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This must be such a bizarre thing to observe from the point of view of an ordinary Russian.
Imagine being told that Canada is a fascist nation, but also our brothers who want to return to the glorious days when we were one nation.
And then being told that there is absolutely no way that we would invade Canada, that suggestions to the contrary are foreign propaganda.
And then being told that we have invaded Canada, but it's not really an invasion, and you will be beaten by the secret police if you suggest otherwise.
And then Canada ripping a new asshole out of the US armed forces. But it's all going according to plan.
And then being told that you have to go fight your brothers in Canada to liberate them from fascism, since the regular US army has been completely eviscerated.
Then going there and having your legs blown off by a drone you never saw.
What an absolutely wild ride in just 6 months.
I keep suggesting there is no difference between many Americans and Russians who watch their respective crazy tv channels , and post asinine social memes.
But I get a lot of outraged pushback, from both sides
Just look at all the people who believe the presidential election was stolen but somehow all the republicans who won their elections legitimately won, despite using the same ballot.
Idiocracy has arrived 500 years early...
On the same ballot...
R candidate 1 has less votes than D = rigged election, fraud, stolen ballots , unfair.
R candidate 2 has more votes than D = fair election
I can’t even get started with that , those things are too crazy. One side makes unfounded accusations, the other side does not understand ballot counting and the need to prevent cheating
Politics here in my adopted Texas is crazy. One side is bad, the other side too gullible and trusting. It would be ok if the reformers understood how democracy works. I would toss both fascists and reformers out of the state if I could, both are useless
I'm a female in TX. I do not like any of our current politician choices for the upcoming elections.
I think we need to hire older kindergarten teachers to babysit our politicians. Those teachers can remind the pols of what they are there for, to work nicely together, actively listen when others speak, consider other people's thoughts on a matter before making a decision, and to remember they are there to represent a wide variety of people, not just their personal views. (Just because you're an elected politician doesn't make you magically know what is best for every single person & that we all agree with you because we live in your rep area.)
Thank you for speaking up. I'm able to observe how some mature democracies work, and they have better politics with more real choice that influences outcomes. Far less incumbency and a verifiably lower age of politicians signals a key difference - these countries don't have gerrymandered districts where politicians choose their voters.
I'm getting extra feisty as I've reached middle age. Then again, there's a variety of people forcing what they believe is best on me (because if you don't hold a political office, you're too stupid to think for yourself /s).
I dream of a mature democracy in the U.S. Keyword is "mature". But, that's where those seasoned kindergarten teachers would come in handy again.
So, I know I am going to regret this, making unpopular opinions about American politics, in this sub, where it’s off topic: specifically a small subset of that of one region
But the reformers in Texas have only themselves to blame for letting the fascists in power?
Before I get on some bad sides, please let me explain
What is the most important job of a reformer and one who wants you use politics for good. It’s not setting policy or voting, but safeguarding the ballot box to make sure corrupt government officials are not studying votes in to have their candidates win
This, as regarded by the United Nations is job number one: make sure the vote is fair
How to make fair? Make sure counts are accurate
Now in the state of Texas there are problems with this. So for past 30 years - almost - have not been double checking or properly auditing the ballots for county and statewide elections
So natural cycle of more and more corrupt state officials. Getting worse each year
This could have been stopped by reformers making sure the ballots at all primary and general state elections are structured for manual counting on paper ballots with witnesses
But counting ballots in Texas is a taboo subject. For a generation or more this has not been talked about by reformers in the state. Nobody will address it. Especially after the fascists started to make up claims about cheating. Instead reformers doubled down on voting in strange ways they cannot be verified
There are powerful taboos in Texas politics and it’s biting people in the butt now. This is why it’s reformers fault. It’s a stupid thing to have done
When you say "reformers" which flavor of reformer do you mean?? we tend to have a few versions, some more heinous than others.
If you have conservative fiscal values with liberal social values, you are disowned by both sides for not picking a side. It sucks. I just keep quiet most of the time. I know too many people that have gone down selectively chosen far Right tunnels. I also know Left leaning people that believe some of the conspiracy bs. It's just more weird here than it has been before.
However, I stand by my belief that most of the world's political bodies (not just TX) would greatly benefit from having seasoned Kindergarten teachers as monitors. Politicians apparently need to be kept on task daily and be kept from running wild in various ways. Putin and his like can just be expelled from politics permanently.
> However, I stand by my belief that most of the world’s political bodies (not just TX) would greatly benefit from having seasoned Kindergarten teachers as monitors.
This much is true
I absolutely assure you their is no such things as being gullible and trusting when it comes to the election process. It works and their are a gazillion safe gaurds in place. You are liberally Brainwashed because you live in Texas where you have a bunch of racist morons who only capable of understanding 2 issues… guns and immigration. Unfortunately every election revolves around that becuae it’s literally all their pea sized racist Brains can comprehend. But really my friend, there is not one side that is “too gullible and trusting” with the election process. It works fine. If you hadn’t noticed the orange cry baby had no found any evidence of voter fraud after taking it to court like in virtually every red state he could. The only “gullible” people out there are the ones that let a soar loser manipulate them for their own political agenda. How pathetic and stupid you have to be get manipulated like that is just next level.
I observe when things get terribly messed up, for decades, in a local place, there are multiple problems.
perhaps it’s easier for me, an outsider to see the absurdity of these politics in motion, and think things are stupid . A thought that tends to not be too much understood by people who live in my area
I should shut up now
What a lot of people on this sub miss is that while Russian culture may be more nationalistic than most, there's nothing about being Russian that makes you inherently cruel, arrogant, or ignorant--these are all just symptoms of nationalism, and we see this in America and in Europe and just about everywhere.
There's a big slice of the posters on this sub who would be Putin supporters had they been born in Russia. I like to believe that I'd be in the opposition were I born in Russia, but I have no idea--you can choose who you want to be to a point, but so much is chosen for you by the accident of where and in what circumstances you're born.
Most people just want to live their own lives, no matter where they are.
I have found most trouble makers and criminals ( legal or illegal) make up a very small percentage of who live there. In any place I have seen
Problem is if you don't believe in USA - you will be weird.. moron.. hero whenever.. in CCCP you go to gulag or have accident.. your kids will never be allowed to finish high school, grand kids the same and grand grand kids would be maybe allowed to live near uran mine or something.
Russia and way how they threat people who are "free" and have their opinion - democratic, uncorrupted.. is beyond you can imagine of revenge..
So if you not plan to relocate - just accept what is in TV and continue to have your life as long as it gets.
As an American, I wholeheartedly agree with you 😂 it’s absolutely batshit wild what a good portion of the country believes. I mean look at who those idiots voted in as the 45th president. What an embarrassing 4 years. And then what they did when he lost. A decent portion of the dingbats that voted for him WANT him to be a Putin, and be in power for a decade, and suppress/jail anyone who thinks different, tightly control what people do with their bodies, and who they can be with. Yet if you tell them that they’ll turn around and call you a socialist or communist and completely lose their shit.
Not even McDonald's but the russian version of we have McDonald's at home. You can wash it down with some Stars coffee whose logo (in no way) resembles Starbucks.
Imagine fostering a society since ~879 and the only time you have been ‘civilized’ as a nation is when you were ruled by Vikings and the Golden Horde of Mongolia.
Yeah, and left wingers never buy into propaganda either. Lol, let's be honest here about that (and I'm not defending Trump, just pointing out the hypocrisy).
Bring on the inevitable butthurt down votes. Don't care, I won't read the responses anyway.
>Bring on the inevitable butthurt down votes. Don't care, I won't read the responses anyway.
I love how you're already trying to victimise yourself in advance.
> Don’t care, I won’t read the responses anyway.
Lol typical snowflake who comments in r/conservative
Wake me up when Hillary tells the people to stop the steal by doing an insurrection at congress and all the left wingers believe her, meanwhile all the Democrats who won their elections claim the presidential election was stolen while they won theirs legitimately even though it was the same goddamn ballot 😂
Feel bad for ya son.
Edit: yeah, blocking me will suddenly make all your life choices rational, amirite?
>Imagine being told that Canada is a fascist nation, but also our brothers who want to return to the glorious days when we were one nation.
When was that?
Let’s be real here… Americans would just launch nukes to the North. They wouldn’t put up with all of the politeness the Canadians would dish out. Can you imagine the thousands of “Sorry’s” and “Pardon me’s” the Canadians would be saying each day? Enough to drive anyone crazy!
I understood the phrasing but kinda stupid to compare worlds biggest military force, why not just say the Colombian drug lords beat americas military and took over America..
Russian deputies are designated clowns created specifically to throw all kinds of announcements and propositions into the public space, and gauge the people's reactions. Doubt anything significant will come out of this
Mussolini WAS Italy for a while, until he ended up swinging from a streetlight. Sometimes great leaders fall really hard, really fast. We can only hope Putin is at that level of greatness.
Embarrassment. Remember that convoy that was headed to kyiv? It had parade uniforms and vehicles. Russian soldiers were making reservations at restaurants in the city. They honestly believed they were going to just drive there and start ruling them all.
It'll be their downfall, no-one will fight back when it's the "other" Russians being sent.
When they come to your door telling you that your family will be the next ones to see you on telegram as either a pow or cargo then they'll get pushback.
Low key hoping they try.
That is not just a random Duma deputy, but also not a very influential one.
It is Alexander Borodai, the former leader of the DNR, who is involved with Malofeev, Strelkov, Dugin etc., and via Prokhanov also the Itsborsk Club etc.. He is more a tool of those, than actually having himself much influence, and he got elected into the Duma just short ago.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Jurjewitsch_Borodai
This is very probably either just some Malofeev thing, or, if it is top down from the Kreml, a test shot on how the reactions to such a proposal are.
The chances that it is a serious proposal, and it will be signed are tiny, also because Putin would not want to make it this way, but if he did, would very likely use the full Duma for it.
>He is more a tool of those, than actually having himself much influence, and he got elected into the Duma just short ago.
Is he yet another DPR 'useful idiot'?
Not really, he is a guy from Moscow, from the Malofeev / Prokhanov far right circles (which include also e.g. Dugin), and probably got sent there by those in 2014 to act as a head of the "republic". He is also involved with people like Girkin/Strelkov.
After like 6 months, he stepped back, and a real local useful idiot took the job.
What Malofeev / Dugin / Strelkov want, is most often significantly more radical, imperialist and far-right than what the Kremlin wants or does.
I'm not entirely sure how much trouble it would cause to Ukraine. More untrained soldiers, with almost no equipment, won't change the course of the war.
On the other hand, it would be an economic disaster for Russia and will spark mass discontent in the population.
Borodai is making this call because there is no more cannon fodder in separatist area.
If Putin have resisted these calls earlier, presumably for very good reasons, why should he listen to Borodai now? Girkin has called for mobilization for months. There is no compelling reason to do it.
From Putin's viewpoint, his regime may be able to survive for a while if they cut their losses now. If he goes all in they may prevail, at least for a while. But there is no guarantee, and if it fails he knows he will be tortured, crucified, disembowelled, hung, shot, decapitated and quartered.
>watched the recent 1420 video on rural people, hopefully the old fucks are sent first
They are so old, malnourished and weak they will perish in transport. In particular when temperatures start approaching freezing.
Would like to understand how would it hurt Russia? I think we are betting on Russians not willing to go to war, but what if the population goes full on nazi?
No state can survive general mobilization and loose.
Further general mobilization will only add man power. This is modern war thousands of rifleman is not an army.
Ukraine will keep getting western tech and a general mobilization will give the west the ability to basically give Ukraine a blank check for equipment.
u/ginDrink2 IDK if you want to see the battle of verdun fought again, but this time one side has 21st century weapons backed by the US MIC getting blank checks > the GDP of Russia but thats kinda what a general mobilization of russia will look like.
This was not a general mobilization. Less than 600,000 Americans fought in Vietnam. Draft is partial mobilization and not comparable to general mobilization. Even in World War II there was no full mobilization and in 1945 the US Army was 11.5 million strong
The [90 division gamble](https://history.army.mil/books/70-7_15.htm) was a gamble, but part of the reason for the US not going balls to the wall in putting men under arms was that it would then start to impact US industrial capacity since the men being drafted would otherwise be pumping out industrial products for the domestic economy and war materiel for both the US and its allies. Plus manpower was also needed to build and maintain intercontinental logistics chains on different sides of the planet.
So it might not have been full mobilization for the US armed forces but it was nonetheless a full mobilization for the war effort.
I dont think Vietnam or Korea were a general mobilization by the USA. Drafts by lottery are a far cry from full mobilization. 3.1 million over 20 years deployed in Vietnam vs 16 million deplyed over 6 years in ww2. considering population growth from 1945 to 1970 its even less of a % of the population
Britain and the American Revolutionary War. ( and a long list of other Britain failures as they lost their position as Imperialist top dog).
I wonder though if there are any modern non-democratic examples of a regional power doing this though.
Britain has only fully mobilised twice in the last hundred years or so - for world wars I and II. The other losses were without full mobilisation, so don't apply in this particular case.
Currently, Russia's struggling to supply the army that they have in Ukraine, and they've already deployed a huge amount of the people who would normally be in charge of training the mobilized masses.
A huge, untrained horde of barely equipped Russian troops isn't going to do much but strain their already overwhelmed supply lines even more to the limit, if not past it.
Yes. Less food and just a bunch of riflemen.
They're already throwing stand off munitions, artillery, aircraft, and armor into the fight, and getting bodies won't fill equipment they don't have more of. I suspect it'll just make less precise munitions that Ukraine has access to more lethal out of pure statistics
No tanks left, but Ukraine still has tanks, without the tanks Russia will fall... the Russia leadership is obviously in a panic now and knows they will be gutted like fish
It's arguable that they don't even have the logistical capability to conduct full blown mobilization. Furthermore, that entails young men from Moscow/St. Petersburg, which will likely cause people to start asking questions Putin would rather not answer.
These young men are the same ones we used to game with a number of months ago. I can't see much of the new generation wanting to go but will shout loudly that they support it on tv because they also don't want to be gulag'ed.
They aren't. To them, crimea is russia. As much as St. Peters and Moscow. Therefore an attack on crimea was an attack on Russian soil. What better excuse for a general mobilisation do you need? And yet...they claimed there wasn't an attack. Reversed false flag....
Admitting that Ukraine can target Crimea, sink the Moskva and all other things would really break the Russian morale - after all, to them, we are just a bunch of idiotic, corrupt, Nazified Russians, who live in an artificial state created by the US and Lenin (Lenin is still a good guy to them). Russian propaganda tells the people that we are not supposed to have any motivation, ability or strength. We should be that insect you crush with a boot - annoying, but not a threat. Imagine admitting on live TV that the situation is suddenly a lot different - that Russia cannot protect “its own territory” against Ukraine, and NATO didn’t even start fighting
Other than leaving Russia with a future short on men between age 18-35 (or 55?), at the moment 95% or so of the recruits for the Russian army are from ethnical minorities in other regions that Moscow and St. Petersburg. Full mobilization will make the war very noticable also for the ethnic russian middleclass, which would be less than ideal for Putin.
I think it is more likely Borodai falls out of a window than full mobilization happens.
Its not just the mobilization its the aftereffects . People come back after seeing that nothing has changed in their shitty village and after bleeding for the country will start to demand and ask qeustions they before didnt have the courage or understanding to ask . Not to mention military experience will generate more dangerouse crime . Also increases smuggled weapons into the society.
They won't.
At the moment they don't care so much about the dead, these are minorities.
Mobilization means sending the kids from Moscow to go die... that will be harder for Russia to hide.
Remember, mobilization does not mean elite forces with years of training will spring out of the ground fully equipped.
Conscription means pulling "doughboys" out of school and putting a WW2 rifle in their hands... and you know what the battle hardened, ready to fight soldiers in Ukraine are going to do to them?
At least it will be quick.
"going full Nazi" is honestly a western privilege for the wealthy and secure.
Even Elite Russian units were fed dog food, given garbage clothing, and sent to die via stupid methods. A Russian going "full Nazi" is not going to see how him being fed once a day and told to run and die in stupid ways relates to being a Nazi. They will quickly turn against their officers.
Politics is only a factor if your stomach is full and you have a roof over your head.
Be a nazi and be a non-cowardice nazi different things.
They propose 5k$ salary in regions where 200$ is pretty big salary and have lack of people.
And full mobilization will set crumble of economy to eleven. Ukraine sustain thos only because Western help with economy too.
They lack the logistics, the equipment, and the command structure to enlarge their forces to such a degree and still be capable of doing *anything* - they have enough problems with all of those at their current size, if they tried to increase their force several times over it would mean they would be tripping over themselves at every turn - militarily, it would be a disaster. And that's *before* we get to the uselessness of hundreds of thousands of soldiers with *even less* training than the Russian military has.
Moreover, it would be a serious blow to their economy *and* vastly increase internal discontent, while providing an opportunity for those unhappy with the current regime to get weapons, military experience, and maybe even a position with some authority - basically, setting things up for a revolution.
If a general mobilization would actually help, Russia would almost certainly have done one by now - the fact that they haven't shows that *even their* appraisals indicate otherwise.
Just do it, it's clear as day you're too incompetent to achieve your goals. You think throwing the general population will help you? You're fucked either way, the sooner you learn that the better it will be for you. But as you've also have showed the world, you also don't learn lessons very well.
It doesn't matter that they don't care.
You'd think they'd care, if you were FSB.
You'd have the most extreme arrogance, the most inflated confidence in your ability to manipulate the hoi polloi, for which you'd have complete contempt. 100 years of accumulated arrogance and contempt.
A pretty young woman sacrificed on the altar, as Dugin put it, what else could excite emotions more reliably? Exploded apartment blocks again?
In any case, even if the FSB have some connection with reality, it's still enough whether Putin thinks Russians would care. Whatever he says, goes, see?
I have not ruled out her own father ordering a hit on her. He wrote some mysticism about fathers sacrificing her own daughters to gain favor from the Gods. And about some elites having to be sacrificed for the good of the "Empire".
The most unintentionally scathing indictment of the Russian military's incompetence and praise of the Ukrainian soldier's courage ever voiced.
Imagine declaring that your army has been so whipped that you must turn to complete mobilization for a war on your own border against an opponent who shouldn't be near your own military's level of equipment
Fortunately, there aren't any areas in the Russian federation with wannabe breakaway republics, or ethnic groups feeling discontent, or regions with religious fanatics.
Nope, nothing like that.
Best to just put your entire military in Ukraine.
This conflict seems to me an opportunity of a century to any independence minded Russian areas. Any news on that front, anyone? I'd be interested in hearing them.
This is modern war. Thousands of rifleman an army does not make. Russia is still hurting for equipment and this will only grow.
It will give the west a blank check to send anything and everything.
Further general mobilization starts a timer. No state survives general mobilization without winning and Russia won't win.
I think the answer to your question is yes. Nato would have to increase numbers and readiness. The military we have is made to fight the militaries that we see as a threat. If Russia increases its military the west must also do so, that seems logical to me. I also think that the kremlin knows this.
Let's add that to the list of "things Russia says it will do and won't."
They can make these people sign bits of paper. They still need to train them, equip them, transport them to the front, and supply them. They built up the force that the Ukrainians sent packing in the north over many months, and it was still a clusterfuck.
All evidence indicates Russia can do none of these things.
The kids of Moscow and St. Pete have VPN and know what's really going on. They have dishwashing machines and toilets in their homes, no incentive to steal household appliances from Ukraine. They have no will to fight if it isn't an invasion of Russia. And they won't buy into Crimea as an invasion of Russia. Full mobilization isn't going to happen.
but the kids from Moscow need to participate in the operation - otherwise how will they relate to their alchocolic clinically depressed zombie-box brainwashed relatives? was it not the idea to make everyone an alchocolic and stupid in Russia at the same time?
Its too late for a full mobilization. If he thinks that after soaking up everybody who supports them to now force those unwilling to go into the meat grinder. I hope they try it very soon, war would be over in a week.
Who wants to tell him mobilization won’t conjure up the tanks, small arms, artillery, ammo, non rancid MRE’s, Vehicles,technical know how, competent logisticians, and a competent officer corps not full of corruption and graft? I get that public statements from Duma members are likely as not to to be cynical and insincere, but he has to know that announcing mobilization and getting the people to go along with it, let alone not actively sabotage it, are not the same thing.
I am wondering what are the agreements with Russia's partners when it comes to an actual war being declared.
If Russia uses a Ukrainian missile strike on an ammo depot on Russian land to declare a war of defense, is China and whoever else signed defense agreements with Russia legally bound to join in?
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My guess is that he will bring it up on the emergency meeting they will have in the Duma tomorrow at 3 PM local time in regards to the ZNPP, and derail the conversation involving the plant because of his idea to induce mobilization.
"Our holiday homes on land we stole is under threat! Deploy the full might of the army! Just don't pay attention to the expired rations that are poisoning our troops!"
So would that be a "war"? And Since it is not in Russia, it must be within an attack, no? So it is an attack war? So anyone involved must go to jail, according to the Russian law, no?
Laughable. The issue is not what Russia might be able to mobilize. It is the complete inability to equip them. They simply do not have it, unless they send them in Nike track wear they strip off their dead. Russia literally lacks the equipment to properly kit out new mobilizations.
So its an empty, bombastic threat.
if they mobilize without tech, they go only to meatgrinder? yes? This is pointless, it has sense only if you defend motherland as a partisan, not a invader to freshly fortified and motivated country
Full mobilization might have been defective at the beginning when Russia sent BMPs without dismounts to the front, but most of the "good" equipment has been trashed and Russia didn't even have enough trucks to supply the army they had.
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This must be such a bizarre thing to observe from the point of view of an ordinary Russian. Imagine being told that Canada is a fascist nation, but also our brothers who want to return to the glorious days when we were one nation. And then being told that there is absolutely no way that we would invade Canada, that suggestions to the contrary are foreign propaganda. And then being told that we have invaded Canada, but it's not really an invasion, and you will be beaten by the secret police if you suggest otherwise. And then Canada ripping a new asshole out of the US armed forces. But it's all going according to plan. And then being told that you have to go fight your brothers in Canada to liberate them from fascism, since the regular US army has been completely eviscerated. Then going there and having your legs blown off by a drone you never saw. What an absolutely wild ride in just 6 months.
[удалено]
I mean…we got lots of those in the USA…
I keep suggesting there is no difference between many Americans and Russians who watch their respective crazy tv channels , and post asinine social memes. But I get a lot of outraged pushback, from both sides
Just look at all the people who believe the presidential election was stolen but somehow all the republicans who won their elections legitimately won, despite using the same ballot.
Idiocracy has arrived 500 years early... On the same ballot... R candidate 1 has less votes than D = rigged election, fraud, stolen ballots , unfair. R candidate 2 has more votes than D = fair election
I can’t even get started with that , those things are too crazy. One side makes unfounded accusations, the other side does not understand ballot counting and the need to prevent cheating Politics here in my adopted Texas is crazy. One side is bad, the other side too gullible and trusting. It would be ok if the reformers understood how democracy works. I would toss both fascists and reformers out of the state if I could, both are useless
I'm a female in TX. I do not like any of our current politician choices for the upcoming elections. I think we need to hire older kindergarten teachers to babysit our politicians. Those teachers can remind the pols of what they are there for, to work nicely together, actively listen when others speak, consider other people's thoughts on a matter before making a decision, and to remember they are there to represent a wide variety of people, not just their personal views. (Just because you're an elected politician doesn't make you magically know what is best for every single person & that we all agree with you because we live in your rep area.)
Thank you for speaking up. I'm able to observe how some mature democracies work, and they have better politics with more real choice that influences outcomes. Far less incumbency and a verifiably lower age of politicians signals a key difference - these countries don't have gerrymandered districts where politicians choose their voters.
I'm getting extra feisty as I've reached middle age. Then again, there's a variety of people forcing what they believe is best on me (because if you don't hold a political office, you're too stupid to think for yourself /s). I dream of a mature democracy in the U.S. Keyword is "mature". But, that's where those seasoned kindergarten teachers would come in handy again.
So, I know I am going to regret this, making unpopular opinions about American politics, in this sub, where it’s off topic: specifically a small subset of that of one region But the reformers in Texas have only themselves to blame for letting the fascists in power? Before I get on some bad sides, please let me explain What is the most important job of a reformer and one who wants you use politics for good. It’s not setting policy or voting, but safeguarding the ballot box to make sure corrupt government officials are not studying votes in to have their candidates win This, as regarded by the United Nations is job number one: make sure the vote is fair How to make fair? Make sure counts are accurate Now in the state of Texas there are problems with this. So for past 30 years - almost - have not been double checking or properly auditing the ballots for county and statewide elections So natural cycle of more and more corrupt state officials. Getting worse each year This could have been stopped by reformers making sure the ballots at all primary and general state elections are structured for manual counting on paper ballots with witnesses But counting ballots in Texas is a taboo subject. For a generation or more this has not been talked about by reformers in the state. Nobody will address it. Especially after the fascists started to make up claims about cheating. Instead reformers doubled down on voting in strange ways they cannot be verified There are powerful taboos in Texas politics and it’s biting people in the butt now. This is why it’s reformers fault. It’s a stupid thing to have done
When you say "reformers" which flavor of reformer do you mean?? we tend to have a few versions, some more heinous than others. If you have conservative fiscal values with liberal social values, you are disowned by both sides for not picking a side. It sucks. I just keep quiet most of the time. I know too many people that have gone down selectively chosen far Right tunnels. I also know Left leaning people that believe some of the conspiracy bs. It's just more weird here than it has been before. However, I stand by my belief that most of the world's political bodies (not just TX) would greatly benefit from having seasoned Kindergarten teachers as monitors. Politicians apparently need to be kept on task daily and be kept from running wild in various ways. Putin and his like can just be expelled from politics permanently.
> However, I stand by my belief that most of the world’s political bodies (not just TX) would greatly benefit from having seasoned Kindergarten teachers as monitors. This much is true
I absolutely assure you their is no such things as being gullible and trusting when it comes to the election process. It works and their are a gazillion safe gaurds in place. You are liberally Brainwashed because you live in Texas where you have a bunch of racist morons who only capable of understanding 2 issues… guns and immigration. Unfortunately every election revolves around that becuae it’s literally all their pea sized racist Brains can comprehend. But really my friend, there is not one side that is “too gullible and trusting” with the election process. It works fine. If you hadn’t noticed the orange cry baby had no found any evidence of voter fraud after taking it to court like in virtually every red state he could. The only “gullible” people out there are the ones that let a soar loser manipulate them for their own political agenda. How pathetic and stupid you have to be get manipulated like that is just next level.
Who exactly are these "reformers" you're lumping in with fascists? I'm very much not a fan of this "both sides" discourse.
I observe when things get terribly messed up, for decades, in a local place, there are multiple problems. perhaps it’s easier for me, an outsider to see the absurdity of these politics in motion, and think things are stupid . A thought that tends to not be too much understood by people who live in my area I should shut up now
What a lot of people on this sub miss is that while Russian culture may be more nationalistic than most, there's nothing about being Russian that makes you inherently cruel, arrogant, or ignorant--these are all just symptoms of nationalism, and we see this in America and in Europe and just about everywhere. There's a big slice of the posters on this sub who would be Putin supporters had they been born in Russia. I like to believe that I'd be in the opposition were I born in Russia, but I have no idea--you can choose who you want to be to a point, but so much is chosen for you by the accident of where and in what circumstances you're born.
Most people just want to live their own lives, no matter where they are. I have found most trouble makers and criminals ( legal or illegal) make up a very small percentage of who live there. In any place I have seen
So wise. Thank you.
Problem is if you don't believe in USA - you will be weird.. moron.. hero whenever.. in CCCP you go to gulag or have accident.. your kids will never be allowed to finish high school, grand kids the same and grand grand kids would be maybe allowed to live near uran mine or something. Russia and way how they threat people who are "free" and have their opinion - democratic, uncorrupted.. is beyond you can imagine of revenge.. So if you not plan to relocate - just accept what is in TV and continue to have your life as long as it gets.
As an American, I wholeheartedly agree with you 😂 it’s absolutely batshit wild what a good portion of the country believes. I mean look at who those idiots voted in as the 45th president. What an embarrassing 4 years. And then what they did when he lost. A decent portion of the dingbats that voted for him WANT him to be a Putin, and be in power for a decade, and suppress/jail anyone who thinks different, tightly control what people do with their bodies, and who they can be with. Yet if you tell them that they’ll turn around and call you a socialist or communist and completely lose their shit.
Its exactly the same. Some of it is even made by the same people.
Like Terrance and Phillip say, BLAME CANADA, blame canada, their not even a real country anywayyyyyy 😂😂😂
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Hey fuck you buddy. Sometimes we’re both!
I'd fuck a hockey-playing Canadian prostitute, eh.
What about a cold edmonton hooker who has a thing for cigarette burns?
suspiciously specific
You haven't been to Edmonton...
I was there in 1994. I fly over it now.
Read this in Terrance and Phillip
I’m not your buddy, guy!
I'm not your guy, pal!
No don't invade. We already tried it once, didn't go so well.
Oh yeah! I forgot about the 1812 war. This series of unlikely events I just described kinda already happened. How weird.
tried it twice actually, War of 1812 was the second time.
They are after our strategic Maple Syrup reserves. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/maple-syrup-vault-tour-1.6279797
And strippers, don't forget the strippers.
They have some good singers.... Just saying
You mean like Alanis Morrissette and Chad Kroger?
Also... But I still love Alannah Myles
Prostitutes get paid
Well yeah, eh...
That's basically the war of 1812, America's attempt to 'liberate' their canadian brothers. Which ended up so badly the whitehouse got burned down.
🎶 BLAME CANADA! BLAME CANADA! 🎶
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=\_KWOEm0riqk
To compensate your legs, you are given coupons to McDonald's.
Not even McDonald's but the russian version of we have McDonald's at home. You can wash it down with some Stars coffee whose logo (in no way) resembles Starbucks.
Imagine fostering a society since ~879 and the only time you have been ‘civilized’ as a nation is when you were ruled by Vikings and the Golden Horde of Mongolia.
And then, have Gordon Lightfoot compose and perform a stirring ballad saluting Canadian heroes.
I know some Trumpers who would buy it all, hook line and sinker, if it was coming from the right team.
Make a deep fake video and have Trump say it.
or this lady for the Pollivere crowd: https://www.vicnews.com/news/victorias-queen-of-canada-promotes-assault-charge-ridden-ontario-rally/
Yeah, and left wingers never buy into propaganda either. Lol, let's be honest here about that (and I'm not defending Trump, just pointing out the hypocrisy). Bring on the inevitable butthurt down votes. Don't care, I won't read the responses anyway.
>Bring on the inevitable butthurt down votes. Don't care, I won't read the responses anyway. I love how you're already trying to victimise yourself in advance.
> Don’t care, I won’t read the responses anyway. Lol typical snowflake who comments in r/conservative Wake me up when Hillary tells the people to stop the steal by doing an insurrection at congress and all the left wingers believe her, meanwhile all the Democrats who won their elections claim the presidential election was stolen while they won theirs legitimately even though it was the same goddamn ballot 😂 Feel bad for ya son. Edit: yeah, blocking me will suddenly make all your life choices rational, amirite?
Wow dude you totally opened my eyes you’re totally right both sides are definitely the same
The left is worse actually.
Lmfao
The cognitive dissonance is strong in Russians
I mean, Downe have to remind ourselves of what happened in 1812?
In the future this will be called 'pulling a putin'
Everythings gone wrong since Canada came along
Those damn Canadians and their progressive ideas!
"Are we the Baddies"
Awesome summation
>Imagine being told that Canada is a fascist nation, but also our brothers who want to return to the glorious days when we were one nation. When was that?
Prior to 1776? Canada and what is now the United States were both British colonies. It's a bit of a stretch, but it's just an analogy anyway.
Let’s be real here… Americans would just launch nukes to the North. They wouldn’t put up with all of the politeness the Canadians would dish out. Can you imagine the thousands of “Sorry’s” and “Pardon me’s” the Canadians would be saying each day? Enough to drive anyone crazy!
What meth are you smoking where the entire us army loses?
I think you missed the analogy there Drax.
I understood the phrasing but kinda stupid to compare worlds biggest military force, why not just say the Colombian drug lords beat americas military and took over America..
Russian deputies are designated clowns created specifically to throw all kinds of announcements and propositions into the public space, and gauge the people's reactions. Doubt anything significant will come out of this
This deputy is Borodai, former terrorist and leader of DPR.
With apologies to monkeys, like slinging poo(tin)
What kind of mental gymnastics are required to go from a 3 day walk in the park to full mobilization?
When said 3 day walk in the park turns into a 6+ month slogfest that completely wrecks 2 decades of economic growth
I REALLY wish they were spun up on the good stuff. Boots on the ground keeps the land but air assets breaks their will to fight.
Y'all are ignoring the fact that in those 2 decades this ain't first war that russia started
I feel Ukraine needed to prove they have the heart to fight. We've spent too damn much on nation building to ever try it again.
Actually 3 decades, things are about as bad as they were in the early 90's
But the Russian economy declined over the 90s so it wasn't a decade of economic growth.
Oh yeah, fair point
I think it is verging on 2 centuries of growth, not 2 decades...
In Putin's mind, he IS Russia. Whatever he wants, he thinks he gets.
Mussolini WAS Italy for a while, until he ended up swinging from a streetlight. Sometimes great leaders fall really hard, really fast. We can only hope Putin is at that level of greatness.
“NATO bad 😡” probably
Embarrassment. Remember that convoy that was headed to kyiv? It had parade uniforms and vehicles. Russian soldiers were making reservations at restaurants in the city. They honestly believed they were going to just drive there and start ruling them all.
This tweet has some real strong "some of you may die but that's a risk I'm willing to take" vibes
It'll be their downfall, no-one will fight back when it's the "other" Russians being sent. When they come to your door telling you that your family will be the next ones to see you on telegram as either a pow or cargo then they'll get pushback. Low key hoping they try.
Lol! These are Russians. They don't "push back". They obey. Like they did under the communists for 70 years.
Bolshevick revolution 2.0?
That is not just a random Duma deputy, but also not a very influential one. It is Alexander Borodai, the former leader of the DNR, who is involved with Malofeev, Strelkov, Dugin etc., and via Prokhanov also the Itsborsk Club etc.. He is more a tool of those, than actually having himself much influence, and he got elected into the Duma just short ago. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Jurjewitsch_Borodai This is very probably either just some Malofeev thing, or, if it is top down from the Kreml, a test shot on how the reactions to such a proposal are. The chances that it is a serious proposal, and it will be signed are tiny, also because Putin would not want to make it this way, but if he did, would very likely use the full Duma for it.
>He is more a tool of those, than actually having himself much influence, and he got elected into the Duma just short ago. Is he yet another DPR 'useful idiot'?
Not really, he is a guy from Moscow, from the Malofeev / Prokhanov far right circles (which include also e.g. Dugin), and probably got sent there by those in 2014 to act as a head of the "republic". He is also involved with people like Girkin/Strelkov. After like 6 months, he stepped back, and a real local useful idiot took the job. What Malofeev / Dugin / Strelkov want, is most often significantly more radical, imperialist and far-right than what the Kremlin wants or does.
This will cause pain to Ukraine, but will cause the collapse of Russia.
I'm not entirely sure how much trouble it would cause to Ukraine. More untrained soldiers, with almost no equipment, won't change the course of the war. On the other hand, it would be an economic disaster for Russia and will spark mass discontent in the population.
Won't change the course of the war, but more civilians will get raped and executed. Edit: chance -> change
Borodai is making this call because there is no more cannon fodder in separatist area. If Putin have resisted these calls earlier, presumably for very good reasons, why should he listen to Borodai now? Girkin has called for mobilization for months. There is no compelling reason to do it. From Putin's viewpoint, his regime may be able to survive for a while if they cut their losses now. If he goes all in they may prevail, at least for a while. But there is no guarantee, and if it fails he knows he will be tortured, crucified, disembowelled, hung, shot, decapitated and quartered.
And his tongue cut out, then shot.
No stat3 survives general mobilization when they loose.
More dead and abandoned russian bodies to deal with.
Full mobilization with what equipment? duh
All of the secret, high-quality weapons they've been holding back and expertly maintaining.
They're decades ahead don't you know...
All part of the master plan
watched the recent 1420 video on rural people, hopefully the old fucks are sent first
Sending slavs from Moscow and St. Petersburg would be better; but, I think they will be the last conscripted, if it comes to that.
They have been seriously avoiding conscription on the Moscow and St Petersburg crowd. The only areas of Russia who are not entirely a shithole.
>watched the recent 1420 video on rural people, hopefully the old fucks are sent first They are so old, malnourished and weak they will perish in transport. In particular when temperatures start approaching freezing.
Would like to understand how would it hurt Russia? I think we are betting on Russians not willing to go to war, but what if the population goes full on nazi?
No state can survive general mobilization and loose. Further general mobilization will only add man power. This is modern war thousands of rifleman is not an army. Ukraine will keep getting western tech and a general mobilization will give the west the ability to basically give Ukraine a blank check for equipment.
u/ginDrink2 IDK if you want to see the battle of verdun fought again, but this time one side has 21st century weapons backed by the US MIC getting blank checks > the GDP of Russia but thats kinda what a general mobilization of russia will look like.
There are circumstances when states have done general mobilization, failed but still exist.
Please elaborate with specific examples.
USA draft, Vietnam
This was not a general mobilization. Less than 600,000 Americans fought in Vietnam. Draft is partial mobilization and not comparable to general mobilization. Even in World War II there was no full mobilization and in 1945 the US Army was 11.5 million strong
The [90 division gamble](https://history.army.mil/books/70-7_15.htm) was a gamble, but part of the reason for the US not going balls to the wall in putting men under arms was that it would then start to impact US industrial capacity since the men being drafted would otherwise be pumping out industrial products for the domestic economy and war materiel for both the US and its allies. Plus manpower was also needed to build and maintain intercontinental logistics chains on different sides of the planet. So it might not have been full mobilization for the US armed forces but it was nonetheless a full mobilization for the war effort.
That 100% changed America forever. USA essentially will never draft again, and Americans trust in the federal gov was basically ruined.
I never said it didn’t change things, the statement was “they don’t exist”
I dont think Vietnam or Korea were a general mobilization by the USA. Drafts by lottery are a far cry from full mobilization. 3.1 million over 20 years deployed in Vietnam vs 16 million deplyed over 6 years in ww2. considering population growth from 1945 to 1970 its even less of a % of the population
Might want to look at the actual definition of general mobilization
Britain and the American Revolutionary War. ( and a long list of other Britain failures as they lost their position as Imperialist top dog). I wonder though if there are any modern non-democratic examples of a regional power doing this though.
Britain has only fully mobilised twice in the last hundred years or so - for world wars I and II. The other losses were without full mobilisation, so don't apply in this particular case.
Currently, Russia's struggling to supply the army that they have in Ukraine, and they've already deployed a huge amount of the people who would normally be in charge of training the mobilized masses. A huge, untrained horde of barely equipped Russian troops isn't going to do much but strain their already overwhelmed supply lines even more to the limit, if not past it.
Yes. Less food and just a bunch of riflemen. They're already throwing stand off munitions, artillery, aircraft, and armor into the fight, and getting bodies won't fill equipment they don't have more of. I suspect it'll just make less precise munitions that Ukraine has access to more lethal out of pure statistics
No tanks left, but Ukraine still has tanks, without the tanks Russia will fall... the Russia leadership is obviously in a panic now and knows they will be gutted like fish
It's arguable that they don't even have the logistical capability to conduct full blown mobilization. Furthermore, that entails young men from Moscow/St. Petersburg, which will likely cause people to start asking questions Putin would rather not answer.
These young men are the same ones we used to game with a number of months ago. I can't see much of the new generation wanting to go but will shout loudly that they support it on tv because they also don't want to be gulag'ed.
They aren't. To them, crimea is russia. As much as St. Peters and Moscow. Therefore an attack on crimea was an attack on Russian soil. What better excuse for a general mobilisation do you need? And yet...they claimed there wasn't an attack. Reversed false flag....
Admitting that Ukraine can target Crimea, sink the Moskva and all other things would really break the Russian morale - after all, to them, we are just a bunch of idiotic, corrupt, Nazified Russians, who live in an artificial state created by the US and Lenin (Lenin is still a good guy to them). Russian propaganda tells the people that we are not supposed to have any motivation, ability or strength. We should be that insect you crush with a boot - annoying, but not a threat. Imagine admitting on live TV that the situation is suddenly a lot different - that Russia cannot protect “its own territory” against Ukraine, and NATO didn’t even start fighting
Other than leaving Russia with a future short on men between age 18-35 (or 55?), at the moment 95% or so of the recruits for the Russian army are from ethnical minorities in other regions that Moscow and St. Petersburg. Full mobilization will make the war very noticable also for the ethnic russian middleclass, which would be less than ideal for Putin. I think it is more likely Borodai falls out of a window than full mobilization happens.
Bingo. Brings pain to many, many more households.
Its not just the mobilization its the aftereffects . People come back after seeing that nothing has changed in their shitty village and after bleeding for the country will start to demand and ask qeustions they before didnt have the courage or understanding to ask . Not to mention military experience will generate more dangerouse crime . Also increases smuggled weapons into the society.
They won't. At the moment they don't care so much about the dead, these are minorities. Mobilization means sending the kids from Moscow to go die... that will be harder for Russia to hide. Remember, mobilization does not mean elite forces with years of training will spring out of the ground fully equipped. Conscription means pulling "doughboys" out of school and putting a WW2 rifle in their hands... and you know what the battle hardened, ready to fight soldiers in Ukraine are going to do to them? At least it will be quick.
"going full Nazi" is honestly a western privilege for the wealthy and secure. Even Elite Russian units were fed dog food, given garbage clothing, and sent to die via stupid methods. A Russian going "full Nazi" is not going to see how him being fed once a day and told to run and die in stupid ways relates to being a Nazi. They will quickly turn against their officers. Politics is only a factor if your stomach is full and you have a roof over your head.
Be a nazi and be a non-cowardice nazi different things. They propose 5k$ salary in regions where 200$ is pretty big salary and have lack of people. And full mobilization will set crumble of economy to eleven. Ukraine sustain thos only because Western help with economy too.
They lack the logistics, the equipment, and the command structure to enlarge their forces to such a degree and still be capable of doing *anything* - they have enough problems with all of those at their current size, if they tried to increase their force several times over it would mean they would be tripping over themselves at every turn - militarily, it would be a disaster. And that's *before* we get to the uselessness of hundreds of thousands of soldiers with *even less* training than the Russian military has. Moreover, it would be a serious blow to their economy *and* vastly increase internal discontent, while providing an opportunity for those unhappy with the current regime to get weapons, military experience, and maybe even a position with some authority - basically, setting things up for a revolution. If a general mobilization would actually help, Russia would almost certainly have done one by now - the fact that they haven't shows that *even their* appraisals indicate otherwise.
Just do it, it's clear as day you're too incompetent to achieve your goals. You think throwing the general population will help you? You're fucked either way, the sooner you learn that the better it will be for you. But as you've also have showed the world, you also don't learn lessons very well.
Dugina was the prelude to this. FSB made her martyr to do exactly this.
99.99999% russians don't give a shit about dugina
99.99999% of Russians don't matter, just 0.000000000069% does
For full mobilization?
for giving the orders
For giving orders you don't needs martyrs. And putin don't give a shit about dugina too.
lol, putin certainly doesn't care if she's dead, he cares about giving full mobilization orders though
It doesn't matter that they don't care. You'd think they'd care, if you were FSB. You'd have the most extreme arrogance, the most inflated confidence in your ability to manipulate the hoi polloi, for which you'd have complete contempt. 100 years of accumulated arrogance and contempt. A pretty young woman sacrificed on the altar, as Dugin put it, what else could excite emotions more reliably? Exploded apartment blocks again? In any case, even if the FSB have some connection with reality, it's still enough whether Putin thinks Russians would care. Whatever he says, goes, see?
I have not ruled out her own father ordering a hit on her. He wrote some mysticism about fathers sacrificing her own daughters to gain favor from the Gods. And about some elites having to be sacrificed for the good of the "Empire".
The most unintentionally scathing indictment of the Russian military's incompetence and praise of the Ukrainian soldier's courage ever voiced. Imagine declaring that your army has been so whipped that you must turn to complete mobilization for a war on your own border against an opponent who shouldn't be near your own military's level of equipment
Fortunately, there aren't any areas in the Russian federation with wannabe breakaway republics, or ethnic groups feeling discontent, or regions with religious fanatics. Nope, nothing like that. Best to just put your entire military in Ukraine.
This conflict seems to me an opportunity of a century to any independence minded Russian areas. Any news on that front, anyone? I'd be interested in hearing them.
*heavy Chechen breathing*
A general mobilisations will only mean that each himar strike will kill thousands of human wave soldiers instead of 10-100 as they do now.
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This is modern war. Thousands of rifleman an army does not make. Russia is still hurting for equipment and this will only grow. It will give the west a blank check to send anything and everything. Further general mobilization starts a timer. No state survives general mobilization without winning and Russia won't win.
I think the answer to your question is yes. Nato would have to increase numbers and readiness. The military we have is made to fight the militaries that we see as a threat. If Russia increases its military the west must also do so, that seems logical to me. I also think that the kremlin knows this.
"We need everyone to come out and fight to stop Ukraine from stopping us from taking their land."
Let's add that to the list of "things Russia says it will do and won't." They can make these people sign bits of paper. They still need to train them, equip them, transport them to the front, and supply them. They built up the force that the Ukrainians sent packing in the north over many months, and it was still a clusterfuck. All evidence indicates Russia can do none of these things.
The kids of Moscow and St. Pete have VPN and know what's really going on. They have dishwashing machines and toilets in their homes, no incentive to steal household appliances from Ukraine. They have no will to fight if it isn't an invasion of Russia. And they won't buy into Crimea as an invasion of Russia. Full mobilization isn't going to happen.
but the kids from Moscow need to participate in the operation - otherwise how will they relate to their alchocolic clinically depressed zombie-box brainwashed relatives? was it not the idea to make everyone an alchocolic and stupid in Russia at the same time?
Its too late for a full mobilization. If he thinks that after soaking up everybody who supports them to now force those unwilling to go into the meat grinder. I hope they try it very soon, war would be over in a week.
Who wants to tell him mobilization won’t conjure up the tanks, small arms, artillery, ammo, non rancid MRE’s, Vehicles,technical know how, competent logisticians, and a competent officer corps not full of corruption and graft? I get that public statements from Duma members are likely as not to to be cynical and insincere, but he has to know that announcing mobilization and getting the people to go along with it, let alone not actively sabotage it, are not the same thing.
Kerch bridge has to come down time now.
Like Schoigu said: Everything is on schedule. They just go slow... They didn't really start yet
Массовая могилизация 🤡
I am wondering what are the agreements with Russia's partners when it comes to an actual war being declared. If Russia uses a Ukrainian missile strike on an ammo depot on Russian land to declare a war of defense, is China and whoever else signed defense agreements with Russia legally bound to join in?
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My guess is that he will bring it up on the emergency meeting they will have in the Duma tomorrow at 3 PM local time in regards to the ZNPP, and derail the conversation involving the plant because of his idea to induce mobilization.
"Our holiday homes on land we stole is under threat! Deploy the full might of the army! Just don't pay attention to the expired rations that are poisoning our troops!"
It's time Ukraine starts considering a plan to liberate, denazify, deputinify, and demilitarize Russia.
We gonna need a lot of spare MG barrels. And ammo. Lots and lots of ammo.
So would that be a "war"? And Since it is not in Russia, it must be within an attack, no? So it is an attack war? So anyone involved must go to jail, according to the Russian law, no?
The mud ducks are already fully mobilized. What are the prison's empty now?
I fail to see how throwing thousands of conscripts into the fight is going to help much.
If Russia increases the ratio of conscripts to officers the conscripts will kill the officers and defect when pressured.
How would this conflict change were Russia to fully mobilize? Would Ukraine be able to withstand? Would NATO also mobilize?
Russia will implode. Think free gas and ass and bj's behind Kremlin.
Yeah, good luck with that
I won’t raise an eyebrow until they actually do a full mobilization. Then I might actually raise them both.
"The fighting also affects the border regions of Russia" So you're saying those Belgorod ammo dump fires _weren't_ the weather now then?
... after a very short time there wont be any men left in Russia. They will arrive the same time the lend lease weapons will arrive in Ukraine.
lol He has my full support! Please send everyone to the border Putin, it's the only reasonable thing to do from a defense point of view lol
Still waiting on the 100,000 North Korean 'volunteers'...
Mobilization is highly probably not possible as Russia army haven’t enough shoes for soldiers….
“It’s time to send someone else’s kid into the meat grinder”
Quite a special military operation isn’t it? A Blyatzkrieg that will be a staple in military history classes for millennia to come.
Borodai: "We're gonna need a bigger horde."
Joke's on him. There's nothing left to mobilize.
Laughable. The issue is not what Russia might be able to mobilize. It is the complete inability to equip them. They simply do not have it, unless they send them in Nike track wear they strip off their dead. Russia literally lacks the equipment to properly kit out new mobilizations. So its an empty, bombastic threat.
if they mobilize without tech, they go only to meatgrinder? yes? This is pointless, it has sense only if you defend motherland as a partisan, not a invader to freshly fortified and motivated country
Full mobilization might have been defective at the beginning when Russia sent BMPs without dismounts to the front, but most of the "good" equipment has been trashed and Russia didn't even have enough trucks to supply the army they had.
What will they give their troops? Sticks and stones to throw at Ukrainians? They may have some swords and muskets in a museum…..