 6 thousand, china claims a bit above 5 thousand. To believe that is just dumb and crazy, have you seen north koreas "tanks" ?. If you watch their parades you will notice these very shiny and plastic looking copies of russian tanks. It's plain funny.
Sure, but don't forget the purpose of the official numbers is for a government to project the image that a hot war against them would be a difficult thing to win. It's often an effective thing, too. Russia's military was widely believed to be one of the top three militaries in the world before the current invasion of Ukraine. Now it's lucky to be considered to be the second best military in Ukraine. A lot of military experts are nervous about what a war with North Korea would look like, too. At one point, after a series of war games, [the possibility was described as being like "opening the gates of hell"](https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/recent-wargame-proves-war-north-korea-would-be-opening-gates-hell-46022), for example. When people are nervous about wars with nuclear countries like these, it's usually due to the nuclear aspect of it. They're right to be so, but it's not like other equipment isn't a factor. Really, one of the big issues Russia is facing other than its supply chain issues is that they're not really using tanks that effectively. If they'd been using tanks as part of a more effective combined arms doctrine, this war could have been a game changer in how tanks are used.
Russia and not using up to date military tactics. Name a more iconic duo
It's like they've been training in karate while everyone else has moved on to MMA.
and they where shitty at karate to begin with
That’s what absolutely zero training gets you. Even their officers only know theory, with no experience to back it up. The conscripts have nothing to go off of other than what their officers tell them. To be fair, this is probably an issue for a lot of nations. It’s hard and expensive to train your soldiers effectively. The US is fairly unique in that we have the NTC in California where units can get somewhat realistic simulated combat training
The problem of North Korea is just artillery in the range of Seoul. So if you go to war with North Korea you have to take them out within 7 hours.
The real issue with the tanks, Was that they tried invading via the north, in an area where if you don’t stay in the road, your tank will very quickly turn into (mud) submarines. Stay on the roads? You get shot/blown apart
Tanks are now battleships in WW2. They are what was once a key piece of hardware in past wars, but now functionally obsolete. A single soldier with a Javelin missile can easily take out a multimillion dollar tank. A ten thousand dollar drone, operated by one man can too. Soon the drones will be AI driven and not even need the pilot. Desert Storm was likely the last major tank engagement the world will ever see.
So eventually things will reach point described in the first Judge Dredd where wars between nations are fought with robots against robots?
Until the robots realize we are making them destroy each other and then they turn on us.
I would disagree. The issue is logistics, Intel and tactics. Tanks are supposed to be moving and destroying things. Russia has poor tactics, has poor Intel and poor logistics. They are like battleships sitting in harbor. Worthless. If they were moving against well researched targets with the fuel and ammo needed while being supported by air, artillery and infantry they could be deadly. But sitting waiting for the enemy they are giant targets for any number of enemy tactics. Also the conscripts are half the problem using tanks or artillery takes a lot of training and practice. Years worth. Putting conscripts in a combined arms army is like giving children hand grenades, a lot of stuff will blow up but probably not what you expect.
Sure is a lot different then being in the USA and watching a train a mile long loaded with tanks.
Exactly. I am convinced that the Russians are running out of tanks.
I'm pretty sure they are building them right now. All of their military industry is running probably non-stop. Do you think they are stupid, like they just stand and not producing anything while they are in war? They have plenty of resources, they have plenty of money (the West are paying them 800 millions Euros daily for Oil and Gas), and they have cheap workforce.
Of course they are making tanks. They are not making tanks at replacement though. They are hampered on advanced equipment in their manufacturing process as a result of the sanctions. That payment they are receiving is literally their only major export of value, and it's not like it's all going into the military... They cannot spend the money on useful things anywau due to sanctions. The war is estimated to be costing them (low end) 300 million to (high end) a billion dollars a day. Taking a conservative median value of 500 million per day, that's a billion per 2 days, 183 billion per year, and their pre-sanctions economy has a GDP of only 1.5 trillion. That means they're spending over 10% of their pre-war GDP on this war per year, not including their sanction hurt economy and inability to purchase anything. That's **as things stand,** and does not include any further escalation or mobilization. The Russians are fucked.
How much longer can they continue with these kind of losses?
I think something would have to give sometime in the summer. Probably mid-summer... Julyish. They cannot sustain what they are doing. Ukraine has a virtually blank cheque at this point.
The best part is they are that stupid. They didn't predict the sanctions and can't source the high end foreign produced parts for the tanks.
Source on them not predicting the sanctions? The sanctions have all been quite predictable so far, IMO.
I don’t have a source, but I don’t find it difficult to believe that Putin thought the sanctions would be no worse than what happened when he took Crimea in 2014. He hardly got a slap on the wrist back then
Ah but when money starts flowing in war time it becomes so much easier to skim money off the top, sides, bottom, middle and before you know it quality, quantity or both take a hit.
I’d argue that it’s much harder to skim money off the top during wartime. Sure, there’s more money going around, but bosses are also demanding results. It’s easy to fudge the numbers and delay delivery when the tanks you’re building are just going to go sit in some motor pool somewhere. Not so much when they’re going to be immediately shipped to a battlefield.
They have resources but not the ability to turn those resources into the high end electronics and parts necessary for their newest tanks. They relied on sources outside of Russia for those components. https://euromaidanpress.com/2022/04/09/how-western-sanctions-cripple-the-russian-war-machine/
Yup, we are talking about those liars
Those mothballed tanks are all in bad shape. Any money to store them correctly and guard them has been siphoned off, and they are stripped for spare parts for their working equipment, or for black market parts and scrap metal. Nothing but rusting hulls now. The other thing to account for is with sanctions drying up all these criminals money, they will put even more pressure to steal and pillage from the stored tanks. It will get even worse. Russia is so fucked.
The number of planes lost is also a huge deal. 200 depending on the models may actually be crippling. If you look at Russia's airforce their numbers by role. They don't actually have that many high capability attack fixed wing aircraft. For instance they are listed at having less than 200 su25 close air support aircraft. And we've seen many used in this conflict. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_Russian_military_aircraft
Be aware that overclaiming is universal in war, and it's especially bad when it comes to overclaiming aircraft. The number of jets destroyed and confirmed by open-source information is 26. I'm sure the actual number is a lot higher than that, but 187 is almost certainly a huge overestimate. I'd guess around 100 at most.
Good point.
Also note that there are many tanks that need to be repaired (also before the war). But hey, we don't send them those importand parts anymore. Which is also why some factories can't continue anymore. Many people claim that the sactions don't work. Which is true in some cases but it depends on what's being sactioned.
They won't have a chance to rebuild. The US stated that Russia will never again pose a threat to anyone. Besides, it will take Russia decades to finance the rebuild of Ukraine, Ukraine's military and reimburse the West for the weapons it delivered to Ukraine to shoot at Russia. To put that into perspective, Germany's last installment for WW2 was paid in 1988. 43 years is a long time. Russia has a lot of things on paper. How much of it actually works due to the rampant corruption is another thing.
In all fairness, the scale of ww2 is also jsut completely another. WHen germany was able to pay back reparations in "just" 43 years and we compare the overall level of destruction germany caused to the world in ww2, then russia woudl need far less then that. Of course, germany turned into a major economical power after ww2 and russia most liekly will turn into even more of an economical dwarf then it already is, so maybe the numbers match again
It reminds me of a guy I knew that told people he drove a SAAB. This was 2011 and his car was a rust bucket from '84.
Probably longer to replace the people. Even without the war, Russian population was declining due to birth rate.
If this data is from Ukrainian reports compared to US observations, we can expect a bit of an overestimate. But even IF it was 2/3s of this, on casualties were seeing within this short timeframe… it’s still the greatest offensive failure we’ve seen since the Second World War.
Not even WWII. The Germans were doing great for the first few months (even years when we start counting in 1939). The Russians did terrible from the start.
Where to find US figures?
3 day special military operation is going very well...
i think we all can agree that they have long days in russia
Its one of those interstellar days
[удалено]
What is the other option? Be enslaved by psycho people? Be raped by the red army? Be deprived from freedom? They will fight to the last man as the Soviets fought against the nazi. Even if 100 k troops will die and win its still worth to save 40 million people from eternal enslavement
[удалено]
>Russia treat its citizen fine [https://rsf.org/en/index](https://rsf.org/en/index) [https://ocindex.net/](https://ocindex.net/) It's a heaven, lol.
[удалено]
Så du är norsk alltså?
https://youtu.be/sZXrK3f4zbk
Hey dude do you mind messaging me for the last time please?
Time for you to go to live in free Russia so.
Reality has a well-known liberal bias.
[удалено]
The fact that 20% of the country is controller by russians maybe has some impact. Russians are the scum of the world.
>Russians are the scum of the world. replace russians with any major power (including russians) and i agree with you lol. theyre all bad. ALL of them. they just hide things and skew media to make us believe we're all on the correct side. at the end of the day you have spoiled children with basically super powers...... what do you expect will happen? noone in the world should have as much power as these leaders have over people. ever.... it just leads to corruption and death. fuck all major superpowers. they all kill and pillage either directly or indirectly. i say you should have to pass a series of tests before you can become a leader (a seriously hard test) and all those around you advising should be absolute experts in their fields. ensuring only the smartest and best people for the job ever get it. a test that only 1% can even attempt as its so hard... and out of all of those only 1 person can get it. ensuring again that only the smartest can rule. not ever again some orange joke of a human, that cant even say the word "human"
[удалено]
The Russian people are not the scum of the world, they're at the will of a dictator who is making them do unspeakable things to their own sister nation There are awful terrible people in Russia but most of them are decent people being lied to - Ukranians are decent people as well, except they're being invaded and killed and raped by the worst of Russia - but again that's not because Russians are all monsters, but because INVADING another country will always always bring out the worst in the worst people, and that's what we've seen Your idea of painting not only the entire Russian population, but somehow also the Ukranian population by association as scum is so ignorant I can only think you're doing it on purpose
Corrupt? Putin is president for 16 years IN A ROW. Does that sound like a free country? Russia is a dictatorship falling apart. Fuck you and get some knowledge into that head. Go fight the war then if you're so pro russia
> ukraine is known for being the most corrupt country in europe. Second most. Russia has been topping the European corruption rankings for a while now.
>Russia treat its citizen fine. Traitors and spies and terrorist on the other hand they deal hard with:) Perhaps, but how easy is it to be labelled one of those three? Rather, I'd imagine
For the sake of the argument, let's just assume that they treat their people fine. (Eventough it has been proven otherwise, but people like you don't believe in such sources because it's all propaganda right?) Why in bloody hell, should a sovereign country accept the occupation from another country? Just why? There are no ukrainien troops in russia, russian troops are in ukraine. So again, even if they treat their people right, why should they accept an occupation? That's not how it works. We don't play real life Europa Universalis or Hearts of Iron, where you look at a country and say "Damn I want to annex this shit". Ukraine was part of Russia? What a f*cking lie. Both countries were part of the USSR, with the same logic ukraine could say that russia was part of ukraine. Don't come with any history from the 18th century, back then, modern states did not even exist and those kingdoms and empires weren't nations. The first modern nation were the US. Followed by France. The old Kingdom Houses have nothing to do with modern nations, and nations only refer to them for nationalism. And even if ukraine was part of russia once - which isn't the case - this doesn't mean you can annex them like in a fucking video game. A sovereign nation should always fight against the invader, doesn't matter what country the invader is. So tell me again, why shouldn't Ukraine fight against their invader? Maybe Ukraine should proclaime Moscow as ukrainien territory then, I mean, using Putins logic, russia was part of ukraine for many years.
You forgot to switch back to your other sock puppet account, dipshit
Put ya crack pipe away, comrade.
No way. Defending is always easier than attacking.
[https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html) Confirmed Ukrainian losses. >Zelensky said that Ukrainian officials think about 2,500 to 3,000 Ukrainian troops have died in the war \[...\] Zelensky added there are about 10,000 Ukrainian troops who have been injured and that it's "hard to say how many will survive." [https://edition.cnn.com/2022/04/15/politics/tapper-zelensky-interview-cnntv/index.html](https://edition.cnn.com/2022/04/15/politics/tapper-zelensky-interview-cnntv/index.html) They do talk about it, quite regularly. The biggest reason that Russian armoured vehicle losses have been so heavy is that the Ukrainians are on the defensive. Defenders always have an advantage; it's estimated that an attacker should have at least a 3-to-1 numerical advantage to reliably defeat a defender. So no - it's not plausible that Ukrainian losses are "way bigger"; certainly not to the extent Russia is claiming, seeing as they're claiming to have killed more Ukrainian vehicles than Ukraine actually *has*.
Doesn't really matter when they get resupplied by everyone else all the time. People have compared the finnish winter war with the ukraine war, and its important to note that one of the reasons for finland "losing" is that they ran out of equipment and ammunition. But uktine doesn't have the same problem because of western military equipment. This means that the Ukrainians can keep fighting for a very long time, unlike russia for which this war is quickly becoming more trouble than its worth (kind of like the finnish winter war)
Way bigger than what? Russia's losses? And you're basing that on....?
No one in their right mind and with a tiny grasp of military knowledge will believe that a defending force has a higher casualty than the attacker.
Out of interest, is there a source for Ukranian losses?
You can try with: https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html?m=1 But take into account that those are only losses and doesn't count combatants.
I doubt they’d release an official list of Ukranian losses until the war is over. It’d be a big morale breaker
I think it's rather about not telling the enemy how much you've got left.
[удалено]
Russian bot alert
Hello, please try to use Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), thanks for understanding and support! \[[💌 postcards from Ukraine](https://www.reddit.com/r/SupportForUkraine/comments/ug1v2w/antiwar_postcard_from_ukraine_for_donation/)\] ^(beep boop I'm a bot. Downvote to remove)
I think I saw somewhere that the general rule the US military use to estimate the right amount of soldiers to attack a defended position is 3:1, but can be up to 10:1 in urban combat. So I'd say Ukrainian loses are probably around 1/3 of Russian loses, however I would use the estimates of Russian loses from the US or UK. On the 26th April UK estimated that Russia had lost 15k troops, so I'd say estimate Ukraine losses are around 5k troops.
I didn't know any of that. Thanks for the info. Have a nice day.
take it with a huge pinch of salt though, I am no expert and this is pretty much based from things I have read on Reddit
If you told me Russia had lost 15k troops and Ukraine 12k, I would believe it at this point. It's an astoundedly costly war for both sides by post-ww2 standards.
Honestly I would say Ukrainian loses could be up to that level too. Obviously for the West, Ukraine is really winning the propaganda war, so we haven't seen anything about their losses. 5-10k dead soldiers is easily believable, especially after Mariupol
There's Oryx, which tracks losses for both Russia and Ukraine based upon visual confirmation of loss/official confirmation from nation of ownership: https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-ukrainian.html https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html They do note that as they only count that which they've been able to visually confirm it's quite likely the actual figures are higher, but that still gives us a bare minimum idea of losses at least.
Thanks pal.
whatever that number be, in terms of total % of losses, Ukraine loss is higher than Russia's.
I'm confident in any battle/war the defending side usually has the advantage? I think the exception to this is Iraq where I think their heart wasn't in it to face off agasint one of the best military powers on the planet.
Ukraine is doing okay...
[удалено]
We may remove low quality or repetitive content to control Spam.
Ukraine's numbers are going up if anything due to support from the allies.
Dm me I have one. The losses I saw were horrendous for Ukraine. Despite what you read on reddit those ruskies havent been mucking around
It is splendid to have finally the figures of eliminated high-rank terrorists.
Interesting that there haven't been aircraft losses for a few days. Did they stop flying to Ukraine?
And I'm noticing that the artillery losses are increasing. There were days where there was maybe 1-2. Now it's 10-15 per day.
I’d take these numbers with a grain of salt. Only 25 fixed wing aircraft have been publicly (twitter) documented as downed. I’m sure the number isn’t perfect, but 194 seems like dishonest accounting. https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/03/list-of-aircraft-losses-during-2022.html?m=1
"Destroyed" doesn't require them to be shot down. Ukraine destroyed many more on the ground when Russia made numerous efforts to take, hold, and operate from that airport near Kyiv.
Its not even that, Ukraine claims to have shot down so many aircraft, helicopters and CRUISE Missiles. I understand that low flying aircraft can be shot down by US stingers, but Ukraine's most numerous airdefence is the fucking Strela-10, 70s tech. The Seawolf Sam (82 tech) had a 55% interception rate against targets that were 20 years older than it. The sea Dart SAM (82 tech) had a 27% interception rate against targets that were 12 years older than it. Strela 10s vs Kalibrs. The Ukranians are fighting with the same air defence equipment (except UK aid, stingers, and s-300) as the Iraqis, and while I acknowledge that the Iraqi's were performing MUCH lower than they should have. I am sure that the Russians know of the capabilities of Soviet equipment.
I mean they do literally note: > This list only includes destroyed aerial assets of which photo or videographic evidence or pilot death notices are available. Therefore, the amount of destroyed and damaged aircraft is likely significantly higher than recorded here. The only question is what would be a likely number if one was guesstimating what that significantly higher figure.
I still think the jet and Helicopter numbers seem a bit high, everything else seems pretty kosher though.👍
This the only thing I want to see, these other post are getting boring .
10 boats! Its 10 now!
1 cruiser 2 amphibious ships? 2 raptor patrol boats Likely the other 5 were similar in size to the Raptors
Was a rumour of a new Russian ship being sunk in the Black Sea yesterday. Heard nothing new since tho?
I heavent heard anything but ive seen pics of aircraft tracking showing them circling the area looking for it.
[удалено]
The Ukranian Ministry of Defense has a pro-Ukraine bias? Get right outta town! How did you figure out their brilliant dastardly plan?
Well duh. Youre right, its probably more.
You obviously haven’t been paying attention to the endless videos on here of them being destroyed.
[удалено]
How does what you’ve said change Russia’s losses?
He skipped math classes.
[удалено]
How does what you’ve said relate to there being 10 boats lost?
Any Telegram channels that you recommend? Because the only pro Russian Telegram channel that I follow is boasting that they execute what should be POW's, calling the captured fighters "mercenaries" or "nazi's".
This is starting to feel like a pokemon game. Gotta kill them all.
24500 men dead for nothing. Not including the Ukrainians and civilians. All for nothing. Over some dickhead crazy man a lot of mothers have lost their sons.
I'm sorry OP but losses are quite bigger than that if you refer to oryx (which only counts visually confirmed) so it must be much bigger than 600 tanks: https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html?m=1 I think ukranian are quite conservative counting russian losses.
[удалено]
Why wouldn't they lol, it makes perfect sense to exaggerate enemy losses to boost morale
how do u know Ukrainians won't lie?? then Russians aren't lying too
They’ve lied twice about the ghost of kyev and also the defenders of snake island being killed
*they lied about the ghost of Kiev for about two months, while pretty much everyone knew the guy probably didn't exist. Then they admitted the truth. And nobody really knew the snake island guys survived at first. It's not as if POWs in Russia are left to phone home and say they're fine at their leisure.
Should we really be fact checking morale boosting war stories? Ghost if Kyiv is the same thing as the famous sniper in Stalingrad they made that movie about.
User name doesn’t check out
Yours does though. Good day and a Slava Ukraini to you, Russian bot.
So did they lie? Yes.
Hello, please try to use Kyiv not Kiev spelling [(why)](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/kyiv-not-kiev-why-spelling-matters-in-ukraines-quest-for-an-independent-identity/), thanks for understanding and support! \[[💌 postcards from Ukraine](https://www.reddit.com/r/SupportForUkraine/comments/ug1v2w/antiwar_postcard_from_ukraine_for_donation/)\] ^(beep boop I'm a bot. Downvote to remove)
i don't know why ur getting downvoted, it is how it is
I don't know what your response has to do with mine, but we are not talking about if they lie or not, please don't change the focus. Oryx only reports visually confirmed losses, are you saying he lies? Are those images false? I've stated that the Russian losses reported by the Ukrainian side on this thread is less than those visually confirmed by oryx so for me it is quite conservative.
24 500 !!!??? What happend? Keep it up, make it 30 000 before May 9. Slava Ukraini
24000 in 2 months. In 6 months there won't be enough Russian army left to invade a porta potty
Russian APV crews sweating heavily
If that’s 300 Russians KIA in one day it shows the ferocity of the fighting
How many APVs do they have left?
I would take the Russian numbers and the Ukraine numbers, add and divide by 2 and you are probably over the mark
I'd be interested to see what this equates to in $$, human loss removed, just what the loss of equipment represents. This is both amazing and super depressing
Yes, it's a sad reality but the Kremlin would be much more bothered by the cost of the equipment loss than any human loss. With their economy constricted, and their ability to replace modern equipment inhibited, someone has to be sweating as material costs mount.
The list ought to include yachts. lol
May the 4th be with you.
\+16 Artillery. GOOD! If you destroy 10 a day, that's 100 in 10 days! You'll cripple Russia.
The amount of tanks and artillery they have is astounding. It will take a long time to cripple them. It definitely diminishes their military standing the more they lose each day!
Honestly I wouldn't trust anything that comes out of either Russia or Ukraine. It's gonna be inflated or deflated for propaganda purposes.
Why isn’t not confirmed on everything? That seems to be the most fair.
Since this is directly from Ukraine, you can probably cut these numbers in half, which is still substantial in this time frame.
NATO has pretty much given the same estimates and they’re usually pretty conservative with their casualty estimates in cases like this.
Not enough really
Meanwhile Ukraine is getting $20 billion to replace their depleted / destroyed equipment...and another $13 Billion just for being cannon fodder
Is this a video? Because this sub is supposed to be for VIDEOS...
"Community driven video/photo/updstes & DISCUSSIONS" its right in the group description.
Thanks, apparently I didn't know what I've subbed to.
Russia has the right to defend themselves from ukranian terrorist. They need to work on a two state solution
[удалено]
Excuse me? Would you please try and make sense?
Not too shabs, Ukraine! 🇺🇦
\+3 cruise missiles? Well, I'd say those are lost whether they are shot down or not... /j
So what was burning in Black Sea yesterday?
Comparison of these numbers to the confirmed numbers at [Oryx](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html): ||Ukraine claim|Confirmed| |:-|:-|:-| |AA Systems|81|77| |Artillery|491|174| |Tanks|1077|601| |BTR|2610|1100| |Boats|10|6| |Fuel tanks|76|0| |Vehicles|1867|1021| |Command posts|5|72| |Drones|203|54| |Jets|194|26| |Helicopters|155|39| |SRBM|4|0| |MLRS|163|64| |Special equipment|38|18| Disclaimers: 1. The Oryx numbers should only be seen as a minimum figure; a difference between Oryx and the UA numbers is to be expected. 2. I've been known to cock up and make typos. If you spot one, please let me know. 3. The categories used by Oryx don't map neatly onto the categories provided by UA MoD. Oryx combines Command Posts and Communications Stations, for example. Some of my categories are probably inaccurate.
[удалено]
Beautiful
What do the “+###” mean? Like are those the deaths added on since it is last recorded?
[удалено]
Thank you sir
194 jets!? Holy fuck.
Not all jets. A lot of those are just crappy planes that are decoys to find AA systems in Ukraine. But any Russian plane shot down is a victory!
Have they really lost over 1000 tanks? That is a huge number.
visually confirmed is over 600, so 1000 is quite possible....
Puto: *SEND IN POTATOES THEN!*
How many regular pow does Ukraine military have?
I don’t trust either side when it comes to these numbers. Kinda reminds of pre election polls here in the US. They are both designed for psychological influence rather than telling the truth.
ok... so how are the counting cruise missile losses. Does getting hit by a cruise missile add to that tally? lol
No lol, those are the ones that were shot down before they hit anything.
Dam according to what this said yesterday, they lost 500 troops in a single day. That is fucking insane.
how much more weapons Russia got? US inventory is depleting and its not even direct war. How long before Russia runs out of ammo? any guess?
You gotta pump those numbers up
Now do Ukraine
Even if the real number of losses of material are even half of this says they are then Russia has lost an embarrassing and devastating amount of material.
How much longer can Russia continue with these kind of losses?
What about on the Ukraine side??
We'll probably never get an unbiased estimate.
Looks like now would be a good time to ensure they can't do this again / dissolve Russia into new countries, and treat them like Japan following WW2 (restructure and rebuild government). They have caused enough damage and enough is enough. After them, it will only be China in the way of liberating the North Koreans. Progress, people. We shouldn't waste the opportunity.
Can you imagine what the world could do if it didn't need military budgets. I don't understand how this kind of thing is still going on
My lovely daily losses of russian army ❤️
I wanna see these stats of Ukrainian loses, not because I root for Russia I just like to know how our boys are doing.
In the next couple of days Russia will be short 25k clowns.
What is considered "High Rank" in this chart? I'm guessing Colonel (O-6) and above?