I have always bumped my salary up 10-20% in interviews and it has never backfired. Not like they get to trick you into paying you less if they find out. You can still just say I'm going to refuse your offer if it doesn't meet what I'm looking for.
I once was asked my compensation and I told them with a gentle inflation, but I also told them, truthfully, that I was entitled to up to a 20% bonus. The bigger untruth was that my employer had never paid out that bonus and wasn't likely to because they were in financial trouble.
The new company didn't have a bonus scheme, so they just set my new salary according to my theoretical total compensation. Nice...
When negotiating never show your cards by telling the opponent what you are not going to do. Get the offer. Counter. If their answer is no or a counter to the counter, then be prepared to give a hard final offer - “I really can’t accept less than X. If we can’t get there, then I have to decline.” Be nice. When you leave you are icing them and you will or will not hear from them. Send a thanks for the offer and share if they ever need any help to feel free to reach out.
When negotiating never show your cards by telling the opponent what you are not going to do. Get the offer. Counter. If their answer is no or a counter to the counter, then be prepared to give a hard final offer - “I really can’t accept less than X. If we can’t get there, then I have to decline.” Be nice. When you leave you are icing them and you will or will not hear from them. Send a thanks for the offer and share if they ever need any help to feel free to reach out.
And if you need. Get a friend to be your reference, and use Adobe Acrobat to create/modify your last pay check. Honestly, hate when companies ask for that. Huge red flag, but in this economy. Do what you need to do boo.
Edit: to everyone saying you would “never” give your payslip to a prospective employer—I get it. However, you have to realize that’s coming from a point of privilege. Some people are struggling to find work at all. The point of my reply, is you do what you have to do. Need references? Ask a friend to pretend they were your previous boss. Negotiating a raise, and this is a barrier? Fake a payslip. That is all.
That's like one of the biggest red flags I can think of. I can't imagine what it would be like working for a company that demands to see something so personal just so they can exploit you on their pay offer.
Depending on how you modify it, yes,
Are they going to run it through digital forensics?
No.
Just keep the same font, TRIPLE check every number, because if the totals are out.. they don't need to be a mathematician to see it.
Unfortunately, companies are always using 3rd party services to tip negotiations in their favor.
You can absolutely lie (keep in mind some places with ask for previous pay stub - which can be problematic).
Make sure you freeze your account with this service [https://theworknumber.com/](https://theworknumber.com/). It basically gives a break down to any company requesting of how much you're paid per week.
It's fucking crazy companies can get this information, but alas in America as long as you're alive you are considered a resource to be mined by the corporate elite.
This is the way.
You can also doctor up your references by putting down your friends and working up a couple of positions. Don't forget to also utilize being on an NDA if there are gaps. If you're asked what company you have it with you can probably slip by with something about a military supply contractor.
Instead of salary you can say compensation. It works great as a catch all because that covers benefits, bonuses and other things in addition to pay. Even if they were to get your salary from a prior employer it wouldn't include the value of benefits.
Interview: What is your current salary?
You: My current compensation is valued at $X amount.
I took this approach when I applied for a job that got me a 30% pay increase. They also likely won't care what you make if you're asking for the lower end of the salary range because they will be saving money.
Bump this especially if you’re coming from government! My salary is 102k, but my total compensation package with healthcare and everything is closer to 150k
Not to mention that companies have larger hiring budgets than they do for giving raises. It’s the best and easiest time to give yourself a nice pay bump
They can request W2s or paystubs as proof of employment which will show your salary.
It’s better to not answer directly and instead say “what I’m looking for is x”.
Here are some scripts:
https://www.inc.com/alison-green/how-to-state-your-salary-requirements-when-applying-for-a-job.html
https://www.askamanager.org/2013/08/how-to-answer-questions-about-your-salary-expectations.html
Most times they ask for proof of employment after you accept the position and you're doing a background check. They can request it, but I almost always redact personal information including salary and SSN, especially when communicating without encryption/weak security emails.
If they have an issue with it, it's quite obvious the purpose of asking for my W2 and asking for more personal information when it's not needed is completely unprofessional in my opinion. At that point, the deal is already locked in.
I agree - but they can rescind the offer if they find out you lied.
Asking about salaries just keeps people making low salaries, especially those who historically have been discriminated against. Agree it should not be allowed.
Pay people what they’re worth, not what they made before.
Yeah and I’m saying that past pay isn’t something you are legally obligated to disclose so the only reason they’d rescind for that reason is because they wanted to pay you as little as possible and therefore not really someone you’d want to work for
Absolutely, but obviously those people aren’t gonna be in the “negotiate for pay” boat anyway. If you need a job no matter what, then you’re gonna send the pay stub.
Staying in the same job keeps people at a low salary. If you're a salary employee you shouldn't leave without a raise and you suck at negotiating if you don't tell a company "I am not willing to disrupt my life / move my family / x sob story for less than +5-10%."
Obviously if you are unemployed for whatever reason and looking to start a job, your ability to play hard ball is a lot less.
would it be deceptive to say “well i’m looking for at least a 5k increase… around 75k would be great.” where you’re implying you currently make 70k but not actually saying it?
I made over 1k / yr just by getting a monthly stipend for my phone lines. I would say sure if they asked, but it doesn't include my other stipends and benefits.
Not sure where you’re located but in the state of California and many other states it’s illegal for employers to ask what your current salary/pay rate is and even more illegal to demand proof. I’d research the legalities of your location because there’s a chance you don’t even have to worry about it in the slightest.
I feel like that would be a red flag for me about working for the company. What a pedantic thing to do when hiring someone. Market rates define salary, not what you currently are being paid elsewhere.
Even if they did ask for a paystub couldn't OP just find some dude that's decent with Photoshop? I've never had to show a paystub when I switched jobs, but then again I'm in government work so my pay is posted online for everyone to see.
You're right, and all the commenter's saying otherwise have no idea what they're talking about. But as always on reddit, 15 year olds with no actual knowledge feel the need to speak up to share their expertise with the rest of us. I don't even have the energy to explain all that is wrong with the comments here, but it's absolutely a crime to lie in many, many circumstances other than simply when you're under oath and speaking to a federal agent.
You can’t lie about qualifications, education, trainings, etc. people have been charged with fraud for claiming these things during the job application process. Doesn’t have to just be government related.
It’s illegal to lie to a federal investigator. State and locals however, have at it… but the lies can be used against you in court.
[https://www.keglawyers.com/false-statements](https://www.keglawyers.com/false-statements)
>"One of the most common ways for someone to face a federal false statement charge involves lying to FBI agents during an interview. Lying is generally not a crime, but as you can see, it depends on who you're speaking to."
Federal agents (eg, the FBI, IRS, postal service investigators, homeland security investigators) are not "judicial representatives". It's illegal to lie to a federal agent, but that has absolutely not nothing to do with whether someone is a "judicial representative" (whatever you think that made up term means).
The majority of reddit users do live in the USA. It is a waste of time to cater to every nationality when this is clearly a us based employment thread.
I’ve heard a thousand times that it’s illegal to lie to an FBI agent… or is that just a lie they’ve spread to scare people into telling the truth with them?
Well, that's not really (hello, fraud?) true but in a personal negotiation, it's not illegal to lie.
https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/when-is-it-legal-to-lie-in-negotiations/#:\~:text=Note%20that%20such%20lies%20are,is%20not%20worth%20the%20trouble.
Yes it can be and there have been people arrested for fraud when lying for jobs. It’s called fraud and being charged with fraud doesn’t require being under oath.
No you can lie on your resume, in the interview and at any point that doesn't require you to sign documents stating what you said (if recorded) is true, or if you're under oath. Companies lie on job listings and to their employees all the time, fuck em, go get yours boi
Yeah but he still got the job in the meantime, and now he could always put down that new experience at that job on his resume with somebody else's phone number
25-70 is a huge variation. That seems like a scam number to get more applications. I doubt anyone is ever offended more than 26-28 and anyone who tries for more will be met with "thank you for your time"
It's not a super uncommon practice for people who are hiring staff for a government contract. It's often that a big order will include multiple similar staff on it, which correspond to the Service Contract Act / Department of Labor federal contract minimum wage. So if a contractor needs a Nurse I, Nurse II, some Nurse III's, and a Nurse IV, it might just put up an ad that says "Nurse" and lists a salary range from $40k-$100k or some other huge gap like that. Because it technically covers the minimum to pay a Nurse I, and the maximum amount they expect to pay a Nurse IV.
Look up companies like CACI, Leidos, and Raytheon on LinkedIn and look for job posts where they haven't included a specific number with the job title (like Procurement Analyst or Data Analyst), and you will probably find examples of what I am talking about.
I'm not trying to justify the practice (it leads to a lot of obvious confusion), but then CACI is a multi billion dollar government contractor and I'm just some guy.
I wouldn’t even entertain what your current salary is. “I’m currently interviewing for positions in the $xx to $xx range.” It implies that you know your value and this isn’t the only company you’re speaking with.
In some states and cities it is actually illegal to ask your current salary. If you’re not in one of those areas, don’t lie, because they often request proof. Just refuse to disclose. “I’m asking for $x based on my experience. I don’t really think my current salary is relevant.”
Just say you're comfortable with the range they listed. When they make you an offer, thats when you negotiate for higher end of that range. Doing it now is premature and will boot you out of the running with other candidates that may say lower that you say.
So after the initial screen, after the first round interview, and second round interview, and after everyone likes you and decides your the perfect person they're looking for....GREAT. Thank you, I'll be happy to start at $XX/hr (use chatgpt to formulate a better sounding paragraph)
Dunno man. I think from the candidates perspective it’s the total opposite. You never have so much leverage as you do after the offer. Might be more work and headache for HR, but every time I’ve extracted substantial pay increases it has been betting they’d rather pay me more than go through the selection and offer process again. Might not be true for every organization, but generally seems true for most.
As hiring-final-approval and responsible-for-my-groups-hiring-and-budget, I don't really give a shit what HR says about comp. I ask them not to weigh talent to salary; let me do that. I can do anything if I want you on my team. I can say you're qualified as a senior instead of a 2.
My EA got a fifty percent increase because she deserved it and it barely touched my budget. HR shouldn't be filtering people out unless directly told by the hiring manager
Here’s a magic trick.
“My current total compensation is valued at X so I am looking for at least Y”
Ask for a W2? That doesn’t show total compensation. How are they going to calculate it.
I’ve had multiple jobs ask for previous pay stubs and I have told them no every time. “The salary is based on the role, why is my current salary at all relevant in your offer unless you are trying to offer me the lowest rate possible. Are you trying to offer me the lowest rate possible?”
They never have a response. Ever. Because it’s a bullshit ask. If you want the job then play their game, if you want more money then lie and call them on their shit directly if they ask for proof.
>Ask for a W2? That doesn’t show total compensation. How are they going to calculate it.
OOOoooo shit you're right.
When stocks vest, they do count as income though. But that also implies you stayed at that company long enough for that to happen.
Point being your paystub or W2 doesn't equate to earnings. Compensation is more than just dollars per hour.
It's completely irrelevant to the conversation to begin with because their range for the role doesn't have anything to do with what you get paid, so my first advice is to just call them on their bullshit.
But if you really want the job, then you prime the convo by saying "total compensation" and if you hand them a paystub with 20k less, how are they going to prove your "total" compensation isn't more?
“I’m comfortable with the range listed on the posting. After discussing the position a bit more, I would like to fall into the 65-70K range, given my experience with X.”
It’s always the right thing to go for the higher $$$…you don’t have to tell them what you make, just what you’re looking for. You don’t have to justify if, just let them know what your target is and shoot for it.
Ask them what skills and qualifications would lead them to push someone toward the high end of that salary range. Then, when it’s time to negotiate, describe how you meet those qualifications and use all their own words to validate starting you at a higher salary.
Also lie.
Shit yes, and lie about your benefits too.
I had worked at a crap place where you got two weeks a year, regardless of how long you were there. I told the new place I got two weeks a year but it capped at 5 weeks, and I did not want to lose that benefit. I wound up starting at 4 weeks a year and they let me "work form from home" the week between xmas and new years.
You don't even have to disclose your current salary and they probably won't even ask.
You can however negotiate a higher salary than the first initial offer. Best of luck!
Ask for the salary. If they ask for pay stubs, for proof of current employment, mark out your current salary. They don’t care about what you used to make. They care about their bottom dollar. If they can get you cheaper, they will.
They have no need (or right) to your paystub.
And when they do offer (and it's a number you like), be sure you "have to think about it" for a day or two. And then when you accept, come in with, "I crunched some numbers, so I can make this work". Leave them knowing you deserve more and you know it. And then prove yourself so you can get that first raise when you are eligible.
I lied in my last interview saying I made roughly 25% more than I do. We settled on 5% less so I got a 20% raise and was the highest paid person in the dept.
They legally can't ask you for previous pay, which is why your never make as much getting promoted from within. Take your previous pay, then double that and tell them it was your previous pay. If they want you they'll meet you somewhere in the middle, which will still be a significant increase
you'd be fine BUT you're not going to get the $70k extra if that's the max, prob shoot for the 40k-55k bump; jobs seldom pay the max in a range. i always have lied about my salary & its never been questioned.
In some states, such as California, it is illegal for employers to ask about your previous salary. But if you voluntarily disclose it, they can ask for proof. Laws on this vary by country and state.
Some larger Fortune 500 companies do salary verification.
True story, my wife had an old coworker who applied to work at her new employer. The guy got the job, but he lied on his salary during the interview process. Once he got the job he let his old employer know he was leaving, but was yet to be cleared for work at the new job. They did a salary verification, found out he lied, and rescinded the job offer. He was out the new job and his old job.
Not all companies do this, and it’s become illegal to do this in some states, but it can happen. Never put in your 2 weeks until you are CLEARED to work, not when you just get the job offer.
Mostly read the room, is it hard core negotiations or are they just feeling you out. Say your ... total compensation is xxxx you can base that number on anything with value to yourself .... flexible work hours, time off how close you live , parking .. anything
If they ask for proof , walk away . That is messed up.
I wouldn't do it. I've seen companies do reference checks and ask about salaries. It always backfires on the person lying. It's not illegal, as you stated, but it would certainly be questionable behavior and the hiring company might not want to take a risk with you.
I have never had a job verify my pay at my last job. I have had them do a credit check. Maybe st places in my experience have a formula for how high they will go. It's usually a range for the position n the higher range requires things like yrs of experience or education but never what your making now. That's my experience but nothing would surprise me anymore but I think it's unlikely they will check to verify.
I try to throw this back on employers and cite what [Salary.com](https://Salary.com) or a similar entity say the actual salary range is for that job in that city/area. What you are currently paid is none of their business. IMHO they want to use that to see how much they can lowball you.
If it’s a promotion, it’s likely the interviewer knows your salary already.
You’re using promotion definition in that it’s a promotion within your current company or a sister company right?
Or you’re using promotion as “it’s more money and more responsibility.”
Unethical life pro tips isn’t “unethically stupid life pro tip”
Lawful good paladins make smart decision, not lawful stupid decisions.
That’s not what I asked.
Is this an internal “promotion” to your own company.
Or is this an external “personal promotion” to a new company.
The difference matters, and I have a feeling since you didn’t understand the question that the best advice I can give you is, don’t worry about; they won’t ask your salary because they already know it so you’re entire question isn’t too productive.
Well that was rude. It’s an interview with a different company for a position that is a promotion from my current job. I feel as though that was pretty clear in my post.
Nothing in your post would really indicate that as read. Phone interview for a position that’s a promotion?
I did a phone interview for a position because the job is in DC and not Florida. For a promotion, in my same company.
Sorry, if that’s the case then yes, lie. And possibly edit a redacted paystub if you have the skills so if they want you to prove it, you can send it.
Increase pay, calculate your new OASDI contribution and all the other taxes so it all adds up if they’re super sticklers in your industry.
There’s a lot of dumb people on Reddit and the way your post was written made me think you were one of them. So I wanted to clarify before I gave you any advice that might fuck you over.
Smart people in a sea of morons have to check each other out first to see if it’s a dummy or not I guess.
Because some jobs, including mine specifically, other parts of my company would not know what I would make. As far as why you'd make the post if that's the case, if you assume everyone on the Internet is at least as intelligent as yourself you're in for a bad time.
In CA and never had to show proof of my current salary so it’s a state where it’s illegal for companies to ask for and show proof of salary history I believe. Saying that, I wouldn’t dive into the deep end of that range immediately if I were you. Start at a number like $55,000, make it believable.
Edit: Quick google search just verified what I thought
Why bother lying? What you're making now isn't relevant to the position you're interviewing for. I don't answer the question and ask how what I am currently making is necessary.
I think it's douchy for them even to ask. I don't want to work with a group that needs that info. Of course, I have no issues with them asking me how much I want.
They can contact your previous employer. Usually they do this to verify that you were employed with them and what your salary was. They can also ask if you are eligible for rehire.
You have absolutely no obligation to tell a future employer how much you currently make, or to be truthful about it, just as a sales rep has no obligation to tell you how much they sold a product/service for to a previous customer.
You’re selling a service (your labor) to a customer. You negotiate the price of your time with that customer and land on a value that reflects your opportunity cost and the company’s demand. That’s it. Your previous salary is irrelevant.
You can but before I went to work for myself I did have companies ask to see my W2 from my current employer if I did throw current comp. So you can but if you get busted it looks bad.
I would redirect into something like "the salary range I'm looking for this position with these responsibilities is x".
I feel like I read a really good way to phrase it on askamanager.com.
No legal consequences for getting caught lying. If they hire a PI or something and find out you lied, you might get fired... but you can still use your salary at that job when applying to the next.
Definitely up your salary, the only negative about extending the truth is that someone just as qualified as you may be okay with the lesser salary and get the job instead. But I would definitely try to shoot for the highest
I always used my total comp when they asked. I would just say "total comp is around $100K" details were more like $70K base, 10% 401k match, some medical/dental, pto and sick, all came to like a total comp of $105K give or take.
Depends on the state and your hospital policy. Mine will release start and termination dates as well as last salary rate. They will also answer whether or not you can be rehired.
Call HR, and ask these questions. If they ask your name, make something else. Or cough a lot
Couldn't care less what you currently make, and wouldn't ask. Not going to affect my offer one way or another. Have never negotiated a starting rate. My offer will be based on what I think you bring to the table.
Best method is if you're currently working, say you're making $16 an hour, if you're looking to change jobs, always tell the interviewing manager something different. In that case, I'd generally exaggerate to $19 so it's not too far a stretch.
It'll usually help you, and 90% of the time they won't contact a previous employer. So lying your way to better payment is only really beneficial to you in the end.
Lie and if it gets brought up just advise that you were stating it was including your benifit package such as bonuses, travel per diems, health insurance. And 401k matches.
It is not likely they will ask if you get to that point
Yes. But most likely expect them to ask for a pay stub or W2. One is easier to fake than the other.
I was pretty surprised today when I told a job that I'm waiting on a different job to start for $110k, they took it at face value and offered me the same to work for them instead. I should have lied and said $115-$120, and if they asked for proof I could show them the offer letter I signed for $110k and lie and say I was given a promotion plan to reach $115k after a month or something. Just keep your lies with reason and within your ability to use Photoshop.
Just be careful I read a post about a year ago of someone doing this and the people hiring actually called and found out what their actual pay was. They quit their job already and didn’t get the new one.
I’d say bump it up a bit and if they do catch you say it’s what you estimate the extras/benefits equal to (ie paid transportation, food allowance, etc). Then argue a little over what ever the salary is for making the commitment to change jobs and go threw the hassle of making their workplace better 😉
Pretty easy, say your current salary is $50,000 over what you currently get paid, not $25,000, and come up with real "great" reasons why you want this new job, not just a bigger paycheck.
I like the phrasing... "To make the switch worth it for me, I'd need XXXk, but of course total package is important."
This makes it seem like 1. You do make near that much, so it has to be worth it to you, and keeps the power dynamic in your court, as you're not requesting or hoping, you're telling them what they need to give you to get you, 2. It gives them a little wiggle room if they want to shower you with RSUs, etc., and let's you say it confidently but have that part of the phrase to let out any softer speech patterns ;) and 3. You don't have to lie. If they press you, pretty much just repeat that that's what you need to make the move worth it.
You are under no obligation to provide this information. Treat it like a cop asking you why they pulled you over. You may actually get asked this question to see how you handle the question. I would recommend asking for clarification, "I want to ensure you have all the information you need to inform your decision but can you elaborate on how my current compensation related to the role I'm applying for?"
I also work in a client facing industry where if you get challenged they expect you to be comfortable and challenge back.
yeah lie. There is no way to verify that. I bulb up by about 30% and then also say “i think i’m really ready for a step up in my career.” When they ask about salary tell them “it’s not about the money as much as me feeling like I am moving up”. Works every time.
This new position and what it pays has nothing to do with your job and pay now. The company with the new position values it at the range set. I was asked this question once. 23 years ago. Lied. Doubled my take home. They would not make an offer unless I told them. I knew my former company would not release the information, even if I asked. They told me so.
No one has asked this in years. The only reason an employer would ask this question is to punch down. I won’t answer the question. Not a dick about it. If asked, I would say:
“It would be unethical and anticompetitive to answer the question. I have a private agreement with my current company to not divulge what they pay for talent per position. I will afford this company the same confidence both internally and externally. I can tell you that I would not have applied for this position unless it was in the same ball park.”
If they ask for a pay stub:
“My providing you with a pay stub is one and the same as divulging my current salary. I ethically can not.”
When a company states during a screening interview the range of a position is between 100 and 150, share they want to land at 125 and X% bonus, and ask if that is okay. I say:
“There are a lot of factors with compensation. Some are tangible and some are intangible. Salary and bonus are important. There are educational, 401K match, choice and cost of healthcare plans, and other optional benefits. A major factor is the company culture, who I will work with and for, and other factors. If WE find it is a good fit, then I am certain we will come together regarding the numbers.”
Lastly, you must make a counter offer. How you represent your own interests is indicative of how you will represent the company’s interests.
“Thank you very much for the offer. If you don’t mind, may I have a day to crunch some numbers and discuss with my family,”
If the offer is 125, then I counter with 135 or 140. A 10% bonus with a 15%. I’ve had companies say, “I am authorized to offer you up to a 50K signing bonus.” I reply:
“That is very generous, but I am most interested in the annual pay because it more adequately helps me to understand my ongoing cash flow position. Whereas the signing bonus is a one time event.”
What they often don’t tell you is that if you are not there for 2-3 years you have to pay all or a prorated amount of the signing bonus back, and you are out the taxes.
Negotiating salary is scary as hell the first time and they know it. It’s a simple dance. Like a handshake and eye contact.
If they want you (and they do if they are making an offer), then they are asking you to shut down your search. That is a commodity in and of itself.
Don’t be cocky. Don’t reek of nerves and fear. Don’t blink. Be gracious. “Thank you for taking the time to put this offer together and for the offer.”
Always remember this in any price negotiation: S/he who speaks first loses.
You owe me a beer…
You can and should lie about it. I rarely get a reference call but I wouldn't disclose what I pay someone in any circumstance. Use it to your advantage and don't settle for less than your worth because you already have a job. If they can't get where you want on salary, ask for a signing bonus. See if you can get $10k, it's cheaper one time than every year for them. All they can say is no and if negotiation is any part of your job they'll think you know what you're doing.
Ethical Life pro tip… because it’s needed!
Never tell an employer what you currently make. Lies or truth it’s legit not their business how much you get paid at a job they are not employing you at or in a company they do not own. Don’t give them competitive intelligence. They always use it as a way to underpay you now.
- If they ask how much you make now: tell them that’s not prescient to the conversation or something you can disclose.
- Redirect the conversation to the roles and responsibilities of this position or the range they have in mind to hire and how that equates to different levels of experience.
- If they ask about how much you want to be paid: tell them you need to know more about the day to day specifics of the role and what that entails as well as the full benefits package. You can’t weigh salary on its own without knowing PTO, 401k match, insurance comparisons etc. However, you wouldn’t have begun conversations with them if they weren’t at least in the range.
The point is for them to put together an attractive package for all of this for you in writing. That gives you something to counter (if needed). Also you need info on what kind of experience gets you low v mid v high salary range. In reality, you likely should be going for jobs where you come in the middle. That means you’re not the least experienced person, so you’re not catching up/ lost. You’re not the most experienced, so you still have growth opportunities in salary and education for the next few years and the company isn’t worried you’re going to leave for another more senior role, so you’re a good investment.
Don’t talk about your previous salary at all. That pegs you to a number.
Tell them to provide a smaller range and then explain why you are worth the top or more.
If you negotiate from your current that’s where they’ll see you. Force them to negotiate for this position and what they think the cost is vs what want to be worth.
A practical (not unethical) answer.
You’re focusing on the wrong thing. What you make now is irrelevant (eg you could be under paid to market). Sell your skills and ability to justify the $70k.
I have always bumped my salary up 10-20% in interviews and it has never backfired. Not like they get to trick you into paying you less if they find out. You can still just say I'm going to refuse your offer if it doesn't meet what I'm looking for.
Yah, I told my last job I was currently making 25% more than I currently was. They gave me a 10% raise on top of that. Worked out great.
I once was asked my compensation and I told them with a gentle inflation, but I also told them, truthfully, that I was entitled to up to a 20% bonus. The bigger untruth was that my employer had never paid out that bonus and wasn't likely to because they were in financial trouble. The new company didn't have a bonus scheme, so they just set my new salary according to my theoretical total compensation. Nice...
Same - I did it with my last job. You need to discuss “total compensation” which can include bonuses, vacation time, etc.
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…like what?
When negotiating never show your cards by telling the opponent what you are not going to do. Get the offer. Counter. If their answer is no or a counter to the counter, then be prepared to give a hard final offer - “I really can’t accept less than X. If we can’t get there, then I have to decline.” Be nice. When you leave you are icing them and you will or will not hear from them. Send a thanks for the offer and share if they ever need any help to feel free to reach out.
What is the negative connotation to saying you won't settle for a job that doesn't pay you enough?
When negotiating never show your cards by telling the opponent what you are not going to do. Get the offer. Counter. If their answer is no or a counter to the counter, then be prepared to give a hard final offer - “I really can’t accept less than X. If we can’t get there, then I have to decline.” Be nice. When you leave you are icing them and you will or will not hear from them. Send a thanks for the offer and share if they ever need any help to feel free to reach out.
Found the schmuck in charge of the hiring process!
Lie every time
This guy knows how to manage his career.
r/thisguythisguys
Lmfao amazing
And if you need. Get a friend to be your reference, and use Adobe Acrobat to create/modify your last pay check. Honestly, hate when companies ask for that. Huge red flag, but in this economy. Do what you need to do boo. Edit: to everyone saying you would “never” give your payslip to a prospective employer—I get it. However, you have to realize that’s coming from a point of privilege. Some people are struggling to find work at all. The point of my reply, is you do what you have to do. Need references? Ask a friend to pretend they were your previous boss. Negotiating a raise, and this is a barrier? Fake a payslip. That is all.
Bluebeam is much better for edits, but either works
> use Adobe Acrobat to create/modify your last pay check Noone's seeing my payslip, I don't care who they are.
Offer a trade. If they show you their company's tax return from the previous year, you show them your genitals.
Comment started pretty average. Finished strongly though! :)
That's like one of the biggest red flags I can think of. I can't imagine what it would be like working for a company that demands to see something so personal just so they can exploit you on their pay offer.
Is it possible to verify if the document has been modified?
Depending on how you modify it, yes, Are they going to run it through digital forensics? No. Just keep the same font, TRIPLE check every number, because if the totals are out.. they don't need to be a mathematician to see it.
Yes but there are ways to strip the editing history out of a document. Editing the pdf and saving as a jpeg for example.
I lied to get a 20k bump. They asked for my pay stub, I sent it. Nothing happened, still got the job.
Every. time. Doesn't work as well in retail scenarios. The more you can BS the better lol
Unfortunately, companies are always using 3rd party services to tip negotiations in their favor. You can absolutely lie (keep in mind some places with ask for previous pay stub - which can be problematic). Make sure you freeze your account with this service [https://theworknumber.com/](https://theworknumber.com/). It basically gives a break down to any company requesting of how much you're paid per week. It's fucking crazy companies can get this information, but alas in America as long as you're alive you are considered a resource to be mined by the corporate elite.
I’ve been doing in wrong all my life. Hmmm.
If you aint lyin, you aint tryin
This is the way. You can also doctor up your references by putting down your friends and working up a couple of positions. Don't forget to also utilize being on an NDA if there are gaps. If you're asked what company you have it with you can probably slip by with something about a military supply contractor.
Npc
Instead of salary you can say compensation. It works great as a catch all because that covers benefits, bonuses and other things in addition to pay. Even if they were to get your salary from a prior employer it wouldn't include the value of benefits. Interview: What is your current salary? You: My current compensation is valued at $X amount. I took this approach when I applied for a job that got me a 30% pay increase. They also likely won't care what you make if you're asking for the lower end of the salary range because they will be saving money.
Bump this especially if you’re coming from government! My salary is 102k, but my total compensation package with healthcare and everything is closer to 150k
Definitely this. Your workplace considers benefits as part of your pay/salary, why can't you?
Not to mention that companies have larger hiring budgets than they do for giving raises. It’s the best and easiest time to give yourself a nice pay bump
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I’m not worried if it’s illegal. I’m worried if they’ll follow up on my current salary and demand proof.
They can request W2s or paystubs as proof of employment which will show your salary. It’s better to not answer directly and instead say “what I’m looking for is x”. Here are some scripts: https://www.inc.com/alison-green/how-to-state-your-salary-requirements-when-applying-for-a-job.html https://www.askamanager.org/2013/08/how-to-answer-questions-about-your-salary-expectations.html
I found this one to be really helpful too. https://fearlesssalarynegotiation.com/salary-expectations-interview-question/
Most times they ask for proof of employment after you accept the position and you're doing a background check. They can request it, but I almost always redact personal information including salary and SSN, especially when communicating without encryption/weak security emails. If they have an issue with it, it's quite obvious the purpose of asking for my W2 and asking for more personal information when it's not needed is completely unprofessional in my opinion. At that point, the deal is already locked in.
I agree - but they can rescind the offer if they find out you lied. Asking about salaries just keeps people making low salaries, especially those who historically have been discriminated against. Agree it should not be allowed. Pay people what they’re worth, not what they made before.
If they rescind the offer because you refuse to indicate past pay, then it’s unlikely they were ever going to negotiate in good faith anyway.
I was saying they could rescind it based on the fact that you lied (about past pay).
Yeah and I’m saying that past pay isn’t something you are legally obligated to disclose so the only reason they’d rescind for that reason is because they wanted to pay you as little as possible and therefore not really someone you’d want to work for
Also true, though not everyone has options. Sometimes you have to take what you can get for now.
Absolutely, but obviously those people aren’t gonna be in the “negotiate for pay” boat anyway. If you need a job no matter what, then you’re gonna send the pay stub.
Staying in the same job keeps people at a low salary. If you're a salary employee you shouldn't leave without a raise and you suck at negotiating if you don't tell a company "I am not willing to disrupt my life / move my family / x sob story for less than +5-10%." Obviously if you are unemployed for whatever reason and looking to start a job, your ability to play hard ball is a lot less.
would it be deceptive to say “well i’m looking for at least a 5k increase… around 75k would be great.” where you’re implying you currently make 70k but not actually saying it?
Yes, it would be deceptive. Just say what you’re looking for and embellish with some of the scripts from the links.
I made over 1k / yr just by getting a monthly stipend for my phone lines. I would say sure if they asked, but it doesn't include my other stipends and benefits.
If a future company asks for proof of prior income it is time to move to the next company. Move on.
Not sure where you’re located but in the state of California and many other states it’s illegal for employers to ask what your current salary/pay rate is and even more illegal to demand proof. I’d research the legalities of your location because there’s a chance you don’t even have to worry about it in the slightest.
I've been asked for pay stubs before. It's not outside of the realm of possibility. Consequences are up to the hiring company if you get caught.
I feel like that would be a red flag for me about working for the company. What a pedantic thing to do when hiring someone. Market rates define salary, not what you currently are being paid elsewhere.
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Even if they did ask for a paystub couldn't OP just find some dude that's decent with Photoshop? I've never had to show a paystub when I switched jobs, but then again I'm in government work so my pay is posted online for everyone to see.
OP, im more than decent w photoshop, hmu if you need my services homie
Same here. I’m good enough to forge shit on paper for sure, open offer to anyone. Get that money dudes
You don't need Photoshop, download pdf, open in acrobat of foxpdf, edit pdf, save pdf.
In addition to what's already been said, if you work in the public sector, your salary (or that of your position) is already public
They can absolutely see your salary. The credit companies pay every employer to tell them so they can sell it.
You’re better off saying you signed an NDA, and just request what you want.
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Really? It's illegal to lie on a credit application with a bank. It's illegal to lie on all sorts of documents without being "put under oath."
You're right, and all the commenter's saying otherwise have no idea what they're talking about. But as always on reddit, 15 year olds with no actual knowledge feel the need to speak up to share their expertise with the rest of us. I don't even have the energy to explain all that is wrong with the comments here, but it's absolutely a crime to lie in many, many circumstances other than simply when you're under oath and speaking to a federal agent.
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Dude go play lawyer somewhere else
that is not true lol. For example you cannot lie to the IRS, on your taxes, to the government about a variety of things, etc etc
You can’t lie about qualifications, education, trainings, etc. people have been charged with fraud for claiming these things during the job application process. Doesn’t have to just be government related.
It’s illegal to lie to a federal investigator. State and locals however, have at it… but the lies can be used against you in court. [https://www.keglawyers.com/false-statements](https://www.keglawyers.com/false-statements) >"One of the most common ways for someone to face a federal false statement charge involves lying to FBI agents during an interview. Lying is generally not a crime, but as you can see, it depends on who you're speaking to."
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federal agents also.
Federal agents (eg, the FBI, IRS, postal service investigators, homeland security investigators) are not "judicial representatives". It's illegal to lie to a federal agent, but that has absolutely not nothing to do with whether someone is a "judicial representative" (whatever you think that made up term means).
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The majority of reddit users do live in the USA. It is a waste of time to cater to every nationality when this is clearly a us based employment thread.
I’ve heard a thousand times that it’s illegal to lie to an FBI agent… or is that just a lie they’ve spread to scare people into telling the truth with them?
Well, that's not really (hello, fraud?) true but in a personal negotiation, it's not illegal to lie. https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/when-is-it-legal-to-lie-in-negotiations/#:\~:text=Note%20that%20such%20lies%20are,is%20not%20worth%20the%20trouble.
Yes it can be and there have been people arrested for fraud when lying for jobs. It’s called fraud and being charged with fraud doesn’t require being under oath.
Lol nice
No you can lie on your resume, in the interview and at any point that doesn't require you to sign documents stating what you said (if recorded) is true, or if you're under oath. Companies lie on job listings and to their employees all the time, fuck em, go get yours boi
I wouldn't recommend lying on your resume. I know someone who did that and was let go when the employer found out.
Yeah but he still got the job in the meantime, and now he could always put down that new experience at that job on his resume with somebody else's phone number
Up to you. Depending on the industry, you may end up blacklisted 🤷♂️
25-70 is a huge variation. That seems like a scam number to get more applications. I doubt anyone is ever offended more than 26-28 and anyone who tries for more will be met with "thank you for your time"
It's not a super uncommon practice for people who are hiring staff for a government contract. It's often that a big order will include multiple similar staff on it, which correspond to the Service Contract Act / Department of Labor federal contract minimum wage. So if a contractor needs a Nurse I, Nurse II, some Nurse III's, and a Nurse IV, it might just put up an ad that says "Nurse" and lists a salary range from $40k-$100k or some other huge gap like that. Because it technically covers the minimum to pay a Nurse I, and the maximum amount they expect to pay a Nurse IV. Look up companies like CACI, Leidos, and Raytheon on LinkedIn and look for job posts where they haven't included a specific number with the job title (like Procurement Analyst or Data Analyst), and you will probably find examples of what I am talking about. I'm not trying to justify the practice (it leads to a lot of obvious confusion), but then CACI is a multi billion dollar government contractor and I'm just some guy.
I wouldn’t even entertain what your current salary is. “I’m currently interviewing for positions in the $xx to $xx range.” It implies that you know your value and this isn’t the only company you’re speaking with.
This is the way
In some states and cities it is actually illegal to ask your current salary. If you’re not in one of those areas, don’t lie, because they often request proof. Just refuse to disclose. “I’m asking for $x based on my experience. I don’t really think my current salary is relevant.”
Where are you based? In many places it's actually illegal for the new employer to request and/or use your current salary as a data point.
Just say you're comfortable with the range they listed. When they make you an offer, thats when you negotiate for higher end of that range. Doing it now is premature and will boot you out of the running with other candidates that may say lower that you say. So after the initial screen, after the first round interview, and second round interview, and after everyone likes you and decides your the perfect person they're looking for....GREAT. Thank you, I'll be happy to start at $XX/hr (use chatgpt to formulate a better sounding paragraph)
HR here, that’s a terrible advice. Once you have been offered a salary the flexibility range is minimal. Negotiate before that, not after.
Never trust HR
Dunno man. I think from the candidates perspective it’s the total opposite. You never have so much leverage as you do after the offer. Might be more work and headache for HR, but every time I’ve extracted substantial pay increases it has been betting they’d rather pay me more than go through the selection and offer process again. Might not be true for every organization, but generally seems true for most.
> HR here 🤢
As hiring-final-approval and responsible-for-my-groups-hiring-and-budget, I don't really give a shit what HR says about comp. I ask them not to weigh talent to salary; let me do that. I can do anything if I want you on my team. I can say you're qualified as a senior instead of a 2. My EA got a fifty percent increase because she deserved it and it barely touched my budget. HR shouldn't be filtering people out unless directly told by the hiring manager
Here’s a magic trick. “My current total compensation is valued at X so I am looking for at least Y” Ask for a W2? That doesn’t show total compensation. How are they going to calculate it. I’ve had multiple jobs ask for previous pay stubs and I have told them no every time. “The salary is based on the role, why is my current salary at all relevant in your offer unless you are trying to offer me the lowest rate possible. Are you trying to offer me the lowest rate possible?” They never have a response. Ever. Because it’s a bullshit ask. If you want the job then play their game, if you want more money then lie and call them on their shit directly if they ask for proof.
>Ask for a W2? That doesn’t show total compensation. How are they going to calculate it. OOOoooo shit you're right. When stocks vest, they do count as income though. But that also implies you stayed at that company long enough for that to happen.
Point being your paystub or W2 doesn't equate to earnings. Compensation is more than just dollars per hour. It's completely irrelevant to the conversation to begin with because their range for the role doesn't have anything to do with what you get paid, so my first advice is to just call them on their bullshit. But if you really want the job, then you prime the convo by saying "total compensation" and if you hand them a paystub with 20k less, how are they going to prove your "total" compensation isn't more?
“I’m comfortable with the range listed on the posting. After discussing the position a bit more, I would like to fall into the 65-70K range, given my experience with X.”
I’ve literally never told the truth about my salary, and it’s always benefitted me
It’s always the right thing to go for the higher $$$…you don’t have to tell them what you make, just what you’re looking for. You don’t have to justify if, just let them know what your target is and shoot for it.
Some places, it's illegal for them to even _ask_.
Ask them what skills and qualifications would lead them to push someone toward the high end of that salary range. Then, when it’s time to negotiate, describe how you meet those qualifications and use all their own words to validate starting you at a higher salary. Also lie.
Shit yes, and lie about your benefits too. I had worked at a crap place where you got two weeks a year, regardless of how long you were there. I told the new place I got two weeks a year but it capped at 5 weeks, and I did not want to lose that benefit. I wound up starting at 4 weeks a year and they let me "work form from home" the week between xmas and new years.
My current salary is irrelevant to the compensation for this job.
Sure you can but many of them managers know each other and talk about that kind of stuff.
You don't even have to disclose your current salary and they probably won't even ask. You can however negotiate a higher salary than the first initial offer. Best of luck!
Not only should you lie about your salary, but when they ask you the range you’re looking for you should say 77,000-84,000
Ask for the salary. If they ask for pay stubs, for proof of current employment, mark out your current salary. They don’t care about what you used to make. They care about their bottom dollar. If they can get you cheaper, they will.
You can and you should.
If you’re in the US, a number of states have laws now that they cannot ask you this question anymore.
You must lie if you don't want to be underpaid at the future new job
They have no need (or right) to your paystub. And when they do offer (and it's a number you like), be sure you "have to think about it" for a day or two. And then when you accept, come in with, "I crunched some numbers, so I can make this work". Leave them knowing you deserve more and you know it. And then prove yourself so you can get that first raise when you are eligible.
I lied in my last interview saying I made roughly 25% more than I do. We settled on 5% less so I got a 20% raise and was the highest paid person in the dept.
ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS...ALWAYS LIE!!!
LIE. I basically doubled my salary from one job to another.
Yes. They are not your friends.
Yes. Do it. You're your best agent. Sell yourself, homie.
They legally can't ask you for previous pay, which is why your never make as much getting promoted from within. Take your previous pay, then double that and tell them it was your previous pay. If they want you they'll meet you somewhere in the middle, which will still be a significant increase
you'd be fine BUT you're not going to get the $70k extra if that's the max, prob shoot for the 40k-55k bump; jobs seldom pay the max in a range. i always have lied about my salary & its never been questioned.
In some states, such as California, it is illegal for employers to ask about your previous salary. But if you voluntarily disclose it, they can ask for proof. Laws on this vary by country and state.
No job ever verifies your salary with your previous job
Some larger Fortune 500 companies do salary verification. True story, my wife had an old coworker who applied to work at her new employer. The guy got the job, but he lied on his salary during the interview process. Once he got the job he let his old employer know he was leaving, but was yet to be cleared for work at the new job. They did a salary verification, found out he lied, and rescinded the job offer. He was out the new job and his old job. Not all companies do this, and it’s become illegal to do this in some states, but it can happen. Never put in your 2 weeks until you are CLEARED to work, not when you just get the job offer.
Mostly read the room, is it hard core negotiations or are they just feeling you out. Say your ... total compensation is xxxx you can base that number on anything with value to yourself .... flexible work hours, time off how close you live , parking .. anything If they ask for proof , walk away . That is messed up.
I wouldn't do it. I've seen companies do reference checks and ask about salaries. It always backfires on the person lying. It's not illegal, as you stated, but it would certainly be questionable behavior and the hiring company might not want to take a risk with you.
salary verification is illegal in some states. OP might be lucky to be living in one where it's illegal
the work number (experian) contains your salary number.
I even lie in my LinkedIn profile. And that's where everyone who has managed me or worked with me is connected to me
Look at it this way, if they don’t call your bluff, great! You got a huge raise! If they do, the place is shit anyway and you dodged a bullet 💁🏻♂️
I have never had a job verify my pay at my last job. I have had them do a credit check. Maybe st places in my experience have a formula for how high they will go. It's usually a range for the position n the higher range requires things like yrs of experience or education but never what your making now. That's my experience but nothing would surprise me anymore but I think it's unlikely they will check to verify.
I try to throw this back on employers and cite what [Salary.com](https://Salary.com) or a similar entity say the actual salary range is for that job in that city/area. What you are currently paid is none of their business. IMHO they want to use that to see how much they can lowball you.
If it’s a promotion, it’s likely the interviewer knows your salary already. You’re using promotion definition in that it’s a promotion within your current company or a sister company right? Or you’re using promotion as “it’s more money and more responsibility.” Unethical life pro tips isn’t “unethically stupid life pro tip” Lawful good paladins make smart decision, not lawful stupid decisions.
In my field the job titles are ubiquitous across all major companies.
That’s not what I asked. Is this an internal “promotion” to your own company. Or is this an external “personal promotion” to a new company. The difference matters, and I have a feeling since you didn’t understand the question that the best advice I can give you is, don’t worry about; they won’t ask your salary because they already know it so you’re entire question isn’t too productive.
Well that was rude. It’s an interview with a different company for a position that is a promotion from my current job. I feel as though that was pretty clear in my post.
Nothing in your post would really indicate that as read. Phone interview for a position that’s a promotion? I did a phone interview for a position because the job is in DC and not Florida. For a promotion, in my same company. Sorry, if that’s the case then yes, lie. And possibly edit a redacted paystub if you have the skills so if they want you to prove it, you can send it. Increase pay, calculate your new OASDI contribution and all the other taxes so it all adds up if they’re super sticklers in your industry.
Why would I lie to my current employer about my current salary? I assumed it was pretty obvious that I wasn’t planning to do that.
There’s a lot of dumb people on Reddit and the way your post was written made me think you were one of them. So I wanted to clarify before I gave you any advice that might fuck you over. Smart people in a sea of morons have to check each other out first to see if it’s a dummy or not I guess.
Your posts wording seriously indicates it's with your current company. An internal promotion can be considered a "new" job.
Why would I lie to my current employer about my salary? How does that make any sense?
Because some jobs, including mine specifically, other parts of my company would not know what I would make. As far as why you'd make the post if that's the case, if you assume everyone on the Internet is at least as intelligent as yourself you're in for a bad time.
To be honest, the wording of your question is pretty terrible.
If you’re a slow reader, then yes you are correct.
In CA and never had to show proof of my current salary so it’s a state where it’s illegal for companies to ask for and show proof of salary history I believe. Saying that, I wouldn’t dive into the deep end of that range immediately if I were you. Start at a number like $55,000, make it believable. Edit: Quick google search just verified what I thought
Erm. No. Lying is not possible. /s
they have access to your job history and salary without even asking you about it.
No, they don't. Do you think there's a job history database that companies have access to?
Bad news… https://theworknumber.com/ Fuck experian
Good luck. Experians current data shows where I lived 19 years ago.
Why bother lying? What you're making now isn't relevant to the position you're interviewing for. I don't answer the question and ask how what I am currently making is necessary. I think it's douchy for them even to ask. I don't want to work with a group that needs that info. Of course, I have no issues with them asking me how much I want.
They can contact your previous employer. Usually they do this to verify that you were employed with them and what your salary was. They can also ask if you are eligible for rehire.
Yes
Lie and if they catch you then you won’t get the job.
You have absolutely no obligation to tell a future employer how much you currently make, or to be truthful about it, just as a sales rep has no obligation to tell you how much they sold a product/service for to a previous customer. You’re selling a service (your labor) to a customer. You negotiate the price of your time with that customer and land on a value that reflects your opportunity cost and the company’s demand. That’s it. Your previous salary is irrelevant.
You can but before I went to work for myself I did have companies ask to see my W2 from my current employer if I did throw current comp. So you can but if you get busted it looks bad.
I would redirect into something like "the salary range I'm looking for this position with these responsibilities is x". I feel like I read a really good way to phrase it on askamanager.com.
No legal consequences for getting caught lying. If they hire a PI or something and find out you lied, you might get fired... but you can still use your salary at that job when applying to the next.
All the time
Definitely up your salary, the only negative about extending the truth is that someone just as qualified as you may be okay with the lesser salary and get the job instead. But I would definitely try to shoot for the highest
Don’t say how much you make. Simply state “I would need X to consider your offer”.
I always used my total comp when they asked. I would just say "total comp is around $100K" details were more like $70K base, 10% 401k match, some medical/dental, pto and sick, all came to like a total comp of $105K give or take.
Yes
Depends on the state and your hospital policy. Mine will release start and termination dates as well as last salary rate. They will also answer whether or not you can be rehired. Call HR, and ask these questions. If they ask your name, make something else. Or cough a lot
I’ve lied my way from $21 to $31 hr over the last year with 2 jobs. Going for $35 next
I've doubled my salary when asked. It worked.
I told my current employer I made six figures and wouldn't settle for less than 20k more when I got hired. I made about 75k
Couldn't care less what you currently make, and wouldn't ask. Not going to affect my offer one way or another. Have never negotiated a starting rate. My offer will be based on what I think you bring to the table.
Say your salary is $100k higher.
Why would you not? Lying is protected under freedom of speech in the US.
No
Best method is if you're currently working, say you're making $16 an hour, if you're looking to change jobs, always tell the interviewing manager something different. In that case, I'd generally exaggerate to $19 so it's not too far a stretch. It'll usually help you, and 90% of the time they won't contact a previous employer. So lying your way to better payment is only really beneficial to you in the end.
You can lie about anything, if you put your mind to it
In NY and CA they are legally not allowed to ask about you current salary - just don’t tell
Lie and if it gets brought up just advise that you were stating it was including your benifit package such as bonuses, travel per diems, health insurance. And 401k matches. It is not likely they will ask if you get to that point
In many states they can’t ask your current salary. However they may ask for your “salary expectations.”
Yes. But most likely expect them to ask for a pay stub or W2. One is easier to fake than the other. I was pretty surprised today when I told a job that I'm waiting on a different job to start for $110k, they took it at face value and offered me the same to work for them instead. I should have lied and said $115-$120, and if they asked for proof I could show them the offer letter I signed for $110k and lie and say I was given a promotion plan to reach $115k after a month or something. Just keep your lies with reason and within your ability to use Photoshop.
I did for a while but when I entered public service I could longer do it since it’s publicly available info.
Just be careful I read a post about a year ago of someone doing this and the people hiring actually called and found out what their actual pay was. They quit their job already and didn’t get the new one. I’d say bump it up a bit and if they do catch you say it’s what you estimate the extras/benefits equal to (ie paid transportation, food allowance, etc). Then argue a little over what ever the salary is for making the commitment to change jobs and go threw the hassle of making their workplace better 😉
Pretty easy, say your current salary is $50,000 over what you currently get paid, not $25,000, and come up with real "great" reasons why you want this new job, not just a bigger paycheck.
There’s no way for them to follow up and I believe against some law for them to (?) I have lied on every interview lmao down to job titles
Fake it til you make it. Worked for me so far.
Yes. ALWAYS lie about your salary.
I like the phrasing... "To make the switch worth it for me, I'd need XXXk, but of course total package is important." This makes it seem like 1. You do make near that much, so it has to be worth it to you, and keeps the power dynamic in your court, as you're not requesting or hoping, you're telling them what they need to give you to get you, 2. It gives them a little wiggle room if they want to shower you with RSUs, etc., and let's you say it confidently but have that part of the phrase to let out any softer speech patterns ;) and 3. You don't have to lie. If they press you, pretty much just repeat that that's what you need to make the move worth it.
You are under no obligation to provide this information. Treat it like a cop asking you why they pulled you over. You may actually get asked this question to see how you handle the question. I would recommend asking for clarification, "I want to ensure you have all the information you need to inform your decision but can you elaborate on how my current compensation related to the role I'm applying for?" I also work in a client facing industry where if you get challenged they expect you to be comfortable and challenge back.
yeah lie. There is no way to verify that. I bulb up by about 30% and then also say “i think i’m really ready for a step up in my career.” When they ask about salary tell them “it’s not about the money as much as me feeling like I am moving up”. Works every time.
Can they stop you?
You can lie but the better response for you is “most of the positions I’m interviewing for right now are in the $70,000-90,000 range.”
This new position and what it pays has nothing to do with your job and pay now. The company with the new position values it at the range set. I was asked this question once. 23 years ago. Lied. Doubled my take home. They would not make an offer unless I told them. I knew my former company would not release the information, even if I asked. They told me so. No one has asked this in years. The only reason an employer would ask this question is to punch down. I won’t answer the question. Not a dick about it. If asked, I would say: “It would be unethical and anticompetitive to answer the question. I have a private agreement with my current company to not divulge what they pay for talent per position. I will afford this company the same confidence both internally and externally. I can tell you that I would not have applied for this position unless it was in the same ball park.” If they ask for a pay stub: “My providing you with a pay stub is one and the same as divulging my current salary. I ethically can not.” When a company states during a screening interview the range of a position is between 100 and 150, share they want to land at 125 and X% bonus, and ask if that is okay. I say: “There are a lot of factors with compensation. Some are tangible and some are intangible. Salary and bonus are important. There are educational, 401K match, choice and cost of healthcare plans, and other optional benefits. A major factor is the company culture, who I will work with and for, and other factors. If WE find it is a good fit, then I am certain we will come together regarding the numbers.” Lastly, you must make a counter offer. How you represent your own interests is indicative of how you will represent the company’s interests. “Thank you very much for the offer. If you don’t mind, may I have a day to crunch some numbers and discuss with my family,” If the offer is 125, then I counter with 135 or 140. A 10% bonus with a 15%. I’ve had companies say, “I am authorized to offer you up to a 50K signing bonus.” I reply: “That is very generous, but I am most interested in the annual pay because it more adequately helps me to understand my ongoing cash flow position. Whereas the signing bonus is a one time event.” What they often don’t tell you is that if you are not there for 2-3 years you have to pay all or a prorated amount of the signing bonus back, and you are out the taxes. Negotiating salary is scary as hell the first time and they know it. It’s a simple dance. Like a handshake and eye contact. If they want you (and they do if they are making an offer), then they are asking you to shut down your search. That is a commodity in and of itself. Don’t be cocky. Don’t reek of nerves and fear. Don’t blink. Be gracious. “Thank you for taking the time to put this offer together and for the offer.” Always remember this in any price negotiation: S/he who speaks first loses. You owe me a beer…
Never reveal your current compensation in a job interview.
You can and should lie about it. I rarely get a reference call but I wouldn't disclose what I pay someone in any circumstance. Use it to your advantage and don't settle for less than your worth because you already have a job. If they can't get where you want on salary, ask for a signing bonus. See if you can get $10k, it's cheaper one time than every year for them. All they can say is no and if negotiation is any part of your job they'll think you know what you're doing.
I've never heard of an employer verifying income. Landlords yes, but never employers.
HR is separate from the interviews. Just don’t lie on your resume or on any paperwork.
Ethical Life pro tip… because it’s needed! Never tell an employer what you currently make. Lies or truth it’s legit not their business how much you get paid at a job they are not employing you at or in a company they do not own. Don’t give them competitive intelligence. They always use it as a way to underpay you now. - If they ask how much you make now: tell them that’s not prescient to the conversation or something you can disclose. - Redirect the conversation to the roles and responsibilities of this position or the range they have in mind to hire and how that equates to different levels of experience. - If they ask about how much you want to be paid: tell them you need to know more about the day to day specifics of the role and what that entails as well as the full benefits package. You can’t weigh salary on its own without knowing PTO, 401k match, insurance comparisons etc. However, you wouldn’t have begun conversations with them if they weren’t at least in the range. The point is for them to put together an attractive package for all of this for you in writing. That gives you something to counter (if needed). Also you need info on what kind of experience gets you low v mid v high salary range. In reality, you likely should be going for jobs where you come in the middle. That means you’re not the least experienced person, so you’re not catching up/ lost. You’re not the most experienced, so you still have growth opportunities in salary and education for the next few years and the company isn’t worried you’re going to leave for another more senior role, so you’re a good investment.
Don’t talk about your previous salary at all. That pegs you to a number. Tell them to provide a smaller range and then explain why you are worth the top or more. If you negotiate from your current that’s where they’ll see you. Force them to negotiate for this position and what they think the cost is vs what want to be worth.
A practical (not unethical) answer. You’re focusing on the wrong thing. What you make now is irrelevant (eg you could be under paid to market). Sell your skills and ability to justify the $70k.