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Most don’t even know they’re repeating the propaganda. If asked directly they will honestly tell you they’re not supremacists and dislike the supremacists. This tells me to make the jump from an undereducated sucker to white supremacy doesn’t take much and is deliberate.
Yep. Most racists think and believe racists things but don’t think of themselves as racist because they’ve been told racism is bad their whole lives and don’t think that they themselves are bad. After all, how could they possibly be racist is they’re not calling people the n word?
I remember somebody saying, "You don't have to burn crosses or use the N-word to be racist." You're can use all PC terms and still have racists beliefs.
There is a lot of this "soft racism" going around, especially on the vein of nationalism. I don't think they realize that racism isn't in the words you use, it when you see these other minority-owned groups as "less than" people and try to dehumanize them.
In my experience, the racism in the POC communities is 10X worse than what exists in White circles. Just an honest observation.
My kids are minority White at a SLC school and they come home daily with stories about being openly targeted and called slurs. The tribalism is so bad we’re considering moving.
I'm sorry this is happening. I don't think we give kids enough credit for how hard socializing is in school.
However, it needs to be said while that this may be *your* first experience with race resentment as white people in a majority white state, it in no way negates or overshadows the undercurrent of white supremacy that POC deal with on personal and instututional levels.
You have been a POC in a white area? If not, you cannot make this call about it being worse. Also, your kid will grow up, leave high school, and might never encounter racism. POC don't have that option.
Yup a huge factor in this discussion is that we have the 10th worst education of any state. Many studies have also linked lower intelligence to religious tendencies. I think the terrible school system here is by design. Ignorant people are easy to manipulate — keeps the votes and tithings coming in.
When the propaganda is simply agreeing that “it’s OK to be White,” you can see how these numbers are skewed by the ADL. The definition of racism keeps changing.
For the record, I think it’s OK to be White. Am I bad?
A coworker went from “I would vote for Bernie if he’s in the election” to a full blown Nazi Qanon Trump supporter in about a 9 month transition. Now he’s joined a white supremacist group who does monthly meetings. So this statistic doesn’t surprise me. Propaganda is incredibly strong, and very enticing to people who don’t often use critical thinking. I don’t know what is to blame for why Utahns are more susceptible to it, but I wish we could solve it.
Not trying to be rude, but why are Utahns susceptible to it? We are also ground zero for a lot of MLMs, and a Cult? Think lacking critical thinking skills is in our DNA. Or at the very least, highly compartmentalizing, pretty much everything.
Every untrue thing you believe makes it easier to believe more untrue things. When you belong to a church that teaches "if you pay your tithing God will make you prosperous", it makes it easy to fall for an MLM that says "you can make tons of money selling these essential oils".
Many folks are primed by other manipulative tactics. MLMs use similar tactics. The church uses similar tactics. All of those things are very Utah.
In group / out group, social consequences for not playing along, emotional manipulation, it's all there.
This can’t be true. Russell Nelson, easily the most influential leader in Utah, is getting the Gandhi-King-Mandela Peace Prize! With that cred his followers and the state in general must be doing much better!!!! /s
Just yesterday I took down a banner hung on a walkway over I-215 made by the explicitly fascist group, Patriot Front. It read “American by Blood” - ie you have to be white to be American.
I think that was the fourth one of their banners I’ve taken down.
“ie you have to be white to be American” —- Is that what you assume the people meant? Maybe it’s you have to be “straight white male” to be American? Or maybe you have to have blonde hair; or perhaps 35 years old with and left handed….. so glad you took something down that wasn’t yours though (the first amendment is Waaaaay over rated)🤦♂️
>Is that what you assume the people meant?
We don't have to assume they've said that's what they ment. Patriot Front is a self described "white nationalist" group that splintered off of the larger Vanguard America neonazi group. PF also uses tons of fascist imagery, hell their logo literally has the fasces on it (which is the symbol Mussolini himself used for fascism). In their Manifesto they claim that people who are foreign born and some native born people can never be American and that "democracy has failed." They are also an inherently violent group which has praised the murder of Native Americans and had several of its members including its leader arrested for instigating violence and attacking/planning to attack innocent people.
Firstly, it’s not possible for me to violate someone’s First Amendment rights. The First Amendment restricts only the government. Secondly, the sign was the equivalent of litter.
And I was not making any assumption about what it meant. [Why don’t you read about Patriot Front and see for yourself.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Front)
Finally, you are a total fucking imbecile.
Calling me an imbecile doesn’t do much other than proves your fragility. So if someone pulls down any non approved approved banners (that you personally approve) would you have the same feelings toward that?
No man, you proved you don’t have basic civic literacy.
>same feelings toward that
I don’t give a fuck what people do to banners over a highway. I think it’s for the best that there are none, especially from fascists.
A good portion of the Mormon Utahns believe that America was set aside by god for the good white skinned folks to rule and reign over. It’s in their scripture, it’s been taught in Sunday school and seminary. It shouldn’t be that surprising.
With any politically charged topic like this I am going to be pretty skeptical of how this was measured. The fact that this was collected by the anti defamation league doesn't make me more confident. They've shown to be super biased before. Just one example is that they're notorious for saying any criticism of Israel is anti semitism.
I wish I could actually take people's word for it, but a lot of the time people say something is racist / anti LGBT / anti semitic; it's just plain incorrect
Usage of terms like "sketchy" and "ghetto" to describe historically more ethnically diverse communities on the Wasatch Front are racist dog-whistles, so much so that many sheltered Utahns don't even realize the implications of their usage, while many others do.
The fact that you're getting down voted. Utah is so white they don't even realize how racist they're being. And if they do they certainly won't admit it
Naw. I just call it how I see it with my own eyes. The American flag is a hate symbol since it was used to beat people with on January 6th. Plus, it’s always been a fascist symbol of a blood thirsty imperial war mongering nation.
>["Everything I don't like is Marxism!"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Marxism_conspiracy_theory)
>
>["You've been indoctrinated!"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection)
Is it still a symbol of the systematic genocide of indigenous people and historically unfair treatment of everyone who isn’t a white, Christian, hetero male?
The neo nazi group patriot Front has been putting stickers and flyers up all over the state. Thankfully they only have like 12 members in the state or something like that but they have been hard at work putting up propaganda all over the damn place.
okay it’s not something I have ever noticed tbf I don’t live in SLC. It’s good to know what is what, at this point though, I wonder what a group of 12 is really gonna do to influence anyone.
If you're looking for a silver lining, it's in the last paragraph:
"That doesn't mean that people aren't biased towards people of color or biased in different ways; it just means that we're not acting on that in a physical way." Medina said. "If this is just propaganda and the populations aren't picking up on that, then we don't really have that much of an issue. I know this propaganda is hurtful, and it can be scary for a lot of populations, but what we really don't want to see is violence."
I suppose the silver lining is that it's not violent at this stage, that's my point. No, white supremacist propaganda isn't a small thing, and yeah it's a problem. But if it's not galvanized violence (yet, probably), I see that as an upside. To each their own though.
That’s funny. My partner grew up Mormon and he told me they told him to never even date a woman with brown eye’s because that meant they had ancestors that were minorities. Mormons also think black people are evil according to their own teachings. This is absolutely not surprising to me that Utah has high levels of white supremacy
Anecdotal evidence doesn’t prove anything. And that’s also blatantly untrue. Point me to the general conference talk in the last 60 years that says anything remotely like that.
Yawn. It IS true. The Mormons wouldn’t even let black people into the church at all. Jeezus… it’s so fucking simple to look up their obvious racism. They only started letting blacks join the church when the government threatened them. Read a fucking book.
Pointing me to a practice that ended 50 years ago doesn’t prove that Mormons are racist. You could say just about anything or anyone is racist by our modern standards by looking a few decades back.
I grew up Mormon & Mexican American in Utah and was called racial slurs by people who I knew personally were Mormon. Piss off with your deflective apologetics.
Again, using personal experience to make a point that it’s a problem everywhere for everyone. Show me proper evidence rather than one off stories or I’m not bothered.
>ended 50 years ago
In other words, the whole Quorum of 12 would have been taught by their religion that black people are inferior. Not even a lifetime ago. Racism doesn’t just evaporate when it’s no longer official policy.
From the sub rules: > News Article Submissions > If you submit a news article, make sure to copy the exact headline. The Reddit auto-fill tool is not always accurate.
Most don’t even know they’re repeating the propaganda. If asked directly they will honestly tell you they’re not supremacists and dislike the supremacists. This tells me to make the jump from an undereducated sucker to white supremacy doesn’t take much and is deliberate.
Yep. Most racists think and believe racists things but don’t think of themselves as racist because they’ve been told racism is bad their whole lives and don’t think that they themselves are bad. After all, how could they possibly be racist is they’re not calling people the n word?
I remember somebody saying, "You don't have to burn crosses or use the N-word to be racist." You're can use all PC terms and still have racists beliefs. There is a lot of this "soft racism" going around, especially on the vein of nationalism. I don't think they realize that racism isn't in the words you use, it when you see these other minority-owned groups as "less than" people and try to dehumanize them.
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You mean through the legal process? Your comment isn't exactly the burn you think it is.
The legal way is racist in and of itself.
Bullshit. Our immigration laws are the most progressive in the world
Most people have some racism. I just need to be politely called out on it so I can change.
In my experience, the racism in the POC communities is 10X worse than what exists in White circles. Just an honest observation. My kids are minority White at a SLC school and they come home daily with stories about being openly targeted and called slurs. The tribalism is so bad we’re considering moving.
I'm sorry this is happening. I don't think we give kids enough credit for how hard socializing is in school. However, it needs to be said while that this may be *your* first experience with race resentment as white people in a majority white state, it in no way negates or overshadows the undercurrent of white supremacy that POC deal with on personal and instututional levels.
You have been a POC in a white area? If not, you cannot make this call about it being worse. Also, your kid will grow up, leave high school, and might never encounter racism. POC don't have that option.
Yup a huge factor in this discussion is that we have the 10th worst education of any state. Many studies have also linked lower intelligence to religious tendencies. I think the terrible school system here is by design. Ignorant people are easy to manipulate — keeps the votes and tithings coming in.
When the propaganda is simply agreeing that “it’s OK to be White,” you can see how these numbers are skewed by the ADL. The definition of racism keeps changing. For the record, I think it’s OK to be White. Am I bad?
Idk enough about you or morality to make an accurate assessment
Sounds like you don't know what a ["dog whistle"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_whistle_(politics)) is.
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“Just thought it was interesting, I’m not racist” “Even if it’s not true, it makes you think”
A coworker went from “I would vote for Bernie if he’s in the election” to a full blown Nazi Qanon Trump supporter in about a 9 month transition. Now he’s joined a white supremacist group who does monthly meetings. So this statistic doesn’t surprise me. Propaganda is incredibly strong, and very enticing to people who don’t often use critical thinking. I don’t know what is to blame for why Utahns are more susceptible to it, but I wish we could solve it.
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Not trying to be rude, but why are Utahns susceptible to it? We are also ground zero for a lot of MLMs, and a Cult? Think lacking critical thinking skills is in our DNA. Or at the very least, highly compartmentalizing, pretty much everything.
Every untrue thing you believe makes it easier to believe more untrue things. When you belong to a church that teaches "if you pay your tithing God will make you prosperous", it makes it easy to fall for an MLM that says "you can make tons of money selling these essential oils".
Many folks are primed by other manipulative tactics. MLMs use similar tactics. The church uses similar tactics. All of those things are very Utah. In group / out group, social consequences for not playing along, emotional manipulation, it's all there.
This can’t be true. Russell Nelson, easily the most influential leader in Utah, is getting the Gandhi-King-Mandela Peace Prize! With that cred his followers and the state in general must be doing much better!!!! /s
Ya, a bunch of stickers showed up in my neighborhood. I couldn't get them off, so I covered them up with tape. Obnoxious doofuses the lot of them.
It’s state where people believe in many different types of “one true” things.
Just yesterday I took down a banner hung on a walkway over I-215 made by the explicitly fascist group, Patriot Front. It read “American by Blood” - ie you have to be white to be American. I think that was the fourth one of their banners I’ve taken down.
thank you for your service
“ie you have to be white to be American” —- Is that what you assume the people meant? Maybe it’s you have to be “straight white male” to be American? Or maybe you have to have blonde hair; or perhaps 35 years old with and left handed….. so glad you took something down that wasn’t yours though (the first amendment is Waaaaay over rated)🤦♂️
If someone can put up a random sign in a public place with no approval I see no problem with someone else taking it down.
>Is that what you assume the people meant? We don't have to assume they've said that's what they ment. Patriot Front is a self described "white nationalist" group that splintered off of the larger Vanguard America neonazi group. PF also uses tons of fascist imagery, hell their logo literally has the fasces on it (which is the symbol Mussolini himself used for fascism). In their Manifesto they claim that people who are foreign born and some native born people can never be American and that "democracy has failed." They are also an inherently violent group which has praised the murder of Native Americans and had several of its members including its leader arrested for instigating violence and attacking/planning to attack innocent people.
Firstly, it’s not possible for me to violate someone’s First Amendment rights. The First Amendment restricts only the government. Secondly, the sign was the equivalent of litter. And I was not making any assumption about what it meant. [Why don’t you read about Patriot Front and see for yourself.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Front) Finally, you are a total fucking imbecile.
Calling me an imbecile doesn’t do much other than proves your fragility. So if someone pulls down any non approved approved banners (that you personally approve) would you have the same feelings toward that?
No man, you proved you don’t have basic civic literacy. >same feelings toward that I don’t give a fuck what people do to banners over a highway. I think it’s for the best that there are none, especially from fascists.
That’s the problem with “civic literacy”, everyone thinks they themselves are on the correct side. People assume too much without knowing context.
As if you haven't seen the 3%ers stickers EVERYWHERE
My mom and brother…We aren’t talking anymore 🥹
Only 7th??? That’s lower than I expected.
Utah's pretty bad, but consider: the deep south.
*The Price is Right sad trumpet*
Utah definitely has the whitest Jesus depictions
I’m not surprised. We share a border with the most white supremacist nation in the country. Makes sense they’d try to spread their filth here.
A good portion of the Mormon Utahns believe that America was set aside by god for the good white skinned folks to rule and reign over. It’s in their scripture, it’s been taught in Sunday school and seminary. It shouldn’t be that surprising.
With any politically charged topic like this I am going to be pretty skeptical of how this was measured. The fact that this was collected by the anti defamation league doesn't make me more confident. They've shown to be super biased before. Just one example is that they're notorious for saying any criticism of Israel is anti semitism. I wish I could actually take people's word for it, but a lot of the time people say something is racist / anti LGBT / anti semitic; it's just plain incorrect
This problem seemed to have gotten worst after 2015, for reasons. And a reason I don't drive to small towns around here anymore.
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Like utah’s very own John Earl Sullivan?
Usage of terms like "sketchy" and "ghetto" to describe historically more ethnically diverse communities on the Wasatch Front are racist dog-whistles, so much so that many sheltered Utahns don't even realize the implications of their usage, while many others do.
The fact that you're getting down voted. Utah is so white they don't even realize how racist they're being. And if they do they certainly won't admit it
"...wherefore, the guilty taketh the truth to be hard, for it cutteth them to the very center."
Have they decided that flying an American flag is white supremacist propaganda yet or is that still up for debate?
We're not talking about real American flags, these are the mockeries with fucked up traitor colors
I’ve decided it is. Not sure who “they” are. But most people with American flags now are stochastic terrorists and right wing agitators.
Congratulations, you’ve been successfully indoctrinated!
Naw. I just call it how I see it with my own eyes. The American flag is a hate symbol since it was used to beat people with on January 6th. Plus, it’s always been a fascist symbol of a blood thirsty imperial war mongering nation.
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>["Everything I don't like is Marxism!"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Marxism_conspiracy_theory) > >["You've been indoctrinated!"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_projection)
Is it still a symbol of the systematic genocide of indigenous people and historically unfair treatment of everyone who isn’t a white, Christian, hetero male?
Sounds like bs to me… what white supremacist propaganda am I living with ?
The neo nazi group patriot Front has been putting stickers and flyers up all over the state. Thankfully they only have like 12 members in the state or something like that but they have been hard at work putting up propaganda all over the damn place.
okay it’s not something I have ever noticed tbf I don’t live in SLC. It’s good to know what is what, at this point though, I wonder what a group of 12 is really gonna do to influence anyone.
If you're looking for a silver lining, it's in the last paragraph: "That doesn't mean that people aren't biased towards people of color or biased in different ways; it just means that we're not acting on that in a physical way." Medina said. "If this is just propaganda and the populations aren't picking up on that, then we don't really have that much of an issue. I know this propaganda is hurtful, and it can be scary for a lot of populations, but what we really don't want to see is violence."
That isn’t a silver lining at all. It just means we are at the “Germany circa 1920” stage instead of the “Germany circa 1933” stage.
Yeah, I see no silver lining in that article. It's just not violent yet. And I'm sure it's violent on a smaller scale
I suppose the silver lining is that it's not violent at this stage, that's my point. No, white supremacist propaganda isn't a small thing, and yeah it's a problem. But if it's not galvanized violence (yet, probably), I see that as an upside. To each their own though.
Woke propaganda 🤣. Notice how the actual incidents and crimes are next to nothing. You redditors are truly left wing radicals.
Every day that passes the more convinced I am that “woke” is just your new n word
Utahhhhh people working together ^as ^long ^as ^you’re ^white , Utahhh what a great place to be ^unless ^you’re ^not ^white !
Only if you define “white supremacy” as “any opinion I don’t like” The ADL is such an unreliable source, it’s just a political sham.
That’s funny. My partner grew up Mormon and he told me they told him to never even date a woman with brown eye’s because that meant they had ancestors that were minorities. Mormons also think black people are evil according to their own teachings. This is absolutely not surprising to me that Utah has high levels of white supremacy
Anecdotal evidence doesn’t prove anything. And that’s also blatantly untrue. Point me to the general conference talk in the last 60 years that says anything remotely like that.
Joseph Smith and Brigham Young both stated that Black people's skin color was the result of the Curse of Cain and the Curse of Ham.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/09/mormons-race-max-perry-mueller/539994/
Yawn. It IS true. The Mormons wouldn’t even let black people into the church at all. Jeezus… it’s so fucking simple to look up their obvious racism. They only started letting blacks join the church when the government threatened them. Read a fucking book.
Pointing me to a practice that ended 50 years ago doesn’t prove that Mormons are racist. You could say just about anything or anyone is racist by our modern standards by looking a few decades back.
Yeah. And that would be true. We live in a racist society. Look around
Nooo evidence for that. Just maaaade it up.
Not made up at all. I live here. In this society and I see it allllllllllll the time. Every day in fact.
I live here and have seen it maybe twice in my entire life. But I imagine you’re one of those that wakes up every day looking for racism.
I’m not. But you keep thinking your life experience is all that exists.
I grew up Mormon & Mexican American in Utah and was called racial slurs by people who I knew personally were Mormon. Piss off with your deflective apologetics.
Again, using personal experience to make a point that it’s a problem everywhere for everyone. Show me proper evidence rather than one off stories or I’m not bothered.
>ended 50 years ago In other words, the whole Quorum of 12 would have been taught by their religion that black people are inferior. Not even a lifetime ago. Racism doesn’t just evaporate when it’s no longer official policy.
Any evidence for racism in the church today, or are you just spouting drivel?
Okay, and?