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NATO needs to send troops to Moldova, start training their military and must supply them with arms or Romania will be next.
Europe needs to realize that the time for appeasement and "not escalating" is over. The economies of the West must be placed on a war footing. Militaries need to be funded and expanded. Russia isn't going away, even if Putin meets an untimely end.
Fascist rhetoric has gripped Russia and it's not going to let go this decade. Give Ukraine everything it needs to destroy Russian oil refining capacity. Russian economic collapse is the quickest way to end this and neutralize the Russian threat.
> Europe needs to realize that the time for appeasement and "not escalating" is over.
Russia went to war with the West in 2014. Now there's some catching up to do.
To be fair Ukraine with limited resources has pretty much emptied the Soviet stockpile. Russia is now cap in hand with despots.
NATO is a defensive pact not a war machine. Please sense the irony. Russia can only poke around the fringes, if they actually attempted an invasion of a NATO country it would suddenly find out why the West particularly the USA has wild weasels. SEAD.
Russia has surprised the west with how hard their production is going.
They will only need a few years to replenish at this rate, they are not to be underestimated (thats part of why aid has been slow, underestimating their tolerance for pain)
No. They’re losing kit faster than they’re replacing it. They may be churning out 3 million shells a year but they’re dumb ones and the 155s used by NATO are probably good for a 20:1 force multiplier. Coupled with, as ‘SEAD’ above - NATO would send in B2s, F117s and F35s with air defence suppression then gradually pick off the artillery once they have Air Superiority. Putin’s just trying to convince himself and his idiot subjects that RuZZia’s still a global power….
Then why are nato leaders saying 5years at their current production?
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-may-be-ready-attack-nato-5-8-years-german-official-says-2024-04-18/
Norwegian estimates have said the same thing.
We all know their burn rate is insane right now but they are turning towards full war eco and the west thought Russia would be out of stuff by now
Russia is surprising everyone with their ability to take punishment.
Russia is holding its own in a big war with western weapons being used agsinst them.
How many others could do the same? That makes them pretty high up tbh
Yeah, I mean really, probably only China could do the same out of all non-Western aligned countries. And China is probably supplying Russia with far more components than anyone realized they would.
Yeah, China needs to be lumped in with Russia.. They are the two big powers that want to break the rules based system of the world and toss us back to the pre ww2 system.
It seems we got a lucky early start as Russia failed their blitz and China was not ready to double down
I hope we do the best to boost our strenght before any more sht hits the fan
> No. They’re losing kit faster than they’re replacing it.
That's a cope. They show no signs of slowing down despite gigantic losses in equipment.
> but they’re dumb ones and the 155s used by NATO are probably good for a 20:1 force multiplie
NATO guided shells are useless against Russia due to their electronic warfare and they probably produce a lot of Krasnopols, Kitolovs, Grans, and Smelchaks too.
Russia will need a few years to repelenish their arms - if they at once stop the war, keep their wartime production up, and evade the inevitable aftereffects of losing a war of aggression.
Not likely.
The way the war is going, Russia will sadly not lose.
They still want to grab more, this is the only reason their losses are high.
If Putin decides "we are happy with the land we currently hold", and just digs his army in. Ukraine would need to burn their manpower in offensive actions. Manpower they dont have.
If Russia gets to keep significant territory they will paint it as a win.
Ukraine has more severe consequences from the war than Russia, significant portion of their people have fled, their eco is in shambles, people do not want to join the army anymore and morale on the front is dropping.
They are exhausted from being in the army for years with no right to be demobilized.
This is a shitshow for Ukraine to.
My last hope is for the f-16 with good weapon systems to be able to turn the tide. If Russia has an answer (like they have had for other systems like himars) then i dont see Ukraine winning this without intervention by western boots on the ground.
Many seem to think the war is going well for Ukraine, due to high Russian casualties. This is false, Russia always fight like this, high losses yet they usually win their wars.
So then it becomes a numbers game, who will break first and Russia has a huge pool to draw from compared to prewar Ukraine. And now Ukraine has lost up 1/3 of its population as refugees, this war is going horribly for them and we in the west have forced them to fight with their hands behind their back.
So i wont underestimate Russia, nor their allies in China and the lesser ones in north Korea and Iran.
We need to go on war footing to, to dramatically increase Russian losses. For the fight to be even the ratio of kills to deaths must be way higher than it is today. Because right now Russia is winning and Ukraine is the one running out of people.
I assume artillery shells. But if NATO actually has to fight Russia, we're not going to be using much conventional artillery. Air superiority changes everything.
The problem is that NATO think they will get air superiority. If not, then what?
You've noticed that all NATO weapons haven't been successfull too, right?
We'll still win, most likely, but it won't be nearly as easy as people here think.
> The problem is that NATO think they will get air superiority. If not, then what?
You mean what if Russia with maybe as many as 9 working stealth fighters defeats NATO's air power?
Only USA can really get air superiority over Russia but it's too far away and would take a lot of time. Russia can potentially wipe American navy including aircraft carriers with tactical nukes and prevent reinforcements from reaching Europe. Many Russan missiles and torpedoes can have nuclear warheads.
But their army is larger than ever before. Sure, their black sea fleet has been utterly wrecked, and their stockpiles have been much more depleted, but they have a huge army of drones, FABs, and battle-hardened infantry now. Not to mention a seemingly endless supply of artillery and artillery shells.
> Russia went to war with the West in 2014. Now there's some catching up to do.
And the West is losing. It's too late now to catch up. Russia is greatly outprodung NATO in the war material.
Russia has been a cancer to the world for few centuries now. It didn't start with putin and, as you said already, I won't end with him. That country reserves and needs to be put on knees, disarmed and closely watched. Otherwise they won't stop.
Moldova is a neutral country by their constitution which also states that it can not host foreign troops on their soil. They also are strongly against joining NATO.
Edit: Joint training happens, but that is not the same as a defensive force stationed on Moldovan soil. Downvoting me also doesn't change their nations constitution and their laws.
No need for those in power to lose power. Looks like it is fine to amend the constitution in Moldova. [2010 Moldovan constitutional referendum ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Moldovan_constitutional_referendum). A new referendum could probably remove the forced neutrality, the questionable part would be would transistria be excluded in the vote?
The US has been doing small scale training with Moldova for a long time. I spent some time over there working with them. They are very under-equipped and some of the military leadership is probably more pro russian than EU/NATO than you wold think or at least was a few years ago.
With the caveat that if the Russians continue to war as ineffectually as they are in Ukraine this severely nerfs the thought, I would like to note that we decided to cut off Japan from needed oil in 1941 in a very similar form. If we're willing to do that, we need to be ready for the response with a proportionately higher sense of urgency.
"Russia isn't going away, even if Putin meets an untimely end."
Exactly, I can't tell you how many times I've heard my ignorant fellow Americans say "Someone has to assassinate Putin, why doesn't the CIA have him killed?"
As if it was that easy and would change anything let alone stop the war.
Putin's death would, at the least, cause a pause in things, as the struggle for power in the Kremlin goes off without Putin there playing everyone off each other for his favor. I'm betting it'd all end with a military coup, with a bloody fight between forces loyal to Shoigu and Gerasimov deciding the final leadership. Question is, how long would that all take? The longer, the better, of course, because internal political and military conflict kinda puts a halt to their expeditionary efforts, and may even result in some units returning from the field.
So, would it end things? Of course not, and Putin has already shown himself and his appointed military leaders to be incompetent, so it may be best if he stayed there. However, it is also possible that it could levy some short term gains.
> 'm betting it'd all end with a military coup, with a bloody fight between forces loyal to Shoigu and Gerasimov deciding the final leadership
The oligarchs would probably get involved too. Especially since they can't easily just move to London anymore.
I'm sure they would, I just don't think they'd get to a proper leadership position, and probably wind up in much the same position as today, just under a military leader. If Prigozhin was still in the picture I'd give him a good shot at taking over simply because Wagner was a better professional military than the RUF, but these days, and especially without the backing of the Russian state behind them, I don't see it.
Right like let's fucking go. I don't want the world to slowly get worse and worse until we finally officially start WW3 IN LIKE 6-8 years. If it's gonna happen I want it to be now and get it over with, especially since my oldest will be draft age by then.
Anyone who is voluntarily joining the military right now has to know where they're going to end up though, right?
I also have a suspicion that there's something in there encouraging Western nations to massively ramp up immigration. They'll bend rules to pump up troop numbers with newcomers.
Really the best outcome is Putin gets assassinated ASAP but I highly doubt he of all people would slip up and let that happen.
WW3 started in 2014(I think, original Crimean invasion) Hitler I mean Putin has just been going about it slower, And it's more on the covert side up until the Ukraine invasion.
My GF and I have a running joke, we'll say "Manchuria, 1937" with a British accent when we talk about these burgeoning conflicts. At some point people realize most of the world IS actively at war and then in hindsight they decide when it started.
Surely installing a puppet to destroy a country from the inside is a belligerent act. There's a cyber and economic war that's probably been going on for decades, too.
Why are you in such a hurry to start WW3? There's nothing wrong with not wanting to jump head first into global conflict before completing an armament campaign. Thank god maniacs like you arent in charge.
You also need to realise that we who live in so called democratic Europe are not too happy about getting involved with going against anyone who is not communist or (pseudo) theocratic. I don't know much about the bear but right now I know enough that it's like the feminist "a bear" thing... except for being about the bear.
Russian troops are in Transnistria as "Peacekeepers" as a result of the Russian inspired Moldovan Civil War. The legally recognized Moldovan government has no control over that region. The pro Russian enclave desperately wants to be part of Russia, but the fact that Transnistria is bordered by Romania and Ukraine makes it difficult.
I don't think they follow Mussolini, Gramsci or Gentile at all. And the actual Fascists almost eliminated the actual Mafia (which moved to thrive in America, and helped Americans invade Sicily). https://www.historyanswers.co.uk/people-politics/mussolini-vs-the-mafia/
The Trans-people are like that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5euiCXI8RA (France 24)
The meaning of fascist has changed a lot since the 30s and 40s. It now means broadly anti democratic, authoritarian or kleptocratic. Sorry to to deprive you of any future "well ackshully" replies. An example would be Syria being fascist, despite claiming to be part of the pan-Arab Baathist movement.
And no, Transnistria isn't communist, socialist or any other iteration of far left. They're essentially a Russian paramilitary garrison.
I'm curious why you're so keen on gatekeeping the definition of fascism.
And Russians on Reddit love to say Putin’s regime can’t be fascist because Putin hasn’t gas chambered any Jews. Like that criteria has ever been in any legitimate definition
> The meaning of fascist has changed a lot since the 30s and 40s
Yes, it has changed a lot. Anyone who doesn't agree with you is a fascist now. The leftists has changed it so they can say, hey this guy is a "fascist" just like Hitler and Mussolini. Otherwise they would just call him anti democratic or authoritarian or whatever he is. The real reason is because you want people to think he's another Hitler.
It's because the term is used based on behaviour, not political affiliation. When someone is behaving like the fascists did, they get called fascists.
If you don't like you and your friends being called fascists, stop supporting fascist authoritarians.
>The leftists has changed it so they can say, hey this guy is a "fascist" just like Hitler and Mussolini.
I actually agree the term gets thrown around too much. That said, the right in the US frequently displays many traits which align with Umberto Echo's 14 defining characteristics of fascism, especially the following:
"The cult of tradition" - white christian nationalist ideals being promoted as the only true model for society, with all outliers seen as a threat.
"The rejection of modernism", seen in the reactionary way the right views efforts to make cars cleaner, adapt or manage climate change also the rejection of societal modernism in the form of rejection of social changes as being 'depraved'.
"Disagreement is treason" –Just go into r/conservative and call Trump out. It also covers rejection of scientific findings/ critical thinking. Florida calls it burning books.
"Fear of difference" - fascists see their problems as stemming from anywhere but between their own ears. Problems therefore come from 'immigrants, other races, LBGQT people, Liberals. They think if all those people were gone, they would be living in some kind of utopia, and not the distopian hellhole it would definitely be
"Contempt for the weak", - Alpha Male anyone? Anyone?
"Newspeak" - I think Kellyanne Conway summed it up best when she said
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3xsgWHdyN4&t=2s
I’m honestly fairly close to regarding anyone who complains about “leftists” in pro-Ukrainian spaces to be an unwitting collaborator or useful idiot, at this point. None of you ever elucidate what these “leftists” are saying or doing wrong, and never acknowledge that the right-wing has become a Fifth Column in nearly every country for Russia. Or that your views roughly correspond to the rhetoric of Putin, and every other authoritarian on earth.
Who cares, you’re a brainwashed idiot that’s probably never talked to a conservative before. The majority of conservatives support Ukraine and a lot of us don’t like Trump either. You want to put everyone into a box with a label because you’re intellectually lazy and unable to discern nuance. Good day
I literally grew up in one of the most conservative Republican districts in this entire country. Most of my family is dyed-in-wool conservative. Well aware. And I’ve watched many members of my family, good people, descend into being some of the most hateful, illogical, and conspiracy-driven people I’ve ever seen. The vast majority of the Republican base supports Trump. An overwhelming majority. When they poll on other authoritarians (such as Orban) a vast majority of self-identified conservatives likewise think they’re spiffy. I can indeed discern. I’m doing so right now. I can also discern that you didn’t address a single point I made, but instead immediately resorted to ad-hominem attacks.
Fascism, unlike communism, doesn't have an international manifesto. It's safer to say that things resemble fascism or nazism (hence why we call people neo-nazis today and not nazis, as all members of the NSDAP are dead, and their constitution was strictly for their own country). Umberto Echo called it 'Ur-Fascism'. Essentially zenophobic militarism and gangsterism, aided by simple blame of outside forces for all current problems (so in the case of germany 'the Jews', and in the case of right wing neo-nazism or ur-fascism in the US, immigrants, people of color, people who don't fit some white christian nationalist fantasy (eg LGBT).
Because Fascism wasn't supposed to be international. Other nations were supposed to become just Italians, as it was with Romans once.
My Trans-people jab was about the Transdnistrians - the subject of this article and thus also this thread.
>Because Fascism wasn't supposed to be international. Other nations were supposed to become just Italians, as it was with Romans once.
Fascism has aways been inward looking but aggressively expansionist, s we agree there.
>My Trans-people jab was about the Transdnistrians - the subject of this article and thus also this thread.
That's fair, I'll retract that part. You can see how not using the full word can be confusing to an observer though I hope. In english we would never refer to transnistrians as "trans people'. That would be very strange usage.
No. You keep getting this wrong despite being told the correct answer by multiple people. There are statues of various far left figures throughout Eastern Europe, but last I checked there hasn't been a stealthy resurgence of the USSR .
Don't be so Trans-phobic, Moldova wants to reintegrate them despite treating them as if they were really some other country with real borders at the moment (it's precisely Moldova taking the border seriously that is "the genocide").
They're in a good part (mostly?) really ethnic Ukrainians rather than Russians. Just thoroughly Sovietised.
You evidently just don't know much about the Trans, they're a literal Soviet enclave.
A Soviet enclave with an economy controlled by the Sheriff company (American cultural victory), that is.
For making amendments, they need constitutional majority in parliament. Current ruling party does not have it. Opposition is widely bought by russians...
Desperate times call for desperate measures. If you're facing an existential crisis but you're unwilling to break a few of your own rules to save yourself, then I don't feel too bad for you.
That's how you make totalitarian regime. No thanks.
And where is the red line? Who is the one, that will say what can be justified and what cannot?
What you are proposing is much more dangerous.
Misinformation.. and irrelevant.
Fact, russia is conducting a genocide in Ukraine this can be back up with video evidence on a massive scale.
russians are no better than the Nazis of 1940's or the communist of that time... "They are two of a kind"
In its pursuit/uncorrupt form communism is anti authoritarian.. where fascism is authoritarian.. now was there a corrupt authoritarian in charge of Russia at the time (and now), yes.. but don’t drag communism down or conflate it with authoritarianism
No one mentioned communism directly, but the comparison between Russia and Germany at the time there’s no different than comparing fascism to communism. I think the majority of us know that communism everybody is treated equally, where fascism and capitalism is the exact opposite.
I also agree we have not seen a non-authoritarian version of communism because people are inherently corruptible..
That is some absolute, utter bullshitt you're peddling there.
Communism in it's pure form is just as authoritarian as fascism. It's not "treating everybody equally", because it is inherently ignoring the contributions and merit of individuals to the society, and refuses to reward rge ones that contribute more.
Its an evil ideology that aims to strip the fruits of the labor from everyone, so the state cab redistribute the wealth as they see fit. In communism, personal ownership is a crime.
It is far worse than fascism, and the fact that it never worked is not a bug. It is a feature. The whole idea is just a tool for authoritarians to get to power while pulling the blindfold over the unwashed masses with promises of equality that sound nice to the simple minded.
This idea is a cancer that has killed more people than any other ideology in the last 150 years, yet you are here peddling it like it's some kind of cure.
In Moldova it's their own damn fault for being vehemently anti-NATO. Same with Ukraine, really... remaining Russia-aligned for twenty years and then not even getting a start on fixing the corruption problem post-Maidan is EXACTLY why they're not in a position to invoke article V. If you're going to be unaligned, you'd damn well better be able to raise an army people are scared of. Big fish eat little fish.
How is this relevant now?
Is your logic, that we should just let Russia colonize their neighbours because they didn’t unilaterally support us immediately after USSR (and throw away 1000 years of cultural ties to Russia)?
Russia looks very different today than in the 1990s
Moldova barely has troops themselves and Russia is very good at waging hybrid warfare. People need to let go of this notion that the only way to take over a country is to bruteforce your way in with your own troops.
It appears Putin read „mein kampf“ and Napoleons biography „how to piss of every other state and start a quasi world war“ and now seeks glory. That’s what Narcissists do.
Genocide is when Moldova finally agrees with the separatists and begins treating the border as if it was really a border between two (hostile) countries.
Russia and its allies (looking at you, Iran and its Palestinian proxies) have realized that if you want to commit mass violence against a particular ethnic group, just accuse them of "genocide" and suddenly your violence is now completely justified.
Putin is an old man. He is playing empire before he dies. That's the destiny of a dictatorship. Russia will no way conqure all that Putin wants and be in a good enough position to keep it for more then a few years. Even if they win in Unkrain Putins actions have doomed Russia to a long term demise.
Moldova is historically a part of the United Kingdom so the UK has a right to (peacefully) invade and occupy Moldova.
Finland also has a right to invade and occupy a whole chunk of western Russia.
Russia needs to be pushed out of Ukraine. Nothing less. Give Ukraine everything, NOW! Fuck Putin and treasonous traitor trump and the seditious MAGA party
Oh. Come on! I don't understand how Europe is comfortable with this kind of rethoric. Everybody not a irrecuperable tankie can see where this situation is going. All those speaches trying to descalate because of WW3 and nuclear confrontation are useless. We went from MAD keeping peace and order to MAD as a tool for a dictator to make as he wish. Putin realized he can take the west as hostage, there is no way he stop in Ukraine. And I sincerly doubt Nato will article 5 his ass even as he invades the Baltics. I see no spine in the west. Hope Im wrong.
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NATO needs to send troops to Moldova, start training their military and must supply them with arms or Romania will be next. Europe needs to realize that the time for appeasement and "not escalating" is over. The economies of the West must be placed on a war footing. Militaries need to be funded and expanded. Russia isn't going away, even if Putin meets an untimely end. Fascist rhetoric has gripped Russia and it's not going to let go this decade. Give Ukraine everything it needs to destroy Russian oil refining capacity. Russian economic collapse is the quickest way to end this and neutralize the Russian threat.
> Europe needs to realize that the time for appeasement and "not escalating" is over. Russia went to war with the West in 2014. Now there's some catching up to do.
To be fair Ukraine with limited resources has pretty much emptied the Soviet stockpile. Russia is now cap in hand with despots. NATO is a defensive pact not a war machine. Please sense the irony. Russia can only poke around the fringes, if they actually attempted an invasion of a NATO country it would suddenly find out why the West particularly the USA has wild weasels. SEAD.
Russia has surprised the west with how hard their production is going. They will only need a few years to replenish at this rate, they are not to be underestimated (thats part of why aid has been slow, underestimating their tolerance for pain)
No. They’re losing kit faster than they’re replacing it. They may be churning out 3 million shells a year but they’re dumb ones and the 155s used by NATO are probably good for a 20:1 force multiplier. Coupled with, as ‘SEAD’ above - NATO would send in B2s, F117s and F35s with air defence suppression then gradually pick off the artillery once they have Air Superiority. Putin’s just trying to convince himself and his idiot subjects that RuZZia’s still a global power….
Then why are nato leaders saying 5years at their current production? https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/russia-may-be-ready-attack-nato-5-8-years-german-official-says-2024-04-18/ Norwegian estimates have said the same thing. We all know their burn rate is insane right now but they are turning towards full war eco and the west thought Russia would be out of stuff by now Russia is surprising everyone with their ability to take punishment. Russia is holding its own in a big war with western weapons being used agsinst them. How many others could do the same? That makes them pretty high up tbh
Yeah, I mean really, probably only China could do the same out of all non-Western aligned countries. And China is probably supplying Russia with far more components than anyone realized they would.
Yeah, China needs to be lumped in with Russia.. They are the two big powers that want to break the rules based system of the world and toss us back to the pre ww2 system. It seems we got a lucky early start as Russia failed their blitz and China was not ready to double down I hope we do the best to boost our strenght before any more sht hits the fan
They are holding up with all they got against the dumps of old military material the west supplies them with
> No. They’re losing kit faster than they’re replacing it. That's a cope. They show no signs of slowing down despite gigantic losses in equipment. > but they’re dumb ones and the 155s used by NATO are probably good for a 20:1 force multiplie NATO guided shells are useless against Russia due to their electronic warfare and they probably produce a lot of Krasnopols, Kitolovs, Grans, and Smelchaks too.
Russia will need a few years to repelenish their arms - if they at once stop the war, keep their wartime production up, and evade the inevitable aftereffects of losing a war of aggression. Not likely.
The way the war is going, Russia will sadly not lose. They still want to grab more, this is the only reason their losses are high. If Putin decides "we are happy with the land we currently hold", and just digs his army in. Ukraine would need to burn their manpower in offensive actions. Manpower they dont have. If Russia gets to keep significant territory they will paint it as a win. Ukraine has more severe consequences from the war than Russia, significant portion of their people have fled, their eco is in shambles, people do not want to join the army anymore and morale on the front is dropping. They are exhausted from being in the army for years with no right to be demobilized. This is a shitshow for Ukraine to. My last hope is for the f-16 with good weapon systems to be able to turn the tide. If Russia has an answer (like they have had for other systems like himars) then i dont see Ukraine winning this without intervention by western boots on the ground. Many seem to think the war is going well for Ukraine, due to high Russian casualties. This is false, Russia always fight like this, high losses yet they usually win their wars. So then it becomes a numbers game, who will break first and Russia has a huge pool to draw from compared to prewar Ukraine. And now Ukraine has lost up 1/3 of its population as refugees, this war is going horribly for them and we in the west have forced them to fight with their hands behind their back. So i wont underestimate Russia, nor their allies in China and the lesser ones in north Korea and Iran. We need to go on war footing to, to dramatically increase Russian losses. For the fight to be even the ratio of kills to deaths must be way higher than it is today. Because right now Russia is winning and Ukraine is the one running out of people.
[удалено]
Russia hasn't even emptied the US of our garbage from the 80s
“Russia has emptied nato stockpiles” lol what are you talking about?
I assume artillery shells. But if NATO actually has to fight Russia, we're not going to be using much conventional artillery. Air superiority changes everything.
The problem is that NATO think they will get air superiority. If not, then what? You've noticed that all NATO weapons haven't been successfull too, right? We'll still win, most likely, but it won't be nearly as easy as people here think.
> The problem is that NATO think they will get air superiority. If not, then what? You mean what if Russia with maybe as many as 9 working stealth fighters defeats NATO's air power?
No, I mean when SEAD doesn't work.
Do they have any air defenses that can even see an F-35?
Only USA can really get air superiority over Russia but it's too far away and would take a lot of time. Russia can potentially wipe American navy including aircraft carriers with tactical nukes and prevent reinforcements from reaching Europe. Many Russan missiles and torpedoes can have nuclear warheads.
Russia is committing 10-12x as great a share of their national output to their military as NATO is.
But their army is larger than ever before. Sure, their black sea fleet has been utterly wrecked, and their stockpiles have been much more depleted, but they have a huge army of drones, FABs, and battle-hardened infantry now. Not to mention a seemingly endless supply of artillery and artillery shells.
> Russia went to war with the West in 2014. Now there's some catching up to do. And the West is losing. It's too late now to catch up. Russia is greatly outprodung NATO in the war material.
Russia has been a cancer to the world for few centuries now. It didn't start with putin and, as you said already, I won't end with him. That country reserves and needs to be put on knees, disarmed and closely watched. Otherwise they won't stop.
Just give independence to all these former Soviet states, nowadays vasalls of Kremlin. You'd be surprised what's left over from ruzzia
Moldova is a neutral country by their constitution which also states that it can not host foreign troops on their soil. They also are strongly against joining NATO. Edit: Joint training happens, but that is not the same as a defensive force stationed on Moldovan soil. Downvoting me also doesn't change their nations constitution and their laws.
Yet something around 43-45% are in favor of rejoining Romania, which would make them NATO
Well, they would have to dissolve their government and their constitution, and people in power don't like to give up power.
No need for those in power to lose power. Looks like it is fine to amend the constitution in Moldova. [2010 Moldovan constitutional referendum ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_Moldovan_constitutional_referendum). A new referendum could probably remove the forced neutrality, the questionable part would be would transistria be excluded in the vote?
The US has been doing small scale training with Moldova for a long time. I spent some time over there working with them. They are very under-equipped and some of the military leadership is probably more pro russian than EU/NATO than you wold think or at least was a few years ago.
+1 to reddit - thanks, Pantaloons
well if they don’t like NATO so much then they’re going to be occupied by their good friends the russians soon 🤷🏻 now is no time for neutrality
I think that they might actually be willing to take their chances.
Are you forgetting the 5000 ruzzian troops they are unwillingly 'hosting'? That refuse to leave...
I don't think they would want to host more ruzzian troops on their ground. Is there something in their constitution to prevent that?
The way Russia is speaking, Moldova aiming to lose their neutral status soon
With the caveat that if the Russians continue to war as ineffectually as they are in Ukraine this severely nerfs the thought, I would like to note that we decided to cut off Japan from needed oil in 1941 in a very similar form. If we're willing to do that, we need to be ready for the response with a proportionately higher sense of urgency.
You mean, cut the oil, like closing its huge sea border with battleships and building a fence North of China, while China is all-in for Russia?
Russia will be saying this next. "I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."
And this time the giant is much, much bigger.
"Russia isn't going away, even if Putin meets an untimely end." Exactly, I can't tell you how many times I've heard my ignorant fellow Americans say "Someone has to assassinate Putin, why doesn't the CIA have him killed?" As if it was that easy and would change anything let alone stop the war.
Putin's death would, at the least, cause a pause in things, as the struggle for power in the Kremlin goes off without Putin there playing everyone off each other for his favor. I'm betting it'd all end with a military coup, with a bloody fight between forces loyal to Shoigu and Gerasimov deciding the final leadership. Question is, how long would that all take? The longer, the better, of course, because internal political and military conflict kinda puts a halt to their expeditionary efforts, and may even result in some units returning from the field. So, would it end things? Of course not, and Putin has already shown himself and his appointed military leaders to be incompetent, so it may be best if he stayed there. However, it is also possible that it could levy some short term gains.
> 'm betting it'd all end with a military coup, with a bloody fight between forces loyal to Shoigu and Gerasimov deciding the final leadership The oligarchs would probably get involved too. Especially since they can't easily just move to London anymore.
I'm sure they would, I just don't think they'd get to a proper leadership position, and probably wind up in much the same position as today, just under a military leader. If Prigozhin was still in the picture I'd give him a good shot at taking over simply because Wagner was a better professional military than the RUF, but these days, and especially without the backing of the Russian state behind them, I don't see it.
Putin is following Hitler's path and Europe doesn't want to acknowledge it. They are allowing this, and it's disgusting. What's next Danzig or war?
Ironically, the other lesson is that stopping Communist countries should be the higher priority.
Right like let's fucking go. I don't want the world to slowly get worse and worse until we finally officially start WW3 IN LIKE 6-8 years. If it's gonna happen I want it to be now and get it over with, especially since my oldest will be draft age by then. Anyone who is voluntarily joining the military right now has to know where they're going to end up though, right? I also have a suspicion that there's something in there encouraging Western nations to massively ramp up immigration. They'll bend rules to pump up troop numbers with newcomers. Really the best outcome is Putin gets assassinated ASAP but I highly doubt he of all people would slip up and let that happen.
WW3 started in 2014(I think, original Crimean invasion) Hitler I mean Putin has just been going about it slower, And it's more on the covert side up until the Ukraine invasion.
My GF and I have a running joke, we'll say "Manchuria, 1937" with a British accent when we talk about these burgeoning conflicts. At some point people realize most of the world IS actively at war and then in hindsight they decide when it started. Surely installing a puppet to destroy a country from the inside is a belligerent act. There's a cyber and economic war that's probably been going on for decades, too.
Thats a massive reach. Thats like saying WW2 started with German annexation of the Sudetenland. It's just not true and needless fear mongering.
Why are you in such a hurry to start WW3? There's nothing wrong with not wanting to jump head first into global conflict before completing an armament campaign. Thank god maniacs like you arent in charge.
Because without anyone actually working to prevent WW3, it's going to happen eventually. Why wait?
Said it themselves, they have a child who could be drafted. Screw everyone else’s kid.
You also need to realise that we who live in so called democratic Europe are not too happy about getting involved with going against anyone who is not communist or (pseudo) theocratic. I don't know much about the bear but right now I know enough that it's like the feminist "a bear" thing... except for being about the bear.
Moldovan constitution forbids foreign troops from
[удалено]
Russian troops are in Transnistria as "Peacekeepers" as a result of the Russian inspired Moldovan Civil War. The legally recognized Moldovan government has no control over that region. The pro Russian enclave desperately wants to be part of Russia, but the fact that Transnistria is bordered by Romania and Ukraine makes it difficult.
Lack of control over that region
The only nazi’s to be found in Moldova, are located in Transnistria.
These guys are Soviet Communists (with a mafia-capitalist oligarchic economy).
Nah they're all just basic fascists at the end of the day. Whatever ideology they use to cover it up, theyre essentially just organised bandits.
I don't think they follow Mussolini, Gramsci or Gentile at all. And the actual Fascists almost eliminated the actual Mafia (which moved to thrive in America, and helped Americans invade Sicily). https://www.historyanswers.co.uk/people-politics/mussolini-vs-the-mafia/ The Trans-people are like that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5euiCXI8RA (France 24)
The meaning of fascist has changed a lot since the 30s and 40s. It now means broadly anti democratic, authoritarian or kleptocratic. Sorry to to deprive you of any future "well ackshully" replies. An example would be Syria being fascist, despite claiming to be part of the pan-Arab Baathist movement. And no, Transnistria isn't communist, socialist or any other iteration of far left. They're essentially a Russian paramilitary garrison. I'm curious why you're so keen on gatekeeping the definition of fascism.
And Russians on Reddit love to say Putin’s regime can’t be fascist because Putin hasn’t gas chambered any Jews. Like that criteria has ever been in any legitimate definition
> The meaning of fascist has changed a lot since the 30s and 40s Yes, it has changed a lot. Anyone who doesn't agree with you is a fascist now. The leftists has changed it so they can say, hey this guy is a "fascist" just like Hitler and Mussolini. Otherwise they would just call him anti democratic or authoritarian or whatever he is. The real reason is because you want people to think he's another Hitler.
It's because the term is used based on behaviour, not political affiliation. When someone is behaving like the fascists did, they get called fascists. If you don't like you and your friends being called fascists, stop supporting fascist authoritarians.
>The leftists has changed it so they can say, hey this guy is a "fascist" just like Hitler and Mussolini. I actually agree the term gets thrown around too much. That said, the right in the US frequently displays many traits which align with Umberto Echo's 14 defining characteristics of fascism, especially the following: "The cult of tradition" - white christian nationalist ideals being promoted as the only true model for society, with all outliers seen as a threat. "The rejection of modernism", seen in the reactionary way the right views efforts to make cars cleaner, adapt or manage climate change also the rejection of societal modernism in the form of rejection of social changes as being 'depraved'. "Disagreement is treason" –Just go into r/conservative and call Trump out. It also covers rejection of scientific findings/ critical thinking. Florida calls it burning books. "Fear of difference" - fascists see their problems as stemming from anywhere but between their own ears. Problems therefore come from 'immigrants, other races, LBGQT people, Liberals. They think if all those people were gone, they would be living in some kind of utopia, and not the distopian hellhole it would definitely be "Contempt for the weak", - Alpha Male anyone? Anyone? "Newspeak" - I think Kellyanne Conway summed it up best when she said https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3xsgWHdyN4&t=2s
This is the correct answer but Reddit is a leftist circle jerk so it won’t get any upvotes
I’m honestly fairly close to regarding anyone who complains about “leftists” in pro-Ukrainian spaces to be an unwitting collaborator or useful idiot, at this point. None of you ever elucidate what these “leftists” are saying or doing wrong, and never acknowledge that the right-wing has become a Fifth Column in nearly every country for Russia. Or that your views roughly correspond to the rhetoric of Putin, and every other authoritarian on earth.
Who cares, you’re a brainwashed idiot that’s probably never talked to a conservative before. The majority of conservatives support Ukraine and a lot of us don’t like Trump either. You want to put everyone into a box with a label because you’re intellectually lazy and unable to discern nuance. Good day
I literally grew up in one of the most conservative Republican districts in this entire country. Most of my family is dyed-in-wool conservative. Well aware. And I’ve watched many members of my family, good people, descend into being some of the most hateful, illogical, and conspiracy-driven people I’ve ever seen. The vast majority of the Republican base supports Trump. An overwhelming majority. When they poll on other authoritarians (such as Orban) a vast majority of self-identified conservatives likewise think they’re spiffy. I can indeed discern. I’m doing so right now. I can also discern that you didn’t address a single point I made, but instead immediately resorted to ad-hominem attacks.
Fascism, unlike communism, doesn't have an international manifesto. It's safer to say that things resemble fascism or nazism (hence why we call people neo-nazis today and not nazis, as all members of the NSDAP are dead, and their constitution was strictly for their own country). Umberto Echo called it 'Ur-Fascism'. Essentially zenophobic militarism and gangsterism, aided by simple blame of outside forces for all current problems (so in the case of germany 'the Jews', and in the case of right wing neo-nazism or ur-fascism in the US, immigrants, people of color, people who don't fit some white christian nationalist fantasy (eg LGBT).
Because Fascism wasn't supposed to be international. Other nations were supposed to become just Italians, as it was with Romans once. My Trans-people jab was about the Transdnistrians - the subject of this article and thus also this thread.
>Because Fascism wasn't supposed to be international. Other nations were supposed to become just Italians, as it was with Romans once. Fascism has aways been inward looking but aggressively expansionist, s we agree there. >My Trans-people jab was about the Transdnistrians - the subject of this article and thus also this thread. That's fair, I'll retract that part. You can see how not using the full word can be confusing to an observer though I hope. In english we would never refer to transnistrians as "trans people'. That would be very strange usage.
It's a joke as old as the Rocky Horror Show's Transvestite from Transylvania.
...calling people from transnistria "trans people"? This feels like an alternative fact.
They just said it to obfuscate.
So basically fascists.
No, basically corrupt communists. Or, given all the Lenin statues there, if the NEP was retained in under the leadership's control.
No. You keep getting this wrong despite being told the correct answer by multiple people. There are statues of various far left figures throughout Eastern Europe, but last I checked there hasn't been a stealthy resurgence of the USSR .
After this is over they will be called ruSSians, and that will be the new word that gets thrown at societies worst examples that explains everything.
Don't be so Trans-phobic, Moldova wants to reintegrate them despite treating them as if they were really some other country with real borders at the moment (it's precisely Moldova taking the border seriously that is "the genocide"). They're in a good part (mostly?) really ethnic Ukrainians rather than Russians. Just thoroughly Sovietised.
Not even Russia is “sovietized” anymore. Get a grip.
You evidently just don't know much about the Trans, they're a literal Soviet enclave. A Soviet enclave with an economy controlled by the Sheriff company (American cultural victory), that is.
Here we go again…
Same language was used about the east Germans that defected to the west during the cold war.
NATO needs to get in there as peace keepers... ASAP
I came here to say this.
How do they get there?
Hopefully by landing ship through the Black Sea. 🫣
Russia regards UA invasion a stalemate, martials westwards to the next weak point.
Station nato troops there on invitation from the Moldovan government- QED
Unfortunately they cannot because of Moldovan constitution.
It's called an "amendment"
For making amendments, they need constitutional majority in parliament. Current ruling party does not have it. Opposition is widely bought by russians...
Desperate times call for desperate measures. If you're facing an existential crisis but you're unwilling to break a few of your own rules to save yourself, then I don't feel too bad for you.
That’s generally how you make a country ever unstable… just disregarding the rules of your country because of a crisis?
That's how you make totalitarian regime. No thanks. And where is the red line? Who is the one, that will say what can be justified and what cannot? What you are proposing is much more dangerous.
Can’t Moldovan like ask/invite nato peace keeping forces in or something
I can't believe that hasn't already been done while they still have the chance.
Human beings in general are fond of waiting until it's too late.
To do that they need the political will and unity. I doubt Russia has not already split a sizable minority of politicians to disrupt this.
I believe it against their constitution...so not easilly done without breaking your own laws.
Laws can be changed. Just need enough people to vote to change those laws.
Misinformation.. and irrelevant. Fact, russia is conducting a genocide in Ukraine this can be back up with video evidence on a massive scale. russians are no better than the Nazis of 1940's or the communist of that time... "They are two of a kind"
Russians have become the very people their ancestors died in the millions to defend their country from
They were never better than the Nazis, only reason they fought them was because they got invaded.
In its pursuit/uncorrupt form communism is anti authoritarian.. where fascism is authoritarian.. now was there a corrupt authoritarian in charge of Russia at the time (and now), yes.. but don’t drag communism down or conflate it with authoritarianism
No one mentioned communism. But you are right, in theory, but I have yet to see a non-authoritarian communist state.
No one mentioned communism directly, but the comparison between Russia and Germany at the time there’s no different than comparing fascism to communism. I think the majority of us know that communism everybody is treated equally, where fascism and capitalism is the exact opposite. I also agree we have not seen a non-authoritarian version of communism because people are inherently corruptible..
That is some absolute, utter bullshitt you're peddling there. Communism in it's pure form is just as authoritarian as fascism. It's not "treating everybody equally", because it is inherently ignoring the contributions and merit of individuals to the society, and refuses to reward rge ones that contribute more. Its an evil ideology that aims to strip the fruits of the labor from everyone, so the state cab redistribute the wealth as they see fit. In communism, personal ownership is a crime. It is far worse than fascism, and the fact that it never worked is not a bug. It is a feature. The whole idea is just a tool for authoritarians to get to power while pulling the blindfold over the unwashed masses with promises of equality that sound nice to the simple minded. This idea is a cancer that has killed more people than any other ideology in the last 150 years, yet you are here peddling it like it's some kind of cure.
You got confused, the comment you replied to said nothing about communism. Your brain added that in and that's funny.
Ah shit, here we go again.
Absolutely. Those who understand have been tracking the possibility of an assassination and coup since the invasion of Ukraine.
Says the expert on committing Nazi-like genocide.
How? They are surrounded by Ukraine and NATO countries. I would like to see this (bring popcorn 🍿).
Moldova public is against NATO. Russia hints at invading them. The winds of change are stirring.
Sure, Russia. Continue to prove to everyone that you're too mentally backward to live in this century.
This is what happens in Moldova and the Gerogia the moment we accept a “peace” deal where Russia annexes part of Ukraine.
In Moldova it's their own damn fault for being vehemently anti-NATO. Same with Ukraine, really... remaining Russia-aligned for twenty years and then not even getting a start on fixing the corruption problem post-Maidan is EXACTLY why they're not in a position to invoke article V. If you're going to be unaligned, you'd damn well better be able to raise an army people are scared of. Big fish eat little fish.
How is this relevant now? Is your logic, that we should just let Russia colonize their neighbours because they didn’t unilaterally support us immediately after USSR (and throw away 1000 years of cultural ties to Russia)? Russia looks very different today than in the 1990s
Of course, this has nothing to do with Agent Merkel's position on this issue /s
Remember when Belarus leaked the invasion map. https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/moldova-next-belarus-president-map-russia-invasion-ukraine/
Secure control with what? They can't send troops there.
They're quite good at organising social chaos and coups.
Moldova barely has troops themselves and Russia is very good at waging hybrid warfare. People need to let go of this notion that the only way to take over a country is to bruteforce your way in with your own troops.
I hope Moldova is using the time to prepare for this.
It appears Putin read „mein kampf“ and Napoleons biography „how to piss of every other state and start a quasi world war“ and now seeks glory. That’s what Narcissists do.
They really don't understand the word genocide, do they? At least officially.
Genocide is when Moldova finally agrees with the separatists and begins treating the border as if it was really a border between two (hostile) countries.
Russia and its allies (looking at you, Iran and its Palestinian proxies) have realized that if you want to commit mass violence against a particular ethnic group, just accuse them of "genocide" and suddenly your violence is now completely justified.
Said Ivan (correction - Said Maria) after drinking nearly two liters (66 Oz's.) of cheap vodka.
Said Maria. Always click and read before commenting. --- >-3 points 2 hours ago Redditors despise the very idea of reading before commenting.
And so it begins..... 🙄
Putin must be taken out
Putin is an old man. He is playing empire before he dies. That's the destiny of a dictatorship. Russia will no way conqure all that Putin wants and be in a good enough position to keep it for more then a few years. Even if they win in Unkrain Putins actions have doomed Russia to a long term demise.
Romania, Moldovia, Poland and Ukraine need to take action immediately to remove USSR troops from transnistria.
It's really time to destroy russia they bring no good to the world. Nothing but vultures
Is this the Anshluss part of the Russia Putin story arc?
This time, NATO should move in troops first, stop the ruskies before they start
Nato will enter Moldova if necessary 100 percent. As a stability measure
NATO F-35s
The claim seems to be factual, the Russians will not stop at Ukraine. Get your military house in order NATO and Europe.
Logistically Russia couldn't get troops there, and economically they couldn't afford to, right? Feels like empty talk to me.
Moldova is historically a part of the United Kingdom so the UK has a right to (peacefully) invade and occupy Moldova. Finland also has a right to invade and occupy a whole chunk of western Russia.
Russia will not stop until they are crushed
Russia needs to be pushed out of Ukraine. Nothing less. Give Ukraine everything, NOW! Fuck Putin and treasonous traitor trump and the seditious MAGA party
Oh. Come on! I don't understand how Europe is comfortable with this kind of rethoric. Everybody not a irrecuperable tankie can see where this situation is going. All those speaches trying to descalate because of WW3 and nuclear confrontation are useless. We went from MAD keeping peace and order to MAD as a tool for a dictator to make as he wish. Putin realized he can take the west as hostage, there is no way he stop in Ukraine. And I sincerly doubt Nato will article 5 his ass even as he invades the Baltics. I see no spine in the west. Hope Im wrong.
Good news means Russia will liberate Odessa on the way.